From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

A REAL DISGRACE took place at the United Nations yesterday rCo Not one,
not two, but three very sinister events! First, the escalator going up
to the Main Speaking Floor came to a screeching halt. It stopped on a
dime. ItrCOs amazing that Melania and I didnrCOt fall forward onto the sharp edges of these steel steps, face first. It was only that we were each
holding the handrail tightly or, it would have been a disaster. This was absolutely sabotage, as noted by a dayrCOs earlier rCLpostrCY in The London Times that said UN workers rCLjoked about turning off an escalator.rCY The people that did it should be arrested! Then, as I stood before a
Television crowd of millions of people all over the World, and important Leaders in the Hall, my teleprompter didnrCOt work. It was stone cold
dark. I immediately thought to myself, rCLWow, first the escalator event,
and now a bad teleprompter. What kind of a place is this?rCY I then
proceeded to make a Speech without a teleprompter, which kicked in about
15 minutes later. The good news is the Speech has gotten fantastic
reviews. Maybe they appreciated the fact that very few people could have
done what I did. And third, after making the Speech, I was told that the
sound was completely off in the Auditorium where the Speech was made,
that World Leaders, unless they used the interpretersrCO earpieces,
couldnrCOt hear a thing. The first person I saw at the conclusion of the Speech was Melania, who was sitting right up front. I said, rCLHow did I do?rCY And she said, rCLI couldnrCOt hear a word you said.rCY This wasnrCOt a coincidence, this was triple sabotage at the UN. They ought to be
ashamed of themselves. IrCOm sending a copy of this letter to the
Secretary General, and I demand an immediate investigation. No wonder
the United Nations hasnrCOt been able to do the job that they were put in existence to do. All security tapes at the escalator should be saved, especially the emergency stop button. The Secret Service is involved.
Thank you for your attention to this matter!

https://truthsocial.com/@realDonaldTrump/posts/115261466629181518

If you made it to the end, congrats. Donald has too much time on his
small hands.
--
"Cough cough"
-- Suzanne Lenglen

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On 9/25/2025 12:18 PM, Pelle Svansl||s wrote:

A REAL DISGRACE took place at the United Nations yesterday rCo Not one,
not two, but three very sinister events! First, the escalator going up
to the Main Speaking Floor came to a screeching halt. It stopped on a
dime. ItrCOs amazing that Melania and I didnrCOt fall forward onto the sharp edges of these steel steps, face first. It was only that we were each holding the handrail tightly or, it would have been a disaster. This was absolutely sabotage, as noted by a dayrCOs earlier rCLpostrCY in The London Times that said UN workers rCLjoked about turning off an escalator.rCY The people that did it should be arrested! Then, as I stood before a
Television crowd of millions of people all over the World, and important Leaders in the Hall, my teleprompter didnrCOt work. It was stone cold
dark. I immediately thought to myself, rCLWow, first the escalator event, and now a bad teleprompter. What kind of a place is this?rCY I then proceeded to make a Speech without a teleprompter, which kicked in about
15 minutes later. The good news is the Speech has gotten fantastic
reviews. Maybe they appreciated the fact that very few people could have done what I did. And third, after making the Speech, I was told that the sound was completely off in the Auditorium where the Speech was made,
that World Leaders, unless they used the interpretersrCO earpieces, couldnrCOt hear a thing. The first person I saw at the conclusion of the Speech was Melania, who was sitting right up front. I said, rCLHow did I do?rCY And she said, rCLI couldnrCOt hear a word you said.rCY This wasnrCOt a
coincidence, this was triple sabotage at the UN. They ought to be
ashamed of themselves. IrCOm sending a copy of this letter to the
Secretary General, and I demand an immediate investigation. No wonder
the United Nations hasnrCOt been able to do the job that they were put in existence to do. All security tapes at the escalator should be saved, especially the emergency stop button. The Secret Service is involved.
Thank you for your attention to this matter!

https://truthsocial.com/@realDonaldTrump/posts/115261466629181518

If you made it to the end, congrats. Donald has too much time on his
small hands.

You got to give it to Trump, he does have brass balls.
--
---------------
Scall5
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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

On 9/25/25 5:08 PM, Scall5 wrote:

On 9/25/2025 12:18 PM, Pelle Svansl||s wrote:

A REAL DISGRACE took place at the United Nations yesterday rCo Not one,
not two, but three very sinister events! First, the escalator going up
to the Main Speaking Floor came to a screeching halt. It stopped on a
dime. ItrCOs amazing that Melania and I didnrCOt fall forward onto the
sharp edges of these steel steps, face first. It was only that we were
each holding the handrail tightly or, it would have been a disaster.
This was absolutely sabotage, as noted by a dayrCOs earlier rCLpostrCY in >> The London Times that said UN workers rCLjoked about turning off an
escalator.rCY The people that did it should be arrested! Then, as I
stood before a Television crowd of millions of people all over the
World, and important Leaders in the Hall, my teleprompter didnrCOt work.
It was stone cold dark. I immediately thought to myself, rCLWow, first
the escalator event, and now a bad teleprompter. What kind of a place
is this?rCY I then proceeded to make a Speech without a teleprompter,
which kicked in about 15 minutes later. The good news is the Speech
has gotten fantastic reviews. Maybe they appreciated the fact that
very few people could have done what I did. And third, after making
the Speech, I was told that the sound was completely off in the
Auditorium where the Speech was made, that World Leaders, unless they
used the interpretersrCO earpieces, couldnrCOt hear a thing. The first
person I saw at the conclusion of the Speech was Melania, who was
sitting right up front. I said, rCLHow did I do?rCY And she said, rCLI
couldnrCOt hear a word you said.rCY This wasnrCOt a coincidence, this was >> triple sabotage at the UN. They ought to be ashamed of themselves. IrCOm
sending a copy of this letter to the Secretary General, and I demand
an immediate investigation. No wonder the United Nations hasnrCOt been
able to do the job that they were put in existence to do. All security
tapes at the escalator should be saved, especially the emergency stop
button. The Secret Service is involved. Thank you for your attention
to this matter!

https://truthsocial.com/@realDonaldTrump/posts/115261466629181518

If you made it to the end, congrats. Donald has too much time on his
small hands.

You got to give it to Trump, he does have brass balls.

The country is being run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine
leadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see a similarly forceful leader.

WRT hands, have you ever seen Xi's?

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping

Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

The country is being run by an unashamedly authoritarian
masculine
leadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson
to see
a similarly forceful leader.

WRT hands, have you ever seen Xi's?

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping

Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?

I guess Trump's masculine... presuming that includes chronic
indecisiveness, emotional neediness, and pathological vanity. The
whininess alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey, you're
entitled to your opinion!
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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

The country is being run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine
leadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see
a similarly forceful leader.

WRT hands, have you ever seen Xi's?

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping

Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?

I guess Trump's masculine... presuming that includes chronic
indecisiveness, emotional neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The whininess alone is a disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled to
your opinion!

So...

"The country is being run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine
leadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see
a similarly forceful leader."

sounded too much like praise, j?

So you are saying we're *not* being run by "an unashamedly authoritarian masculine leadership cadre"?
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> write=

The country is being run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculi=

leadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see>=

a similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen Xi's?>>>> =

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> Napoleon complex=
, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's masculine... presuming that includ=
es chronic > indecisiveness, emotional neediness, and pathological vanity. =
The > whininess alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey, you're entitled =
to > your opinion!So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly authorit= arian masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jacks=
on to seea similarly forceful leader."sounded too much like praise, j?So yo=
u are saying we're *not* being run by "an unashamedly authoritarian masculi=
ne leadership cadre"?-- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~



I think this is a good read for you.


https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-sty= le-214391/


Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established himself as a = woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we like him not what he's sa= ying but for what he is, and we don't really pay attention to what he's say= ing?



Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?


--=20




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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> > >>>> The country is being run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine>> leadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen Xi's?>>>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's masculine... presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, emotional neediness, and pathological vanity. The > whininess alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey, you're entitled to > your opinion!So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to seea similarly forceful leader."sounded too much like praise, j?So you are saying we're *not* being run by "an unashamedly authoritarian masculine leadership cadre"?-- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I think this is a good read for you.

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/

Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we like him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we don't really pay attention to what he's saying?

Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?

Huh.

I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich are. Boy,
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!

Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a UC
professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish
<sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> > >>>> The country is being
run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine>> leadership
cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a
similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen
Xi's?>>>>
https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>>
Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's
masculine... presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness,
emotional neediness, and pathological vanity. The > whininess
alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey, you're entitled to >
your opinion!So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go
back to Andrew Jackson to seea similarly forceful
leader."sounded too much like praise, j?So you are saying
we're *not* being run by "an unashamedly authoritarian
masculine leadership cadre"?--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open
the pod bay doors,
HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I think this is a good read for you.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/
Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established
himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we
like
him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we don't
really pay
attention to what he's saying?
Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?

Huh.

I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich
are. Boy,
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!

Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a
UC
professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?

Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads... mmm, manly?
Must be an Portland thing.
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis wro=

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On 9/25/25 7:44 = PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> > >>>> The=

country is being >>> run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine>> leade= rship >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>=

similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>= >>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napole=

on complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine... presumi=
ng that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional neediness, and pat= hological vanity. The > whininess >>> alone is a disqualifier for me. But=
hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion!So..."The country is being run =
by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd h= ave to go >>> back to Andrew Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader.= "sounded too much like praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being ru=
n by "an unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>> ~= ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"= Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you= .>> https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking= -style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has establis= hed>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> lik= e>> him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay=

attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could = say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and D= ennis Kusinich > are. Boy,> oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie S= anders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, = like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair = transplants, girdles, shoulder pads... mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thin=

g.




This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona is ta= inted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world anymo= re.




It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and anim= als. If science were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd probably have t=
o use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it wouldn't be a true mammoth = from a bygone era, technically, but would be very very close to it.


This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection etc =
so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you jdeluise=
note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat and partiall=
y, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes or made him more v= isible, palpatable and relatable than for example Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.=20




So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take him =
by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's words are=
meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other, but we=
don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.





--=20




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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM,
*skriptis wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in
message:r>>> On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>>
<sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>>
run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>>
cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a

similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever

seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>>
https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>>
Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>>
masculine... presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness,

emotional neediness, and pathological vanity. The >

whininess >>> alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey, you're
entitled to > >>> your opinion!So..."The country is being run
by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian masculineleadership
cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew Jackson to seea
similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like praise,
j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an
unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?--

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open

the pod bay doors, >>>

HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>>
I think this is a good read for you.>>
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>>
Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>>
himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we

like>> him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we

don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a
Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I
hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich >
are. Boy,> oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie
Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that
someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us
straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder
pads... mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho
persona is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our
world anymore.

It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different
spices and animals. If science were to recreate mammoth, clone
it, they'd probably have to use bits of elephant genome or
whatever so it wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era,
technically, but would be very very close to it.

This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful
projection etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in
feminine style, as you jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants,
words often, etc so somewhat and partially, it's kinda feminine,
and I do believe it's what makes or made him more visible,
palpatable and relatable than for example Ted Cruz who seemed
dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.

So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We
don't take him by his words. His fans don't care what he says,
basically Trump's words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the
other, but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

He's also catty and vindictive. This indictment of Comey for
instance, I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for
vindictive prosecution. Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal
ran.. I mean posts, and pleas to Bondi. Some of these other
"mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are similarly fraught. Trump
may not even care about winning them, he's just hissing and
scratching. Normative manly behavior? Ya, I think not.
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:> jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com>=

Wrote in message:r>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:=
38 PM, >> *skriptis wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in >> mes= sage:r>>> On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> >> <sawfish666@g= mail.com> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> >> run by an unashamedly=
authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> >> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go b= ack to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >> >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT = hands, have you ever >> seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> >> https://www.cnn.com/2022/= 10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> >> Napoleon complex, but with hand-si=

I guess Trump's >>> >> masculine... presuming that includes chronic =

indecisiveness, >> >>> emotional neediness, and pathological vanity. The=

whininess >>> alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey, you're >> ent=

itled to > >>> your opinion!So..."The country is being run >> by an unasham= edly >>> authoritarian masculineleadership >> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go = >>> back to Andrew Jackson to seea >> similarly forceful >>> leader."sounde=
d too much like praise, >> j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by=
"an >> unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >> >>>=

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~"Open >> >>> the pod bay doors, >>> >> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> >> I think this is a goo=

d read for you.>> >> https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-= feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> >> Basically if this is true it could mea=
n Trump has established>> >> himself as a woman in our relationship to him,=
he talks but we >> >> like>> him not what he's saying but for what he is, = and we >> don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a >>=
Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I >> hadn't re= alized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > >> are. Boy,> oh boy, w=
as I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie >> Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, s= kript! I'm sure glad that >> someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can def= initively set us >> straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, should=
er >> pads... mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.>>>>> This is a funny t= opic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.>> I feel there's something in = it.>> In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho > perso=
na is tainted by the era in which he lives.>> He has to, sort of, evolve to=
maintain success.>> So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neith=
er is our > world anymore.>>>>> It's basically like those genetic manipulat= ion of different > spices and animals. If science were to recreate mammoth=
, clone > it, they'd probably have to use bits of elephant genome or > what= ever so it wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, > technically, but=
would be very very close to it.>>> This is it.>> Trump is masculine no dou=
bt in his views, resolve, forceful > projection etc so Sawfish is right, bu=
t he's wrapped it in > feminine style, as you jdeluise note, make up, hair = transplants, > words often, etc so somewhat and partially, it's kinda femin= ine, > and I do believe it's what makes or made him more visible, > palpata= ble and relatable than for example Ted Cruz who seemed > dull?>> Not commen= ting on politics at all. >>>>> So the really funny thing is we do treat him=
as a woman. We > don't take him by his words. His fans don't care what he = says, > basically Trump's words are meaningless?>> He says so much and of c= ourse something has to contradict the > other, but we don't care.>> If you = like him, you like him.>> So yeah, he's like a woman to us.He's also catty = and vindictive. This indictment of Comey for instance, I'd be shocked if i=
t didn't get thrown out for vindictive prosecution. Mostly due to Trump's = own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts, and pleas to Bondi. Some of these = other "mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are similarly fraught. Trump may=
not even care about winning them, he's just hissing and scratching. Norma= tive manly behavior? Ya, I think not.




But crushing your enemies is also very masculine.=20

Showing mercy or building bridges after you have won, is one thing, but fig= hting is another.

E.g. handshakes in men's game are often warmer and more cordial and women a=
re bitches.=20


https://www.reddit.com/r/tennis/comments/1hzidn3/qinwen_zheng_says_if_she_l= oses_she_wont_give_a_handshake


https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/sports/international-sports/iga-witek-v= s-victoria-azarenka-the-viral-frostbite-handshake-that-shocked-tennis-fans/= articleshow/122107232.cms


https://www.cbc.ca/sports/tennis/eugenie-bouchard-loses-after-refusing-to-s= hake-opponent-s-hand-1.3038945




But men's cordial handshake and hugs all of that is after the war. Men figh=
t hard.

Trump is still in a war.


This is very Sawfish is right.




