From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On 6/16/25 2:21 AM, Jerry Brown wrote:

On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 13:22:48 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:

<snip>

Disney, however, takes great works and ruins them. That's my objection.
Whoever decided to tack a happy ending on to Hunchback of Notre Dame deserves
to be thrown in the catacombs.

20,00 Leagues Under the Sea is a bit of an oddity in that Nemo is much nastier than in the book, and the ending was changed so that Nemo died despite surviving until "The Mysterious Island" book-wise. Imagine
that nowadays, where the norm is to leave an opening for sequels.

Book-wise the time line is a mess. 20,000 LEAGUES UNDER THE SEA takes
place from 1866 to 1868, after the American Civil War, while THE
MYSTERIOUS ISLAND starts during the American Civil War in 1865 and goes
to 1869. During that time, Nemo does not seem to be gone from the
island for any extended period of time.
--
Evelyn C. Leeper, http://leepers.us/evelyn
"When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a
child, I thought as a child: and when I was a man I decided
how foolish it would be to give all that up." --Mark R. Leeper
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From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On 6/16/25 8:41 AM, Evelyn C. Leeper wrote:

On 6/16/25 2:21 AM, Jerry Brown wrote:

On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 13:22:48 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:

<snip>

Disney, however, takes great works and ruins them.-a That's my objection. >>> Whoever decided to tack a happy ending on to Hunchback of Notre Dame
deserves
to be thrown in the catacombs.

20,00 Leagues Under the Sea is a bit of an oddity in that Nemo is much
nastier than in the book, and the ending was changed so that Nemo died
despite surviving until "The Mysterious Island" book-wise. Imagine
that nowadays, where the norm is to leave an opening for sequels.

Book-wise the time line is a mess.-a 20,000 LEAGUES UNDER THE SEA takes place from 1866 to 1868, after the American Civil War, while THE
MYSTERIOUS ISLAND starts during the American Civil War in 1865 and goes
to 1869.-a During that time, Nemo does not seem to be gone from the
island for any extended period of time.

My recollection is that in the book _20,000 Leagues_, Nemo appears to
die at the end, but he's brought back for _Mysterious Island_. It's been
a long time since I've read either, though, so I might be wrong.
--
Gary McGath http://www.mcgath.com
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 10:37:32 -0400, Gary McGath <garym@mcgath.com>
wrote:

On 6/16/25 8:41 AM, Evelyn C. Leeper wrote:

On 6/16/25 2:21 AM, Jerry Brown wrote:

On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 13:22:48 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:

<snip>

Disney, however, takes great works and ruins them.a That's my objection. >>>> Whoever decided to tack a happy ending on to Hunchback of Notre Dame
deserves
to be thrown in the catacombs.

20,00 Leagues Under the Sea is a bit of an oddity in that Nemo is much
nastier than in the book, and the ending was changed so that Nemo died
despite surviving until "The Mysterious Island" book-wise. Imagine
that nowadays, where the norm is to leave an opening for sequels.

Book-wise the time line is a mess.a 20,000 LEAGUES UNDER THE SEA takes
place from 1866 to 1868, after the American Civil War, while THE
MYSTERIOUS ISLAND starts during the American Civil War in 1865 and goes
to 1869.a During that time, Nemo does not seem to be gone from the
island for any extended period of time.

My recollection is that in the book _20,000 Leagues_, Nemo appears to
die at the end, but he's brought back for _Mysterious Island_. It's been
a long time since I've read either, though, so I might be wrong.

It's been so long since I read either of them -- how long has it been?
-- that all /I/ remember is the fact that I read them.
Oh, and that my father had to point out that the "20,000 leagues" were
a horizontal measurement, not a vertical one. I was quite young at the
time.
--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On 6/16/25 11:29 AM, Paul S Person wrote:

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 10:37:32 -0400, Gary McGath <garym@mcgath.com>
wrote:

On 6/16/25 8:41 AM, Evelyn C. Leeper wrote:

On 6/16/25 2:21 AM, Jerry Brown wrote:

On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 13:22:48 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:

<snip>

Disney, however, takes great works and ruins them.-a That's my objection. >>>>> Whoever decided to tack a happy ending on to Hunchback of Notre Dame >>>>> deserves
to be thrown in the catacombs.

20,00 Leagues Under the Sea is a bit of an oddity in that Nemo is much >>>> nastier than in the book, and the ending was changed so that Nemo died >>>> despite surviving until "The Mysterious Island" book-wise. Imagine
that nowadays, where the norm is to leave an opening for sequels.

