On 2026-01-04 00:50, rbowman wrote:
On Sat, 3 Jan 2026 16:26:09 -0500, CrudeSausage wrote:
We're not yet seeing the benefits on the PC side, but once Linux fully
supports them (I'm not sure if they do yet), it will definitely be the
architecture to go for. Absolutely no one wants to get no more than
six hours of battery life from their laptop anymore.
The Raspberry Pi OS is derived from Debian. Considering the limitations
of the Pi 5 it usable. Other distros can run on the Pi too but I took
the easy way out. The Raspberry Pi Imager has been expanded to include
Ubunto,
Alpine, and the Fedora based Ultramarine.
I'm not too familiar with the Raspberry Pi devices but I imagine that
they use an ARM processor. Is that correct?
At 4 Jan 2026 05:53:47 GMT, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 23:07:44 +0000, vallor wrote:
At 3 Jan 2026 21:07:02 GMT, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 17:18:34 +0000, vallor wrote:
My laptop is an ASUS Tufbook. I needed something rugged for
travel.
They stole Panasonic's name? I had a client say 'We use Panasonic
Toughbooks'. I found Panasonic has endless SKUs for Toughbooks and
had to go back for clarification on exactly what they had.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09RMH9B6F
Any problems with Nvidia? TUF is far enough away from Toughbook to not
trigger the lawyers.
I've heard there can be problem with suspend and NVIDIA, but I don't use suspend. (It boots so fast that I just shut the thing off when not
using it.)
On 2026-01-04 17:05, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/4/26 7:46 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:29, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/4/26 7:25 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 15:16, chrisv wrote:
Alan wrote:
(snipped, unread)
Idiot.
Run away, little man!
Chris believes that paying for Usenet to ignore most posts even
though he bothers to reply, and to expose his childlike thought
process, is a good investment.
Yeah...
Your words are less than nothing.
Buzz off, kid.
Make me, poser.-a You're not older than me, at least not that anyone
can tell, you fucking retard Mac fool.-a I wasn't talking about you, I
was replying to you.-a It's Usenet, you don't like it, get the fuck
out.-a I would kick your dumb ass for talking to me like that,
imbecile, Mac user faggot.
Look at you! Talking smack when you know you're completely safe from any repercussions!
I've been posting to Usenet since about the mind 1990's...
...and if you've finished your puberty growth spurt, I'd be stunned.
If you have, then all it shows is you've never matured to match your physical age.
But if you think you can "kick [my] dumb ass"...
...bring it on.
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple overlords >>>>>>> aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run an OS. >>>>>>
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on
that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program
written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that either
Linux or
Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over
macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it
on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line
utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven
innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and
those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far as
putting
stickers representing your political beliefs on the lid of the
computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks exactly the >>>> same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1. Looks at
display
attached to Mac mini #2. Three different desktops; even the Docks are
different, several apps are on only one of the machines. Hint: one of
the Mac
minis is a server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your
Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to your
Linux machine...
On 2026-01-04 15:21, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 14:55, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 18:26, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-03 20:20, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:Which is entirely my point. Some of us buy hardware with the
[...]
Linux supports almost every platform under the sun.
How many platforms does MacOS run on?
macOS is designed to run on Apple kit, nothing else.-a If it ran
on other manucturers' (inferior) hardware, Apple would not sell
as much of their own kit, which is where they make their money.
This is not rocket surgery, just sound commercial design.
intention of doing whatever we want with it. We have a choice to run
Windows or Linux if we bought x86-64, but Linux is still an option
for us if we bought hardware of any other platform. If I were to buy
a Mac, there is no doubt that I would have excellent hardware under
my fingers when I type. Nevertheless, the hardware will never allow
me to do whatever I want with it because, inevitably, Apple will
cease to support it a few years after I bought it with no realistic
option to keep it useful once the updates stop coming. I'm left with
the option of buying a new one from Apple and allowing them to
recycle my machine.
Ummmmmm...what?
Apple's support goes on for years, dude.
Seven years on average. It's part of why I got an iPhone 13 over an
Android which is usually supported for no more than two years. It's
the same with the desktops and laptops. People with 2019 models of
Apple computers are already aware that their machines are about to be
forgotten.
Ummmmm...no. That's more Linux snob bullshit.
My last laptop was a 13" MacBook Pro (A1502) from early 2015, and I
only replaced it with my current M3 MacBook Air in early 2024.
I got about 8.5 years out of it, and when I finally replaced it, it
was capable of running macOS (12)...
...which came out AFTER I'd already replaced the machine.
A series of articles has been written about how long Apple supports
its computers. Heck, I even did an AI search for you:
"Apple typically provides hardware support for iPhones and Macs for
five to seven years after the last sale date of the product.
-a-aFor iPhones, this support window includes both software updates and
hardware repair services, with major iOS updates generally available
for six to eight years after release.
-a-aAfter the end of software support, Apple continues to provide
security patches and limited hardware repairs for up to two more
years, after which devices are classified as "vintage" or "obsolete"
and no longer receive official service.
-a-aFor Macs, hardware support generally lasts around five years from
the discontinuation of a model, although some models have received
extended support due to longer sales periods."
OK. So?
Meanwhile, Linux just allowed my brother to give a third life to hisWhich is good usage, I grant you.
laptop from 2007.
But don't pretend that "Apple cease[s] support in a few years".
Five to seven years, even our AI overlords agree.
"Five to seven years" in computing is not "a few".
(snipped, unread)
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD.
Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch.
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good".
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple overlords
aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
It doesn't. <snip>
Thank you.
Your bullshit irrelevant to the discussion removed.
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run an OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program
written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
What if I don't want to pay exorbitant prices for RAM or storage and
intend to hold onto my computer (and have updates) for more then seven
years? Apple has nothing to sell me.
How has that anything to do with the topic under discussion?
Oh right!
It doesn't!
On 1/4/26 8:35 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 17:05, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/4/26 7:46 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:29, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/4/26 7:25 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 15:16, chrisv wrote:
Alan wrote:
(snipped, unread)
Idiot.
Run away, little man!
Chris believes that paying for Usenet to ignore most posts even
though he bothers to reply, and to expose his childlike thought
process, is a good investment.
Yeah...
Your words are less than nothing.
Buzz off, kid.
Make me, poser.-a You're not older than me, at least not that anyone
can tell, you fucking retard Mac fool.-a I wasn't talking about you, I
was replying to you.-a It's Usenet, you don't like it, get the fuck
out.-a I would kick your dumb ass for talking to me like that,
imbecile, Mac user faggot.
Look at you! Talking smack when you know you're completely safe from
any repercussions!
I've been posting to Usenet since about the mind 1990's...
Wow, so have I, so yeah wow.
...and if you've finished your puberty growth spurt, I'd be stunned.
If you have, then all it shows is you've never matured to match your
physical age.
But if you think you can "kick [my] dumb ass"...
...bring it on.
You are a dumbass, you started this, you always start it, you are a smug middle class geek Mac using dweeb, how would I be scared of you?-a "Bring
it on" indeed, Alan, no one is fooled by your arrogant BS, you're a
jerk-off and you pay Apple for things.
For the record, I'll be 49 on March 1st.-a But more importantly I have a spine, unlike you and most Mactards.My, my... ...49.
Alan wrote:
(snipped, unread)
Idiot.
On 2026-01-03 18:15, CrudeSausage wrote:
they can depend on to obfuscate their drawbacks and exaggerate theirAnd yet you can never actually articulate something that either Linux
better features, making it seem like the investment in a Mac isn't
overpaying Apple but in fact an upgrade over its competition, a
proposition easily refuted by actually using the three platforms
enough to see how mediocre Apple's crapware really is.
or Windows does better.
Servers and supercomputers for Linux, gaming for Windows.
First: not what people care about for a PERSONAL computer.
Second: "more" is not "better".
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695aff72$0$22$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your
Macs, sir.
Apple no longer supports OS X Server. One of my Mac minis is a server, with multiple physical volumes attached. One has assorted USB items, cameras, drawing tablets, headset, stuff like that.
but hey... you still need help.
On 2026-01-04 19:27, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 15:21, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 14:55, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 18:26, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-03 20:20, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:Which is entirely my point. Some of us buy hardware with the
[...]
Linux supports almost every platform under the sun.
How many platforms does MacOS run on?
macOS is designed to run on Apple kit, nothing else.-a If it ran
on other manucturers' (inferior) hardware, Apple would not sell
as much of their own kit, which is where they make their money.
