• Re: Excellent WSJ Article On What It's Really Like On The Front Lines In Ukraine. NO PAYWALL

    From a425couple@a425couple@hotmail.com to alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,talk.politics.guns,rec.aviation.military,sci.military.naval,soc.history.war.misc on Fri Feb 7 12:17:21 2025
    From Newsgroup: soc.history.war.misc

    On 2/7/25 09:37, John Smyth wrote:
    <https://archive.is/INbWX>

    'POKROVSK, UkrainerCoIn the flat farmland and shattered mining towns surrounding this eastern Ukrainian city, the war has become mainly a
    contest between Russian foot soldiers and Ukrainian explosive drones.
    After nearly three years of fighting, Ukraine is desperately short on infantry to man the trenches. They are outnumbered at least 5-to-1 along
    most of the eastern front, and the men they have are mostly older,
    recently conscripted, and lacking motivation and experience in battle, Ukrainian officers said.
    What KyivrCOs forces have in abundance are dronesrCowhich Ukraine is now relying on to compensate for the lack of infantry.
    Surveillance drones police the 600-mile front line, having all but
    entirely replaced human reconnaissance. When Russian soldiers advance
    toward Ukrainian positions, explosive aerial drones are dispatched to
    pick them off, while larger drones drop bomblets onto them. Infantry
    fire their weapons only when the occasional Russian soldier manages to
    slip past the phalanx of unmanned aerial vehicles.
    The strategy has worked, up to a point. In nearly a year since Moscow
    began marching on Pokrovsk, Russian troops have failed to capture the
    city, despite huge advantages in manpower and artillery ammunition.

    Russian drones are a constant threat in besieged Pokrovsk. WSJrCOs Ian
    Lovett reports from the city where some residents are determined to
    remain, despite MoscowrCOs forces on their doorstep. Photo: Serhii
    Korovayny, Nikita Nikolaienko
    Their slow progress is a testament to just how difficult the
    proliferation of drones has made attacking. Neither side sends large
    armored vehicles all the way to the contact line much anymorerCothey are
    easy targets for drones. Instead, infantry usually hike the last few
    miles on foot, often in groups of just two or three soldiers, which are harder for drones to spot.
    But the age of front lines patrolled by drones instead of humans isnrCOt
    here yet. The Russians are still advancing, albeit slowly. To halt their progress, Ukraine would need a large influx of troops, according to
    several officers fighting in the arearCosomething that is unlikely in the near future.
    rCLDrones canrCOt replace men,rCY said a battalion commander who has been fighting just south of Pokrovsk for the past two months. During that
    time, his battalion has retreated about a mile. rCLThey can disrupt an
    enemy attack, but not fully stop it.rCY
    Without drone support, he added, rCLthe situation would be horrific.rCY
    The same dynamic is playing out across the eastern front, with Russian
    forces putting undermanned Ukrainian brigades under intense pressure
    across a broad swath of territory. Moscow recently seized the city of
    Velyka Novosilka, southwest of Pokrovsk, and is now threatening Chasiv
    Yar to the north.
    In some more rural areas, Ukrainian drone pilots can almost defend the
    line on their own.
    Late last month, The Wall Street Journal visited an aerial-drone
    battalion from UkrainerCOs 60th Mechanized Brigade, which was trying to
    beat back Russian assaults near the northeastern village of Terny. From
    a command post, the battalionrCOs commander, a senior lieutenant who goes
    by the call sign Munin, watched live surveillance-drone feeds as Russian soldiers rushed forward across the flat, marshy fields around Terny
    toward a river.

    A destroyed building in the Ukraine-held city of Pokrovsk last month.
    One of MuninrCOs deputies spotted two Russians sprinting across a bridge,
    and Munin dispatched an explosive drone to hunt them down. As the
    Russians heard the drone approaching, they dropped to the ground. Then a
    huge blast lit up the screen. One man lay still, his leg blown off. The
    other struggled to get to his feet, then fell again.
    rCLI think theyrCOre dead,rCY a drone pilot, who was in a bunker several miles
    back from the front line, said on the radio.
    rCLGo finish him so we know for sure,rCY Munin responded.
    A second drone hit a minute later. rCLPlus two,rCY said 38-year-old Munin, meaning two more Russians killed, bringing the battalionrCOs total that
    day to eight. The nearest Ukrainian infantry hadnrCOt needed to leave
    their foxhole.
    Munin said a massive increase in the quantity of drones at his disposal
    has allowed his battalion to take pressure off infantry.
    A year earlier, his team might have launched 15 first-person-view
    drones, or FPVs, on a busy day. Now, Ukraine is producing roughly
    200,000 drones a month. Munin sends out at least 60 on a normal dayrCoand
    can afford to use them on severely injured Russians. In addition, many surveillance drones are now equipped with thermal-vision cameras, making
    it easy to spot Russian attacks at night.
    Still, the Russians are slowly advancing around Terny and now control
    most of the village. Though they have taken more than 1,000 casualties
    in their assault on the village, Munin said, they seem to have
    rCLunlimited manpowerrCY and continue to send men forward in small groups, which can more easily slip past surveillance drones.
    Sometimes, Russian jammers down Ukrainian drones. On rainy or foggy
    days, most drones canrCOt fly, which gives Russian forces the chance to
    make larger assaults with armored vehicles. Once leaves cover the trees
    again in spring, Russian infantry will be harder for drones to spot.
    And once they spot a Ukrainian position, they hammer it with every type
    of weapon they have until the Ukrainians are forced to withdraw.

