• Usent history (was Re: This tiny gold crystal could bring quantum technology out of the deep freeze)

    From Kragen Javier Sitaker@kragen@canonical.org to sci.electronics.design,alt.folklore.computers on Sun Sep 6 11:08:46 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> writes:
    On 9/6/26 04:42, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    I think you have forgotten Bandygrams. There was never a time when
    everyone on Usenet was polite and reasonable. Knowledgeable, maybe.
    Kragen

    Since when do you know of usenet?

    I first posted to Usenet in 01992, but Bandygrams were in the early
    01980s. For a number of years, it was possible to read early Usenet via DejaNews and then Google Groups, but that does not work well anymore, so
    if you missed out on reading early 80s Usenet, it may be quite a while
    before you find out what a Bandygram is.

    Kragen
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson@johann@myrkraverk.invalid to alt.folklore.computers on Sun Sep 6 23:14:54 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On 06/09/2026 10:08 PM, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> writes:
    On 9/6/26 04:42, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    I think you have forgotten Bandygrams. There was never a time when
    everyone on Usenet was polite and reasonable. Knowledgeable, maybe.
    Kragen

    Since when do you know of usenet?

    I first posted to Usenet in 01992, but Bandygrams were in the early

    Is this octal 01992? How do you have nines in octal numbers?

    01980s. For a number of years, it was possible to read early Usenet via DejaNews and then Google Groups, but that does not work well anymore, so
    if you missed out on reading early 80s Usenet, it may be quite a while
    before you find out what a Bandygram is.

    Kragen

    I believe I first posted to Usenet in the early 00s, but probably knew
    about it in the late 90s, just didn't have internet at home. By the
    time I first entered university, I guess I used the university's access
    to Usenet, which has probably been shut down since.

    Later on, I used the ISP Usenet access, which I guess is also gone, but
    then I've moved countries since, and now use a commercial Usenet access
    because ISPs no longer provide this service -- or at least, I've never
    seen any ISP advertise it here, nor have I checked.

    Point being, Usenet used to be a standard offering of ISPs where I came
    from, but isn't anymore, and certainly isn't standard here.


    Best wishes, and happy Usenet!
    --
    Johann | email: invalid -> com | http://www.myrkraverk.com/blog/
    I'm not from the Internet, I just work there. | via Easynews.com https://bsky.app/profile/myrkraverk.bsky.social | for ( ;; ) _:;
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Peter Flass@Peter@Iron-Spring.com to alt.folklore.computers on Sun Sep 6 08:20:17 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On 9/6/26 07:08, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> writes:
    On 9/6/26 04:42, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    I think you have forgotten Bandygrams. There was never a time when
    everyone on Usenet was polite and reasonable. Knowledgeable, maybe.
    Kragen

    Since when do you know of usenet?

    I first posted to Usenet in 01992, but Bandygrams were in the early
    01980s. For a number of years, it was possible to read early Usenet via DejaNews and then Google Groups, but that does not work well anymore, so
    if you missed out on reading early 80s Usenet, it may be quite a while
    before you find out what a Bandygram is.

    Supposedly Google picked up all the posts from DejaNews,

    Craig - you might think you can't win, because no sooner do you offer
    this great service than we start pointing out problems, but, again,
    thank you!

    The way usenet is going this will probably soon be archive-only, because
    I see groups dropping out one by one.


    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Jeroen Belleman@jeroen@nospam.please to alt.folklore.computers on Sun Sep 6 20:09:05 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On 9/6/26 16:08, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> writes:
    On 9/6/26 04:42, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    I think you have forgotten Bandygrams. There was never a time when
    everyone on Usenet was polite and reasonable. Knowledgeable, maybe.
    Kragen

    Since when do you know of usenet?

    I first posted to Usenet in 01992, but Bandygrams were in the early
    01980s. For a number of years, it was possible to read early Usenet via DejaNews and then Google Groups, but that does not work well anymore, so
    if you missed out on reading early 80s Usenet, it may be quite a while
    before you find out what a Bandygram is.

    Kragen

    I discovered usenet in 1983 or so. I still remember the kremvax
    prank. I'd never heard of bandygrams, so it must have been some
    niche phenomenon. Not that it matters.

    Usenet people *were* polite and benevolent in those days. It didn't
    last very long, is true. Even 'rn' had a kill file.

