On Sat, 9 May 2026 08:49:57 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
In message <slrn10vrkgp.425.jon+usenet@raven.unequivocal.eu>, at
12:07:53 on Fri, 8 May 2026, Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> >>remarked:
On 2026-05-08, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
In message <10tk3q4$2n44m$1@dont-email.me>, at 08:36:31 on Fri, 8 May
2026, billy bookcase <billy@anon.com> remarked:
"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote in message >>>>>news:cf98j+FjaV$pFAFk@perry.uk...
I have a couple of pre-paid credit cards
Oh no you don't.
Oh yes I do </panto).
No, if you're pre-paying then by definition they're not "credit".
What you have are some pre-paid debit cards.
This is not just pedantry, because the Apple age verification will not >>>accept debit cards as proof of age (presumably because you have to be 18 >>>to get a credit card but not a debit card).
They aren't Debit Cards, because they don't have a linked bank account.
So appear to the world as Credit Cards, just ones that don't allow the >>holder to run up a negative balance.
They don't appear to the world as credit cards. They appear to the world as >prepaid cards. The card number will identify it as a prepaid card.
If you've got a prepaid card, put the first six digits into the BIN checker >here:
https://www.bincodes.com/bin-checker/
As a test, I just put the BIN on my daughter's prepaid card into the
checker, and it told me this:
BIN 472628
Issuing Bank GOHENRY CARD ISSUED BY IDT FINANCIAL SERVICES, LTD.
Card Brand VISA
Card Type DEBIT
Card Level PREPAID
ISO Country Name UNITED KINGDOM
ISO Country A2 GB
ISO Country A3 GBR
ISO Country Number 826
There's all kinds of nuances in cards, for example the classic Amex
being a *charge* card, so neither a *debit* card (see above) nor a
Credit Card (because it requires paying off in full at the end of each >>month. But oonce again, to the systems, it appears to be a credit card.
No, a charge card appears to the system as a charge card.
Once upon a time, when most card transactions were offline, charge cards
were typically treated the same as credit cards, because the difference >didn't matter to the merchant - they'd get their payment either way. But >online, the nature of the card is part of the data. Again, putting an Amex >charge card BIN into the checker gives this:
BIN 374250
Issuing Bank AMERICAN EXPRESS UK CONSUMER CHARGE
Card Brand AMERICAN EXPRESS
Card Type CHARGE CARD
Card Level PERSONAL
ISO Country Name UNITED KINGDOM
ISO Country A2 GB
ISO Country A3 GBR
ISO Country Number 826
And, for reference, here are a couple of my cards:
BIN 518652
Issuing Bank TESCO PERSONAL FINANCE, LTD.
Card Brand MASTERCARD
Card Type CREDIT
Card Level REWARDS
ISO Country Name UNITED KINGDOM
ISO Country A2 GB
ISO Country A3 GBR
ISO Country Number 826
BIN 465941
Issuing Bank HSBC BANK PLC
Card Brand VISA
Card Type DEBIT
Card Level BUSINESS
ISO Country Name UNITED KINGDOM
ISO Country A2 GB
ISO Country A3 GBR
ISO Country Number 826
All of that data is made available to the merchant's card handling system >when a card payment is made. And the merchant can make decisions based on
any part of it.
Mark
On Mon, 11 May 2026 17:01:34 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
In message <qiZhsjJNrLAqFA1W@perry.uk>, at 18:05:17 on Sun, 10 May 2026, >>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> remarked:
In message <10tnp20$3pkg8$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:57:28 on Sat, 9 May >>>2026, billy bookcase <billy@anon.com> remarked:
There are no such things as pre-paid credit cards.
You are plain wrong about that.
A single instance of any bank or financial institution, large
or small, offering to provide a pre-paid credit card will
suffice.*
I am always happy to be proved wrong.
I'll keep you posted.
Two candidates: Orange Cash (mine was issued in 2015),
Orange Cash is a prepaid debit card:
https://bintable.com/bin/480029
and JaJa which
is
actually a real credit card, not a prepaid card:
https://jaja.co.uk/
https://bincheck.io/details/556869
Mark
Could you explain what you mean by "prepaid credit cards"? I tried >>>>googling it and got things like this:
Prepaid Cards
Alternatives to credit or debit cards
<https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/credit-cards/prepaid-cards/>
Pre-paid cards, sometimes called everyday spending cards, are debit
cards that operate on a pay-as-you-go basis. You top it up with
money and spend as you would normally with retailers.
<https://www.moneysupermarket.com/prepaid-cards/>
A card that you load with money, and appears to the merchant to be a
credit card (not a debit card), and where the user has a more permanent
relationship with the card issuer than a gift card bought at the
supermarket.
Thanks for clarifying that. You can see why people kept saying they
don't exist. I'm surprised that they look like credit cards to the >>merchant, but I believe you.
