On 09/08/2026 02:03, Cryptoengineer wrote:
On 8/7/2026 11:48 PM, The True Doctor wrote:
On 07/08/2026 17:02, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Paul S Person-a <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
Anyone else beginning to suspect that The True Doctor is a troll? Or, >>>>> worse, a potty-mouthed bot?
He is not a bot since he predates the existence of real usenet
bots.-a He
basically posts random crap to the drwho groups and drives off real
discussion,
I do nothing of the kind. The ones posting crap into this group are
those demonstrating the enormity of their total imbecilitude (is that
my word of the Captain's?) by repeating the unfounded popular lie
that Homer's works and the Bible were the product of an oral
tradition, despite writing having existed for over a millennium
before both works were composed and the historicity of both being
verified by modern archaeology and the discovery (even in the time of
Herodotus) of Egyptian, Hittite, and Assyro-Babylonian inscriptions
testifying to the historical people and events these texts mention.
The Merneptah Stela not only corroborates the account of the outbreak
of the Trojan War and the attack on Egypt by the Trojans as described
by Herodotus but also of the Exodus as described by Manetho and the
Bible even naming Israel itself as being left devoid of seed. Then
there's the Inscription and mural or Ramses III which corroborates
the attack on Egypt by Achaeans (named) led by Menelaus and Teukrians
(named) led by Teucer the founder of Salamis from a base in Cyprus
which is referred to in the Odyssey and is the basis of Euripides'
play Helen.
but occasionally will get threads crossposted into other groups.
Whether he
is a an offical troll is hard to say.
--scott
We have people like this drop into rasfw periodically. They all follow
the same pattern: They have some elaborate theory that they desperately
want to-a be taken seriously, but which falls apart under expert academic
scrutiny.
You mean like the total and absolute BOLLOCKS of oral traditions? As
opposed to the truth, that writing was in continuous use in ancient
Greece (including Cyprus and Asia-Minor) since 1900 BC without
interruption as has been proven archaeologically and history was written down. As opposed to accepting what ancient historians wrote down
themselves, that kings lists and lists of Argive priestesses of Hera
were written down and preserved since 1700 or 1800 BC along with the
notable historical events that happened year by year while they were in office. Oh no, that simple idea of actually recording history in writing year-by-year can't possibly be true, so, these totally degenerate fools
have to invent a complete and utter total load of BOLLOCKS about oral traditions, without even knowing what an oral tradition even is, PARRY
SAID THEY WERE ALL BY DEFINITION REQUIRED TO UNDERGO SUBSTANTIAL CHANGE EVERY TIME THEY WERE PASSED ON TO DIFFERENT POETS YOU FUCKING IGNORANT UNEDUCATED IMBECILE, in order to make everything extremely complicated
for everyone else so that they can put forward anything they want to
make up themselves out of thin air to suit their political views and
pretend that it's actual history and no one else who they don't deem
capable of understanding their stupid illogical nonsense is a fool that
must be ridiculed so that others are discouraged from also calling out
their lies. FUCKING DEGENERATE IMBECILES!
They come to rasfw thinking we'll be more open minded and accepting, but
don't realize that decades of reading SF leaves fans with the most
sensitive bullshit detectors on the planet.
Reading George Orwell's 1984 makes it obvious that these degenerate
fucking imbeciles proposing that oral traditions even existed when there
is not one single ancient or even more recent source prior to Parry even recording their existence, NOT ONE, and even Parry said it was
impossible to prove they were even a traditions, let alone them
recording actual history, which Parry didn't even go as far as stating anyway, because he only considered them to be a means of creating
fiction in literate societies where everything was eventually written
down and recorded, including the material he used for his own studies,
are working for MINITRUE and employed in the Department of Fiction
rewriting and dissembling history and literature in order to insert
their ignorant deranged thoughts and political messages so as to serve
their degenerate left-wing ideology, the ideology of George Orwell's
Nazis, that of Ingsoc, the English Socialist Party. FUCKING MORONS!
When we don't bow down to their claimed expertise, they get upset, and
eventually decamp. I fully expect 'The True Doctor' to do so in time.
pt
I'm calling you out as the Emperor With No Clothes. You don't have a
shred of evidence to dispute the simple fact that ancient history and
poetry was recorded in writing, so you try to make out that everyone who sees you parading down the streets completely naked, covered only with
your invisible birthday suit of oral traditions (which you don't even understand and have not even read the original source material for,
which says the complete opposite of what you are calming), is an idiot, except after you have been called out by little boy stating the obvious
they are all laughing their heads off at you. YOU STUPID FUCKING
DEGENERATE!
Cujo DeSockpuppet <cujo@petitmorte.net> wrote:
kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote in >>news:1158f8t$rpl$1@panix2.panix.com:
Cujo DeSockpuppet <cujo@petitmorte.net> wrote:
PS: ALL HAI TEEDOTBEE.
Indeed. Now, in those days we had trolls that were real trolls. We
will never see the likes of Carasso again. These kids have but a
pale shadow of his trolling.
Back in those days I had to wade uphill past 400 other posts just to
beg to be allowed to get in line to be trolled by CARASSO.
This is because he, like many, started trolling people in real life
before moving to the net. The kids today have it easy, never actually leaving their parents' basement to troll anyone in person. To wit:
In article <15025@chaph.usc.edu> carasso@aludra.usc.edu (Roger RDC
Carasso) writ es:
TRUE:
Me and a couple of my friends at Cal Poly went into a porn movie
with several Soft Soap Bottles in a backpack. We'd yell out "Oh,
oh, oh, yes, yes, I'm coming!", and then squirt out the Soft Soap
off the balcony. Some guy below then yelled "HEY...What the fuck
is *this*!" We were laughing our heads off.
The Doctor <doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
In article <hisj7lpfc4v9dh03aog5u23hgls2sjcp0g@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
And some people think kids today are bad!
Cujo is a tasteless troll
Perhaps, but Cujo is a pretty good troll. At least he displays skill
at the game. Better than crossposting random screeds all over.
--scott
The Doctor wrote in article <115csnt$15kp$5@gallifrey.nk.ca>:
In article <MPG.44e3b8685c6f6adc98a2cd@news.eternal-september.org>,
The True Melissa <thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> wrote:
Well, we did have poets before we had writing. Music/poetry is
our oldest art form, older than cave paintings, and it began as a
single thing. That was long before any literacy.
Please explain the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Explain what about them? That was considerably after cave-
dwelling times.
Paul S Person wrote in article
<iusj7lldbitgimdhtj44sfieptff7oddpg@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 9 Aug 2026 19:08:53 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The
Doctor) wrote:
In article <hg9h7l5p3anh743up6td1jsjsm29n8gtik@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Sat, 8 Aug 2026 23:52:58 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The
Doctor) wrote:
<snippo>
Ateism is a spawn of Satan.
I'm not sure Satan is biological equipped for spawning. In any sense.
Explain the Nepelim then.
I think the text is quite clear. What's to explain?
You do realize that, being pre-Flood, the story has to be that they
all drowned and any later giants (like Goliath) had a different
origin, right?
One of the Gnostic gospels tells of a tribe of Nephilim preserved
in the mountains. The left-out gospels talk about all kinds of
things the preserved ones didn't mention.
----
The meek shall inherit, we're told,
But I'm not so easily sold.
For supposing they should,
It would do them no good --
They'd lose it at once to the bold.
The Doctor wrote in article <115csnt$15kp$5@gallifrey.nk.ca>:
In article <MPG.44e3b8685c6f6adc98a2cd@news.eternal-september.org>,
The True Melissa <thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> wrote:
Well, we did have poets before we had writing. Music/poetry is
our oldest art form, older than cave paintings, and it began as a
single thing. That was long before any literacy.
Please explain the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Explain what about them? That was considerably after cave-
dwelling times.
----
The meek shall inherit, we're told,
But I'm not so easily sold.
For supposing they should,
It would do them no good --
They'd lose it at once to the bold.
kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote in
news:115cei5$aqi$1@panix2.panix.com:
Cujo DeSockpuppet <cujo@petitmorte.net> wrote:
kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote in >>>news:1158f8t$rpl$1@panix2.panix.com:
Cujo DeSockpuppet <cujo@petitmorte.net> wrote:
PS: ALL HAI TEEDOTBEE.