    Jeroen Belleman
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Tapiro Ubriaco@interwebs.dude@gmail.com to alt.folklore.computers on Mon Sep 21 09:31:53 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On Sun, 6 Sep 2026 23:14:54 +0800, Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson wrote:


    Point being, Usenet used to be a standard offering of ISPs where I came
    from, but isn't anymore, and certainly isn't standard here.

    I remember it being standard well into the 00s.
    IIRC, most commercial Italian ISPs (where I live) have dropped it sometime around 2010-2015.

    A loss.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Tapiro Ubriaco@interwebs.dude@gmail.com to alt.folklore.computers on Mon Sep 21 09:33:56 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On Sun, 6 Sep 2026 20:09:05 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:


    Usenet people *were* polite and benevolent in those days. It didn't last
    very long, is true. Even 'rn' had a kill file.

    Have you tried, at least once, Facebook?

    And I'm not suggesting that you do.

    Just that if you'd made that mistake, your scale for "polite and
    benevolent" would end up readjusted in a way that would make the most
    toxic newsgroup look like tea with the Queen of England :-)
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Jeroen Belleman@jeroen@nospam.please to alt.folklore.computers on Mon Sep 21 15:28:34 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On 9/21/26 11:33, Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
    On Sun, 6 Sep 2026 20:09:05 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:


    Usenet people *were* polite and benevolent in those days. It didn't last
    very long, is true. Even 'rn' had a kill file.

    Have you tried, at least once, Facebook?

    And I'm not suggesting that you do.

    Just that if you'd made that mistake, your scale for "polite and
    benevolent" would end up readjusted in a way that would make the most
    toxic newsgroup look like tea with the Queen of England :-)

    You can't compare the present-day Facebook rabble with the
    early Usenet users. They aren't in the same league at all.

    I don't suppose you were around at the time. Discussions
    were interesting and informative. As I said, that didn't
    last very long.

    I've used Facebook in a corner where common decency was
    still the rule, but I found it messy and entirely unfit
    for purpose.

    Jeroen Belleman
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Charlie Gibbs@cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid to alt.folklore.computers on Mon Sep 21 16:02:13 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On 2026-09-21, Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sun, 6 Sep 2026 23:14:54 +0800, Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson wrote:

    Point being, Usenet used to be a standard offering of ISPs where I came
    from, but isn't anymore, and certainly isn't standard here.

    I remember it being standard well into the 00s.
    IIRC, most commercial Italian ISPs (where I live) have dropped it sometime around 2010-2015.

    A loss.

    Even worse, some hotel wi-fi connections block port 119.
    --
    /~\ Charlie Gibbs | In this world there are
    \ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | two kinds of people:
    X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | 1. Those who can extrapolate
    / \ if you read it the right way. | from incomplete data.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Chris Abraham@chris@gerriscorp.com to alt.folklore.computers on Mon Sep 21 12:22:01 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On Mon, 21 Sep 2026, Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
    Point being, Usenet used to be a standard offering of ISPs where I came
    from, but isn't anymore, and certainly isn't standard here.

    I remember it being standard well into the 00s.
    IIRC, most commercial Italian ISPs (where I live) have dropped it sometime around 2010-2015.

    A loss.

    I am back. Have not been here since the late 90s. Got a free account. Connected it to my Alpine install. And give it a go. I wonder if there
    will be a resurgence. Back in the day, I even created something like:

    alt.fan.chris-abraham
    alt.fan.chris.abraham

    Or something like that. I was nobody I just wanted to know if I could
    spawn it.

    https://9p.io/sources/contrib/sl/lib/newsgroups

    Cheers and hello again!

    Chris
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Chris Abraham@chris@gerriscorp.com to alt.folklore.computers on Mon Sep 21 12:27:26 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    This message is in MIME format. The first part should be readable text,
    while the remaining parts are likely unreadable without MIME-aware tools.

    --8323329-208983104-1790008053=:446672
    Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE

    On Mon, 21 Sep 2026, Jeroen Belleman wrote:
    You can't compare the present-day Facebook rabble with the
    early Usenet users. They aren't in the same league at all.

