From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

I just read
GitHub, Android, Python, Go: More Software Adopts Race-Neutral Terminology

at https://developers.slashdot.org/story/20/06/14/1722223/github-android-python-go-more-software-adopts-race-neutral-terminology

The BIND 9.11 Administrator Reference Manual at https://kb.isc.org/docs/aa-01493
still refers to masters and slaves.

Is this ARM the most recent version?

Are there any discussions about changing terms?

Anyway, when one is talking abut BDSM^H^H^H^H BIND, "master" and "slave"
are the established terms, I believe?

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On Sun, 14 Jun 2020, Vin0cius Ferrpo wrote:

ISC had a statement about it a time ago:ahttps://twitter.com/ISCdotORG/status/942815837299253248

Thanks. I vaguely recalled something but my search didn't turn
this up.

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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

Totally not BIND related, but in BDSM "top" and "bottom" are quite
widely used. So there is a non-slavery-related nomenclature there as well.


Am 15.06.20 um 00:53 schrieb Vin|!cius Ferr|uo via bind-users:

ISC had a statement about it a time ago:-ahttps://twitter.com/ISCdotORG/status/942815837299253248

You can now call primary and secondary zones. But the prevalence of
terms are still master and slave. And I really hope this thing of
changing nomenclatures doesnrCOt go any further due to political correctness.

For the newcomers itrCOs not OK to break years of terms, software and documentation just because some people canrCOt handle terms like master
and slave. Slavery still exists today and making the word disappear will
not solve the issue.

And yourCOre correct about the BDSM thing. ItrCOs a waste of time, efforts and lines of code.

Regards,

On 14 Jun 2020, at 19:38, Brett Delmage <Brett@BrettDelmage.ca
<mailto:Brett@BrettDelmage.ca>> wrote:

I just read
GitHub, Android, Python, Go: More Software Adopts Race-Neutral Terminology >>
at
https://developers.slashdot.org/story/20/06/14/1722223/github-android-python-go-more-software-adopts-race-neutral-terminology

The BIND 9.11 Administrator Reference Manual at
https://kb.isc.org/docs/aa-01493
still refers to masters and slaves.

Is this ARM the most recent version?

Are there any discussions about changing terms?

Anyway, when one is talking abut BDSM^H^H^H^H BIND, "master" and
"slave" are the established terms, I believe?

_______________________________________________
Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to
unsubscribe from this list

ISC funds the development of this software with paid support
subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more
information.


bind-users mailing list
bind-users@lists.isc.org
https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users

_______________________________________________
Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list

ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information.

bind-users mailing list
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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind


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Hi Brett,

BIND 9 already uses primary/secondary as keywords and we are actively
working on updating BIND 9 to match the canon defined in RFC 8499.

You can find the latest documentation from the BIND 9 development branch
here: https://bind9.readthedocs.io/en/latest/

Cheers,
Ondrej
--
Ond=C5=99ej Sur=C3=BD
ondrej@isc.org

On 15 Jun 2020, at 00:38, Brett Delmage <Brett@BrettDelmage.ca> wrote:
=20
I just read
GitHub, Android, Python, Go: More Software Adopts Race-Neutral =

Terminology

=20
at =

https://developers.slashdot.org/story/20/06/14/1722223/github-android-pyth= on-go-more-software-adopts-race-neutral-terminology

=20
The BIND 9.11 Administrator Reference Manual at https://kb.isc.org/docs/aa-01493
still refers to masters and slaves.
=20
Is this ARM the most recent version?
=20
Are there any discussions about changing terms?
=20
Anyway, when one is talking abut BDSM^H^H^H^H BIND, "master" and =

"slave" are the established terms, I believe?

=20
_______________________________________________
Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to =

unsubscribe from this list

=20
ISC funds the development of this software with paid support =

subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more = information.

=20
=20
bind-users mailing list
bind-users@lists.isc.org
https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users

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while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.

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Vin=C3=ADcius Ferr=C3=A3o via bind-users <bind-users@lists.isc.org> wrote:

But the prevalence of terms are still master and slave. And I really
hope this thing of changing nomenclatures doesn=E2=80=99t go any further =

due to

political correctness.

"Political correctness" just means being considerate for other people, especially people who do not have many of the advantages we might take for granted.

In any case, master/slave is bad terminology because it is actively
misleading. It suggests that zone transfers to downstream servers are
under the control of the upstream servers, which is definitely not the
case. And it suggests a binary categorization of servers which is also
wrong, because zone transfers often form a multi-level cascade between
servers that perform several different functions. It's better to talk
about update servers, signing servers, zone transfer servers, public or
private or stealth authoritative servers. For zone transfers it's better
to talk about which servers are upstream and downstream of each other in
the distribution network.

You should find that your writing is easier to understand, both for
experts and non-experts, if you don't use the bad old terminology.

Tony.
--=20
f.anthony.n.finch <dot@dotat.at> http://dotat.at/
Plymouth: Cyclonic 3 to 5. Mainly slight. Thundery showers. Good, occasiona= lly
poor.
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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

The terminology is fairly misleading, as in the slave is not doing the
work on-behalf of or instruction of the the master. But there is ways
for the master to influence the slaves; such as "allow-transfer".