--=20




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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:> jdeluise
<jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>> Sawfish
<sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, >>
*skriptis wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in >>
message:r>>> On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>>

<sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> > >>>> The country is being

run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine>>

leadership >>> >> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew
Jackson to see>> a >> >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT
hands, have you ever >> seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> >>
https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>>

Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>>
masculine... presuming that includes chronic >

indecisiveness, >> >>> emotional neediness, and pathological
vanity. The > >> whininess >>> alone is a disqualifier for me.
But hey, you're >> entitled to > >>> your opinion!So..."The
country is being run >> by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian
masculineleadership >> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to
Andrew Jackson to seea >> similarly forceful >>>
leader."sounded too much like praise, >> j?So you are saying

we're *not* being run by "an >> unashamedly authoritarian
masculine leadership cadre"?-- >> >>> >>

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open

the pod bay doors, >>> >>

HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>>

I think this is a good read for you.>> >>

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>>

Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has

established>> >> himself as a woman in our relationship to him,
he talks but we >> >> like>> him not what he's saying but for
what he is, and we >> don't >> really pay>> attention to what
he's saying?>> Maybe a >> Pelle, expert on genders could say a
word here?>> >> Huh.>> I >> hadn't realized how masculine Ted
Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > >> are. Boy,> oh boy, was I ever
wrong about them!!! Bernie >> Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much,
skript! I'm sure glad that >> someone smart, like a > UC>
professor, can definitively set us >> straight, huh?Makeup,
hair transplants, girdles, shoulder >> pads... mmm, manly? Must
be an Portland thing.>>>>> This is a funny topic but I for one
do not dismiss this idea.>> I feel there's something in it.>>
In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho >
persona is tainted by the era in which he lives.>> He has to,
sort of, evolve to maintain success.>> So he's not really
"macho" per old textbook, but neither is our > world
anymore.>>>>> It's basically like those genetic manipulation of
different > spices and animals. If science were to recreate
mammoth, clone > it, they'd probably have to use bits of
elephant genome or > whatever so it wouldn't be a true mammoth
from a bygone era, > technically, but would be very very close
to it.>>> This is it.>> Trump is masculine no doubt in his
views, resolve, forceful > projection etc so Sawfish is right,
but he's wrapped it in > feminine style, as you jdeluise note,
make up, hair transplants, > words often, etc so somewhat and
partially, it's kinda feminine, > and I do believe it's what
makes or made him more visible, > palpatable and relatable than
for example Ted Cruz who seemed > dull?>> Not commenting on
politics at all. >>>>> So the really funny thing is we do treat
him as a woman. We > don't take him by his words. His fans
don't care what he says, > basically Trump's words are
meaningless?>> He says so much and of course something has to
contradict the > other, but we don't care.>> If you like him,
you like him.>> So yeah, he's like a woman to us.He's also
catty and vindictive. This indictment of Comey for instance,
I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive
prosecution. Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I
mean posts, and pleas to Bondi. Some of these other "mortgage
fraud" cases he's brought are similarly fraught. Trump may not
even care about winning them, he's just hissing and scratching.
Normative manly behavior? Ya, I think not.

But crushing your enemies is also very masculine.

I said he's NOT crushing his enemies with these cases, they're
likely to be losers out of the gate. This new fall gu.., I mean
attorney he appointed to try Comey is a former beauty pageant
contestant who has never tried a case before. As I said, just
hissing and scratching.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

On 9/25/25 11:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com>
writes:> > >>>> The country is being run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculine>> leadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go
back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT
hands, have you ever seen Xi's?>>>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/
asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> >
I guess Trump's masculine... presuming that includes chronic >
indecisiveness, emotional neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The > >>>> whininess alone is a disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled
to > your opinion!So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back
to Andrew Jackson to seea similarly forceful leader."sounded too
much like praise, j?So you are saying we're *not* being run by "an
unashamedly authoritarian masculine leadership cadre"?--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I think this is a good read for you.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-
speaking-style-214391/
Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established
himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we like
him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we don't really pay
attention to what he's saying?
Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?

Huh.

I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich are. Boy,
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!

Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a UC
professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?

Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads... mmm, manly? Must be
an Portland thing.

I *knew* we should have moved. Right after the Occupy Movement, downtown.

I told my wife, but she wouldn't listen...

Now it's civic drag shows...Stark St renamed to Harvey Milk Blvd...

:^O
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

On 9/26/25 12:17 AM, *skriptis wrote:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine... presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional neediness, and pathological vanity. The > whininess >>> alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion!So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you.>> https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> like>> him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,> oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads... mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world anymore.

It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and animals. If science were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically, but would be very very close to it.

This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.

So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other, but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

I think those are supportable and plausible points. I also think that we
could examine historical leaders and maybe we'd see an evolution.

My guess is that when alpha male leaders quit having outrageously large
harems is when it started.

What say you?
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

On 9/26/25 12:38 AM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis
wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On
9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com>
writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go
back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>>
WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://
www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napoleon
complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine...
presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional
neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The > whininess >>> alone is a
disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion!
So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian
masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew
Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like
praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an
unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you.>> https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> like>> him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,> oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads... mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona
is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world
anymore.




It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and
animals. If science-a were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd
probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it
wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically, but would
be very very close to it.


This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection
etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you
jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat
and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes
or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example
Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.



So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take
him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's
words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other,
but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

He's also catty and vindictive.-a This indictment of Comey for instance,
I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive prosecution. Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts, and pleas
to Bondi.-a Some of these other "mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are similarly fraught.-a Trump may not even care about winning them, he's
just hissing and scratching.-a Normative manly behavior?-a Ya, I think not.

In all truth, j., it depends on by what standard we define masculine for
this discussion. If we use Clint Eastwood/John Wayne, your points have
value. If we use Henry VIII not so much.

So it depends where you set the bar.
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

On 9/26/25 8:40 AM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:> jdeluise
<jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>> Sawfish
<sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, >> *skriptis
wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in >> message:r>>> On
9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> >>
<sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> >>
run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> >>
cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >> >>>
similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever >> seen >>>
Xi's?>>>> >>> >> https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-
jinping>>>> >>> >> Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess
Trump's >>> >> masculine... presuming that includes chronic >
indecisiveness, >> >>> emotional neediness, and pathological vanity.
The > >> whininess >>> alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey,
you're >> entitled to > >>> your opinion!So..."The country is being
run >> by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian masculineleadership >>
cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew Jackson to seea >>
similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like praise, >> j?So
you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an >> unashamedly
authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >> >>> >>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >> >>> the pod bay doors, >>> >> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> >> I think this is a good read for you.>> >> https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> >> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> >> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> >> like>> him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we >> don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a >> Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I >> hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > >> are. Boy,> oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie >> Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that >> someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us >> straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder >> pads... mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.>>>>> This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.>> I feel there's something in it.>> In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho > persona is tainted by the era in which he lives.>> He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.>> So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our > world anymore.>>>>> It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different > spices and animals. If science-a were to recreate mammoth, clone > it, they'd probably have to use bits of elephant genome or > whatever so it wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, > technically, but would be very very close to it.>>> This is it.>> Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful > projection etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in > feminine style, as you jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, > words often, etc so somewhat and partially, it's kinda feminine, > and I do believe it's what makes or made him more visible, > palpatable and relatable than for example Ted Cruz who seemed > dull?>> Not commenting on politics at all. >>>>> So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We > don't take him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, > basically Trump's words are meaningless?>> He says so much and of course something has to contradict the > other, but we don't care.>> If you like him, you like him.>> So yeah, he's like a woman to us.He's also catty and vindictive.-a This indictment of Comey for instance, I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive prosecution.-a Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts, and pleas to Bondi.-a Some of these other "mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are similarly fraught.-a Trump may not even care about winning them, he's just hissing and scratching. Normative manly behavior?-a Ya, I think not.

But crushing your enemies is also very masculine.

I said he's NOT crushing his enemies with these cases, they're likely to
be losers out of the gate.-a This new fall gu.., I mean attorney he appointed to try Comey is a former beauty pageant contestant who has
never tried a case before.-a As I said, just hissing and scratching.

It's fun to try to be the first to guess, isn't it, j?

The w2hole point of my long rants since Trump was re-elected is that for
the first time in my life it looks to me like there is a maybe 50-50
chance that all legal niceties will go out the win, al al Franco.

So I'm really reluctant to look at Trump's personal vengeance as
superficially catty--it could simply be the first wave of persecutions.
We'll see, and the first solid indication will be the 2026 midterms,
although such moves as enlarging ICE, sending the National Guard into
cities, and little gatherings like this:

https://www.cnn.com/2025/09/25/politics/hegseth-generals-surprise-meeting

Might be meaningful.

So really, I don't know. And I know that you don't, either. Why, I'd bet
that even skriptis doesn't know, for sure...

But I do know that not all forms of democracy are stable and viable--and
I'm thinking that describes the current state of the US form--and it
would be possible to find a niche and have a decent life in a less
democratic political milieu. But you have to put it on your radar
screen, or it's the gulag for you...

..and yet the stock market seems to like all this, so far.

