From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with damaged rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through there on Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway- pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with damaged rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through there on Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
lindsay <lindsay@nuneya.biz> wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound
delays on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope
Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with
damaged rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
Always the state
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
Only the rims, not the tyres
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through there
on Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or State? >>
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's
east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through there
on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with Dan
Andrews
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
Thereafter the rot continued. And the Vic land tax was the coup de--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
grace! The denizens of country areas are surrounding their large
potholes in white paint to warn motorists. Fugg!
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with Dan
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-It even made the news up here in QLD.
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's east. >>>
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or State? >>>
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through there on >>> Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
Andrews who was criminally insane,
much like his predecessors Kennett.
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
Thereafter the rot continued. And the Vic land tax was the coup de
grace!
The denizens of country areas are surrounding their large
potholes in white paint to warn motorists. Fugg!
On 10/08/2026 7:38 pm, Keithr0 wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through
there on Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
I use that freeway a minimum of 30 times a year-a (15x, both ways)...
It's now a contest as to whether there's more potholes, more fog, or
more fixed speed cameras. Like the rest of the joint, it's a basket case.
On 10/08/2026 12:32 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
lindsay <lindsay@nuneya.biz> wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large
potholes that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in
Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound
delays on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before
Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it
was carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with
damaged rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
Always the state
cool. So the Vic state govt is responsible for maintenance of a
federal freeway. Havent hears a peep form the new "leader" Ben Carroll.
https://imgur.com/a/9FWo1Lt
God knows what this has cost, due to inaction of Jacinta Alien and her
crew of genetic misfits. So much money stuffed down the Suburban Rail
Loop black hole, and the rail crossing removal as well, the rest of
the transport $$$$ for the whole of the state has evaporated. It'll
take YEARS to recover. Would be interesting to see both sides of Vic politics to put a "real" price on repairing-a Victorians roads before
the Nov election. From memory, Cint the Bint promised $1.1 billion,
Wilson promised 4 x more over the next 3 years.
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
Only the rims, not the tyres
Jesus, if it was me? Id use the tyres like the South Africans used to...
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's
east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound delays >>>> on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope Street. >>>>
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was >>>> carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with damaged >>>> rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through
there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
Always the state
cool. So the Vic state govt is responsible for maintenance of a
federal freeway. Havent hears a peep form the new "leader" Ben Carroll.
he has peeped now, vowing to fix this problem, and the roads in general
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote:
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate
in greater Melb.
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the
most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last week, difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but the I found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the most expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the East West
link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes >>>>> that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's >>>>> east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound
delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope
Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it >>>>> was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with
damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or >>>>> State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through
there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate
in greater Melb.
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the
most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last week, difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but the I found that the project itself was impressive.--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the most expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the East West
link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 09:24:06 +1000, Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway- >>>>>> pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes >>>>>> that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's >>>>>> east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound
delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope
Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it >>>>>> was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with
damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal
or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through
there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate
in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of them
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the
most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
On 11/08/2026 9:24 am, Daryl wrote:
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote:
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate
in greater Melb.
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the
most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last week,
difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but the I
found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the most
expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the East West
link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
IMHO, the railway xing removal was a good idea at the start... then when
it was nearly completed (50 xings?) he added another 25 or so to keep
the unions and bikies happy and in a job/at the trough. No doubt a fair
bit of the missing $15 billion was spent/wasted/stolen here..
Gotta get Andrews and Allen in front of a judge...>
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway- >>>>>>> pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large
potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's >>>>>>> east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound >>>>>>> delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it >>>>>>> was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with >>>>>>> damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal >>>>>>> or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through >>>>>>> there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still >>>>> ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate >>> in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of
them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the same
time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other projects, in
other words it would be affordable.
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same time
than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of time.
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the >>> most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home due
to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between her
workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting rid of that traffic congestion?
The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts,
possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate issue to whether or not a project has merit.
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question is can
Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 09:24:06 +1000, Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway- >>>>>> pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes >>>>>> that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's >>>>>> east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound
delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope
Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it >>>>>> was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with
damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal
or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through
there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate
in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of them
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the
most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
--I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last week,
difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but the I
found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the most
expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the East West
link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound
delays on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope
Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with
damaged rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or
State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through there
on Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway- >>>>>>>> pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large
potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in
Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound >>>>>>>> delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne >>>>>>>> it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with >>>>>>>> damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal >>>>>>>> or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through >>>>>>>> there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan >>>>>> Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still >>>>>> ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of
them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the same
time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other projects, in
other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same time
than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of time.
Makes a lot more sense to no do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has
the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial
vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home due
to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between her
workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting rid of
that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
--The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts,
possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate issue to
whether or not a project has merit.
That project has no merit given the insane cost of it
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question is
can Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
So it is stupid, like I said
There is a reason no one else is that stupid
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large potholes >>>>> that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's
east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound
delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope Street. >>>>>
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it was >>>>> carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with
damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal or >>>>> State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through
there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate
in greater Melb.
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the
most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last week, difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but the I found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the most expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the East West
link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway- >>>>>>>> pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's >>>>>>>> east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound >>>>>>>> delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it >>>>>>>> was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with >>>>>>>> damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal >>>>>>>> or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through >>>>>>>> there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with Dan >>>>>> Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still >>>>>> ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate >>>> in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of
them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the same
time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other projects, in
other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same time
than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of time.
Makes a lot more sense to no do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the >>>> most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial
vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home due
to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between her
workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting rid of that >> traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts,
possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate issue to
whether or not a project has merit.
That project has no merit given the insane cost of it
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question is can
Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
So it is stupid, like I said
There is a reason no one else is that stupid
On 11/8/2026 9:59 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 09:24:06 +1000, Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au>
wrote:
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:Yep, insanely expensive
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote: >>>>
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway- >>>>>>> pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large
potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in Victoria's >>>>>>> east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound >>>>>>> delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne it >>>>>>> was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with >>>>>>> damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal >>>>>>> or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through >>>>>>> there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still >>>>> ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Insanely expensive but that's because of the *delay*. Those crossings
were causing huge issues when I first moved to Melbourne in 1980. That
was the optimum time, traffic would have had way less disruption and
they could have been dealt with a few at a time, worst ones first. In
fact they did start with one of the worst ones - the Box Hill/Station Street Xing. That was completed in 1985 and made a huge difference to anyone using Station Street or the Box Hill shopping centre in general.
The problem was created by the fact that the line from Camberwell to Ringwood was extremely busy with many trains per hour at peak times
which, I might add, coincided with peak times for road traffic.
Box Hill was already completed by the time I moved out that way in 1986
but it showed what could be done and the improvement to amenity such developments would make. I used to use the Rooks Road railway crossing
in preference to either Springvale Road or Mitcham road crossings since
it was halfway between stations and delays were brief. Not so with Nunawading and Mitcham stations being so close to the major road
crossings - long delays with multiple trains keeping the crossings
closed for extended periods. Fond memories - not!>
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every electorate >>> in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of
them
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was "yesterday".
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has the >>> most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion.Pity about the insane cost of that
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was "yesterday".
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last week,
difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but the I
found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the most
expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the East West
link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in
Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound >>>>>>>>> delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne >>>>>>>>> it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with >>>>>>>>> damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal >>>>>>>>> or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through >>>>>>>>> there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with Dan >>>>>>> Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of >>>> them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the same
time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other projects, in
other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same time >>> than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of time.
Makes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has >>>>> the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic
congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial
vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home due >>> to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between her
workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting rid of
that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the track.
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts,
possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate issue to
whether or not a project has merit.
That project has no merit given the insane cost of it
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question is
can Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
So it is stupid, like I said
There is a reason no one else is that stupid
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in
Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC
Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway?
Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going
through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan >>>>>>>> Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many >>>>> of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the same
time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other projects,
in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same
time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of
time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has >>>>>> the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic
congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial
vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home
due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between
her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting rid
of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 13:09:28 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 9:59 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 09:24:06 +1000, Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au>
wrote:
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:-aYep, insanely expensive
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote: >>>>>
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway- >>>>>>>> pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large
potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in
Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound >>>>>>>> delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne >>>>>>>> it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with >>>>>>>> damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal >>>>>>>> or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through >>>>>>>> there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan >>>>>> Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up politically >>>
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings (still >>>>>> ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Insanely expensive but that's because of the *delay*. Those crossings
were causing huge issues when I first moved to Melbourne in 1980. That
was the optimum time, traffic would have had way less disruption and
they could have been dealt with a few at a time, worst ones first. In
fact they did start with one of the worst ones - the Box Hill/Station
Street Xing. That was completed in 1985 and made a huge difference to
anyone using Station Street or the Box Hill shopping centre in general.
The problem was created by the fact that the line from Camberwell to
Ringwood was extremely busy with many trains per hour at peak times
which, I might add, coincided with peak times for road traffic.
Box Hill was already completed by the time I moved out that way in
1986 but it showed what could be done and the improvement to amenity
such developments would make. I used to use the Rooks Road railway
crossing in preference to either Springvale Road or Mitcham road
crossings since it was halfway between stations and delays were brief.
Not so with Nunawading and Mitcham stations being so close to the
major road crossings - long delays with multiple trains keeping the
crossings closed for extended periods. Fond memories - not!>
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of
them
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was "yesterday".
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
--IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has
the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic congestion. >>> -aPity about the insane cost of that
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was "yesterday".
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last week,
difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but the I
found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the most
expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the East
West link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC
Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under >>>>>>>>>>> the majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with >>>>>>>>> Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many >>>>>> of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the same >>>>> time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other projects, >>>>> in other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same
time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of >>>>> time.
Makes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has >>>>>>> the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic
congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial >>>>> vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
Delays of up to 20mins would not be unusual,
do you think that that is acceptable?
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel 3km in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing, do you
think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak times near
the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone since the level crossing was removed so well worth the money in saved time.
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project is between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when compared to other big build projects it looks like good value.
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home >>>>> due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between
her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting rid >>>>> of that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the
track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels crossings,
what is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network way back when
it was first done,
most other places separated to two transport modes
so they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
On 11/8/2026 3:14 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 13:09:28 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:
On 11/8/2026 9:59 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 09:24:06 +1000, Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> >>>> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:Yep, insanely expensive
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com>
wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
From ABC:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes-freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in
Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne-bound >>>>>>>>> delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC Melbourne >>>>>>>>> it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over with >>>>>>>>> damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? Federal >>>>>>>>> or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going through >>>>>>>>> there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with Dan >>>>>>> Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Insanely expensive but that's because of the *delay*. Those crossings
were causing huge issues when I first moved to Melbourne in 1980. That >>> was the optimum time, traffic would have had way less disruption and
they could have been dealt with a few at a time, worst ones first. In
fact they did start with one of the worst ones - the Box Hill/Station
Street Xing. That was completed in 1985 and made a huge difference to
anyone using Station Street or the Box Hill shopping centre in general.
The problem was created by the fact that the line from Camberwell to
Ringwood was extremely busy with many trains per hour at peak times
which, I might add, coincided with peak times for road traffic.
Box Hill was already completed by the time I moved out that way in
1986 but it showed what could be done and the improvement to amenity
such developments would make. I used to use the Rooks Road railway
crossing in preference to either Springvale Road or Mitcham road
crossings since it was halfway between stations and delays were brief. >>> Not so with Nunawading and Mitcham stations being so close to the
major road crossings - long delays with multiple trains keeping the
crossings closed for extended periods. Fond memories - not!>
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many of >>>> them
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was
"yesterday".
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
You should tell that to the Thais.
Bangkok is being ringed by elevated roadways and railways, not to forget subways, to reduce or remove the accident risk.
If you had ever been to Thailand, you would know the risks that have
been entirely removed - like this;
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/may/16/thailand-bangkok-rail-crossing-collision-freight-train-bus
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has >>>>> the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic
congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was
"yesterday".
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last week, >>>>> difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but the I >>>>> found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the most >>>>> expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the East
West link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in
Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC
Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway?
Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going
through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan >>>>>>>> Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many >>>>> of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the same
time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other projects,
in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same
time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of
time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has >>>>>> the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic
congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial
vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home
due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between
her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting rid
of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
--The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts,
possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate issue
to whether or not a project has merit.
-aThat project has no merit given the insane cost of it
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question is
can Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
-aSo it is stupid, like I said
-aThere is a reason no one else is that stupid
On 11/8/2026 3:22 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC
Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with >>>>>>>>> Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many >>>>>> of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the
same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other
projects, in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same
time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of >>>>> time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that
has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic >>>>>>> congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial >>>>> vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
Delays of up to 20mins would not be unusual, do you think that that is acceptable?
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel 3km in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing, do you
think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak times near
the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone since the level crossing was removed so well worth the money in saved time.
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project is between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when compared to
other big build projects it looks like good value.
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home
due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between
her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting
rid of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the
track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels crossings, what is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network
way back when it was first done, most other places separated to two transport modes so they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
Daryl--
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under >>>>>>>>>>>> the-a-a majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started >>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so
many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the
same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other
projects, in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same >>>>>> time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period
of time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic >>>>>>>> congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including
commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
-aBullshit
Delays of up to 20mins would not be unusual,
Bullshit
do you think that that is-a-a acceptable?
Given the cost of doing anything about that particular crossing, yet
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel 3km
in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing, do
you think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?
I don't believe that number
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
Bullshit
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD
and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak times
near the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone since the
level crossing was removed so well worth the money in saved time.
Bullshit
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project is
between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when compared to
other big build projects it looks like good value.
Bullshit it does. That's an insane amount of money to spend on that
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
-aStill not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home >>>>>> due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between >>>>>> her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting
rid of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the
track.