I don't see the big issue with making a terminology change in this case.

On 15/06/2020 15:38, Tony Finch wrote:

Vin|!cius Ferr|uo via bind-users <bind-users@lists.isc.org> wrote:

But the prevalence of terms are still master and slave. And I really
hope this thing of changing nomenclatures doesnrCOt go any further due to
political correctness.

"Political correctness" just means being considerate for other people, especially people who do not have many of the advantages we might take for granted.

In any case, master/slave is bad terminology because it is actively misleading. It suggests that zone transfers to downstream servers are
under the control of the upstream servers, which is definitely not the
case. And it suggests a binary categorization of servers which is also
wrong, because zone transfers often form a multi-level cascade between servers that perform several different functions. It's better to talk
about update servers, signing servers, zone transfer servers, public or private or stealth authoritative servers. For zone transfers it's better
to talk about which servers are upstream and downstream of each other in
the distribution network.

You should find that your writing is easier to understand, both for
experts and non-experts, if you don't use the bad old terminology.

Tony.

_______________________________________________
Please visit https://lists.isc.org/mailman/listinfo/bind-users to unsubscribe from this list

ISC funds the development of this software with paid support subscriptions. Contact us at https://www.isc.org/contact/ for more information.

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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

After I feel I have mastered DNS and BIND after slaving over the docs and
code for years (I'm not there yet, and I have not) how am I going to communicate this to people?

How will I be able to master anything technical anymore? Should I just
stop trying?


Thesaurus.com suggests that one could call one type of DNS server the "crackerjack" server instead. I guess that's an improvement over
"cracked". "Ace" server is a suggested alternative too, and it's nicely
terse.

https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/master?s=t




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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

Completely aside from the topic at hand, I often like to think that
after a few years I mastered something. System administration,
electronics, programming, whatever has piqued my interest for several
years already and got me to invest in it. It is never true. The first profession I pursued was system administration and Linux in general.
Even today I still learn so much on the daily. Mastery? I may be
experienced with Linux but mastery is still far ahead... It's quite interesting how deep the rabbit hole can go. What matters is how deep we
want it to go I guess.

Crackerjack is an interesting name, if anything I'd just want it for
shits and giggles :D

On 6/15/20 9:07 PM, Brett Delmage wrote:

After I feel I have mastered DNS and BIND after slaving over the docs
and code for years (I'm not there yet, and I have not) how am I going
to communicate this to people?

How will I be able to master anything technical anymore? Should I just
stop trying?

Thesaurus.com suggests that one could call one type of DNS server the "crackerjack" server instead. I guess that's an improvement over
"cracked". "Ace" server is a suggested alternative too, and it's
nicely terse.

https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/master?s=t

--
Met vriendelijke groet / Best regards,
Michael De Roover
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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 10:38 AM Tony Finch <dot@dotat.at> wrote:

Vin|!cius Ferr|uo via bind-users <bind-users@lists.isc.org> wrote:

But the prevalence of terms are still master and slave. And I really
hope this thing of changing nomenclatures doesnrCOt go any further due to political correctness.

"Political correctness" just means being considerate for other people, especially people who do not have many of the advantages we might take for granted.

Being considerate to others should not be associated with politics,
something the term "political correctness" is.
There is a term in Africa for those who use "especially people who do
not have many of the advantages we might take for granted" in their
sentences; it is not a particularly positive term.
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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

On Mon, 15 Jun 2020, Mauricio Tavares wrote:

On Mon, Jun 15, 2020 at 10:38 AM Tony Finch <dot@dotat.at> wrote:

Vin?cius Ferr?o via bind-users <bind-users@lists.isc.org> wrote:

But the prevalence of terms are still master and slave. And I really
hope this thing of changing nomenclatures doesn?t go any further due to
political correctness.

"Political correctness" just means being considerate for other people,
especially people who do not have many of the advantages we might take for >> granted.

Being considerate to others should not be associated with politics,
something the term "political correctness" is.

There is a term in Africa for those who use "especially people who do
not have many of the advantages we might take for granted" in their sentences; it is not a particularly positive term.

Regardless of whether you consider this a political issue or not the terminology master/slave has a poor connotation for large swathes of the general public.

In the time we live in the change from master/slave to primary/secondary
is both justified and appropriate.

Although nobody likes to change, this is a fairly minor issue and not deserving of complaint.

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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

Hi there,

On Mon, 15 Jun 2020, bind-users-request@lists.isc.org wrote - and wrote, and wrote:

... [all sniped] ...

Please guys[1], stop it.
--

73,
Ged.
[1] The masculine embraces the feminine where the context permits.
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From Newsgroup: comp.protocols.dns.bind

We have decided to put the list into general moderation because it feels like there is nothing substantive to add on this topic and it seems like we might benefit from a cooling off period before anyone gets more upset. We will push through any posts on any other topic (about BIND anyway), and will remove the moderation flag in a day or two.
If anyone wants to object, they can email me directly, or just mail to the list and I will see it even if it isnrCOt posted.
Vicky--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2