From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

from https://www.inc.com/chloe-aiello/why-elon-musk-sees-1-million-people-on-mars-by-2040s.html

Why Elon Musk Sees 1 Million People on Mars by the 2040s
The billionaire SpaceX CEO tasked scientists with designing domes and researching procreation with an eye towards colonizing the Red Planet.
BY CHLOE AIELLO, REPORTER @CHLOBO_ILO
JUL 11, 2024
Elon Musk.
Elon Musk. Photos: Getty Images
Elon Musk's interplanetary ambitions are reportedly still going strong.

The billionaire CEO of SpaceX and Tesla is ramping up plans for
mankind's arrival to Mars and then the planet's colonization, according
to a report from The New York Times. And on the back of successful tests
of his new Starship rocket and a massive pay bump at Tesla, he
reportedly believes it's all possible in about 20 years.

"There's high urgency to making life multi-planetary," he said,
according to The New York Times. "We've got to do it while civilization
is so strong."

One SpaceX employee told the Times that Musk said in April he
anticipates some one million people could live on the Red Planet in
about two decades. Musk has earned a reputation for setting ambitious timelines with projects and then failing to stick to them, such as the recently canceled dearMoon project with billionaire Yusaja Maezawa,
originally slated for 2023; the accelerated launch of Tesla's Robotaxi,
pushed back to an October unveiling; and more delayed initiatives, like
the Cybertruck.

Still, he's making preparations for Mars. Musk has reportedly tasked
SpaceX scientists with developing a host of new technologies for life in
outer space. He has teams researching dome habitations, space suits, and
even procreation in a potential Mars colony. One particularly graphic
detail from people familiar with Musk's plans is that he offered his own
sperm to help start the colony. Musk already has 12 children from three different mothers, The Daily Beast reported.

Musk is currently CEO of both SpaceX and electric vehicle company Tesla.
He also founded tunneling venture the Boring Company and brain implant
company Neuralink. He owns social media platform X, formerly Twitter,
and is also working on an artificial intelligence company, meant to be
an OpenAI competitor. Critics have questioned whether Musk's diversified business interests pose a conflict of interest--especially a recent
maneuver where he allocated Nvidia AI chips, originally meant for Tesla
to X. But what unifies many of these endeavors are his plans for Mars, according to the Times report.

The Times reported, for example, that Musk purchased X to research consensus-driven governments of the sort he envisions on Mars. SpaceX president and COO Gwynne Shotwell mentioned shared learnings among
Musk-run companies, telling CNBC in 2018 that "the Boring Company could
be the way we house people on Mars. We'll have to dig tunnels for folks."

Furthermore, Musk has hinted in various social media posts throughout
the years that a version of Tesla's stainless steel cybertruck could be
sent into space on Starship or even used on Mars.

"Tesla Cybertruck (pressurized edition) will be official truck of Mars,"
he posted on social media platform X, then Twitter, in 2019.

When fighting for his recent, massive compensation package at Tesla,
Musk even justified the roughly $50 billion pay package in court as
helping to fund the creation of a Martian colony. Not only does Musk now
have the additional resources he claimed he needed, but also his ride to
Mars is closer to viability than ever. In June, SpaceX's Starship
megarocket completed its first successful test flight. On its website,
SpaceX describes Starship's future as carrying "up to 100 people on long-duration, interplanetary flights."

RELATED STORIES
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The Smartest Thing Apple Announced at WWDC Has Nothing to Do With AI
3 Lessons for Navigating the AI Transformation

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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

"a425couple" wrote in message news:tickO.11338$ySE.7189@fx11.iad...

from https://www.inc.com/chloe-aiello/why-elon-musk-sees-1-million-people-on-mars-by-2040s.html

Why Elon Musk Sees 1 Million People on Mars by the 2040s

------------------------------------------------------
Are these the million people trying to colonize the Sahara?

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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

Read too much bad scifi.
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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

On 7/12/24 09:34, Jim Wilkins wrote:

"a425couple"-a wrote in message news:tickO.11338$ySE.7189@fx11.iad...

from https://www.inc.com/chloe-aiello/why-elon-musk-sees-1-million-people-on-mars-by-2040s.html

Why Elon Musk Sees 1 Million People on Mars by the 2040s

------------------------------------------------------
Are these the million people trying to colonize the Sahara?

