From Newsgroup: uk.religion.christian

* "Kendall K. Down" <10hdi61$1vrql$1@dont-email.me> :
Wrote on Thu, 11 Dec 2025 04:43:46 +0000:

At least, that is the latest conspiracy theory doing the rounds among
our gullible cousins across the water. Some of these individuals have
ust woken up to the fact that Matthew 17:21 is missing from their
Bibles. In case you have not memorised that particular chapter, it is
the one where Jesus comes down from the Mount of Transfiguration to
find a demon-possessed boy and a distressed father.

Jesus successfully casts out the demon and His disciples then ask why
they had not been able to do so. In the missing verse Jesus allegedly
tells them that "this kind goeth not out except by prayer and
fasting", a verse beloved by all those who trust in their own works
and delight in being uncomfortable.

There is a similar account in Mark 9:29 and scholars have noted that
the earliest manuscripts of the gospel of Matthew do not include
17:21. It is only after the 5th century AD that the verse begins to
appear, presumably copied from the parallel account in Mark.

But it gets even better, because Mark does not include the worda "and fasting", which seem to have been added around the same time as Mark's
verse was copied into Matthew.

In other words, I strongly suspect that some monk, addicted to
mortifying the flesh, felt that prayer was not sufficient and added in
"and fasting". It may have been the same person who transferred the
verse and added it into Matthew.

So unless the American government has perfected the art of time travel
and gone back in time to the 5th century AD, we have to let them off
the hook over this one. To the disappointment of all masochists out
there, Jesus recommended prayer but not fasting.

Isn't it awful? How are you going to blackmail God into answering your prayers if you can no longer go on hunger-strike?

No, you were right. it is after all a conspiracy of the type you are
trying to parody(...), so some folk may lose faith in "prayer and
fasting" and thus be prevented from casting out demons in the name of
jesus. the conspiracy has a goal to protect any threat to that brand of
demons.

Unfortunately there is the extensive record of the sackcloths and
fasting when approaching God in both testaments (with which God may or
may not have been pleased depending on the occassion) but this only has
to be debunked with some selective exegesis, which declares that these
are not valid.



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From Newsgroup: uk.religion.christian

On 11/12/2025 04:43, Kendall K. Down wrote:

Ooo-er! That wicked American government has been at it again, this time deleting verses from the Bible!

At least, that is the latest conspiracy theory doing the rounds among
our gullible cousins across the water. Some of these individuals have
ust woken up to the fact that Matthew 17:21 is missing from their
Bibles. In case you have not memorised that particular chapter, it is
the one where Jesus comes down from the Mount of Transfiguration to find
a demon-possessed boy and a distressed father.

Jesus successfully casts out the demon and His disciples then ask why
they had not been able to do so. In the missing verse Jesus allegedly
tells them that "this kind goeth not out except by prayer and fasting",
a verse beloved by all those who trust in their own works and delight in being uncomfortable.

There is a similar account in Mark 9:29 and scholars have noted that the earliest manuscripts of the gospel of Matthew do not include 17:21. It
is only after the 5th century AD that the verse begins to appear,
presumably copied from the parallel account in Mark.

But it gets even better, because Mark does not include the worda "and fasting", which seem to have been added around the same time as Mark's
verse was copied into Matthew.

In other words, I strongly suspect that some monk, addicted to
mortifying the flesh, felt that prayer was not sufficient and added in
"and fasting". It may have been the same person who transferred the
verse and added it into Matthew.

So unless the American government has perfected the art of time travel
and gone back in time to the 5th century AD, we have to let them off the hook over this one. To the disappointment of all masochists out there,
Jesus recommended prayer but not fasting.

Isn't it awful? How are you going to blackmail God into answering your prayers if you can no longer go on hunger-strike?

God bless,
Kendall K. Down

Does this mean i dont have to pray and fast during "Advent" and
"lent"??? yippee!!



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From Newsgroup: uk.religion.christian

On 13/12/2025 15:53, Madhu wrote:

Unfortunately there is the extensive record of the sackcloths and
fasting when approaching God in both testaments (with which God may or
may not have been pleased depending on the occassion) but this only has
to be debunked with some selective exegesis, which declares that these
are not valid.

Yes, there are numerous references to fasting and, of course, the
reference where God declares that the only fast of which He approves is
not where you abstain from food, but where you abstain from oppressing
your neighbours!

Unfortunately the human impulse to "do something" to earn God's favour
is very strong. Of course, it is probably correct that if you are asking
God for something - particularly in a distressing context - eating like
a glutton at the same time is probably not a good idea. As always,
moderation, the middle path, is the way to go.

God bless,
Kendall K. Down
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From Newsgroup: uk.religion.christian

On 14/12/2025 16:24, Michael Falconer wrote:

Does this mean i dont have to pray and fast during "Advent" and
"lent"??? yippee!!

Praying is always good - in fact, you should "pray without ceasing". It
is the fasting that is unnecessary.

God bless,
Kendall K. Down
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