• Betterbird bugs, it doesn't wanna start anymore.

    From Edmund@nomail@hotmail.com to alt.os.linux.mint on Sat Sep 19 19:01:57 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    Betterbird bugs, it doesn't wanna start anymore.

    AI tells me it is probably due to the fact it is using thunderbird
    settings and - surprise surprise - that creates problems.

    I look at it when en news mint release comes and I do an install without Thunderbird.

    BTW in the repositories I can choose ONE flatpack install, not a normal one.
    --
    Once an organization gains any influence, it will be corrupted from both within and without.

    Edmund

    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Paul@nospam@needed.invalid to alt.os.linux.mint on Sat Sep 19 14:40:55 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    On Sat, 9/19/2026 1:01 PM, Edmund wrote:
    Betterbird bugs, it doesn't wanna start anymore.

    AI tells me it is probably due to the fact it is using thunderbird settings and - surprise surprise - that creates problems.

    I look at it when en news mint release comes and I do an install without Thunderbird.

    BTW in the repositories I can choose ONE flatpack install, not a normal one.



    I don't see a Betterbird in Synaptic, but then I don't have
    any PPA added to Synaptic to change the situation either.

    You could open a Terminal and use a command line invocation, to
    see if there is any useful output from flatpak during the launch.
    For example, if the eu.betterbird.Betterbird flatpak executable
    was missing, then flatpak could likely tell you that.

    This is just to illustrate some command line invocations. You don't
    have to do these exact ones. It's to show how you can run it from Terminal. Right now, flatpak run eu.betterbird.Betterbird is plenty, because I tested that and it works.

    https://github.com/flathub/eu.betterbird.Betterbird

    "You can work around this issue by giving the Betterbird flatpak access to your complete home directory

    temporarily: by starting Betterbird using

    flatpak run --filesystem=home:rw eu.betterbird.Betterbird every time.

    permanently: by giving Betterbird the filesystem=home permission using the Flatseal app
    or by running

    flatpak override --user --filesystem=home eu.betterbird.Betterbird (once is enough).

    If the Betterbird code is erroring out, there may not be printf statements
    from Betterbird into the Terminal window.

    I think if I installed that here on my LM223, I'd probably have to do it
    with flatpak commands and via listing in flatpak, what versions or whatever were available. As I'm not seeing an entry in Synaptic right now (fresh install).

    But in any case, running it from the command line in a Terminal,
    is one thing you can do with any of the versions, as a start at debug.

    If the program is actually crashing, it has its own crash reporter, but
    whether that process would be visible in "top", it might be hidden by
    flatpak. I don't know the details of how anything works, in flatpak.

    1. [ ] eu.betterbird.Betterbird.Locale
    2. [ ] org.freedesktop.Platform.GL.default
    3. [ ] org.freedesktop.Platform.GL.default
    4. [ ] org.freedesktop.Platform.Locale
    5. [ ] org.freedesktop.Platform.codecs-extra
    6. [ ] org.gtk.Gtk3theme.Mint-Y-Aqua
    7. [/] org.freedesktop.Platform
    8. [ ] eu.betterbird.Betterbird

    Installing 7/8 ...

    I tried flatpak run eu.betterbird.Betterbird and
    the output to Terminal wasn't all that impressive.

    Summary:

    I think to debug this, I'd need something other than a Flatpak method.
    I'm not sure I can get the traction needed.
    And as it should be a multi-process application (more than one row in "top"),
    I might not even be able to attach to something useful to debug.

    And I hope you don't have some Thunderbird processes still running at
    the same time as Betterbird processes. If there is a lock file, indicating
    one program is in control of the profile folder, a second candidate is
    not going to like that, and will bail on the lock. That's assuming a Flatpak even uses a lock file.

    You could drop this question into alt.comp.software.thunderbird where
    Jorg might see it, but Jorg appreciates bug reports over on his own setup, rather than chasing stuff in a.c.s.t . And at this point, we don't have enough info to even file a bug report, as we have no idea at what level this is fouling up. Is flatpak busted ? As an example.

    That's why I'd rather find a way of running a .deb if I could.

    *******

    OK, you could use the Linux archive and unpack it in your Downloads folder.
    And this should not interfere with your other setup. It's a parallel portable path.
    Using archive manager, you unpack the .tar.xz . I tend to keep these in my Downloads folder, as I'm that lazy. I picked three files here, to show you we're in an executable folder. And many of the files will need 755 permissions to be executable (that's if the tar screwed up and they were 644 by accident).

    https://www.betterbird.eu/downloads/

    https://www.betterbird.eu/downloads/LinuxArchive/betterbird-153.3.0esr-bb9.en-US.linux-x86_64.tar.xz

    libxul.so 196,090,664 bytes
    betterbird 5,544 bytes <=== cd to the unpacked "tar" folder and run this as .\betterbird
    betterbird-bin 573,264 bytes <=== This is what it calls, you could attach to this process.
    You could edit the betterbird script 5,544 bytes, to inject the
    command to trace betterbird-bin .

