• Re: RIP Just Fontaine

    From Futbolmetrix@futbolmetrix@yahoo.com to rec.sport.soccer on Fri Jul 31 06:55:42 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.sport.soccer

    RIP Franco Baresi, 66 years old

    An unused substitute in the WC-winning 1982 World Cup team, then
    anchored the almost unbeatable Italian defense in 1990, and famously
    played the 1994 final only three weeks removed from meniscus knee
    surgery. A heroic 120 minutes where he repelled everything Romario and
    Bebeto threw at him, only to end in tears and tragedy when he missed
    Italy's first penalty in the shootout.

    He also won a thing or two with Milan, they tell me.

    One of the finest defenders of his generation and of all time. RIP
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  • From Werner Pichler@wpichler@gmail.com to rec.sport.soccer on Fri Jul 31 23:25:09 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.sport.soccer

    On 31/07/2026 12:55, Futbolmetrix wrote:
    RIP Franco Baresi, 66 years old

    An unused substitute in the WC-winning 1982 World Cup team, then
    anchored the almost unbeatable Italian defense in 1990, and famously
    played the 1994 final only three weeks removed from meniscus knee
    surgery. A heroic 120 minutes where he repelled everything Romario and
    Bebeto threw at him, only to end in tears and tragedy when he missed
    Italy's first penalty in the shootout.

    He also won a thing or two with Milan, they tell me.

    One of the finest defenders of his generation and of all time. RIP

    RIP, a true legend.

    So there's the first player of the 1994 WC final that passed away.
    Those are getting closer to home :(


    BTW this list is longer than I would have thought

    https://www.besoccer.com/new/gone-but-not-forgotten-25-stars-of-usa-94-who-have-passed-away-1402935


    Ciao,
    Werner
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  • From Futbolmetrix@futbolmetrix@yahoo.com to rec.sport.soccer on Sat Sep 19 14:50:57 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.sport.soccer

    On Wed, 18 Sep 2024 11:28:34 +0000, futbolmetrix@yahoo.com
    (Futbolmetrix) wrote:

    RIP Sandro Mazzola. Widely considered one of the best Italian players
    of all time (where would he be if you compiled a list today?), and one
    of the symbols of the dominating Inter team of the 1960s. Famously
    played 84 minutes in the 1970 WC final, drawing the ire of Italian
    fans who would have wanted to see Rivera take the field.

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  • From Werner Pichler@wpichler@gmail.com to rec.sport.soccer on Mon Sep 21 21:06:04 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.sport.soccer

    Futbolmetrix <futbolmetrix@yahoo.com> wrote:
    On Wed, 18 Sep 2024 11:28:34 +0000, futbolmetrix@yahoo.com
    (Futbolmetrix) wrote:

    RIP Sandro Mazzola. Widely considered one of the best Italian players
    of all time (where would he be if you compiled a list today?), and one
    of the symbols of the dominating Inter team of the 1960s. Famously
    played 84 minutes in the 1970 WC final, drawing the ire of Italian
    fans who would have wanted to see Rivera take the field.

    Which is a bit strange, to not want someone
    considered one of the best Italian players of all time to
    play in a World Cup final?

    Juve fans unfortunately didnrCOt cover themselves in
    glory during the minuterCOs silence for Mazzola.


    Ciao,
    Werner
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  • From =?UTF-8?B?TGzDqW8=?=@llb.moura@gmail.com to rec.sport.soccer on Tue Sep 22 00:44:56 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.sport.soccer

    On 21/09/2026 18:06, Werner Pichler wrote:
    Futbolmetrix <futbolmetrix@yahoo.com> wrote:
    On Wed, 18 Sep 2024 11:28:34 +0000, futbolmetrix@yahoo.com
    (Futbolmetrix) wrote:

    RIP Sandro Mazzola. Widely considered one of the best Italian players
    of all time (where would he be if you compiled a list today?), and one
    of the symbols of the dominating Inter team of the 1960s. Famously
    played 84 minutes in the 1970 WC final, drawing the ire of Italian
    fans who would have wanted to see Rivera take the field.

    Which is a bit strange, to not want someone
    considered one of the best Italian players of all time to
    play in a World Cup final?


    Wouldn't that apply to Rivera too, though? Perhaps the ideal situation
    for Italian fans would be having both together on the pitch (not sure if
    that had already been tried, though).


    Best regards,

    Ll|-o
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  • From MH@MHnospam@ucalgary.ca to rec.sport.soccer on Wed Sep 23 11:10:50 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.sport.soccer

    On 2026-09-21 20:44, Ll|-o wrote:
    On 21/09/2026 18:06, Werner Pichler wrote:
    Futbolmetrix <futbolmetrix@yahoo.com> wrote:
    On Wed, 18 Sep 2024 11:28:34 +0000, futbolmetrix@yahoo.com
    (Futbolmetrix) wrote:

    RIP Sandro Mazzola. Widely considered one of the best Italian players
    of all time (where would he be if you compiled a list today?), and one
    of the symbols of the dominating Inter team of the 1960s. Famously
    played 84 minutes in the 1970 WC final, drawing the ire of Italian
    fans who would have wanted to see Rivera take the field.

