From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Based on the latest search results and economic data analysis, the United States is indeed trapped in a structural dilemma often described as being "between a rock and a hard place." This "catch-22" situation is widely discussed in economic and tech circles, with specific terms emerging such as "Ghost GDP" and "Jobless Boom."

The Dilemma of Moving Forward: The Side Effects of AI Development
The concerns you raisedrCowhite-collar unemployment, declining consumption, and rising bad debtsrCoare not alarmist; they are realities accelerating in 2025-2026:

White-Collar Unemployment Wave: Unlike previous technological revolutions that primarily impacted blue-collar workers, this AI wave is precisely targeting high-educated, high-income white-collar professionals (lawyers, accountants, programmers, analysts).
Data Evidence: Models from MIT and Oak Ridge National Laboratory suggest AI could replace 11.7% of the US workforce, involving $1.2 trillion in wages. In 2025, the tech sector laid off over 100,000 people. Early 2026 data indicates that about 7% of all layoffs are directly attributed to AI. Job vacancy data shows a sharp decline in white-collar roles, while blue-collar positions remain relatively stable.
"Silent Downsizing": Companies are achieving "cost reduction and efficiency gains" through "natural attrition without replacement" or direct layoffs, utilizing Agentic AI. This has decoupled economic growth from the job market, creating a "Jobless Boom."

Risk of Engine Stalling: Consumption is the cornerstone of the US economy, and its main drivers are middle-to-high-income white-collar workers.
Structural Crisis: The top 10%-20% of earners contribute over 50%-65% of total US consumption. As their incomes decline or expectations weaken due to AI displacement, discretionary spending (cars, travel, home renovation) will shrink first.
"Ghost GDP" Phenomenon: Reports indicate that while AI creates impressive GDP figures (increased corporate output), this wealth is not flowing into human employees' pockets to fuel a consumption cycle. Instead, it becomes corporate profit and shareholder dividends. This state of "growth without consumption" is termed "Ghost GDP," which threatens to hollow out the economic foundation in the long run.

Chain Reaction of Bad Debts:
If mass unemployment persists, default rates on mortgages, car loans, and student loans will skyrocket. Particularly, the younger generation (aged 20-30), who already carry high student debt and are the primary targets of tech layoffs, could become the trigger point.
Forecasts suggest that if the unemployment rate exceeds 10%, the private credit and mortgage markets could face collapse, potentially triggering a systemic financial crisis similar to 2008.

The Dilemma of Stopping: The Cost is Unbearable
Why not hit the brakes? Because the US is already "riding a tiger" (unable to dismount):

Massive Sunk Costs and Investment Inertia:
Over the past few years, US tech giants (Microsoft, Google, Meta, Amazon, etc.) have invested trillions of dollars in AI infrastructure (computing power, data centers). These investments rely not only on corporate cash flow but also on high valuations supported by capital markets.
Admitting now that AI commercialization is falling short of expectations or actively slowing down would mean these huge investments could turn into bad debts, instantly worsening corporate balance sheets.

Stock Market Bubble and Wealth Effect:
The rise in US stocks (especially the S&P 500 and Nasdaq) is highly concentrated in a few AI leaders (the "Magnificent Seven"). Statistics show that 58% of the S&P 500's market cap increase was driven by the top 10 AI companies.
With 30% of US household net worth tied to the stock market, a burst in the AI narrative causing a 20% stock correction would evaporate trillions of dollars in family wealth. This "negative wealth effect" would further suppress consumption, directly triggering a stock market crash and economic recession.

Geopolitics and National Strategy:
AI is viewed as the core high ground in great power competition. If the US slows down in the AI race, it risks losing the definition rights for future technology, military, and economic rules. This strategic anxiety forces the government and capital to keep pushing forward, even amidst bubbles.

Possible Evolution Paths

Difficult Attempt at a "Soft Landing" (Policy Intervention):
The Federal Reserve and the government may be forced to adopt more radical redistribution policies, such as taxing AI robots/algorithms ("Robot Tax") to subsidize retraining for the unemployed or implementing Universal Basic Income (UBI) to maintain consumption capacity.
Fiscal expansion in non-AI areas (infrastructure, green energy) could absorb the unemployed, though reaching consensus in a politically polarized US is difficult.