They don't look like credit cards to the merchant. They don't look like
debit cards either. They look like prepaid cards. The card number will >unambiguously identify it as a prepaid card.
When TfL introduced their contactless scheme I'm 99% certain they only
accepted credit cards (not debit cards because they are regarded as much
more of a throw-away item, or might be issued to Minors). They also
didn't accept most foreign-issued cards.
It might well be the case that they've relaxed both rules now.
Minors are allowed to use public transport!
In message <h6se0l58sn8flt9tu0kan6sjip1k7as6k6@4ax.com>, at 20:31:23 on
Fri, 15 May 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk>
remarked:
Could you explain what you mean by "prepaid credit cards"? I tried
googling it and got things like this:
Prepaid Cards
Alternatives to credit or debit cards
<https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/credit-cards/prepaid-cards/>
Pre-paid cards, sometimes called everyday spending cards, are debit >>>>> cards that operate on a pay-as-you-go basis. You top it up with
money and spend as you would normally with retailers.
<https://www.moneysupermarket.com/prepaid-cards/>
A card that you load with money, and appears to the merchant to be a
credit card (not a debit card), and where the user has a more permanent >>>> relationship with the card issuer than a gift card bought at the
supermarket.
Thanks for clarifying that. You can see why people kept saying they
don't exist. I'm surprised that they look like credit cards to the
merchant, but I believe you.
They don't look like credit cards to the merchant. They don't look like
debit cards either. They look like prepaid cards. The card number will
unambiguously identify it as a prepaid card.
I'm parking any further comments until you assure me you have an app
that can reveal what my cards looked like to a merchant ten years ago,
not 2026, 2025, but ten years ago.
A practical question for the user (quite separate from the question of whether
the card issuer is providing credit) is whether the financial system *treats* >>them as credit cards. For instance, does the issuer honour the Section 75 >>obligation to refund the user if the seller breaks the contract?
No, because there is no credit involved.
On 24 May 2026 at 14:40:35 BST, "Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
In message <h6se0l58sn8flt9tu0kan6sjip1k7as6k6@4ax.com>, at 20:31:23 on
Fri, 15 May 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk>
remarked:
Could you explain what you mean by "prepaid credit cards"? I tried >>>>>> googling it and got things like this:
Prepaid Cards
Alternatives to credit or debit cards
<https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/credit-cards/prepaid-cards/>
Pre-paid cards, sometimes called everyday spending cards, are debit >>>>>> cards that operate on a pay-as-you-go basis. You top it up with
money and spend as you would normally with retailers.
<https://www.moneysupermarket.com/prepaid-cards/>
A card that you load with money, and appears to the merchant to be a >>>>> credit card (not a debit card), and where the user has a more permanent >>>>> relationship with the card issuer than a gift card bought at the
supermarket.
Thanks for clarifying that. You can see why people kept saying they
don't exist. I'm surprised that they look like credit cards to the
merchant, but I believe you.
They don't look like credit cards to the merchant. They don't look like
debit cards either. They look like prepaid cards. The card number will
unambiguously identify it as a prepaid card.
I'm parking any further comments until you assure me you have an app
that can reveal what my cards looked like to a merchant ten years ago,
not 2026, 2025, but ten years ago.
I'm honestly not taking sides in this, but surely a prepaid credit card could >never have been used to set up a continued payment authority? There must have >been some indication of this.
Recently I think the age for being issued with a *debit* card has been reduced, but it's still no younger than 11 for mainstream banks, and of course if when TfL does their overnight billing run and it turns out
their card has insufficient funds, they can't be sued. The only remedy
is for TfL to block the card for any future use.
They aren't Debit Cards, because they don't have a linked bank account. >>>So appear to the world as Credit Cards, just ones that don't allow the >>>holder to run up a negative balance.
I have temporarily misplaced the cards I mentioned originally, but will check
them as soon as I find them. Have only just got back from a week's vacation so
apologies for delay in responding.
Meanwhile, I'd just like to point out that it doesn't matter what the cards appear to be today, but what they were considered to be ten years ago when issued. I presume the tool you mention doesn't allow back-dated queries.
In message <3l0f0ll0bsg4tvv9k4cjj6h1d4a6cnc0br@4ax.com>, at 21:38:05 on
Fri, 15 May 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk>
remarked:
On Mon, 11 May 2026 17:01:34 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
In message <qiZhsjJNrLAqFA1W@perry.uk>, at 18:05:17 on Sun, 10 May 2026, >>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> remarked:
In message <10tnp20$3pkg8$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:57:28 on Sat, 9 May >>>>2026, billy bookcase <billy@anon.com> remarked:
There are no such things as pre-paid credit cards.
You are plain wrong about that.
A single instance of any bank or financial institution, large
or small, offering to provide a pre-paid credit card will
suffice.*
I am always happy to be proved wrong.