-aIt makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels
crossings,
Bullshit it is
what is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network way back
when it was first done,
Bullshit, it worked fine and still does
most other places separated to two-a-a transport modes
More bullshit
so they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
They weren't stupid enough to do anything like that
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 16:22:53 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 3:14 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 13:09:28 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:
On 11/8/2026 9:59 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 09:24:06 +1000, Daryl
<dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:-aYep, insanely expensive
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> >>>>>>> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in
Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC
Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result. >>>>>>>>>>
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway?
Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under the >>>>>>>>>> majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going
through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started with Dan >>>>>>>> Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Insanely expensive but that's because of the *delay*. Those
crossings were causing huge issues when I first moved to Melbourne
in 1980. That was the optimum time, traffic would have had way less
disruption and they could have been dealt with a few at a time,
worst ones first. In fact they did start with one of the worst ones
- the Box Hill/Station Street Xing. That was completed in 1985 and
made a huge difference to anyone using Station Street or the Box
Hill shopping centre in general.
The problem was created by the fact that the line from Camberwell to
Ringwood was extremely busy with many trains per hour at peak times
which, I might add, coincided with peak times for road traffic.
Box Hill was already completed by the time I moved out that way in
1986 but it showed what could be done and the improvement to amenity
such developments would make. I used to use the Rooks Road railway
crossing in preference to either Springvale Road or Mitcham road
crossings since it was halfway between stations and delays were
brief. Not so with Nunawading and Mitcham stations being so close to
the major road crossings - long delays with multiple trains keeping
the crossings closed for extended periods. Fond memories - not!>
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many >>>>> of them
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was
"yesterday".
-aIt makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
You should tell that to the Thais.
They are not doing anything like that with RAILWAY CROSSINGS
Bangkok is being ringed by elevated roadways and railways, not to
forget subways, to reduce or remove the accident risk.
Nope, to do something about the utterly insane traffic jams
Something Melburg never ever has
If you had ever been to Thailand, you would know the risks that have
been entirely removed - like this;
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/may/16/thailand-bangkok-rail-
crossing-collision-freight-train-bus
We aren't actually stupid enough to spend anything
like what Melburg has done to avoid something like that
--IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has >>>>>> the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic
congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was
"yesterday".
-aIt makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last
week, difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but >>>>>> the I found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the
suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the
most expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the
East West link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC
Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under >>>>>>>>>>> the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with >>>>>>>>> Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many >>>>>> of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the same >>>>> time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other projects, >>>>> in other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same
time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of >>>>> time.
Makes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has >>>>>>> the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic
congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial >>>>> vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
I have waited up to 20 minutes at Box Hill.
That was why they did that one back as far as 1983-5.
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
Grade crossing removal has been going on for 40 years and more.
Obviously it has been giving quite a few people the shits for quite a
long time.
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home >>>>> due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between
her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting rid >>>>> of that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the
track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Sydney does not have nearly as many level crossings as Melbourne.
Melbourne had roughly 180 level crossings on its suburban network,
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
What's more, Sydney systematically eliminated nearly all of its level crossings decades ago.
originally planned and built with dedicated, elevated, or underground rights of way.
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the railways?
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much easier and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the rail network.
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the last
examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying the much higher cost of grade separation.
Thus far 87 grade crossings have been removed on the suburban rail
network, only another ~110 to go.
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
Grade crossings on these will not cause the level of frustration that Melbourne's grade crossings have.
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts,
possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate issue >>>>> to whether or not a project has merit.
That project has no merit given the insane cost of it
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question is >>>>> can Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
So it is stupid, like I said
There is a reason no one else is that stupid
On 11/8/2026 4:43 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 16:22:53 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:
On 11/8/2026 3:14 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 13:09:28 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:
On 11/8/2026 9:59 am, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 09:24:06 +1000, Daryl
<dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 8:08 am, Rod Speed wrote:Yep, insanely expensive
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 06:59:41 +1000, Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> >>>>>>>> wrote:
On Mon, 10 Aug 2026 19:38:42 +1000, Keithr0
<nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote:
On 10/08/2026 11:20 am, lindsay wrote:
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before Hope >>>>>>>>>>> Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC
Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result. >>>>>>>>>>>
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under >>>>>>>>>>> the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with >>>>>>>>> Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up
politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Insanely expensive but that's because of the *delay*. Those
crossings were causing huge issues when I first moved to Melbourne >>>>> in 1980. That was the optimum time, traffic would have had way less >>>>> disruption and they could have been dealt with a few at a time,
worst ones first. In fact they did start with one of the worst ones >>>>> - the Box Hill/Station Street Xing. That was completed in 1985 and >>>>> made a huge difference to anyone using Station Street or the Box
Hill shopping centre in general.
The problem was created by the fact that the line from Camberwell to >>>>> Ringwood was extremely busy with many trains per hour at peak times >>>>> which, I might add, coincided with peak times for road traffic.
Box Hill was already completed by the time I moved out that way in >>>>> 1986 but it showed what could be done and the improvement to amenity >>>>> such developments would make. I used to use the Rooks Road railway >>>>> crossing in preference to either Springvale Road or Mitcham road
crossings since it was halfway between stations and delays were
brief. Not so with Nunawading and Mitcham stations being so close to >>>>> the major road crossings - long delays with multiple trains keeping >>>>> the crossings closed for extended periods. Fond memories - not!>
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many >>>>>> of them
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was
"yesterday".
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
You should tell that to the Thais.
They are not doing anything like that with RAILWAY CROSSINGS
No, they are instead closing those rail lines down and moving them out
of town.
The new Metro lines are above or undeground. So, doing it but
differently. End result, grade crossings will eventually be gone.
Bangkok is being ringed by elevated roadways and railways, not to
forget subways, to reduce or remove the accident risk.
Nope, to do something about the utterly insane traffic jams
Something Melburg never ever has
Been to Melburg lately?
If you had ever been to Thailand, you would know the risks that have
been entirely removed - like this;
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2026/may/16/thailand-bangkok-rail-
crossing-collision-freight-train-bus
We aren't actually stupid enough to spend anything
like what Melburg has done to avoid something like that
It was done decades ago.
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that has >>>>>>> the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic
congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
It only gets more expensive over time. The optimum time was
"yesterday".
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
I also used the new Metro rail tunnel for the first time last
week, difficult to say if its worth the money (very likely is) but >>>>>>> the I found that the project itself was impressive.
The Westgate tunnel is a very expensive white elephant as is the >>>>>>> suburban rail loop as is the North East link which AFAIK is the >>>>>>> most expensive project of all, at approx 5 times the cost of the >>>>>>> East West link that Andrews cancelled at great cost.
On 11/8/2026 4:38 pm, Rod Speed wrote:You wouldn't know what real hell was if it bit you on your lard arse
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wroteI lived in one of the worst affected areas and I can tell you it was > hell back then.
Rod Speed wroteBullshit
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under >>>>>>>>>>>>> the majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started >>>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.>> >>>>>>>>>> That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every >>>>>>>>> electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so >>>>>>>> many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the >>>>>>> same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other >>>>>>> projects, in other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same >>>>>>> time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period >>>>>>> of time.
Makes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic >>>>>>>>> congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including >>>>>>> commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?>>Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
Delays of up to 20mins would not be unusual,
do you think that that is acceptable?Given the cost of doing anything about that particular crossing, yet>>
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel 3km >>> in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing, do >>> you think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?I don't believe that number
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.Bullshit
A visit prior to Covid, 2019 to be precise, showed me that it had become > immeasurably worse vehicular traffic wise.Bullshit
And that was after the worst level crossings were removed - Heatherdale > Rd, Mitcham Rd, Rooks Rd, Springvale Rd, Blackburn Rd, Middleborough Rd. > These were the ones I used, all gone now, and traffic has built up > beyond all recognition.Bullshit
If the grade crossings were still there, it would be total chaos.Bullshit
I'm told by people who still live in the area that it's like peak hour > all day long and at weekends as well.Complete and utter bullshit
And I thought it couldn't get any worse.Been doing that since before you were even born thanks
Ah, you aren't used to dealing with such numbers.In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD >>> and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak times >>> near the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone since the >>> level crossing was removed so well worth the money in saved time.Bullshit
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project is >>> between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when compared to >>> other big build projects it looks like good value.Bullshit it does. That's an insane amount of money to spend on that
We'll see...According to AI, you're wrongBullshit it isThe line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its >>>>> maximum in both directions at peak times.Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she >>>>>>> finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home >>>>>>> due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between >>>>>>> her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting >>>>>>> rid of that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the >>>>> track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels >>> crossings,
AI OverviewOz isn't the WORLD, fool
Melbourne has historically had an unusually high number of at-grade rail > level crossings for a major developed cityrCOs urban rail system, with > roughly 178 to 180 crossings prior to recent major state-funded > elimination works. It holds the most by a wide margin in Australia, > prompting the massive multi-billion-dollar Level Crossing Removal > Project to eliminate 110 of them.
Bullshit on the lastThe rail network works fine, the road network, not so much.what is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network way back >>> when it was first done,Bullshit, it worked fine and still does
Remember, road traffic gives way to trains.Irrelevant to your stupid claim
YepBeen to Sydney lately?most other places separated to two transport modesMore bullshit
Care to count the grade level crossings?Pity about the number of traffic lights
Never happenedWell, the evidence points to them doing itso they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.They weren't stupid enough to do anything like that
and Melbourne waiting until critical mass was reached.There never was any critical mass, just terminal labor stupidity
On 11/8/2026 4:21 pm, Daryl wrote:
On 11/8/2026 3:22 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteDelays of up to 20mins would not be unusual, do you think that that is
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under >>>>>>>>>>>> the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started with >>>>>>>>>> Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so many >>>>>>> of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the
same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other
projects, in other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same >>>>>> time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period of >>>>>> time.
Makes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic >>>>>>>> congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including commercial >>>>>> vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
acceptable?
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel 3km
in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing, do you
think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD
and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak times
near the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone since the
level crossing was removed so well worth the money in saved time.
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project is
between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when compared to
other big build projects it looks like good value.
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she >>>>>> finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home >>>>>> due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between >>>>>> her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting >>>>>> rid of that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the
track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
crossings, what is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network
way back when it was first done, most other places separated to two
transport modes so they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
Melbourne was flat, road transport was scarce and slow.
You wanted fast travel back then, you traveled by train.
Melbourne save on building costs back then,
they pay for it now because they waited so long to do necessary upgrades.
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under >>>>>>>>>>>> the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started >>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every
electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so
many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the
same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other
projects, in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same >>>>>> time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period
of time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic >>>>>>>> congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including
commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
-aBullshit
I have waited up to 20 minutes at Box Hill.
That's not a very long time and doesn't happen that often
and even if it did, still no reason to be spending anything
even remotely like billions to avoid that happening
That was why they did that-a-a one back as far as 1983-5.
Doesn't change the fact that it makes no sense to be
spending anything like billions to fix that, let alone
all the other level crossings in Melburg
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its
maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
Grade crossing removal has been going on for 40 years and more.
Yes, that stupidity has been going on for that long there
Obviously it has been giving quite a few people the shits for quite a
long time.
Its actually the stupidity of what victorian govts get up to
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she
finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home >>>>>> due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between >>>>>> her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting
rid of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the
track.
That's inflation, stupid, not a good reason to do it earlier
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Sydney does not have nearly as many level crossings as Melbourne.
Pity about the other state capitals
Melbourne had roughly 180 level crossings on its suburban network,
Yes
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
Bullshit
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's hilly
terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and rail using
cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
That mangles the real story too
What's more, Sydney systematically eliminated nearly all of its level
crossings decades ago.
Bullshit
In fact, most of Sydney's suburban rail network was
originally planned and built with dedicated, elevated, or underground
rights of way.
Bullshit
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the railways?
There was no need to
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much easier
and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the rail network.
More bulllshit
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the last
examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
Bullshit
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying the
much higher cost of grade separation.
Bullshit
Thus far 87 grade crossings have been removed on the suburban rail
network, only another ~110 to go.
Because Labor is that stupid
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
Bullshit
--Grade crossings on these will not cause the level of frustration that
Melbourne's grade crossings have.
Bullshit
The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts,
possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate issue >>>>>> to whether or not a project has merit.
-aThat project has no merit given the insane cost of it
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question
is can Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
-aSo it is stupid, like I said
-aThere is a reason no one else is that stupid
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 17:08:28 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 4:38 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote-aBullshit
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of
Melbourne- bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered >>>>>>>>>>>>>> under the-a-a majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started >>>>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway
crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every >>>>>>>>>> electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so >>>>>>>>> many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the >>>>>>>> same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other >>>>>>>> projects, in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the
same time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger >>>>>>>> period of time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe
traffic congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including
commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
-aBullshit
Delays of up to 20mins would not be unusual,
do you think that that is-a-a acceptable?-aGiven the cost of doing anything about that particular crossing, yet
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel-aI don't believe that number
3km in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing,
do you think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
-aBullshit
I lived in one of the worst affected areas and I can tell you it was
hell back then.
You wouldn't know what real hell was if it bit you on your lard arse
A visit prior to Covid, 2019 to be precise, showed me that it had
become immeasurably worse vehicular traffic wise.
Bullshit
And that was after the worst level crossings were removed -
Heatherdale Rd, Mitcham Rd, Rooks Rd, Springvale Rd, Blackburn Rd,
Middleborough Rd. These were the ones I used, all gone now, and
traffic has built up beyond all recognition.
Bullshit
If the grade crossings were still there, it-a-a would be total chaos.
Bullshit
I'm told by people who still live in the area that it's like peak hour
all day long and at weekends as well.
Complete and utter bullshit
And I thought-a-a it couldn't get any worse.
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD-aBullshit
and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak
times near the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone
since the level crossing was removed so well worth the money in
saved time.
