From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.

--2739015498-1157977665-1659820659=:95900
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE

On Sat, 6 Aug 2022, Eduardo Chappa wrote:

On Fri, 5 Aug 2022, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

Could I please request that you not post articles to plain text Usenet t= hat=20
are attachments with QUOTED-PRINTABLE encoding? There's no plain text=20
alternative part and there's no reason to encode.

Adam, please take a look at RFC 5536, which effectively allows for=20 quoted-printable in news articles. I understand you will never like it, b=

ut=20

it is perfectly legal, and there is no reason to create noise about it.

Oh. So I didn't accidentally do anything wrong then.

Anyway, could you please point out where I can set this off anyway? Since=
=20
I haven't set such thing ... at least not knowingly.

--=20
=E2=82=AA BUD =E2=82=AA
--2739015498-1157977665-1659820659=:95900--
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

At 11:26am -0000, 08/06/22, Eduardo Chappa <chappa@washington.edu> wrote:

On Fri, 5 Aug 2022, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

Could I please request that you not post articles to plain text Usenet that >>are attachments with QUOTED-PRINTABLE encoding? There's no plain text >>alternative part and there's no reason to encode.

Adam, please take a look at RFC 5536, which effectively allows for >quoted-printable in news articles. I understand you will never like it, but >it is perfectly legal, and there is no reason to create noise about it.

I'm posting a followup with alpine. Here's a non-ASCII character.

o

Let's see if I get quoted-printable encoding and if the main body of the article ends up in a second attachment, with the boilerplate nag about MIME-aware tools in the first part.
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From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

At 8:01pm -0000, 08/06/22, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-7
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT

At 11:26am -0000, 08/06/22, Eduardo Chappa <chappa@washington.edu> wrote:

On Fri, 5 Aug 2022, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

Could I please request that you not post articles to plain text Usenet that >>>are attachments with QUOTED-PRINTABLE encoding? There's no plain text >>>alternative part and there's no reason to encode.

Adam, please take a look at RFC 5536, which effectively allows for >>quoted-printable in news articles. I understand you will never like it, but >>it is perfectly legal, and there is no reason to create noise about it.

I'm posting a followup with alpine. Here's a non-ASCII character.

?

In UTF-8, that was supposed to be an apostrophe.

Let's see if I get quoted-printable encoding and if the main body of the >article ends up in a second attachment, with the boilerplate nag about >MIME-aware tools in the first part.

Huh

I was not expecting the MIME header to declare ISO-8859-7 since my shell's environment has character set to UTF-8, and my terminal emulation matches.

In any event, I didn't get a multipart.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

Eduardo Chappa <chappa@washington.edu> wrote:

On Fri, 5 Aug 2022, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

Could I please request that you not post articles to plain text Usenet >>that are attachments with QUOTED-PRINTABLE encoding? There's no plain
text alternative part and there's no reason to encode.

Adam, please take a look at RFC 5536, which effectively allows for >quoted-printable in news articles. I understand you will never like it,
but it is perfectly legal, and there is no reason to create noise about
it.

I don't agree that attachments are part of plain-text Usenet either.
I've just never seen alpine do that before and I have no idea how
to recreate it.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.

--2739015498-1355159910-1659889921=:53077
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE

On Sun, 7 Aug 2022, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

Eduardo Chappa <chappa@washington.edu> wrote:

On Fri, 5 Aug 2022, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

Could I please request that you not post articles to plain text Usenet
that are attachments with QUOTED-PRINTABLE encoding? There's no plain
text alternative part and there's no reason to encode.

Adam, please take a look at RFC 5536, which effectively allows for
quoted-printable in news articles. I understand you will never like it,
but it is perfectly legal, and there is no reason to create noise about
it.

I don't agree that attachments are part of plain-text Usenet either.
I've just never seen alpine do that before and I have no idea how
to recreate it.

If you figure that out let me know how I turn that thing off ... so far I=
=20
have no idea what is going on.

Like I said. I haven't done any setting of that sort. So I'm completely=20 clueless why this happens.

--=20
=E2=82=AA BUD =E2=82=AA
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From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.

--2739015498-1164100211-1659933957=:9738
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE

On Sun, 7 Aug 2022, Bud Spencer wrote:

On Sun, 7 Aug 2022, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

Eduardo Chappa <chappa@washington.edu> wrote:

On Fri, 5 Aug 2022, Adam H. Kerman wrote:

=20

Could I please request that you not post articles to plain text Usenet >>>> that are attachments with QUOTED-PRINTABLE encoding? There's no plain
text alternative part and there's no reason to encode.

=20

Adam, please take a look at RFC 5536, which effectively allows for
quoted-printable in news articles. I understand you will never like it,
but it is perfectly legal, and there is no reason to create noise about
it.

=20
I don't agree that attachments are part of plain-text Usenet either.
I've just never seen alpine do that before and I have no idea how
to recreate it.

If you figure that out let me know how I turn that thing off ... so far I=

=20

have no idea what is going on.

Like I said. I haven't done any setting of that sort. So I'm completely=

=20

clueless why this happens.

Could you help Eduardo? I still have no idea how to set Alpine not to do=20 such thing. Or I'm just missing something big time :)

--=20
=E2=82=AA BUD =E2=82=AA
--2739015498-1164100211-1659933957=:9738--
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

On Mon, 8 Aug 2022, Bud Spencer wrote:

Could you help Eduardo? I still have no idea how to set Alpine not to do such thing. Or I'm just missing something big time :)

Bud, there is nothing to do here. You cannot configure Alpine so that it
will not do something that Adam will not like.