This is not rocket surgery, just sound commercial design.
intention of doing whatever we want with it. We have a choice to
run Windows or Linux if we bought x86-64, but Linux is still an
option for us if we bought hardware of any other platform. If I
were to buy a Mac, there is no doubt that I would have excellent
hardware under my fingers when I type. Nevertheless, the hardware
will never allow me to do whatever I want with it because,
inevitably, Apple will cease to support it a few years after I
bought it with no realistic option to keep it useful once the
updates stop coming. I'm left with the option of buying a new one
from Apple and allowing them to recycle my machine.
Ummmmmm...what?
Apple's support goes on for years, dude.
Seven years on average. It's part of why I got an iPhone 13 over an
Android which is usually supported for no more than two years. It's
the same with the desktops and laptops. People with 2019 models of
Apple computers are already aware that their machines are about to be
forgotten.
Ummmmm...no. That's more Linux snob bullshit.
There's no need to refute you when AI does it so well for all of us. But
I'm sure AI is a Linux snob too:
"The 2019 Macs, which are Intel-based, will receive their final major
macOS update with macOS 26 Tahoe, which is the last version to support Intel-based Macs.
-aThis means that starting in 2026, these models will no longer receive
new feature updates. However, the 2019 MacBook Pro and 2019 iMac will continue to receive security updates for three years after the release
of macOS 26 Tahoe, including two additional years of security patches
beyond the feature update period.
-aThis brings the total support duration to approximately five years
from the end of their sale cycle, aligning with ApplerCOs recent pattern
of providing about five years of support post end of sale.
-aAfter this period, no further updatesrConeither feature nor securityrCo will be provided, making these devices increasingly vulnerable to
security threats and incompatible with modern software."
*FIVE* *YEARS* . Even Microsoft supports hardware for longer.
My last laptop was a 13" MacBook Pro (A1502) from early 2015, and I
only replaced it with my current M3 MacBook Air in early 2024.
I got about 8.5 years out of it, and when I finally replaced it, it
was capable of running macOS (12)...
...which came out AFTER I'd already replaced the machine.
A series of articles has been written about how long Apple supports
its computers. Heck, I even did an AI search for you:
"Apple typically provides hardware support for iPhones and Macs for
five to seven years after the last sale date of the product.
-a-aFor iPhones, this support window includes both software updates and >>> hardware repair services, with major iOS updates generally available
for six to eight years after release.
-a-aAfter the end of software support, Apple continues to provide
security patches and limited hardware repairs for up to two more
years, after which devices are classified as "vintage" or "obsolete"
and no longer receive official service.
-a-aFor Macs, hardware support generally lasts around five years from
the discontinuation of a model, although some models have received
extended support due to longer sales periods."
OK. So?
So, I just confirmed that I was right and that you are full of poop like every other Apple zealot.
How does what Microsoft do impact what Apple does?Meanwhile, Linux just allowed my brother to give a third life toWhich is good usage, I grant you.
his laptop from 2007.
But don't pretend that "Apple cease[s] support in a few years".
Five to seven years, even our AI overlords agree.
"Five to seven years" in computing is not "a few".
Meanwhile, people are going nuts because Microsoft's Windows 11 refuses
to support machines from 2017. I guess us PC users are idiots for
expecting to hold onto our hardware for as long as we want rather than
as long as the manufacturer wants us to.
On 2026-01-04 19:25, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>>
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple
overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run an OS. >>>>>>>
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on
that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program >>>>>>> written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that either >>>>>>> Linux or
Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over
macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it
on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line
utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven
innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and
those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far as
putting
stickers representing your political beliefs on the lid of the
computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Considering the amount of Macs on eBay being sold with dents, it appears
to be a serious problem on those bodies.
I completely admit that.Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks exactly the >>>>> same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1. Looks at
display
attached to Mac mini #2. Three different desktops; even the Docks are
different, several apps are on only one of the machines. Hint: one
of the Mac
minis is a server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your
Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to your
Linux machine...
And you run rather than admit that MacOS doesn't allow for
customizations in the slightest...
Buzz off, kid.
Make me, poser.
Look at you!
On 2026-01-04 19:28, Alan wrote:
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD.
Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch.
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good".
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple overlords
aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
It doesn't. <snip>
Thank you.
Your bullshit irrelevant to the discussion removed.
There was no topic, zealot.
You inferred anger there?There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run an OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on that OS. >>>>
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program
written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
What if I don't want to pay exorbitant prices for RAM or storage and
intend to hold onto my computer (and have updates) for more then
seven years? Apple has nothing to sell me.
How has that anything to do with the topic under discussion?
Oh right!
It doesn't!
Ridiculous anger at being exposed for your zealotry noted.
On 2026-01-04 19:29, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 18:15, CrudeSausage wrote:
they can depend on to obfuscate their drawbacks and exaggerateAnd yet you can never actually articulate something that either
their better features, making it seem like the investment in a Mac
isn't overpaying Apple but in fact an upgrade over its competition, >>>>> a proposition easily refuted by actually using the three platforms
enough to see how mediocre Apple's crapware really is.
Linux or Windows does better.
Servers and supercomputers for Linux, gaming for Windows.
First: not what people care about for a PERSONAL computer.
You asked what Linux does better (still available to quote above) and I
told you.
It isn't BETTER from a computing standpoint.Second: "more" is not "better".
Being able to play every game under the sun and with excellent
performance is a lot more important to a gamer than knowing that two or three titles Apple selected run fine on Apple's hardware. So yes, _more_ games and _more_ frames are indeed better, Linux is a better option that MacOS for gamers who don't want to use Windows, but Windows is still
king for now.
On 2026-01-04 19:43, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695aff72$0$22$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your
Macs, sir.
Apple no longer supports OS X Server. One of my Mac minis is a server,
with
multiple physical volumes attached. One has assorted USB items, cameras,
drawing tablets, headset, stuff like that.
but hey... you still need help.
And this represents MacOS's customization how, exactly? I had a 24-pin
dot matrix printer connected to my 286 back in the day, does that count
as customization?
Alan wrote:
(snipped, unread)
Idiot.
On 2026-01-04 18:14, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/4/26 8:35 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 17:05, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/4/26 7:46 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:29, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/4/26 7:25 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 15:16, chrisv wrote:
Alan wrote:
(snipped, unread)
Idiot.
Run away, little man!
Chris believes that paying for Usenet to ignore most posts even
though he bothers to reply, and to expose his childlike thought
process, is a good investment.
Yeah...
Your words are less than nothing.
Buzz off, kid.
Make me, poser.-a You're not older than me, at least not that anyone
can tell, you fucking retard Mac fool.-a I wasn't talking about you,
I was replying to you.-a It's Usenet, you don't like it, get the fuck >>>> out.-a I would kick your dumb ass for talking to me like that,
imbecile, Mac user faggot.
Look at you! Talking smack when you know you're completely safe from
any repercussions!
I've been posting to Usenet since about the mind 1990's...
Wow, so have I, so yeah wow.
So when you were 13? You get that the mid 1990s were 30 years ago, right?
...and if you've finished your puberty growth spurt, I'd be stunned.
If you have, then all it shows is you've never matured to match your
physical age.
But if you think you can "kick [my] dumb ass"...
...bring it on.
You are a dumbass, you started this, you always start it, you are a
smug middle class geek Mac using dweeb, how would I be scared of you?
"Bring it on" indeed, Alan, no one is fooled by your arrogant BS,
you're a jerk-off and you pay Apple for things.
No, asshole. You inserted your worthless opinion into a thread I was in.
YOU started this.
For the record, I'll be 49 on March 1st.-a But more importantly I have
a spine, unlike you and most Mactards.
My, my... ...49.
So you're a youngster.
And your mental age matches the age you claim to
have been in the mid 1990s.
On 2026-01-04 18:22, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:27, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 15:21, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 14:55, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 18:26, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-03 20:20, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:Which is entirely my point. Some of us buy hardware with the
[...]
Linux supports almost every platform under the sun.
How many platforms does MacOS run on?
macOS is designed to run on Apple kit, nothing else.-a If it ran >>>>>>> on other manucturers' (inferior) hardware, Apple would not sell
as much of their own kit, which is where they make their money.
This is not rocket surgery, just sound commercial design.
intention of doing whatever we want with it. We have a choice to
run Windows or Linux if we bought x86-64, but Linux is still an
option for us if we bought hardware of any other platform. If I
were to buy a Mac, there is no doubt that I would have excellent
hardware under my fingers when I type. Nevertheless, the hardware >>>>>> will never allow me to do whatever I want with it because,
inevitably, Apple will cease to support it a few years after I
bought it with no realistic option to keep it useful once the
updates stop coming. I'm left with the option of buying a new one >>>>>> from Apple and allowing them to recycle my machine.