    Please excuse me shameless share:=20 https://biznology.com/2014/06/successful-snss-modeled-college-campus/

    Successful SNS=E2=80=99s should be modeled on the college campus (2014) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^=20
    The future of Social Network Services (SNS) can be discovered on High=20
    School and College campuses. I believe that topic-specific =E2=80=9Cvertica= l=E2=80=9D=20
    SNS=E2=80=99s are very important, but I also think that the model needs to = be=20
    University-like =E2=80=93 a modularized SNS. There needs to be a campus =E2= =80=9Cbrand=E2=80=9D=20
    (or University) within which the topic-specific =E2=80=9Cclubs,=E2=80=9D = =E2=80=9Chouses,=E2=80=9D=20
    =E2=80=9Cfraternities,=E2=80=9D =E2=80=9Cdorms,=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cinter= est groups=E2=80=9D can interact =E2=80=93 somewhere=20
    where crossovers, cross-fertilization, and aggregation are encouraged =E2= =80=93=20
    no, needs =E2=80=93 to happen. I hate SNS sites like cardomain.com =E2=80=
    =93 a site=20
    devoted to your favorite cars =E2=80=93 because I am not JUST a car guy.

    I am a car guy for sure but I am also interested in motorcycling, rowing,=
    =20
    training, running, in biking, in Thomas Pynchon, and in talk radio =E2=80= =93=20
    CarDoimain might be successful in the short term, but in the long-term,=20
    the real power would come from creating a open, creative, resource-rich=20 platform/campus/university/high school and maybe create a school of=20 engineering, a liberal arts school, a law school, a dining hall, and so=20 forth, but then allow the SNS to find itself.

    Facebook, Google+, reddit, and even Twitter does a beautiful job of doing=
    =20
    this, incidentally, allowing both the big tent generalist socialization=20
    and connection while also really being able to break into departments,=20 clubs, and little hidy-holes where you can enjoy an ad hoc get together=20
    with friends and co-conspirators.

    To allow the SNS and its members to find their own voice, their own=20 interests, and their own passions =E2=80=93 which may well be very differen=
    t from=20
    what is first assumed by the creator. Google gets this, though not yet=20 within the construct of the SNS=E2=80=99s. What Google did do successfully = was to=20
    buy USENET =E2=80=93 the original newsgroups =E2=80=93 and then build an su= perstructure on=20
    top of that =E2=80=93 make it modern, sustainable, durable, and more readab= le.

    Google returned USENET to relevance in a world that considered newsgroups=
    =20
    and IRC to be dead or dying. Each and every one of communities on USENET=20
    is amazingly vertical, but they could all back up and back out to the=20
    larger USENET community =E2=80=93 to the equivalent of the =E2=80=9Cwelcome=
    new students=E2=80=9D=20
    meetings and gatherings colleges offer to entering Freshmen.

    Communities that are too vertical tend to shoe horn the =E2=80=9Cgeneral to= pics=E2=80=9D=20
    conversations into hidden =E2=80=9Coff topic=E2=80=9D eddies. That is just = the opposite of=20
    what should be done. The conversation should be general,=20
    cross-pollinating, and then move, after a conversation starts, into=20
    another room.

    Start with an amazing platform, collect users, listen and watch them to=20
    see how they=E2=80=99re playing with the software application objects, widg= ets,=20
    and tools (are they playing with the toy or the box?), and then build for=
    =20
    the users base, withholding judgment. reddit is a case study for this:=20
    start small, grow organically, and allow your members to find themselves.

    The developers of reddit realized that after initial vertical growth based=
    =20
    on the general members of Digg, kuro5hin, and Slashdot (techie, geeky,=20 teens, boys), reddit would suffer from the same sort of vulnerabilities=20
    that Digg suffered when it didn=E2=80=99t evolve and grow and broaden itsel=
    f past=20
    =E2=80=9CNews for nerds. Stuff that matters.=E2=80=9D

    People love talking about Linux, but when happens when the Dow drops or=20
    the elections come? Where will the conversation happen? Where is the=20 =E2=80=9Ckitchen=E2=80=9D at the party where every eventually goes to just = talk about=20
    general interest stuff? Unless there are opportunities to express and=20
    share so-called =E2=80=9Coff-topic=E2=80=9D conversation right there, withi=
    n the community=20
    in which members are already committed, with members to whom they=E2=80=99r= e=20
    already committed, then they are bound to go elsewhere.

    Starting small and allowing the community to design itself is much=20
    different than starting big and losing one=E2=80=99s focus. Other mistakes = happen=20
    when community builders make assumptions as to what participants, members,=
    =20
    and lurkers want. Another mistake is putting a wall up around the=20
    community so that non-members cannot get a full feeling for the community=
    =20
    from without.