Yes/no?
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

------=_Part_0_170848030.1758926973538
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

On 9/26/25 12:17 AM, *skriptis wrote:> jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrot=

e in message:r>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM=
, *skriptis wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> O=
n 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com> writ=

The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly authoritarian ma=

sculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackso=
n to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever se=
en >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping= >>>> >>> Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> mascu= line... presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional nee= diness, and pathological vanity. The > whininess >>> alone is a disqualifi=
er for me. But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion!So..."The countr=
y is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian masculineleadership cadr=
e. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew Jackson to seea similarly force= ful >>> leader."sounded too much like praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're=
*not* being run by "an unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership = cadre"?-- >>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a go=
od read for you.>> https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-fe= minine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Tru=
mp has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talk=
s but we >> like>> him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we don'=
t >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on=
genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine=
Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,> oh boy, was I ever wrong about t= hem!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that = someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, hu= h?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads... mmm, manly? Must be a=
n Portland thing.> > > > > This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismi=
ss this idea.> > I feel there's something in it.> > In a world that's has b= een thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona is tainted by the era in whi=
ch he lives.> > He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.> > So he's = not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world anymore.> > >=

It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and=

animals. If science were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd probably h= ave to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it wouldn't be a true mam= moth from a bygone era, technically, but would be very very close to it.> >=

This is it.> > Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forcef=

ul projection etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine styl=
e, as you jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so som= ewhat and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes =
or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example Ted Cru=
z who seemed dull?> > Not commenting on politics at all.> > > > > So the re= ally funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take him by his wo= rds. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's words are meaningl= ess?> > He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other=
, but we don't care.> > If you like him, you like him.> > So yeah, he's lik=
e a woman to us.> > > > > I think those are supportable and plausible point=
s. I also think that we could examine historical leaders and maybe we'd see=
an evolution.My guess is that when alpha male leaders quit having outrageo= usly large harems is when it started.What say you?-- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open the pod bay door=
s, HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~= ~~~~~~~~



There is no golden age really, in Mozart era men wore wigs and makeup and h= igh heels. Is that masculine?


Perhaps the most masculine era was Victorian age, and we feel the residue o=
f that, but that's not usual age at all.

It was perhaps the best, but it's hardly a historical norm.



Here's another thought. Why did Germans die for Fatherland and Russians for=
Motherland?

It's the same kinda, but also it is isn't.

Language is important.



So that's why I am open to analysis like these regarding Trump.




--=20




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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

On 9/26/25 3:49 PM, *skriptis wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

On 9/26/25 12:17 AM, *skriptis wrote:> jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On 9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napoleon complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine... presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional neediness, and pathological vanity. The > whininess >>> alone is a disqualifier for me. But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion!So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you.>> https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> like>> him not what he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,> oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads... mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.> > > > > This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.> > I feel there's something in it.> > In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona is tainted by the era in which he lives.> > He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.> > So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world anymore.> > > > > It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and animals. If science were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically, but would be very very close to it.> > > This is it.> > Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example Ted Cruz who seemed dull?> > Not commenting on politics at all.> > > > > So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's words are meaningless?> > He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other, but we don't care.> > If you like him, you like him.> > So yeah, he's like a woman to us.> > > > > I think those are supportable and plausible points. I also think that we could examine historical leaders and maybe we'd see an evolution.My guess is that when alpha male leaders quit having outrageously large harems is when it started.What say you?-- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There is no golden age really, in Mozart era men wore wigs and makeup and high heels. Is that masculine?

Perhaps the most masculine era was Victorian age, and we feel the residue of that, but that's not usual age at all.

It was perhaps the best, but it's hardly a historical norm.

Here's another thought. Why did Germans die for Fatherland and Russians for Motherland?

It's the same kinda, but also it is isn't.

Language is important.

So that's why I am open to analysis like these regarding Trump.

These are all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The notion that
we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a reflection
of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as regards normed
sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more indicative
of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were wealthy wore high heels
and wigs, but males tended to get more oral sex.

... :^O

And so now, with all the industrial nations, wigs, high heels, etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as many as he/she wants, so given
that availability, the dividing, defining criterion has become sex. If
I'm a transvestite who flatters himslef to think he's a woman, he starts
with wigs and heels, and swishes along from there.

That seems like a valid alternate view. What do you think?

Too, the truly dominant individual--and these can be of either sex, but
are over time disproportionately male--can, by exercise of power, make
*any* behavior/appearance "acceptable" simply as a means of forcing the
rest of the populace to say "uncle!", figuratively. The Emperor's New
Clothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two such examples.

Masculinity is defined by actions and attitudes. Fire-bombing speed
boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been wearing a
cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less masculine an
act...

;^)
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

These are all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The
notion that
we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a
reflection
of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as regards
normed
sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more
indicative of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were
wealthy
wore high heels and wigs, but males tended to get more oral sex.

... :^O

And so now, with all the industrial nations, wigs, high heels,
etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as many as he/she
wants,
so given that availability, the dividing, defining criterion has
become sex. If I'm a transvestite who flatters himslef to think
he's a
woman, he starts with wigs and heels, and swishes along from
there.

That seems like a valid alternate view. What do you think?

Too, the truly dominant individual--and these can be of either
sex,
but are over time disproportionately male--can, by exercise of
power,
make *any* behavior/appearance "acceptable" simply as a means of
forcing the rest of the populace to say "uncle!",
figuratively. The
Emperor's New Clothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two such
examples.

Masculinity is defined by actions and attitudes. Fire-bombing
speed
boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been
wearing a
cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less
masculine an
act...

;^)

I see it as the act of a narcissist who hates boundaries. For it
to be a purely masculine act he'd have to follow it up with
behaviors that are actually masculine. His whining, his
indecisiveness, his pleading to his underlings, his
over-compensation... all the behaviors we mentioned before that
advertise he's insecure about his appearance, his intelligence,
his appeal. Nah, not a great example of masculinity.

Maybe you have a bit of a man crush on him?
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On 9/26/25 7:24 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

These are all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The notion that
we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a reflection
of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as regards normed
sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more
indicative of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were wealthy
wore high heels and wigs, but males tended to get more oral sex.

... :^O

And so now, with all the industrial nations, wigs, high heels,
etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as many as he/she wants,
so given that availability, the dividing, defining criterion has
become sex. If I'm a transvestite who flatters himslef to think he's a
woman, he starts with wigs and heels, and swishes along from there.

That seems like a valid alternate view. What do you think?

Too, the truly dominant individual--and these can be of either sex,
but are over time disproportionately male--can, by exercise of power,
make *any* behavior/appearance "acceptable" simply as a means of
forcing the rest of the populace to say "uncle!", figuratively. The
Emperor's New Clothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two such
examples.

Masculinity is defined by actions and attitudes. Fire-bombing speed
boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been wearing a
cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less masculine an
act...

;^)

I see it as the act of a narcissist who hates boundaries.

But a *masculine* narcisist, j.

-a For it to be
a purely masculine act he'd have to follow it up with behaviors that are actually masculine.-a His whining, his indecisiveness, his pleading to
his underlings, his over-compensation... all the behaviors we mentioned before that advertise he's insecure about his appearance, his
intelligence, his appeal.-a Nah, not a great example of masculinity.

Maybe you have a bit of a man crush on him?

...or maybe, like Justice Jackson, you can't clearly define what a woman
is, or a man...

Ah, well, j...
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 9/26/25 7:24 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

These are all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The
notion that
we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a
reflection
of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as regards
normed
sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more
indicative of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were
wealthy
wore high heels and wigs, but males tended to get more oral
sex.

... :^O

And so now, with all the industrial nations, wigs, high heels,
etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as many as he/she
wants,
so given that availability, the dividing, defining criterion
has
become sex. If I'm a transvestite who flatters himslef to
think he's a
woman, he starts with wigs and heels, and swishes along from
there.

That seems like a valid alternate view. What do you think?

Too, the truly dominant individual--and these can be of either
sex,
but are over time disproportionately male--can, by exercise of
power,
make *any* behavior/appearance "acceptable" simply as a means
of
forcing the rest of the populace to say "uncle!",
figuratively. The
Emperor's New Clothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two such
examples.

Masculinity is defined by actions and attitudes. Fire-bombing
speed
boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been
wearing a
cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less
masculine an
act...

;^)

I see it as the act of a narcissist who hates boundaries.

But a *masculine* narcisist, j.