Indeed. Now, in those days we had trolls that were real trolls. We
will never see the likes of Carasso again. These kids have but a
pale shadow of his trolling.
Back in those days I had to wade uphill past 400 other posts just to
beg to be allowed to get in line to be trolled by CARASSO.
This is because he, like many, started trolling people in real life
before moving to the net. The kids today have it easy, never actually
leaving their parents' basement to troll anyone in person. To wit:
In article <15025@chaph.usc.edu> carasso@aludra.usc.edu (Roger RDC
Carasso) writ es:
TRUE:
Me and a couple of my friends at Cal Poly went into a porn movie
with several Soft Soap Bottles in a backpack. We'd yell out "Oh,
oh, oh, yes, yes, I'm coming!", and then squirt out the Soft Soap
off the balcony. Some guy below then yelled "HEY...What the fuck
is *this*!" We were laughing our heads off.
That'll teach them to sit in the front without umbrellas. I recall him >setting off Merde by calling her a "fat hairy douchebag".
Mao pissing off Gnat and pretending it was his son all along was a
classic backpedal and self own.
----
"I've known for over a year that this guy is the assassin of the Usenet >poetry community. When I first arrived, I thought he was keeping the
lights on in a dead group by reposting from archives. I soon realized
that he was just endlessly reposting his own stuff, that he had killed
the group by flooding it, and that most of the people he called
"trolls" were actually the members of the group.
I've joined the crowd. I'm done trying to work with him and speak reason
to him. It's exhausting and pointless." - Little Willie Douchebag gets >another asskicking from The One True Melissa
kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote in
news:115cu8v$6rs$1@panix2.panix.com:
The Doctor <doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca> wrote:
In article <hisj7lpfc4v9dh03aog5u23hgls2sjcp0g@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
And some people think kids today are bad!
Cujo is a tasteless troll
Perhaps, but Cujo is a pretty good troll. At least he displays skill
at the game. Better than crossposting random screeds all over.
--scott
<snicker>
Nadless T. Capon thinks trolling is setting followups to
alt.sex.pedophilia. Charming bloke, isn't he?
----
"I've known for over a year that this guy is the assassin of the Usenet >poetry community. When I first arrived, I thought he was keeping the
lights on in a dead group by reposting from archives. I soon realized
that he was just endlessly reposting his own stuff, that he had killed
the group by flooding it, and that most of the people he called
"trolls" were actually the members of the group.
I've joined the crowd. I'm done trying to work with him and speak reason
to him. It's exhausting and pointless." - Little Willie Douchebag gets >another asskicking from The One True Melissa
In article <MPG.44e3e0ea422ba0ed98a2d1@news.eternal-september.org>,
The True Melissa <thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> wrote:
[quoted text muted]
Explain what about them? That was considerably after cave-
dwelling times.
But ancient written scrools.
The Doctor wrote in article <115e1q5$20ke$19@gallifrey.nk.ca>:
In article <MPG.44e3e0ea422ba0ed98a2d1@news.eternal-september.org>,
The True Melissa <thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> wrote:
[quoted text muted]
Explain what about them? That was considerably after cave-
dwelling times.
But ancient written scrools.
There's nothing to explain. They're from after the preliterate
period. That doesn't mean the preliterate period didn't exist.
----
The meek shall inherit, we're told,
But I'm not so easily sold.
For supposing they should,
It would do them no good --
They'd lose it at once to the bold.
Paul S Person wrote in articleTo this day, if you seach hard enough, you can find left-out books
<iusj7lldbitgimdhtj44sfieptff7oddpg@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 9 Aug 2026 19:08:53 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The
Doctor) wrote:
In article <hg9h7l5p3anh743up6td1jsjsm29n8gtik@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Sat, 8 Aug 2026 23:52:58 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The
Doctor) wrote:
<snippo>
Ateism is a spawn of Satan.
I'm not sure Satan is biological equipped for spawning. In any sense.
Explain the Nepelim then.
I think the text is quite clear. What's to explain?
You do realize that, being pre-Flood, the story has to be that they
all drowned and any later giants (like Goliath) had a different
origin, right?
One of the Gnostic gospels tells of a tribe of Nephilim preserved
in the mountains. The left-out gospels talk about all kinds of
things the preserved ones didn't mention.
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 14:21:27 -0400, The True Melissa ><thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> wrote:
Paul S Person wrote in article >><iusj7lldbitgimdhtj44sfieptff7oddpg@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 9 Aug 2026 19:08:53 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The
Doctor) wrote:
In article <hg9h7l5p3anh743up6td1jsjsm29n8gtik@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Sat, 8 Aug 2026 23:52:58 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The >>> >>Doctor) wrote:
<snippo>
Ateism is a spawn of Satan.
I'm not sure Satan is biological equipped for spawning. In any sense.
Explain the Nepelim then.
I think the text is quite clear. What's to explain?
You do realize that, being pre-Flood, the story has to be that they
all drowned and any later giants (like Goliath) had a different
origin, right?
One of the Gnostic gospels tells of a tribe of Nephilim preserved
in the mountains. The left-out gospels talk about all kinds of
things the preserved ones didn't mention.
To this day, if you seach hard enough, you can find left-out books
that mention all kinds of things the preserved ones don't mention.
Flying saucers. I very strange theory that suns burn out and become
planets which, when they find a sun to orbit, produce life. All sorts
of things.
Highly intellectual theories also abound. I book of my father's,
/Pocket Bible Handbook/ by Henry H. Halley spends a lot of time
documenting when writing was developed in Egypt. Why? Because one of
those theories asserted that Moses could not have written the first
five books because /writing had not been invented yet/. Such is the
wisdom of pointy-headed intellectual double-domes! The same sort as >Schliemann proved wrong by digging up Troy, Mycenae, Knossos.
This was a well-printed, well-bound book. It is not a paperback, but
the material used for the back and covers is not what a hardback book
would have either. The current version, on Amazon, looks, I must say,
a lot spiffier.
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
In article <nbim7l9f4iitc0mbbgsk42fdm0epsfg9rl@4ax.com>,I was thinking more of a book on Revelation (read over the past few
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 14:21:27 -0400, The True Melissa >><thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> wrote:
Paul S Person wrote in article >>><iusj7lldbitgimdhtj44sfieptff7oddpg@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 9 Aug 2026 19:08:53 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The >>>> Doctor) wrote:
In article <hg9h7l5p3anh743up6td1jsjsm29n8gtik@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Sat, 8 Aug 2026 23:52:58 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The >>>> >>Doctor) wrote:
<snippo>
Ateism is a spawn of Satan.
I'm not sure Satan is biological equipped for spawning. In any sense. >>>> >>
Explain the Nepelim then.
I think the text is quite clear. What's to explain?
You do realize that, being pre-Flood, the story has to be that they
all drowned and any later giants (like Goliath) had a different
origin, right?
One of the Gnostic gospels tells of a tribe of Nephilim preserved
in the mountains. The left-out gospels talk about all kinds of
things the preserved ones didn't mention.
To this day, if you seach hard enough, you can find left-out books
that mention all kinds of things the preserved ones don't mention.
Flying saucers. I very strange theory that suns burn out and become
planets which, when they find a sun to orbit, produce life. All sorts
of things.
Highly intellectual theories also abound. I book of my father's,
/Pocket Bible Handbook/ by Henry H. Halley spends a lot of time
documenting when writing was developed in Egypt. Why? Because one of
those theories asserted that Moses could not have written the first
five books because /writing had not been invented yet/. Such is the
wisdom of pointy-headed intellectual double-domes! The same sort as >>Schliemann proved wrong by digging up Troy, Mycenae, Knossos.
This was a well-printed, well-bound book. It is not a paperback, but
the material used for the back and covers is not what a hardback book
would have either. The current version, on Amazon, looks, I must say,
a lot spiffier.
Roswell 1947 anyone?
