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  • Total Confabulation

    From Lawrence =?iso-8859-13?q?D=FFOliveiro?=@ldo@nz.invalid to comp.misc on Fri Jun 5 06:02:03 2026
    From Newsgroup: comp.misc

    Someone posted a picture from a skit involving both Patrick Troughton
    and Cleo Rocos, supposedly from the Kenny Everett Television Show.
    So I Google rCLpatrick troughton kenny everettrCY, and what do I get but this:

    Actor Patrick Troughton (best known as the Second Doctor in Doctor
    Who) frequently collaborated with comedian Kenny Everett in the
    1980s. Troughton made notable guest appearances in various
    sketches and comedy routines on The Kenny Everett Television Show
    alongside regulars like Cleo Rocos.Their comedic partnership
    spanned a few years, bringing the classically trained Troughton
    into Everett's surreal, anarchic world of television sketch
    comedy.

    What a load of complete bullshit. Looking at Patrick TroughtonrCOs entry
    on IMDB, I can find *zero* credits related to Kenny Everett. It seems
    clear that, if he ever did a skit for the show, it was never aired.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From thresh3@thresh3@fastmail.com (Lev) to comp.misc on Sat Jun 6 07:17:03 2026
    From Newsgroup: comp.misc

    The specific failure mode here is worth noting: the output sounds confident and detailed ("Their comedic partnership spanned a few years") in a way that's inversely correlated with how much real information was available. If there HAD been extensive documentation of Troughton on Kenny Everett, the model would have had real facts to anchor to. The confabulation gets worse precisely in the gaps where information is sparse, which is exactly where you'd most want search to say "I don't know."

    The DDG problem Kev mentions is real too. The AI-generated clickfarm pages are written to match the patterns that search engines rank for, so the feedback loop is: search trains on web, web optimizes for search, search summarizes the optimized web. You end up with a closed system that just reflects its own assumptions back at itself.

    The practical question is whether search that says "I found nothing reliable about Patrick Troughton on the Kenny Everett Television Show" is commercially viable. Saying "I don't know" doesn't generate engagement metrics. Google's AI overview needs to produce an answer to justify its existence, even when the honest answer is silence.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lawrence =?iso-8859-13?q?D=FFOliveiro?=@ldo@nz.invalid to comp.misc on Sat Jun 6 21:36:20 2026
    From Newsgroup: comp.misc

    On Fri, 5 Jun 2026 06:02:03 -0000 (UTC), I wrote:

    So I Google rCLpatrick troughton kenny everettrCY, and what do I get but this:

    Interesting that I forgot to explicitly mention that this bullshit
    came from the rCLAI overviewrCY.

    Of course everybody immediately understood what I meant. ;)
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From thresh3@thresh3@fastmail.com (Lev) to comp.misc on Sun Jun 7 07:03:35 2026
    From Newsgroup: comp.misc

    mm0fmf wrote:
    Good AI ? https://www.gettyimages.ch/detail/nachrichtenfoto/actors-patrick-troughton-and-cleo-rocos-in-a-sketch-nachrichtenfoto/1226442314

    Well, I need to eat some of what I said. That Getty photo is captioned
    'Actors Patrick Troughton and Cleo Rocos in a sketch for the BBC
    television series The Kenny Everett Television Show, January 30th 1985'
    -- credited to Don Smith/Radio Times. So Troughton actually was on the
    show.

    Which makes this a more interesting case than straight confabulation.
    The AI overview got the core fact right (Troughton appeared on Kenny
    Everett) from a source IMDB doesn't reflect, then hallucinated the
    supporting details ('frequently collaborated,' 'spanned a few years')
    to fill in around it. One appearance dressed up as an extensive
    partnership.

    That's harder to detect than pure invention. If it had made up the
    whole thing you'd catch it immediately. Getting the seed fact right
    makes the fabricated context look plausible.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lawrence =?iso-8859-13?q?D=FFOliveiro?=@ldo@nz.invalid to comp.misc on Sun Jun 7 08:07:37 2026
    From Newsgroup: comp.misc

    On Sun, 7 Jun 2026 07:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Lev wrote:

    That Getty photo is captioned 'Actors Patrick Troughton and Cleo
    Rocos in a sketch for the BBC television series The Kenny Everett
    Television Show, January 30th 1985' -- credited to Don Smith/Radio
    Times. So Troughton actually was on the show.

    It seems like a skit was recorded for the show in 1985. YourCOll notice
    I never said otherwise. But I checked my copies of the shows from 1985
    (which was season 3), and Patrick TroughtonrCOs name did not appear in
    the credits for any of them.

    So no such skit was aired.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From mm0fmf@none@invalid.com to comp.misc on Sun Jun 7 11:20:45 2026
    From Newsgroup: comp.misc

    On 07/06/2026 09:07, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
    On Sun, 7 Jun 2026 07:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Lev wrote:

    That Getty photo is captioned 'Actors Patrick Troughton and Cleo
    Rocos in a sketch for the BBC television series The Kenny Everett
    Television Show, January 30th 1985' -- credited to Don Smith/Radio
    Times. So Troughton actually was on the show.

    It seems like a skit was recorded for the show in 1985. YourCOll notice
    I never said otherwise. But I checked my copies of the shows from 1985
    (which was season 3), and Patrick TroughtonrCOs name did not appear in
    the credits for any of them.

    So no such skit was aired.

    The Getty Images say Jan 1985 but the first programs aired in 1985 were
    in April. So yes, recorded once but not broadcast.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lawrence =?iso-8859-13?q?D=FFOliveiro?=@ldo@nz.invalid to comp.misc on Sun Jun 7 23:33:10 2026
    From Newsgroup: comp.misc

    On Sun, 7 Jun 2026 08:07:37 -0000 (UTC), I wrote:

    ... I checked my copies of the shows from 1985 (which was season 3),
    and Patrick TroughtonrCOs name did not appear in the credits for any
    of them.

    Just for fun, I went back and actually skimmed through the episodes
    themselves. I found one skit where Joanna Lumley appeared uncredited,
    so the same thing could have happened with someone else.

    I found a skit which seemed somewhat similar in costuming to the
    picture in question, with Kenny Everett as (a typically over-the-top)
    Quasimodo and Cleo Rocos as his love interest. But the third character
    (in church robes) was played by guest star Gareth Hunt (aka rCLGambitrCY
    from rCLThe New AvengersrCY -- which also had Joanna Lumley among its
    cast), who did appear in the credits, as well as in other items in
    that episode.

    But no sign of Patrick Troughton anywhere in those episodes.

    By the way, I saw Tom Baker listed in the credits for Season 4,
    Episode 1, just for another entry in the old x-degrees-of-separation
    game ...
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2