I'll keep you posted.
Two candidates: Orange Cash (mine was issued in 2015),
Orange Cash is a prepaid debit card:
https://bintable.com/bin/480029
But I don't think it was, when I had mine issued. Can you backdate the
query ten years and try again?
and JaJa which
is
Maybe now, but not back then.
Did you not read what I posted earlier:
"JaJa which suffers a bit from AI-slop if you try to research it
online, with the product offering changing over time, but has
the word "Credit" on the front despite being pre-pay.
actually a real credit card, not a prepaid card:
https://jaja.co.uk/
https://bincheck.io/details/556869
Mark
Except the one I was issued with originally was absolutely definitely
100% prepaid. That was the **WHOLE POINT** of choosing it.
So I could lend it to people to buy their TfL travel (especially when
TfL weren't yet accepting foreign issued cards, and one of those friends
had a credit card that deliberately[1] wasn't[2] contactless). My total >exposure to financial risk was whatever I'd loaded on it - which was >typically one daily cap's worth of TfL fares.
Meanwhile, I still have that card somewhere and I'm pretty sure they
won't have magically turned it into a conventional credit card without >telling me, and I've received no communication from them for years. It's
also "in date", many more then three or four years later.
[1] So if it was lost or stolen it was harder for them to lose money.
They were from a country without the UK's contactless card
guarantees.
[2] And still wasn't, two years ago when I last saw them - causing
consternation to UK-based vendors, who had to print a manual slip of
paper for them to sign.
On Sun, 24 May 2026 14:38:45 +0100, Roland Perry wrote:
Recently I think the age for being issued with a *debit* card has been
reduced, but it's still no younger than 11 for mainstream banks, and of
course if when TfL does their overnight billing run and it turns out
their card has insufficient funds, they can't be sued. The only remedy
is for TfL to block the card for any future use.
Or sue the legal guardian(s) ?
In message <10uv05m$3i1$6@dont-email.me>, at 13:58:14 on Sun, 24 May
2026, Jethro <jethro_UK@hotmailbin.com> remarked:
On Sun, 24 May 2026 14:38:45 +0100, Roland Perry wrote:
Recently I think the age for being issued with a *debit* card has been
reduced, but it's still no younger than 11 for mainstream banks, and of
course if when TfL does their overnight billing run and it turns out
their card has insufficient funds, they can't be sued. The only remedy
is for TfL to block the card for any future use.
Or sue the legal guardian(s) ?
I don't think that works because minors' debts can't be pursued in the
courts (as far as I'm aware, but I'm happy to listen to any contary opinions).
Unless TfL has a scheme which I'm unaware of, for opening contactless accounts for minors where someone guarantees any debit that's run up.
On 2026-05-10, Roland Perry wrote:
When TfL introduced their contactless scheme I'm 99% certain they only
accepted credit cards (not debit cards because they are regarded as much
more of a throw-away item, or might be issued to Minors). They also
didn't accept most foreign-issued cards.
It might well be the case that they've relaxed both rules now.
Minors are allowed to use public transport!
On 15/05/2026 16:27, Adam Funk wrote:
On 2026-05-10, Roland Perry wrote:
When TfL introduced their contactless scheme I'm 99% certain they only
accepted credit cards (not debit cards because they are regarded as much >>> more of a throw-away item, or might be issued to Minors). They also
didn't accept most foreign-issued cards.
It might well be the case that they've relaxed both rules now.
Minors are allowed to use public transport!
So how do minors use public transport using the "tap on/tap/off" method? There are Oyster cards, which can be pre-loaded with value, but these
are only useable in London and surrounding areas. I don't think you can
use them on Slough buses.
For a minor to use a debit card, the maximum fare would have to be
debited from the user's account on the first tap (and refunded, if appropriate, on the tap out), and I don't think there's any way to do
this as it's a batch operation.
On 2026-05-26, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> wrote:
On 15/05/2026 16:27, Adam Funk wrote:
On 2026-05-10, Roland Perry wrote:
When TfL introduced their contactless scheme I'm 99% certain they only >>>> accepted credit cards (not debit cards because they are regarded as much >>>> more of a throw-away item, or might be issued to Minors). They also
didn't accept most foreign-issued cards.
It might well be the case that they've relaxed both rules now.
Minors are allowed to use public transport!
So how do minors use public transport using the "tap on/tap/off" method?
There are Oyster cards, which can be pre-loaded with value, but these
are only useable in London and surrounding areas. I don't think you can
use them on Slough buses.
For a minor to use a debit card, the maximum fare would have to be
debited from the user's account on the first tap (and refunded, if
appropriate, on the tap out), and I don't think there's any way to do
this as it's a batch operation.
Eh? Why do you say it's a batch operation?
And why do you say they would have to debit the maximum fare?
