From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

Did anyone else hear the somewhat bizarre apocalyptic lead story on
"1pm News" yesterday (starting at 12:57)?

It was titled "Shadow of War" is the UK ready? (spoiler alert NO)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002ntq7

About political and military leaders stating the need for the UK to
prepare for war with Russia. It is a quite a long piece.

Strangely it never appeared at all on the main BBC website or TV news.

It was also picked up late on Saturday by foreign news outlets who
seemed to have noticed something that Tobias Elwood had said recently on
the same topic. People to have obtained stocks of iodine tablets,
drinking water, battery radio, tinned food and all the other prepper
stuff ready to survive at least 72 hours without mains power or other utilities that we normally take for granted.

I can't find anything more recent than this though:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/exdefence-minister-says-british-homes-stockpile-prepare-attacks

Although it must have been something he said on Saturday that triggered
it suddenly coming up on the radar as a hot topic again. It seems to me
that the government has a duty of care to inform its citizens how to
survive a potential escalation of hostilities with Russia.

Time for a re-run of Protect and Survive:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protect_and_Survive
--
Martin Brown

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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

On 12/22/25 11:11, Martin Brown wrote:

I can't find anything more recent than this though:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/exdefence-minister-says- british-homes-stockpile-prepare-attacks

Politics 101, when you have lost all electoral support, due to economic failure, move to a war setting.




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Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> wrote:

On 12/22/25 11:11, Martin Brown wrote:

I can't find anything more recent than this though:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/exdefence-minister-says-
british-homes-stockpile-prepare-attacks

Politics 101, when you have lost all electoral support, due to economic failure, move to a war setting.

Vladimir PutinrCOs desire to recreate the Soviet Union at apparently any cost has far more to do with current tensions than this cockup governmentrCOs own Soviet-style agenda.
--
Spike

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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

On Mon, 22 Dec 2025 11:34:18 +0000, Pancho wrote:

On 12/22/25 11:11, Martin Brown wrote:

I can't find anything more recent than this though:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/exdefence-minister-says-
british-homes-stockpile-prepare-attacks

Politics 101, when you have lost all electoral support, due to economic failure, move to a war setting.

Apparently the Danish government did this a year ago, issuing a 'prepare
for war, stock up on bottled water and paracetamol' alert, delivered as a pamphlet through every front door in the country. I asked the guy who told
me this if he was genuinely concerned and he replied 'no, it just means
they intend to raise taxes'.


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"Martin Brown" <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> wrote in message news:10ib90t$3f4nc$1@dont-email.me...

Did anyone else hear the somewhat bizarre apocalyptic lead story on "1pm News"
yesterday (starting at 12:57)?

It was titled "Shadow of War" is the UK ready? (spoiler alert NO)

Apparently Putin is having to put back the date of the Invasion following
A major disagreements among his top Russian Generals

Among other things, as to who gets overall control of Thames Water
and who gets South West Trains,


bb








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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

In message <10ib90t$3f4nc$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:11:22 on Mon, 22 Dec
2025, Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> remarked:

Did anyone else hear the somewhat bizarre apocalyptic lead story on
"1pm News" yesterday (starting at 12:57)?

It was titled "Shadow of War" is the UK ready? (spoiler alert NO)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002ntq7

About political and military leaders stating the need for the UK to
prepare for war with Russia. It is a quite a long piece.

Strangely it never appeared at all on the main BBC website or TV news.

It was also picked up late on Saturday by foreign news outlets who
seemed to have noticed something that Tobias Elwood had said recently
on the same topic. People to have obtained stocks of iodine tablets, >drinking water, battery radio, tinned food and all the other prepper
stuff ready to survive at least 72 hours

72 months more like.

without mains power or other utilities that we normally take for
granted.

I can't find anything more recent than this though:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/exdefence-minister-says-britis >h-homes-stockpile-prepare-attacks

Although it must have been something he said on Saturday that triggered
it suddenly coming up on the radar as a hot topic again. It seems to me
that the government has a duty of care to inform its citizens how to
survive a potential escalation of hostilities with Russia.

Time for a re-run of Protect and Survive:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protect_and_Survive

--
Roland Perry

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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

On Mon, 22 Dec 2025 11:11:22 +0000, Martin Brown wrote:

Did anyone else hear the somewhat bizarre apocalyptic lead story on "1pm News" yesterday (starting at 12:57)?

It was titled "Shadow of War" is the UK ready? (spoiler alert NO)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002ntq7

About political and military leaders stating the need for the UK to
prepare for war with Russia. It is a quite a long piece.

Strangely it never appeared at all on the main BBC website or TV news.

It was also picked up late on Saturday by foreign news outlets who
seemed to have noticed something that Tobias Elwood had said recently on
the same topic. People to have obtained stocks of iodine tablets,
drinking water, battery radio, tinned food and all the other prepper
stuff ready to survive at least 72 hours without mains power or other utilities that we normally take for granted.