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
On Wed, 12 Aug 2026 04:58:40 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <nbim7l9f4iitc0mbbgsk42fdm0epsfg9rl@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 14:21:27 -0400, The True Melissa >>><thetruemelissa@gmail.comNOSPAM> wrote:
Paul S Person wrote in article >>>><iusj7lldbitgimdhtj44sfieptff7oddpg@4ax.com>:
On Sun, 9 Aug 2026 19:08:53 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The >>>>> Doctor) wrote:
In article <hg9h7l5p3anh743up6td1jsjsm29n8gtik@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Sat, 8 Aug 2026 23:52:58 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca (The >>>>> >>Doctor) wrote:
<snippo>
Ateism is a spawn of Satan.
I'm not sure Satan is biological equipped for spawning. In any sense. >>>>> >>
Explain the Nepelim then.
I think the text is quite clear. What's to explain?
You do realize that, being pre-Flood, the story has to be that they
all drowned and any later giants (like Goliath) had a different
origin, right?
One of the Gnostic gospels tells of a tribe of Nephilim preserved
in the mountains. The left-out gospels talk about all kinds of
things the preserved ones didn't mention.
To this day, if you seach hard enough, you can find left-out books
that mention all kinds of things the preserved ones don't mention.
Flying saucers. I very strange theory that suns burn out and become >>>planets which, when they find a sun to orbit, produce life. All sorts
of things.
Highly intellectual theories also abound. I book of my father's,
/Pocket Bible Handbook/ by Henry H. Halley spends a lot of time >>>documenting when writing was developed in Egypt. Why? Because one of >>>those theories asserted that Moses could not have written the first
five books because /writing had not been invented yet/. Such is the >>>wisdom of pointy-headed intellectual double-domes! The same sort as >>>Schliemann proved wrong by digging up Troy, Mycenae, Knossos.
This was a well-printed, well-bound book. It is not a paperback, but
the material used for the back and covers is not what a hardback book >>>would have either. The current version, on Amazon, looks, I must say,
a lot spiffier.
Roswell 1947 anyone?
I was thinking more of a book on Revelation (read over the past few
years as one of many such books inherited from my grandfather, who had
an interest in the topic) that shows a /color/ (and so quite
expensive) picture of a purported "flying saucer".
It also claimed that, when Jesus talked about summoning legions of
angels, those angels would space aliens from other planets. And
similar tripe. Still, it was at least different from the others.
The second bit was from a book which then proceded to discuss /every
single Bible story/ in which someone descended and returned. There are
quite a few even I could think of if I bothered to try. He found a lot
more because, of course, he was looking for a Pattern and he saw it >everywhere.
------
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
The second bit was from a book which then proceded to discuss /every
single Bible story/ in which someone descended and returned. There are
quite a few even I could think of if I bothered to try. He found a lot
more because, of course, he was looking for a Pattern and he saw it everywhere.
On 13/08/2026 2:14 am, Paul S Person wrote:
<Snip>
The second bit was from a book which then proceded to discuss /every
single Bible story/ in which someone descended and returned. There are
quite a few even I could think of if I bothered to try. He found a lot
more because, of course, he was looking for a Pattern and he saw it
everywhere.
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??)
Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.--
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
Of course, one might expect that Scientific/Engeering developments back
on E.T.'s home planet should have meant that the Jesus -> Muhammad cycle >should have happened more quickly, maybe after only 200 - 300 years.
--
Daniel70
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times.... and
then returned to E.T.'s Home Planet each time before
returning.
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
On 13/08/2026 2:14 am, Paul S Person wrote:No. That is why the 20th century ran from 1901 to 2000. This caused a
<Snip>
The second bit was from a book which then proceded to discuss /every
single Bible story/ in which someone descended and returned. There are
quite a few even I could think of if I bothered to try. He found a lot
more because, of course, he was looking for a Pattern and he saw it
everywhere.
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??)
Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.--
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
Of course, one might expect that Scientific/Engeering developments back
on E.T.'s home planet should have meant that the Jesus -> Muhammad cycle >should have happened more quickly, maybe after only 200 - 300 years.
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:Cue Aquinas (1225-1274) and Marx (1818-1883) ...
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >>Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one >around 1800 presumably?
On Thu, 13 Aug 2026 09:19:04 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??)
Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>> E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one
around 1800 presumably?
Cue Aquinas (1225-1274) and Marx (1818-1883) ...
Not that I think this nonsense is worth commenting on, BTW.
On 8/13/26 08:53, Paul S Person wrote:
On Thu, 13 Aug 2026 09:19:04 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??)
Quoting from Wiki.
There was no year Zero as the concept was unknown but Jesus was
reportedly born not on the BCE/CE timeline change. The date
of his birth was during the reign of Ceasar Augustus
Augustus reigned from 16 January 27 BC to 19 August AD 14.
The date of the birth of Jesus is not stated in the gospels or
in any historical sources and the evidence is insufficient to
allow for consistent dating. However, most biblical scholars
and ancient historians believe that his birth date is
around 6 to 4 BC.
And, if the mytcical Jesus ever existed in any way, he was supposedly
born was around 20-21 April ... nowhere near the 25 December that the
church hijacked Pagan rituals for the celebration.
The entire Christian religion is based on nothing but lies and
stupidity, the same as all the other religion idiocy.
On Thu, 13 Aug 2026 22:26:49 +1000, Daniel70
<daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 13/08/2026 2:14 am, Paul S Person wrote:
<Snip>
The second bit was from a book which then proceded to discuss /every
single Bible story/ in which someone descended and returned. There are
quite a few even I could think of if I bothered to try. He found a lot
more because, of course, he was looking for a Pattern and he saw it
everywhere.
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??)
No. That is why the 20th century ran from 1901 to 2000. This caused a
lot of confusion during the Millenium bug era.
--Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.--
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
Of course, one might expect that Scientific/Engeering developments back
on E.T.'s home planet should have meant that the Jesus -> Muhammad cycle >>should have happened more quickly, maybe after only 200 - 300 years.
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
On 8/13/26 08:53, Paul S Person wrote:
On Thu, 13 Aug 2026 09:19:04 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Buddha had lots of students and later disciples after his lifetime
who added to his teaching and conferred divinity where he had
implied none. The isle Ceylon hosted Theravada Buddhism while
the Continent of Asia became a hotbed of Mahayana Buddhism and
sent evangelical minded Buddhists to Tibet, thru China, Korea
and finally to Japan where it introduced reading and writing.
The Japanese Buddhist cults rose to great power under the
Japanese empire and into the Shogun-al years but with the
Shogun Zen Buddhism became the main religion of the warrior
class, the Samurai whose value to their lives was defined
by their deaths. Shinto which is animism essentially is
the religion which was led by the Emperor who performed
essential rites.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??)
Quoting from Wiki.
There was no year Zero as the concept was unknown but Jesus was
reportedly born not on the BCE/CE timeline change. The date
of his birth was during the reign of Ceasar Augustus
Augustus reigned from 16 January 27 BC to 19 August AD 14.
The date of the birth of Jesus is not stated in the gospels or
in any historical sources and the evidence is insufficient to
allow for consistent dating. However, most biblical scholars
and ancient historians believe that his birth date is
around 6 to 4 BC.
Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>>> E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one >>> around 1800 presumably?
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and
at which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out".
You leave out the various Islamic and Jewish notables and messianic
cult figures. There were quite a few.
Cue Aquinas (1225-1274) and Marx (1818-1883) ...
Mother Shipton would be another.
The Prophet Joseph Smith of the Church of Latter Day Saints
would also fit the timing. And he was murdered which is part of
the monotheistic pattern.
I would rather fill in the space with the great chemists
and physicists of the 17th, 18th and 19th and 20th Century.
Not that I think this nonsense is worth commenting on, BTW.
Of course it is totally ridiculous.--
But wait until my gospel of unlimited grace is published. ;^)
bliss - study, practice, experience
On 2026-08-13 19:27:50 +0000, BobbieSellers said:
On 8/13/26 08:53, Paul S Person wrote:
On Thu, 13 Aug 2026 09:19:04 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (ScottQuoting from Wiki.
Dorsey) wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >>
There was no year Zero as the concept was unknown but Jesus was
reportedly born not on the BCE/CE timeline change. The date
of his birth was during the reign of Ceasar Augustus
Augustus reigned from 16 January 27 BC to 19 August AD 14.