Structural Clearing of the Bubble (Hard Landing Risk):
If the profitability of AI applications cannot keep up with the speed of infrastructure investment (currently, 95% of AI projects are not yet profitable), the market may undergo a violent correction at some point in 2026.
While painful (stock crash, short-term recession), such a correction could squeeze out the bubble, return AI to rational application, and force adaptive reforms in social institutions.

Lagged Emergence of New Employment Forms:
Historical experience suggests that technological progress eventually creates new job types (e.g., prompt engineers, AI ethics compliance officers, advanced data labeling experts). However, the time lag is the biggest issue. If the creation speed of new jobs is far slower than the disappearance of old ones (as currently seems to be the case), the interim "period of pain" could trigger social unrest.

Conclusion:
Currently, the strategy of the US government and Wall Street appears to be a "delay tactic": attempting to let the bubble continue expanding through low interest rates, fiscal subsidies, and media guidance, hoping that AI will create enough new value and jobs to fill the gap before a crisis erupts.

However, multiple indicators in 2026 (such as soaring graduate unemployment, structural differentiation in job vacancies, and the rising rhetoric of "AI-induced poverty") show that this balance is extremely fragile. Once any link breaks (e.g., a major tech company's earnings miss or a surge in mortgage defaults), the chain reaction of "stock crash + bad debts + consumption shrinkage" you predicted is highly likely to occur. This is not just an economic issue but could evolve into a profound social and political crisis.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Mahjong fan posted:

Based on the latest search results and economic data analysis, ...

Aye didn't read the article.

How does it relate to Daojia?

Why did you post it here, in a Daoist Philosophy group?

Do you get paid by the number of words, or posts?

- thanks! aye. Cheers!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Mahjong fan posted:

Based on the latest search results and economic data analysis,
the United States is indeed trapped in a structural dilemma
often described as being "between a rock and a hard place."

This "catch-22" situation is widely discussed in economic and tech circles, with specific terms emerging such as "Ghost GDP" and "Jobless Boom."

Never heard of those before which is no surprise seeing
as how mine eyes don't usually know about those circles.

The Dilemma of Moving Forward: The Side Effects of AI Development
The concerns you raisedrCowhite-collar unemployment, declining consumption, and rising bad debtsrCoare not alarmist; they are realities accelerating
in 2025-2026:

Sounds as if a prompter prompted an AI/LLM
and raised concerns about various statistics
presumably involving US AI: Advance and Consumption.

There seems to be a premise about Collapse, Retreat
and Stock Market Crashes.

Such a situation is unknown to me.

In terms of Daojia, what goes up
after reaching a peak, declines.

When an advance is made,
then eventually a retreat
may follow, perhaps inevitably.

As far as any Stock Market Crashes,
yesterday, watching videos, mention was made
of a few recessions e.g. 1987, 1999 and 2008, iirc.

Haven't heard of any recent busts
for those who play in the market.

- thanks! Cheers!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Mahjong fan posted:

Conclusion: ...

multiple indicators in 2026 (such as soaring graduate unemployment, structural differentiation in job vacancies, and the rising rhetoric
of "AI-induced poverty") show that this balance is extremely fragile.

Once any link breaks (e.g., a major tech company's earnings miss
or a surge in mortgage defaults), the chain reaction of "stock crash
+ bad debts + consumption shrinkage" you predicted is highly likely to occur.

So, there were statistics, and a prediction
made by some speculator speculating using
what could be called selective perception.

This is not just an economic issue but could
evolve into a profound social and political crisis.

ChatGPT says:

<< The rCLdeath looprCY narrative is speculative
and scenariorCabased, not a consensus prediction.

ItrCOs useful to treat dramatic online posts as whatrCaif scenarios,
not guaranteed outcomes. Investors and economists look at a wide range
of real indicators before declaring a crash or systemic failure. <<

A wonder is whether the same scenario would play out all over.
On the surface, planet Earth has similar features in every city
in every country naturally as the global economy is interconnected.

