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  • Re: Mother nature knows best...

    From Roger Hayter@roger@hayter.org to uk.d-i-y on Sat Aug 15 12:57:39 2026
    From Newsgroup: uk.d-i-y

    On 28 Mar 2024 at 13:51:02 GMT, "GB" <NOTsomeone@microsoft.invalid> wrote:

    On 28/03/2024 12:40, SteveW wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:15, Fredxx wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:08, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:03, GB wrote:
    I don't know about costs, but a pivot system could have two uses:

    1) Keep the panels at 90 degrees to the sun throughout the day, to
    absorb maximum energy.
    2) Rotate the panels so they are horizontal with the glass downwards >>>>> when storms are expected, in order to prevent hail damage.

    The great thing about 'free' solar and wind energy is how much it
    costs and how much more it costs to make it reliable.

    I've never heard of nuclear power plants needing batteries, massive
    grid interconnectors, mechanisms to protect against hail, backup
    power stations

    The irony is that the Fukushima disasters was precisely because backup
    systems didn't work.

    But modern reactor designs don't need those backup systems. Older
    designs had to keep the pumps running, newer ones can be shut-down with
    no active cooling.


    Why weren't these 'modern' designs implemented in the first place?

    Why did we ever bother with steam locomotives and then diesels when we could have had electric trains?
    --

    Roger Hayter
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  • From The Natural Philosopher@tnp@invalid.invalid to uk.d-i-y on Sat Aug 15 14:15:29 2026
    From Newsgroup: uk.d-i-y

    On 15/08/2026 13:57, Roger Hayter wrote:
    On 28 Mar 2024 at 13:51:02 GMT, "GB" <NOTsomeone@microsoft.invalid> wrote:

    On 28/03/2024 12:40, SteveW wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:15, Fredxx wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:08, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:03, GB wrote:
    I don't know about costs, but a pivot system could have two uses:

    1) Keep the panels at 90 degrees to the sun throughout the day, to >>>>>> absorb maximum energy.
    2) Rotate the panels so they are horizontal with the glass downwards >>>>>> when storms are expected, in order to prevent hail damage.

    The great thing about 'free' solar and wind energy is how much it
    costs and how much more it costs to make it reliable.

    I've never heard of nuclear power plants needing batteries, massive
    grid interconnectors, mechanisms to protect against hail, backup
    power stations

    The irony is that the Fukushima disasters was precisely because backup >>>> systems didn't work.

    But modern reactor designs don't need those backup systems. Older
    designs had to keep the pumps running, newer ones can be shut-down with
    no active cooling.


    Why weren't these 'modern' designs implemented in the first place?

    Why did we ever bother with steam locomotives and then diesels when we could have had electric trains?


    At any given time the cost of labour, the level of technology the
    availability of resources and of course the political flimflam dictates
    what is the optimal solution

    In the case of Fukushima the backup systems did not fail. The
    containment contained...

    Now the fact of the matter is that a large - very large - reactors is
    more efficient in terms of resources but the political flimflam makes it immensely long to get certified. Not built: certified.

    Small modular reactors are more expensive in terms of resources, but
    need less approval due to no active scram cooling and being able to be approved just once at the factory.

    This makes them nuch faster to bring online., 3 years maybe
    --
    "Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They
    always run out of other people's money. It's quite a characteristic of them"

    Margaret Thatcher

    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Charles Hope@clh@candehope.me.uk to uk.d-i-y on Sat Aug 15 13:45:07 2026
    From Newsgroup: uk.d-i-y

    On 15/08/2026 13:57, Roger Hayter wrote:
    On 28 Mar 2024 at 13:51:02 GMT, "GB" <NOTsomeone@microsoft.invalid> wrote:

    On 28/03/2024 12:40, SteveW wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:15, Fredxx wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:08, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:03, GB wrote:
    I don't know about costs, but a pivot system could have two uses:

    1) Keep the panels at 90 degrees to the sun throughout the day, to >>>>>> absorb maximum energy.
    2) Rotate the panels so they are horizontal with the glass downwards >>>>>> when storms are expected, in order to prevent hail damage.

    The great thing about 'free' solar and wind energy is how much it
    costs and how much more it costs to make it reliable.

    I've never heard of nuclear power plants needing batteries, massive
    grid interconnectors, mechanisms to protect against hail, backup
    power stations

    The irony is that the Fukushima disasters was precisely because backup >>>> systems didn't work.

    But modern reactor designs don't need those backup systems. Older
    designs had to keep the pumps running, newer ones can be shut-down with
    no active cooling.


    Why weren't these 'modern' designs implemented in the first place?

    Why did we ever bother with steam locomotives and then diesels when we could have had electric trains?


    timing. I don't think electricity had been invented in time,].
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Joe@joe@jretrading.com to uk.d-i-y on Sat Aug 15 15:48:51 2026
    From Newsgroup: uk.d-i-y

    On Sat, 15 Aug 26 13:45:07 UTC
    Charles Hope <clh@candehope.me.uk> wrote:

    On 15/08/2026 13:57, Roger Hayter wrote:
    On 28 Mar 2024 at 13:51:02 GMT, "GB" <NOTsomeone@microsoft.invalid>
    wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:40, SteveW wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:15, Fredxx wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:08, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
    On 28/03/2024 12:03, GB wrote:
    I don't know about costs, but a pivot system could have two
    uses:

    1) Keep the panels at 90 degrees to the sun throughout the
    day, to absorb maximum energy.
    2) Rotate the panels so they are horizontal with the glass
    downwards when storms are expected, in order to prevent hail
    damage.

    The great thing about 'free' solar and wind energy is how much
    it costs and how much more it costs to make it reliable.

    I've never heard of nuclear power plants needing batteries,
    massive grid interconnectors, mechanisms to protect against
    hail, backup power stations

    The irony is that the Fukushima disasters was precisely because
    backup systems didn't work.

    But modern reactor designs don't need those backup systems. Older
    designs had to keep the pumps running, newer ones can be
    shut-down with no active cooling.


    Why weren't these 'modern' designs implemented in the first place?


    Why did we ever bother with steam locomotives and then diesels when
    we could have had electric trains?


    timing. I don't think electricity had been invented in time,].

    The first electric motor ran some years before Stephenson's Rocket.
    Technology takes time and someone's money to develop, and steam looked
    easier to scale up, and did not require a large and complex fuel
    distribution infrastructure. Even today, not all UK railway track has
    electric power. There are still diesel engines, though now they
    normally drive electric motors.

    The earliest cars were driven by steam and by electricity, but
    hydrocarbons took the lead fairly quickly. Even today, electric cars
    are much more expensive and of lower utility than hydrocarbon-driven
    cars, and are driven by politics. Had they been driven by economics and practicality, they would have become popular decades earlier, and would
    have forced battery development much earlier than actually happened.
    --
    Joe

    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2