The date of the birth of Jesus is not stated in the gospels or
in any historical sources and the evidence is insufficient to
allow for consistent dating. However, most biblical scholars
and ancient historians believe that his birth date is
around 6 to 4 BC.
And, if the mytcical Jesus ever existed in any way, he was supposedly
born was around 20-21 April ... nowhere near the 25 December that the
church hijacked Pagan rituals for the celebration.
The entire Christian religion is based on nothing but lies and
stupidity, the same as all the other religion idiocy.
On Thu, 13 Aug 2026 09:19:04 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >>>Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>>E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one >>around 1800 presumably?
Cue Aquinas (1225-1274) and Marx (1818-1883) ...
Not that I think this nonsense is worth commenting on, BTW.
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
No wonder rasfw is such an active interesting place.--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
https://myimgs.org/image/H4i6AW6Y
The entire Christian religion is based on nothing but
lies and stupidity,
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >> Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >> E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one around 1800 presumably?
On 8/13/26 08:53, Paul S Person wrote:
On Thu, 13 Aug 2026 09:19:04 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Buddha had lots of students and later disciples after his lifetime
who added to his teaching and conferred divinity where he had implied
none.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year
Zero??)
Quoting from Wiki.
There was no year Zero as the concept was unknown but Jesus was
reportedly born not on the BCE/CE timeline change. The date of his
birth was during the reign of Ceasar Augustus Augustus reigned from
16 January 27 BC to 19 August AD 14. The date of the birth of Jesus
is not stated in the gospels or in any historical sources and the
evidence is insufficient to allow for consistent dating. However,
most biblical scholars and ancient historians believe that his birth
date is around 6 to 4 BC.
Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then
returned to E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200
and one around 1800 presumably?
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them
out".
You leave out the various Islamic and Jewish notables and messianic
cult figures. There were quite a few.
Cue Aquinas (1225-1274) and Marx (1818-1883) ...
Mother Shipton would be another.
The Prophet Joseph Smith of the Church of Latter Day Saints would
also fit the timing.
And he was murdered which is part of the monotheistic pattern.--
I would rather fill in the space with the great chemists and
physicists of the 17th, 18th and 19th and 20th Century.
Not that I think this nonsense is worth commenting on, BTW.
Of course it is totally ridiculous. But wait until my gospel of
unlimited grace is published. ;^)
bliss - study, practice, experience
The Doctor wrote:
No wonder rasfw is such an active interesting place.
https://myimgs.org/image/H4i6AW6Y
Your Name wrote:
The entire Christian religion is based on nothing but
lies and stupidity,
I'd go with...
Bastardised history mixed-in with fantastic tales of mythic
heroes and some fables for the weak-minded.
On 13/08/2026 11:19 pm, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >>> Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>> E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one
around 1800 presumably?
Yeah .... except they were probably dismissed as Witches or some such.
----
Daniel70
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
On 8/13/26 08:53, Paul S Person wrote:
On Thu, 13 Aug 2026 09:19:04 -0400 (EDT), kludge@panix.com (Scott
Dorsey) wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Buddha had lots of students and later disciples after his lifetime
who added to his teaching and conferred divinity where he had implied
none.
Did I dispute this??
<Snip>
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year
Zero??)
Quoting from Wiki.
There was no year Zero as the concept was unknown but Jesus was
reportedly born not on the BCE/CE timeline change. The date of his
birth was during the reign of Ceasar Augustus Augustus reigned from
16 January 27 BC to 19 August AD 14. The date of the birth of Jesus
is not stated in the gospels or in any historical sources and the
evidence is insufficient to allow for consistent dating. However,
most biblical scholars and ancient historians believe that his birth
date is around 6 to 4 BC.
Thank you and, yes, I had read that Jesus might have been born in 4 B.C.
Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then
returned to E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200
and one around 1800 presumably?
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them
out".
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
You leave out the various Islamic and Jewish notables and messianic
cult figures. There were quite a few.
Cue Aquinas (1225-1274) and Marx (1818-1883) ...
Mother Shipton would be another.
Pass .... Pass and Pass.
The Prophet Joseph Smith of the Church of Latter Day Saints would
also fit the timing.
Aren't they, sort of, Christian??
--And he was murdered which is part of the monotheistic pattern.
I would rather fill in the space with the great chemists and
physicists of the 17th, 18th and 19th and 20th Century.
Not that I think this nonsense is worth commenting on, BTW.
Of course it is totally ridiculous. But wait until my gospel of
unlimited grace is published. ;^)
bliss - study, practice, experience
--
Daniel70
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out".
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out".
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but
there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil
one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god, represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace
(and we got an infinite number of chances).
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of "perfect" and went to heaven on death.-a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The
war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern estates.
Arius had nothing to do with this.-a He would have abhorred Catharism,
and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back
in, and died, some said of poison.-a Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
The Albigensians show up in some SF, in particular in Meredith's
Timeliner trilogy.
William Hyde
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
`-a-a-a If Kage Baker had thought of it she would have made the Cathar fortress into a Dr.Zeus base hiding behind the religionists...
-aOf course that is only my opinion and maybe she did since I seem to
have missed the majority of that series volumes.
On 13/08/2026 11:19 pm, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >>> Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>> E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one
around 1800 presumably?
Yeah .... except they were probably dismissed as Witches or some such.
In article <115mum5$2fsp7$3@dont-email.me>,
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 13/08/2026 11:19 pm, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year
Zero??) Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then
returned to E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200
and one around 1800 presumably?
Yeah .... except they were probably dismissed as Witches or some such.
Would make sense. I am sure if Jesus came again today, He would be
denounced at a peacenik hippie and held down by police while they cut
his hair. --scott
In article <115mum5$2fsp7$3@dont-email.me>,
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 13/08/2026 11:19 pm, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >>>> Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>>> E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one >>> around 1800 presumably?
Yeah .... except they were probably dismissed as Witches or some such.
Would make sense. I am sure if Jesus came again today, He would be denounced >at a peacenik hippie and held down by police while they cut his hair.
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out".
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but
there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the >Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil
one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god, >represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace
(and we got an infinite number of chances).
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >"perfect" and went to heaven on death. If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors.
The war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab
southern estates.
Arius had nothing to do with this. He would have abhorred Catharism,
and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back
in, and died, some said of poison. Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
The Albigensians show up in some SF, in particular in Meredith's
Timeliner trilogy.
William Hyde--
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out".
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain? >>
there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the
Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil
one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace
(and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition.
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of
"perfect" and went to heaven on death.-a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The
war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern
estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they
increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.-a He would have abhorred Catharism,
and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back
in, and died, some said of poison.-a Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of
the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
The Albigensians show up in some SF, in particular in Meredith's
Timeliner trilogy.
William Hyde
` If Kage Baker had thought of it she would have made the Cathar >fortress into a Dr.Zeus base hiding behind the religionists...
Of course that is only my opinion and maybe she did since I seem to
have missed the majority of that series volumes.
bliss
kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote in
news:115o0t0$1jb$1@panix2.panix.com:
In article <115mum5$2fsp7$3@dont-email.me>,
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 13/08/2026 11:19 pm, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year
Zero??) Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then
returned to E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200
and one around 1800 presumably?
Yeah .... except they were probably dismissed as Witches or some such.
Would make sense. I am sure if Jesus came again today, He would be
denounced at a peacenik hippie and held down by police while they cut
his hair. --scott
ICE would have deported him to Zomboanga.
----
"I've known for over a year that this guy is the assassin of the Usenet >poetry community. When I first arrived, I thought he was keeping the
lights on in a dead group by reposting from archives. I soon realized
that he was just endlessly reposting his own stuff, that he had killed
the group by flooding it, and that most of the people he called
"trolls" were actually the members of the group.
I've joined the crowd. I'm done trying to work with him and speak reason
to him. It's exhausting and pointless." - Little Willie Douchebag gets >another asskicking from The One True Melissa
kludge@panix.com (Scott Dorsey) writes:
In article <115mum5$2fsp7$3@dont-email.me>,
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 13/08/2026 11:19 pm, Scott Dorsey wrote:
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
"someone descended and returned" "looking for a pattern"
Buddha born approx 623 B.C.