Ummmmmm...what?
Apple's support goes on for years, dude.
Seven years on average. It's part of why I got an iPhone 13 over an
Android which is usually supported for no more than two years. It's
the same with the desktops and laptops. People with 2019 models of
Apple computers are already aware that their machines are about to
be forgotten.
Ummmmm...no. That's more Linux snob bullshit.
There's no need to refute you when AI does it so well for all of us.
But I'm sure AI is a Linux snob too:
"The 2019 Macs, which are Intel-based, will receive their final major
macOS update with macOS 26 Tahoe, which is the last version to support
Intel-based Macs.
-a-aThis means that starting in 2026, these models will no longer
receive new feature updates. However, the 2019 MacBook Pro and 2019
iMac will continue to receive security updates for three years after
the release of macOS 26 Tahoe, including two additional years of
security patches beyond the feature update period.
-a-aThis brings the total support duration to approximately five years
from the end of their sale cycle, aligning with ApplerCOs recent pattern
of providing about five years of support post end of sale.
-a-aAfter this period, no further updatesrConeither feature nor securityrCo >> will be provided, making these devices increasingly vulnerable to
security threats and incompatible with modern software."
*FIVE* *YEARS* . Even Microsoft supports hardware for longer.
Wow. You're arithmetic skills are for shit, too!
What is 2025 - 2019, hmmm?
I'll give you six guesses.
My last laptop was a 13" MacBook Pro (A1502) from early 2015, and I >>>>> only replaced it with my current M3 MacBook Air in early 2024.
I got about 8.5 years out of it, and when I finally replaced it, it >>>>> was capable of running macOS (12)...
...which came out AFTER I'd already replaced the machine.
A series of articles has been written about how long Apple supports
its computers. Heck, I even did an AI search for you:
"Apple typically provides hardware support for iPhones and Macs for
five to seven years after the last sale date of the product.
-a-aFor iPhones, this support window includes both software updates
and hardware repair services, with major iOS updates generally
available for six to eight years after release.
-a-aAfter the end of software support, Apple continues to provide
security patches and limited hardware repairs for up to two more
years, after which devices are classified as "vintage" or "obsolete"
and no longer receive official service.
-a-aFor Macs, hardware support generally lasts around five years from >>>> the discontinuation of a model, although some models have received
extended support due to longer sales periods."
OK. So?
So, I just confirmed that I was right and that you are full of poop
like every other Apple zealot.
Nah... ...you can't even do the basic arithmetic.
How does what Microsoft do impact what Apple does?Meanwhile, Linux just allowed my brother to give a third life toWhich is good usage, I grant you.
his laptop from 2007.
But don't pretend that "Apple cease[s] support in a few years".
Five to seven years, even our AI overlords agree.
"Five to seven years" in computing is not "a few".
Meanwhile, people are going nuts because Microsoft's Windows 11
refuses to support machines from 2017. I guess us PC users are idiots
for expecting to hold onto our hardware for as long as we want rather
than as long as the manufacturer wants us to.
And does your hardware magically stop working when you no longer receive
the latest OS upgrade? Hmmm?
My dad can beat up your dad.
On 2026-01-04 18:17, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:25, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>>>
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple
overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run an >>>>>>>> OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on >>>>>>>> that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program >>>>>>>> written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that either >>>>>>>> Linux or
Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over
macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it
on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line
utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven
innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and
those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far as
putting
stickers representing your political beliefs on the lid of the
computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Considering the amount of Macs on eBay being sold with dents, it
appears to be a serious problem on those bodies.
Proof, please!
I completely admit that.Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks exactly >>>>>> the
same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1. Looks
at display
attached to Mac mini #2. Three different desktops; even the Docks are >>>>> different, several apps are on only one of the machines. Hint: one
of the Mac
minis is a server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your
Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to your
Linux machine...
And you run rather than admit that MacOS doesn't allow for
customizations in the slightest...
Now...
...what will be your next excuse?
:-)
On 2026-01-04 18:28, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:28, Alan wrote:
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD.
Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple overlords >>>>>> aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
It doesn't. <snip>
Thank you.
Your bullshit irrelevant to the discussion removed.
There was no topic, zealot.
Sure there was.
It was a specific claim from someone who both claimed that ARM was "second-best"...
...and that the best counter-examples he could provide (I infer; do you
even know the difference between "infer" and "imply". I very much doubt
it.) MIGHT surpass ARM someday.
<snipped more irrelevant bullshit>
On 2026-01-04 18:34, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:43, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695aff72$0$22$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your
Macs, sir.
Apple no longer supports OS X Server. One of my Mac minis is a
server, with
multiple physical volumes attached. One has assorted USB items, cameras, >>> drawing tablets, headset, stuff like that.
but hey... you still need help.
And this represents MacOS's customization how, exactly? I had a 24-pin
dot matrix printer connected to my 286 back in the day, does that
count as customization?
I ask you again:
What actual customizations have you done to your Linux system?
BTW, do you also have a Windows system you keep for when you actually
need to be useful?
Resistance is futile!
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install a different operating system
On Mon, 5 Jan 2026 02:38:52 +0000, Mr |un!on wrote:
My dad can beat up your dad.
You sound like a Dimdows user trying to impress Linux users.
Resistance is futile!
On 2026-01-04 18:33, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:29, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 18:15, CrudeSausage wrote:
they can depend on to obfuscate their drawbacks and exaggerateAnd yet you can never actually articulate something that either
their better features, making it seem like the investment in a Mac >>>>>> isn't overpaying Apple but in fact an upgrade over its
competition, a proposition easily refuted by actually using the
three platforms enough to see how mediocre Apple's crapware really >>>>>> is.
Linux or Windows does better.
Servers and supercomputers for Linux, gaming for Windows.
First: not what people care about for a PERSONAL computer.
You asked what Linux does better (still available to quote above) and
I told you.
In the context of what APPLE provides, yes.
Do you see the difference?
It isn't BETTER from a computing standpoint.Second: "more" is not "better".
Being able to play every game under the sun and with excellent
performance is a lot more important to a gamer than knowing that two
or three titles Apple selected run fine on Apple's hardware. So yes,
_more_ games and _more_ frames are indeed better, Linux is a better
option that MacOS for gamers who don't want to use Windows, but
Windows is still king for now.
But if you want to make that your standard, then Linux is clearly MUCH "worse" than Apple...
...because Apple provides far more of the software packages that people
want to use.
Same standard, you agree, right?
(Man, you are bad at this!)
(BTW, that was all AMUSEMENT. :-) )
On 2026-01-04 18:34, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:43, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695aff72$0$22$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your
Macs, sir.
Apple no longer supports OS X Server. One of my Mac minis is a
server, with
multiple physical volumes attached. One has assorted USB items, cameras, >>> drawing tablets, headset, stuff like that.
but hey... you still need help.
And this represents MacOS's customization how, exactly? I had a 24-pin
dot matrix printer connected to my 286 back in the day, does that
count as customization?
I ask you again:
What actual customizations have you done to your Linux system?
BTW, do you also have a Windows system you keep for when you actually
need to be useful?
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
[...]
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install a different operating system
[...]
Really? Sez who?
On 2026-01-04 21:39, Alan wrote:And you STILL miss the point that was under discussion.
On 2026-01-04 18:28, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:28, Alan wrote:
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple overlords >>>>>>> aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
It doesn't. <snip>
Thank you.
Your bullshit irrelevant to the discussion removed.
There was no topic, zealot.
Sure there was.
It was a specific claim from someone who both claimed that ARM was
"second-best"...
...and that the best counter-examples he could provide (I infer; do
you even know the difference between "infer" and "imply". I very much
doubt it.) MIGHT surpass ARM someday.
<snipped more irrelevant bullshit>
Well, I for one agree that Apple's move to ARM was a more significant technological event than RISC-V or LoongArch (which is way behind in performance, as far as I know) hypothetically supplanting it one day. Nevertheless, the point remains that the wonderful line ARM uses is
limited to MacOS and is completely at the mercy of Apple and their
decision on how long it each machine should be supported. At least with
the competitors, you can install another system and extend the life of whatever hardware you invest in.
On 1/4/26 10:01 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
On Mon, 5 Jan 2026 02:38:52 +0000, Mr +n!on wrote:
My dad can beat up your dad.
You sound like a Dimdows user trying to impress Linux users.
Resistance is futile!
You didn't check his headers? He's posting with a macOS-native app.
CSMA added back since he's probably the type to think COLA is for those
yucky people who don't want to pay Apple $200 to upgrade a Mac from 256
to 512 GB storage, heh.
