• Already Saved? Hear what Jesus said.

    From zebrabible@zebrabible@proton.me to alt.bible on Wed Sep 16 21:41:23 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.bible

    Already Saved? Hear what Jesus said.

    -- New King James
    Matthew 24:13 "But he who endures to the end shall be saved."

    If you claim to be already saved, enduring or not enduring, won't make
    any difference.

    But Jesus did make salvation conditional. You have to 'endure to the
    end'. So don't be fooled by those who quote something different, but
    not in harmony with Jesus' words at Mt 24:13.

    For example, Paul said, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will get
    saved, you and your household.o (Acts 16:31)

    So that's all you have to do? That's the first initial step, but more
    is required. There is no time period mentioned here, but Jesus gave us
    a time period. You have to be following Christian teachings all the
    way to the end. THEN you are saved.

    "How Can the Bible Help You?
    Find out with our free interactive Bible study program."
    Go to: jw.org (9/16/2026)
    zebrabible@proton.me

    Help put the fire out in Hellfire
    (God is not a sadist but a God of love)
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  • From Christ Rose@usenet@christrose.news to alt.bible on Thu Sep 17 12:44:20 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.bible

    The Biblical Truth About Present Salvation

    The Present Possession Of Salvation

    (1) John 5:24

    "Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes
    him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into
    judgment, but has passed from death to life." (John 5:24 ESV)

    Jesus does not say that the one who believes will eventually obtain
    eternal life if he holds out to the end of life. He states that the
    believer "has" eternal life right now. It is a present possession. Furthermore, Jesus declares that this person "does not come into
    judgment," and "has passed from death to life." The transition from
    spiritual death to life is an accomplished fact the moment a person
    believes.

    (2) 1 John 5:13

    "I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son
    of God, that you may know that you have eternal life." (1 John
    5:13 ESV)

    God desires believers to have absolute certainty of their salvation in
    the present time. The Apostle John does not say we might hope to receive eternal life at the finish line; he says we "may know" that we "have" it
    now.

    (3) Ephesians 2:8-9

    "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not
    your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so
    that no one may boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9 ESV)

    Salvation is spoken of as a completed work: "you have been saved." It is
    not described as wages earned by endurance, but as a free "gift of God."
    If salvation required our own endurance as a condition to finally
    achieve it, it would be of works, and men could boast. Scripture says it
    is not of works.

    (4) Romans 8:30

    "And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he
    called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also
    glorified." (Romans 8:30 ESV)

    The Apostle Paul uses the past tense to state a future certainty: "he
    also glorified." Glorification is the final, consummated state of
    salvation in heaven. Yet the Holy Spirit speaks of it as an already accomplished event in the divine purpose. Why? Because God has
    predestined that every single person who is justified is also glorified.
    Not one link in this chain can be broken. If a man has been justified by faith, his final glorification in heaven is already a predetermined
    fact, so certain that God speaks of it as having already taken place.

    First Proposition: The Bible plainly teaches that whoever believes in
    Jesus Christ already possesses eternal life, is already saved from condemnation, has already passed from death to life, and has a future glorification that is already sealed and settled as an accomplished fact.

    The True Meaning Of Matthew 24:13 And Physical Deliverance

    (1) Matthew 24:3

    "As he sat on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him
    privately, saying, 'Tell us, when will these things be, and what
    will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?'"
    (Matthew 24:3 ESV)

    Jesus is not answering a question about how an individual sinner obtains spiritual salvation from the lake of fire. He is answering specific
    questions concerning the prophetic signs preceding His second coming and
    the close of the age.

    (2) Matthew 24:13, 22

    "But the one who endures to the end will be saved... And if those
    days had not been cut short, no human being would be saved. But
    for the sake of the elect those days will be cut short."
    (Matthew 24:13, 22 ESV)

    The context of Matthew 24 is the future period of the Great Tribulation.
    In verse 22, the exact same word "saved" is defined: if those days were
    not shortened, "no human being [literally, no flesh] would be saved."

    This cannot mean salvation of the soul from eternal damnation, for the
    cutting short of days does not determine spiritual salvation. It refers strictly to physical survival through the catastrophic judgments of the Tribulation. Those who endure and survive to the end of that period
    alive will be physically delivered into the Messianic Kingdom when
    Christ returns to earth.