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project
is between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when
compared to other big build projects it looks like good value.
-aBullshit it does. That's an insane amount of money to spend on that
Ah, you aren't used to dealing with such numbers.
Been doing that since before you were even born thanks
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at
its maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she >>>>>>>> finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get >>>>>>>> home due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing >>>>>>>> between her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth >>>>>>>> getting rid of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the >>>>>> track.
-aIt makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels
crossings,
-aBullshit it is
According to AI, you're wrong
We'll see...
AI Overview
Melbourne has historically had an unusually high number of at-grade
rail level crossings for a major developed cityrCOs urban rail system,
with roughly 178 to 180 crossings prior to recent major state-funded
elimination works. It holds the most by a wide margin in Australia,
prompting the massive multi-billion-dollar Level Crossing Removal
Project to eliminate 110 of them.
Oz isn't the WORLD, fool
what is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network way back
when it was first done,
-aBullshit, it worked fine and still does
The rail network works fine, the road network, not so much.
Bullshit on the last
Remember,-a-a road traffic gives way to trains.
Irrelevant to your stupid claim
most other places separated to two transport modes
-aMore bullshit
Been to Sydney lately?
Yep
Care to count the grade level crossings?
Pity about the number of traffic lights
--so they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
-aThey weren't stupid enough to do anything like that
Well, the evidence points to them doing it
Never happened
and Melbourne waiting until critical mass was reached.
There never was any critical mass, just terminal labor stupidity
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 16:51:11 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 4:21 pm, Daryl wrote:
On 11/8/2026 3:22 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote-aDelays of up to 20mins would not be unusual, do you think that that
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to >>>>>>>>>>>>> large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered >>>>>>>>>>>>> under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started >>>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway
crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every >>>>>>>>> electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so >>>>>>>> many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the >>>>>>> same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other
projects, in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same >>>>>>> time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period >>>>>>> of time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic >>>>>>>>> congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including
commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
is acceptable?
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel 3km
in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing, do
you think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD
and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak times
near the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone since the
level crossing was removed so well worth the money in saved time.
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project
is between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when
compared to other big build projects it looks like good value.
-aMelbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its >>>>> maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she >>>>>>> finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get
home due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing
between her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth >>>>>>> getting rid of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the
track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
crossings, what is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network
way back when it was first done, most other places separated to two
transport modes so they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
Melbourne was flat, road transport was scarce and slow.
Bullshit on that last
You wanted fast-a-a travel back then, you traveled by train.
More of your mindless bullshit
Melbourne save on building-a-a costs back then,
No one else was stupid enough to separate road and rail
they pay for it now because they waited so long to do necessary upgrades.
You lot pay for that now because you were stupid enough vote labor
On 11/8/2026 6:48 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wroteThat's not a very long time and doesn't happen that often
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to large >>>>>>>>>>>>> potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result.
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered under >>>>>>>>>>>>> the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started >>>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway crossings >>>>>>>>>>> (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every >>>>>>>>> electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so >>>>>>>> many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the >>>>>>> same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other
projects, in other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same >>>>>>> time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period >>>>>>> of time.
Makes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic >>>>>>>>> congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including
commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
I have waited up to 20 minutes at Box Hill.
It is a very long time stuck in traffic that isn't even incing forward.
and even if it did, still no reason to be spending anything
even remotely like billions to avoid that happening
That was why they did that one back as far as 1983-5.Doesn't change the fact that it makes no sense to be
spending anything like billions to fix that, let alone
all the other level crossings in Melburg
Yes, that stupidity has been going on for that long thereThe line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its >>>>> maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
Grade crossing removal has been going on for 40 years and more.
Obviously it has been giving quite a few people the shits for quite aIts actually the stupidity of what victorian govts get up to
long time.
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she >>>>>>> finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get home >>>>>>> due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing between >>>>>>> her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth getting >>>>>>> rid of that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the >>>>> track.
That's inflation, stupid, not a good reason to do it earlier
You do it before the need becomes pressing, not after.
Pity about the other state capitalsIt makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Sydney does not have nearly as many level crossings as Melbourne.
Melbourne had roughly 180 level crossings on its suburban network,Yes
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
Bullshit
Please argue that point with the NSW government.
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's hilly
terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and rail using
cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
That mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade
crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
Nothing mangled about it.
What's more, Sydney systematically eliminated nearly all of its levelBullshit
crossings decades ago.
In fact, most of Sydney's suburban rail network was
originally planned and built with dedicated, elevated, or underground
rights of way.
Bullshit
Again, argue that point with the NSW government.
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the railways?
There was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in certain locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common, problems
existed at *every grade crossing*.
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much easier
and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the rail network.
More bulllshit
There weren't many cars back then, especially pre 1950.
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the last
examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
Bullshit
Melbourne phased out its last hand operated, manual gate railway level crossings with gatekeepers such as those at Jewell station on Union
Street in the late 1990s, when they were replaced with automated boom gates. That was one I seemed always getting caught at. That and the one
on the same line at Brunswick Rd a little further down. Those streets
were my rat run through that part of town.
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying the
much higher cost of grade separation.
Bullshit
The very last manually operated swing gates at New Street in Brighton
were closed permanently circa 2010.
Thus far 87 grade crossings have been removed on the suburban railBecause Labor is that stupid
network, only another ~110 to go.
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
Bullshit
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2Grade crossings on these will not cause the level of frustration that
Melbourne's grade crossings have.
Bullshit
The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts, >>>>>>> possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate issue >>>>>>> to whether or not a project has merit.
That project has no merit given the insane cost of it
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question >>>>>>> is can Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
So it is stupid, like I said
There is a reason no one else is that stupid
On 11/8/2026 7:18 pm, Rod Speed wrote:Just because you have hangups...
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 17:08:28 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> >> wrote:Well, my experience along Middleborough Rd in 2019 certainly felt like > it. I was driving along it around 6pm on a Saturday and it felt like > peak hour during the weekday.
You wouldn't know what real hell was if it bit you on your lard arse>>
On 11/8/2026 4:38 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wroteBullshit
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne- bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result. >>>>
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> under the majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started >>>>>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors >>>>>>>>>>>>> Kennett.
More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway >>>>>>>>>>>>> crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every >>>>>>>>>>> electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so >>>>>>>>>> many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the >>>>>>>>> same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other >>>>>>>>> projects, in other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the >>>>>>>>> same time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger >>>>>>>>> period of time.
Makes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe >>>>>>>>>>> traffic congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including >>>>>>>>> commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
Delays of up to 20mins would not be unusual,
do you think that that is acceptable?Given the cost of doing anything about that particular crossing, yet
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel >>>>> 3km in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing, >>>>> do you think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?I don't believe that number
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
Bullshit
I lived in one of the worst affected areas and I can tell you it was >>> hell back then.
A visit prior to Covid, 2019 to be precise, showed me that it had >>> become immeasurably worse vehicular traffic wise.Bullshit
And that was after the worst level crossings were removed - >>> Heatherdale Rd, Mitcham Rd, Rooks Rd, Springvale Rd, Blackburn Rd, >>> Middleborough Rd. These were the ones I used, all gone now, and >>> traffic has built up beyond all recognition.Bullshit
If the grade crossings were still there, it would be total chaos.Bullshit
I'm told by people who still live in the area that it's like peak hour >>> all day long and at weekends as well.Complete and utter bullshit
YOU made that stupid comment about the worldI didn't realise we were including the rest of the world. Hint, the > focus is on Melbourne.And I thought it couldn't get any worse.Been doing that since before you were even born thanks
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD >>>>> and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak >>>>> times near the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone >>>>> since the level crossing was removed so well worth the money in >>>>> saved time.Bullshit
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project >>>>> is between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when >>>>> compared to other big build projects it looks like good value.
Bullshit it does. That's an insane amount of money to spend on that
Ah, you aren't used to dealing with such numbers.
We'll see...The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at >>>>>>> its maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she >>>>>>>>> finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get >>>>>>>>> home due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing >>>>>>>>> between her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth >>>>>>>>> getting rid of that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the >>>>>>> track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid>>>>>> cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels >>>>> crossings,
Bullshit it is
According to AI, you're wrong
AI OverviewOz isn't the WORLD, fool
Melbourne has historically had an unusually high number of at-grade >>> rail level crossings for a major developed cityrCOs urban rail system, >>> with roughly 178 to 180 crossings prior to recent major state-funded >>> elimination works. It holds the most by a wide margin in Australia, >>> prompting the massive multi-billion-dollar Level Crossing Removal >>> Project to eliminate 110 of them.
The train frequency did not increase significantly at peak timesNot at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train frequency is > increased, the road network feels it at grade crossings.Bullshit on the lastwhat is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network way back >>>>> when it was first done,
Bullshit, it worked fine and still does
The rail network works fine, the road network, not so much.
Remember, road traffic gives way to trains.Irrelevant to your stupid claim
They are much more important than level grossingsNot talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade crossings.Yepmost other places separated to two transport modes
More bullshit
Been to Sydney lately?
Care to count the grade level crossings?Pity about the number of traffic lights
Try to keep on point.Get stuffed, again
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2Never happenedso they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
They weren't stupid enough to do anything like that
Well, the evidence points to them doing it
and Melbourne waiting until critical mass was reached.There never was any critical mass, just terminal labor stupidity
On 11/8/2026 7:23 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 16:51:11 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:
Bullshit on that last
On 11/8/2026 4:21 pm, Daryl wrote:
On 11/8/2026 3:22 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteDelays of up to 20mins would not be unusual, do you think that that >>>> is acceptable?
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
From ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of Melbourne- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result. >>>>>
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered >>>>>>>>>>>>>> under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing. The rot started >>>>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
Bullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett. >>>>>More mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway >>>>>>>>>>>> crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
That stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
Yep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every >>>>>>>>>> electorate in greater Melb.
And it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so >>>>>>>>> many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the >>>>>>>> same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other >>>>>>>> projects, in other words it would be affordable.
Any govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the same >>>>>>>> time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger period >>>>>>>> of time.
Makes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe traffic >>>>>>>>>> congestion.
Pity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including
commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
Its never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
Bullshit
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel 3km >>>> in peak period including negotiating a congested level crossing, do
you think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to travel 3km?
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the CBD >>>> and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at peak times >>>> near the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly gone since the >>>> level crossing was removed so well worth the money in saved time.
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal project
is between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but when
compared to other big build projects it looks like good value.
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many levels >>>> crossings, what is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network >>>> way back when it was first done, most other places separated to two
The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at its >>>>>> maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she >>>>>>>> finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get >>>>>>>> home due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing >>>>>>>> between her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth >>>>>>>> getting rid of that traffic congestion?
Not when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the >>>>>> track.
It makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
transport modes so they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
Melbourne was flat, road transport was scarce and slow.
You wanted fast travel back then, you traveled by train.More of your mindless bullshit
Melbourne save on building costs back then,No one else was stupid enough to separate road and rail
they pay for it now because they waited so long to do necessaryYou lot pay for that now because you were stupid enough vote labor
upgrades.
I'm not paying for it. I have been a NSW resident for 14 years now.
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 20:09:39 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 7:18 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 17:08:28 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au>
wrote:
-aYou wouldn't know what real hell was if it bit you on your lard arse
On 11/8/2026 4:38 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote-aBullshit
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> princes- freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne- bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> before Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result. >>>>>
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> under the-a-a majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started >>>>>>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kennett.
-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway >>>>>>>>>>>>>> crossings (still-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before. >>>>>
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every >>>>>>>>>>>> electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so >>>>>>>>>>> many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at >>>>>>>>>> the same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on >>>>>>>>>> other projects, in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and >>>>>>>>> whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the >>>>>>>>>> same time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger >>>>>>>>>> period of time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project >>>>>>>>>>>> that has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe >>>>>>>>>>>> traffic congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time? >>>>>
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
-aBullshit
Delays of up to 20mins would not be unusual,
do you think that that is-a-a acceptable?-aGiven the cost of doing anything about that particular crossing, yet >>>>>
I gave an example of how long it took a former employee to travel >>>>>> 3km in peak period including negotiating a congested level-aI don't believe that number
crossing, do you think that its acceptable to take 30-40mins to
travel 3km?
That was more than 6yrs ago, its gotten ever worse since then.
-aBullshit
I lived in one of the worst affected areas and I can tell you it was
hell back then.
A visit prior to Covid, 2019 to be precise, showed me that it had-aBullshit
become immeasurably worse vehicular traffic wise.
And that was after the worst level crossings were removed --aBullshit
Heatherdale Rd, Mitcham Rd, Rooks Rd, Springvale Rd, Blackburn Rd,
Middleborough Rd. These were the ones I used, all gone now, and
traffic has built up beyond all recognition.
If the grade crossings were still there, it-a-a would be total chaos.-aBullshit
I'm told by people who still live in the area that it's like peak
hour all day long and at weekends as well.
-aComplete and utter bullshit
Well, my experience along Middleborough Rd in 2019 certainly felt like
it. I was driving along it around 6pm on a Saturday and it felt like
peak hour during the weekday.
Just because you have hangups...
And I thought-a-a it couldn't get any worse.-aBeen doing that since before you were even born thanks
In the late 1970's I lived in Murrumbeena, my wife worked in the-aBullshit
CBD and traveled there by train, even back then the traffic at
peak times near the station was chaos, that chaos has now mostly
gone since the level crossing was removed so well worth the money >>>>>> in saved time.
According to Google the cost so far of the crossing removal
project is between 15 and 18 billion, certainly a big number but
when compared to other big build projects it looks like good value.
-aBullshit it does. That's an insane amount of money to spend on that
Ah, you aren't used to dealing with such numbers.