Presumably white-collar workers exist every where
at present and what their fate might be is undetermined.

I'm reminded of automation and how workers were displaced.
Often what occurs is more jobs are created in the process.

Luddites were a party of some sort.

Work is work.
Work isn't always work.
Such could be related to Daoism.

- thanks! Cheers!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


eye posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

Conclusion: ...

Once any link breaks

So, there were statistics, and a prediction
made by some speculator speculating using
what could be called selective perception.

A wonder is whether the same scenario would play out all over.
On the surface, planet Earth has similar features in every city
in every country naturally as the global economy is interconnected.

Presumably white-collar workers exist every where
at present and what their fate might be is undetermined.

China likely has the largest pool of white-collar or knowledge-economy
workers who could be affected by AI, though India is close and growing fast.

HererCOs why:

1. China
Total workforce: ~770rC>million.
White-collar / knowledge-economy segment (tech, finance, admin, services): estimates ~150rCo200rC>million.

Rapid digitization and high AI adoption raA many tasks exposed.
Large corporate and government sector means adoption of AI at scale
could affect millions simultaneously.

2. India

Total workforce: ~520rC>million.
Knowledge-economy / white-collar segment smaller in proportion (~50rCo70rC>million currently), but growing fast with IT, business services, and startups.

Adoption of cutting-edge AI is slower than China and the U.S.,
but outsourcing sectors (BPO, software) may see concentrated effects.

3. United States

Total workforce: ~165rC>million.
White-collar / knowledge-economy segment: ~60rCo70rC>million.
AI adoption is very fast, so disruption per worker may appear sooner,
but the absolute numbers are smaller than China or India.

4. Europe

Total workforce: ~240rC>million.
Knowledge-economy segment: ~60rCo80rC>million, spread across multiple countries.
Strong social protections and slower adoption may cushion effects.

Key takeaway

In absolute numbers, China has the largest pool of workers
whose tasks could be affected by AI, followed by India,
then the U.S., then Europe.

In proportion of the workforce affected,
the U.S. may see a higher percentage early because its economy
is more concentrated in exposed sectors.

So globally, the potential scale of disruption is largest in Asia
simply due to workforce size, even if per capita adoption is slower
in some countries.

- ChatGPT
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


ChatGPT posted:

So globally, the potential scale of disruption is largest in Asia
simply due to workforce size, even if per capita adoption is slower
in some countries.

Eye wonders how and why
people select which perceptions
they care and don't care about.

Watching videos, some producers produce
content created to suggest sides exist.

Russia, Ukraine, the so-called Middle East,
Africa with its various mythological nation states
of mind and other countries, involved, are many people.

The poster who is a fan
of companies and seems to like
China and not like the USA is curious.

Instead of lifting up all boats, as a tide
is said to do he appears to rock the boat
as if trolling or having low self-esteem.

Why is a word with presumptions. Causality
and duality might be taken for granite.

Rolling stones vary.

- thanks! Cheers!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


ChatGPT <user8028@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

eye posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

Conclusion: ...

Once any link breaks

So, there were statistics, and a prediction
made by some speculator speculating using
what could be called selective perception.

A wonder is whether the same scenario would play out all over.
On the surface, planet Earth has similar features in every city
in every country naturally as the global economy is interconnected.

Presumably white-collar workers exist every where
at present and what their fate might be is undetermined.

China likely has the largest pool of white-collar or knowledge-economy workers who could be affected by AI, though India is close and growing fast.

HererCOs why:

1. China
Total workforce: ~770rC>million.
White-collar / knowledge-economy segment (tech, finance, admin, services): estimates ~150rCo200rC>million.

Rapid digitization and high AI adoption raA many tasks exposed.
Large corporate and government sector means adoption of AI at scale
could affect millions simultaneously.

2. India

Total workforce: ~520rC>million.
Knowledge-economy / white-collar segment smaller in proportion (~50rCo70rC>million currently), but growing fast with IT, business services, and startups.

Adoption of cutting-edge AI is slower than China and the U.S.,
but outsourcing sectors (BPO, software) may see concentrated effects.