-a For it to be a purely masculine act he'd have to follow it up
with
behaviors that are actually masculine.-a His whining, his
indecisiveness, his pleading to his underlings, his
over-compensation... all the behaviors we mentioned before that
advertise he's insecure about his appearance, his intelligence,
his
appeal.-a Nah, not a great example of masculinity.
Maybe you have a bit of a man crush on him?

...or maybe, like Justice Jackson, you can't clearly define what
a
woman is, or a man...

Ah, well, j...

Look, I'm not seriously saying he's feminine either. But good god
man, he's certainly not the macho manly-man you seem to think he
is. Not by a long shot.
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On 9/26/25 8:09 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 9/26/25 7:24 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

These are all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The notion that >>>> we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a reflection >>>> of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as regards normed
sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more
indicative of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were wealthy
wore high heels and wigs, but males tended to get more oral sex.

... :^O

And so now, with all the industrial nations, wigs, high heels,
etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as many as he/she wants,
so given that availability, the dividing, defining criterion has
become sex. If I'm a transvestite who flatters himslef to think he's a >>>> woman, he starts with wigs and heels, and swishes along from there.

That seems like a valid alternate view. What do you think?

Too, the truly dominant individual--and these can be of either sex,
but are over time disproportionately male--can, by exercise of power,
make *any* behavior/appearance "acceptable" simply as a means of
forcing the rest of the populace to say "uncle!", figuratively. The
Emperor's New Clothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two such
examples.

Masculinity is defined by actions and attitudes. Fire-bombing speed
boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been wearing a
cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less masculine an >>>> act...

;^)

I see it as the act of a narcissist who hates boundaries.

But a *masculine* narcisist, j.

-a For it to be a purely masculine act he'd have to follow it up with
behaviors that are actually masculine.-a His whining, his
indecisiveness, his pleading to his underlings, his
over-compensation... all the behaviors we mentioned before that
advertise he's insecure about his appearance, his intelligence, his
appeal.-a Nah, not a great example of masculinity.
Maybe you have a bit of a man crush on him?

...or maybe, like Justice Jackson, you can't clearly define what a
woman is, or a man...

Ah, well, j...

Look, I'm not seriously saying he's feminine either.-a But good god man, he's certainly not the macho manly-man you seem to think he is.-a Not by
a long shot.

It's as I originally said: the US is being led (ruled) by an
authoritarian masculine cadre. You're the guy who brought Trump into
this discussion.

Really, they're deporting people without process, to what looks like international *commercial* concentration camps, killing *suspected*
criminals in international territory, labeling trans folk as deviants
and denying them treatment. None of those acts are normally associated
with the tradition of feminine patience and nurturing. That's why I'm characterizing it as a masculine authoritarian regime.

Do you see it substantially differently?
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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*skriptis kirjoitti 27.9.2025 klo 1.49:

Why did Germans die for Fatherland and Russians for Motherland?

Because a Russian rarely knows their father?
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Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 9/26/25 8:09 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 9/26/25 7:24 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

These are all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The
notion that
we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a
reflection
of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as
regards normed
sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more
indicative of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were
wealthy
wore high heels and wigs, but males tended to get more oral
sex.

... :^O

And so now, with all the industrial nations, wigs, high
heels,
etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as many as
he/she wants,
so given that availability, the dividing, defining criterion
has
become sex. If I'm a transvestite who flatters himslef to
think he's a
woman, he starts with wigs and heels, and swishes along from
there.

That seems like a valid alternate view. What do you think?

Too, the truly dominant individual--and these can be of
either sex,
but are over time disproportionately male--can, by exercise
of power,
make *any* behavior/appearance "acceptable" simply as a
means of
forcing the rest of the populace to say "uncle!",
figuratively. The
Emperor's New Clothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two
such
examples.

Masculinity is defined by actions and
attitudes. Fire-bombing speed
boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been
wearing a
cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less
masculine an
act...

;^)

I see it as the act of a narcissist who hates boundaries.

But a *masculine* narcisist, j.

-a For it to be a purely masculine act he'd have to follow it
up with
behaviors that are actually masculine.-a His whining, his
indecisiveness, his pleading to his underlings, his
over-compensation... all the behaviors we mentioned before
that
advertise he's insecure about his appearance, his
intelligence, his
appeal.-a Nah, not a great example of masculinity.
Maybe you have a bit of a man crush on him?

...or maybe, like Justice Jackson, you can't clearly define
what a
woman is, or a man...

Ah, well, j...

Look, I'm not seriously saying he's feminine either.-a But good
god
man, he's certainly not the macho manly-man you seem to think
he
is.-a Not by a long shot.

It's as I originally said: the US is being led (ruled) by an
authoritarian masculine cadre. You're the guy who brought Trump
into
this discussion.

Really, they're deporting people without process, to what looks
like
international *commercial* concentration camps, killing
*suspected*
criminals in international territory, labeling trans folk as
deviants
and denying them treatment. None of those acts are normally
associated
with the tradition of feminine patience and nurturing. That's
why I'm
characterizing it as a masculine authoritarian regime.

Do you see it substantially differently?

I don't by default associate authoritarianism with masculinity.
You may, and that's fine. But there have been authoritarian
female state leaders too. Would you characterize Catherine the
Great as masculine? Even in this administration you see budding authoritarianist women. Is Pam Bondi "masculine" also because she
said she wants to prosecute negative speech towards Charlie Kirk?

How about the old school marms who ruled the classroom with a
ruler or a paddle? Masculine?

I don't think we see it vastly differently though. Just, I don't
see Trump as a particularly masculine figure based on the overall
package.
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TT <TT@dprk.kp> writes:

*skriptis kirjoitti 27.9.2025 klo 1.49:

Why did Germans die for Fatherland and Russians for
Motherland?

Because a Russian rarely knows their father?

ZING :)
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------=_Part_0_165033789.1758957156266
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/26/25 8:09 PM, jdeluise wrot=

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:>> >>> On 9/26/25 7:24 PM, jdelu= ise wrote:>>>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:>>>>>>>>>>>>>> These a=

re all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The >>>>> notion that>>>>> = we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a >>>>> reflectio= n>>>>> of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as >>>>> regards = normed>>>>> sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more>>>=

indicative of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were >>>>> wealthy= >>>>> wore high heels and wigs, but males tended to get more oral >>>>> sex= .>>>>>>>>>> ... :^O>>>>>>>>>> And so now, with all the industrial nations, = wigs, high >>>>> heels,>>>>> etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as=

many as >>>>> he/she wants,>>>>> so given that availability, the dividing,=
defining criterion >>>>> has>>>>> become sex. If I'm a transvestite who fl= atters himslef to >>>>> think he's a>>>>> woman, he starts with wigs and he= els, and swishes along from >>>>> there.>>>>>>>>>> That seems like a valid = alternate view. What do you think?>>>>>>>>>> Too, the truly dominant indivi= dual--and these can be of >>>>> either sex,>>>>> but are over time dispropo= rtionately male--can, by exercise >>>>> of power,>>>>> make *any* behavior/= appearance "acceptable" simply as a >>>>> means of>>>>> forcing the rest of=
the populace to say "uncle!", >>>>> figuratively. The>>>>> Emperor's New C= lothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two >>>>> such>>>>> examples.>>>>>>>= >>> Masculinity is defined by actions and >>>>> attitudes. Fire-bombing spe= ed>>>>> boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been >>>>> we= aring a>>>>> cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less >>>>=

masculine an>>>>> act...>>>>>>>>>> ;^)>>>> I see it as the act of a narci=

ssist who hates boundaries.>>>>>> But a *masculine* narcisist, j.>>>>>>> = For it to be a purely masculine act he'd have to follow it >>>> up with>>>>=
behaviors that are actually masculine. His whining, his>>>> indecisivenes=
s, his pleading to his underlings, his>>>> over-compensation... all the beh= aviors we mentioned before >>>> that>>>> advertise he's insecure about his = appearance, his >>>> intelligence, his>>>> appeal. Nah, not a great exampl=
e of masculinity.>>>> Maybe you have a bit of a man crush on him?>>>>>> ...=
or maybe, like Justice Jackson, you can't clearly define >>> what a>>> woma=
n is, or a man...>>>>>> Ah, well, j...>> Look, I'm not seriously saying he'=
s feminine either. But good >> god>> man, he's certainly not the macho man= ly-man you seem to think >> he>> is. Not by a long shot.>> It's as I origi= nally said: the US is being led (ruled) by an> authoritarian masculine cadr=
e. You're the guy who brought Trump > into> this discussion.>> Really, they= 're deporting people without process, to what looks > like> international *= commercial* concentration camps, killing > *suspected*> criminals in intern= ational territory, labeling trans folk as > deviants> and denying them trea= tment. None of those acts are normally > associated> with the tradition of = feminine patience and nurturing. That's > why I'm> characterizing it as a m= asculine authoritarian regime.>> Do you see it substantially differently?I = don't by default associate authoritarianism with masculinity. You may, and = that's fine. But there have been authoritarian female state leaders too. = Would you characterize Catherine the Great as masculine? Even in this admi= nistration you see budding authoritarianist women. Is Pam Bondi "masculine=
" also because she said she wants to prosecute negative speech towards Char= lie Kirk?How about the old school marms who ruled the classroom with a rule=
r or a paddle? Masculine?I don't think we see it vastly differently though=
. Just, I don't see Trump as a particularly masculine figure based on the = overall package.