    The best SNS=E2=80=99s, virtual worlds, and online communities are honeypot=
    s. By=20
    honeypot, I am not suggesting, =E2=80=9Ca server that is configured to dete=
    ct an=20
    intruder by mirroring a real production system. It appears as an ordinary=
    =20
    server doing work, but all the data and transactions are phony. Located=20 either in or outside the firewall, the honeypot is used to learn about an=
    =20
    intruder=E2=80=99s techniques as well as determine vulnerabilities in the r= eal=20
    system.=E2=80=9D Although I am, sort of. The best SNS needs to be appealing= ,=20
    attractive, sweet, and compelling. Community-builders and SNS ASP=20
    developers need to be willing learn about member techniques, interests,=20 processes, and needs, as well as determine =E2=80=9Cvulnerabilities=E2=80=
    =9D in the SNS=20
    platform that may repel, turn off, or limit the evolution and growth of=20
    the community.

    To channel Chauncey Gardener for a second, one must do whatever one must=20
    to make sure that the earth in the garden is moist and well fed, one must=
    =20
    seed well and completely, one must keep the garden in sun and water, one=20 must encourage the garden to grow as it will for only in its growth will=20
    the garden be successful, and then, after rigorous growth, pruning and=20 weeding must be done, only in order to allow the garden to be healthy, not=
    =20
    to turn the garden into topiary. Okay, I am done.

    reddit allows all of these things. reddit is perfectly useful and=20
    compelling even as an alien, but it is way more fun and interesting when=20 you=E2=80=99re a citizen, that=E2=80=99s for sure. An SNS community needs t=
    o be as=20
    attractive as possible because exclusivity is no longer essential or even=
    =20
    valuable. What is valuable is =E2=80=9Cuseful,=E2=80=9D =E2=80=9Cinterestin= g,=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cauthentic.=E2=80=9D=20
    They also have to have community buy-in and the best enjoy a certain=20 fanatical devotion. Just like the best Universities and Colleges.

    And reddit allowed its member to tell it when it was time to evolve past=20 tech and geek news. reddit did not limit its scope or define itself too=20 tightly with being =E2=80=9Cgear for geeks=E2=80=9D or =E2=80=9Cnews for ne= rds.=E2=80=9D That would have=20
    ultimately been the death of reddit.

    What the best Universities (such as Yale) understand is that it is not the=
    =20
    student who is blessed and honored by being accepted by a top college=20
    (Yale College) but rather it is the college that should be blessed and=20 honored (and should be grateful) that such a quality student is accepting=
    =20
    its offers and actually attending =E2=80=93 choosing =E2=80=93 their partic= ular school:=20
    Yale instead of Princeton, Brown, Harvard, Oxford, Cambridge, Dartmouth,=20 Stanford, Columbia, Berkeley, etc=E2=80=A6

    Harvard, too, is aware that although in the short-term Harvard makes the=20 Harvard Man, over the long term, it is Harvard Men who made Harvard and=20 continue to make Harvard. =E2=80=9CWho have you graduated recently?=E2=80=
    =9D Unless the=20
    quality and character of its students and alumni remain top-drawer,=20
    Harvard is not guaranteed its position as =E2=80=9Ctop three=E2=80=9D in US=
    A Today=20
    alongside Princeton and Yale. No matter how grand its endowment.

    So, Harvard and Yale spoil their students rotten! My friends who attended=
    =20
    Harvard or Yale college swoon over those 4 years like I swoon over my=20
    first love.

    Likewise, SNS=E2=80=99s, virtual worlds, and virtual communities need to re= alize=20
    that at any one point, their brand is only as good as the collective that=
    =20
    is manifest in the users, the members, the lurkers, the stewards, and the=
    =20
    alumni of the property.

    This isn=E2=80=99t only true in SNS=E2=80=99s. The same thing can be said o=
    f the most=20
    successful message boards and online communities. The most important=20 distinction, I think, is that all of these =E2=80=9Crooms=E2=80=9D and all =
    of these=20
    =E2=80=9Cclubs=E2=80=9D and all of these spaces where (and are) defined and=
    created by the=20
    communities themselves. Sui generis. And this sort of ownership =E2=80=93 = =E2=80=9Cfor us=20
    by us,=E2=80=9D as the slogan goes over as Howard Rheingold=E2=80=99s Brain= storms=20
    community =E2=80=93 should never be underestimated.

    The Well has Howard Rheingold as a member and alumnus, for example, and=20
    the credibility of all that he has made and done; over time, more and more=
    =20
    virtual communities, virtual worlds, and SNS will be known for their=20
    members as well: who studies, who studied, and who wants to join.