-aWe'll see...The line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at >>>>>>>> its maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when >>>>>>>>>> she finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to >>>>>>>>>> get home due to crazy peak period congestion at the level >>>>>>>>>> crossing between her workplace and home, do you think that it >>>>>>>>>> isn't worth getting rid of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down >>>>>>>> the track.
-aIt makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid >>>>>>> cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Melbourne is one of the few places in the world with so many
levels crossings,
-aBullshit it is
According to AI, you're wrong
AI Overview
Melbourne has historically had an unusually high number of at-grade
rail level crossings for a major developed cityrCOs urban rail system, >>>> with roughly 178 to 180 crossings prior to recent major state-funded
elimination works. It holds the most by a wide margin in Australia,
prompting the massive multi-billion-dollar Level Crossing Removal
Project to eliminate 110 of them.
-aOz isn't the WORLD, fool
I didn't realise we were including the rest of the world. Hint, the
focus is on Melbourne.
YOU made that stupid comment about the world
-aBullshit on the lastwhat is stupid is the poor design of the road/rail network way
back when it was first done,
-aBullshit, it worked fine and still does
The rail network works fine, the road network, not so much.
Remember,-a-a road traffic gives way to trains.
-aIrrelevant to your stupid claim
Not at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train frequency is
increased, the road network feels it at grade crossings.
The train frequency did not increase significantly at peak times
That's the problem with trains, that can't be done
-aYepmost other places separated to two transport modes
-aMore bullshit
Been to Sydney lately?
Care to count the grade level crossings?
-aPity about the number of traffic lights
Not talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade crossings.
They are much more important than level grossings
to traffic flow because there are FAR more of them
Try to keep on point.
Get stuffed, again
---aNever happenedso they didn't need to fix it later at great cost.
-aThey weren't stupid enough to do anything like that
Well, the evidence points to them doing it
and Melbourne waiting until critical mass was reached.-aThere never was any critical mass, just terminal labor stupidity
On Tue, 11 Aug 2026 20:02:44 +1000, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
On 11/8/2026 6:48 pm, Rod Speed wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote-aThat's not a very long time and doesn't happen that often
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Daryl <dwalford@westpine.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Keithr0 <nothing.to.see@here.com.au> wrote
lindsay wrote
-aFrom ABC: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2026-08-10/princes- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> freeway-
pothole-damage-bunyip-drivers-damaged-cars/107016002
Up to 30 vehicles have been forced off the road due to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> large potholes
that have opened along the Princes Freeway at Bunyip in >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Victoria's east.
The Victorian transport department has warned of
Melbourne- bound delays
on the freeway as a result of the road damage just before >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hope Street.
Garry, who was driving through the area, has told ABC >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Melbourne it was
carnage, with more than two dozen cars damaged as a result. >>>>>
"For about 15 kilometres thereafter, cars were pulled over >>>>>>>>>>>>>> with damaged
rims," he said.
Who's responsibility is it for maintenance of a Freeway? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Federal or State?
And is this sort of damage (tyres and or rims) covered >>>>>>>>>>>>>> under the
majority of comprehensive insurance?
I wonder how long it'll take to get repaired? I'm going >>>>>>>>>>>>>> through there on
Thursday... Waze will go off it's nut!
It even made the news up here in QLD.
To where many Vic industries are fleeing.-a The rot started >>>>>>>>>>>> with Dan
Andrews
-aBullshit, plenty were doing that long before he showed up >>>>>>>>>>> politically
who was criminally insane, much like his predecessors Kennett. >>>>>-aMore mindless bullshit on both counts
The former spent $quillions in covering over railway
crossings (still
ongoing) in an example of pork barelling rarely seen before.
-aThat stupidity has nothing to do with pork barelling
Removing rail crossing is stupidity?
-aYep, insanely expensive
Agree its not pork barrelling since its being done in every >>>>>>>>>> electorate in greater Melb.
-aAnd it is completely stupid to do anything like that with so >>>>>>>>> many of them
Yes and no, it would be okay to spend that much money if at the >>>>>>>> same time they weren't also spending massive amounts on other >>>>>>>> projects, in other words it would be affordable.
-aAny govt expenditure of that sort of money has to decide
if that is the best thing to spend that sort of money on and
whether spending that sort of money warrants new taxs
like the land tax and that project doesn't on either count
Its actually cheaper to do multiple crossing removals at the
same time than to randomly do them one at a time over a larger >>>>>>>> period of time.
-aMakes a lot more sense to not do that sort of thing at all
IMHO removal of level crossing is the "big build" project that >>>>>>>>>> has the most merit, it removes many instances of severe
traffic congestion.
-aPity about the insane cost of that
How much does it cost to have lots of vehicles including
commercial vehicles sitting idle in long queues for a long time?
-aIts never a long time and you get that at any traffic lights
In an urban environment it can be a very long time.
-aBullshit
I have waited up to 20 minutes at Box Hill.
It is a very long time stuck in traffic that isn't even incing forward.
and even if it did, still no reason to be spending anything
even remotely like billions to avoid that happening
That was why they did that-a-a one back as far as 1983-5.-aDoesn't change the fact that it makes no sense to be
spending anything like billions to fix that, let alone
all the other level crossings in Melburg
-aYes, that stupidity has been going on for that long thereThe line I lived on was double tracked and train density was at
its maximum in both directions at peak times.
Still not a very long time and it makes no sense
to be doing all railway crossings even if one or
two are like that one you lived on
Grade crossing removal has been going on for 40 years and more.
Obviously it has been giving quite a few people the shits for quite-aIts actually the stupidity of what victorian govts get up to
a long time.
A former employee lived approx 3 km from her workplace, when she >>>>>>>> finished work at about 6pm it could take her 30-40mins to get >>>>>>>> home due to crazy peak period congestion at the level crossing >>>>>>>> between her workplace and home, do you think that it isn't worth >>>>>>>> getting rid of that traffic congestion?
-aNot when it costs that absolutely insane amount of money
It costs a lot more when it becomes an absolute necessity down the >>>>>> track.
-aThat's inflation, stupid, not a good reason to do it earlier
You do it before the need becomes pressing, not after.
Irrelevant to your ignorant claim that doing it like that saves money
-aPity about the other state capitalsIt makes no sense to do any of them at any time given the stupid
cost and that's why no one else is doing anything that stupid
Sydney does not have nearly as many level crossings as Melbourne.
Melbourne had roughly 180 level crossings on its suburban network,-aYes
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
-aBullshit
Please argue that point with the NSW government.
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
Makes more sense to use google maps in something as basic as that
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's
hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and rail
using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
-aThat mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade
crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
Bullshit
Nothing mangled about it.
Everything mangled about that claim of yours
What's more, Sydney systematically eliminated nearly all of its-aBullshit
level crossings decades ago.
-aIn fact, most of Sydney's suburban rail network was
originally planned and built with dedicated, elevated, or
underground rights of way.
-aBullshit
Again, argue that point with the NSW government.
Again, even you should be able to work out what is govt spin
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the railways?
-aThere was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in certain
locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common, problems
existed at *every grade crossing*.
Bullshit
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much easier
and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the rail network.
-aMore bulllshit
There weren't many cars back then, especially pre 1950.
Bullshit
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the last
examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
-aBullshit
Melbourne phased out its last hand operated, manual gate railway level
crossings with gatekeepers such as those at Jewell station on Union
Street in the late 1990s, when they were replaced with automated boom
gates. That was one I seemed always getting caught at. That and the
one on the same line at Brunswick Rd a little further down. Those
streets were my rat run through that part of town.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying the
much higher cost of grade separation.
-aBullshit
The very last manually operated swing gates at New Street in Brighton
were closed permanently circa 2010.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Thus far 87 grade crossings have been removed on the suburban rail-aBecause Labor is that stupid
network, only another ~110 to go.
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
-aBullshit
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
Just govt spin
--Grade crossings on these will not cause the level of frustration
that Melbourne's grade crossings have.
-aBullshit
The cost of doing anything and especially Govt projects is nuts, >>>>>>>> possibly due to union/Govt corruption but that is a separate
issue to whether or not a project has merit.
-aThat project has no merit given the insane cost of it
All of the "Big Build" projects have some merit but the question >>>>>>>> is can Vic afford them and the answer to that is absolutely not.
-aSo it is stupid, like I said
-aThere is a reason no one else is that stupid
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Not at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train frequency is
increased, the road network feels it at grade crossings.
The train frequency did not increase significantly at peak times
I beg to differ.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MelbourneTrains/comments/1qrnw6y/melbournes_train_service_frequency_february_2026/#lightbox
At my old station, Nunawading, there was one train every five minutes at peak, not counting those traveling in the opposite direction. The line
was double tracked through there.
At Mont Albert and Surrey Hills, it was even worse and the lines were triple tracked. Those two grade crossings were the pits but one or the other was on my route to/from work.
That's the problem with trains, that can't be done
It *is* done with trains. In Fact, at peak times some Melb. urban lines reached peak capacity due to signalling system constraints.
most other places separated to two transport modes
More bullshit
Been to Sydney lately?
Yep
Care to count the grade level crossings?
Pity about the number of traffic lights
Not talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade
crossings.
They are much more important than level grossings
to traffic flow because there are FAR more of them
They can be adjusted on the fly to give peak priority flow.
Melb. did that, Sydney should be able to do the same.
However train crossing lights cannot since they respond to train timetables.
Try to keep on point.
Get stuffed, again
Thanks for the win Rod, quite generous of you.
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
Bullshit
Please argue that point with the NSW government.
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
Makes more sense to use google maps in something as basic as that
Off you go then.
That link will refer you to Google maps and even direct you to
StreetView.
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's
hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and rail >>>>> using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
That mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade
crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
Bullshit
The proof is in the system as it now stands.
Nothing mangled about it.
Everything mangled about that claim of yours
What's more, Sydney systematically eliminated nearly all of its
level crossings decades ago.
Bullshit
In fact, most of Sydney's suburban rail network was
originally planned and built with dedicated, elevated, or
underground rights of way.
Bullshit
Again, argue that point with the NSW government.
Again, even you should be able to work out what is govt spin
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the railways?
There was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in certain
locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common, problems
existed at *every grade crossing*.
Bullshit
How would you know Rod?
You live in extreme regional NSW.
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much easier >>>>> and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the rail
network.
More bulllshit
There weren't many cars back then, especially pre 1950.
Bullshit
I'd say I'm right and you're wrong.
AI Overview
In the mid-1950s, Australia had roughly 2.2 million registered motor vehicles, with passenger vehicle registrations around 1.4 million. By
the early 2020s, according to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, total registered motor vehicles surpassed 20.1 million, reflecting massive population and ownership growth.
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the last >>>>> examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
Bullshit
Melbourne phased out its last hand operated, manual gate railway level >>> crossings with gatekeepers such as those at Jewell station on Union
Street in the late 1990s, when they were replaced with automated boom
gates. That was one I seemed always getting caught at. That and the
one on the same line at Brunswick Rd a little further down. Those
streets were my rat run through that part of town.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Obviously never experienced a manned gated level crossing.
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying the >>>>> much higher cost of grade separation.
Bullshit
The very last manually operated swing gates at New Street in Brighton
were closed permanently circa 2010.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Made a huge difference when they put automated boom gates in.
Didn't have to wait until boom gates were opened one by one by the gatekeeper.
Thus far 87 grade crossings have been removed on the suburban rail >>>>> network, only another ~110 to go.
Because Labor is that stupid
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
Bullshit
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
Just govt spin
Govt facts.
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Not at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train frequency
is increased, the road network feels it at grade crossings.
-aThe train frequency did not increase significantly at peak times
I beg to differ.
Down on your knees, boy
https://www.reddit.com/r/MelbourneTrains/comments/1qrnw6y/
melbournes_train_service_frequency_february_2026/#lightbox
That's not PEAK TIMES
At my old station, Nunawading, there was one train every five minutes
at peak, not counting those traveling in the opposite direction. The
line was double tracked through there.
At Mont Albert and Surrey Hills, it was even worse and the lines were
triple tracked. Those two grade crossings were the pits but one or the
other was on my route to/from work.
That's the problem with trains, that can't be done
It *is* done with trains. In Fact, at peak times some Melb. urban
lines reached peak capacity due to signalling system constraints.
Nothing to do with the signalling system,
everything to do with the fact that that
trains in the same direction have to wait
for the one(s) in front of them and you
can't do express trains that don't stop
at every station on the line in peak times
most other places separated to two transport modes
-aMore bullshit
Been to Sydney lately?
-aYep
Care to count the grade level crossings?
-aPity about the number of traffic lights
Not talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade
crossings.
-aThey are much more important than level grossings
to traffic flow because there are FAR more of them
They can be adjusted on the fly to give peak priority flow.
Bullshit with sydney
Melb. did-a-a that, Sydney should be able to do the same.
Nope, because the road network is MUCH
more complicated in sydney due to the harbor
However train crossing-a-a lights cannot since they respond to train
timetables.
The timetables are the result of the limitation of train lines
--Try to keep on point.
-aGet stuffed, again
Thanks for the win Rod, quite generous of you.
Just another of your pathetic little childish fantasys
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
-aBullshit
Please argue that point with the NSW government.
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
-aMakes more sense to use google maps in something as basic as that
Off you go then.
I'm not going anywhere
That link will refer you to Google maps and even direct you to
StreetView.
Which says nothing like your claim
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's
hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and
rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
-aThat mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade
crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
-aBullshit
The proof is in the system as it now stands.
It says nothing like that hilly claim
Nothing mangled about it.
-aEverything mangled about that claim of yours
What's more, Sydney systematically eliminated nearly all of its
level crossings decades ago.
-aBullshit
-aIn fact, most of Sydney's suburban rail network was
originally planned and built with dedicated, elevated, or
underground rights of way.
-aBullshit
Again, argue that point with the NSW government.
-aAgain, even you should be able to work out what is govt spin
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the railways?