Catherine the Great was product of her time, enlightenment.

It was a micro-woke period, to say it in terms we are familiar with.

One simple but most likely incomplete historical measure is to follow the b= eards. When men wear beards, it's anti-woke. They didn't wear beards then.


Kudos to her, she was neither direct heir to throne nor a male. She's reall=
y a very successful usurper. She pulled a magnificent upset.

(It's probably what made Hitler think Russians are weak, a German girl seiz= ing their throne).



Still, even in her time, the whole system she ruled over, was nevertheless = masculine. It was woke enough to allow her to climb to power, but it wasn't=
really a woke world.

The era was still brutal and masculine I would say, it's just that people s=
aw enlightenment as the goal and were open to certain ideas.

Yet all those counts, generals she seduced, punished and rewarded, led and = ordered, were tough battleted guys who waged wars.

She just came to be as a sort of Queen in insect world.

That's Margaret Thatcher for you. A figure in a rather masculine system.




--=20




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On 9/26/25 11:26 PM, TT wrote:

*skriptis kirjoitti 27.9.2025 klo 1.49:

-a Why did Germans die for Fatherland and Russians for Motherland?

Because a Russian rarely knows their father?

I thought that only applied to Ireland...

Live & learn...
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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On 9/27/25 12:12 AM, *skriptis wrote:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/26/25 8:09 PM, jdeluise wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:>> >>> On 9/26/25 7:24 PM, jdeluise wrote:>>>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:>>>>>>>>>>>>>> These are all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The >>>>> notion that>>>>> we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a >>>>> reflection>>>>> of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as >>>>> regards normed>>>>> sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more>>>>> indicative of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were >>>>> wealthy>>>>> wore high heels and wigs, but males tended to get more oral >>>>> sex.>>>>>>>>>> ... :^O>>>>>>>>>> And so now, with all the industrial nations, wigs, high >>>>> heels,>>>>> etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as many as >>>>> he/she wants,>>>>> so given that availability, the dividing, defining criterion >>>>> has>>>>> become sex. If I'm a transvestite who flatters himslef to >>>>> think he's a>>>>> woman, he starts with wigs and heels, and swishes along from >>>>> there.>>>>>>>>>> That seems like a valid alternate view. What do you think?>>>>>>>>>> Too, the truly dominant individual--and these can be of >>>>> either sex,>>>>> but are over time disproportionately male--can, by exercise >>>>> of power,>>>>> make *any* behavior/appearance "acceptable" simply as a >>>>> means of>>>>> forcing the rest of the populace to say "uncle!", >>>>> figuratively. The>>>>> Emperor's New Clothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two >>>>> such>>>>> examples.>>>>>>>>>> Masculinity is defined by actions and >>>>> attitudes. Fire-bombing speed>>>>> boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been >>>>> wearing a>>>>> cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less >>>>> masculine an>>>>> act...>>>>>>>>>> ;^)>>>> I see it as the act of a narcissist who hates boundaries.>>>>>> But a *masculine* narcisist, j.>>>>>>> For it to be a purely masculine act he'd have to follow it >>>> up with>>>> behaviors that are actually masculine. His whining, his>>>> indecisiveness, his pleading to his underlings, his>>>> over-compensation... all the behaviors we mentioned before >>>> that>>>> advertise he's insecure about his appearance, his >>>> intelligence, his>>>> appeal. Nah, not a great example of masculinity.>>>> Maybe you have a bit of a man crush on him?>>>>>> ...or maybe, like Justice Jackson, you can't clearly define >>> what a>>> woman is, or a man...>>>>>> Ah, well, j...>> Look, I'm not seriously saying he's feminine either. But good >> god>> man, he's certainly not the macho manly-man you seem to think >> he>> is. Not by a long shot.>> It's as I originally said: the US is being led (ruled) by an> authoritarian masculine cadre. You're the guy who brought Trump > into> this discussion.>> Really, they're deporting people without process, to what looks > like> international *commercial* concentration camps, killing > *suspected*> criminals in international territory, labeling trans folk as > deviants> and denying them treatment. None of those acts are normally > associated> with the tradition of feminine patience and nurturing. That's > why I'm> characterizing it as a masculine authoritarian regime.>> Do you see it substantially differently?I don't by default associate authoritarianism with masculinity. You may, and that's fine. But there have been authoritarian female state leaders too. Would you characterize Catherine the Great as masculine? Even in this administration you see budding authoritarianist women. Is Pam Bondi "masculine" also because she said she wants to prosecute negative speech towards Charlie Kirk?How about the old school marms who ruled the classroom with a ruler or a paddle? Masculine?I don't think we see it vastly differently though. Just, I don't see Trump as a particularly masculine figure based on the overall package.

Catherine the Great was product of her time, enlightenment.

It was a micro-woke period, to say it in terms we are familiar with.

One simple but most likely incomplete historical measure is to follow the beards. When men wear beards, it's anti-woke. They didn't wear beards then.

Kudos to her, she was neither direct heir to throne nor a male. She's really a very successful usurper. She pulled a magnificent upset.

(It's probably what made Hitler think Russians are weak, a German girl seizing their throne).

Still, even in her time, the whole system she ruled over, was nevertheless masculine. It was woke enough to allow her to climb to power, but it wasn't really a woke world.

The era was still brutal and masculine I would say, it's just that people saw enlightenment as the goal and were open to certain ideas.

Yet all those counts, generals she seduced, punished and rewarded, led and ordered, were tough battleted guys who waged wars.

She just came to be as a sort of Queen in insect world.

That's Margaret Thatcher for you. A figure in a rather masculine system.

I'm finding that this is a very complex topic.
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On 9/26/25 11:48 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 9/26/25 8:09 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 9/26/25 7:24 PM, jdeluise wrote:

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

These are all potentially very broad concepts, skript. The notion >>>>>> that
we'd judge high heels and wigs as necessarily feminine is a
reflection
of our own perception of what is appropriate dress as regards normed >>>>>> sex. In that sense, high heels/wigs were, at that time, more
indicative of wealth, rather than sex. Both sexes who were wealthy >>>>>> wore high heels and wigs, but males tended to get more oral sex.

... :^O

And so now, with all the industrial nations, wigs, high heels,
etc. are democratized--any pissant can have as many as he/she wants, >>>>>> so given that availability, the dividing, defining criterion has
become sex. If I'm a transvestite who flatters himslef to think
he's a
woman, he starts with wigs and heels, and swishes along from there. >>>>>>
That seems like a valid alternate view. What do you think?

Too, the truly dominant individual--and these can be of either sex, >>>>>> but are over time disproportionately male--can, by exercise of power, >>>>>> make *any* behavior/appearance "acceptable" simply as a means of
forcing the rest of the populace to say "uncle!", figuratively. The >>>>>> Emperor's New Clothes, and "see deer, say horse", are two such
examples.

Masculinity is defined by actions and attitudes. Fire-bombing speed >>>>>> boats, no questions asked, and the like. If Trump had been wearing a >>>>>> cocktail gown when signing the order, it would be no less
masculine an
act...

;^)

I see it as the act of a narcissist who hates boundaries.

But a *masculine* narcisist, j.