I would've thought they would just pre-auth a small charge (e.g. the
minimum fare)
on tapping in, to check the card in principle is working, and then
charge the total aggregate fare at the end of the day.
"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote in message >news:1ltWt6OPCtEqFAXb@perry.uk...
They aren't Debit Cards, because they don't have a linked bank account. >>>>So appear to the world as Credit Cards, just ones that don't allow the >>>>holder to run up a negative balance.
I have temporarily misplaced the cards I mentioned originally, but
will check
them as soon as I find them. Have only just got back from a week's >>vacation so
apologies for delay in responding.
Meanwhile, I'd just like to point out that it doesn't matter what the cards >> appear to be today, but what they were considered to be ten years ago when >> issued. I presume the tool you mention doesn't allow back-dated queries.
quote:
Consumer Credit Act 1974
UK Public General Acts 1974 c. 39 PART IV Advertising
43 Advertisements to which Part IV applies
(1)This Part applies to any advertisement, published
for the purposes of a business carried on by the advertiser,
indicating that he is willing-
(a) to provide credit, or
(b)to enter into an agreement for the bailment or (in Scotland)
the hiring of goods by him.
46 False or misleading advertisements
(1)If an advertisement to which this Part applies conveys
information which in a material respect is false or
misleading the advertiser commits an offence.
(2)Information stating or implying an intention on the
advertiser's part which he has not got is false.
:unquote
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1974/39/part/IV/crossheading/advert >ising/enacted
In message <slrn111b0os.1hf4.jon+usenet@raven.unequivocal.eu>, at
11:25:16 on Tue, 26 May 2026, Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> remarked:
On 2026-05-26, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> wrote:
On 15/05/2026 16:27, Adam Funk wrote:
On 2026-05-10, Roland Perry wrote:
When TfL introduced their contactless scheme I'm 99% certain they only >>>>> accepted credit cards (not debit cards because they are regarded as much >>>>> more of a throw-away item, or might be issued to Minors). They also
didn't accept most foreign-issued cards.
It might well be the case that they've relaxed both rules now.
Minors are allowed to use public transport!
So how do minors use public transport using the "tap on/tap/off" method? >>> There are Oyster cards, which can be pre-loaded with value, but these
are only useable in London and surrounding areas. I don't think you can
use them on Slough buses.
For a minor to use a debit card, the maximum fare would have to be
debited from the user's account on the first tap (and refunded, if
appropriate, on the tap out), and I don't think there's any way to do
this as it's a batch operation.
Eh? Why do you say it's a batch operation?
On TfL it's an overnight batch operation, the sensible way to do daily/weekly capping.
And why do you say they would have to debit the maximum fare?
Indeed, what they do is charge the "maximum fee" only if you fail to touch-out at the end of the day.
I would've thought they would just pre-auth a small charge (e.g. the >>minimum fare)
More likely 10p
on tapping in, to check the card in principle is working, and then
charge the total aggregate fare at the end of the day.
Yes.
In message <10uv05m$3i1$6@dont-email.me>, at 13:58:14 on Sun, 24 May
2026,
Jethro <jethro_UK@hotmailbin.com> remarked:
[quoted text muted]
I don't think that works because minors' debts can't be pursued in the
courts (as far as I'm aware, but I'm happy to listen to any contary opinions).
In message <10uv05m$3i1$6@dont-email.me>, at 13:58:14 on Sun, 24 May
2026, Jethro <jethro_UK@hotmailbin.com> remarked:
On Sun, 24 May 2026 14:38:45 +0100, Roland Perry wrote:
Recently I think the age for being issued with a *debit* card has been
reduced, but it's still no younger than 11 for mainstream banks, and of
course if when TfL does their overnight billing run and it turns out
their card has insufficient funds, they can't be sued. The only remedy
is for TfL to block the card for any future use.
Or sue the legal guardian(s) ?
I don't think that works because minors' debts can't be pursued in the courts (as far as I'm aware, but I'm happy to listen to any contary opinions).
In message <slrn111b0os.1hf4.jon+usenet@raven.unequivocal.eu>, at
11:25:16 on Tue, 26 May 2026, Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> remarked:
On 2026-05-26, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> wrote:
On 15/05/2026 16:27, Adam Funk wrote:
On 2026-05-10, Roland Perry wrote:
When TfL introduced their contactless scheme I'm 99% certain they only >>>>> accepted credit cards (not debit cards because they are regarded as >>>>> much
more of a throw-away item, or might be issued to Minors). They also
didn't accept most foreign-issued cards.
It might well be the case that they've relaxed both rules now.
Minors are allowed to use public transport!
So how do minors use public transport using the "tap on/tap/off" method? >>> There are Oyster cards, which can be pre-loaded with value, but these
are only useable in London and surrounding areas. I don't think you can
use them on Slough buses.