On 2026-01-04 21:41, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:33, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:29, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 18:15, CrudeSausage wrote:
they can depend on to obfuscate their drawbacks andAnd yet you can never actually articulate something that
exaggerate their better features, making it seem like
the investment in a Mac isn't overpaying Apple but in
fact an upgrade over its competition, a proposition
easily refuted by actually using the three platforms
enough to see how mediocre Apple's crapware really is.
either Linux or Windows does better.
Servers and supercomputers for Linux, gaming for Windows.
First: not what people care about for a PERSONAL computer.
You asked what Linux does better (still available to quote
above) and I told you.
In the context of what APPLE provides, yes.
Do you see the difference?
Theoretically, if Apple were to decide to produce a server product
again, I'm sure that the line of processors would do the job and
the product would be quite impressive. Nevertheless, it would
inevitably cost more and provide little to no benefit over the lower-
cost, more easily maintained Linux servers. I think Apple realized
that it's not a market they can easily penetrate.
It isn't BETTER from a computing standpoint.Second: "more" is not "better".
Being able to play every game under the sun and with excellent
performance is a lot more important to a gamer than knowing that
two or three titles Apple selected run fine on Apple's hardware.
So yes, _more_ games and _more_ frames are indeed better, Linux
is a better option that MacOS for gamers who don't want to use
Windows, but Windows is still king for now.
But if you want to make that your standard, then Linux is clearly
MUCH "worse" than Apple...
...because Apple provides far more of the software packages that
people want to use.
Same standard, you agree, right?
(Man, you are bad at this!)
(BTW, that was all AMUSEMENT. :-) )
You're moving goal posts. You're talking about what MacOS's
competition does better and I mentioned gaming which, whether you
like it or not, is still something people do on their _desktops_ and _laptops_, a segment Apple caters to. As it is, Linux has already
conquered the portable gaming market as companies see the benefit of
using the Linux-based SteamOS on portable devices rather than
Windows. Still with Steam and Proton, Linux will allow you to play
90% or more of what's available for Windows with a small performance
penalty on NVIDIA GPUs and better performance on AMD GPUs. MacOS's compatibility with the large number of titles already available for
Windows is nowhere near 90%. In most cases, Apple users have to hope
that someone is nice enough to port a game.
So not only can Linux do everything the Mac can but it can also:
1) Run servers and provide a complete set of tools for remote access
and maintenance. 2) Play about 90% of all games ever released.
Both of those at _no_ extra charge and on hardware that costs half
of what Apple charges.
On 2026-01-04 22:26, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
[...]
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install
a different operating system
[...]
Really? Sez who?
Feel free to give me a list of the operating system options
on the newer Macs.
Joel W. Crump <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:
On 1/4/26 10:01 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
On Mon, 5 Jan 2026 02:38:52 +0000, Mr |un!on wrote:
My dad can beat up your dad.
You sound like a Dimdows user trying to impress Linux users.
Resistance is futile!
You didn't check his headers? He's posting with a macOS-native app.
CSMA added back since he's probably the type to think COLA is for those
yucky people who don't want to pay Apple $200 to upgrade a Mac from 256
to 512 GB storage, heh.
[header modified]
Foolish child; I'm using a legacy 32-bit capable machine
for Usenet because my preferred User-Agent is 32 bit.
My daily driver is my 64-bit only MacBook Pro M1X.
It's a lovely machine, I'm really pleased with it.
P. S. Neener.
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 22:26, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install
a different operating system
Really? Sez who?
Feel free to give me a list of the operating system options
on the newer Macs.
You made the assertion, the onus is on you to show your proof.
So, are you a serious debater or a windbag?
On 2026-01-04 21:36, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:17, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:25, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>>>>
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple
overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run >>>>>>>>> an OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on >>>>>>>>> that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program >>>>>>>>> written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that either >>>>>>>>> Linux or
Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over >>>>>>>> macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it >>>>>>>> on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line >>>>>>>> utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven
innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and
those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far as >>>>>>> putting
stickers representing your political beliefs on the lid of the
computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Considering the amount of Macs on eBay being sold with dents, it
appears to be a serious problem on those bodies.
Proof, please!
Sure. Go to www.ebay.com, do a search for MacBook and read the
descriptions. Dents seem to be the least worrisomeof the issues though;
most of them have broken screens. I guess some Mac users are really ugly.
I completely admit that.Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks
exactly the
same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1. Looks >>>>>> at display
attached to Mac mini #2. Three different desktops; even the Docks are >>>>>> different, several apps are on only one of the machines. Hint: one >>>>>> of the Mac
minis is a server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on
your Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to your
Linux machine...
And you run rather than admit that MacOS doesn't allow for
customizations in the slightest...
Now...
...what will be your next excuse?
:-)
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll
show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though: <https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate horizontally
than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available in
the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-party,
paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not
wild with those things either.
On 2026-01-04 19:09, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 21:36, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:17, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:25, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>>>>
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple >>>>>>>>>> overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run >>>>>>>>> an OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on >>>>>>>>> that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program >>>>>>>>> written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that either >>>>>>>>> Linux or
Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over >>>>>>>> macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it >>>>>>>> on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line >>>>>>>> utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven
innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and >>>>>>>> those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far as >>>>>>> putting
stickers representing your political beliefs on the lid of the >>>>>>> computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Considering the amount of Macs on eBay being sold with dents, it
appears to be a serious problem on those bodies.
Proof, please!
Sure. Go to www.ebay.com, do a search for MacBook and read the descriptions. Dents seem to be the least worrisomeof the issues though; most of them have broken screens. I guess some Mac users are really ugly.
I completely admit that.Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks
exactly the
same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1. Looks >>>>>> at display
attached to Mac mini #2. Three different desktops; even the Docks are >>>>>> different, several apps are on only one of the machines. Hint: one >>>>>> of the Mac
minis is a server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on
your Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to your >>>> Linux machine...
And you run rather than admit that MacOS doesn't allow for
customizations in the slightest...
Now...
...what will be your next excuse?
:-)
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though: <https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-party, paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not
wild with those things either.
LOLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!
This is TOO FUNNY!
You've shown a video of a Linux distro...
...that looks almost EXACTLY like macOS!
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLL!
I don't get it. I thought he showed an imgur imageIf you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'llLOLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!
show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though:<https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate horizontally
than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available in >>> the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-party,
paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not
wild with those things either.
This is TOO FUNNY!
You've shown a video of a Linux distro...
...that looks almost EXACTLY like macOS!
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLL!
of Cinnamon...
On 2026-01-04 23:38, vallor wrote:
I don't get it. I thought he showed an imgur imageIf you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll >>> show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents meLOLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though:<https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate horizontally >>> than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available in >>> the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what >>> I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I >>> set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-party, >>> paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not
wild with those things either.
This is TOO FUNNY!
You've shown a video of a Linux distro...
...that looks almost EXACTLY like macOS!
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLL!
of Cinnamon...
Are you kidding?
Dock: it might be on the left, but it's pretty much identical to macOS (which can put it on the left if you prefer.
Menu bar: a group of small icons at the righthand end... ...just like macOS.
Folder window: a little simpler perhaps, but still so much like a macOS Finder window, it's hilarious!
I think the i5-14600 is a great choice of CPU.
(snipped, unread)
On 2026-01-04 19:14, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 21:39, Alan wrote:And you STILL miss the point that was under discussion.
On 2026-01-04 18:28, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:28, Alan wrote:
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>>Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple
overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
It doesn't. <snip>
Thank you.
Your bullshit irrelevant to the discussion removed.
There was no topic, zealot.
Sure there was.
It was a specific claim from someone who both claimed that ARM was
"second-best"...
...and that the best counter-examples he could provide (I infer; do
you even know the difference between "infer" and "imply". I very much
doubt it.) MIGHT surpass ARM someday.
<snipped more irrelevant bullshit>
Well, I for one agree that Apple's move to ARM was a more significant
technological event than RISC-V or LoongArch (which is way behind in
performance, as far as I know) hypothetically supplanting it one day.
Nevertheless, the point remains that the wonderful line ARM uses is
limited to MacOS and is completely at the mercy of Apple and their
decision on how long it each machine should be supported. At least
with the competitors, you can install another system and extend the
life of whatever hardware you invest in.
You cannot claim that ARM is "second-best" and then only present alternatives that are not better than it.
On 2026-01-04 19:33, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 21:41, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:33, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:29, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 18:15, CrudeSausage wrote:
they can depend on to obfuscate their drawbacks andAnd yet you can never actually articulate something that
exaggerate their better features, making it seem like
the investment in a Mac isn't overpaying Apple but in
fact an upgrade over its competition, a proposition
easily refuted by actually using the three platforms
enough to see how mediocre Apple's crapware really is.
either Linux or Windows does better.