I do not know.

I think somewhere was a quote, I can not remember well enough.
But Google gave me this that is on the general topic:

r/IsaacArthur icon
Go to IsaacArthur
r/IsaacArthur
rCo
3 yr. ago
D3cepti0ns

To all the people that would choose to live on Mars but not in
Antarctica, why?
I just don't understand why anybody would actually want to live on Mars.
I don't think people quite understand how desolate it is. Antarctica is
a thousand times more hospitable, but you don't see people volunteering
to move there. You want oxygen, higher temps, abundant water, agreeable gravity, radiation protection, fast communication? Mars isn't probably
for you.

If you'd volunteer to live on Mars but not in the middle of Antarctica
you seriously misunderstand the situation you are so excited to
volunteer for. I don't think anyone will be living on Mars before anyone
is living in Antarctica.



Best

Search Comments
Expand comment search
u/Flaxinator avatar
Flaxinator
rCo
3y ago
People don't want to go there for the comfort and amenities, they want
to go because it is a different planet. They want to be part of the next
great leap for humankind, even if it means discomfort and hardship.



u/Harbingerx81 avatar
Harbingerx81
rCo
3y ago
It saddens me how many people find this so hard to understand.


Upvote
28



u/MandatoryFunEscapee avatar
MandatoryFunEscapee
rCo
3y ago
Humans haven't had to pioneer a new frontier in a while now. I would not
go on one of the first missions, but I would go on one of the first 20
or so, if given the chance.

The opportunities, the discoveries, the adventure sounds incredible.
I've deployed with the military a few times. I can sleep anywhere, carry
all my stuff in a ruck, I'm used to uncomfortable rides and wearing
equipment to counter rough environments. Going to Mars is orders of
magnitude more difficult and intense than anything I've ever done, but I
bet I would truly feel alive again in a way I haven't in years, and may
never feel again.

That alone is worth the risk.

theistdoge
rCo
3y ago
rCo
Edited 3y ago
I'm not going to volunteer to live on Mars, but I can point out at least
a few things:

The Antarctic Treaty System makes it really, really difficult to legally settle Antarctica.

Antarctica actually do have residents all year round. Amundsen-Scott
base on the south pole for example. There are even a few people born on
the continent.

Mars doesn't have a 6 month long night, so you can have solar all year
round.

Mars doesn't have the kinds of storms that can make you unable to walk
outside and will blow you away if you're caught unawares.

Mars doesn't have the kind of ice that literally bury your station over
the winter. It has dust that would cover it in a layer, but that's a lot easier to handle.

Temperatures are similar, but conduction/convection through the Mars atmosphere is much, much slower. So staying warm is lots easier. In some cases, you may have a problem cooling down.

What it does have in common is radiation - Mars is a harsher, but the
poles are also significant.

Mars is harsh, but it's not all the same things and in some ways the
Martian harshness is easier to handle. Curiosity wouldn't have survived
a week on Antarctica, let alone 8 years - and I don't know if we could
even build a rover that survives 8 years there.

Despite all this, I think there would be some people who would have
tried to set up shop on Antarctica if it weren't for the ATS. We are > 6 billion people and you're going to find some percentage (however small)
that would like that kind of thing. Same is going to apply to Mars.

You want oxygen, higher temps, abundant water, agreeable gravity,
radiation protection, fast communication?

What you're saying is you can't go outside with only a t-shirt and jeans
on and you can't talk with your old mum in real time or google cat
memes. Everyone that wants to go already knows that and still wants to.
What you're doing is pointing out your own preferences and assuming it
applies to literally everyone.

agreeable gravity

Question is how would partial gravity affect reproduction? Muscle/bone
atrophy is not a huge issue since any martians will be doing lots of
hard physical labor, especially in the beginning.



19 more replies
u/Ilyushenka avatar
Ilyushenka
rCo
3y ago
People who want to go to Mars are not doing it for the comfort, they are
doing it because they want to be part of something important. Astronauts
who travel to the ISS face discomfort and danger for up to a year, yet
most of them would say itrCOs one of the most rewarding and fulfilling experiences in life.

