From Newsgroup: misc.phone.mobile.iphone

Jolly Roger wrote:

We're all supposed to ignore that. We're also supposed to forget that he
said it wasn't possible and then argued with and insulted every single
person that told him he was wrong. This went on for over a week, and
then when several of us posted screenshots proving we were right, he
created new goal posts and started building his little narrative that he actually figured it out himself. He couldn't be more full of shit.

I am not going to respond to JR's personal remarks. They do not help the discussion and they do not address the technical point I am raising.

Simply allow me to set the record straight for Jolly Roger to remember,
because his version of events leaves out the most important part.

I did not reject the SMB claim because of Android. I rejected it because
you have a long history of making technical claims about iOS that cannot be verified, and then attacking anyone who asks for evidence. After years of
that pattern, I simply could not rely on your statements without
independent confirmation.

The only reason I took the SMB claim seriously was because Tyrone
demonstrated actual knowledge of Windows 11 networking.

Once he showed that, only then I treated his claim as worth testing.

I then verified it myself on Windows 10 specifically to rule out any port-mapping artifacts. When the results matched what he described, I acknowledged it and thanked him.

That is not weakness.

That is how someone trained in engineering and sciences behaves.
When evidence appears, you update your conclusions.

What I will not do is accept unverified assertions from people who have repeatedly made inaccurate claims about iOS in the past. My approach has
been consistent the entire time as I trust reproducible results, not declarations.

You did not provide reproducible results. Tyrone did.
That is why I accepted his information and not yours.

I hope you understand.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: misc.phone.mobile.iphone

Jolly Roger wrote:

But insisted even after being show screenshots and even videos that it
couldn't be possible...

Yup. Someone told him that you can run an SMB service on an iOS device
using the default port and connect to it from a computer, and he
immediately claimed that was not possible because it doesn't work that
way on Android. He then argued with and insulted anyone who told him he
was wrong. He petty bickering went on for over a week IIRC and included several of us posting screenshots showing that it does indeed work on
iOS, while he continued to argue. Like most interactions with Arlen, it
was a ridiculous waste of time filled with schoolyard insults and
pathetic lies.

Hi Jolly Roger,

I'm not interested in trading insults, but I'll respond to your accusation. Specifically, I will clarify facts about how I approached this discussion.

When the SMB claim first came up, I simply couldn't rely on your statements because past technical claims you've made about iOS haven't aligned with
what I've been able to verify in practice. That's not meant as a personal attack; it's just the reality of how adults must evaluate information.

The only reason I took the SMB claim seriously was because Tyrone
demonstrated a solid understanding of Windows 11 networking and provided verifiable details. Once I saw that, I then adding the testing of the
behavior myself, and through that testing I learned exactly where iOS
behaves differently, specifically including the lack of port mapping.

Without that testing, I wouldn't have known, and neither would anyone else
in the thread, that the actual ports were not being mapped under the hood.

My point isn't to re-litigate old disagreements. That's your point.

My point is simply to make you aware that I rely on reproducible results,
not assertions.

When something is demonstrated clearly, I accept it, even if it's from you.

When it isn't, I verify it myself. That's how I approach every platform, whether that platform is iOS, Android, Windows, Linux or anything else.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: misc.phone.mobile.iphone

badgolferman wrote:

But I'll back off on this tack since if anyone thinks the goal is 'just
trying to be right', then I've failed at educating people on this ng how
Apple products actually work in the real world (outside of absurd marketing >> claims).

Remember the "wrong" thread? What I said above applies to most everyone in this group. You've actually admitted to being wrong in the past, it's everyone else's ego which can't handle it. What they really want is for someone to validate them so they can _win_ their argument.

Yeah. I remember it well.

I again apologize if I came off, to you, as "just trying to be right".
I care about discussions that aim purposefully toward a logical answer.

Which takes great effort to attain (e.g., in the Apple WPS situation where
I asked Apple why my opted-out AP is in their highly insecure public DB).

The whole point of a Usenet discussion is to refine our understanding, not
to declare victory. My educational background in science & engineering
drilled into me that most of us start out wrong until we test our
assumptions. That's why I appreciate when someone can admit a mistake.

What I push back against are the folks who confuse certainty with evidence
and think simply endlessly repeating a fact-free claim makes it true.

You and I have both admitted when we got something wrong, because
that's how people actually learn new things.

I admitted it openly, publicly & repeatedly in the iOS port issue, right?
Now I know possibly know it better'n they do, simply because I tested the
hell out of it on Windows to make sure it wasn't doing port swapping.

I had no problem learning from Tyrone (who was the only one I had trusted, since he knew Windows 11 behavior that I was unaware of) about the ports.

I even profusely and openly publicly thanked Tyrone for being believable.
And yet, even today, Tyrone uses the fact I had no trouble admitting that
only iOS does the ports the way they do as a way to attack me endlessly.

EDIT: I just noticed moments ago, that Tyrone ATTACKED ME VICIOUSLY simply
for admitting I was wrong, and, let's be very clear, I'm the only one who completely and thoroughly tested the ports on Windows to make sure that
nothing was being port mapped under the covers.

And yet, by me LEARNING from Tyrone & OPENLY admitting I was wrong (since
only iOS works that way), Tyrone, moments ago, viciously attacked me!

The funny thing is they feel if someone admits they're wrong, it's a
weakness, and yet, in reality, as you are aware, it's a strength.

Someone who can't admit they're wrong will never learn how to be right.

But to some of these people, if you admit you're wrong once, they attack
you forever, just like Tyrone just did in this very thread moments ago!