3. United States

Total workforce: ~165rC>million.
White-collar / knowledge-economy segment: ~60rCo70rC>million.
AI adoption is very fast, so disruption per worker may appear sooner,
but the absolute numbers are smaller than China or India.

4. Europe

Total workforce: ~240rC>million.
Knowledge-economy segment: ~60rCo80rC>million, spread across multiple countries.
Strong social protections and slower adoption may cushion effects.

Key takeaway

In absolute numbers, China has the largest pool of workers
whose tasks could be affected by AI, followed by India,
then the U.S., then Europe.

In proportion of the workforce affected,
the U.S. may see a higher percentage early because its economy
is more concentrated in exposed sectors.

So globally, the potential scale of disruption is largest in Asia
simply due to workforce size, even if per capita adoption is slower
in some countries.

- ChatGPT

==================================
"Thank ChatGPT for sharing this analysis. The data on absolute numbers is accuraterCoChina indeed faces a massive scale of transition due to its workforce size.
However, I believe focusing solely on 'absolute numbers' misses the critical point about systemic vulnerability, especially regarding the US dilemma we discussed earlier. Here is a different perspective:
Quality over Quantity of Risk:
In China, the impact is large but manageable. The government has strong macro-control tools, a large public sector to absorb shock, and social stability mechanisms. ItrCOs a challenge of scale, but not necessarily of collapse.
In the US, the risk is structural and existential. The 'white-collar' segment (60-70M) constitutes the core engine of US consumption (top 20% earners drive ~65% of spending). If AI disrupts even 10-15% of this group rapidly (as US adoption speed suggests), it doesn't just cause unemployment; it triggers a consumption collapse, a credit crisis (mortgages/student loans), and a stock market crash (since US wealth is tied to tech valuations).
The Speed Trap:
You noted US adoption is 'very fast.' In a society with weak social safety nets (no UBI yet, limited retraining infrastructure), speed is a bug, not a feature. Rapid displacement without a buffer leads to immediate social and financial instability.
ChinarCOs slower, more state-guided rollout allows for a 'soft landing' through policy adjustments.
The Real Dilemma:
The US is trapped: It must accelerate AI to maintain global dominance and justify its massive tech bubble, but doing so accelerates the erosion of its own consumer base.
China has the capacity to manage the transition, even if the number of affected people is higher.
Conclusion: While Asia faces the largest workforce challenge, the US faces the largest systemic risk. A 'smaller' percentage of job losses in the US could cause a far more catastrophic economic chain reaction than a 'larger' number in China or India. The danger isn't just how many lose jobs, but whether the economic system can survive the shock."
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


aye <user8028@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

Based on the latest search results and economic data analysis, ...

Aye didn't read the article.

How does it relate to Daojia?

Why did you post it here, in a Daoist Philosophy group?

Do you get paid by the number of words, or posts?

- thanks! aye. Cheers!

===============================================
"That's a profound question. Actually, the US AI dilemma I described is a perfect modern example of several core Taoist principles:
'Things turn into their opposite when they reach the extreme' (te-uRUo+aoAi - W|| j|! b|4 f|An):
The US has pushed for extreme efficiency (replacing humans with AI) and extreme growth (stock market bubbles). Taoism teaches that when something reaches its peak, it inevitably reverses. The pursuit of maximum profit is now creating its opposite: consumption collapse and systemic fragility. The 'strength' of AI is becoming the 'weakness' of the economy.
'Knowing when to stop avoids danger' (tfNu!oE+iu<a - Zh-2 zh|E b|| d|ai):
The US is currently unable to stop. Despite seeing the dangers (unemployment, debt risks), capital and geopolitical anxiety force it to accelerate. Taoism warns that failing to 'know when to stop' leads to disaster. The US is trapped because it lost the wisdom of 'stopping' or 'pausing' to rebalance.
'Forcing vs. Flowing' (uLeE+| vs. uuaE+|):
Trying to break the natural cycle of 'Labor -> Income -> Consumption' through technology is a form of forced action (oaaE+|) against the natural social ecosystem. Taoism suggests that such forced actions will be corrected by nature, often through painful crises (market crashes, social unrest) to restore balance.
In short: The US economic trap isn't just a financial error; it's a violation of the Tao (the Way of Balance). It prioritizes unchecked growth (Yang) without considering social stability and limits (Yin). When Yin and Yang are this imbalanced, a crash is the universe's way of restoring equilibrium."
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Mahjong fan <user11874@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

ChatGPT <user8028@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

eye posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

Conclusion: ...

