From Newsgroup: sci.lang

Thanks Hen. I have doubts that tall came by that unusual route.

I think it was always related to tower, perhaps a dialect sound/spelling change but not semantic change.
A star or cloud might be high, but a tower was tall, because it was constructed of (straight) sticks.
And stick has meaning of both a pole and adhesive, because it stemmed from jabbing a stick into the ground to support a structure.
There's a bunch of words that fit the concept of stick-built structure (steeple, teepee, stable, staple, stall, stand, staff...).
Some are from PIE *steup or *steb or *stel. I think tall came from that place, and by 1500 was used in English, but wasn't rooted in tal or get|al but in twr or tur.


_________________________

I just remembered something...

WHen I was a teenager... (living in Calif.)

I just assumed that
Palos Verdes meant Green Hills
or (great views) Vista of the Green (landscape)


So I was surprised to learn that
it meant Green Sticks.

and (shortly after) was relieved to learn that it means (tall) Green Trees.





The name "Palos Verdes"N++ comes from the Spanish phrase meaning "green sticks"N++ or "green trees"N++.

It originated from the Mexican land grant called Rancho de Los Palos Verdes granted in the early 1800s in what is now the Palos Verdes Peninsula area of California.

The name likely referred to the lush willow trees or green timber growing in the canyons of the region.

The phrase "Palos Verdes"N++ was used to describe the landscaperCOs verdant vegetation, although early photos show the hills to have been mostly barren. The name has stuck and now applies broadly to the peninsula and surrounding communities.
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From Newsgroup: sci.lang


HenHanna@NewsGrouper <user4055@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

Thanks Hen. I have doubts that tall came by that unusual route.

I think it was always related to tower, perhaps a dialect sound/spelling change but not semantic change.
A star or cloud might be high, but a tower was tall, because it was constructed of (straight) sticks.
And stick has meaning of both a pole and adhesive, because it stemmed from jabbing a stick into the ground to support a structure.
There's a bunch of words that fit the concept of stick-built structure (steeple, teepee, stable, staple, stall, stand, staff...).
Some are from PIE *steup or *steb or *stel. I think tall came from that place, and by 1500 was used in English, but wasn't rooted in tal or get|al but in twr or tur.

_________________________

I just remembered something...

WHen I was a teenager... (living in Calif.)

I just assumed that
Palos Verdes meant Green Hills
or (great views) Vista of the Green (landscape)

So I was surprised to learn that
it meant Green Sticks.

and (shortly after) was relieved to learn that it means (tall) Green Trees.

The name "Palos Verdes"N++ comes from the Spanish phrase meaning "green sticks"N++ or "green trees"N++.

It originated from the Mexican land grant called Rancho de Los Palos Verdes granted in the early 1800s in what is now the Palos Verdes Peninsula area of California.

The name likely referred to the lush willow trees or green timber growing in the canyons of the region.

The phrase "Palos Verdes"N++ was used to describe the landscaperCOs verdant vegetation, although early photos show the hills to have been mostly barren. The name has stuck and now applies broadly to the peninsula and surrounding communities.

Thanks Hen, that is great. I recall 'pale' being a word for a stick or post, probably related to 'impale'.
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From Newsgroup: sci.lang


DDeden <user5108@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

HenHanna@NewsGrouper <user4055@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

Thanks Hen. I have doubts that tall came by that unusual route.

I think it was always related to tower, perhaps a dialect sound/spelling change but not semantic change.
A star or cloud might be high, but a tower was tall, because it was constructed of (straight) sticks.
And stick has meaning of both a pole and adhesive, because it stemmed from jabbing a stick into the ground to support a structure.
There's a bunch of words that fit the concept of stick-built structure (steeple, teepee, stable, staple, stall, stand, staff...).
Some are from PIE *steup or *steb or *stel. I think tall came from that place, and by 1500 was used in English, but wasn't rooted in tal or get|al but in twr or tur.

_________________________

I just remembered something...

WHen I was a teenager... (living in Calif.)

I just assumed that
Palos Verdes meant Green Hills
or (great views) Vista of the Green (landscape)

So I was surprised to learn that
it meant Green Sticks.

and (shortly after) was relieved to learn that it means (tall) Green Trees.