Servers and supercomputers for Linux, gaming for Windows.
First: not what people care about for a PERSONAL computer.
You asked what Linux does better (still available to quote
above) and I told you.
In the context of what APPLE provides, yes.
Do you see the difference?
Theoretically, if Apple were to decide to produce a server product
again, I'm sure that the line of processors would do the job and
the product would be quite impressive. Nevertheless, it would
inevitably cost more and provide little to no benefit over the lower-
cost, more easily maintained Linux servers. I think Apple realized
that it's not a market they can easily penetrate.
But this discussion is about how Apple was supposedly "crapware"
compared to Linux or Windows.
So none of what you said about servers is in any way relevant.
It isn't BETTER from a computing standpoint.Second: "more" is not "better".
Being able to play every game under the sun and with excellent
performance is a lot more important to a gamer than knowing that
two or three titles Apple selected run fine on Apple's hardware.
So yes, _more_ games and _more_ frames are indeed better, Linux
is a better option that MacOS for gamers who don't want to use
Windows, but Windows is still king for now.
But if you want to make that your standard, then Linux is clearly
MUCH "worse" than Apple...
...because Apple provides far more of the software packages that
people want to use.
Same standard, you agree, right?
(Man, you are bad at this!)
(BTW, that was all AMUSEMENT. :-) )
You're moving goal posts. You're talking about what MacOS's
Nope!
I adopted YOUR goalposts.
competition does better and I mentioned gaming which, whether you
But the topic was how Apple COMPUTERS were supposedly worse AS COMPUTERS.
like it or not, is still something people do on their _desktops_ and
_laptops_, a segment Apple caters to. As it is, Linux has already
conquered the portable gaming market as companies see the benefit of
using the Linux-based SteamOS on portable devices rather than
Windows. Still with Steam and Proton, Linux will allow you to play
90% or more of what's available for Windows with a small performance
penalty on NVIDIA GPUs and better performance on AMD GPUs. MacOS's
compatibility with the large number of titles already available for
Windows is nowhere near 90%. In most cases, Apple users have to hope
that someone is nice enough to port a game.
So not only can Linux do everything the Mac can but it can also:
1) Run servers and provide a complete set of tools for remote access
and maintenance. 2) Play about 90% of all games ever released.
Both of those at _no_ extra charge and on hardware that costs half
of what Apple charges.
None of which is relevant to the topic that was being discussed.
You're not just repeating yourself.
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 22:26, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
[...]
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install
a different operating system
[...]
Really? Sez who?
Feel free to give me a list of the operating system options
on the newer Macs.
You made the assertion, the onus is on you to show your proof.
So, are you a serious debater or a windbag?
On 2026-01-04 19:09, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 21:36, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:17, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:25, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even >>>>>>>>>>>>> LoongArch.
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as >>>>>>>>>>>> good".
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple >>>>>>>>>>> overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run >>>>>>>>>> an OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on >>>>>>>>>> that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program >>>>>>>>>> written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that
either Linux or
Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over >>>>>>>>> macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it >>>>>>>>> on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line >>>>>>>>> utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven
innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and >>>>>>>>> those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far as >>>>>>>> putting
stickers representing your political beliefs on the lid of the >>>>>>>> computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Considering the amount of Macs on eBay being sold with dents, it
appears to be a serious problem on those bodies.
Proof, please!
Sure. Go to www.ebay.com, do a search for MacBook and read the
descriptions. Dents seem to be the least worrisomeof the issues
though; most of them have broken screens. I guess some Mac users are
really ugly.
I completely admit that.Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks
exactly the
same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1. Looks >>>>>>> at display
attached to Mac mini #2. Three different desktops; even the Docks >>>>>>> are
different, several apps are on only one of the machines. Hint:
one of the Mac
minis is a server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on
your Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to your >>>>> Linux machine...
And you run rather than admit that MacOS doesn't allow for
customizations in the slightest...
Now...
...what will be your next excuse?
:-)
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll
show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though: <https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate
horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available
in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-
party, paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but
I'm not wild with those things either.
LOLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!
This is TOO FUNNY!
You've shown a video of a Linux distro...
...that looks almost EXACTLY like macOS!
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLL!
At Sun, 4 Jan 2026 23:10:02 -0800, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:09, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 21:36, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:17, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:25, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>>>>>>
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple >>>>>>>>>>>> overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to run >>>>>>>>>>> an OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run on >>>>>>>>>>> that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a program >>>>>>>>>>> written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that either >>>>>>>>>>> Linux or
Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over >>>>>>>>>> macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it >>>>>>>>>> on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line >>>>>>>>>> utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven >>>>>>>>>> innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and >>>>>>>>>> those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far as >>>>>>>>> putting
stickers representing your political beliefs on the lid of the >>>>>>>>> computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Considering the amount of Macs on eBay being sold with dents, it
appears to be a serious problem on those bodies.
Proof, please!
Sure. Go to www.ebay.com, do a search for MacBook and read the
descriptions. Dents seem to be the least worrisomeof the issues though;
most of them have broken screens. I guess some Mac users are really ugly. >>>
I completely admit that.Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks
exactly the
same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1. Looks >>>>>>>> at display
attached to Mac mini #2. Three different desktops; even the Docks are >>>>>>>> different, several apps are on only one of the machines. Hint: one >>>>>>>> of the Mac
minis is a server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on
your Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to your >>>>>> Linux machine...
And you run rather than admit that MacOS doesn't allow for
customizations in the slightest...
Now...
...what will be your next excuse?
:-)
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll
show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though: <https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate horizontally
than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available in >>> the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-party,
paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not
wild with those things either.
LOLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!
This is TOO FUNNY!
You've shown a video of a Linux distro...
...that looks almost EXACTLY like macOS!
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLL!
I don't get it. I thought he showed an imgur image
of Cinnamon...
At Mon, 5 Jan 2026 00:24:26 -0800, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 23:38, vallor wrote:
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll >>>>> show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me >>>>> with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is aLOLLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!
screenshot of what I use though:<https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate horizontally >>>>> than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available in >>>>> the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what >>>>> I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I >>>>> set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no >>>>> more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-party, >>>>> paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not >>>>> wild with those things either.
This is TOO FUNNY!
You've shown a video of a Linux distro...
...that looks almost EXACTLY like macOS!
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLL!
And a lot of other Unix workstations. Your point?I don't get it. I thought he showed an imgur image
of Cinnamon...
Are you kidding?
Dock: it might be on the left, but it's pretty much identical to macOS
(which can put it on the left if you prefer.
Menu bar: a group of small icons at the righthand end... ...just like macOS. >>
Folder window: a little simpler perhaps, but still so much like a macOS
Finder window, it's hilarious!
How ccan you identify the MacOS finder, as opposed to any other file
browser?
On Sun, 04 Jan 2026 13:26:54 -0600, chrisv wrote:
I think the i5-14600 is a great choice of CPU.
Only Xeon W with ECC.
Xeon W is pro. Everything else is consumer junk.
Xeon W is expensive AF however, but one gets what one pays for.
On 2026-01-04 10:51 p.m., Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 22:26, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
[...]
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install
a different operating system
[...]
Really? Sez who?
Feel free to give me a list of the operating system options
on the newer Macs.
You made the assertion, the onus is on you to show your proof.
So, are you a serious debater or a windbag?
And you run...
Here is an answer from a guy called Woodmeister in Apple's own forums:
"The Linux kernel itself can easily be ported to the M1.
Where the real problem comes in is with supporting drivers
for the M1 hardware, especially video and memory management
which is completely different on M1 Macs now. Apple isn't quite
so forthcoming on the low level interfaces required, even with
commercial vendors.
As far as booting, most Linux distros I know of don't like any boot
loaders other than Linux friendly ones like GRUB even on PC platforms.
As of now, zero exist for the M1 and because of Apple boot security they
may never."
You Apple zealots might as well be muhammedans since you are very comfortable lying to protect your god.
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 10:51 p.m., Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 22:26, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install
a different operating system
Really? Sez who?
Feel free to give me a list of the operating system options
on the newer Macs.
You made the assertion, the onus is on you to show your proof.
So, are you a serious debater or a windbag?
And you run...
Here is an answer from a guy called Woodmeister in Apple's own forums:
"The Linux kernel itself can easily be ported to the M1.
Where the real problem comes in is with supporting drivers
for the M1 hardware, especially video and memory management
which is completely different on M1 Macs now. Apple isn't quite
so forthcoming on the low level interfaces required, even with
commercial vendors.