I can't find anything more recent than this though:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/exdefence-minister-says-

british-homes-stockpile-prepare-attacks

Although it must have been something he said on Saturday that triggered
it suddenly coming up on the radar as a hot topic again. It seems to me
that the government has a duty of care to inform its citizens how to
survive a potential escalation of hostilities with Russia.

Time for a re-run of Protect and Survive:

Not really. You'd need more than a packet of aspirin and two bottles of
water to live out a nuclear conflict.

Russias ability to weild power is very contingent on China not minding.

And the people who know least about the UKs military capabilities are generally the UK public and media. Which is not an accident.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protect_and_Survive

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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

On 23/12/2025 09:29, Roland Perry wrote:

In message <10ib90t$3f4nc$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:11:22 on Mon, 22 Dec
2025, Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> remarked:

Did anyone else hear the somewhat bizarre apocalyptic lead story on
"1pm News" yesterday (starting at 12:57)?

It was titled "Shadow of War" is the UK ready? (spoiler alert NO)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002ntq7

About political and military leaders stating the need for the UK to
prepare for war with Russia. It is a quite a long piece.

Strangely it never appeared at all on the main BBC website or TV news.

It was also picked up late on Saturday by foreign news outlets who
seemed to have noticed something that Tobias Elwood had said recently
on the same topic. People to have obtained stocks of iodine tablets,
drinking water, battery radio, tinned food and all the other prepper
stuff ready to survive at least 72 hours

72 months more like.

I expect both sides to use conventional weapons at least until their
backs are against the wall. In which case you could well be right about
the duration. Energy infrastructure is clearly going to be a target.

In the event of a nuclear exchange there is a very good reason why they
use that number as an easily remembered compromise. Obviously the longer
you can stay in a shelter and avoid contamination the better.

It is critical not to be outside in the early stages after a nuclear
blast when the fallout on the ground can be very hot indeed.

The rough heuristic for nuclear fallout from an airburst is that the
radiation dose rate drops by a factor of 10 for each multiple of 7
increase in time from 1 hour after the detonation. This used to be
classified but is now widely available on your favourite search engine.

1 hour 100%
7 hours 10%
2 days 1%
2 weeks 0.1%

https://cdp.dhs.gov/shared/se/courses/default/AWR-923-W%2005122021%201.2-20210512144644/groups/394.html

And once the dose rate is below a certain threshold you can survive OK
even though it will result in some permanent genetic damage.

Wartime emergency dose to avoid radiation sickness impairment is
surprisingly high compared to acceptable civilian annual dose rates.

http://www.roc-heritage.co.uk/uploads/7/6/8/9/7689271/rocjaannexj.pdf

That may still be a classified document.
--
Martin Brown


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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> wrote:

I expect both sides to use conventional weapons at least until their
backs are against the wall. In which case you could well be right about
the duration. Energy infrastructure is clearly going to be a target.

A 300kt weapon configured for EMP and detonated circa 180 miles above the
North Sea will cripple electronic devices in such territories as the
British Isles, NW France, the Low Countries and Scandinavia.

The resultant breakdown in law and order will do all the damage the
latter-day Soviet Union could desire.

In the event of a nuclear exchange there is a very good reason why they
use that number as an easily remembered compromise. Obviously the longer
you can stay in a shelter and avoid contamination the better.

The marauding gangs looking for food and women will be a very significant threat.

Any sign of a house with a light on, or the aroma of cooking food, will
draw them in.

It is critical not to be outside in the early stages after a nuclear
blast when the fallout on the ground can be very hot indeed.

Iodine is the main early radiation threat, but its half-life is only 7
days.

Anyone under 30 should shelter for at least a month, to avoid radioactive strontium being accumulated in the bone structure.

The rough heuristic for nuclear fallout from an airburst is that the radiation dose rate drops by a factor of 10 for each multiple of 7
increase in time from 1 hour after the detonation. This used to be classified but is now widely available on your favourite search engine.

1 hour 100%
7 hours 10%
2 days 1%
2 weeks 0.1%

https://cdp.dhs.gov/shared/se/courses/default/AWR-923-W%2005122021%201.2-20210512144644/groups/394.html

And once the dose rate is below a certain threshold you can survive OK
even though it will result in some permanent genetic damage.

Wartime emergency dose to avoid radiation sickness impairment is surprisingly high compared to acceptable civilian annual dose rates.

http://www.roc-heritage.co.uk/uploads/7/6/8/9/7689271/rocjaannexj.pdf

That may still be a classified document.

All interesting stuff.
--
Spike

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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

Martin Brown wrote:

On 23/12/2025 09:29, Roland Perry wrote:

In message <10ib90t$3f4nc$1@dont-email.me>, at 11:11:22 on Mon, 22 Dec
2025, Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> remarked:

Did anyone else hear the somewhat bizarre apocalyptic lead story on
"1pm News" yesterday (starting at 12:57)?

It was titled "Shadow of War" is the UK ready? (spoiler alert NO)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002ntq7

About political and military leaders stating the need for the UK to
prepare for war with Russia. It is a quite a long piece.

