• [OT] Keir Starmer now has a very serious rival for power

    From Rhino@no_offline_contact@example.com to rec.arts.tv on Fri Jun 19 08:30:03 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.arts.tv

    The UK had 3 by-elections yesterday to replace members of Parliament who
    had stepped down and one of them was in Makerfield, England. The mayor
    of Manchester, Andy Burnham, won the seat quite handily with 54% of the
    vote; his closest challenger was a representative of the Reform Party
    but he was well back. The other parties got almost no votes at all.

    This was quite remarkable. Six weeks ago, Andy Burnham's party, Labour,
    was badly mauled in local elections by Reform, not winning a single
    seat, in a constituency that had been a Labour stronghold for over a
    century. But Burnham apparently did it by campaigning as himself, rather
    than as the Labour candidate. Apparently, his affiliation with the
    Labour Party was simply not mentioned because Labour is so reviled right
    now, even in areas that have had only Labour seat-holders for literally decades.

    Burnham is a well-known quantity in the UK, having been in two cabinets
    over the years (those of Tony Blair and Gordon Brown) and twice having
    run for the leadership of the Labour Party, although he failed on both
    runs. He has made it very clear that he plans to challenge Keir Starmer
    for the leadership of the party so, now that he has won, Starmer must be
    very, very anxious about his job.

    Starmer is utterly despised by vast swathes of the electorate despite
    having sailed into office with the second biggest majority in British
    history just two years ago. His almost uncountable flip-flops on policy,
    his obsession with wokery and DEI, his unwillingness to do anything substantial about the much-loathed encroachment of illegal immigrants
    and his robotic presence have all combined to drive Britons to despair.
    One of the biggest problems Starmer has is his own MPs, most of whom are
    even farther left than he is, and keep demanding things that he
    initially starts to give them, then has to back away from due to outrage
    from everyone else.

    Andy Burnham is closer to the far left of the party than Starmer so is
    very likely to win the leadership of the party when he mounts his
    challenge. IF Burnham wins that challenge he becomes Party leader of the largest party in Parliament and that makes him Prime Minister
    automatically. (Unfortunately, he's NOT required to call for a new
    election so the public can confirm that they are okay with him being
    PM.) This would seem to guarantee that Britain will slide even further
    left than it has under Starmer.
    --
    Rhino

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  • From Adam H. Kerman@ahk@chinet.com to rec.arts.tv on Fri Jun 19 15:29:28 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.arts.tv

    Rhino <no_offline_contact@example.com> wrote:

    The UK had 3 by-elections yesterday to replace members of Parliament who
    had stepped down and one of them was in Makerfield, England. The mayor
    of Manchester, Andy Burnham, won the seat quite handily with 54% of the >vote; his closest challenger was a representative of the Reform Party
    but he was well back. The other parties got almost no votes at all.

    This was quite remarkable. Six weeks ago, Andy Burnham's party, Labour,
    was badly mauled in local elections by Reform, not winning a single
    seat, in a constituency that had been a Labour stronghold for over a >century. But Burnham apparently did it by campaigning as himself, rather >than as the Labour candidate. Apparently, his affiliation with the
    Labour Party was simply not mentioned because Labour is so reviled right >now, even in areas that have had only Labour seat-holders for literally >decades.

    The vacancy was specifically for Burnham's election so that he could
    challenge Starmer in a leadership fight within Labour. I think everybody
    in that constituency was very well aware that they were a key part of
    the process in choosing the next prime minister. And Burnham "running as himself" was to maintain his nationwide reputation, not just within the constituency.

    . . .

    Andy Burnham is closer to the far left of the party than Starmer so is
    very likely to win the leadership of the party when he mounts his
    challenge. IF Burnham wins that challenge he becomes Party leader of the >largest party in Parliament and that makes him Prime Minister
    automatically. (Unfortunately, he's NOT required to call for a new
    election so the public can confirm that they are okay with him being
    PM.) This would seem to guarantee that Britain will slide even further
    left than it has under Starmer.

    I don't know. Being on the left doesn't preclude one from being a
    practical politician. What if Labour were to resume representing the
    working class, as opposed to whoever the fuck they think they are
    currently trying to appeal to? This is analogous to our discussion that
    to be an elected official in the Green Party doesn't mean practical
    politics on behalf of environmental causes.
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  • From Andy Burns@usenet@andyburns.uk to rec.arts.tv on Fri Jun 19 16:38:13 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.arts.tv

    Adam H. Kerman wrote:

    The vacancy was specifically for Burnham's election so that he could challenge Starmer in a leadership fight within Labour. I think everybody
    in that constituency was very well aware that they were a key part of
    the process in choosing the next prime minister.

    People are forever complaining "My vote doesn't count" yet even in this
    case where they definitely would, still about 30,000 of the electorate
    didn't bother voting ...


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  • From Rhino@no_offline_contact@example.com to rec.arts.tv on Fri Jun 19 12:25:24 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.arts.tv

    On 2026-06-19 11:38 a.m., Andy Burns wrote:
    Adam H. Kerman wrote:

    The vacancy was specifically for Burnham's election so that he could
    challenge Starmer in a leadership fight within Labour. I think everybody
    in that constituency was very well aware that they were a key part of
    the process in choosing the next prime minister.

    People are forever complaining "My vote doesn't count" yet even in this
    case where they definitely would, still about 30,000 of the electorate didn't bother voting ...