    =E2=80=9CWhat=E2=80=99s in it for me=E2=80=9D (WIIFM) and the concept of pr= ide of ownership are=20
    important =E2=80=93 essential =E2=80=93 ingredients of a sustainable, deep,=
    thriving, and=20
    healthy community. The success Facebook is that the verticals are not=20
    (were not) defined for them by their grand architects =E2=80=93 they are=20 self-creating, self-forming, and also self-destructing. They form, reform,=
    =20
    mutate and disperse after they hit a limit of general conversation and=20
    then either break off and reform into an =E2=80=9Cinterest group=E2=80=9D o=
    r =E2=80=9Cclub=E2=80=9D or=20
    they self-check and work to =E2=80=9Cget back on topic.=E2=80=9D

    SNS=E2=80=99s and communities in general tend to be formed in one of two wa= ys:=20
    like Paris or like London. Intelligence Design (architecture) or Emergent=
    =20
    Design. The later never looks very beautiful or the way people =E2=80=93 or=
    the=20
    creators, investors, and architects =E2=80=93 expect (or want) it to look, = because=20
    investors and designers tend to not be able to control it =E2=80=93 and whe=
    n they=20
    do try to impost order, often in a heavy-handed way, they also tend to=20
    scare off all of their members, too.

    This organic revolution has proven its success online time and time again.=
    =20
    The Internet does not respond (well or at all) to command and control. The=
    =20
    smartest Web 2.0 platforms allow the =E2=80=9Cmasses of asses=E2=80=9D (yes=
    , the customer;=20
    yes, us) to define the platform and the experience =E2=80=93 their own and=
    =20
    collective environment and experience.

    Facebook does this amazingly well. Friendster and MySpace suffered from a=
    =20
    vision and used command and control tactics to try to coerce its users=20
    that =E2=80=9Cit didn=E2=80=99t really want to do things that way=E2=80=9D = and Friendster members=20
    abandoned in droves to platforms and experiences not so monitored by =E2=80= =9Cmom=20
    and dad.=E2=80=9D

    A command and control grand vision doesn=E2=80=99t work when you develop an= =20
    environment that needs to be truly both attractive and compelling much=20
    more than it needs to be informational or instructional. An SNS needs to=20
    be attractive, diversional, compelling, amusing, and entertaining =E2=80=93=
    never=20
    limiting.

    My analogy of college and high school never mentioned classrooms or=20
    classes for training or learning. People do enough of that at school and=20
    at work. An SNS needs to give its users a university campus without any=20 expectations or concepts of dropping out, getting judged, doing homework,=
    =20
    or being held accountable for anything.

    A good SNS should be all late-night wine-influenced discussions of=20
    Descartes and Plato and the summer afternoons on the quad and the time=20 playing Xbox with your roommates.

    When I go onto my long-term online communities, the Well, The Meta=20
    Network, USENET, and Brainstorms, there are many very deep and very=20
    vertical communities, discussing things as frivolous as fashion and video=
    =20
    games and as deep as how to survive cancer, how to get a post doc grant,=20
    and very deep discussions on =E2=80=9Cspirit,=E2=80=9D =E2=80=9Cchaos theor= y,=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9Cworld=20
    politics.=E2=80=9D

    What makes this amazing and sustainable is that there are an infinite=20
    number of ways to get along, to move into a space of intense conversation,=
    =20
    and then to pull back into common areas, just to see who=E2=80=99s around. =
    In a=20
    university setting, this could be the dining hall, the quad, the commons,=
    =20
    etc. These spaces are very important.

    If you think about all of this in terms of evolution, then we can think=20 about the way things evolve in the most perverse ways when isolated from=20 others of its kinds. So, if there are impervious walls =E2=80=93 gaps or vo= ids,=20
    mountains or ridges =E2=80=93 between these vertical markets, SNS=E2=80=99s=
    , and=20
    communities, then there may be an initial success, but there can also be a=
    =20
    terrible volatility. One plague or drought can decimate a population=20 completely.

    Having a commons allows members and visitors to have a place to meet new=20 people, have new experiences, and learn of new clubs, new opportunities,=20
    and new places =E2=80=93 inbreeding versus crossbreeding. Ultimately, a div= ersity=20
    of visitors helps build a more resilient, invested, and self-identifying=20 community. They will become =E2=80=9Cstudents for life=E2=80=9D at best and=
    proud alums at=20
    worst. They will carry the brand awareness, even if their lives become too=
    =20
    busy to participate any more.