    But even without modification, if you CD to the unpacked .tar.xz file,
    and do ./betterbird , you may get more useful output. For example, it is
    likely to complain about a dependency, it has quite a selection of .so
    in the directory as well, so if anything is missing, it might only be
    one item at most. It looks to be designed to be pretty self sufficient.
    Only some last moment version screwup might need fixing, if any.

    Anyway, I hope that gives you some leads on debugging and collecting
    what info you can, before bugging Jorg. When dealing with a small shop,
    you wanna throw them a bone, ya know -- give them what debug info you can.

    Paul
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Edmund@nomail@hotmail.com to alt.os.linux.mint on Sat Sep 19 21:02:14 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    On 9/19/26 20:40, Paul wrote:
    On Sat, 9/19/2026 1:01 PM, Edmund wrote:
    Betterbird bugs, it doesn't wanna start anymore.

    AI tells me it is probably due to the fact it is using thunderbird settings and - surprise surprise - that creates problems.

    I look at it when en news mint release comes and I do an install without Thunderbird.

    BTW in the repositories I can choose ONE flatpack install, not a normal one. >>


    I don't see a Betterbird in Synaptic, but then I don't have
    any PPA added to Synaptic to change the situation either.

    Thats funny, I do not see betterbird in Synaptic either, but I do see it
    in software manager.

    As always, thanks for your reply but I am not going to struggle with betterbird in my current XFCE mint.
    I will start over WHITHOUT TB in the next cinnamon version.

    You could open a Terminal and use a command line invocation, to
    see if there is any useful output from flatpak during the launch.
    For example, if the eu.betterbird.Betterbird flatpak executable
    was missing, then flatpak could likely tell you that.

    This is just to illustrate some command line invocations. You don't
    have to do these exact ones. It's to show how you can run it from Terminal. Right now, flatpak run eu.betterbird.Betterbird is plenty, because I tested
    that and it works.

    https://github.com/flathub/eu.betterbird.Betterbird

    "You can work around this issue by giving the Betterbird flatpak access to your complete home directory

    temporarily: by starting Betterbird using

    flatpak run --filesystem=home:rw eu.betterbird.Betterbird every time.

    permanently: by giving Betterbird the filesystem=home permission using the Flatseal app
    or by running

    flatpak override --user --filesystem=home eu.betterbird.Betterbird (once is enough).

    If the Betterbird code is erroring out, there may not be printf statements from Betterbird into the Terminal window.

    I think if I installed that here on my LM223, I'd probably have to do it
    with flatpak commands and via listing in flatpak, what versions or whatever were available. As I'm not seeing an entry in Synaptic right now (fresh install).

    But in any case, running it from the command line in a Terminal,
    is one thing you can do with any of the versions, as a start at debug.

    If the program is actually crashing, it has its own crash reporter, but whether that process would be visible in "top", it might be hidden by flatpak. I don't know the details of how anything works, in flatpak.

    1. [ ] eu.betterbird.Betterbird.Locale
    2. [ ] org.freedesktop.Platform.GL.default
    3. [ ] org.freedesktop.Platform.GL.default
    4. [ ] org.freedesktop.Platform.Locale
    5. [ ] org.freedesktop.Platform.codecs-extra
    6. [ ] org.gtk.Gtk3theme.Mint-Y-Aqua
    7. [/] org.freedesktop.Platform
    8. [ ] eu.betterbird.Betterbird

    Installing 7/8 ...

    I tried flatpak run eu.betterbird.Betterbird and
    the output to Terminal wasn't all that impressive.

    Summary:

    I think to debug this, I'd need something other than a Flatpak method.
    I'm not sure I can get the traction needed.
    And as it should be a multi-process application (more than one row in "top"),
    I might not even be able to attach to something useful to debug.

    And I hope you don't have some Thunderbird processes still running at
    the same time as Betterbird processes. If there is a lock file, indicating one program is in control of the profile folder, a second candidate is
    not going to like that, and will bail on the lock. That's assuming a Flatpak even uses a lock file.

    You could drop this question into alt.comp.software.thunderbird where Jorg might see it, but Jorg appreciates bug reports over on his own setup, rather than chasing stuff in a.c.s.t . And at this point, we don't have enough
    info to even file a bug report, as we have no idea at what level this is fouling up. Is flatpak busted ? As an example.

    That's why I'd rather find a way of running a .deb if I could.