For a minor to use a debit card, the maximum fare would have to be
debited from the user's account on the first tap (and refunded, if
appropriate, on the tap out), and I don't think there's any way to do
this as it's a batch operation.
Eh? Why do you say it's a batch operation?
On TfL it's an overnight batch operation, the sensible way to do daily/ weekly capping.
And why do you say they would have to debit the maximum fare?
Indeed, what they do is charge the "maximum fee" only if you fail to touch-out at the end of the day.
I would've thought they would just pre-auth a small charge (e.g. the
minimum fare)
More likely 10p
on tapping in, to check the card in principle is working, and then
charge the total aggregate fare at the end of the day.
Yes.
In message <10v15fi$18061$1@dont-email.me>, at 10:40:57 on Mon, 25 May 2026, billy bookcase <billy@anon.com> remarked:
"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote in message >>news:1ltWt6OPCtEqFAXb@perry.uk...
They aren't Debit Cards, because they don't have a linked bank account. >>>>>So appear to the world as Credit Cards, just ones that don't allow the >>>>>holder to run up a negative balance.
I have temporarily misplaced the cards I mentioned originally, but will >>> check
them as soon as I find them. Have only just got back from a week's vacation
so
apologies for delay in responding.
Meanwhile, I'd just like to point out that it doesn't matter what the cards >>> appear to be today, but what they were considered to be ten years ago when >>> issued. I presume the tool you mention doesn't allow back-dated queries.
quote:
Consumer Credit Act 1974
UK Public General Acts 1974 c. 39 PART IV Advertising
43 Advertisements to which Part IV applies
(1)This Part applies to any advertisement, published
for the purposes of a business carried on by the advertiser,
indicating that he is willing-
(a) to provide credit, or
(b)to enter into an agreement for the bailment or (in Scotland)
the hiring of goods by him.
46 False or misleading advertisements
(1)If an advertisement to which this Part applies conveys
information which in a material respect is false or
misleading the advertiser commits an offence.
(2)Information stating or implying an intention on the
advertiser's part which he has not got is false.
:unquote
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1974/39/part/IV/crossheading/advert >>ising/enacted
Just so you know, I'm ignoring your postings because they are irrelevant to the topic under discussion.
On Mon, 25 May 2026 17:40:59 +0100, Roland Perry wrote:
In message <10uv05m$3i1$6@dont-email.me>, at 13:58:14 on Sun, 24 May
2026,
Jethro <jethro_UK@hotmailbin.com> remarked:
[quoted text muted]
I don't think that works because minors' debts can't be pursued in the
courts (as far as I'm aware, but I'm happy to listen to any contary
opinions).
However, can a minors parents be sued for damages if they fail to
supervise little Johnny ? Including supervising them from making a
contract and costs flowing from that ?
So how do minors use public transport using the "tap on/tap/off" method? >>>> There are Oyster cards, which can be pre-loaded with value, but these
are only useable in London and surrounding areas. I don't think you can >>>> use them on Slough buses.
For a minor to use a debit card, the maximum fare would have to be
debited from the user's account on the first tap (and refunded, if
appropriate, on the tap out), and I don't think there's any way to do
this as it's a batch operation.
Eh? Why do you say it's a batch operation?
On TfL it's an overnight batch operation, the sensible way to do
daily/weekly capping.
And why do you say they would have to debit the maximum fare?
Indeed, what they do is charge the "maximum fee" only if you fail to
touch-out at the end of the day.
I would've thought they would just pre-auth a small charge (e.g. the >>>minimum fare)
More likely 10p
So... that bit is not a batch operation then? ;-)
On 26/05/2026 14:27, Roland Perry wrote:
In message <slrn111b0os.1hf4.jon+usenet@raven.unequivocal.eu>, at >>11:25:16 on Tue, 26 May 2026, Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> >>remarked:
On 2026-05-26, Max Demian <max_demian@bigfoot.com> wrote:On TfL it's an overnight batch operation, the sensible way to do
On 15/05/2026 16:27, Adam Funk wrote:
On 2026-05-10, Roland Perry wrote:
When TfL introduced their contactless scheme I'm 99% certain they only >>>>>> accepted credit cards (not debit cards because they are regarded >>>>>>as much
more of a throw-away item, or might be issued to Minors). They also >>>>>> didn't accept most foreign-issued cards.
It might well be the case that they've relaxed both rules now.
Minors are allowed to use public transport!
So how do minors use public transport using the "tap on/tap/off" method? >>>> There are Oyster cards, which can be pre-loaded with value, but these
are only useable in London and surrounding areas. I don't think you can >>>> use them on Slough buses.
For a minor to use a debit card, the maximum fare would have to be
debited from the user's account on the first tap (and refunded, if
appropriate, on the tap out), and I don't think there's any way to do
this as it's a batch operation.