    Infantry soldiers from UkrainerCOs 60th Mechanized Brigade in UkrainerCOs Donetsk region last month. The massive deployment of drones has eased pressure on the infantry.
    rCLArtillery, glide bombs, everything,rCY Munin said. rCLUntil you canrCOt use
    the position as cover anymore.rCY
    The Russians also have their own drone army, which is the foremost
    menace for both Ukrainian infantry and civilians in front-line cities. A medic working around Pokrovsk said roughly 70% of the Ukrainian
    casualties in the area come from drone strikes. Any military vehicle
    entering the city is equipped with an array of electronic jammers, but Russians are also using drones that are connected to the pilots by fiber-optic cables and canrCOt be jammed. When soldiers spot them, the
    only reprieve is to shoot them down.
    The enormous volume of drones in the air has changed the nature of
    combat over the past year, according to Ukrainian soldiers.
    Last spring, when a 25-year-old infantry platoon commander first arrived
    in the area south of Pokrovsk, there was lots of close infantry combat,
    he said. Within a month of the brigaderCOs arrival in the Pokrovsk area,
    he said, 80% of the infantry had been injured or killed and were no
    longer fit to fight. Since then, he said, the brigade had retreated
    about 19 miles in the area west of Pokrovsk.
    They are now outnumbered by the Russians about 10-to-1, but the growing supply of dronesrCoplus small influxes of new soldiersrCohave allowed the brigade to continue fighting the Russian advance. The Russians are
    suffering at least seven casualties for every Ukrainian soldier injured
    or killed, he said, but added that Kyiv would need 10 times as many
    troops here to stop MoscowrCOs troops entirely.
    rCLWe just donrCOt have enough people to defend Pokrovsk,rCY he said.
    In open fields, it is relatively easy for drones to spot Russian foot soldiers trying to advance. But in the towns and villages around
    Pokrovsk, where there are more buildings for the Russians to take cover
    from drones, infantry are irreplaceable.
    Several weeks ago, Russian forces advanced into a village south of
    Pokrovsk, first occupying one house on the main street, then another. To properly defend that village, the platoon commander said, Ukrainian
    forces would have needed men in all eight houses on the street. But they didnrCOt have enough, and three weeks ago had to withdraw from the
    village.
    rCLWe donrCOt have enough reinforcements,rCY he said. rCLWe just kept moving back.rCY
    Commanders around Pokrovsk say the quality of reinforcements has also
    become a problem, with most of the new arrivals recent conscripts in
    their 40s and 50s with little motivation to fight. Some abandon
    positions, they say, or refuse to go to first-line trenches. One brigade commander said 30 men of the quality he had early in the war would be
    more effective than 100 of the men he has now.
    A major in the 68th Jaeger Brigade, which is fighting south of Pokrovsk,
    said that new recruits need time to adjust to the reality of life at the front line before they are thrown into a trench.
    rCLBut in the current circumstances, we donrCOt have time to let people adapt,rCY said the major, who goes by the call sign Barracuda. rCLThererCOs a shortage in every position, especially in the infantry.'

    --- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Jim Wilkins@muratlanne@gmail.com to alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,talk.politics.guns,rec.aviation.military,sci.military.naval,soc.history.war.misc on Fri Feb 7 17:03:56 2025
    From Newsgroup: soc.history.war.misc

    "a425couple" wrote in message news:mTtpP.841$lBR6.177@fx41.iad...

    On 2/7/25 09:37, John Smyth wrote:
    <https://archive.is/INbWX>

    'POKROVSK, UkrainerCoIn the flat farmland and shattered mining towns surrounding this eastern Ukrainian city, the war has become mainly a
    contest between Russian foot soldiers and Ukrainian explosive drones.
    -----------------------------------------------

    That sounds much like the German WW1 accounts "All Quiet on the Western
    Front" and "The Storm of Steel", in which abundant Allied artillery pursued anyone seen exposed with hot flying death.

    https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/75011
    The Nazis banned "All Quiet on the Western Front" because its account of battle was so unheroic and gruesome.

    https://ia802904.us.archive.org/26/items/ErnstJngerTheStormOfSteel/Ernst_J%C3%BCnger_The_Storm_of_Steel.pdf

    Life in the French artillery was hard too: https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/54816


    Capturing an enemy trench was fairly easy, until tanks appeared mud and artillery made supporting the assault across No Man's Land impossible.

    --- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2