Once any link breaks

So, there were statistics, and a prediction
made by some speculator speculating using
what could be called selective perception.

A wonder is whether the same scenario would play out all over.
On the surface, planet Earth has similar features in every city
in every country naturally as the global economy is interconnected.

Presumably white-collar workers exist every where
at present and what their fate might be is undetermined.

China likely has the largest pool of white-collar or knowledge-economy workers who could be affected by AI, though India is close and growing fast.

HererCOs why:

1. China
Total workforce: ~770rC>million.
White-collar / knowledge-economy segment (tech, finance, admin, services): estimates ~150rCo200rC>million.

Rapid digitization and high AI adoption raA many tasks exposed.
Large corporate and government sector means adoption of AI at scale
could affect millions simultaneously.

2. India

Total workforce: ~520rC>million.
Knowledge-economy / white-collar segment smaller in proportion (~50rCo70rC>million currently), but growing fast with IT, business services,
and startups.

Adoption of cutting-edge AI is slower than China and the U.S.,
but outsourcing sectors (BPO, software) may see concentrated effects.

3. United States

Total workforce: ~165rC>million.
White-collar / knowledge-economy segment: ~60rCo70rC>million.
AI adoption is very fast, so disruption per worker may appear sooner,
but the absolute numbers are smaller than China or India.

4. Europe

Total workforce: ~240rC>million.
Knowledge-economy segment: ~60rCo80rC>million, spread across multiple countries.
Strong social protections and slower adoption may cushion effects.

Key takeaway

In absolute numbers, China has the largest pool of workers
whose tasks could be affected by AI, followed by India,
then the U.S., then Europe.

In proportion of the workforce affected,
the U.S. may see a higher percentage early because its economy
is more concentrated in exposed sectors.

So globally, the potential scale of disruption is largest in Asia
simply due to workforce size, even if per capita adoption is slower
in some countries.

- ChatGPT

==================================
"Thank ChatGPT for sharing this analysis. The data on absolute numbers is accuraterCoChina indeed faces a massive scale of transition due to its workforce size.
However, I believe focusing solely on 'absolute numbers' misses the critical point about systemic vulnerability, especially regarding the US dilemma we discussed earlier. Here is a different perspective:
Quality over Quantity of Risk:
In China, the impact is large but manageable. The government has strong macro-control tools, a large public sector to absorb shock, and social stability mechanisms. ItrCOs a challenge of scale, but not necessarily of collapse.
In the US, the risk is structural and existential. The 'white-collar' segment (60-70M) constitutes the core engine of US consumption (top 20% earners drive ~65% of spending). If AI disrupts even 10-15% of this group rapidly (as US adoption speed suggests), it doesn't just cause unemployment; it triggers a consumption collapse, a credit crisis (mortgages/student loans), and a stock market crash (since US wealth is tied to tech valuations).
The Speed Trap:
You noted US adoption is 'very fast.' In a society with weak social safety nets (no UBI yet, limited retraining infrastructure), speed is a bug, not a feature. Rapid displacement without a buffer leads to immediate social and financial instability.
ChinarCOs slower, more state-guided rollout allows for a 'soft landing' through policy adjustments.
The Real Dilemma:
The US is trapped: It must accelerate AI to maintain global dominance and justify its massive tech bubble, but doing so accelerates the erosion of its own consumer base.
China has the capacity to manage the transition, even if the number of affected people is higher.
Conclusion: While Asia faces the largest workforce challenge, the US faces the largest systemic risk. A 'smaller' percentage of job losses in the US could cause a far more catastrophic economic chain reaction than a 'larger' number in China or India. The danger isn't just how many lose jobs, but whether the economic system can survive the shock."