Jesus born approx 0 B.C./A.D. (Was there even a Year Zero??) >>>>> Muhammad born approx 570 A.D.
My theory E.T. that visited Earth three times ..... and then returned to >>>>> E.T.'s Home Planet each time before returning.
So about every 600 years. So we should have seen one around 1200 and one >>>> around 1800 presumably?
Yeah .... except they were probably dismissed as Witches or some such.
Would make sense. I am sure if Jesus came again today, He would be denounced >>at a peacenik hippie and held down by police while they cut his hair.
Well, Joe Smith made his mark; but then there were the
Branch Davidians and Heaven's Gate....
Do the wrds
You cannot hold down Jesus.
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain? >>>
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>
there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the
Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil
one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace
(and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition.
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of
"perfect" and went to heaven on death.-a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The >>> war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern >>> estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they
increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.-a He would have abhorred Catharism,
and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>> in, and died, some said of poison.-a Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >> the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that Jesus was
just of human being. Note that there are entire denominations based on
the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher, and nothing more, so ...
confusion ... on this point is nothing to get excited about.
In article <115nnj6$2p4io$1@dont-email.me>,
William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out".
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain? >>
there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the
Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil
one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace
(and we got an infinite number of chances).
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of
"perfect" and went to heaven on death. If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors.
The war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab
southern estates.
Arius had nothing to do with this. He would have abhorred Catharism,
and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back
in, and died, some said of poison. Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
The Albigensians show up in some SF, in particular in Meredith's
Timeliner trilogy.
Iberia was muslim at the start of the 11th Century.
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers ><bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain? >>>
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>
there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the
Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil
one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition.
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of
"perfect" and went to heaven on death.a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The >>> war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern >>> estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they >>increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.a He would have abhorred Catharism,
and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>> in, and died, some said of poison.a Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of >self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that Jesus was
just of human being. Note that there are entire denominations based on
the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher, and nothing more, so ...
confusion ... on this point is nothing to get excited about.
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
The Doctor wrote:
In article <115nnj6$2p4io$1@dont-email.me>,
William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain? >>>
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at
which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>
there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the
Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil
one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace
(and we got an infinite number of chances).
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of
"perfect" and went to heaven on death. If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors.
The war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab
southern estates.
Arius had nothing to do with this. He would have abhorred Catharism,
and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>> in, and died, some said of poison. Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
The Albigensians show up in some SF, in particular in Meredith's
Timeliner trilogy.
Iberia was muslim at the start of the 11th Century.
Mostly Muslim ruled from the early 700s. What percentage of the
population was Muslim at various times is unclear.
In the early years a number of Visigothic nobles converted so as to save >their lands. The sincerity of their conversions can be doubted (they
had only recently converted from Arian to Catholic), though they did
wage war against the remnant Christian states of the north.
Politics frequently trumped religion. Christian-Muslim alliances
against other Christian or Muslim powers were common. Even Duke Odo of >Aquitaine was allied with a Berber lord who was on the outs with the
Muslim noble who claimed to rule all Iberia. Just as Odo was on the outs >with Charles Martel.
William Hyde
The Doctor wrote:
Iberia was muslim at the start of the 11th Century.
Mostly Muslim ruled from the early 700s. What percentage of the
population was Muslim at various times is unclear.
In the early years a number of Visigothic nobles converted so as to save their lands. The sincerity of their conversions can be doubted (they
had only recently converted from Arian to Catholic), though they did
wage war against the remnant Christian states of the north.
Politics frequently trumped religion. Christian-Muslim alliances
against other Christian or Muslim powers were common. Even Duke Odo of Aquitaine was allied with a Berber lord who was on the outs with the
Muslim noble who claimed to rule all Iberia. Just as Odo was on the outs with Charles Martel.
On 8/15/26 08:56, Paul S Person wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>> there wasn't much conversion.
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain? >>>>
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City
walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the
Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil
one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition. >>>
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.-a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The >>>> war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern >>>> estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they
increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.-a He would have abhorred Catharism, >>>> and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>>> in, and died, some said of poison.-a Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>> the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
I thought it was fairly obvious that I am a heretic.
Jesus aka Reb Jeshua was human and Christ is an old myth with
many heroes from mythology taking that role.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of
self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that Jesus was
just of human being. Note that there are entire denominations based on
the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher, and nothing more, so ...
confusion ... on this point is nothing to get excited about.
Indeed.
In article <115qfva$3lkpj$1@dont-email.me>,
William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote:
The Doctor wrote:
(Snip!)
Iberia was muslim at the start of the 11th Century.
Mostly Muslim ruled from the early 700s. What percentage of the
population was Muslim at various times is unclear.
In the early years a number of Visigothic nobles converted so as to save
their lands. The sincerity of their conversions can be doubted (they
had only recently converted from Arian to Catholic), though they did
wage war against the remnant Christian states of the north.
Politics frequently trumped religion. Christian-Muslim alliances
against other Christian or Muslim powers were common. Even Duke Odo of
Aquitaine was allied with a Berber lord who was on the outs with the
Muslim noble who claimed to rule all Iberia. Just as Odo was on the outs
with Charles Martel.
About 3 centuries later (after the collapse of the Caliphate of
Cordoba), the great Spanish national hero Rodrigo D|!az de Vivar (aka El >Cid) served under Islam rulers about as much time he served under
Christian rulers.
----
"We have advanced to new and surprising levels of bafflement."
Imperial Auditor Miles Vorkosigan describes progress in _Komarr_. >rCo-----------------------------------------------------
Robert Woodward robertaw@drizzle.com
In article <115q7pp$3iq3m$1@dont-email.me>,Given her point of view, I would say she just did.
BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/15/26 08:56, Paul S Person wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City >>>>>>> walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>>
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>>> there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the >>>>> Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil >>>>> one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>>>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition. >>>>
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but >>>>> wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.-a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The >>>>> war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern >>>>> estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they
increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.-a He would have abhorred Catharism, >>>>> and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe >>>>> that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>>>> in, and died, some said of poison.-a Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he >>>>> was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>>> the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
I thought it was fairly obvious that I am a heretic.
Jesus aka Reb Jeshua was human and Christ is an old myth with
many heroes from mythology taking that role.
Please explain the Virgin birth.
In article <he218ltdungk393uteva42aktr7tbdrgt8@4ax.com>,That is one theory, yes. It is based on the idea that the Seven
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers >><bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>> there wasn't much conversion.
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain? >>>>
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City >>>>>> walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French
crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the
Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil >>>> one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition.
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but
wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The >>>> war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern >>>> estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they >>>increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.a He would have abhorred Catharism, >>>> and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe
that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>>> in, and died, some said of poison.a Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he >>>> was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>>the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of >>self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that Jesus was
just of human being. Note that there are entire denominations based on
the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher, and nothing more, so ...
confusion ... on this point is nothing to get excited about.
Jesus is the Son of God and part of the Holy Trinity.
The RCC is the propecied Church of Thyatira.
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:44:21 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <115q7pp$3iq3m$1@dont-email.me>,
BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/15/26 08:56, Paul S Person wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City >>>>>>>> walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French >>>>>>>> crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>>>
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>>>> there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the >>>>>> Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil >>>>>> one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>>>>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition. >>>>>
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but >>>>>> wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.-a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The >>>>>> war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern >>>>>> estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they
increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.-a He would have abhorred Catharism, >>>>>> and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe >>>>>> that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>>>>> in, and died, some said of poison.-a Orthodox Christians took great >>>>>> delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he >>>>>> was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>>>> the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
I thought it was fairly obvious that I am a heretic.
Jesus aka Reb Jeshua was human and Christ is an old myth with
many heroes from mythology taking that role.
Please explain the Virgin birth.
Given her point of view, I would say she just did.
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:37:37 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <he218ltdungk393uteva42aktr7tbdrgt8@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers >>><bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City >>>>>>> walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French >>>>>>> crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>>
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>>> there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the >>>>> Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil >>>>> one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>>>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition. >>>>
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but >>>>> wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The >>>>> war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern >>>>> estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they >>>>increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.a He would have abhorred Catharism, >>>>> and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe >>>>> that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>>>> in, and died, some said of poison.a Orthodox Christians took great
delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he >>>>> was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>>>the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of >>>self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that Jesus was >>>just of human being. Note that there are entire denominations based on >>>the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher, and nothing more, so ... >>>confusion ... on this point is nothing to get excited about.