    (3) Acts 27:31

    "Paul said to the centurion and the soldiers, 'Unless these men
    stay in the ship, you cannot be saved.'" (Acts 27:31 ESV)

    Here the Holy Spirit uses the very same word: "saved." If one insists on wrenching the word "saved" out of its context to mean spiritual
    salvation from the lake of fire every time it appears, then Paul was
    here teaching that the only way for soldiers and sailors to go to heaven
    was to remain inside a storm-battered, sinking wooden boat! The
    absurdity of such an interpretation exposes the error. In Acts 27:31,
    being "saved" meant not drowning in the sea. In Matthew 24:13, being
    "saved" means surviving the horrors of the Great Tribulation. To take a passage about physically surviving the Tribulation and convert it into a works-based plan of spiritual salvation is to turn the Scriptures upside
    down.

    Second Proposition: Matthew 24:13 treats entirely of physical
    preservation through the catastrophic events at the close of the age,
    and cannot be made into a formula for the spiritual salvation of a
    sinner without reducing biblical interpretation to absurdity.

    The Principle Of Clear Reference In Scripture

    1 Corinthians 15:1-3

    "Now I would remind you, brothers, of the gospel I preached to
    you, which you received, in which you stand, and by which you
    are being saved, if you hold fastrCounless you believed in vain.
    For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also
    received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the
    Scriptures." (1 Corinthians 15:1-3 ESV)

    God has given the Church the inspired Epistles for the explicit purpose
    of defining, explaining, and defending the doctrine of justification and salvation for this age. Sound interpretation requires that we interpret difficult, prophetic, or parabolic statements in light of the clear,
    direct, and normative teachings addressed to the Church. One cannot
    ignore the plain, systematic gospel declarations of the Apostles in
    Romans, Galatians, and Ephesians in favor of freelance interpretations
    of isolated verses lifted from prophetic contexts in the Gospels or the
    Old Testament.

    Third Proposition: The clear, direct doctrinal declarations delivered by
    the inspired Apostles to the Church must govern our understanding of salvation, and must never be overridden by misapplied snippets taken out
    of prophetic contexts.

    Justification Before God Versus Justification Before Men

    (1) Justification Before God Is By Grace Through Faith Alone

    Romans 3:28

    "For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of
    the law." (Romans 3:28 ESV)

    Romans 4:5

    "And to the one who does not work but believes in him who
    justifies the ungodly, his faith is counted as righteousness."
    (Romans 4:5 ESV)

    Galatians 2:16

    "Yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law
    but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in
    Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and
    not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will
    be justified." (Galatians 2:16 ESV)

    Titus 3:5

    "He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness,
    but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration
    and renewal of the Holy Spirit." (Titus 3:5 ESV)

    When the Apostle Paul speaks of justification, he is speaking of a
    sinner being declared righteous in the court of almighty God. Before
    God, who sees the heart, a sinner is justified entirely by grace through
    faith in the blood of Christ, completely apart from human deeds,
    performance, or endurance.

    (2) Justification Before Men Is Demonstrated By Works

    James 2:18

    "But someone will say, 'You have faith and I have works.' Show me
    your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith
    by my works." (James 2:18 ESV)

    James 2:24

    "You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith
    alone." (James 2:24 ESV)

    Galatians 5:22-23

    Matthew 7:18-20

    rCLA healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree
    bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut
    down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will recognize them by
    their fruits.rCY (Matthew 7:18rCo20, ESV)

    Galatians 5:22-23

    "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience,
    kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control;
    against such things there is no law." (Galatians 5:22-23 ESV)

    Titus 3:8

    "The saying is trustworthy, and I want you to insist on these
    things, so that those who have believed in God may be careful to
    devote themselves to good works. These things are excellent and
    profitable for people." (Titus 3:8 ESV)

    Ephesians 2:10

    "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good
    works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in
    them." (Ephesians 2:10 ESV)

    James is not discussing how an ungodly sinner secures peace with God.
    James is discussing how a living faith is shown to men. God can see
    faith in the heart without works; men cannot. Therefore James says,
    "Show me your faith." Works do not create justification before God;
    works demonstrate justification before men. Good works and the fruit of
    the Spirit are the outward evidence of an inward life already received.