Colonizing Antarctica wonrCOt provide much tangible benefit to humanity
(aside from the research werCOre already doing), but Mars will help us in
lots of ways. Learning to terraform Mars and turn barren regolith into
soil will help us learn to use earthrCOs resources more efficiently. Mars
will also act as a helpful launchpad for exploring the rest of the solar system, since we can potentially launch rockets from there more cheaply because of the lower gravity. Finally, a self sustaining civilization on
Mars would help safeguard humanity against catastrophe.



[deleted]
Titanosaurus
rCo
3y ago
Whoa whoa whoa. LetrCOs not get too pretentious with our thoughts.
Antarctica is the last part of earth to colonize. ThererCOs untapped
resources that can last humanity 100s if not thousands of years. ItrCOs a continent, not some deserted island in the middle of the pacific.

There is a lot of benefit to humanity in Antarctica.


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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

On 7/13/24 06:27, bertietaylor wrote:

Read too much bad scifi.

Perhaps.
Or, perhaps a unusually capable man who really wants in
his life to make a change in humanity.



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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

"a425couple" wrote in message news:jSxkO.28112$xYQc.4243@fx12.iad...

On 7/13/24 06:27, bertietaylor wrote:

Read too much bad scifi.

Perhaps.
Or, perhaps a unusually capable man who really wants in
his life to make a change in humanity.

-------------------------------

The list of such men includes Ford and Edison but also Napoleon Bonaparte
and Julius Caesar.



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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

In alt.astronomy a425couple <a425couple@hotmail.com> wrote:

On 7/12/24 09:34, Jim Wilkins wrote:

"a425couple"?? wrote in message news:tickO.11338$ySE.7189@fx11.iad...

from
https://www.inc.com/chloe-aiello/why-elon-musk-sees-1-million-people-on-mars-by-2040s.html

Why Elon Musk Sees 1 Million People on Mars by the 2040s

------------------------------------------------------
Are these the million people trying to colonize the Sahara?

I do not know.

I think somewhere was a quote, I can not remember well enough.
But Google gave me this that is on the general topic:

r/IsaacArthur icon
Go to IsaacArthur
r/IsaacArthur
???
3 yr. ago
D3cepti0ns

To all the people that would choose to live on Mars but not in
Antarctica, why?

...

False premise. People volunteer to live in Antartica all the time.
1000 people live there all year and the pop in summer gets up to 4000.
Larger numbers are against international law.

The only people that go there against their will are various militaries. Scientists and support staff are in theory 100% voluntary.
I did public service exams sometime in highschool and was offered
a position at some Antartic base but I whimped out and did a job
digging latrines in Indochina instead. Later I did volunteer for
another little job in Spitzbergen (pop of the whole region around 1000)
on the Arctic circle and it was a pretty +ve experience.

Colonising Mars will not be easy and that's probably a good thing.
The conditions are so hard and the place is so remote it will
quickly diverge from Earth customs pretty fast much like Australia
did from Britain. Just cross fingers they dont make the same kinda
mess the Brits did to the antipodes.

--
[Motor vehicles will never ever ever be a thing!]
Horatio Nelson Jackson (March 25, 1872 - January 14, 1955) was an American physician [b Toronto] and automobile pioneer. In 1903, he and driving
partner Sewall K. Crocker became the first people to drive an automobile across the United States.
[The journey took around 63 days, used 800 gal of gas for their 2nd hand 2
cyl Winton, and cost around $210,000 in 2016 dollars].
-- wikipedia

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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

"R Kym Horsell" wrote in message news:v6uqoo$1ta0$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com...

[Motor vehicles will never ever ever be a thing!]
Horatio Nelson Jackson (March 25, 1872 - January 14, 1955) was an American physician [b Toronto] and automobile pioneer. In 1903, he and driving
partner Sewall K. Crocker became the first people to drive an automobile
across the United States.
[The journey took around 63 days, used 800 gal of gas for their 2nd hand 2
cyl Winton, and cost around $210,000 in 2016 dollars].
-- wikipedia

---------------------------------------- https://www.pbs.org/kenburns/horatios-drive/

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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

R Kym Horsell wrote on 14/7/24 7:15 am:

<Snip>

Colonising Mars will not be easy and that's probably a good thing.
The conditions are so hard and the place is so remote it will
quickly diverge from Earth customs pretty fast much like Australia
did from Britain.