Jesus is the Son of God and part of the Holy Trinity.
The RCC is the propecied Church of Thyatira.
That is one theory, yes. It is based on the idea that the Seven
Churches represent different historic periods.
Another theory is that they are examples of what the Church, and each >individual Church, down to each and every congregation, is, and was,
and will be: a mix of different believers in different states.
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
In article <robertaw-7C31C0.21580415082026@news.individual.net>,
Robert Woodward <robertaw@drizzle.com> wrote:
In article <115qfva$3lkpj$1@dont-email.me>,
William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote:
The Doctor wrote:
(Snip!)
Iberia was muslim at the start of the 11th Century.
Mostly Muslim ruled from the early 700s. What percentage of the
population was Muslim at various times is unclear.
In the early years a number of Visigothic nobles converted so as to save >>> their lands. The sincerity of their conversions can be doubted (they
had only recently converted from Arian to Catholic), though they did
wage war against the remnant Christian states of the north.
Politics frequently trumped religion. Christian-Muslim alliances
against other Christian or Muslim powers were common. Even Duke Odo of
Aquitaine was allied with a Berber lord who was on the outs with the
Muslim noble who claimed to rule all Iberia. Just as Odo was on the outs >>> with Charles Martel.
About 3 centuries later (after the collapse of the Caliphate of
Cordoba), the great Spanish national hero Rodrigo D|a-!az de Vivar (aka El >> Cid) served under Islam rulers about as much time he served under
Christian rulers.
Such is Holy War.
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:44:21 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <115q7pp$3iq3m$1@dont-email.me>,
BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/15/26 08:56, Paul S Person wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City >>>>>>>> walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French >>>>>>>> crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>>>
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>>>> there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the >>>>>> Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil >>>>>> one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god,
represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>>>>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition. >>>>>
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but >>>>>> wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.|e-a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The >>>>>> war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern >>>>>> estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they
increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.|e-a He would have abhorred Catharism, >>>>>> and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe >>>>>> that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back >>>>>> in, and died, some said of poison.|e-a Orthodox Christians took great >>>>>> delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he >>>>>> was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>>>> the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
I thought it was fairly obvious that I am a heretic.
Jesus aka Reb Jeshua was human and Christ is an old myth with
many heroes from mythology taking that role.
Please explain the Virgin birth.
Given her point of view, I would say she just did.
The Doctor wrote:
In article <robertaw-7C31C0.21580415082026@news.individual.net>,
Robert Woodward <robertaw@drizzle.com> wrote:
In article <115qfva$3lkpj$1@dont-email.me>,
William Hyde <wthyde1953@gmail.com> wrote:
The Doctor wrote:
(Snip!)
Iberia was muslim at the start of the 11th Century.
Mostly Muslim ruled from the early 700s. What percentage of the
population was Muslim at various times is unclear.
In the early years a number of Visigothic nobles converted so as to save >>>> their lands. The sincerity of their conversions can be doubted (they >>>> had only recently converted from Arian to Catholic), though they did
wage war against the remnant Christian states of the north.
Politics frequently trumped religion. Christian-Muslim alliances
against other Christian or Muslim powers were common. Even Duke Odo of >>>> Aquitaine was allied with a Berber lord who was on the outs with the
Muslim noble who claimed to rule all Iberia. Just as Odo was on the outs >>>> with Charles Martel.
About 3 centuries later (after the collapse of the Caliphate of
Cordoba), the great Spanish national hero Rodrigo D|a-!az de Vivar (aka El >>> Cid) served under Islam rulers about as much time he served under
Christian rulers.
Such is Holy War.
No, that was secular war.
Which is the point of the previous two posts. Religious wars often
change into secular wars. As in the 30 years war where Catholic France >weighed in on the Protestant side, because an Austrian/Spanish victory
would be bad for France while the Protestant Dutch helped France repress >it's own Protestants because they needed French support for the wider war.
And the Spanish allowed their enemies, the Dutch, to run the Spanish
coastal trade because they themselves could not, and the Dutch did this >because they needed the money from Spain to fight Spain.
William Hyde
On 8/16/26 09:55, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:44:21 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.caSouthern Spain?
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <115q7pp$3iq3m$1@dont-email.me>,
BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/15/26 08:56, Paul S Person wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City >>>>>>>>> walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French >>>>>>>>> crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>>>>
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>>>>> there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the >>>>>>> Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil >>>>>>> one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god, >>>>>>> represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>>>>>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition. >>>>>>
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but >>>>>>> wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>>>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.|e-a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The
war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern
estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they >>>>>> increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.|e-a He would have abhorred Catharism,
and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe >>>>>>> that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back
in, and died, some said of poison.|e-a Orthodox Christians took great >>>>>>> delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he >>>>>>> was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>>>>> the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
I thought it was fairly obvious that I am a heretic.
Jesus aka Reb Jeshua was human and Christ is an old myth with
many heroes from mythology taking that role.
Please explain the Virgin birth.
Given her point of view, I would say she just did.
The Virgin Birth is an RC and maybe Orthodox doctrine that
alleges that God was present in Jesus and that only a virgin could
be worthy of such birth. Some say that the child emerged from her
side, that she was impregnated by Divine Action. Further that
G*d had intervened to free Mary from the taint of Original Sin.
But in those times a Virgin was an independent woman not
subjected to the authority of a husband. Not necessarily a
virgo intacto or woman who had not had intercourse.
A particular strain of heresy, not mine, states that
Mary was a temple virgin and thus open to sacred prostitution
and that the father of Jesus was a Greek soldier.
i also fail to believe in Original Sin or the Doctrine
that through disobedience to divine orders, Eve or Zoe ate an
apple by which she became aware of the difference between good
and evil. I believe that people are naturally selfish and
self-centered.
As for Sin a former moon god of Babylon who was believed
to be the father of all children he has been downgraded to the
the alleged inconvenience caused to others by our selfish
actions. Now I can readily understand how I by my actions and
others can inconvenience myself and others but looking out
upon the vast universe which G*d is alleged to be responsible
for I doubt very much that my actions could ever bother
that deity in the slightest. So I doubt that any order against
eating from the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge could
bother that One.
I believe that doctrine of Original Sin is the merest patriarchal
invention to help ensure the subjection of women
to male authority.
Remember that I believe in evolution and that original
state of womankind and man was ignorance. Stories were invented
to explain anything of interest as soon as homo sapiens or homo
sapiens sapiens evolved/invented language. These stories if
they satisfied some need were repeated through oral recitation.
We moved from stories to real explanations for natural
phenomenon from the 17th century through the present. Some
people who derives power from the stone age stores resist
these explanations which still give men power over women at
the least and impose a hierarchical order on society.
People who benefit from that hierarchical order feel
that civilization will collapse if they do not have lower
ranked people to push around physically or verbally.
I am an agnostic Deist but if any divinity rules
human society it must be Eris who controls the counsels
of mankind.
bliss - study, practice, experience.
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:37:37 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <he218ltdungk393uteva42aktr7tbdrgt8@4ax.com>, Paul S
Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Arius had nothing to do with this. He would have abhorred
Catharism, and he lived in the time of Constantine. His
"heresy" was to believe that JC was a created being. He was
exiled from the empire, allowed back in, and died, some said
of poison. Orthodox Christians took great delight in
inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the
mystery of the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of
self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that
Jesus was just of human being. Note that there are entire
denominations based on the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher,
and nothing more, so ... confusion ... on this point is nothing
to get excited about.
Jesus is the Son of God and part of the Holy Trinity.
The RCC is the propecied Church of Thyatira.
That is one theory, yes. It is based on the idea that the Seven
Churches represent different historic periods.
Sorry!! "the Seven Churches"?? What are they, please??