Eh? Why do you say it's a batch operation?
daily/ weekly capping.
And why do you say they would have to debit the maximum fare?Indeed, what they do is charge the "maximum fee" only if you fail to >>touch-out at the end of the day.
I would've thought they would just pre-auth a small charge (e.g. the >>>minimum fare)More likely 10p
on tapping in, to check the card in principle is working, and then >>>charge the total aggregate fare at the end of the day.Yes.
But the minor might not have enough in his account by that time.
It has to be a batch operation as buses can't be expected to have an >internet connection all the time.
Just so you know, I'm ignoring your postings because they are irrelevant to >> the topic under discussion.
"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote in message >news:cf98j+FjaV$pFAFk@perry.uk...
"I have a couple of pre-paid credit cards"
One step at a time; that's always been my motto.
In message <10v4ge2$26mg3$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:06:23 on Tue, 26 May 2026, billy bookcase <billy@anon.com> remarked:
Just so you know, I'm ignoring your postings because they are irrelevant to >>> the topic under discussion.
"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote in message >>news:cf98j+FjaV$pFAFk@perry.uk...
"I have a couple of pre-paid credit cards"
One step at a time; that's always been my motto.
And if you'd been paying attention,
you'd know I still do.
(Although one has now expired).
In message <SMdPnijNzvEqFAQ7@perry.uk>, at 14:27:41 on Sun, 24 May
2026, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> remarked:
In message <3l0f0ll0bsg4tvv9k4cjj6h1d4a6cnc0br@4ax.com>, at 21:38:05
on
Fri, 15 May 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk>
remarked:
On Mon, 11 May 2026 17:01:34 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> >>>wrote:
In message <qiZhsjJNrLAqFA1W@perry.uk>, at 18:05:17 on Sun, 10 May >>>>2026,
Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> remarked:
In message <10tnp20$3pkg8$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:57:28 on Sat, 9 >>>>>May
2026, billy bookcase <billy@anon.com> remarked:
There are no such things as pre-paid credit cards.
You are plain wrong about that.
A single instance of any bank or financial institution, large
or small, offering to provide a pre-paid credit card will
suffice.*
I am always happy to be proved wrong.
I'll keep you posted.
Two candidates: Orange Cash (mine was issued in 2015),
Orange Cash is a prepaid debit card:
https://bintable.com/bin/480029
But I don't think it was, when I had mine issued. Can you backdate the >>query ten years and try again?
and JaJa which
is
Maybe now, but not back then.
Did you not read what I posted earlier:
"JaJa which suffers a bit from AI-slop if you try to research
it
online, with the product offering changing over time, but has
the word "Credit" on the front despite being pre-pay.
actually a real credit card, not a prepaid card:
https://jaja.co.uk/
https://bincheck.io/details/556869
Mark
Except the one I was issued with originally was absolutely definitely
100% prepaid. That was the **WHOLE POINT** of choosing it.
So I could lend it to people to buy their TfL travel (especially when
TfL weren't yet accepting foreign issued cards, and one of those
friends
had a credit card that deliberately[1] wasn't[2] contactless). My
total
exposure to financial risk was whatever I'd loaded on it - which was >>typically one daily cap's worth of TfL fares.
Meanwhile, I still have that card somewhere and I'm pretty sure they
won't have magically turned it into a conventional credit card without >>telling me, and I've received no communication from them for years.
It's
also "in date", many more then three or four years later.
[1] So if it was lost or stolen it was harder for them to lose money.
They were from a country without the UK's contactless card
guarantees.
[2] And still wasn't, two years ago when I last saw them - causing
consternation to UK-based vendors, who had to print a manual slip
of
paper for them to sign.
I've found the two lost cards, plus an additional one.
According to your tool, results today (not necessarily the results one
would have got ten years ago)
Orange Cash 530831 Issued 2015 Prepaid Debit
JAJA 461807 Expires 2026 Visa Credit
Optimum 530831 Expired 2017 Prepaid Debit
So I don't think that gets us any further forward.
What we need now are the parameters of TfL's early contactless scheme, because my recollection is they only allowed [UK-issued] credit
cards - for reasons I've explained earlier - hence my extended search
for a prepaid such animal.
Because I wanted to be able to lend them to someone with very low
financial risk (for them to use on TfL) and you probably can't get
credit cards with u20 credit limits.
--
Roland Perry
On Sat, 9 May 2026 08:49:57 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
In message <slrn10vrkgp.425.jon+usenet@raven.unequivocal.eu>, at
12:07:53 on Fri, 8 May 2026, Jon Ribbens <jon+usenet@unequivocal.eu> >>remarked:
On 2026-05-08, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
In message <10tk3q4$2n44m$1@dont-email.me>, at 08:36:31 on Fri, 8 May
2026, billy bookcase <billy@anon.com> remarked:
"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote in message >>>>>news:cf98j+FjaV$pFAFk@perry.uk...