The point is: There are 8-bits in your message, Alpine will encode them somehow (meaning they will not be sent as 8-bit). That is the standard.
--
Eduardo
https://alpineapp.email (web)
http://repo.or.cz/alpine.git (Git)
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.

--2739015498-1322974694-1659985100=:22649
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE

On Mon, 8 Aug 2022, Eduardo Chappa wrote:

On Mon, 8 Aug 2022, Bud Spencer wrote:

Could you help Eduardo? I still have no idea how to set Alpine not to do= =20
such thing. Or I'm just missing something big time :)

Bud, there is nothing to do here. You cannot configure Alpine so that it =

will=20

not do something that Adam will not like.

I wasn't thinking of this because of him. Just out of interest and if,=20
which is doubtful, I did have made something in mistake.

The point is: There are 8-bits in your message, Alpine will encode them=

=20

somehow (meaning they will not be sent as 8-bit). That is the standard.

So nothing is broken then. I'm fine with that.

Thanks for taking time to elaborate this more to my autistic mind :)

--=20
=E2=82=AA BUD =E2=82=AA
--2739015498-1322974694-1659985100=:22649--
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

Eduardo Chappa <chappa@washington.edu> wrote:

On Mon, 8 Aug 2022, Bud Spencer wrote:

Could you help Eduardo? I still have no idea how to set Alpine not to do >>such thing. Or I'm just missing something big time :)

Bud, there is nothing to do here. You cannot configure Alpine so that it >will not do something that Adam will not like.

The point is: There are 8-bits in your message, Alpine will encode them >somehow (meaning they will not be sent as 8-bit). That is the standard.

You're being unfair, Eduardo. I raised the issue because of the fact that alpine created an article as a two-part multipart with one of the two
parts blank (except for the nag boilerplate about using MIME-aware
tools) with his intended main body of the article in the second
attachment.

Multiparts aren't plain text Usenet. That's undesireable.

The quoted-printable encoding was a separate matter. Yes, there is a quoted-printable encoding standard that alpine implements. Nevertheless, unencoded text should be prefered over encoded text in an almost entirely
8-bit clean environment like Usenet.

The issue of attachments is of greater concern than the issue of quoted-printable.

I wasn't able to figure out what settings he used to get that result.

I understand that you disagree with everything I've written.
Nevertheless, I'm not alone in caring that text Usenet remains a plain
text medium of communication.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> wrote:

This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.

--2739015498-1322974694-1659985100=:22649
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed >Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE

On Mon, 8 Aug 2022, Eduardo Chappa wrote:

On Mon, 8 Aug 2022, Bud Spencer wrote:

Could you help Eduardo? I still have no idea how to set Alpine not to do= >=20
such thing. Or I'm just missing something big time :)

Bud, there is nothing to do here. You cannot configure Alpine so that it = >will=20
not do something that Adam will not like.

I wasn't thinking of this because of him. Just out of interest and if,=20 >which is doubtful, I did have made something in mistake.

The point is: There are 8-bits in your message, Alpine will encode them=

=20

somehow (meaning they will not be sent as 8-bit). That is the standard.

So nothing is broken then. I'm fine with that.

Broken behavior is non-standards compliance. That's not the issue here.
Eduardo makes sure alpine remains standards compliant.

Thanks for taking time to elaborate this more to my autistic mind :)

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

Hi Adam,

Eduardo Chappa <chappa@washington.edu> wrote:
[...]

The point is: There are 8-bits in your message, Alpine will encode them >>somehow (meaning they will not be sent as 8-bit). That is the standard.

[...]
The quoted-printable encoding was a separate matter. Yes, there is a quoted-printable encoding standard that alpine implements. Nevertheless, unencoded text should be prefered over encoded text in an almost entirely 8-bit clean environment like Usenet.

I beg your pardon! In newsgroups text should get uuencoded in preference
to for instance quoted printable encoding?

Especially in newsgroups exactly this should be the case at all. They
should stay as close to us ascii text as possible so that they are as
readable as possible even if the raw article is presented to you.

And I think this is what you'll read if you read all RFCs relevant for newsgroup articles.

The issue of attachments is of greater concern than the issue of quoted-printable.

Here I'm totally with you.

[...]

Best regards,
Henning
--
Zero Mostel: That's it baby! When you got it, flaunt it! Flaunt it!
-- Mel Brooks, "The Producers"
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mail.pine

Henning Hucke <h_hucke+news.reply@newsmail.aeon.icebear.org> wrote:

Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

Eduardo Chappa <chappa@washington.edu> wrote:

[...]

The point is: There are 8-bits in your message, Alpine will encode them >>>somehow (meaning they will not be sent as 8-bit). That is the standard.

[...]
The quoted-printable encoding was a separate matter. Yes, there is a >>quoted-printable encoding standard that alpine implements. Nevertheless, >>unencoded text should be prefered over encoded text in an almost entirely >>8-bit clean environment like Usenet.

I beg your pardon! In newsgroups text should get uuencoded in preference
to for instance quoted printable encoding?

You've whooshed me.

Especially in newsgroups exactly this should be the case at all. They
should stay as close to us ascii text as possible so that they are as >readable as possible even if the raw article is presented to you.

And I think this is what you'll read if you read all RFCs relevant for >newsgroup articles.

8Bit Content Transfer Encoding is certainly allowed. Usenet wasn't
restricted to 7bit like SMTP but does retain the 1000 character line
length limit.

The issue of attachments is of greater concern than the issue of >>quoted-printable.

Here I'm totally with you.

Is the MIME-aware tools nag message language boilerplate from one of
the standards?

[...]

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2