They think learning something by admitting we're wrong, is a weakness.
And yet, it's the strength that all well-educated logical people own.
--
My ego is in UNDERSTANDING how the product actually works, not in
joining a group of zealots in huddling around their marketing god.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: misc.phone.mobile.iphone

Jolly Roger wrote:

On 2025-12-24, Marian <marianjones@helpfulpeople.com> wrote:

Jolly Roger wrote:

We're all supposed to ignore that. We're also supposed to forget that
he said it wasn't possible and then argued with and insulted every
single person that told him he was wrong. This went on for over a
week, and then when several of us posted screenshots proving we were
right, he created new goal posts and started building his little
narrative that he actually figured it out himself. He couldn't be
more full of shit.

I did not reject the SMB claim because of Android.

You did. You claimed because Android cannot do it, that iOS also cannot
do it. We all read your words. It's on record, liar.

you have a long history of making technical claims about iOS that cannot be >> verified

Then it should be very easy for you to point to one. #JustOne

You won't because you can't because you are a liar.

The only reason I took the SMB claim seriously was because Tyrone
demonstrated actual knowledge of Windows 11 networking.

I did too. You argued with each and every person who did so. You spent
over a week bickering about this, long after several people showed you
proof that it works fine on iOS.

That is not weakness.

Keep repeating that if it helps you feel better. It doesn't change
anything back here in reality, Pumpkin.

Hi Jolly Roger,

Merry Christmas!

I am not going to address the personal remarks from Jolly Roger.
They do not contribute to the technical discussion.

To stay focused on the actual issue, my position has been consistent.
I do not accept prima facie any technical claim about iOS, Android,
Windows, or any other platform from JR without reproducible evidence.

To weigh the credibility of the post is common standard science &
engineering practice we extremely-well-educated people often employ.

Regarding SMB access testing, the sequence was straightforward:

a. Multiple claims were made, but all without reproducible steps
and nobody showed exactly which port was being used or verified.
b. Later, Tyrone provided a technically coherent explanation of
the Windows 11 networking behavior involved, which was credible.
c. Based on that credibility alone, I fully and completely tested
the scenario myself on Windows 10 to the level that none of the
folks on this newsgroup perhaps save for Tyrone, could understand.
d. This eliminated variables such as port mapping possibilities.
e. My results matched what Tyrone described, so I accepted the conclusion.
f. Like any well-educated intelligent adult whose ego is not tied
in rhetoric, I openly publicly profusely thanked Tyrone & JR.

This is a fact.
It's not an opinion.

Jolly Roger seems to have forgotten what happened, and he seems to have forgotten he lacks credibility in that Jolly Roger even today still claims
his iOS device saves the IPA to the device, so, with that in mind, it's no wonder well-educated people don't find Jolly Rogers wild claims credible.

For example, JR still claims that a decibel and a Mbps are the same thing!
*It's a fact iOS devices can't even graph Wi-Fi signal strength over time*
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/PZuec56EWB0

In summary, the basis of my response was to only invest the time to explore claims by people who proved themselves to be credible purveyors of fact.

It was simply a matter of verifying a claim before accepting it.

If you have reproducible technical data to contribute, I will evaluate it
the same way. If not, there is nothing further to resolve on this point.
--
I'm not interested in trading insults, so I'll keep this to the facts.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: misc.phone.mobile.iphone

On 2025-12-23 19:34, Marian wrote:

Jolly Roger wrote:

We're all supposed to ignore that. We're also supposed to forget that he
said it wasn't possible and then argued with and insulted every single
person that told him he was wrong. This went on for over a week, and
then when several of us posted screenshots proving we were right, he
created new goal posts and started building his little narrative that he
actually figured it out himself. He couldn't be more full of shit.

I am not going to respond to JR's personal remarks. They do not help the discussion and they do not address the technical point I am raising.
Simply allow me to set the record straight for Jolly Roger to remember, because his version of events leaves out the most important part.

I did not reject the SMB claim because of Android. I rejected it because
you have a long history of making technical claims about iOS that cannot be verified, and then attacking anyone who asks for evidence. After years of that pattern, I simply could not rely on your statements without
independent confirmation.

The only reason I took the SMB claim seriously was because Tyrone demonstrated actual knowledge of Windows 11 networking.
Once he showed that, only then I treated his claim as worth testing.
I then verified it myself on Windows 10 specifically to rule out any port-mapping artifacts. When the results matched what he described, I acknowledged it and thanked him.
-a-a-a-a-a-a That is not weakness.
That is how someone trained in engineering and sciences behaves.
-a-a When evidence appears, you update your conclusions.

What I will not do is accept unverified assertions from people who have repeatedly made inaccurate claims about iOS in the past. My approach has
been consistent the entire time as I trust reproducible results, not declarations.
You did not provide reproducible results. Tyrone did. That is why I
accepted his information and not yours.

I hope you understand.

I understand that if "we" includes you, then "we" didn't prove it.

Others proved it TO YOU.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: misc.phone.mobile.iphone

On 2025-12-23 19:35, Marian wrote:

Jolly Roger wrote:

But insisted even after being show screenshots and even videos that it
couldn't be possible...

Yup. Someone told him that you can run an SMB service on an iOS device
using the default port and connect to it from a computer, and he
immediately claimed that was not possible because it doesn't work that
way on Android. He then argued with and insulted anyone who told him he
was wrong. He petty bickering went on for over a week IIRC and included
several of us posting screenshots showing that it does indeed work on
iOS, while he continued to argue. Like most interactions with Arlen, it
was a ridiculous waste of time filled with schoolyard insults and
pathetic lies.

Hi Jolly Roger,

I'm not interested in trading insults,

YOU didn't "prove" anything.

You denied the proofs you were offered.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2