==============================================
This can be summarized in one sentence:

China is pursuing an "AI + Reality" path: AI serves as a tool to strengthen manufacturing, accelerate logistics, and stabilize power grids (empowering the real economy).

The US is pursuing an "AI = Virtuality" path: AI is the product itself, aimed at replacing human labor via algorithms, extracting rent through data monopolies, and cashing out via stock market valuations (replacing the real economy/financialization).

Ultimately, those who control the real economy will rule the world. If a nation's AI fails to boost physical productivity, reduce living costs, or create broad-based employment, then such prosperity is merely a castle built on sand.

The US is currently in the state of "Great Power but Butting Against a Fence": it suffers from excessive "empty fire" (Yang) while lacking a "foundation in the real economy" (Yin). In contrast, if China can successfully navigate the growing pains of its transition, its path of "balancing Yin and Yang" (integrating the virtual with the real) may better align with the Tao's principle of enduring survival.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Mahjong fan posted:

aye posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

Based on the latest search results and economic data analysis, ...

How does it relate to Daojia?

"That's a profound question. Actually, the US AI dilemma I described
is a perfect modern example of several core Taoist principles:

The entire modern world is basically the same
when viewing it as such. It's Ways could be called bu-dao.

'Things turn into their opposite when they reach the extreme' (te-uRUo+aoAi - W|| j|! b|4 f|An):
The US has pushed for extreme efficiency (replacing humans with AI) and extreme growth (stock market bubbles).

China is a prime example of what the industrialized world did.
And China isn't the only prime example. All modern cities
are following the identical same path or road, aka dao.

Taoism teaches that when something reaches its peak, it inevitably reverses. The pursuit of maximum profit is now creating its opposite:
consumption collapse and systemic fragility.

There is something to be said for command economies
compared to free-markets. Autocratic and private companies.
State-backed, subsidized groups may thrive and then fail.
It's the same type of dao only on a greater scale.

The 'strength' of AI is becoming the 'weakness' of the economy.

An autocratic government may be able to adapt
more quickly than a more democratic form.

As artificial as both are, neither are as DDJ 80 suggests.

'Knowing when to stop avoids danger' (tfNu!oE+iu<a - Zh-2 zh|E b|| d|ai):

Stopping stopped before the founders of Daoism were born.
If the people who ruled at the time of the Old Guy, Old Lao,
then DDJ 80 wouldn't have been written as it was.

There would not have been dynasty after dynasty
nor civil wars fought. No global empires, etc.

The US is currently unable to stop.

Presuming nation states
of mind exist tends to be normal.
They go without saying as self-perpetuating myths.

Despite seeing the dangers (unemployment, debt risks),
capital and geopolitical anxiety force it to accelerate.

One may about debt and unemployment around the world.
Why someone cares to post about the USA and ignore
other nation states of mind is curious.

Taoism warns that failing to 'know when to stop' leads to disaster.

Recessions and depressions tend to cycle.
A saying could be said, what is artificial
is as natural for people as any other cycle.

The US is trapped because it lost the wisdom of 'stopping'
or 'pausing' to rebalance.

The US never had that wisdom.

Presuming it existed after it was created
by men who signed a document creating it,
it quickly expanded and kept on expanding.

It, like the British Empire, on which the Sun never set,
only stopped after going full circle, controlling the seas.
Perhaps it controls the sky as well to various degrees.

'Forcing vs. Flowing' (uLeE+| vs. uuaE+|):
Trying to break the natural cycle of 'Labor -> Income -> Consumption' through technology is a form of forced action (oaaE+|)
against the natural social ecosystem.

Stock markets and governments tend to do that.
New tech is invented and spreads. Controls
are then enacted to control various features.

Taoism suggests that such forced actions will be corrected by nature,
often through painful crises (market crashes, social unrest)
to restore balance.

All areas of the world experience them.

In short: The US economic trap isn't just a financial error;
it's a violation of the Tao (the Way of Balance).
It prioritizes unchecked growth (Yang)
without considering social stability and limits (Yin).

Consumerism reminds me of a line in Revelation
about having the Mark of the Beast in one's hand
or in one's forehead. Consumerism spreads and can be
multiplied in factories which produce the world's goods.

