• Munchkins

    From The True Melissa@thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM to alt.games.adnd,rec.games.frp.dnd on Wed Sep 30 09:32:56 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.games.frp.dnd

    My munchkin player is at it again. At setup, he created a
    ridiculously dramatic backstory and successfully talked me into
    trading some charisma points for ambidexterity. Since then, he
    retooled his character into a paladin and gave himself dice which
    can read people's souls (I didn't realize he thought the dice
    were that powerful). He insists that this god wears a Gucci suit,
    though I've said no to the anachronism.

    Most recently, he wanted to invent the guitar and introduce
    "strange, entrancing tunes." Essentially, he wanted to invent
    rock-n-roll and become a medieval Elvis, hoping that fame would
    offset the charisma hit he chose. Um, no? I have told him that he
    can seek work as a bard, but he'll be using a lute or zither and
    should look into folk music.

    I like the guy overall. He's a good player. His creative ideas
    often liven things up. I just wish he could get the hang of being
    a regular guy in this world.

    IMO that's one of the main differences between 1e and 5e. In 5e,
    we start exceptional. In 1e, we start out as ordinary people and
    try to become exceptional.
    --
    The True Melissa - Canal Winchester - Ohio
    United States of America - North America - Earth
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  • From Spalls Hurgenson@spallshurgenson@gmail.com to rec.games.frp.dnd on Wed Sep 30 13:23:03 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.games.frp.dnd

    On Wed, 30 Sep 2026 09:32:56 -0400, The True Melissa <thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> said this thing:

    My munchkin player is at it again. At setup, he created a
    ridiculously dramatic backstory and successfully talked me into
    trading some charisma points for ambidexterity. Since then, he
    retooled his character into a paladin and gave himself dice which
    can read people's souls (I didn't realize he thought the dice
    were that powerful). He insists that this god wears a Gucci suit,
    though I've said no to the anachronism.


    Yeah, you definitely have to put your foot down on his trying to
    roleplay his character's deity. He can say what he BELIEVES his god is
    like but ultimately the DM is in control of that sort of thing.

    It does introduce some fun role-playing opportunities, where the PC
    says "this is what my god looks like" and either the god itself (or
    the church) smacks him down for his heresy. Similarly, he might
    BELIEVE his dice have these all-seeing powers, but it's all just in
    his head. Let him roll the dice, tell people "This man has a dark
    stain on his soul" and be found out to be a fraud. It makes for some
    great storytelling opportunities, and he either learns from it... or
    not.

    But definitely you need to take the player aside and (re-) explain to
    him that he controls his character and his character alone. The
    effects of magical items, gods, and whatever else he thinks he has
    influence over are actually in the purview of the DM. Just so he
    understands ahead of time that you aren't 'changing the deal' on him
    unfairly; that's just how the game works.


    Most recently, he wanted to invent the guitar and introduce
    "strange, entrancing tunes." Essentially, he wanted to invent
    rock-n-roll and become a medieval Elvis, hoping that fame would
    offset the charisma hit he chose. Um, no? I have told him that he
    can seek work as a bard, but he'll be using a lute or zither and
    should look into folk music.


    I always hesitate to say to players that they can't do something. I
    just put realistic obstacles in their way (and maybe give them some
    warning about possible consequences). Your PC thinks he can fly? Let
    them leap off a cliff, flap their arms and see what happens. Who
    knows; maybe they're right and they'll soar into the atmosphere! I
    wouldn't bet on it, but I won't tell them they can't try. ;-)

    So the player wants his character to invent the guitar? Let him try.
    But creating a new instrument isn't easy. Does he have carpentry or
    musical skills? Is he spending the months and years to experiment and
    build? Researching and buying special materials for strings and frame?
    No? Then he's gonna end up with something akin to a rubber-band
    strapped to a popsicle stick.

    And just because he introduces a new style of music and dancing,
    doesn't mean any of the NPCs will care for it. Elvis was castigated
    for his 'wanton' gyrations and 'uncivilized' rhythms even in the
    1950s. A thousand years earlier he might have been burned at the
    stake. All the moreso since the lack of mass communication in the
    medieval era means your Paladin's new ideas won't be comminicated far,
    so he'll have to re-fight the same battles over and over to get his
    musical stylings accepted in every single town and hamlet.