I have a couple of pre-paid credit cards
Oh no you don't.
Oh yes I do </panto).
No, if you're pre-paying then by definition they're not "credit".
What you have are some pre-paid debit cards.
This is not just pedantry, because the Apple age verification will not >>>accept debit cards as proof of age (presumably because you have to be 18 >>>to get a credit card but not a debit card).
They aren't Debit Cards, because they don't have a linked bank account.
So appear to the world as Credit Cards, just ones that don't allow the >>holder to run up a negative balance.
They don't appear to the world as credit cards. They appear to the world as prepaid cards. The card number will identify it as a prepaid card.
If you've got a prepaid card, put the first six digits into the BIN checker here:
https://www.bincodes.com/bin-checker/
"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote in message >news:quWhfoJlpHFqFAdo@perry.uk...
In message <SMdPnijNzvEqFAQ7@perry.uk>, at 14:27:41 on Sun, 24 May
2026, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> remarked:
In message <3l0f0ll0bsg4tvv9k4cjj6h1d4a6cnc0br@4ax.com>, at 21:38:05
on
Fri, 15 May 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk> >>>remarked:
On Mon, 11 May 2026 17:01:34 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> >>>>wrote:
In message <qiZhsjJNrLAqFA1W@perry.uk>, at 18:05:17 on Sun, 10 May >>>>>2026,
Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> remarked:
In message <10tnp20$3pkg8$1@dont-email.me>, at 17:57:28 on Sat, 9 >>>>>>May
2026, billy bookcase <billy@anon.com> remarked:
There are no such things as pre-paid credit cards.
You are plain wrong about that.
A single instance of any bank or financial institution, large
or small, offering to provide a pre-paid credit card will >>>>>>>suffice.*
I am always happy to be proved wrong.
I'll keep you posted.
Two candidates: Orange Cash (mine was issued in 2015),
Orange Cash is a prepaid debit card:
https://bintable.com/bin/480029
But I don't think it was, when I had mine issued. Can you backdate the >>>query ten years and try again?
and JaJa which
is
Maybe now, but not back then.
Did you not read what I posted earlier:
"JaJa which suffers a bit from AI-slop if you try to research
it
online, with the product offering changing over time, but has
the word "Credit" on the front despite being pre-pay.
actually a real credit card, not a prepaid card:
https://jaja.co.uk/
https://bincheck.io/details/556869
Mark
Except the one I was issued with originally was absolutely definitely >>>100% prepaid. That was the **WHOLE POINT** of choosing it.
So I could lend it to people to buy their TfL travel (especially when
TfL weren't yet accepting foreign issued cards, and one of those
friends
had a credit card that deliberately[1] wasn't[2] contactless). My
total
exposure to financial risk was whatever I'd loaded on it - which was >>>typically one daily cap's worth of TfL fares.
Meanwhile, I still have that card somewhere and I'm pretty sure they >>>won't have magically turned it into a conventional credit card without >>>telling me, and I've received no communication from them for years.
It's
also "in date", many more then three or four years later.
[1] So if it was lost or stolen it was harder for them to lose money.
They were from a country without the UK's contactless card
guarantees.
[2] And still wasn't, two years ago when I last saw them - causing
consternation to UK-based vendors, who had to print a manual slip
of
paper for them to sign.
I've found the two lost cards, plus an additional one.
According to your tool, results today (not necessarily the results one
would have got ten years ago)
Orange Cash 530831 Issued 2015 Prepaid Debit
JAJA 461807 Expires 2026 Visa Credit
Optimum 530831 Expired 2017 Prepaid Debit
So I don't think that gets us any further forward.
What we need now are the parameters of TfL's early contactless scheme,
because my recollection is they only allowed [UK-issued] credit
cards - for reasons I've explained earlier - hence my extended search
for a prepaid such animal.
Because I wanted to be able to lend them to someone with very low
financial risk (for them to use on TfL) and you probably can't get
credit cards with u20 credit limits.
--
Roland Perry
I believe it may depend on when and who issued the card.
For instance my old ICE prepaid card ( 5+ years ago?) was definately >advertised as a Prepaid credit card - and even though it expired a few
years ago https://www.bincodes.com/bin-checker/ still reports:-
Details for BIN 538443
BIN 538443
Issuing Bank
Card Brand MASTERCARD
Card Type CREDIT
Card Level
ISO Country Name ? UNITED KINGDOM
ISO Country A2 GB
ISO Country A3 GBR
ISO Country Number 826
Ive since replaced it with another card from another supplier which does >indeed show up as a prepaid debit card.
Regards,
Zippy.