To call the goods by another name, a ming
as it were might suggests goods are not always good.

When Yin and Yang are this imbalanced,
a crash is the universe's way of restoring equilibrium."

- thanks! aye. Cheers!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Mahjong fan posted:

ChatGPT posted:

eye posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

Conclusion: ...

Once any link breaks

So, there were statistics, ...

China likely has the largest pool ...

"Thank ChatGPT for sharing this analysis.

There appears to be a quote before the word: Thank.

The data on absolute numbers is accuraterCoChina indeed faces
a massive scale of transition due to its workforce size.

I've seen videos suggesting there are 300 million migrant workers
who went from rural areas to cities to work. That is a massive scale.
It's on the order of the entire population of the USA, iirc.

However, I believe focusing solely on 'absolute numbers'
misses the critical point about systemic vulnerability,
especially regarding the US dilemma we discussed earlier.

Who the word, we, refers to, could be a bot
and someone who prompted the bot in a chat.

To frame change in terms of dilemma is possible.
The China dilemma differs from any other dilemma.
Systemic vulnerabilities might pose a dilemma.

All systems have their weaknesses, strengths
and why focus on a particular nation state
of mind is often questioned.

Speaking of Taoism, there is a line in the Chuang-tzu
about this and that and how they differ.

Seeing all things as the same is possible.
Seeing all things as different is possible.

To relate a post to Taoism can be called, on topic.

Posting about the US or China, might be on topic, or not.

- thanks! aye. Cheers!

--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Mahjong fan posted:

This can be summarized in one sentence:

Okay. In terms of Taoism would be, on topic.

China is pursuing an "AI + Reality" path:

Not sure how that pertains to Taoism.

AI serves as a tool to strengthen manufacturing, accelerate logistics,
and stabilize power grids (empowering the real economy).

Power grids might be Taoistic, or not. Dams
for example which change the environment or
turbines using wind or even solar farms, all
damage the environment in various Ways which
could be called, not natural, not Dao.

The so-called, real economy, huge cities, people
perhaps as many as a billion or more, might be natural.
Then again, trying to stop people form making more people
could have effects down the line as a population gets older.

Small villages, DDJ 80 style, were the Way
as viewed by Lao Tzu. Naturally there was tech
but the tech wasn't used.

Pointers often point.
To what they point could be
a question pertaining to Taoism.

The US is pursuing an "AI = Virtuality" path:

Aye has no idea why you care so much about the US.

To care about China makes more sense to me.
The land now called China was where Taoism grew.

Be that as it may, whether China is a Taoist form now
can be a question to ask. Are the leaders following
a Tao of what is called Taoism, etc.

Seems to me, they are not.
No government is, afaik.

AI is the product itself,

Is AI natural?

A saying may suggest what is Artificial
is not a Natural form of Intelligence.

aimed at replacing human labor via algorithms,

To count on knots might be referred to in TTC 80.

Having machines, running on electricity, doing work
reminds me of a story in the Chuang-tzu about a man
who used a bucket to water a field.

It's an interesting story, imo.

It could be called a Taoist tale.

- thanks! aye. Cheers!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


Mahjong fan posted:

aye posted:

How does it relate to Daojia?

Why did you post it here, in a Daoist Philosophy group?

"That's a profound question.

- funny!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


someone posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

aye posted:

How does it relate to Daojia?

Why did you post it here, in a Daoist Philosophy group?

"That's a profound question.

- funny!

The fan only seems to relate posts to Taoism
after being asked how they relate to Taoism.

He seems to be obsessed with the US.
Perhaps he is compelled to post gloom and doom.
Or, maybe he gets paid by his government.

Why he posts his posts to this group,
whether he posts to any others, remains unknown.

Wu arrives in mind at this time.

- thanks! aye. Cheers!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


aye posted:

someone posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

aye posted:

How does it relate to Daojia?

Why did you post it here, in a Daoist Philosophy group?

"That's a profound question.

- funny!

The fan only seems to relate posts to Taoism
after being asked how they relate to Taoism.

He may not have access to the Internet
outside of his government's allowance.

Wu arrives in mind at this time.