-a For it to be a purely masculine act he'd have to follow it up with >>>>> behaviors that are actually masculine.-a His whining, his
indecisiveness, his pleading to his underlings, his
over-compensation... all the behaviors we mentioned before that
advertise he's insecure about his appearance, his intelligence, his
appeal.-a Nah, not a great example of masculinity.
Maybe you have a bit of a man crush on him?

...or maybe, like Justice Jackson, you can't clearly define what a
woman is, or a man...

Ah, well, j...

Look, I'm not seriously saying he's feminine either.-a But good god
man, he's certainly not the macho manly-man you seem to think he
is.-a Not by a long shot.

It's as I originally said: the US is being led (ruled) by an
authoritarian masculine cadre. You're the guy who brought Trump into
this discussion.

Really, they're deporting people without process, to what looks like
international *commercial* concentration camps, killing *suspected*
criminals in international territory, labeling trans folk as deviants
and denying them treatment. None of those acts are normally associated
with the tradition of feminine patience and nurturing. That's why I'm
characterizing it as a masculine authoritarian regime.

Do you see it substantially differently?

OK, we'll need to disagree. We see this out-of-phase, along different axes.

I'll explain but it's understood if you don't read it.

I don't by default associate authoritarianism with masculinity. You may,
and that's fine.-a But there have been authoritarian female state leaders too.

Absolutely, but:

a) in order to gain, and more importantly hold, power, you'll need to
resort to either masculine actions (purges, gulags), or help from ale institution, such as the army, etc.;

b) the feminine rulers that can hold supreme power in most societies are
the exception.

Would you characterize Catherine the Great as masculine?

She is a female who demonstrated traits such as ruthlessness m ore in
line with the way men do. A female *acting* male at those times.

-a Even in
this administration you see budding authoritarianist women.

Yes.

-a Is Pam
Bondi "masculine" also because she said she wants to prosecute negative speech towards Charlie Kirk?

She is a female exhibiting the masculine tendency toward revenge and
seizure of power...and perhaps doing it at Trump's overt behest.

How about the old school marms who ruled the classroom with a ruler or a paddle?-a Masculine?

Domestic discipline, including in an instructional setting, has always featured corporal intervention. This is neither masculine nor feminine.

I don't think we see it vastly differently though.-a Just, I don't see
Trump as a particularly masculine figure based on the overall package.

It seems to me that there are general cultural expectancies that certain behaviors *tend* to be favored and practiced more by one sex over the
other. Physical fighting for males; nuturing infants for females.

I see a female who spends the bulk of her time physically fighting as a
female practicing traditional masculine traits. She might also have a
child of whom she is protective, and that's a feminine trait. But if all
I see is the fighting, I'd tend to label her as a masculine female.

I see stated goals and the accomplished actions of this administration,
and they seem to almost all fall into the traditional harsh masculine definition. Nor would it matter if female functionaries carried out
these policies. The policies themselves reflect masculine approaches to interactions that go back to knuckle-dragger days.

Which is why I first said that the nation is being led by a cadre of
masculine authoritarians. The policies are masculine. Doesn't really
matter who carries them out in terms of effect.
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"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

In article <10b6dsf$13l92$3@dont-email.me>,
Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> wrote:

On 9/26/25 12:38 AM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis >>>> wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On
9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com>
writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>>> back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>>
WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://
www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napoleon
complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine...
presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional
neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The > whininess >>> alone is a
disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion! >>>> So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian
masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew
Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like
praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an
unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you.>>

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> like>> him not what
he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,>
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads...
mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona
is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world
anymore.




It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and
animals. If science-a were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd
probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it
wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically, but would
be very very close to it.


This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection
etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you
jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat
and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes
or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example
Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.



So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take
him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's
words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other,
but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

He's also catty and vindictive.-a This indictment of Comey for instance,
I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive prosecution.
Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts, and pleas
to Bondi.-a Some of these other "mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are
similarly fraught.-a Trump may not even care about winning them, he's
just hissing and scratching.-a Normative manly behavior?-a Ya, I think not.

In all truth, j., it depends on by what standard we define masculine for >this discussion. If we use Clint Eastwood/John Wayne, your points have >value. If we use Henry VIII not so much.

So it depends where you set the bar.

Saw, I don't see any measure by which Henry Viii could be considered manly. He was cruel and used
the power that came with the throne to achieve his goals, not by resonating with his subjects as a
benevolent despot would. Hey, that sounds a lot like you-know-who.
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On 10/1/25 3:02 PM, bmoore wrote:

In article <10b6dsf$13l92$3@dont-email.me>,
Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> wrote:

On 9/26/25 12:38 AM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis >>>>> wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On
9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com> >>>>> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>>>> back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> >>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://
www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napoleon
complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine...
presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional
neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The > whininess >>> alone is a >>>>> disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion! >>>>> So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian
masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew
Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like >>>>> praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an
unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you.>>

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> like>> him not what
he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,>
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads...
mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona
is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world
anymore.




It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and >>>> animals. If science-a were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd
probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it
wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically, but would
be very very close to it.


This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection >>>> etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you >>>> jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat >>>> and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes
or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example
Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.



So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take >>>> him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's
words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other,
but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

He's also catty and vindictive.-a This indictment of Comey for instance, >>> I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive prosecution.
Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts, and pleas
to Bondi.-a Some of these other "mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are
similarly fraught.-a Trump may not even care about winning them, he's
just hissing and scratching.-a Normative manly behavior?-a Ya, I think not. >>

In all truth, j., it depends on by what standard we define masculine for
this discussion. If we use Clint Eastwood/John Wayne, your points have
value. If we use Henry VIII not so much.

So it depends where you set the bar.

Saw, I don't see any measure by which Henry Viii could be considered manly. He was cruel and used
the power that came with the throne to achieve his goals, not by resonating with his subjects as a
benevolent despot would. Hey, that sounds a lot like you-know-who.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't see benevolence as a definitive masculine trait. It's purely secondary or tertiary.
--
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"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

In article <10bkask$lloj$1@dont-email.me>,
Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> wrote:

On 10/1/25 3:02 PM, bmoore wrote:

In article <10b6dsf$13l92$3@dont-email.me>,
Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> wrote:

On 9/26/25 12:38 AM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis >>>>>> wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On
9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com> >>>>>> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>>>>> back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> >>>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://
www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napoleon
complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine...
presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional
neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The > whininess >>> alone is a >>>>>> disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion! >>>>>> So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian >>>>>> masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew >>>>>> Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like >>>>>> praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an
unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you.>>

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> like>> him not what
he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,>
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads...
mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona >>>>> is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world >>>>> anymore.




It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and >>>>> animals. If science-a were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd
probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it
wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically, but would >>>>> be very very close to it.


This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection >>>>> etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you >>>>> jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat >>>>> and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes >>>>> or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example
Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.



So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take >>>>> him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's >>>>> words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other, >>>>> but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

He's also catty and vindictive.-a This indictment of Comey for instance, >>>> I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive prosecution. >>>> Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts, and pleas >>>> to Bondi.-a Some of these other "mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are >>>> similarly fraught.-a Trump may not even care about winning them, he's
just hissing and scratching.-a Normative manly behavior?-a Ya, I think not.

In all truth, j., it depends on by what standard we define masculine for >>> this discussion. If we use Clint Eastwood/John Wayne, your points have
value. If we use Henry VIII not so much.

So it depends where you set the bar.

Saw, I don't see any measure by which Henry Viii could be considered manly. He was cruel and used
the power that came with the throne to achieve his goals, not by resonating with his subjects as a
benevolent despot would. Hey, that sounds a lot like you-know-who.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't see benevolence as a definitive >masculine trait. It's purely secondary or tertiary.

Fair enoyugh. But I don't see hiding behind the power of the title is something characteristic of a real man, or human being, for that matter.