    They will become life long brand ambassadors for your community. Proud=20 alumni.

    And, in terms of =E2=80=9Cviral marketing,=E2=80=9D it is also important wh=
    en it comes to=20
    a member of an SNS =E2=80=9Cinviting his friends=E2=80=9D =E2=80=93 not all=
    of my friends have the=20
    same vertical interests that I do=E2=80=A6 They could have very different=
    =20
    interests =E2=80=93 but as I explore the =E2=80=9Ccommons=E2=80=9D of an SN=
    S, I can note that=20
    there are things happening online that =E2=80=9Cfriend x=E2=80=9D and =E2= =80=9Cfriend y=E2=80=9D would=20
    love, and that would be my incentive to invite them on board.

    I am the only person I know in my entire community =E2=80=93 that is not tr= ue, my=20
    buddy has an Audi S4 =E2=80=93 who is into cars. My buddy is an Audi driver=
    and I=20
    am a BMW driver. Does that mean we=E2=80=99re both drivers? Does that mean =
    we love=20
    cars or our particular car? Do we cross over on performance sedans? On=20 German cars? On luxury cars?

    You have to offer the tools to allow the market to choose for itself,=20 otherwise, you might never find out that the SNS needs all three, or none=
    =20
    at all.

    A =E2=80=9CModularized SNS=E2=80=9D should be neutral like a university (un= like MySpace,=20
    which is pretty pre-defined as to what the demographic is), and there are=
    =20
    lots of =E2=80=9Cvertical niche SNS=E2=80=99s=E2=80=9D (e.g. car enthusiast=
    s, gourmet cooking,=20
    travel, Rolex fans, Republican politicos, etc.) That way, everyone can=20
    form a SNS experience that actually fits them by modularly assembling the=
    =20
    groups of people who have similar interests, (not just friends-in-common!)

    Got it? Go git =E2=80=99em, Tiger!
    --8323329-208983104-1790008053=:446672--
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Chris Abraham@chris@gerriscorp.com to alt.folklore.computers on Mon Sep 21 12:28:51 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On Mon, 21 Sep 2026, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
    Even worse, some hotel wi-fi connections block port 119.

    I am running my USENET client on a Digital Oceans droplet that I reach
    through Alpine. Really old school. Let the droplet proxy 119. This is
    really new to me but I am loving it.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From s|b@me@privacy.invalid to alt.folklore.computers on Mon Sep 21 20:53:12 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On Mon, 21 Sep 2026 09:31:53 -0000 (UTC), Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:

    I remember it being standard well into the 00s.
    IIRC, most commercial Italian ISPs (where I live) have dropped it sometime around 2010-2015.

    I learned about Usenet through the university servers somewhere in 1998.

    I got on Belgian cable (Telenet) in 2000. They had their own newsserver
    and even some internal pandora.* newsgroups. Users used to post binaries locally which didn't count as up/download.

    They ended this service on Dec 31 2011 claiming 'the Telenet Usenet
    Service was outdated/obsolete and that there were alternatives (Google Groups)'. A more likely reason was the upl/download of (illegal)
    binaries through their newsservers. By the end of each month everybody
    started up/downloading en masse and you could notice the speed going
    down. Good times. (-:
    --
    Horum omnium fortissimi sunt Belgae.
    - Julius Caesar
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lawrence =?iso-8859-13?q?D=FFOliveiro?=@ldo@nz.invalid to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 00:39:31 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On Mon, 21 Sep 2026 12:27:26 -0400, Chris Abraham wrote:

    Please excuse me shameless share: https://biznology.com/2014/06/successful-snss-modeled-college-campus/

    Successful SNSrCOs should be modeled on the college campus (2014) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    The future of Social Network Services (SNS) can be discovered on
    High School and College campuses. I believe that topic-specific rCLverticalrCY SNSrCOs are very important, but I also think that the model needs to be University-like rCo a modularized SNS.

    Anybody remember CoSy, from the 1980s? From the University of Guelph?
    BYTE magazine were using it for their online forums.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Joed Oakes@lost@noway.home.invalid to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 10:35:12 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On 9/21/26 20:39, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
    On Mon, 21 Sep 2026 12:27:26 -0400, Chris Abraham wrote:

    Please excuse me shameless share:
    https://biznology.com/2014/06/successful-snss-modeled-college-campus/

    Anybody remember CoSy, from the 1980s? From the University of Guelph?
    BYTE magazine were using it for their online forums.