Australia 'diverge' from Britian!! You have got to be joking! Unlike The
U.S. of A. (and Europe and just about everywhere else on Earth), we in Australia drive on THE CORRECT SIDE OF THE ROAD (which isn't the RIGHT
side) .... and we spell words the correct way (Well the older
generations do, those that haven't been so influenced by U.S. of A.
T.V.!!) ;-P
--
Daniel
--- Synchronet 3.21d-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

On Sat, 13 Jul 2024 16:23:42 +0000, a425couple wrote:

On 7/13/24 06:27, bertietaylor wrote:

Read too much bad scifi.

Perhaps.
Or, perhaps a unusually capable man who really wants in
his life to make a change in humanity.

He is a disaster. His rockets pollute the upper atmosphere to accelerate greenhouse effect many times over. Rockets are for fireworks. Not space travel. For that there will be Arindam's reactionless motors and his new physics upgrading Newton's laws of motion.

Woof-woof

What fools these bipeds be!

Bertietaylor
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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

"Daniel70" wrote in message news:v6vq9g$1bd2$1@dont-email.me...

R Kym Horsell wrote on 14/7/24 7:15 am:

<Snip>

Colonising Mars will not be easy and that's probably a good thing.
The conditions are so hard and the place is so remote it will
quickly diverge from Earth customs pretty fast much like Australia
did from Britain.

Australia 'diverge' from Britian!! You have got to be joking! Unlike The
U.S. of A. (and Europe and just about everywhere else on Earth), we in Australia drive on THE CORRECT SIDE OF THE ROAD (which isn't the RIGHT
side) .... and we spell words the correct way (Well the older
generations do, those that haven't been so influenced by U.S. of A.
T.V.!!) ;-P
--
Daniel
----------------------------- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_gauge_in_Australia

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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

Jim Wilkins wrote on 14/7/24 9:23 pm:

"Daniel70"-a wrote in message news:v6vq9g$1bd2$1@dont-email.me...
R Kym Horsell wrote on 14/7/24 7:15 am:

<Snip>

Colonising Mars will not be easy and that's probably a good thing.
The conditions are so hard and the place is so remote it will
quickly diverge from Earth customs pretty fast much like Australia
did from Britain.

Australia 'diverge' from Britian!! You have got to be joking! Unlike The U.S. of A. (and Europe and just about everywhere else on Earth), we in Australia drive on THE CORRECT SIDE OF THE ROAD (which isn't the RIGHT
side) .... and we spell words the correct way (Well the older
generations do, those that haven't been so influenced by U.S. of A.
T.V.!!) ;-P

.... and then Jim Wilkins posted a link to

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_gauge_in_Australia

about the various Rail Gauges in Australia due to each of the former
Colonies not wanting to follow the lead of any of the other Colonies.

For that reason, the Albury Railway Station https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albury_railway_station was reputed to be
the Longest Railway Station in The World because it had to be long
enough to handle two trains, a New South Wales Railways STANDARD GUAGE
(4ft 8inch, I think) Train as well as a Victorian Railways BROAD GUAGE
(5ft 3inch) Train, at the same time.
-
Daniel
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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

"Daniel70" wrote in message news:v72q5p$kv16$1@dont-email.me...

.... and then Jim Wilkins posted a link to

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_gauge_in_Australia

about the various Rail Gauges in Australia due to each of the former
Colonies not wanting to follow the lead of any of the other Colonies.

For that reason, the Albury Railway Station https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albury_railway_station was reputed to be
the Longest Railway Station in The World because it had to be long
enough to handle two trains, a New South Wales Railways STANDARD GUAGE
(4ft 8inch, I think) Train as well as a Victorian Railways BROAD GUAGE
(5ft 3inch) Train, at the same time.
-
Daniel
-----------------------------------
Is GUAGE the British spelling?

That is an example of leaders with strongly held opinions disagreeing
because they weigh the values of choices differently. The same could easily happen with promoters and volunteers of space colonies, as it did to the
early English colonies in America.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Williams

"Williams was expelled by the Puritan leaders from the Massachusetts Bay Colony, and he established Providence Plantations in 1636 as a refuge
offering what he termed "liberty of conscience".