Book-wise the time line is a mess.-a 20,000 LEAGUES UNDER THE SEA takes
place from 1866 to 1868, after the American Civil War, while THE
MYSTERIOUS ISLAND starts during the American Civil War in 1865 and goes
to 1869.-a During that time, Nemo does not seem to be gone from the
island for any extended period of time.

My recollection is that in the book _20,000 Leagues_, Nemo appears to
die at the end, but he's brought back for _Mysterious Island_. It's been
a long time since I've read either, though, so I might be wrong.

It's been so long since I read either of them -- how long has it been?
-- that all /I/ remember is the fact that I read them.

Oh, and that my father had to point out that the "20,000 leagues" were
a horizontal measurement, not a vertical one. I was quite young at the
time.

I had to point this out to someone (an adult) on a panel at Philcon 2005.
--
Evelyn C. Leeper, http://leepers.us/evelyn
"When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a
child, I thought as a child: and when I was a man I decided
how foolish it would be to give all that up." --Mark R. Leeper
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 10:37:32 -0400, Gary McGath <garym@mcgath.com>
wrote:

<snip>

My recollection is that in the book _20,000 Leagues_, Nemo appears to
die at the end, but he's brought back for _Mysterious Island_. It's been
a long time since I've read either, though, so I might be wrong.

My memory of the book is that Aronnax, etc escaped in a detachable pod
while Nemo and the crew were busy battling a storm, but it was about
40 years ago that I read it.

Maybe time for a reread.
--
Jerry Brown

A cat may look at a king
(but probably won't bother)
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

Jerry Brown <jerry@jwbrown.co.uk.invalid> wrote:

My memory of the book is that Aronnax, etc escaped in a detachable pod
while Nemo and the crew were busy battling a storm, but it was about
40 years ago that I read it.

Maybe time for a reread.

If you are reading in translation, let me suggest that the recent translation is MUCH better than the old version we grew up with.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On 6/16/25 7:26 PM, Scott Dorsey wrote:

Jerry Brown <jerry@jwbrown.co.uk.invalid> wrote:

My memory of the book is that Aronnax, etc escaped in a detachable pod
while Nemo and the crew were busy battling a storm, but it was about
40 years ago that I read it.

Maybe time for a reread.

If you are reading in translation, let me suggest that the recent translation is MUCH better than the old version we grew up with.
--scott

You mean the one where they translate "lentille" as "bean" (instead of
"lens") and hence claimed Ned Land used a bean to make a fire?

Or as I wrote in my 2006 review of 20KLUTS:

If [Mercier] Lewis [the original translator] was not writing that the
density of steel was "from .7 to .8 that of water" where Verne had said
that it was "7.8 that of water," then he was having Nemo talk about
"jumping over" an island where Verne says "blowing up" (the same word in French, but Lewis completely misses the meaning). In fact, Lewis
consistently gets the numbers and calculations wrong. He frequently
confuses the French "six" (6) with "dix" (10), and substitutes English measures for metric. The latter would be almost close if he substituted "yards" for "metres," but he sometimes substitutes "feet" instead! When
you read this book, use either Miller's annotated version or a newer translation. (If the fourth paragraph mentions Cuvier and other
naturalists, it is undoubtedly a newer translation.)
--
Evelyn C. Leeper, http://leepers.us/evelyn
"When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a
child, I thought as a child: and when I was a man I decided
how foolish it would be to give all that up." --Mark R. Leeper
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 12:46:16 -0400, "Evelyn C. Leeper" <evelynchimelisleeper@gmail.com> wrote:

On 6/16/25 11:29 AM, Paul S Person wrote:

<snippo, topic is /20,000 Leagues Under the Sea/.

Oh, and that my father had to point out that the "20,000 leagues" were
a horizontal measurement, not a vertical one. I was quite young at the
time.

I had to point this out to someone (an adult) on a panel at Philcon 2005.

In my (our?) defence, the Nautilus /is/ a submarine and submerging is
what it does. But the horizontal interpretation is correct.
--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On 6/17/2025 8:14 AM, Paul S Person wrote:

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 12:46:16 -0400, "Evelyn C. Leeper" <evelynchimelisleeper@gmail.com> wrote:

On 6/16/25 11:29 AM, Paul S Person wrote:

<snippo, topic is /20,000 Leagues Under the Sea/.

Oh, and that my father had to point out that the "20,000 leagues" were
a horizontal measurement, not a vertical one. I was quite young at the
time.

I had to point this out to someone (an adult) on a panel at Philcon 2005.