As far as booting, most Linux distros I know of don't like any boot
loaders other than Linux friendly ones like GRUB even on PC platforms.
As of now, zero exist for the M1 and because of Apple boot security they
may never."
You Apple zealots might as well be muhammedans since you are very
comfortable lying to protect your god.
I will treat that religious slur with the contempt that it deserves.
Linux and 'Doze are both quite content to run in UTM VMs on macOS.
Do you still say that they are incompatible with Apple kit?
On 2026-01-04 10:44 p.m., Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:14, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 21:39, Alan wrote:And you STILL miss the point that was under discussion.
On 2026-01-04 18:28, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:28, Alan wrote:
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as good". >>>>>>>>>>Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the SSD. >>>>>>>>>>>Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even LoongArch. >>>>>>>>>>
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple
overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
It doesn't. <snip>
Thank you.
Your bullshit irrelevant to the discussion removed.
There was no topic, zealot.
Sure there was.
It was a specific claim from someone who both claimed that ARM was
"second-best"...
...and that the best counter-examples he could provide (I infer; do
you even know the difference between "infer" and "imply". I very
much doubt it.) MIGHT surpass ARM someday.
<snipped more irrelevant bullshit>
Well, I for one agree that Apple's move to ARM was a more significant
technological event than RISC-V or LoongArch (which is way behind in
performance, as far as I know) hypothetically supplanting it one day.
Nevertheless, the point remains that the wonderful line ARM uses is
limited to MacOS and is completely at the mercy of Apple and their
decision on how long it each machine should be supported. At least
with the competitors, you can install another system and extend the
life of whatever hardware you invest in.
You cannot claim that ARM is "second-best" and then only present
alternatives that are not better than it.
It's not that I'm missing the point; it's that I don't care.
I have no
interest in debating by your ever-changing rules.
I concede that the Mx
series is better than the competition and that Qualcomm's Snapdragon products are the best alternative for now.
On 2026-01-04 19:43, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695aff72$0$22$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your Macs, sir.
Apple no longer supports OS X Server. One of my Mac minis is a server, with multiple physical volumes attached. One has assorted USB items, cameras, drawing tablets, headset, stuff like that.
but hey... you still need help.
And this represents MacOS's customization how, exactly? I had a 24-pin
dot matrix printer connected to my 286 back in the day, does that count
as customization?
On 2026-01-04 18:34, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:43, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695aff72$0$22$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on your Macs, sir.
Apple no longer supports OS X Server. One of my Mac minis is a server, with
multiple physical volumes attached. One has assorted USB items, cameras, drawing tablets, headset, stuff like that.
but hey... you still need help.
And this represents MacOS's customization how, exactly? I had a 24-pin
dot matrix printer connected to my 286 back in the day, does that count
as customization?
I ask you again:
What actual customizations have you done to your Linux system?
BTW, do you also have a Windows system you keep for when you actually
need to be useful?
Well, I for one agree that Apple's move to ARM was a moreAnd you STILL miss the point that was under discussion.
significant technological event than RISC-V or LoongArch (which is
way behind in performance, as far as I know) hypothetically
supplanting it one day. Nevertheless, the point remains that the
wonderful line ARM uses is limited to MacOS and is completely at the
mercy of Apple and their decision on how long it each machine should
be supported. At least with the competitors, you can install another
system and extend the life of whatever hardware you invest in.
You cannot claim that ARM is "second-best" and then only present
alternatives that are not better than it.
It's not that I'm missing the point; it's that I don't care.
So basic Usenet etiquette is beyond you.
I have no interest in debating by your ever-changing rules.
Where have my rules "ever-chang[ed]"?
I concede that the Mx series is better than the competition and that
Qualcomm's Snapdragon products are the best alternative for now.
There... ...was that really so hard for you to admit?
On 2026-01-05 16:42, Alan wrote:
< snip >
Well, I for one agree that Apple's move to ARM was a more
significant technological event than RISC-V or LoongArch (which is
way behind in performance, as far as I know) hypothetically
supplanting it one day. Nevertheless, the point remains that the
wonderful line ARM uses is limited to MacOS and is completely at
the mercy of Apple and their decision on how long it each machine
should be supported. At least with the competitors, you can install >>>>> another system and extend the life of whatever hardware you invest in. >>>> And you STILL miss the point that was under discussion.
You cannot claim that ARM is "second-best" and then only present
alternatives that are not better than it.
It's not that I'm missing the point; it's that I don't care.
So basic Usenet etiquette is beyond you.
You're a zealot and a stubborn, insulting one at that. You're the last person who should be commenting on etiquette.
I have no interest in debating by your ever-changing rules.
Where have my rules "ever-chang[ed]"?
Debating with you is no different than debating with Snit Michael
Glasser Prescott Parasite and Computer Guy. It's just a matter of time before you start complaining about screencasting applications and how
you are bothered by how your improved productivity and error-reduction
have been compromised.
I concede that the Mx series is better than the competition and that
Qualcomm's Snapdragon products are the best alternative for now.
There... ...was that really so hard for you to admit?
I had already admitted that, but I think it happened during one of your five-times-daily prayers in the direction of Cupertino.
Alan wrote
What actual customizations have you done to your Linux system?
i suspect that he will never answer this
WolfFan wrote:
Alan wrote
What actual customizations have you done to your Linux system?
i suspect that he will never answer this
Check the variety of Linux distributions and Linux desktop
environments. Or do those not count as "actual customizations"?
On 2026-01-05 19:59, Alan wrote:
< snip pointless Snit-like debate >
On 2026-01-04 10:48 p.m., Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:33, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 21:41, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:33, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:29, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 18:15, CrudeSausage wrote:
they can depend on to obfuscate their drawbacks andAnd yet you can never actually articulate something that
exaggerate their better features, making it seem like
the investment in a Mac isn't overpaying Apple but in
fact an upgrade over its competition, a proposition
easily refuted by actually using the three platforms
enough to see how mediocre Apple's crapware really is.
either Linux or Windows does better.
Servers and supercomputers for Linux, gaming for Windows.
First: not what people care about for a PERSONAL computer.
You asked what Linux does better (still available to quote
above) and I told you.
In the context of what APPLE provides, yes.
Do you see the difference?
Theoretically, if Apple were to decide to produce a server product
again, I'm sure that the line of processors would do the job and
the product would be quite impressive. Nevertheless, it would
inevitably cost more and provide little to no benefit over the lower-
cost, more easily maintained Linux servers. I think Apple realized
that it's not a market they can easily penetrate.
But this discussion is about how Apple was supposedly "crapware"
compared to Linux or Windows.
So none of what you said about servers is in any way relevant.
Well, since you insist on me being on point, Apple is crapware because
the moment the NVMe your machine comes from which also can't be replaced reaches its TBW, the computer becomes a literal paperweight because the component sends a signal to the rest of the machine to prevent it from turning on. I believe that is the definition of crap. I'm happy that I'm
now back on point.
It isn't BETTER from a computing standpoint.Second: "more" is not "better".
Being able to play every game under the sun and with excellent
performance is a lot more important to a gamer than knowing that
two or three titles Apple selected run fine on Apple's hardware.
So yes, _more_ games and _more_ frames are indeed better, Linux
is a better option that MacOS for gamers who don't want to use
Windows, but Windows is still king for now.
But if you want to make that your standard, then Linux is clearly
MUCH "worse" than Apple...
...because Apple provides far more of the software packages that
people want to use.
Same standard, you agree, right?
(Man, you are bad at this!)
(BTW, that was all AMUSEMENT. :-) )
You're moving goal posts. You're talking about what MacOS's
Nope!
I adopted YOUR goalposts.
competition does better and I mentioned gaming which, whether you
But the topic was how Apple COMPUTERS were supposedly worse AS COMPUTERS.
My computers don't self-destruct, Apple's do.
like it or not, is still something people do on their _desktops_ and
_laptops_, a segment Apple caters to. As it is, Linux has already
conquered the portable gaming market as companies see the benefit of
using the Linux-based SteamOS on portable devices rather than
Windows. Still with Steam and Proton, Linux will allow you to play
90% or more of what's available for Windows with a small performance
penalty on NVIDIA GPUs and better performance on AMD GPUs. MacOS's
compatibility with the large number of titles already available for
Windows is nowhere near 90%. In most cases, Apple users have to hope
that someone is nice enough to port a game.
So not only can Linux do everything the Mac can but it can also:
1) Run servers and provide a complete set of tools for remote access
and maintenance. 2) Play about 90% of all games ever released.
Both of those at _no_ extra charge and on hardware that costs half
of what Apple charges.
None of which is relevant to the topic that was being discussed.