On 17/08/2026 2:57 am, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:37:37 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <he218ltdungk393uteva42aktr7tbdrgt8@4ax.com>, Paul S
Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
<Snip>
Arius had nothing to do with this. He would have abhorred
Catharism, and he lived in the time of Constantine. His
"heresy" was to believe that JC was a created being. He was
exiled from the empire, allowed back in, and died, some said
of poison. Orthodox Christians took great delight in
inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the
mystery of the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of
self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that
Jesus was just of human being. Note that there are entire
denominations based on the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher,
and nothing more, so ... confusion ... on this point is nothing
to get excited about.
Jesus is the Son of God and part of the Holy Trinity.
The RCC is the propecied Church of Thyatira.
And where does YOUR Church fit in here, Binky(Word used by paedophiles to indicate their joy of child sexual molestation)??
That is one theory, yes. It is based on the idea that the Seven
Churches represent different historic periods.
Sorry!! "the Seven Churches"?? What are they, please??
----
Daniel70
Daniel70 wrote:
Sorry!! "the Seven Churches"?? What are they, please??
Churches obviously. Where misguided/lonely people go to pray...
and be seen so the neighbours don't talk about them. Surely you
have more than one church in Melbourne? Edmonton in Canada has
to be the same.
We have plenty around here, I'm not sure if there's seven
though.
<starts counting>
One is down the road in the village, our local church... the
next one is a few miles further down the main road in the parish
of UpYerBum. If you turn right at the junction with the big tree
on the left, there's a smaller church down there in
SweatyTitsVille... if you'd gone right at the junction instead
that would eventually bring you to the village of MeBollix,
there's another church there... there was also a church in the
nearby town of BallyBigCock... but I think Satanists blew that
one up... so how many is that? Four. Oh. Maybe we don't have
seven so...
On 8/16/26 09:55, Paul S Person wrote:<snippo mostly confused bits and pieces. sorry about that, but that's
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:44:21 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
It is rather more general than that. At least, in official doctrine.Please explain the Virgin birth.
Given her point of view, I would say she just did.
The Virgin Birth is an RC and maybe Orthodox doctrine that
alleges that God was present in Jesus and that only a virgin could
be worthy of such birth. Some say that the child emerged from her
side, that she was impregnated by Divine Action. Further that
G*d had intervened to free Mary from the taint of Original Sin.
But in those times a Virgin was an independent woman notThere was no such thing as an "independent woman". This was the time
subjected to the authority of a husband. Not necessarily a
virgo intacto or woman who had not had intercourse.
We moved from stories to real explanations for naturalYour faith in the reality of those explanations is touching.
phenomenon from the 17th century through the present. Some
people who derives power from the stone age stores resist
these explanations which still give men power over women at
the least and impose a hierarchical order on society.
People who benefit from that hierarchical order feelThat's actually not a bad summary. Except that "heirarchical" is
that civilization will collapse if they do not have lower
ranked people to push around physically or verbally.
I am an agnostic Deist but if any divinity rulesClassic deists don't believe God is present in the world at all and
human society it must be Eris who controls the counsels
of mankind.
In article <9sq38lhiuee8gc0uue4r5ethms1u9mo62l@4ax.com>,Well, yes, but is it? Or is "prophesy" merely a (very popular)
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:37:37 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <he218ltdungk393uteva42aktr7tbdrgt8@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers >>>><bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of Southern Spain?
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City >>>>>>>> walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French >>>>>>>> crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>>>
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>>>> there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the >>>>>> Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil >>>>>> one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god, >>>>>> represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace >>>>>> (and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition. >>>>>
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but >>>>>> wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The
war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern
estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they >>>>>increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.a He would have abhorred Catharism, >>>>>> and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe >>>>>> that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back
in, and died, some said of poison.a Orthodox Christians took great >>>>>> delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he >>>>>> was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>>>>the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the >>>>Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of >>>>self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that Jesus was >>>>just of human being. Note that there are entire denominations based on >>>>the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher, and nothing more, so ... >>>>confusion ... on this point is nothing to get excited about.
Jesus is the Son of God and part of the Holy Trinity.
The RCC is the propecied Church of Thyatira.
That is one theory, yes. It is based on the idea that the Seven
Churches represent different historic periods.
Another theory is that they are examples of what the Church, and each >>individual Church, down to each and every congregation, is, and was,
and will be: a mix of different believers in different states.
If it is propecised, it is done.
In article <115uoho$trf9$1@dont-email.me>,Jesus did the writing, but otherwise you are correct.
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 17/08/2026 2:57 am, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:37:37 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <he218ltdungk393uteva42aktr7tbdrgt8@4ax.com>, Paul S
Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
<Snip>
Arius had nothing to do with this. He would have abhorred
Catharism, and he lived in the time of Constantine. His
"heresy" was to believe that JC was a created being. He was
exiled from the empire, allowed back in, and died, some said
of poison. Orthodox Christians took great delight in
inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the
mystery of the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of
self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that
Jesus was just of human being. Note that there are entire
denominations based on the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher,
and nothing more, so ... confusion ... on this point is nothing
to get excited about.
Jesus is the Son of God and part of the Holy Trinity.
The RCC is the propecied Church of Thyatira.
And where does YOUR Church fit in here, Binky(Word used by paedophiles to indicate their joy of child sexual molestation)??
That is one theory, yes. It is based on the idea that the Seven
Churches represent different historic periods.
Sorry!! "the Seven Churches"?? What are they, please??
The seven churches Paul writes to in Asia minor now modern day Turkey.
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 13:38:08 -0700, BobbieSellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/16/26 09:55, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:44:21 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
<snippo mostly confused bits and pieces. sorry about that, but that's
how I see it.>
Please explain the Virgin birth.
Given her point of view, I would say she just did.
The Virgin Birth is an RC and maybe Orthodox doctrine that
alleges that God was present in Jesus and that only a virgin could
be worthy of such birth. Some say that the child emerged from her
side, that she was impregnated by Divine Action. Further that
G*d had intervened to free Mary from the taint of Original Sin.
It is rather more general than that. At least, in official doctrine.
But in those times a Virgin was an independent woman not
subjected to the authority of a husband. Not necessarily a
virgo intacto or woman who had not had intercourse.
There was no such thing as an "independent woman". This was the time
of the /real/ Traditiional Family Values, and there was /always/ a man holding her leash: a father, a husband, a brother, an uncle, a son ... always.
This is based on Isaiah, and the Hebrew there means "young woman".
<snippo as much babbling as possible>
We moved from stories to real explanations for natural
phenomenon from the 17th century through the present. Some
people who derives power from the stone age stores resist
these explanations which still give men power over women at
the least and impose a hierarchical order on society.
Your faith in the reality of those explanations is touching.
People who benefit from that hierarchical order feel
that civilization will collapse if they do not have lower
ranked people to push around physically or verbally.
That's actually not a bad summary. Except that "heirarchical" is
inherently religious (see derivation) and so limited in scope and "civilization" is often claimed but rarely defined.
I am an agnostic Deist but if any divinity rules
human society it must be Eris who controls the counsels
of mankind.
Classic deists don't believe God is present in the world at all and
are monotheists[1] so, for them, no other gods exist.
[1] I'm not sure "monodeist" is ever used. The confusion, of course,
is because some terms use Latin /deus/ and others use Greek /theos/
for "God".
Wikipedia <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism#Contemporary_Deism>
but I don't think believing in other gods, such as Eris, fits well
into any of them.
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 13:38:08 -0700, BobbieSellers ><bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/16/26 09:55, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:44:21 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
<snippo mostly confused bits and pieces. sorry about that, but that's
how I see it.>
Please explain the Virgin birth.
Given her point of view, I would say she just did.
The Virgin Birth is an RC and maybe Orthodox doctrine that
alleges that God was present in Jesus and that only a virgin could
be worthy of such birth. Some say that the child emerged from her
side, that she was impregnated by Divine Action. Further that
G*d had intervened to free Mary from the taint of Original Sin.
It is rather more general than that. At least, in official doctrine.
But in those times a Virgin was an independent woman not
subjected to the authority of a husband. Not necessarily a
virgo intacto or woman who had not had intercourse.
There was no such thing as an "independent woman". This was the time
of the /real/ Traditiional Family Values, and there was /always/ a man >holding her leash: a father, a husband, a brother, an uncle, a son ... >always.
This is based on Isaiah, and the Hebrew there means "young woman".