In my (our?) defense, the Nautilus /is/ a submarine and submerging is
what it does. But the horizontal interpretation is correct.

OTOH, 20,000 leagues is approximately 10 times the diameter of the Earth.
--

Qualified immunity = virtual impunity.

Tim Merrigan

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG antivirus software.
www.avg.com
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 19:26:28 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:

Jerry Brown <jerry@jwbrown.co.uk.invalid> wrote:

My memory of the book is that Aronnax, etc escaped in a detachable pod >>while Nemo and the crew were busy battling a storm, but it was about
40 years ago that I read it.

Maybe time for a reread.

If you are reading in translation, let me suggest that the recent translation >is MUCH better than the old version we grew up with.
--scott

I looked for it on Kindle and there are several recent editions. Who
is the translator of the better version, please?

Would the same be the case for Journey to the Centre of the Earth and
the Moon books?
--
Jerry Brown

A cat may look at a king
(but probably won't bother)
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On 6/16/2025 10:37 AM, Gary McGath wrote:

On 6/16/25 8:41 AM, Evelyn C. Leeper wrote:

On 6/16/25 2:21 AM, Jerry Brown wrote:

On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 13:22:48 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:

<snip>

Disney, however, takes great works and ruins them.-a That's my
objection.
Whoever decided to tack a happy ending on to Hunchback of Notre Dame
deserves
to be thrown in the catacombs.

20,00 Leagues Under the Sea is a bit of an oddity in that Nemo is much
nastier than in the book, and the ending was changed so that Nemo died
despite surviving until "The Mysterious Island" book-wise. Imagine
that nowadays, where the norm is to leave an opening for sequels.

Book-wise the time line is a mess.-a 20,000 LEAGUES UNDER THE SEA takes
place from 1866 to 1868, after the American Civil War, while THE
MYSTERIOUS ISLAND starts during the American Civil War in 1865 and
goes to 1869.-a During that time, Nemo does not seem to be gone from
the island for any extended period of time.

My recollection is that in the book _20,000 Leagues_, Nemo appears to
die at the end, but he's brought back for _Mysterious Island_. It's been
a long time since I've read either, though, so I might be wrong.

If my half century old memories of the book hold up, the Nautilus is
sucked into the Maelstrom off the coast of Norway, and the protagonists
assume Nemo is dead.

...and yes, he is later shown to have survived.

pt
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From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

Jerry Brown <jerry@jwbrown.co.uk.invalid> wrote:

I looked for it on Kindle and there are several recent editions. Who
is the translator of the better version, please?

There are several new translations. Coward's and Butcher's are apparently
both good and people argue about which one is better. But everyone
agrees that the old Mercier translation is awful.

Would the same be the case for Journey to the Centre of the Earth and
the Moon books?

In both cases the Mercier translations are terrible bu I cannot say
which of the more modern translations are any good.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On Tue, 17 Jun 2025 08:27:08 -0700, Tim Merrigan <tppm@rr.ca.com>
wrote:

On 6/17/2025 8:14 AM, Paul S Person wrote:

On Mon, 16 Jun 2025 12:46:16 -0400, "Evelyn C. Leeper"
<evelynchimelisleeper@gmail.com> wrote:

On 6/16/25 11:29 AM, Paul S Person wrote:

<snippo, topic is /20,000 Leagues Under the Sea/.

Oh, and that my father had to point out that the "20,000 leagues" were >>>> a horizontal measurement, not a vertical one. I was quite young at the >>>> time.

I had to point this out to someone (an adult) on a panel at Philcon 2005. >>

In my (our?) defense, the Nautilus /is/ a submarine and submerging is
what it does. But the horizontal interpretation is correct.

OTOH, 20,000 leagues is approximately 10 times the diameter of the Earth.

Ah, but "horizontal" doesn't mean "in a straight line". It doesn't
even mean "on a Great Circle". They move around a bit.
But perhaps the title was chosen by Marketing ...
--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: rec.arts.sf.movies

On Tue, 17 Jun 2025 19:46:44 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:

Jerry Brown <jerry@jwbrown.co.uk.invalid> wrote:

I looked for it on Kindle and there are several recent editions. Who
is the translator of the better version, please?

There are several new translations. Coward's and Butcher's are apparently >both good and people argue about which one is better. But everyone
agrees that the old Mercier translation is awful.

<snip>

I've got samples of both the Coward and Butcher translations. I'll try
a chapter of each before committing to one.

Thanks for the advice.
--
Jerry Brown

A cat may look at a king
(but probably won't bother)
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2