-aThere was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in
certain locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common,
problems existed at *every grade crossing*.
-aBullshit
How would you know Rod?
I lived in Melburg for many years and visited it
lots of the time right thru that period and never
once ever got held up at a level crossing
You live in extreme regional NSW.
Nothing extreme about it and even you should
realise that its the closest state capital to where
I live and plenty of events happen there and my
sister lives there and still does and I even get
real readical and visit at times
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much
easier and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the
rail network.
-aMore bulllshit
There weren't many cars back then, especially pre 1950.
-aBullshit
I'd say I'm right and you're wrong.
And you are completely wrong
AI Overview
In the mid-1950s, Australia had roughly 2.2 million registered motor
vehicles, with passenger vehicle registrations around 1.4 million. By
the early 2020s, according to the Australian Bureau of Statistics,
total registered motor vehicles surpassed 20.1 million, reflecting
massive population and ownership growth.
Pity that many of them now don't get used on the
roads daily and that's what matter traffic wise
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the last >>>>>> examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
-aBullshit
Melbourne phased out its last hand operated, manual gate railway
level crossings with gatekeepers such as those at Jewell station on
Union Street in the late 1990s, when they were replaced with
automated boom gates. That was one I seemed always getting caught
at. That and the one on the same line at Brunswick Rd a little
further down. Those streets were my rat run through that part of town.
-aMakes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Obviously never experienced a manned gated level crossing.
There you go, face down in the mud, as always.
Relos had a business in Brighton
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying the >>>>>> much higher cost of grade separation.
-aBullshit
The very last manually operated swing gates at New Street in
Brighton were closed permanently circa 2010.
-aMakes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Made a huge difference when they put automated boom gates in.
Bullshit
--Didn't-a-a have to wait until boom gates were opened one by one by the
gatekeeper.
Fuck all compared with the time that they didn't let traffic thru
Thus far 87 grade crossings have been removed on the suburban rail >>>>>> network, only another ~110 to go.
-aBecause Labor is that stupid
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or
industrial lines.
-aBullshit
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
-aJust govt spin
Govt facts.
Bullshit
Rod Speed wroteNo need and my eyes aint rheumy
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteTake a closer look with those old rheumy eyes.
Rod Speed wroteDown on your knees, boy
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteI beg to differ.
Not at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train frequency >>>>> is increased, the road network feels it at grade crossings.The train frequency did not increase significantly at peak times
https://www.reddit.com/r/MelbourneTrains/comments/1qrnw6y/ >>> melbournes_train_service_frequency_february_2026/#lightboxThat's not PEAK TIMES
The chart shows the entire timetabled day, a weekday at that, from 4am > through to train finish at 1am - a 21 hour operating schedule. Since it > is a WEEKDAY and covers the entire day, it does indeed show PEAK TIMES.But doesn't show that the number of trains has increased in
And fixing that would have been a fucking sightTraditional fixed-block signalling systems have been a major physical > constraint on train frequency and network capacity across MelbournerCOs > metropolitan rail network, particularly in core bottlenecks like the > City Loop and inner-city corridors.At my old station, Nunawading, there was one train every five minutes >>> at peak, not counting those traveling in the opposite direction. The >>> line was double tracked through there.Nothing to do with the signalling system,
At Mont Albert and Surrey Hills, it was even worse and the lines were >>> triple tracked. Those two grade crossings were the pits but one or the >>> other was on my route to/from work.
That's the problem with trains, that can't be doneIt *is* done with trains. In Fact, at peak times some Melb. urban >>> lines reached peak capacity due to signalling system constraints.
https://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/ipl/high-capacity-signalling-melbourne
You don't see express trains used to carry the peak time paxeverything to do with the fact that thatThat's why express lines in Melbourne are triple or quadruple tracked. > The line to Malvern was like that - express trains ran on the outer pair > of lines, stopping all stations trains on the inner pair of lines so > they had a common platform. IOW, express trains did not interfere with > local trains so your point is bullshit.
trains in the same direction have to wait
for the one(s) in front of them and you
can't do express trains that don't stop
at every station on the line in peak times
You are wrong, as alwaysIt appears you might be wrong, *again*.Bullshit with sydneyThey can be adjusted on the fly to give peak priority flow.They are much more important than level grossingsNot talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade >>>>> crossings.YepBeen to Sydney lately?most other places separated to two transport modesMore bullshit
Care to count the grade level crossings?Pity about the number of traffic lights
to traffic flow because there are FAR more of them
N++N++Sydney traffic light sequences are dynamically adjusted in real time > to suit traffic flow needs. Most traffic signals across New South Wales > are managed by SCATS (Sydney Coordinated Adaptive Traffic System), an > intelligent platform developed in Sydney that continuously measures > vehicle volumes, queue lengths, and pedestrian demand via road sensors > to optimize green times and cycle lengths.And the reality is that because of the way roads are done in sydney
https://www.trafficltd.com.au/services/scats/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFoThen you need new glasses or your first glasses
How Traffic Sequences Adapt
Real-Time Adjustments: Sensors (such as inductive loops buried in the > pavement) detect vehicle numbers and adjust phase splits and cycle times > on a cycle-by-cycle basis.
Network Coordination: Intersections are linked together to coordinate > "green waves" along major corridors, helping traffic move smoothly > through multiple consecutive lights rather than stopping at each one.
Public Transport & Priority: Specialized systems like the SCATS Priority > Engine (SPE) allow the network to dynamically favor buses, trams, or > emergency vehicles when needed.
Targeted Upgrades: Transport for NSW regularly updates infrastructure > through initiatives like the Intelligent Traffic Light Program to trial > new smart sensors, AI-assisted detection, and safer turning phases.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_Coordinated_Adaptive_Traffic_System https://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/projects/strategy/transport-technology-strategy/delivering-transport-outcomes-technology/transport-2
Looks no different to what is being done in Melbourne.
That does not see the traffic on any particularIt would seem not since NSW is using a home grown traffic management > system.Melb. did that, Sydney should be able to do the same.Nope, because the road network is MUCH
more complicated in sydney due to the harbor
--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2And train signalling. Won't get an argument from me on that score.>However train crossing lights cannot since they respond to train >>> timetables.The timetables are the result of the limitation of train lines
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or >>>>>>> industrial lines.
Bullshit
Please argue that point with the NSW government.
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
Makes more sense to use google maps in something as basic as that
Off you go then.
I'm not going anywhere
More's the pity.
That link will refer you to Google maps and even direct you to
StreetView.
Which says nothing like your claim
That link, used properly, shows every grade crossing in NSW.
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's >>>>>>> hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and >>>>>>> rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
That mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade
crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
Bullshit
The proof is in the system as it now stands.
It says nothing like that hilly claim
Only need to drive around Sydney to verify.
Nothing mangled about it.
Everything mangled about that claim of yours
What's more, Sydney systematically eliminated nearly all of its >>>>>>> level crossings decades ago.
Bullshit
In fact, most of Sydney's suburban rail network was
originally planned and built with dedicated, elevated, or
underground rights of way.
Bullshit
Again, argue that point with the NSW government.
Again, even you should be able to work out what is govt spin
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the
railways?
There was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in
certain locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common,
problems existed at *every grade crossing*.
Bullshit
How would you know Rod?
I lived in Melburg for many years and visited it
lots of the time right thru that period and never
once ever got held up at a level crossing
You don't when you're on the train Rod!
You live in extreme regional NSW.
Nothing extreme about it and even you should
realise that its the closest state capital to where
I live and plenty of events happen there and my
sister lives there and still does and I even get
real readical and visit at times
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much
easier and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the >>>>>>> rail network.
More bulllshit
There weren't many cars back then, especially pre 1950.
Bullshit
I'd say I'm right and you're wrong.
And you are completely wrong
AI Overview
In the mid-1950s, Australia had roughly 2.2 million registered motor
vehicles, with passenger vehicle registrations around 1.4 million. By
the early 2020s, according to the Australian Bureau of Statistics,
total registered motor vehicles surpassed 20.1 million, reflecting
massive population and ownership growth.
Pity that many of them now don't get used on the
roads daily and that's what matter traffic wise
Most do, and on a daily basis.
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the last >>>>>>> examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
Bullshit
Melbourne phased out its last hand operated, manual gate railway
level crossings with gatekeepers such as those at Jewell station on >>>>> Union Street in the late 1990s, when they were replaced with
automated boom gates. That was one I seemed always getting caught
at. That and the one on the same line at Brunswick Rd a little
further down. Those streets were my rat run through that part of
town.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Obviously never experienced a manned gated level crossing.
There you go, face down in the mud, as always.
Relos had a business in Brighton
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying the >>>>>>> much higher cost of grade separation.
Bullshit
The very last manually operated swing gates at New Street in
Brighton were closed permanently circa 2010.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Made a huge difference when they put automated boom gates in.
Bullshit
Why would they have spent the money otherwise?
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Not at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train frequency >>>>>> is increased, the road network feels it at grade crossings.
-aThe train frequency did not increase significantly at peak times
I beg to differ.
-aDown on your knees, boy
https://www.reddit.com/r/MelbourneTrains/comments/1qrnw6y/
melbournes_train_service_frequency_february_2026/#lightbox
-aThat's not PEAK TIMES
Take a closer look with those old rheumy eyes.
No need and my eyes aint rheumy
The chart shows the entire timetabled day, a weekday at that, from 4am
through to train finish at 1am - a 21 hour operating schedule.-a Since
it is a WEEKDAY and covers the entire day, it does indeed show PEAK
TIMES.
But doesn't show that the number of trains has increased in
peak times because that isn't possible given how trains work
The most that can happen is longer trains with more carraiges
and that has no significant effect on how long a level crossing
is closed to car and truck traffic
At my old station, Nunawading, there was one train every five
minutes at peak, not counting those traveling in the opposite
direction. The line was double tracked through there.
At Mont Albert and Surrey Hills, it was even worse and the lines
were triple tracked. Those two grade crossings were the pits but one
or the other was on my route to/from work.
That's the problem with trains, that can't be done
It *is* done with trains. In Fact, at peak times some Melb. urban-aNothing to do with the signalling system,
lines reached peak capacity due to signalling system constraints.
Traditional fixed-block signalling systems have been a major physical
constraint on train frequency and network capacity across MelbournerCOs
metropolitan rail network, particularly in core bottlenecks like the
City Loop and inner-city corridors.
https://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/ipl/high-capacity-
signalling-melbourne
And fixing that would have been a fucking sight
cheaper than replacing all level crossings
everything to do with the fact that that
trains in the same direction have to wait
for the one(s) in front of them and you
can't do express trains that don't stop
at every station on the line in peak times
That's why express lines in Melbourne are triple or quadruple tracked.
The line to Malvern was like that - express trains ran on the outer
pair of lines, stopping all stations trains on the inner pair of lines
so they had a common platform. IOW, express trains did not interfere
with local trains so your point is bullshit.
You don't see express trains used to carry the peak time pax
That's used for country traffic
most other places separated to two transport modes
-aMore bullshit
Been to Sydney lately?
-aYep
Care to count the grade level crossings?
-aPity about the number of traffic lights
Not talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade
crossings.
-aThey are much more important than level grossings
to traffic flow because there are FAR more of them
They can be adjusted on the fly to give peak priority flow.
-aBullshit with sydney
It appears you might be wrong, *again*.
You are wrong, as always
N++N++Sydney traffic light sequences are dynamically adjusted in real time >> to suit traffic flow needs. Most traffic signals across New South
Wales are managed by SCATS (Sydney Coordinated Adaptive Traffic
System), an intelligent platform developed in Sydney that continuously
measures vehicle volumes, queue lengths, and pedestrian demand via
road sensors to optimize green times and cycle lengths.
And the reality is that because of the way roads are done in sydney
its just not possible to give just one road traffic lights that sees none
of the traffic on that road having to never stop for a traffic light
https://www.trafficltd.com.au/services/scats/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo
How Traffic Sequences Adapt
Real-Time Adjustments: Sensors (such as inductive loops buried in the
pavement) detect vehicle numbers and adjust phase splits and cycle
times on a cycle-by-cycle basis.
Network Coordination: Intersections are linked together to coordinate
"green waves" along major corridors, helping traffic move smoothly
through multiple consecutive lights rather than stopping at each one.
Public Transport & Priority: Specialized systems like the SCATS
Priority Engine (SPE) allow the network to dynamically favor buses,
trams, or emergency vehicles when needed.
Targeted Upgrades: Transport for NSW regularly updates infrastructure
through initiatives like the Intelligent Traffic Light Program to
trial new smart sensors, AI-assisted detection, and safer turning phases.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_Coordinated_Adaptive_Traffic_System
https://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/projects/strategy/transport-
technology-strategy/delivering-transport-outcomes-technology/transport-2
Looks no different to what is being done in Melbourne.
Then you need new glasses or your first glasses
Melb. did-a-a that, Sydney should be able to do the same.
-aNope, because the road network is MUCH
more complicated in sydney due to the harbor
It would seem not since NSW is using a home grown traffic management
system.
That does not see the traffic on any particular
road never have to stop at a traffic light
--However train crossing-a-a lights cannot since they respond to train
timetables.
The timetables are the result of the limitation of train lines
And train signalling. Won't get an argument from me on that score.>
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or >>>>>>>> industrial lines.
-aBullshit
Please argue that point with the NSW government.
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
-aMakes more sense to use google maps in something as basic as that
Off you go then.
-aI'm not going anywhere
More's the pity.
More's the shitty in your case
That link will refer you to Google maps and even direct you to
StreetView.
-aWhich says nothing like your claim
That link, used properly, shows every grade crossing in NSW.
And says nothing like your original stupid ignorant claim
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's >>>>>>>> hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and >>>>>>>> rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
-aThat mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade
crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
-aBullshit
The proof is in the system as it now stands.