    *******

    OK, you could use the Linux archive and unpack it in your Downloads folder. And this should not interfere with your other setup. It's a parallel portable path.
    Using archive manager, you unpack the .tar.xz . I tend to keep these in my Downloads folder, as I'm that lazy. I picked three files here, to show you we're in an executable folder. And many of the files will need 755 permissions
    to be executable (that's if the tar screwed up and they were 644 by accident).

    https://www.betterbird.eu/downloads/

    https://www.betterbird.eu/downloads/LinuxArchive/betterbird-153.3.0esr-bb9.en-US.linux-x86_64.tar.xz

    libxul.so 196,090,664 bytes
    betterbird 5,544 bytes <=== cd to the unpacked "tar" folder and run this as .\betterbird
    betterbird-bin 573,264 bytes <=== This is what it calls, you could attach to this process.
    You could edit the betterbird script 5,544 bytes, to inject the
    command to trace betterbird-bin .

    But even without modification, if you CD to the unpacked .tar.xz file,
    and do ./betterbird , you may get more useful output. For example, it is likely to complain about a dependency, it has quite a selection of .so
    in the directory as well, so if anything is missing, it might only be
    one item at most. It looks to be designed to be pretty self sufficient.
    Only some last moment version screwup might need fixing, if any.

    Anyway, I hope that gives you some leads on debugging and collecting
    what info you can, before bugging Jorg. When dealing with a small shop,
    you wanna throw them a bone, ya know -- give them what debug info you can.

    Paul
    --
    Once an organization gains any influence, it will be corrupted from both within and without.

    Edmund
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Mike Easter@MikeE@ster.invalid to alt.os.linux.mint on Sat Sep 19 12:34:35 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    Edmund wrote:
    BTW in the repositories I can choose ONE flatpack install, not a
    normal one.

    As I look around, not finding a .ppa for a .deb, I find the advice in
    the LM forum to 'recommend' the flatpak route, but one comment
    'embellishes' that idea w/ that of flathub's Warehouse.

    https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=431286
    How install Betterbird

    https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?p=2550056&sid=6457dba3ea84f3844511f79d6d70c203#p2550056

    https://flathub.org/en/apps/io.github.flattool.Warehouse

    Warehouse provides a simple UI to control complex Flatpak options,
    all without resorting to the command line.
    --
    Mike Easter
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Monsieur@Monsieur@notreal.invalid to alt.os.linux.mint on Sun Sep 20 09:45:38 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    Mike Easter wrote:
    Edmund wrote:
    BTW in the repositories I can choose ONE flatpack install, not a
    normal one.

    As I look around, not finding a .ppa for a .deb, I find the advice in
    the LM forum to 'recommend' the flatpak route, but one comment
    'embellishes' that idea w/ that of flathub's Warehouse.

    No idea how anyone could ever "recommend" flatpak - unless being flooded
    every day by countless updates of that annoying (and suspicious) thing
    called "org.freedesktop.Platform" is your idea of fun.

    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Edmund@nomail@hotmail.com to alt.os.linux.mint on Sun Sep 20 11:29:44 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    On 9/20/26 09:45, Monsieur wrote:
    Mike Easter wrote:
    Edmund wrote:
    BTW in the repositories I can choose ONE flatpack install, not a
    normal one.

    As I look around, not finding a .ppa for a .deb, I find the advice in
    the LM forum to 'recommend' the flatpak route, but one comment
    'embellishes' that idea w/ that of flathub's Warehouse.

    No idea how anyone could ever "recommend" flatpak - unless being flooded every day by countless updates of that annoying (and suspicious) thing called "org.freedesktop.Platform" is your idea of fun.


    See the insanity of our linux cut&paste coders

    https://search.brave.com/search?q=why+isn%27t+betterbird+using+my+settings+if+it+used+thunderbird+settings&conversation=099638f664fec94ee8d998b2179ac7a4e489

    it clearly demonstrates why linux always will be a chaotic mess.
    --
    Once an organization gains any influence, it will be corrupted from both within and without.

    Edmund
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Mike Easter@MikeE@ster.invalid to alt.os.linux.mint on Sun Sep 20 10:10:25 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    Edmund wrote:
    it clearly demonstrates why linux always will be a chaotic mess.

    Remember, Edmund, you don't know what 'linux' (really) is.
    --
    Mike Easter
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lawrence =?iso-8859-13?q?D=FFOliveiro?=@ldo@nz.invalid to alt.os.linux.mint on Mon Sep 21 01:15:24 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    On Sat, 19 Sep 2026 19:01:57 +0200, Edmund wrote:

    Betterbird bugs, it doesn't wanna start anymore.

    What error messages do you get?
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Edmund@nomail@hotmail.com to alt.os.linux.mint on Mon Sep 21 09:54:25 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.os.linux.mint

    On 9/21/26 03:15, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
    On Sat, 19 Sep 2026 19:01:57 +0200, Edmund wrote:

    Betterbird bugs, it doesn't wanna start anymore.

    What error messages do you get?

    Missing .... whatever I forgot.
    In the mean time I removed it, downloaded and installed another one
    which picked up my settings.
    So far so good.
    --
    Once an organization gains any influence, it will be corrupted from both within and without.

    Edmund
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2