    Agreed. The voter turnout yesterday in Makerfield was only 58% which
    means 42% of the electorate didn't care enough to vote (or that they
    took it for granted that whoever they preferred would get in without
    their help).
    --
    Rhino
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  • From Rhino@no_offline_contact@example.com to rec.arts.tv on Fri Jun 19 12:44:06 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.arts.tv

    On 2026-06-19 11:29 a.m., Adam H. Kerman wrote:
    Rhino <no_offline_contact@example.com> wrote:

    The UK had 3 by-elections yesterday to replace members of Parliament who
    had stepped down and one of them was in Makerfield, England. The mayor
    of Manchester, Andy Burnham, won the seat quite handily with 54% of the
    vote; his closest challenger was a representative of the Reform Party
    but he was well back. The other parties got almost no votes at all.

    This was quite remarkable. Six weeks ago, Andy Burnham's party, Labour,
    was badly mauled in local elections by Reform, not winning a single
    seat, in a constituency that had been a Labour stronghold for over a
    century. But Burnham apparently did it by campaigning as himself, rather
    than as the Labour candidate. Apparently, his affiliation with the
    Labour Party was simply not mentioned because Labour is so reviled right
    now, even in areas that have had only Labour seat-holders for literally
    decades.

    The vacancy was specifically for Burnham's election so that he could challenge Starmer in a leadership fight within Labour. I think everybody
    in that constituency was very well aware that they were a key part of
    the process in choosing the next prime minister. And Burnham "running as himself" was to maintain his nationwide reputation, not just within the constituency.

    . . .

    Andy Burnham is closer to the far left of the party than Starmer so is
    very likely to win the leadership of the party when he mounts his
    challenge. IF Burnham wins that challenge he becomes Party leader of the
    largest party in Parliament and that makes him Prime Minister
    automatically. (Unfortunately, he's NOT required to call for a new
    election so the public can confirm that they are okay with him being
    PM.) This would seem to guarantee that Britain will slide even further
    left than it has under Starmer.

    I don't know. Being on the left doesn't preclude one from being a
    practical politician. What if Labour were to resume representing the
    working class, as opposed to whoever the fuck they think they are
    currently trying to appeal to? This is analogous to our discussion that
    to be an elected official in the Green Party doesn't mean practical
    politics on behalf of environmental causes.

    I've heard analyses that say Labour has utterly abandoned the working
    class and really only concerns itself with winning the favour of the
    elites who have prestigious dinner parties in North London. That sounds
    like a bit of an oversimplification but there's no doubt that Energy
    Minister Ed Milliband has made every conceivable effort to play to the
    climate zealots by establishing regulations prohibiting the construction
    of new nuclear power stations and utterly forbidding Britain from
    accessing North Sea oil and gas, which surely pleases those elites. It's
    also had the effect of putting serious brakes on industry since Britain
    has the most expensive energy in Europe and Milliband only permits
    "green" energy. Britain is essentially de-industrializing which surely antagonizes the working class that used to depend on industry for jobs.

    The working class in particular is also appalled by the state of
    Britain's defenses. For all their activism on behalf of unions, the
    working class is also famously patriotic and the utter failure of the
    last several British governments to maintain a strong military has upset
    them. It's clear from the election results since Labour won in 2024 that
    a lot of the Labour base has moved on, some to the Greens but more to
    Reform.

    Starmer could have done a lot to help himself in the past couple of
    years by keeping his campaign promises to defend the borders because
    pretty much EVERYONE is upset about open borders but his own far left
    MPs have apparently made that impossible: too many of them love open
    borders and the rest of the country can just go pound sand.

    Today, I've seen predictions that Starmer may very resign in the next
    couple of days if he assesses his support within his caucus and sees
    that he hasn't a reasonable chance of winning a leadership contest.
    Friends that have been interviewed insist that he would fight in a
    leadership contest regardless of the outlook.
    --
    Rhino
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  • From The Horny Goat@lcraver@home.ca to rec.arts.tv on Sun Jun 21 18:10:25 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.arts.tv

    On Fri, 19 Jun 2026 15:29:28 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
    <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

    The vacancy was specifically for Burnham's election so that he could >challenge Starmer in a leadership fight within Labour. I think everybody
    in that constituency was very well aware that they were a key part of
    the process in choosing the next prime minister. And Burnham "running as >himself" was to maintain his nationwide reputation, not just within the >constituency.

    Having a member of Parliament resign to create a vacancy that will be
    filled by a star candidate is fairly common in all English speaking
    countries other than the US. The Conservative party in British
    Columbia has just elected a new leader who is a former Federal member
    and who will need a seat in the provincial parliament. Guess who's
    been reading lots of speculation on this point in the local
    newspapers?

    (They had a provincial election last year where the socialist ruling
    party won by two seats so the provincial Conservatives are lusting for
    an election even though we're only one year past the election...)
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  • From The Horny Goat@lcraver@home.ca to rec.arts.tv on Sun Jun 21 18:12:02 2026
    From Newsgroup: rec.arts.tv

    On Fri, 19 Jun 2026 15:29:28 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
    <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

    I don't know. Being on the left doesn't preclude one from being a
    practical politician. What if Labour were to resume representing the
    working class, as opposed to whoever the fuck they think they are
    currently trying to appeal to? This is analogous to our discussion that
    to be an elected official in the Green Party doesn't mean practical
    politics on behalf of environmental causes.

    Especially in the UK where the Green party has been flirting iwth
    local Islamists.

    I regularly watch British newscasts and don't recall the British
    Greens talking about environmental issues...
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