Only those who don't fit well into established society will be tempted to leave it, self-reliant independent spirits want to stay that way. Most
Utopian communities fell apart from disagreement. https://memoriesoftheprairie.com/blog-1/2023/06/21/robert-owens-innovative-new-harmony-indiana-utopia/

rCLI doubt whether those who have been comfortable and content in their old mode of life, will find an increase of enjoyment when they come here. How
long it will require to accustom themselves to their new mode of living, I
am unable to determine.rCY

"He never gave up on his dream, but he realized that at New Harmony, he underestimated the complexity of his fellow human beings."

And that's the underlying failure of socialism, it needs to depend on the people it's not fit for.

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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

In alt.astronomy Jim Wilkins <muratlanne@gmail.com> wrote:

"Daniel70" wrote in message news:v6vq9g$1bd2$1@dont-email.me...

R Kym Horsell wrote on 14/7/24 7:15 am:

<Snip>

Colonising Mars will not be easy and that's probably a good thing.
The conditions are so hard and the place is so remote it will
quickly diverge from Earth customs pretty fast much like Australia
did from Britain.

Australia 'diverge' from Britian!! You have got to be joking! Unlike The U.S. of A. (and Europe and just about everywhere else on Earth), we in Australia drive on THE CORRECT SIDE OF THE ROAD (which isn't the RIGHT
side) .... and we spell words the correct way (Well the older
generations do, those that haven't been so influenced by U.S. of A.
T.V.!!) ;-P

....

Classifying the "old country" as POMEland, compulsory voting, incomprehandible local termanology for everything, female franchise ,
public nudity, and bathing in the ocean during daylight hrs are just the
start of a long list of "divergences".

A recent grab from TV has Will Smith approach a voluptuous woman
sitting at a bar in a swimsuit. Will tells her to "cover up"
because there are "peole... AUSTRALIAN people" present that might be offended. The joke is of course Australians have a very non-Egnlish attitude
to public nudity.

From the early days in the colonies it was illegal to bathe in the ocean
during daylight hours because it offended the public decency. Back home.

But Australians quickly developed an orientation for disregarding any
damn POME law that didnt make sense and did so en masse.

Not only did they proceed to bath in the ocean every day and any damn time they felt like it they also liked to dispense with the neck-to-knee swimming costumes the English favored. Eventually leading to the "universal"
adoption of the biniki and budgeesmuggler.

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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

"R Kym Horsell" wrote in message news:v734r4$2f4c$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com...

Classifying the "old country" as POMEland, compulsory voting,
incomprehandible local termanology for everything, female franchise ,
public nudity, and bathing in the ocean during daylight hrs are just the
start of a long list of "divergences".

A recent grab from TV has Will Smith approach a voluptuous woman
sitting at a bar in a swimsuit. Will tells her to "cover up"
because there are "peole... AUSTRALIAN people" present that might be
offended.
The joke is of course Australians have a very non-Egnlish attitude
to public nudity.

From the early days in the colonies it was illegal to bathe in the ocean
during daylight hours because it offended the public decency. Back home.

But Australians quickly developed an orientation for disregarding any
damn POME law that didnt make sense and did so en masse.

Not only did they proceed to bath in the ocean every day and any damn time
they felt like it they also liked to dispense with the neck-to-knee swimming costumes the English favored. Eventually leading to the "universal"
adoption of the biniki and budgeesmuggler.

------------------------------

The USA has "free" beaches too, and I've never seen another area the
visitors kept so clean.

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From Newsgroup: alt.fan.heinlein

Jim Wilkins wrote on 15/7/24 9:17 pm:

"Daniel70"-a wrote in message news:v72q5p$kv16$1@dont-email.me...

.... and then Jim Wilkins posted a link to

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_gauge_in_Australia

about the various Rail Gauges in Australia due to each of the former
Colonies not wanting to follow the lead of any of the other Colonies.

For that reason, the Albury Railway Station https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albury_railway_station was reputed to be
the Longest Railway Station in The World because it had to be long
enough to handle two trains, a New South Wales Railways STANDARD GUAGE
(4ft 8inch, I think) Train as well as a Victorian Railways BROAD GUAGE
(5ft 3inch) Train, at the same time.
-
Daniel
-----------------------------------
Is GUAGE the British spelling?

No, it's my misspelling of Gauge!! ;-( But I was close!!
--
Daniel
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