    Which is a bit strange, to not want someone
    considered one of the best Italian players of all time to
    play in a World Cup final?


    Wouldn't that apply to Rivera too, though? Perhaps the ideal situation
    for Italian fans would be having both together on the pitch (not sure if that had already been tried, though).

    I had always read the the coach did not believe they could play together
    and preferred the harder working Mazzoloa, but by the knockout rounds he
    was worried enough about Italy's lack of goals that he started
    platooning them (stafeta ?) with Rivera coming on in the second half
    when the opposition were tired. This worked OK against Germany and
    Mexico (lots of second half and ET goals in those ones). However, the
    coach did not bring on Rivera in the final until very late. >

    Best regards,

    Ll|-o

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  • From Futbolmetrix@futbolmetrix@yahoo.com to rec.sport.soccer on Wed Sep 23 19:18:31 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.sport.soccer

    On Wed, 23 Sep 2026 11:10:50 -0700, MH <MHnospam@ucalgary.ca> wrote:

    On 2026-09-21 20:44, Lloo wrote:
    On 21/09/2026 18:06, Werner Pichler wrote:
    Futbolmetrix <futbolmetrix@yahoo.com> wrote:
    On Wed, 18 Sep 2024 11:28:34 +0000, futbolmetrix@yahoo.com
    (Futbolmetrix) wrote:

    RIP Sandro Mazzola. Widely considered one of the best Italian players
    of all time (where would he be if you compiled a list today?), and one >>>> of the symbols of the dominating Inter team of the 1960s. Famously
    played 84 minutes in the 1970 WC final, drawing the ire of Italian
    fans who would have wanted to see Rivera take the field.

    Which is a bit strange, to not want someone
    considered one of the best Italian players of all time to
    play in a World Cup final?


    Wouldn't that apply to Rivera too, though? Perhaps the ideal situation
    for Italian fans would be having both together on the pitch (not sure if
    that had already been tried, though).

    I had always read the the coach did not believe they could play together
    and preferred the harder working Mazzoloa, but by the knockout rounds he
    was worried enough about Italy's lack of goals that he started
    platooning them (stafeta ?) with Rivera coming on in the second half
    when the opposition were tired. This worked OK against Germany and
    Mexico (lots of second half and ET goals in those ones). However, the
    coach did not bring on Rivera in the final until very late. >


    Yes, that's exactly the case. The word "staffetta" literally means
    "relay". Coach Valcareggi's decision to give up on it in the final
    (Rivera came in for the last 6 minutes) is still one of the most
    controversial decisions in Italian football history. It was probably
    dictated by the fact that Rivera had played 30 extra minutes relative
    to Mazzola just a few days before. To be honest, it probably wouldn't
    have made much of a difference.

    Unsurprisingly, there were a lot of interviews with Rivera following
    Mazzola's death, with people asking him to comment on their rivalry
    and the famous staffetta. Most of Rivera's answers were pretty
    boilerplate ("we were rivals in our club teams, but we worked together
    for the common goal when playing with the national team, bla bla
    bla"), but one thing caught my attention. Rivera claimed that the
    staffetta was just a Valcareggi invention during WC1970, and that both
    before and after he and Mazzola had played together and there had
    never been any problems.

    Was that really the case, at least in major international tournaments?


    WC66:
    Italy - Chile 2-0 : Both Mazzola and Rivera started
    USSR - Italy 1-0 : Mazzola started, Rivera on the bench
    North Korea - Italy 1-0: Both Mazzola and Rivera started

    Euro 1968
    Italy - USSR 0-0 : Both Mazzola and Rivera started
    Italy - Yugoslavia 1-1: Neither started
    Italy - Yugoslavia 2-0: Mazzola started, Rivera on the bench

    WC 1974
    Italy - Haiti 3-1: Both Mazzola and Rivera started
    Argentina - Italy 1-1: Both Mazzola and Rivera started
    Poland - Italy 2-1: Mazzola started, Rivera benched


    W-D-L record when both Mazzola and Rivera started: 2-2-1, GD 6-3
    Mazzola started, Rivera on the bench: 1-0-2, GD 3-3
    Neither started : 0-1-0 , GD 1-1

    So, not exactly correct that they always played together. And Italy's
    record when they both started was not exactly stellar...

    Also worth mentioning that earlier in his career Mazzola was more of
    an out and out forward, and became an attacking midfielder (so more
    likely to be in competition with Rivera) later on.

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