-aIt says nothing like that hilly claim
Only need to drive around Sydney to verify.
Been doing that since before you were even born thanks
and streetview proved your claim is ignorant crap
Nothing mangled about it.
-aEverything mangled about that claim of yours
What's more, Sydney systematically eliminated nearly all of its >>>>>>>> level crossings decades ago.
-aBullshit
-aIn fact, most of Sydney's suburban rail network was
originally planned and built with dedicated, elevated, or
underground rights of way.
-aBullshit
Again, argue that point with the NSW government.
-aAgain, even you should be able to work out what is govt spin
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the
railways?
-aThere was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in
certain locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common,
problems existed at *every grade crossing*.
-aBullshit
How would you know Rod?
-aI lived in Melburg for many years and visited it
lots of the time right thru that period and never
once ever got held up at a level crossing
You don't when you're on the train Rod!
I haven't used the train since I lived in Melburg as a kid
You live in extreme regional NSW.
Nothing extreme about it and even you should
realise that its the closest state capital to where
I live and plenty of events happen there and my
sister lives there and still does and I even get
real readical and visit at times
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much
easier and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the >>>>>>>> rail network.
-aMore bulllshit
There weren't many cars back then, especially pre 1950.
-aBullshit
I'd say I'm right and you're wrong.
-aAnd you are completely wrong
AI Overview
In the mid-1950s, Australia had roughly 2.2 million registered motor
vehicles, with passenger vehicle registrations around 1.4 million.
By the early 2020s, according to the Australian Bureau of
Statistics, total registered motor vehicles surpassed 20.1 million,
reflecting massive population and ownership growth.
Pity that many of them now don't get used on the
roads daily and that's what matter traffic wise
Most do, and on a daily basis.
Bullshit given more than one car per household
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the >>>>>>>> last examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
-aBullshit
Melbourne phased out its last hand operated, manual gate railway
level crossings with gatekeepers such as those at Jewell station
on Union Street in the late 1990s, when they were replaced with
automated boom gates. That was one I seemed always getting caught >>>>>> at. That and the one on the same line at Brunswick Rd a little
further down. Those streets were my rat run through that part of
town.
-aMakes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Obviously never experienced a manned gated level crossing.
-aThere you go, face down in the mud, as always.
-aRelos had a business in Brighton
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying >>>>>>>> the much higher cost of grade separation.
-aBullshit
The very last manually operated swing gates at New Street in
Brighton were closed permanently circa 2010.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Made a huge difference when they put automated boom gates in.
-aBullshit
Why would they have spent the money otherwise?
So they didn't have to pay the wages of the fella
who opened and closed the gates, fuckwit
Rod Speed wroteThat is only a small effect. The problem is that they
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteThe more efficient the signalling, the tighter the block systems can be.
Rod Speed wroteNo need and my eyes aint rheumy
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteTake a closer look with those old rheumy eyes.
Rod Speed wroteDown on your knees, boy
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Not at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train frequency >>>>>>> is increased, the road network feels it at grade crossings.The train frequency did not increase significantly at peak times>>>>> I beg to differ.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MelbourneTrains/comments/1qrnw6y/ >>>>> melbournes_train_service_frequency_february_2026/#lightboxThat's not PEAK TIMES
The chart shows the entire timetabled day, a weekday at that, from 4am >>> through to train finish at 1am - a 21 hour operating schedule. Since >>> it is a WEEKDAY and covers the entire day, it does indeed show PEAK >>> TIMES.But doesn't show that the number of trains has increased in
peak times because that isn't possible given how trains work
But that is limited by the length of the platformsThe most that can happen is longer trains with more carraigesThey did that too.
Nopeand that has no significant effect on how long a level crossingHave I got news for you!
is closed to car and truck traffic
And fixing that would have been a fucking sightTraditional fixed-block signalling systems have been a major physical >>> constraint on train frequency and network capacity across MelbournerCOs >>> metropolitan rail network, particularly in core bottlenecks like the >>> City Loop and inner-city corridors.At my old station, Nunawading, there was one train every five >>>>> minutes at peak, not counting those traveling in the opposite >>>>> direction. The line was double tracked through there.Nothing to do with the signalling system,
At Mont Albert and Surrey Hills, it was even worse and the lines >>>>> were triple tracked. Those two grade crossings were the pits but one >>>>> or the other was on my route to/from work.
That's the problem with trains, that can't be doneIt *is* done with trains. In Fact, at peak times some Melb. urban >>>>> lines reached peak capacity due to signalling system constraints.
https://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/ipl/high-capacity- >>> signalling-melbourne
cheaper than replacing all level crossings
You don't see express trains used to carry the peak time paxeverything to do with the fact that thatThat's why express lines in Melbourne are triple or quadruple tracked. >>> The line to Malvern was like that - express trains ran on the outer >>> pair of lines, stopping all stations trains on the inner pair of lines >>> so they had a common platform. IOW, express trains did not interfere >>> with local trains so your point is bullshit.
trains in the same direction have to wait
for the one(s) in front of them and you
can't do express trains that don't stop
at every station on the line in peak times
That's used for country traffic
AI OverviewThat's not express trains
Limited-stop and express train services on Metro Trains Melbourne > operate primarily during weekday peak directions on lines like the > Frankston, Hurstbridge, Lilydale, Belgrave, Glen Waverley, and Sunbury > routes. Unlike networks with permanent multi-track express layouts, > Melbourne's tracks mostly mix all-stops and peak express trains via > periodic overtaking or designated sequential non-stop runs.
Key Characteristics of Express OperationsThose are country lines
Peak Direction Focus: Most express and limited-stop patterns run inbound > toward the CBD in the morning and outbound in the evening.
Line-Specific Patterns:
Werribee Line: Routinely operates express sections from Laverton through > to North Melbourne on weekdays.
Lilydale & Belgrave Lines: Utilize a shared third-track section as far > as Box Hill to allow peak express runs to pass local all-stops services.
Hurstbridge & Frankston: Feature targeted peak express or limited-stop > jumps past congested inner-suburban bottlenecks.
Time Savings: Commute time reductions can vary, as some express and > adjacent all-stops services are tightly scheduled with comparable > overall end-to-end run timesBecause you still need to have the traffic lights stop the
You are wrong, as alwaysIt appears you might be wrong, *again*.Bullshit with sydneyThey can be adjusted on the fly to give peak priority flow.They are much more important than level grossingsNot talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade >>>>>>> crossings.YepBeen to Sydney lately?most other places separated to two transport modesMore bullshit
Care to count the grade level crossings?Pity about the number of traffic lights
to traffic flow because there are FAR more of them
N++N++Sydney traffic light sequences are dynamically adjusted in real time >>> to suit traffic flow needs. Most traffic signals across New South >>> Wales are managed by SCATS (Sydney Coordinated Adaptive Traffic >>> System), an intelligent platform developed in Sydney that continuously >>> measures vehicle volumes, queue lengths, and pedestrian demand via >>> road sensors to optimize green times and cycle lengths.And the reality is that because of the way roads are done in sydney
its just not possible to give just one road traffic lights that sees >> none of the traffic on that road having to never stop for a traffic >> light
Bullshit it does when there is always traffic that needs to turnNever said it did. What it does do is smooth out the traffic flow.https://www.trafficltd.com.au/services/scats/Then you need new glasses or your first glasses
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo
How Traffic Sequences Adapt
Real-Time Adjustments: Sensors (such as inductive loops buried in the >>> pavement) detect vehicle numbers and adjust phase splits and cycle >>> times on a cycle-by-cycle basis.
Network Coordination: Intersections are linked together to coordinate >>> "green waves" along major corridors, helping traffic move smoothly >>> through multiple consecutive lights rather than stopping at each one.
Public Transport & Priority: Specialized systems like the SCATS >>> Priority Engine (SPE) allow the network to dynamically favor buses, >>> trams, or emergency vehicles when needed.
Targeted Upgrades: Transport for NSW regularly updates infrastructure >>> through initiatives like the Intelligent Traffic Light Program to >>> trial new smart sensors, AI-assisted detection, and safer turning >>> phases.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_Coordinated_Adaptive_Traffic_System >>> https://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/projects/strategy/transport- >>> technology-strategy/delivering-transport-outcomes-technology/transport-2
Looks no different to what is being done in Melbourne.
That does not see the traffic on any particularIt would seem not since NSW is using a home grown traffic management >>> system.Melb. did that, Sydney should be able to do the same.Nope, because the road network is MUCH
more complicated in sydney due to the harbor
road never have to stop at a traffic light
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor or >>>>>>>>> industrial lines.
Bullshit
Please argue that point with the NSW government.
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/index.html
Makes more sense to use google maps in something as basic as that
Off you go then.
I'm not going anywhere
More's the pity.
More's the shitty in your case
That link will refer you to Google maps and even direct you to
StreetView.
Which says nothing like your claim
That link, used properly, shows every grade crossing in NSW.
And says nothing like your original stupid ignorant claim
Rheumy eyes,
get them seen to.
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, Sydney's >>>>>>>>> hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate roads and >>>>>>>>> rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
That mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade >>>>>>> crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
Bullshit
The proof is in the system as it now stands.
It says nothing like that hilly claim
Only need to drive around Sydney to verify.
Been doing that since before you were even born thanks
and streetview proved your claim is ignorant crap
Prove it.
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the >>>>>>>>> railways?
There was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in
certain locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common, >>>>>>> problems existed at *every grade crossing*.
Bullshit
How would you know Rod?
I lived in Melburg for many years and visited it
lots of the time right thru that period and never
once ever got held up at a level crossing
You don't when you're on the train Rod!
I haven't used the train since I lived in Melburg as a kid
Things have changed in the past 100 years Rod.
You live in extreme regional NSW.
Nothing extreme about it and even you should
realise that its the closest state capital to where
I live and plenty of events happen there and my
sister lives there and still does and I even get
real readical and visit at times
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much >>>>>>>>> easier and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of the >>>>>>>>> rail network.
More bulllshit
There weren't many cars back then, especially pre 1950.
Bullshit
I'd say I'm right and you're wrong.
And you are completely wrong
AI Overview
In the mid-1950s, Australia had roughly 2.2 million registered motor >>>>> vehicles, with passenger vehicle registrations around 1.4 million. >>>>> By the early 2020s, according to the Australian Bureau of
Statistics, total registered motor vehicles surpassed 20.1 million, >>>>> reflecting massive population and ownership growth.
Pity that many of them now don't get used on the
roads daily and that's what matter traffic wise
Most do, and on a daily basis.
Bullshit given more than one car per household
And, during the day, all the cars are out, even the wife's hack -
shopping, school drop offs and pickups, socialising.
Oh, I forgot, it's been nigh on a century since you did that sort of thing
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the >>>>>>>>> last examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
Bullshit
Melbourne phased out its last hand operated, manual gate railway >>>>>>> level crossings with gatekeepers such as those at Jewell station >>>>>>> on Union Street in the late 1990s, when they were replaced with >>>>>>> automated boom gates. That was one I seemed always getting caught >>>>>>> at. That and the one on the same line at Brunswick Rd a little >>>>>>> further down. Those streets were my rat run through that part of >>>>>>> town.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Obviously never experienced a manned gated level crossing.
There you go, face down in the mud, as always.
Relos had a business in Brighton
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying >>>>>>>>> the much higher cost of grade separation.
Bullshit
The very last manually operated swing gates at New Street in
Brighton were closed permanently circa 2010.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Made a huge difference when they put automated boom gates in.
Bullshit
Why would they have spent the money otherwise?
So they didn't have to pay the wages of the fella
who opened and closed the gates, fuckwit
Minimal in the overall scheme of things.
The time taken for one person to open 2 gates sequentially and close 2 gates sequentially was the killer reason.
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Not at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train
frequency is increased, the road network feels it at grade
crossings.
-aThe train frequency did not increase significantly at peak times
I beg to differ.
-aDown on your knees, boy
https://www.reddit.com/r/MelbourneTrains/comments/1qrnw6y/
melbournes_train_service_frequency_february_2026/#lightbox
-aThat's not PEAK TIMES
Take a closer look with those old rheumy eyes.
-aNo need and my eyes aint rheumy
The chart shows the entire timetabled day, a weekday at that, from
4am through to train finish at 1am - a 21 hour operating schedule.
Since it is a WEEKDAY and covers the entire day, it does indeed show
PEAK TIMES.
-aBut doesn't show that the number of trains has increased in
peak times because that isn't possible given how trains work
The more efficient the signalling, the tighter the block systems can be.
That is only a small effect. The problem is that they
still need to stop at the stations to let pax on and off
The most that can happen is longer trains with more carraiges
They did that too.
But that is limited by the length of the platforms
and that has no significant effect on how long a level crossing
is closed to car and truck traffic
At my old station, Nunawading, there was one train every five
minutes at peak, not counting those traveling in the opposite
direction. The line was double tracked through there.
At Mont Albert and Surrey Hills, it was even worse and the lines
were triple tracked. Those two grade crossings were the pits but
one or the other was on my route to/from work.
That's the problem with trains, that can't be done
It *is* done with trains. In Fact, at peak times some Melb. urban >>>>>> lines reached peak capacity due to signalling system constraints.-aNothing to do with the signalling system,
Traditional fixed-block signalling systems have been a major
physical constraint on train frequency and network capacity across
MelbournerCOs metropolitan rail network, particularly in core
bottlenecks like the City Loop and inner-city corridors.
https://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/ipl/high-capacity-
signalling-melbourne
-aAnd fixing that would have been a fucking sight
cheaper than replacing all level crossings
everything to do with the fact that that
trains in the same direction have to wait
for the one(s) in front of them and you
can't do express trains that don't stop
at every station on the line in peak times
That's why express lines in Melbourne are triple or quadruple
tracked. The line to Malvern was like that - express trains ran on
the outer pair of lines, stopping all stations trains on the inner
pair of lines so they had a common platform. IOW, express trains did
not interfere with local trains so your point is bullshit.