You're not just repeating yourself.
You're right, I'm back on point and I present this as evidence of what
I'm talking about. Woe is me that instead of doing everything this
gentleman does to fix a dead MacBook, I can simply pull the old NVMe out
and put in a new one. We're missing out on Apple's greatest feature, I suppose.
On 2026-01-05 17:02, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-05 19:59, Alan wrote:
< snip pointless Snit-like debate >
Coward.
On 1/6/26 1:41 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-05 17:02, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-05 19:59, Alan wrote:
< snip pointless Snit-like debate >
Coward.
He is, but not really because of that, well bringing Snit into it is ridiculous, but nevertheless if there *were* truth to "Snit-like" here,
it would definitely apply to you.-a You avoid real debate, consistently,
and have the nerve to wonder why people think you're just a shill.
On 2026-01-06 12:27, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/6/26 1:41 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-05 17:02, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-05 19:59, Alan wrote:
< snip pointless Snit-like debate >
Coward.
He is, but not really because of that, well bringing Snit into it is
ridiculous, but nevertheless if there *were* truth to "Snit-like"
here, it would definitely apply to you.-a You avoid real debate,
consistently, and have the nerve to wonder why people think you're
just a shill.
Buzz off, kid.
On 1/6/26 3:49 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-06 12:27, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/6/26 1:41 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-05 17:02, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-05 19:59, Alan wrote:
< snip pointless Snit-like debate >
Coward.
He is, but not really because of that, well bringing Snit into it is
ridiculous, but nevertheless if there *were* truth to "Snit-like"
here, it would definitely apply to you.-a You avoid real debate,
consistently, and have the nerve to wonder why people think you're
just a shill.
Buzz off, kid.
Make me, under-developed old faggot Mactard *LOSER*.-a I would rape you.
On 2026-01-04 22:26, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
[...]
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install a different operating
system
[...]
Really?-a Sez who?
Feel free to give me a list of the operating system options on the newer Macs.
On 2026-01-04 10:51 p.m., Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 22:26, Sn!pe wrote:
CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
[...]
Since the newer Macs don't allow you to install
a different operating system
[...]
Really?-a Sez who?
Feel free to give me a list of the operating system options
on the newer Macs.
You made the assertion, the onus is on you to show your proof.
So, are you a serious debater or a windbag?
And you run...
Here is an answer from a guy called Woodmeister in Apple's own forums:
"The Linux kernel itself can easily be ported to the M1.
Where the real problem comes in is with supporting drivers
for the M1 hardware, especially video and memory management
which is completely different on M1 Macs now.-a Apple isn't quite
so forthcoming on the low level interfaces required, even with
commercial vendors.
As far as booting, most Linux distros I know of don't like any boot
loaders other than Linux friendly ones like GRUB even on PC platforms.
As of now, zero exist for the M1 and because of Apple boot security they
may never."
You Apple zealots might as well be muhammedans since you are very comfortable lying to protect your god.
Make me, under-developed old faggot Mactard *LOSER*.-a I would rape you.
Joel W. Crump wrote:
Make me, under-developed old faggot Mactard *LOSER*.-a I would rape you.
https://postimg.cc/YGtgD8gV
On 2026-01-06 13:41, Alan wrote:
< filtered >
On 1/6/26 1:41 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-05 17:02, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-05 19:59, Alan wrote:
<snip pointless Snit-like debate >
Coward.
He is, but not really because of that, well bringing Snit into it is ridiculous, but nevertheless if there *were* truth to "Snit-like" here,
it would definitely apply to you. You avoid real debate, consistently,
and have the nerve to wonder why people think you're just a shill.
On Jan 6, 2026 at 1:27:31rC>PM MST, ""Joel W. Crump"" wrote <Tee7R.1485876$Lzl2.304638@fx15.iad>:
On 1/6/26 1:41 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-05 17:02, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-05 19:59, Alan wrote:
<snip pointless Snit-like debate >
Coward.
He is, but not really because of that, well bringing Snit into it is
ridiculous, but nevertheless if there *were* truth to "Snit-like" here,
it would definitely apply to you. You avoid real debate, consistently,
and have the nerve to wonder why people think you're just a shill.
I am happy to have real discussions and even debates... but those who troll me
run. They snip, they lie, they twist... they are here just to cause harm.
On 1/7/26 5:44 PM, Brock McNuggets wrote:
On Jan 6, 2026 at 1:27:31rC>PM MST, ""Joel W. Crump"" wrote
<Tee7R.1485876$Lzl2.304638@fx15.iad>:
On 1/6/26 1:41 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-05 17:02, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-05 19:59, Alan wrote:
<snip pointless Snit-like debate >
Coward.
He is, but not really because of that, well bringing Snit into it is
ridiculous, but nevertheless if there *were* truth to "Snit-like" here,
it would definitely apply to you. You avoid real debate, consistently,
and have the nerve to wonder why people think you're just a shill.
I am happy to have real discussions and even debates... but those who troll me
run. They snip, they lie, they twist... they are here just to cause harm.
I've seen regulars have a problem with you but never give a valid reason
for it.
While I advocate(d) for Linux, speaking of using it in schools and even helping many students use it at school and home, and talk about the benefits of doing so, I also spoke of benefits of other systems, especially macOS. But even as I did so I shared my view that people should use what they like -- I am a tech advocate who sees value in Linux, macOS, and Windows (and more). Some did not see that as "pure" enough.
On 08/01/2026 13:47, Brock McNuggets wrote:
While I advocate(d) for Linux, speaking of using it in schools and even
helping many students use it at school and home, and talk about the benefits >> of doing so, I also spoke of benefits of other systems, especially macOS. But
even as I did so I shared my view that people should use what they like -- I >> am a tech advocate who sees value in Linux, macOS, and Windows (and more). >> Some did not see that as "pure" enough.
I'm aware that you have a very wide knowledge base and have never, as
far as I'm aware, misled me in any way.
I'm currently running Linux Mint 22.2 on my old (2009) 24 inch iMac and
it works just fine.
I've set up my 27 inch iMac as a dual boot arrangement as macOS Ventura
is the most up-to-date I can now install on this 2017 iMac.
However, when I last started up this 2017 iMac with Linux Mint 22.2 I
could not get my Bluetooth Apple Magic Mouse to work (move the mouse pointer). It said it was paired, but it just would not work (a wired
mouse DID move the cursor).
Any suggestions of how I should identify and correct the problem?
Thanks.--
On 08/01/2026 13:47, Brock McNuggets wrote:
While I advocate(d) for Linux, speaking of using it in schools and even
helping many students use it at school and home, and talk about the benefits >> of doing so, I also spoke of benefits of other systems, especially macOS. But
even as I did so I shared my view that people should use what they like -- I >> am a tech advocate who sees value in Linux, macOS, and Windows (and more). >> Some did not see that as "pure" enough.
I'm aware that you have a very wide knowledge base and have never, as
far as I'm aware, misled me in any way.
I'm currently running Linux Mint 22.2 on my old (2009) 24 inch iMac and
it works just fine.
I've set up my 27 inch iMac as a dual boot arrangement as macOS Ventura
is the most up-to-date I can now install on this 2017 iMac.
However, when I last started up this 2017 iMac with Linux Mint 22.2 I
could not get my Bluetooth Apple Magic Mouse to work (move the mouse pointer). It said it was paired, but it just would not work (a wired
mouse DID move the cursor).
Any suggestions of how I should identify and correct the problem?
Thanks.
However, when I last started up this 2017 iMac with Linux Mint 22.2 I
could not get my Bluetooth Apple Magic Mouse to work (move the mouse
pointer). It said it was paired, but it just would not work (a wired
mouse DID move the cursor).
My advice to you is to ask anyone but snit for advice.
WolfFan wrote:
Alan wrote
What actual customizations have you done to your Linux system?
i suspect that he will never answer this
Check the variety of Linux distributions and Linux desktop
environments. Or do those not count as "actual customizations"?
On 2026-01-06 07:27, chrisv wrote:
WolfFan wrote:
Alan wrote
What actual customizations have you done to your Linux system?
i suspect that he will never answer this
Check the variety of Linux distributions and Linux desktop
environments.-a Or do those not count as "actual customizations"?
It's becoming pretty clear that this is no different than arguing with a muhammedan on the street. No matter how much you answer their question,
they will say that you didn't and ask you another one to "win" the
debate again you.
Check the variety of Linux distributions and Linux desktop
environments. Or do those not count as "actual customizations"?
They do not.
To "customize" something is to change it from how you got it.
Alan wrote:
Check the variety of Linux distributions and Linux desktop
environments. Or do those not count as "actual customizations"?
They do not.