    Not sure of the timeframe, but I seem to recall accessing something from
    Byte using the "Byte Information Exchange" (BIX) in what I believe was
    the late 1980s. Was this actually CoSy ???

    Boy the memory gets hazy after 40 years...
    --
    "Build a man a fire, and he's warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and
    he's warm for the rest of his life."

    - Terry Pratchett, Discworld
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Anton Antimo@anton@safunu.org to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 12:05:16 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> writes:

    On 06/09/2026 10:08 PM, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> writes:
    On 9/6/26 04:42, Kragen Javier Sitaker wrote:
    I think you have forgotten Bandygrams. There was never a time when
    everyone on Usenet was polite and reasonable. Knowledgeable, maybe.
    Kragen

    Since when do you know of usenet?
    I first posted to Usenet in 01992, but Bandygrams were in the early

    Is this octal 01992? How do you have nines in octal numbers?

    It can't be octal, right? Could it be that Kragen Javier Sitaker is
    reserving a digit place for when we reach year 10000? That can't be.
    But it would be amusing.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Anton Antimo@anton@safunu.org to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 12:06:19 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:

    On 2026-09-21, Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sun, 6 Sep 2026 23:14:54 +0800, Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson wrote:

    Point being, Usenet used to be a standard offering of ISPs where I came
    from, but isn't anymore, and certainly isn't standard here.

    I remember it being standard well into the 00s.
    IIRC, most commercial Italian ISPs (where I live) have dropped it sometime >> around 2010-2015.

    A loss.

    Even worse, some hotel wi-fi connections block port 119.

    That's ridiculous. They're probably blocking a long range of ports that
    119 falls in.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Anton Antimo@anton@safunu.org to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 12:44:48 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> writes:

    On Sun, 6 Sep 2026 20:09:05 +0200, Jeroen Belleman wrote:


    Usenet people *were* polite and benevolent in those days. It didn't last
    very long, is true. Even 'rn' had a kill file.

    Have you tried, at least once, Facebook?

    And I'm not suggesting that you do.

    Just that if you'd made that mistake, your scale for "polite and
    benevolent" would end up readjusted in a way that would make the most
    toxic newsgroup look like tea with the Queen of England :-)

    Funny---I would think otherwise. I'd think the anonymity of USENET is
    (on average) what allows for the rudeness, but what do I know?
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From drb@drb@ihatespam.msu.edu (Dennis Boone) to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 16:27:01 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    Anybody remember CoSy, from the 1980s? From the University of Guelph?
    BYTE magazine were using it for their online forums.

    Not sure of the timeframe, but I seem to recall accessing something from Byte using the "Byte Information Exchange" (BIX) in what I believe was
    the late 1980s. Was this actually CoSy ???

    Yes, BIX was a CoSy installation.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoSy

    De
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Charlie Gibbs@cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 17:00:22 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On 2026-09-22, Anton Antimo <anton@safunu.org> wrote:

    Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:

    On 2026-09-21, Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> wrote:

    On Sun, 6 Sep 2026 23:14:54 +0800, Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson wrote:

    Point being, Usenet used to be a standard offering of ISPs where I came >>>> from, but isn't anymore, and certainly isn't standard here.

    I remember it being standard well into the 00s.
    IIRC, most commercial Italian ISPs (where I live) have dropped it sometime >>> around 2010-2015.

    A loss.

    Even worse, some hotel wi-fi connections block port 119.

    That's ridiculous. They're probably blocking a long range of ports that
    119 falls in.

    You're no doubt right. That's more the way a security nazi would think.
    Still, it makes it a pain in the ass when you're on the road.
    --
    /~\ Charlie Gibbs | In this world there are
    \ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | two kinds of people:
    X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | 1. Those who can extrapolate
    / \ if you read it the right way. | from incomplete data.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lynn Wheeler@lynn@garlic.com to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 07:16:38 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    Lawrence DrCOOliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> writes:
    Anybody remember CoSy, from the 1980s? From the University of Guelph?
    BYTE magazine were using it for their online forums.

    Aug1976, TYMSHARE
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tymshare
    start offering their VM370/CMS-based computer conferencing system free
    to the IBM mainframe users group, SHARE https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHARE_(computing)

    archives here:
    http://vm.marist.edu/~vmshare

    I had cut a deal with TYMSHARE to get monthly tape dump of all VMSHARE
    files for putting up on IBM internal systems and network. Later when MD
    bought TYMSHARE, the SHARE organization had to come up with a way of
    rehosting the service.
    --
    virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lawrence =?iso-8859-13?q?D=FFOliveiro?=@ldo@nz.invalid to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 21:00:29 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On Tue, 22 Sep 2026 07:16:38 -1000, Lynn Wheeler wrote:

    Lawrence DrCOOliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> writes:

    Anybody remember CoSy, from the 1980s? From the University of
    Guelph? BYTE magazine were using it for their online forums.