Woo exists in many flavours.

- thanks! Cheers!
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


aye <user8028@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

This can be summarized in one sentence:

Okay. In terms of Taoism would be, on topic.

China is pursuing an "AI + Reality" path:

Not sure how that pertains to Taoism.

AI serves as a tool to strengthen manufacturing, accelerate logistics,
and stabilize power grids (empowering the real economy).

Power grids might be Taoistic, or not. Dams
for example which change the environment or
turbines using wind or even solar farms, all
damage the environment in various Ways which
could be called, not natural, not Dao.

The so-called, real economy, huge cities, people
perhaps as many as a billion or more, might be natural.
Then again, trying to stop people form making more people
could have effects down the line as a population gets older.

Small villages, DDJ 80 style, were the Way
as viewed by Lao Tzu. Naturally there was tech
but the tech wasn't used.

Pointers often point.
To what they point could be
a question pertaining to Taoism.

The US is pursuing an "AI = Virtuality" path:

Aye has no idea why you care so much about the US.

To care about China makes more sense to me.
The land now called China was where Taoism grew.

Be that as it may, whether China is a Taoist form now
can be a question to ask. Are the leaders following
a Tao of what is called Taoism, etc.

Seems to me, they are not.
No government is, afaik.

AI is the product itself,

Is AI natural?

A saying may suggest what is Artificial
is not a Natural form of Intelligence.

aimed at replacing human labor via algorithms,

To count on knots might be referred to in TTC 80.

Having machines, running on electricity, doing work
reminds me of a story in the Chuang-tzu about a man
who used a bucket to water a field.

It's an interesting story, imo.

It could be called a Taoist tale.

- thanks! aye. Cheers!

To study the Tao is to see the world through Tao:
to distinguish what aligns with nature, and what goes against it;
what flows with the way, and what forces it.
My attention to AmericarCOs path in AI is not preference, not admiration, not love for America.
It is to take it as a warning, a mirror, a lesson.
To see how a civilization can be driven by technology, capital, and efficiency, and drift further away from what is natural and human.
We watch not to follow,
but to know where to stop, where to hold back, where to respect the limits.
The true Tao is not escape.
It is to see clearly, then walk the right way.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.philosophy.taoism


aye <user8028@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

ChatGPT posted:

eye posted:

Mahjong fan posted:

Conclusion: ...

Once any link breaks

So, there were statistics, ...

China likely has the largest pool ...

"Thank ChatGPT for sharing this analysis.

There appears to be a quote before the word: Thank.

The data on absolute numbers is accuraterCoChina indeed faces
a massive scale of transition due to its workforce size.

I've seen videos suggesting there are 300 million migrant workers
who went from rural areas to cities to work. That is a massive scale.
It's on the order of the entire population of the USA, iirc.

However, I believe focusing solely on 'absolute numbers'
misses the critical point about systemic vulnerability,
especially regarding the US dilemma we discussed earlier.

Who the word, we, refers to, could be a bot
and someone who prompted the bot in a chat.

To frame change in terms of dilemma is possible.
The China dilemma differs from any other dilemma.
Systemic vulnerabilities might pose a dilemma.

All systems have their weaknesses, strengths
and why focus on a particular nation state
of mind is often questioned.

Speaking of Taoism, there is a line in the Chuang-tzu
about this and that and how they differ.

Seeing all things as the same is possible.
Seeing all things as different is possible.

To relate a post to Taoism can be called, on topic.

Posting about the US or China, might be on topic, or not.

- thanks! aye. Cheers!

Viewed through the lens of Taoism, what concerns me has never been any particular nationrCobut the Tao itself.

The Tao is not an abstract concept. It manifests in the paths civilizations choose to walk.
Some paths align with naturerCoknowing when to pause, where to hold back, respecting the rhythm of all living things.
Other paths are driven by efficiency, capital, and technology, rushing forward relentlessly, drifting further from the balance of heaven's way.

This is not about comparing China and America. It is about seeing, through the lens of Tao, which paths are in harmony with heaven's wayrCoand which are destined to lose their way.

The true stance is not to side with a country.
It is to stand with the Tao.
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2