<snippo as much babbling as possible>
We moved from stories to real explanations for natural
phenomenon from the 17th century through the present. Some
people who derives power from the stone age stores resist
these explanations which still give men power over women at
the least and impose a hierarchical order on society.
Your faith in the reality of those explanations is touching.
People who benefit from that hierarchical order feel
that civilization will collapse if they do not have lower
ranked people to push around physically or verbally.
That's actually not a bad summary. Except that "heirarchical" is
inherently religious (see derivation) and so limited in scope and >"civilization" is often claimed but rarely defined.
I am an agnostic Deist but if any divinity rules
human society it must be Eris who controls the counsels
of mankind.
Classic deists don't believe God is present in the world at all and
are monotheists[1] so, for them, no other gods exist.
[1] I'm not sure "monodeist" is ever used. The confusion, of course,
is because some terms use Latin /deus/ and others use Greek /theos/
for "God".
Wikipedia <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism#Contemporary_Deism>
but I don't think believing in other gods, such as Eris, fits well
into any of them.
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 18:43:34 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <9sq38lhiuee8gc0uue4r5ethms1u9mo62l@4ax.com>,Southern Spain?
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:37:37 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <he218ltdungk393uteva42aktr7tbdrgt8@4ax.com>,
Paul S Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers >>>>><bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
Daniel70 wrote:
On 14/08/2026 5:27 am, BobbieSellers wrote:
Wasn't South France widely Muslim ... or am I thinking of
You leave out Arius who was skinned and his hide hung on the City >>>>>>>>> walls, he was responsible for the Arian heresy which the French >>>>>>>>> crusade wiped out by killing everyone in the South of France and at >>>>>>>>> which the memorable phrase "Kill them all and let God sort them out". >>>>>>>>
A part of Southern France was under Muslim occupation in the 700s, but >>>>>>> there wasn't much conversion.
The crusade referred to is the anti-Albigensian crusade, against the >>>>>>> Cathars, dualists who believed that the old testament god was an evil >>>>>>> one who created the world for us to suffer in while the real god, >>>>>>> represented by JC would welcome our souls once we lived a life of grace
(and we got an infinite number of chances).
Thanks to your numerous corrections to my confused (by RC HS) rendition. >>>>>>
Cathars were to attempt to abstain from sex, meat, and violence (but >>>>>>> wine was OK) and if they succeeded in this they attained the status of >>>>>>> "perfect" and went to heaven on death.a If not, try again.
While the Cathars were wiped out or dispersed, the bulk of the
casualties were local Catholics who defended their Cathar neighbors. The
war became a religious pretext for landless northerners to grab southern
estates.
Well some of them had estates by which murders of the locals they >>>>>>increased.
Arius had nothing to do with this.a He would have abhorred Catharism, >>>>>>> and he lived in the time of Constantine. His "heresy" was to believe >>>>>>> that JC was a created being. He was exiled from the empire, allowed back
in, and died, some said of poison.a Orthodox Christians took great >>>>>>> delight in inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he >>>>>>> was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the mystery of >>>>>>the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the >>>>>Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of >>>>>self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that Jesus was >>>>>just of human being. Note that there are entire denominations based on >>>>>the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher, and nothing more, so ... >>>>>confusion ... on this point is nothing to get excited about.
Jesus is the Son of God and part of the Holy Trinity.
The RCC is the propecied Church of Thyatira.
That is one theory, yes. It is based on the idea that the Seven
Churches represent different historic periods.
Another theory is that they are examples of what the Church, and each >>>individual Church, down to each and every congregation, is, and was,
and will be: a mix of different believers in different states.
If it is propecised, it is done.
Well, yes, but is it? Or is "prophesy" merely a (very popular) >interpretation? Which may be in error, who can say?
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
On Mon, 17 Aug 2026 14:37:28 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <115uoho$trf9$1@dont-email.me>,to indicate their joy of child sexual molestation)??
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 17/08/2026 2:57 am, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:37:37 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
In article <he218ltdungk393uteva42aktr7tbdrgt8@4ax.com>, Paul S
Person <psperson@old.netcom.invalid> wrote:
On Fri, 14 Aug 2026 12:31:30 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/14/26 11:42, William Hyde wrote:
<Snip>
Arius had nothing to do with this. He would have abhorred
Catharism, and he lived in the time of Constantine. His
"heresy" was to believe that JC was a created being. He was
exiled from the empire, allowed back in, and died, some said
of poison. Orthodox Christians took great delight in
inventing a painful and embarrassing death for him, but he
was never skinned.
Jesus not the Christ was a created being. It is part of the
mystery of the Incarnation aka being in the meat.
If that is your memory of RC theology, you may want to find the
Catholic Encyclopedia on line and give it a read on this topic.
Then again, a recent report on a survey had more than half of
self-indentified Evangelicals agreeing with a statement that
Jesus was just of human being. Note that there are entire
denominations based on the idea that Jesus was a Great Teacher,
and nothing more, so ... confusion ... on this point is nothing
to get excited about.
Jesus is the Son of God and part of the Holy Trinity.
The RCC is the propecied Church of Thyatira.
And where does YOUR Church fit in here, Binky(Word used by paedophiles
That is one theory, yes. It is based on the idea that the Seven
Churches represent different historic periods.
Sorry!! "the Seven Churches"?? What are they, please??
The seven churches Paul writes to in Asia minor now modern day Turkey.
Jesus did the writing, but otherwise you are correct.
The letters are found in the first few chapters of Revelation.
----
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"
On 8/17/26 09:05, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 13:38:08 -0700, BobbieSellers
<bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.invalid> wrote:
On 8/16/26 09:55, Paul S Person wrote:
On Sun, 16 Aug 2026 01:44:21 -0000 (UTC), doctor@doctor.nl2k.ab.ca
(The Doctor) wrote:
<snippo mostly confused bits and pieces. sorry about that, but that's
how I see it.>
Please explain the Virgin birth.
Given her point of view, I would say she just did.
The Virgin Birth is an RC and maybe Orthodox doctrine that
alleges that God was present in Jesus and that only a virgin could
be worthy of such birth. Some say that the child emerged from her
side, that she was impregnated by Divine Action. Further that
G*d had intervened to free Mary from the taint of Original Sin.
It is rather more general than that. At least, in official doctrine.
But in those times a Virgin was an independent woman not
subjected to the authority of a husband. Not necessarily a
virgo intacto or woman who had not had intercourse.
There was no such thing as an "independent woman". This was the time
of the /real/ Traditiional Family Values, and there was /always/ a man
holding her leash: a father, a husband, a brother, an uncle, a son ...
always.
This is based on Isaiah, and the Hebrew there means "young woman".
<snippo as much babbling as possible>
We moved from stories to real explanations for natural
phenomenon from the 17th century through the present. Some
people who derives power from the stone age stores resist
these explanations which still give men power over women at
the least and impose a hierarchical order on society.
Your faith in the reality of those explanations is touching.
People who benefit from that hierarchical order feel
that civilization will collapse if they do not have lower
ranked people to push around physically or verbally.
That's actually not a bad summary. Except that "heirarchical" is
inherently religious (see derivation) and so limited in scope and
"civilization" is often claimed but rarely defined.
hierarchical order is most clearly experienced not only in religion but
in the Military organizations.
I am an agnostic Deist but if any divinity rules
human society it must be Eris who controls the counsels
of mankind.
Classic deists don't believe God is present in the world at all and
are monotheists[1] so, for them, no other gods exist.
I am not even classy, much less Classical in any sense.
[1] I'm not sure "monodeist" is ever used. The confusion, of course,
is because some terms use Latin /deus/ and others use Greek /theos/
for "God".
And Thea was earlier, the Goddess Themis representing law and ordered
society
Wikipedia <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deism#Contemporary_Deism>
but I don't think believing in other gods, such as Eris, fits well
into any of them.
Who cares about fitting into any system, Eris is a metaphor for the
disputatious nature of mankind. She is, recall, the Goddess who tossed
the golden apple to Paris to be awarded to the most beautiful of
the Goddesses there assembled which sparked the Trojan War.
Since she is female she is another patriarchal scapegoat as well. Men
are always blaming women for their own sexual drives and disputes.
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