    Aug1976, TYMSHARE
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tymshare
    start offering their VM370/CMS-based computer conferencing system free
    to the IBM mainframe users group, SHARE

    How did it compare to CoSy?

    Knowing IBM, it was probably pretty clunky to use ...
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lynn Wheeler@lynn@garlic.com to alt.folklore.computers on Tue Sep 22 13:15:31 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers


    Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> writes:
    Aug1976, TYMSHARE
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tymshare
    start offering their VM370/CMS-based computer conferencing system free
    to the IBM mainframe users group, SHARE https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHARE_(computing)

    archives here:
    http://vm.marist.edu/~vmshare


    TYMSHARE beginnings:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tymshare#Beginnings

    Other TYMSHARE:

    Ann Hardy https://medium.com/chmcore/someone-elses-computer-the-prehistory-of-cloud-computing-bca25645f89

    Ann Hardy is a crucial figure in the story of Tymshare and
    time-sharing. She began programming in the 1950s, developing software
    for the IBM Stretch supercomputer. Frustrated at the lack of opportunity
    and pay inequality for women at IBM -- at one point she discovered she
    was paid less than half of what the lowest-paid man reporting to her was
    paid -- Hardy left to study at the University of California, Berkeley,
    and then joined the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory in 1962. At
    the lab, one of her projects involved an early and surprisingly
    successful time-sharing operating system.

    Ann Hardy at Computer History Museum https://www.computerhistory.org/collections/catalog/102717167

    Ann rose up to become Vice President of the Integrated Systems Division
    at Tymshare, from 1976 to 1984, which did online airline reservations,
    home banking, and other applications. When Tymshare was acquired by McDonnell-Douglas in 1984, Ann's position as a female VP became
    untenable, and was eased out of the company by being encouraged to spin
    out Gnosis, a secure, capabilities-based operating system developed at Tymshare. Ann founded Key Logic, with funding from Gene Amdahl, which
    produced KeyKOS, based on Gnosis, for IBM and Amdahl mainframes. After
    closing Key Logic, Ann became a consultant, leading to her cofounding
    Agorics with members of Ted Nelson's Xanadu project

    ... snip ...

    ... trivia: 1984, I was brought in to do the evaluation of Gnosis as
    part of the spin-off

    GNOSIS: A Prototype Operating System for the 1990's http://cap-lore.com/CapTheory/upenn/Gnosis/Gnosis.html
    --
    virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Kurt Weiske@kurt.weiske@realitycheckbbs.org.remove-mtt-this to Charlie Gibbs on Thu Sep 24 07:44:38 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    To: Charlie Gibbs
    Charlie Gibbs wrote to alt.folklore.computers <=-

    That's ridiculous. They're probably blocking a long range of ports that
    119 falls in.

    You're no doubt right. That's more the way a security nazi would
    think. Still, it makes it a pain in the ass when you're on the road.

    Did I ever tell you about the time my company decided to route the
    entire 10.0.0.0 network through the VPN? There was *no* possibility
    anyone else was using that range internally!

    kurt weiske | kweiske at realitycheckbbs dot org
    | http://realitycheckbbs.org
    | 1:218/700@fidonet




    --- MultiMail/Win v0.52
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Win32 NewsLink 1.2
    * realitycheckBBS - Aptos, CA - telnet://realitycheckbbs.org
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Lawrence =?iso-8859-13?q?D=FFOliveiro?=@ldo@nz.invalid to alt.folklore.computers on Thu Sep 24 23:30:15 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.folklore.computers

    On Thu, 24 Sep 2026 07:44:38 -0700, Kurt Weiske wrote:

    Did I ever tell you about the time my company decided to route the
    entire 10.0.0.0 network through the VPN? There was *no* possibility
    anyone else was using that range internally!

    Stick your own routing functionrCa on the front, so only the parts yourCOre
    not using go through to their VPN.

    rCaNotice I said rCLrouting functionrCY, not rCLrouterrCY. It doesnrCOt have to be
    a separate box, just a set of rules in your packet filter.
    --- Synchronet 3.22a-Linux NewsLink 1.2