-aYou don't see express trains used to carry the peak time pax
-aThat's used for country traffic
Have I got news for you!
Nope
AI Overview
Limited-stop and express train services on Metro Trains Melbourne
operate primarily during weekday peak directions on lines like the
Frankston, Hurstbridge, Lilydale, Belgrave, Glen Waverley, and Sunbury
routes. Unlike networks with permanent multi-track express layouts,
Melbourne's tracks mostly mix all-stops and peak express trains via
periodic overtaking or designated sequential non-stop runs.
That's not express trains
Key Characteristics of Express Operations
Peak Direction Focus: Most express and limited-stop patterns run
inbound toward the CBD in the morning and outbound in the evening.
Line-Specific Patterns:
Werribee Line: Routinely operates express sections from Laverton
through to North Melbourne on weekdays.
Lilydale & Belgrave Lines: Utilize a shared third-track section as far
as Box Hill to allow peak express runs to pass local all-stops services.
Hurstbridge & Frankston: Feature targeted peak express or limited-stop
jumps past congested inner-suburban bottlenecks.
Those are country lines
Time Savings: Commute time reductions can vary, as some express and
adjacent all-stops services are tightly scheduled with comparable
overall end-to-end run times
most other places separated to two transport modes
-aMore bullshit
Been to Sydney lately?
-aYep
Care to count the grade level crossings?
-aPity about the number of traffic lights
Not talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade >>>>>>>> crossings.
-aThey are much more important than level grossings
to traffic flow because there are FAR more of them
They can be adjusted on the fly to give peak priority flow.
-aBullshit with sydney
It appears you might be wrong, *again*.
-aYou are wrong, as always
N++N++Sydney traffic light sequences are dynamically adjusted in real >>>> time to suit traffic flow needs. Most traffic signals across New
South Wales are managed by SCATS (Sydney Coordinated Adaptive
Traffic System), an intelligent platform developed in Sydney that
continuously measures vehicle volumes, queue lengths, and pedestrian
demand via road sensors to optimize green times and cycle lengths.
-aAnd the reality is that because of the way roads are done in sydney
its just not possible to give just one road traffic lights that
sees-a-a none-a of the traffic on that road having to never stop for a
traffic light
Because you still need to have the traffic lights stop the
traffic so that those who need to turn right across the
traffic coming in the opposite direction can do that
https://www.trafficltd.com.au/services/scats/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo
How Traffic Sequences Adapt
Real-Time Adjustments: Sensors (such as inductive loops buried in
the pavement) detect vehicle numbers and adjust phase splits and
cycle times on a cycle-by-cycle basis.
Network Coordination: Intersections are linked together to
coordinate "green waves" along major corridors, helping traffic move
smoothly through multiple consecutive lights rather than stopping at
each one.
Public Transport & Priority: Specialized systems like the SCATS
Priority Engine (SPE) allow the network to dynamically favor buses,
trams, or emergency vehicles when needed.
Targeted Upgrades: Transport for NSW regularly updates
infrastructure through initiatives like the Intelligent Traffic
Light Program to trial new smart sensors, AI-assisted detection, and
safer turning phases.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/
Sydney_Coordinated_Adaptive_Traffic_System
https://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/projects/strategy/transport-
technology-strategy/delivering-transport-outcomes-technology/
transport-2
Looks no different to what is being done in Melbourne.
-aThen you need new glasses or your first glasses
Melb. did-a-a that, Sydney should be able to do the same.
-aNope, because the road network is MUCH
more complicated in sydney due to the harbor
It would seem not since NSW is using a home grown traffic management
system.
That does not see the traffic on any particular
road never have to stop at a traffic light
Never said it did. What it does do is smooth out the traffic flow.
Bullshit it does when there is always traffic that needs to turn
right off the road you are trying to smooth the traffic on
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Sydney has only about five remaining level crossings on minor >>>>>>>>>> or industrial lines.
-aBullshit
Please argue that point with the NSW government.
https://maps.transport.nsw.gov.au/egeomaps/level-crossing/
index.html
-aMakes more sense to use google maps in something as basic as that
Off you go then.
-aI'm not going anywhere
More's the pity.
-aMore's the shitty in your case
That link will refer you to Google maps and even direct you to
StreetView.
-aWhich says nothing like your claim
That link, used properly, shows every grade crossing in NSW.
-aAnd says nothing like your original stupid ignorant claim
Rheumy eyes,
Just another of your pathetic little ignorant fantays
get them seen to.
Go and fuck yourself, again
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly,
Sydney's hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate >>>>>>>>>> roads and rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and tunnels.
-aThat mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade >>>>>>>> crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
-aBullshit
The proof is in the system as it now stands.
-aIt says nothing like that hilly claim
Only need to drive around Sydney to verify.
-aBeen doing that since before you were even born thanks
and streetview proved your claim is ignorant crap
Prove it.
Streetview does that
YOU made that ignorant claim
YOU get to prove that claim
THAT'S how it works
-aThere was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in >>>>>>>> certain locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common, >>>>>>>> problems existed at *every grade crossing*.
-aBullshit
How would you know Rod?
I lived in Melburg for many years and visited it
lots of the time right thru that period and never
once ever got held up at a level crossing
You don't when you're on the train Rod!
-aI haven't used the train since I lived in Melburg as a kid
Things have changed in the past 100 years Rod.
I have been there in a car countless times since then, fuckwit
--You live in extreme regional NSW.
Nothing extreme about it and even you should
realise that its the closest state capital to where
I live and plenty of events happen there and my
sister lives there and still does and I even get
real readical and visit at times
Simple, Melbourne's flat landscape made level junctions much >>>>>>>>>> easier and cheaper to build during the initial expansion of >>>>>>>>>> the rail network.
-aMore bulllshit
There weren't many cars back then, especially pre 1950.
-aBullshit
I'd say I'm right and you're wrong.
-aAnd you are completely wrong
AI Overview
In the mid-1950s, Australia had roughly 2.2 million registered
motor vehicles, with passenger vehicle registrations around 1.4
million. By the early 2020s, according to the Australian Bureau of >>>>>> Statistics, total registered motor vehicles surpassed 20.1
million, reflecting massive population and ownership growth.
Pity that many of them now don't get used on the
roads daily and that's what matter traffic wise
Most do, and on a daily basis.
-aBullshit given more than one car per household
And, during the day, all the cars are out, even the wife's hack -
shopping, school drop offs and pickups, socialising.
Bullshit and streetview proves that that claim is complete
and utter mindless bullshit, as always from you
Oh, I forgot, it's-a-a been nigh on a century since you did that sort of
thing
More of your complete and utter mindless bullshit, as always from you
It wasn't until relatively recent times Melbourne removed the >>>>>>>>>> last examples of *manned* level crossing *gates*.
-aBullshit
Melbourne phased out its last hand operated, manual gate railway >>>>>>>> level crossings with gatekeepers such as those at Jewell station >>>>>>>> on Union Street in the late 1990s, when they were replaced with >>>>>>>> automated boom gates. That was one I seemed always getting
caught at. That and the one on the same line at Brunswick Rd a >>>>>>>> little further down. Those streets were my rat run through that >>>>>>>> part of town.
-aMakes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Obviously never experienced a manned gated level crossing.
-aThere you go, face down in the mud, as always.
-aRelos had a business in Brighton
I can still recall those in Brunswick. Now Melbourne is paying >>>>>>>>>> the much higher cost of grade separation.
-aBullshit
The very last manually operated swing gates at New Street in
Brighton were closed permanently circa 2010.
Makes no difference to the effect on car traffic
Made a huge difference when they put automated boom gates in.
-aBullshit
Why would they have spent the money otherwise?
-aSo they didn't have to pay the wages of the fella
who opened and closed the gates, fuckwit
Minimal in the overall scheme of things.
Still worth doing and that's why they did that, fuckwit
The time taken for one person to open 2 gates sequentially and close 2
gates sequentially was the killer reason.
Bullshit it was
Rod Speed wroteSo they can't increase that for the reason I stated
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote6 car sets, standard for most urban transit.
Rod Speed wroteThat is only a small effect. The problem is that they
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteThe more efficient the signalling, the tighter the block systems can >>> be.
Rod Speed wroteNo need and my eyes aint rheumy
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteTake a closer look with those old rheumy eyes.
Rod Speed wroteDown on your knees, boy
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Not at all, the train network doesn't slow down if train >>>>>>>>> frequency is increased, the road network feels it at grade >>>>>>>>> crossings.The train frequency did not increase significantly at peak times >>>>>>> I beg to differ.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MelbourneTrains/comments/1qrnw6y/ >>>>>>> melbournes_train_service_frequency_february_2026/#lightboxThat's not PEAK TIMES
The chart shows the entire timetabled day, a weekday at that, from >>>>> 4am through to train finish at 1am - a 21 hour operating schedule. >>>>> Since it is a WEEKDAY and covers the entire day, it does indeed show >>>>> PEAK TIMES.But doesn't show that the number of trains has increased in
peak times because that isn't possible given how trains work
still need to stop at the stations to let pax on and off
But that is limited by the length of the platformsThe most that can happen is longer trains with more carraigesThey did that too.
That said, nothing is static.One extra car is sweet fuck all
Melbourne has had to lengthen station platforms multiple times in its > history to accommodate longer train sets, including major platform > extension projects for the introduction of 7-car High Capacity Metro > Trains (HCMTs) and historical expansions.
Pity about the routes it listedNopeand that has no significant effect on how long a level crossingHave I got news for you!
is closed to car and truck traffic
And fixing that would have been a fucking sightTraditional fixed-block signalling systems have been a major >>>>> physical constraint on train frequency and network capacity across >>>>> MelbournerCOs metropolitan rail network, particularly in core >>>>> bottlenecks like the City Loop and inner-city corridors.At my old station, Nunawading, there was one train every five >>>>>>> minutes at peak, not counting those traveling in the opposite >>>>>>> direction. The line was double tracked through there.Nothing to do with the signalling system,
At Mont Albert and Surrey Hills, it was even worse and the lines >>>>>>> were triple tracked. Those two grade crossings were the pits but >>>>>>> one or the other was on my route to/from work.
That's the problem with trains, that can't be doneIt *is* done with trains. In Fact, at peak times some Melb. urban >>>>>>> lines reached peak capacity due to signalling system constraints.
https://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/ipl/high-capacity- >>>>> signalling-melbourne
cheaper than replacing all level crossings
You don't see express trains used to carry the peak time paxeverything to do with the fact that thatThat's why express lines in Melbourne are triple or quadruple >>>>> tracked. The line to Malvern was like that - express trains ran on >>>>> the outer pair of lines, stopping all stations trains on the inner >>>>> pair of lines so they had a common platform. IOW, express trains did >>>>> not interfere with local trains so your point is bullshit.
trains in the same direction have to wait
for the one(s) in front of them and you
can't do express trains that don't stop
at every station on the line in peak times
That's used for country traffic
AI Overview
It says, "Limited-stop and express train services on Metro Trains". That > covers the bases I suspect.Limited-stop and express train services on Metro Trains Melbourne >>> operate primarily during weekday peak directions on lines like the >>> Frankston, Hurstbridge, Lilydale, Belgrave, Glen Waverley, and Sunbury >>> routes. Unlike networks with permanent multi-track express layouts, >>> Melbourne's tracks mostly mix all-stops and peak express trains via >>> periodic overtaking or designated sequential non-stop runs.That's not express trains
Those listed are still shorter country linesElectrified urban lines using urban electric car sets. Country lines are > served by *diesels*.Key Characteristics of Express OperationsThose are country lines
Peak Direction Focus: Most express and limited-stop patterns run >>> inbound toward the CBD in the morning and outbound in the evening.
Line-Specific Patterns:
Werribee Line: Routinely operates express sections from Laverton >>> through to North Melbourne on weekdays.
Lilydale & Belgrave Lines: Utilize a shared third-track section as far >>> as Box Hill to allow peak express runs to pass local all-stops >>> services.
Hurstbridge & Frankston: Feature targeted peak express or limited-stop >>> jumps past congested inner-suburban bottlenecks.
You have no choice in sydney, fuckwitAnd I can tell you from personal experience that you won't want to be > doing that on any regular basis.Time Savings: Commute time reductions can vary, as some express and >>> adjacent all-stops services are tightly scheduled with comparable >>> overall end-to-end run timesBecause you still need to have the traffic lights stop the
You are wrong, as alwaysIt appears you might be wrong, *again*.Bullshit with sydneyThey can be adjusted on the fly to give peak priority flow.They are much more important than level grossingsNot talking about traffic lights, talking about railway grade >>>>>>>>> crossings.YepBeen to Sydney lately?most other places separated to two transport modesMore bullshit
Care to count the grade level crossings?Pity about the number of traffic lights
to traffic flow because there are FAR more of them
N++N++Sydney traffic light sequences are dynamically adjusted in real >>>>> time to suit traffic flow needs. Most traffic signals across New >>>>> South Wales are managed by SCATS (Sydney Coordinated Adaptive >>>>> Traffic System), an intelligent platform developed in Sydney that >>>>> continuously measures vehicle volumes, queue lengths, and pedestrian >>>>> demand via road sensors to optimize green times and cycle lengths.>>>> And the reality is that because of the way roads are done in sydneyits just not possible to give just one road traffic lights that sees >>>> none of the traffic on that road having to never stop for a traffic >>>> light
traffic so that those who need to turn right across the
traffic coming in the opposite direction can do that
Pity about those who need to turn right off the peak flow trafficIt smooths the traffic in the peak flow direct and those traveling in > the opposite direction are left hanging - a lot!Bullshit it does when there is always traffic that needs to turnNever said it did. What it does do is smooth out the traffic flow.https://www.trafficltd.com.au/services/scats/Then you need new glasses or your first glasses
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo
How Traffic Sequences Adapt
Real-Time Adjustments: Sensors (such as inductive loops buried in >>>>> the pavement) detect vehicle numbers and adjust phase splits and >>>>> cycle times on a cycle-by-cycle basis.