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From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:

On 10/1/25 3:02 PM, bmoore wrote:

In article <10b6dsf$13l92$3@dont-email.me>,
Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> wrote:

On 9/26/25 12:38 AM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM,
*skriptis
wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in
message:r>>> On
9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>>
<sawfish666@gmail.com>
writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an
unashamedly
authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd
have to go
back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful
leader.>>>>
WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://
www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>>
Napoleon
complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>>
masculine...
presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>>
emotional
neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The > whininess >>>
alone is a
disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled to > >>>
your opinion!
So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>>
authoritarian
masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back
to Andrew
Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too
much like
praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by
"an
unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership
cadre"?-- >>>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open

the pod bay doors, >>>

HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>>
I think this is a good read for you.>>

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>>
Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has
established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him,
he talks but we >> like>> him not what
he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>>
attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on
genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized
how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,>
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders,
too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone
smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us
straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder
pads...
mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this
idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a
macho persona
is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is
our world
anymore.




It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different
spices and
animals. If science-a were to recreate mammoth, clone it,
they'd
probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so
it
wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically,
but would
be very very close to it.


This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful
projection
etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine
style, as you
jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc
so somewhat
and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's
what makes
or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for
example
Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.



So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We
don't take
him by his words. His fans don't care what he says,
basically Trump's
words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict
the other,
but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

He's also catty and vindictive.-a This indictment of Comey for
instance,
I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive
prosecution.
Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts,
and pleas
to Bondi.-a Some of these other "mortgage fraud" cases he's
brought are
similarly fraught.-a Trump may not even care about winning
them, he's
just hissing and scratching.-a Normative manly behavior?-a Ya,
I think not.

In all truth, j., it depends on by what standard we define
masculine for
this discussion. If we use Clint Eastwood/John Wayne, your
points have
value. If we use Henry VIII not so much.

So it depends where you set the bar.

Saw, I don't see any measure by which Henry Viii could be
considered
manly. He was cruel and used
the power that came with the throne to achieve his goals, not
by resonating with his subjects as a
benevolent despot would. Hey, that sounds a lot like
you-know-who.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I don't see benevolence as a
definitive masculine trait. It's purely secondary or tertiary.

As Red Green said, "a real man has to be loud, strong, and smell
like gas. Which for us means you have to have an outboard motor".
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

bmoore kirjoitti 2.10.2025 klo 1.02:

In article <10b6dsf$13l92$3@dont-email.me>,
Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> wrote:

On 9/26/25 12:38 AM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis >>>>> wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On
9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com> >>>>> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>>>> back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> >>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://
www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napoleon
complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine...
presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional
neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The > whininess >>> alone is a >>>>> disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion! >>>>> So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian
masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew
Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like >>>>> praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an
unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you.>>

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> like>> him not what
he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,>
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads...
mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona
is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world
anymore.




It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and >>>> animals. If science-a were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd
probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it
wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically, but would
be very very close to it.


This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection >>>> etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you >>>> jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat >>>> and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes
or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example
Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.



So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take >>>> him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's
words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other,
but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

He's also catty and vindictive.-a This indictment of Comey for instance, >>> I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive prosecution.
Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts, and pleas
to Bondi.-a Some of these other "mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are
similarly fraught.-a Trump may not even care about winning them, he's
just hissing and scratching.-a Normative manly behavior?-a Ya, I think not. >>

In all truth, j., it depends on by what standard we define masculine for
this discussion. If we use Clint Eastwood/John Wayne, your points have
value. If we use Henry VIII not so much.

So it depends where you set the bar.

Saw, I don't see any measure by which Henry Viii could be considered manly. He was cruel and used
the power that came with the throne to achieve his goals, not by resonating with his subjects as a
benevolent despot would. Hey, that sounds a lot like you-know-who.

Keir Starmer?
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.sport.tennis

In article <10bmlo9$17rq7$1@dont-email.me>, TT <TT@dprk.kp> wrote:

bmoore kirjoitti 2.10.2025 klo 1.02:

In article <10b6dsf$13l92$3@dont-email.me>,
Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> wrote:

On 9/26/25 12:38 AM, jdeluise wrote:

*skriptis <skriptis@post.t-com.hr> writes:

jdeluise <jdeluise@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r

Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> writes:> On 9/25/25 9:38 PM, *skriptis >>>>>> wrote:>> Sawfish <sawfish666@gmail.com> Wrote in message:r>>> On
9/25/25 7:44 PM, jdeluise wrote:> Sawfish >>> <sawfish666@gmail.com> >>>>>> writes:> > >>>> The country is being >>> run by an unashamedly
authoritarian masculine>> leadership >>> cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>>>>> back to Andrew Jackson to see>> a >>> similarly forceful leader.>>>> >>>>>> WRT hands, have you ever seen >>> Xi's?>>>> >>> https://
www.cnn.com/2022/10/14/asia/gallery/xi-jinping>>>> >>> Napoleon
complex, but with hand-size?> > I guess Trump's >>> masculine...
presuming that includes chronic > indecisiveness, >>> emotional
neediness, and pathological vanity.-a The > whininess >>> alone is a >>>>>> disqualifier for me.-a But hey, you're entitled to > >>> your opinion! >>>>>> So..."The country is being run by an unashamedly >>> authoritarian >>>>>> masculineleadership cadre. Maybe we'd have to go >>> back to Andrew >>>>>> Jackson to seea similarly forceful >>> leader."sounded too much like >>>>>> praise, j?So you are saying >>> we're *not* being run by "an
unashamedly authoritarian >>> masculine leadership cadre"?-- >>>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~"Open >>> the pod bay doors, >>> HAL."~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~>> I think this is a good read for you.>>

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/10/trump-feminine-speaking-style-214391/>> Basically if this is true it could mean Trump has established>> himself as a woman in our relationship to him, he talks but we >> like>> him not what
he's saying but for what he is, and we don't >> really pay>> attention to what he's saying?>> Maybe a Pelle, expert on genders could say a word here?>> >> Huh.>> I hadn't realized how masculine Ted Cruz and Dennis Kusinich > are. Boy,>
oh boy, was I ever wrong about them!!! Bernie Sanders, too!!!>> Thanks so much, skript! I'm sure glad that someone smart, like a > UC> professor, can definitively set us straight, huh?Makeup, hair transplants, girdles, shoulder pads...
mmm, manly? Must be an Portland thing.

This is a funny topic but I for one do not dismiss this idea.

I feel there's something in it.

In a world that's has been thoroughly feminised, even a macho persona >>>>> is tainted by the era in which he lives.

He has to, sort of, evolve to maintain success.

So he's not really "macho" per old textbook, but neither is our world >>>>> anymore.




It's basically like those genetic manipulation of different spices and >>>>> animals. If science-a were to recreate mammoth, clone it, they'd
probably have to use bits of elephant genome or whatever so it
wouldn't be a true mammoth from a bygone era, technically, but would >>>>> be very very close to it.


This is it.

Trump is masculine no doubt in his views, resolve, forceful projection >>>>> etc so Sawfish is right, but he's wrapped it in feminine style, as you >>>>> jdeluise note, make up, hair transplants, words often, etc so somewhat >>>>> and partially, it's kinda feminine, and I do believe it's what makes >>>>> or made him more visible, palpatable and relatable than for example
Ted Cruz who seemed dull?

Not commenting on politics at all.



So the really funny thing is we do treat him as a woman. We don't take >>>>> him by his words. His fans don't care what he says, basically Trump's >>>>> words are meaningless?

He says so much and of course something has to contradict the other, >>>>> but we don't care.

If you like him, you like him.

So yeah, he's like a woman to us.

He's also catty and vindictive.-a This indictment of Comey for instance, >>>> I'd be shocked if it didn't get thrown out for vindictive prosecution. >>>> Mostly due to Trump's own post-menopausal ran.. I mean posts, and pleas >>>> to Bondi.-a Some of these other "mortgage fraud" cases he's brought are >>>> similarly fraught.-a Trump may not even care about winning them, he's
just hissing and scratching.-a Normative manly behavior?-a Ya, I think not.

In all truth, j., it depends on by what standard we define masculine for >>> this discussion. If we use Clint Eastwood/John Wayne, your points have
value. If we use Henry VIII not so much.

So it depends where you set the bar.

Saw, I don't see any measure by which Henry Viii could be considered manly. He was cruel and used
the power that came with the throne to achieve his goals, not by resonating with his subjects as a
benevolent despot would. Hey, that sounds a lot like you-know-who.

Keir Starmer?

Could be, but I was thinking about the other side of the pond.

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