In message <h6se0l58sn8flt9tu0kan6sjip1k7as6k6@4ax.com>, at 20:31:23 on
Fri, 15 May 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk>
remarked:
Could you explain what you mean by "prepaid credit cards"? I tried >>>>>googling it and got things like this:
Prepaid Cards
Alternatives to credit or debit cards
<https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/credit-cards/prepaid-cards/>
Pre-paid cards, sometimes called everyday spending cards, are debit >>>>> cards that operate on a pay-as-you-go basis. You top it up with
money and spend as you would normally with retailers.
<https://www.moneysupermarket.com/prepaid-cards/>
A card that you load with money, and appears to the merchant to be a
credit card (not a debit card), and where the user has a more permanent >>>> relationship with the card issuer than a gift card bought at the
supermarket.
Thanks for clarifying that. You can see why people kept saying they
don't exist. I'm surprised that they look like credit cards to the >>>merchant, but I believe you.
They don't look like credit cards to the merchant. They don't look like >>debit cards either. They look like prepaid cards. The card number will >>unambiguously identify it as a prepaid card.
I'm parking any further comments until you assure me you have an app
that can reveal what my cards looked like to a merchant ten years ago,
not 2026, 2025, but ten years ago.
I'm parking any further comments until you assure me you have an app
that can reveal what my cards looked like to a merchant ten years ago,
not 2026, 2025, but ten years ago.
I've got a copy of the BINlist from more than ten years ago (dating from
when I worked for an online retailer). I obviously can't say what results it >would give for specific cards without knowing their numbers (or, at least, >the first six digits), but prepaid cards are certainly a category within it.
In message <8p312ltbvd92acq6b02agji2o9s6rbsu8h@4ax.com>, at 21:33:34 on Wed, 3
Jun 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk> remarked:
I'm parking any further comments until you assure me you have an app
that can reveal what my cards looked like to a merchant ten years ago, >>>not 2026, 2025, but ten years ago.
I've got a copy of the BINlist from more than ten years ago (dating from >>when I worked for an online retailer). I obviously can't say what results it >>would give for specific cards without knowing their numbers (or, at least, >>the first six digits), but prepaid cards are certainly a category within it.
Try this one: 5308 3102 .... (expired 12/16)
Curiously a Mastercard issued by a subsidiary of Barclays (normally associated
with Visa).
In message <8p312ltbvd92acq6b02agji2o9s6rbsu8h@4ax.com>, at 21:33:34 on Wed, 3
Jun 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk> remarked:
I'm parking any further comments until you assure me you have an app
that can reveal what my cards looked like to a merchant ten years ago, >>>not 2026, 2025, but ten years ago.
I've got a copy of the BINlist from more than ten years ago (dating from >>when I worked for an online retailer). I obviously can't say what results it >>would give for specific cards without knowing their numbers (or, at least, >>the first six digits), but prepaid cards are certainly a category within it.
Try this one: 5308 3102 .... (expired 12/16)
Curiously a Mastercard issued by a subsidiary of Barclays (normally associated
with Visa).
"Roland Perry" <roland@perry.uk> wrote in message >news:U7z+K5MFDTIqFAyv@perry.uk...
In message <8p312ltbvd92acq6b02agji2o9s6rbsu8h@4ax.com>, at 21:33:34
on Wed, 3
Jun 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk> remarked:
Try this one: 5308 3102 .... (expired 12/16)I'm parking any further comments until you assure me you have an app >>>>that can reveal what my cards looked like to a merchant ten years ago, >>>>not 2026, 2025, but ten years ago.
I've got a copy of the BINlist from more than ten years ago (dating from >>>when I worked for an online retailer). I obviously can't say what results it >>>would give for specific cards without knowing their numbers (or, at least, >>>the first six digits), but prepaid cards are certainly a category within it. >>
Curiously a Mastercard issued by a subsidiary of Barclays (normally >>associated with Visa).
https://www.mastercard.com/adobe/dynamicmedia/deliver/dm-aid--dbf30eb5-1 >fef-4d37-8545-e44a95d8b19e/mastercard-touch-cards-1280x720.jpg?preferweb >p=true&quality=82
In message <8p312ltbvd92acq6b02agji2o9s6rbsu8h@4ax.com>, at 21:33:34 on
Wed, 3 Jun 2026, Mark Goodge <usenet@listmail.good-stuff.co.uk>
remarked:
I'm parking any further comments until you assure me you have an app
that can reveal what my cards looked like to a merchant ten years ago, >>>not 2026, 2025, but ten years ago.
I've got a copy of the BINlist from more than ten years ago (dating from >>when I worked for an online retailer). I obviously can't say what results it >>would give for specific cards without knowing their numbers (or, at least, >>the first six digits), but prepaid cards are certainly a category within it.
Try this one: 5308 3102 .... (expired 12/16)
Curiously a Mastercard issued by a subsidiary of Barclays (normally >associated with Visa).
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