    Fourth Proposition: Scripture teaches two distinct aspects of
    justification: a sinner is justified before God solely by faith in Jesus Christ apart from works, and a believer is justified before men by the
    visible fruit of good works which demonstrate the reality of his faith.

    Faith In Christ Is Fully Sufficient For Salvation

    (1) Acts 16:30-31

    "Then he brought them out and said, 'Sirs, what must I do to be
    saved?' And they said, 'Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will
    be saved, you and your household.'" (Acts 16:30-31 ESV)

    When the Philippian jailer asked the exact question, "What must I do to
    be saved?", the inspired Apostle did not say, "Believing is only the
    first step, and after that you must endure to the end to be saved." He
    gave one clear, sufficient condition: "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and
    you will be saved."

    (2) John 6:47

    "Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life."
    (John 6:47 ESV)

    Jesus Himself lays down the single requirement for possessing eternal
    life: believing on Him. He does not add conditions of future merit or self-sustained endurance.

    (3) Romans 10:9-10

    "Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and
    believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you
    will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified,
    and with the mouth one confesses and is saved." (Romans 10:9-10
    ESV)

    God justifies the ungodly through heart faith. To claim that faith is
    merely an initial step and that salvation is only granted after a
    lifetime of personal performance is to deny the Gospel of justification
    by faith alone.

    Fifth Proposition: Regarding the salvation of a soul before God,
    Scripture never presents faith as an incomplete first step, but as the
    sole means by which a sinner is completely and immediately justified.

    The Security And Perseverance Of The Believer

    (1) John 10:27-29

    "My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I
    give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one
    will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them
    to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them
    out of the Father's hand." (John 10:27-29 ESV)

    Jesus gives His sheep eternal life. It cannot be lost or revoked, for He states unequivocally that "they will never perish." Their safety does
    not depend upon their own frail strength, but upon the almighty grip of
    the Son and the Father.

    (2) Philippians 1:6

    "And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will
    bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ." (Philippians
    1:6 ESV)

    The believer endures not to earn salvation, but because God Himself
    preserves him and completes the work He started. Perseverance is the
    evidence that someone is saved, not the means by which they become right
    with God.

    Sixth Proposition: The believer is kept secure by the power of God, and
    the gift of eternal life guarantees that he will never perish.

    Summary

    By the clear statements of Christ that the believer "has eternal life"
    and "has passed from death to life" right now; by the divine decree that
    those who are justified are already reckoned as "glorified" in the
    eternal purpose of God; by the plain prophetic context of Matthew 24
    which deals with physical survival through the Great Tribulation, as
    shown by parallel uses of the word "saved" such as in Acts 27:31; by the
    clear apostolic letters given to instruct the Church in the gospel; by
    the essential distinction between justification before God by faith
    alone and justification before men by visible works; and by the divine guarantee that Christ's sheep "shall never perish"rCothe Bible
    conclusively refutes the claim that salvation is withheld until the end
    of life based on human endurance. Salvation is a present, secure
    possession received entirely by faith in Jesus Christ.
    --
    Good News rCa

    Jesus is God: christrose.news/Jesus-God.

    No other message can save except the true gospel: Christ died for our
    sins and rose from the dead (1 Corinthians 15:1-4; Galatians 1:8-9). Any contrary gospel is false and plunges people into conscious, eternal
    torment in the lake of fire (2 Thessalonians 1:8-9; John 3:18;
    Revelation 14:10-11; Revelation 19:20; Revelation 20:11-15). Denying the
    deity of Jesus ensures you will die in your sins (John 8:58).

    Through the cross, Christ erased the spiritual debt we owed to God for
    our rebellion (Colossians 2:14), a reality established when God raised
    Him from the dead (Romans 1:4). God can now righteously pardon our sins (Romans 3:26) and exempt us from the coming divine judgment (1
    Thessalonians 1:10). Salvation cannot be earned; it is a free gift for believers (Romans 6:23). Trust in Jesus and invoke His name to be saved (Romans 10:9-13):

    How to be saved: christrose.news/salvation
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