The name "Palos Verdes"N++ comes from the Spanish phrase meaning "green sticks"N++ or "green trees"N++.

It originated from the Mexican land grant called Rancho de Los Palos Verdes granted in the early 1800s in what is now the Palos Verdes Peninsula area of California.

The name likely referred to the lush willow trees or green timber growing in the canyons of the region.

The phrase "Palos Verdes"N++ was used to describe the landscaperCOs verdant vegetation, although early photos show the hills to have been mostly barren. The name has stuck and now applies broadly to the peninsula and surrounding communities.

Thanks Hen, that is great. I recall 'pale' being a word for a stick or post, probably related to 'impale'.

Pale meaning stick --- (according to the book (The Roots of English) by R.Claiborne) is related to
trepalium (torture device made of 3 sticks) and to the word Travel. and to Pagans

Pale (color) made me think of German (adj.) Blass, Bleich, and Fahl.
and Nabokov's Pale Fire...


_________________

The short story "Pale Anna"N++ by Heinrich B||ll is set in post-war Germany around 1950 and tells the story of a nameless ex-soldier recently returned from war. The narrator is lost and disconnected, spending his days waiting aimlessly in a rented room. His landlady frequently talks about her son, who died at war, and shows the narrator photos of the son with a girl named Anna, known as "Pale Anna," who was scarred and disfigured due to an air raid during the war.

The narrator seems to have an unclear but emotional connection to "Pale Anna," whom he once knew before the war. He struggles with memories of relationships and his war experiences, haunted by guilt, trauma, and loss. When he finally gathers the courage to visit Pale Anna's room, the story ends ambiguously, hinting at physical and psychological scars, unresolved feelings, and the complex aftermath of war. Themes include trauma, memory, alienation, and the difficulty of confronting onerCOs past.
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From Newsgroup: sci.lang

Op 23/10/2025 om 17:59 schreef HenHanna@NewsGrouper:

DDeden <user5108@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

Thanks Hen, that is great. I recall 'pale' being a word for a stick or post, probably related to 'impale'.

Pale meaning stick --- (according to the book (The Roots of English) by R.Claiborne) is related to
trepalium (torture device made of 3 sticks) and to the word Travel. and to Pagans

From torture to work, to travel and labour, the word has traveled quite
a bit. Don't forget "pole", be aware of homonyms.

Here in S.Am. you'll find "palo borracho" trees, "drunken sticks" (also
in Spain). A pink-white and a yellow-white flower species can be found
(to be in blossom soon, I hope). The trunk is bottle-shaped, and covered
with prickles, as are the branches. In the Ceiba-# genus like the Kapok
tree, within the Malvaceae family like the Baobab.

-#Not the same as the Ceibo tree, itself in the Fabaceae family, and
national tree of Argentina.
--
guido wugi

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From Newsgroup: sci.lang


wugi <wugi@brol.invalid> posted:

Op 23/10/2025 om 17:59 schreef HenHanna@NewsGrouper:

DDeden <user5108@newsgrouper.org.invalid> posted:

Thanks Hen, that is great. I recall 'pale' being a word for a stick or post, probably related to 'impale'.

Pale meaning stick --- (according to the book (The Roots of English) by R.Claiborne) is related to
trepalium (torture device made of 3 sticks) and to the word Travel. and to Pagans

From torture to work, to travel and labour, the word has traveled quite
a bit. Don't forget "pole", be aware of homonyms.

Here in S.Am. you'll find "palo borracho" trees, "drunken sticks" (also
in Spain). A pink-white and a yellow-white flower species can be found
(to be in blossom soon, I hope). The trunk is bottle-shaped, and covered with prickles, as are the branches. In the Ceiba-# genus like the Kapok tree, within the Malvaceae family like the Baobab.

-#Not the same as the Ceibo tree, itself in the Fabaceae family, and national tree of Argentina.

I just rode bicycle past a bunch of palo borracho trees in a tree park in Miami, with their bottle shaped thorny trunks.

Pale (palace, palisade), pole, post, pag, peg, stick, stake all share the idea of a stick and adhesion. Attach: at stake.
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