Strangely it never appeared at all on the main BBC website or TV news.

It was also picked up late on Saturday by foreign news outlets who
seemed to have noticed something that Tobias Elwood had said recently
on the same topic. People to have obtained stocks of iodine tablets,
drinking water, battery radio, tinned food and all the other prepper
stuff ready to survive at least 72 hours

72 months more like.

I expect both sides to use conventional weapons at least until their
backs are against the wall. In which case you could well be right about
the duration. Energy infrastructure is clearly going to be a target.

In the event of a nuclear exchange there is a very good reason why they
use that number as an easily remembered compromise. Obviously the longer
you can stay in a shelter and avoid contamination the better.

It is critical not to be outside in the early stages after a nuclear
blast when the fallout on the ground can be very hot indeed.

The rough heuristic for nuclear fallout from an airburst is that the radiation dose rate drops by a factor of 10 for each multiple of 7
increase in time from 1 hour after the detonation. This used to be classified but is now widely available on your favourite search engine.

1 hour 100%
7 hours 10%
2 days-a-a 1%
2 weeks-a 0.1%

https://cdp.dhs.gov/shared/se/courses/default/AWR-923-W%2005122021%201.2-20210512144644/groups/394.html

And once the dose rate is below a certain threshold you can survive OK
even though it will result in some permanent genetic damage.

Wartime emergency dose to avoid radiation sickness impairment is surprisingly high compared to acceptable civilian annual dose rates.

http://www.roc-heritage.co.uk/uploads/7/6/8/9/7689271/rocjaannexj.pdf

That may still be a classified document.

As you say, the WED is surprising: 1000mSv in any one day, 2000mSv
total, 150mSv perday for up to 100 days.
This compares with (from https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/ionising-radiation-dose-comparisons/ionising-radiation-dose-comparisons):

- Annual exposure limit for nuclear industry employees: 20 mSv
- Level at which changes in blood cells can be readily observed: 100 mSv
- Acute radiation effects including nausea and a reduction in white
blood cell count: 1000 mSv
- Dose of radiation which would kill about half of those receiving it in
a month: 5000 mSv

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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

Martin Brown wrote:

Did anyone else hear the somewhat bizarre apocalyptic lead story on "1pm News" yesterday (starting at 12:57)?

It was titled "Shadow of War" is the UK ready? (spoiler alert NO)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m002ntq7

About political and military leaders stating the need for the UK to
prepare for war with Russia. It is a quite a long piece.

Strangely it never appeared at all on the main BBC website or TV news.

It was also picked up late on Saturday by foreign news outlets who
seemed to have noticed something that Tobias Elwood had said recently on
the same topic. People to have obtained stocks of iodine tablets,
drinking water, battery radio, tinned food and all the other prepper
stuff ready to survive at least 72 hours without mains power or other utilities that we normally take for granted.

I can't find anything more recent than this though:

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/exdefence-minister-says-british-homes-stockpile-prepare-attacks

Although it must have been something he said on Saturday that triggered
it suddenly coming up on the radar as a hot topic again. It seems to me
that the government has a duty of care to inform its citizens how to
survive a potential escalation of hostilities with Russia.

Time for a re-run of Protect and Survive:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protect_and_Survive

A question might be where to buy a reliable supply of 65mg KI tablets
... something, if ever needed, that one would prefer not to be counterfeit!

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From Newsgroup: uk.legal.moderated

On 23/12/2025 11:33, No mail wrote:

Martin Brown wrote:

Time for a re-run of Protect and Survive:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protect_and_Survive

A question might be where to buy a reliable supply of 65mg KI tablets
... something, if ever needed, that one would prefer not to be counterfeit!

You can get a grade intended for sterilising drinking water when out
camping that would do at a pinch from almost any outdoors hiking shop.

I still have some potassium iodide and iodate lurking in the garage
somewhere from my teenage years experimenting with chemical clocks.

It was lab grade but for 65mg I'd be prepared to take the chance of
impurities which by now probably includes dead spiders and thrips.

Ones that actually go tick-tock-tick-tock- for several to many cycles
with starch indicator to make the iodine show up more clearly.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BriggsrCoRauscher_reaction

The B-Z reaction is even more impressive, easier to make work and can in principle be used to make a Turing complete liquid chemical computer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BelousovrCoZhabotinsky_reaction

It does bother me that the UK government doesn't advise it's citizens
what to do in the case of a national emergency of this kind. There is a
whole generation or more that have grown up post perestroika.

Many other countries do although how effective their advice is remains
to be seen. In Japan it was more about surviving major earthquakes.
--
Martin Brown


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On 23/12/2025 11:33, No mail wrote:

A question might be where to buy a reliable supply of 65mg KI tablets ... something, if ever needed, that one would prefer not to be counterfeit!

Near a Nuclear Installation.

https://www.lancashire.gov.uk/council/strategies-policies-plans/corporate/emergency-planning/emergency-plans/public-information/

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