Network Coordination: Intersections are linked together to >>>>> coordinate "green waves" along major corridors, helping traffic move >>>>> smoothly through multiple consecutive lights rather than stopping at >>>>> each one.
Public Transport & Priority: Specialized systems like the SCATS >>>>> Priority Engine (SPE) allow the network to dynamically favor buses, >>>>> trams, or emergency vehicles when needed.
Targeted Upgrades: Transport for NSW regularly updates >>>>> infrastructure through initiatives like the Intelligent Traffic >>>>> Light Program to trial new smart sensors, AI-assisted detection, and >>>>> safer turning phases.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u67cHJ_JUFo
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ >>>>> Sydney_Coordinated_Adaptive_Traffic_System
https://www.transport.nsw.gov.au/projects/strategy/transport- >>>>> technology-strategy/delivering-transport-outcomes-technology/ >>>>> transport-2
Looks no different to what is being done in Melbourne.
That does not see the traffic on any particularIt would seem not since NSW is using a home grown traffic management >>>>> system.Melb. did that, Sydney should be able to do the same.Nope, because the road network is MUCH
more complicated in sydney due to the harbor
road never have to stop at a traffic light
right off the road you are trying to smooth the traffic on
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, >>>>>>>>>>> Sydney's hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate >>>>>>>>>>> roads and rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and >>>>>>>>>>> tunnels.
That mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade >>>>>>>>> crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
Bullshit
The proof is in the system as it now stands.
It says nothing like that hilly claim
Only need to drive around Sydney to verify.
Been doing that since before you were even born thanks
and streetview proved your claim is ignorant crap
Prove it.
Streetview does that
YOU made that ignorant claim
YOU get to prove that claim
THAT'S how it works
Not really,
my claim was that the NSW govt. own data showsvery few urban grade crossings, 5 or 6 IIRC.
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the >>>>>>>>>>> railways?
There was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in >>>>>>>>> certain locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common, >>>>>>>>> problems existed at *every grade crossing*.
Bullshit
How would you know Rod?
I lived in Melburg for many years and visited it
lots of the time right thru that period and never
once ever got held up at a level crossing
You don't when you're on the train Rod!
I haven't used the train since I lived in Melburg as a kid
Things have changed in the past 100 years Rod.
I have been there in a car countless times since then, fuckwit
But I *lived there* until a mere 14 years ago.
And that from 1980. Ergo, my experience is in dealing with the system
and observing first hand the changes over time , a long time.
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
I'm afraid it is Rod. I have actually been there
and it's as hilly as a roller coaster,
and the roads are as convoluted as squashed toads' guts.
I wouldn't live there if the streets were paved with gold.
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
I'm afraid it is Rod. I have actually been there
I have lived there for years
and it's as hilly as a roller coaster,
Mindlessly silly
and the roads are as convoluted as squashed toads' guts.
yes
I wouldn't live there if the streets were paved with gold.
You are irrelevant
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, >>>>>>>>>>>> Sydney's hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate >>>>>>>>>>>> roads and rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and >>>>>>>>>>>> tunnels.
That mangles the real story too
No, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid grade >>>>>>>>>> crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
Bullshit
The proof is in the system as it now stands.
It says nothing like that hilly claim
Only need to drive around Sydney to verify.
Been doing that since before you were even born thanks
and streetview proved your claim is ignorant crap
Prove it.
Streetview does that
YOU made that ignorant claim
YOU get to prove that claim
THAT'S how it works
Not really,
Yes, really
my claim was that the NSW govt. own data showsvery few urban grade
crossings, 5 or 6 IIRC.
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
Why didn't Melbourne do this when they initially built the >>>>>>>>>>>> railways?
There was no need to
Initially, no, by the 60s and 70s the need became pressing in >>>>>>>>>> certain locations. As vehicular traffic became much more common, >>>>>>>>>> problems existed at *every grade crossing*.
Bullshit
How would you know Rod?
I lived in Melburg for many years and visited it
lots of the time right thru that period and never
once ever got held up at a level crossing
You don't when you're on the train Rod!
I haven't used the train since I lived in Melburg as a kid
Things have changed in the past 100 years Rod.
I have been there in a car countless times since then, fuckwit
But I *lived there* until a mere 14 years ago.
I have visited there heaps of times in that time
And that from 1980. Ergo, my experience is in dealing with the system
and observing first hand the changes over time , a long time.
And my experience in that time that it has changed fuck all in that time
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
I'm afraid it is Rod. I have actually been there
I have lived there for years
and it's as hilly as a roller coaster,
Mindlessly silly
and the roads are as convoluted as squashed toads' guts.
yes
Well, AI thinks your opinion is irrelevant,
AI Overview
Sydney is much more hilly than Melbourne.
Sydney features a complex, undulating terrain
ridges, and coastal cliffs.
Sydney: Characterized by steep, rolling hills, deep valleys, and dramatic drops down to waterways. Neighborhoods frequently demand steep
up-and-down walking or driving.
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
I'm afraid it is Rod. I have actually been there
I have lived there for years
and it's as hilly as a roller coaster,
Mindlessly silly
and the roads are as convoluted as squashed toads' guts.
yes
Well, AI thinks your opinion is irrelevant,
Bullshit it does
AI Overview
Sydney is much more hilly than Melbourne.
Doesn't mean that sydney is hilly, it isnt
Sydney features a complex, undulating terrain
That's not HILLY
built around an intricate natural harbor, sandstone
ridges, and coastal cliffs.
Sydney: Characterized by steep, rolling hills, deep valleys, and dramatic
drops down to waterways. Neighborhoods frequently demand steep
up-and-down walking or driving.
Bullshit
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:Ha! Rod shot down in flames yet again. Rod owes me many belly-crawl retractions and we can add this snafu to the list. How can he stand
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
I'm afraid it is Rod. I have actually been there
I have lived there for years
and it's as hilly as a roller coaster,
Mindlessly silly
and the roads are as convoluted as squashed toads' guts.
yes
I wouldn't live there if the streets were paved with gold.
You are irrelevant
Well, AI thinks your opinion is irrelevant,
AI Overview
Sydney is much more hilly than Melbourne. Sydney features a complex, >undulating terrain built around an intricate natural harbor, sandstone >ridges, and coastal cliffs.
In contrast, Melbourne sits on a much flatter, low-lying plain that >historically allowed for an organized street grid layout.
Terrain Differences
Sydney: Characterized by steep, rolling hills, deep valleys, and dramatic >drops down to waterways. Neighborhoods frequently demand steep up-and-down >walking or driving.
Melbourne: Built on a mostly flat geological terrain with gentle slopes, >making inner and outer suburbs much more uniform and level.
HTH Rod
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:Have fun listing any examples of that happening
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, >>>>>>>>>>>>> Sydney's hilly terrain made it easier historically to >>>>>>>>>>>>> separate
roads and rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and >>>>>>>>>>>>> tunnels.
YepNo,Yes, reallyNot really,Streetview does thatProve it.Been doing that since before you were even born thanksOnly need to drive around Sydney to verify.It says nothing like that hilly claimThe proof is in the system as it now stands.BullshitThat mangles the real story tooNo, the real story is that it was relatively easy to avoid >>>>>>>>>>> grade crossings in Sydney compared to Melbourne.
and streetview proved your claim is ignorant crap
YOU made that ignorant claim
YOU get to prove that claim
THAT'S how it works
my claim was that the NSW govt. own data showsvery few urban gradeWe are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
crossings, 5 or 6 IIRC.
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
YOU are trying to shift the goalpostsNo goalposts ever moved
now that you lost the argument on level crossings.That never happened on WHY sydney doesn't have
AI is informing you that yourCOre on apath to a hiding on this point as > well.Bullshit it does anything of the sort
So run along and argue with one of your alternateGo and fuck yourself, again and retake bullshitting 101
personalities, wonrCOt you?
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:Bullshit it does
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wroteAI disagrees with you,
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:Bullshit it does
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wroteWell, AI thinks your opinion is irrelevant,
I have lived there for yearsWe are NOW discussing your stupid ignorantI'm afraid it is Rod. I have actually been there
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
and it's as hilly as a roller coaster,Mindlessly silly
and the roads are as convoluted as squashed toads' guts.yes
ergo, your opinion is irrelevant.Even sillier than you usually manage and that's saying something
G,S & M.Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed drunken fantasys
BullshitIt does mean exactly that.AI OverviewDoesn't mean that sydney is hilly, it isnt
Sydney is much more hilly than Melbourne.
Both have hills, Sydney more so than Melbourne.Different matter entirely
Wrong, we have different words for a reason, fuckwitUndulating is indicative of hills.Sydney features a complex, undulating terrainThat's not HILLY
Not mountains, hills!There certainly are mountains to the west of sydney, but that's not sydney
No such animal in sydneySteep rolling hills,built around an intricate natural harbor, sandstoneBullshit
ridges, and coastal cliffs.
Sydney: Characterized by steep, rolling hills, deep valleys, and >>> dramatic
drops down to waterways. Neighborhoods frequently demand steep
up-and-down walking or driving.
deep valleys, dramatic drops to waterways,That's not hills, fuckwit
hilly in anyonerCOs book.Only in a fuckwit's book
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
I'm afraid it is Rod.-a-a I have actually been there
I have lived there for years
and it's as hilly as a roller coaster,
Mindlessly silly
and the roads are as convoluted as squashed-a-a toads' guts.
yes
Well, AI thinks your opinion is irrelevant,
Bullshit it does
AI disagrees with you,
Bullshit it does
ergo, your opinion is irrelevant.
Even sillier than you usually manage and that's saying something
G,S & M.
Just another of your pathetic little drug crazed drunken fantasys
AI Overview
Sydney is much more hilly than Melbourne.
Doesn't mean that sydney is hilly, it isnt
It does mean exactly that.
Bullshit
Both have hills, Sydney more so than-a-a Melbourne.
Different matter entirely
Sydney features a complex,-a-a undulating terrain
That's not HILLY
Undulating is indicative of hills.
Wrong, we have different words for a reason, fuckwit
Not mountains, hills!
There certainly are mountains to the west of sydney, but that's not sydney
built around an intricate natural harbor, sandstone
ridges, and coastal cliffs.
Sydney: Characterized by steep, rolling hills, deep valleys, and
dramatic
drops down to waterways. Neighborhoods frequently demand steep
up-and-down-a-a walking or driving.
Bullshit
Steep rolling hills,
No such animal in sydney
deep valleys, dramatic drops to waterways,
That's not hills, fuckwit
hilly in-a-a anyonerCOs book.
Only in a fuckwit's book
And can't cite even a single example of where--
that has meant that there was no need for a
LEVEL CROSSING there
On 12 Aug 2026 22:58:12 GMT, Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:Ha! Rod shot down in flames yet again. Rod owes me many belly-crawl retractions and we can add this snafu to the list. How can he stand
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
We are NOW discussing your stupid ignorant
claim that sydney is hilly. Pigs arse it is
I'm afraid it is Rod. I have actually been there
I have lived there for years
and it's as hilly as a roller coaster,
Mindlessly silly
and the roads are as convoluted as squashed toads' guts.
yes
I wouldn't live there if the streets were paved with gold.
You are irrelevant
Well, AI thinks your opinion is irrelevant,
AI Overview
Sydney is much more hilly than Melbourne. Sydney features a complex,
undulating terrain built around an intricate natural harbor, sandstone
ridges, and coastal cliffs.
In contrast, Melbourne sits on a much flatter, low-lying plain that
historically allowed for an organized street grid layout.
Terrain Differences
Sydney: Characterized by steep, rolling hills, deep valleys, and dramatic
drops down to waterways. Neighborhoods frequently demand steep up-and-down >> walking or driving.
Melbourne: Built on a mostly flat geological terrain with gentle slopes,
making inner and outer suburbs much more uniform and level.
HTH Rod
the SHAME!
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Sydney features a complex, undulating terrain
That's not HILLY
Undulating is indicative of hills.
Wrong, we have different words for a reason, fuckwit
AI Overview
Undulating terrain means a landscape that rises and falls
smoothly in a wave-like pattern.
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Sydney features a complex,-a-a undulating terrain
That's not HILLY
Undulating is indicative of hills.
-aWrong, we have different words for a reason, fuckwit
AI Overview
-a-a-a Undulating terrain means a landscape that rises and falls
-a-a-a smoothly in a wave-like pattern.
We have different words for a reason, fuckwit
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter Jason <pj@jostle.com> wrote
Sydney features a complex, undulating terrain
That's not HILLY
Undulating is indicative of hills.
Wrong, we have different words for a reason, fuckwit
AI Overview
Undulating terrain means a landscape that rises and falls
smoothly in a wave-like pattern.
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote--- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sydney's hilly terrain made it easier historically to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> separate
roads and rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> tunnels.
Have fun listing any examples of that happening
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
Rod Speed wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sydney's hilly terrain made it easier historically to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> separate
roads and rail using cuttings, embankments, bridges, and >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tunnels.
Have fun listing any examples of that happening
Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote
Xeno <xenolith@optusnet.com.au> wrote
There are several very good reasons for that. Firstly,
Sydney's hilly terrain made it easier historically to separate roads
and rail using cuttings, embankments,bridges, and tunnels.
Have fun listing any examples of that happening
Sure, first example is Central Station.
| Sysop: | Amessyroom |
|---|---|
| Location: | Fayetteville, NC |
| Users: | 74 |
| Nodes: | 6 (0 / 6) |
| Uptime: | 52:28:34 |
| Calls: | 1,101 |
| Calls today: | 1 |
| Files: | 1,339 |
| Messages: | 276,091 |