    So let the Paladin try. It might work out the way he wants; it
    probably won't. Either way, it'll be fun to see what happens.


    IMO that's one of the main differences between 1e and 5e. In 5e,
    we start exceptional. In 1e, we start out as ordinary people and
    try to become exceptional.


    I often describe the difference between the systems as playing heroes
    vs. super-heroes but your description is catchier. ;-)



    <Digression mode=on>

    The thing is, I don't think 3E (and later) intended to be like that.
    It's just that --by making every possible option a learnable skill
    with fixed rules and benefits-- that was the result.

    I often point to "Bulls Rush" as an example. It used to be that if a
    player wanted their character to rush into battle, it was up to the DM
    to determine the outcome: the penalties/bonuses, how the monsters are
    affected, etc. Nothing was fixed and any character could do stuff like
    that at any time. But when "Bulls Rush" became a learnable skill, it
    became a 'power' that made the PCs seem exceptional in comparison to
    other characters. It -and similar skills- led to a feeling of
    continual power creep.

    Again, I don't think that was the idea when WOTC redesigned the game
    for 3E and later. I think they just wanted to standardize the rules
    and put more ideas into the hands of players (especially with combat,
    which too many DMs let devolve into opposing lines of foes just
    whacking at one another until HP reached zero). The new skills, I
    think, were made to enliven the game (and combat specifically).

    But they also turned the PCs into superheroes.


    </digression>


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  • From The True Melissa@thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM to rec.games.frp.dnd on Wed Sep 30 15:20:45 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.games.frp.dnd

    Spalls Hurgenson wrote in article <cnfqbldcdji6vo9ht54fqh71fl1d72052m@4ax.com>:
    But definitely you need to take the player aside and (re-) explain to
    him that he controls his character and his character alone. The
    effects of magical items, gods, and whatever else he thinks he has
    influence over are actually in the purview of the DM. Just so he
    understands ahead of time that you aren't 'changing the deal' on him unfairly; that's just how the game works.

    Yeah, I think that's the path forward. In particular, we need to
    get clear on the holy dice. Yes, they are sacred to that deity.
    No, other characters won't automatically believe you're a deity's
    chosen one, believe the dice are from the deity, believe you
    always interpret them correctly, rank that deity above their own
    chosen deity, and treat that one deity's pronouncements as
    overriding their own morals and ethics. If you kill people you
    promised you'd release safely, people will disapprove whether you
    mention the dice or not.

    The part that weirded me out a little was that both he and his
    brother (playing his character's brother) seemed genuinely
    confused by other characters not just accepting "but dice" as a
    reason to ignore the law and normal ethics/morality.

    The medieval Elvis thing was out of left field. At the same time,
    he also wanted to trade some intelligence points for more
    strength points. The next time he asks for a major upgrade, I
    think I'll say that since he constantly wants to retool this
    character, he might be happier refocusing on his other character.
    --
    The True Melissa - Canal Winchester - Ohio
    United States of America - North America - Earth
    Solar System - Milky Way - Local Group
    Virgo Cluster - Laniakea Supercluster - Cosmos
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  • From Arnaud Gomes@arnaud+rgfd@carrosse.frmug.org to rec.games.frp.dnd on Wed Sep 30 22:40:35 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.games.frp.dnd

    The True Melissa <thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> writes:

    The medieval Elvis thing was out of left field. At the same time,
    he also wanted to trade some intelligence points for more
    strength points. The next time he asks for a major upgrade, I
    think I'll say that since he constantly wants to retool this
    character, he might be happier refocusing on his other character.

    Well, this one is easy: if he wants to play a different character, let
    him create another and play the character from level 1. Nobody said he
    was stuck with his initial choice forever.

    Actually this is one area 5e is not too bad at, at least for the lower
    levels, say up to level 6 to 8; if you handle experience by the book and
    the current characters are not above this level range, his new character
    will catch up reasonably fast and stay at most 1 or 2 levels below, so
    not an unreasonable difference.
    --
    Arnaud
    https://the-dm.oook.fr/
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