...said the unreasonable dipshit.
To "customize" something is to change it from how you got it.
Linux users have tons of freedom to do that, also.
On 2026-01-12 05:05, chrisv wrote:
Alan wrote:
Check the variety of Linux distributions and Linux desktop
environments. Or do those not count as "actual customizations"?
They do not.
...said the unreasonable dipshit.
To "customize" something is to change it from how you got it.
Linux users have tons of freedom to do that, also.
That may be true--it is true of course...
...but the question I was asking was whether he actually DID it.
At Mon, 12 Jan 2026 08:12:13 -0800, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2026-01-12 05:05, chrisv wrote:
Alan wrote:
Check the variety of Linux distributions and Linux desktop
environments. Or do those not count as "actual customizations"?
They do not.
...said the unreasonable dipshit.
To "customize" something is to change it from how you got it.
Linux users have tons of freedom to do that, also.
That may be true--it is true of course...
...but the question I was asking was whether he actually DID it.
Were you unsatisfied with the answer he gave?
On 2026-01-04 21:36, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:17, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:25, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the >>>>>>>>>>>> SSD.
Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even
LoongArch.
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as >>>>>>>>>> good".
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple
overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to
run an OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run
on that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a
program written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that
either Linux or Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over >>>>>>> macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it >>>>>>> on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line >>>>>>> utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven
innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and
those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far
as putting stickers representing your political beliefs on the
lid of the computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Considering the amount of Macs on eBay being sold with dents, it
appears to be a serious problem on those bodies.
Proof, please!
Sure. Go to www.ebay.com, do a search for MacBook and read the
descriptions. Dents seem to be the least worrisomeof the issues
though; most of them have broken screens. I guess some Mac users are
really ugly.
I completely admit that.Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks
exactly the same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1.
Looks at display attached to Mac mini #2. Three different
desktops; even the Docks are different, several apps are on
only one of the machines. Hint: one of the Mac minis is a
server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on
your Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to
your Linux machine...
And you run rather than admit that MacOS doesn't allow for
customizations in the slightest...
Now...
...what will be your next excuse?
:-)
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll
show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though: <https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate
horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available
in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a
third-party, paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to,
but I'm not wild with those things either.
At Sun, 4 Jan 2026 22:09:53 -0500, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:
On 2026-01-04 21:36, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:17, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 19:25, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-04 16:01, CrudeSausage wrote:
On 2026-01-04 18:44, WolfFan wrote:
On Jan 4, 2026, CrudeSausage wrote
(in article<695a6593$2$23$882e4bbb@reader.netnews.com>):
On 2026-01-04 07:08, Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
Alan wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
On 2026-01-03 14:07, Joel W. Crump wrote:
On 1/3/26 4:57 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-03 13:50, Lawrence DrCOOliveiro wrote:
On Sat, 03 Jan 2026 20:35:17 +0000, Tyrone wrote:
Arm CPUs are the best thing to happen to PCs since the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> SSD.
Second-best. RISC-V may yet surpass them. Maybe even >>>>>>>>>>>>> LoongArch.
Ummmm... "may yet surpass" literally means "aren't YET as >>>>>>>>>>>> good".
And as usual, Linux is leading the way.
LOL!
Linux and Windows both support ARM, your precious Apple
overlords aren't
So? How does that show Linux "leading the way"?
There's more to leading the way that simply being able to
run an OS.
People don't use the OS: they use applications that can run >>>>>>>>>> on that OS.
And Apple has lead the way in making it possible to run a
program written for a different architecture on new one.
Motorola to PowerPC
PowerPC to Intel
And now, Intel to Apple Silicon.
This isn't the flex you think it is.
<snip>
And yet you can never actually articulate something that
either Linux or Windows does better.
AI Overview
Linux generally offers superior customization, hardware
choice, open-source freedom, and powerful developer tools over >>>>>>>>> macOS, allowing users to tailor the OS extensively, install it >>>>>>>>> on diverse (often cheaper) hardware, use powerful command-line >>>>>>>>> utilities (Bash, Docker), and benefit from community-driven
innovation, making it ideal for power users, developers, and >>>>>>>>> those prioritizing control and flexibility.
Bottom line: Linux makes me happy!
Speaking of customization, for Mac users, it only goas as far
as putting stickers representing your political beliefs on the >>>>>>>> lid of the computer.
not on any of mine.
Then, how do you hide the dent caused by merely looking at it?
Why must you make shit up?
Considering the amount of Macs on eBay being sold with dents, it
appears to be a serious problem on those bodies.
Proof, please!
Sure. Go to www.ebay.com, do a search for MacBook and read the
descriptions. Dents seem to be the least worrisomeof the issues
though; most of them have broken screens. I guess some Mac users are
really ugly.
I completely admit that.Every desktop looks exactly the same, every computer looks
exactly the same.
looks at MacBook. Looks at display attached to Mac mini #1.
Looks at display attached to Mac mini #2. Three different
desktops; even the Docks are different, several apps are on
only one of the machines. Hint: one of the Mac minis is a
server, with multiple volumes attached.
Feel free to show us the extensive customization you've done on
your Macs, sir.
Feel free to show the "extensive customization" you've done to
your Linux machine...
And you run rather than admit that MacOS doesn't allow for
customizations in the slightest...
Now...
...what will be your next excuse?
:-)
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll
show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though: <https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate
horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available
in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a
third-party, paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to,
but I'm not wild with those things either.
According to Alan, this isn't customization.
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll
show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though: <https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate horizontally
than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available
in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-party,
paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not
wild with those things either.
According to Alan, this isn't customization.
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 17:28:30 +0000, vallor wrote:
< snip >
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, I'll
show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default, presents me
with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. Here is a
screenshot of what I use though: <https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate horizontally
than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available
in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is what
I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so I
set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a third-party,
paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not
wild with those things either.
According to Alan, this isn't customization.
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
That's because Alan knows very well that Apple doesn't allow you to do
much to deviate from the standard MacOS desktop. You can change the wallpaper, you can move the dock and you can choose which of their widgets are interesting to you. That's about it. Anything more than that would probably cause Apple to excommunicate you and for Apple users themselves
to start doing the unfathomable: thinking for themselves.
Either way, there is no communicating with Alan. If you need to know what
he thinks about something, just create a script which automatically
delivers the Apple-endorsed response.
On 2026-01-12 09:58, CrudeSausage wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 17:28:30 +0000, vallor wrote:
< snip >
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop,
I'll show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default,
presents me with most of what I want out of a desktop experience.
Here is a screenshot of what I use though:
<https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate
horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already
available in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is
what I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared,
so I set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is
no more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a
third-party, paid application. I could do more if I really wanted
to, but I'm not wild with those things either.
According to Alan, this isn't customization.
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
That's because Alan knows very well that Apple doesn't allow you to
do much to deviate from the standard MacOS desktop. You can change
the wallpaper, you can move the dock and you can choose which of
their widgets are interesting to you. That's about it. Anything
more than that would probably cause Apple to excommunicate you and
for Apple users themselves to start doing the unfathomable:
thinking for themselves.
Either way, there is no communicating with Alan. If you need to
know what he thinks about something, just create a script which automatically delivers the Apple-endorsed response.
Of the 5 things you listed, I can do most of them.
I can reposition the Dock.
I can remove elements from the Dock.
I can use different icons.
The two I can't do are PURELY cosmetic.
At Mon, 12 Jan 2026 10:06:21 -0800, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2026-01-12 09:58, CrudeSausage wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 17:28:30 +0000, vallor wrote:
< snip >
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop,
I'll show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default,
presents me with most of what I want out of a desktop experience.
Here is a screenshot of what I use though:
<https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate
horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already
available in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is
what I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared,
so I set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is
no more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a
third-party, paid application. I could do more if I really wanted
to, but I'm not wild with those things either.
According to Alan, this isn't customization.
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
That's because Alan knows very well that Apple doesn't allow you to
do much to deviate from the standard MacOS desktop. You can change
the wallpaper, you can move the dock and you can choose which of
their widgets are interesting to you. That's about it. Anything
more than that would probably cause Apple to excommunicate you and
for Apple users themselves to start doing the unfathomable:
thinking for themselves.
Either way, there is no communicating with Alan. If you need to
know what he thinks about something, just create a script which
automatically delivers the Apple-endorsed response.
Of the 5 things you listed, I can do most of them.
I can reposition the Dock.
I can remove elements from the Dock.
I can use different icons.
The two I can't do are PURELY cosmetic.
So? Who says customizations have to be anything
_but_ cosmetic?
CS casually made changes to his desktop that he
didn't even have to think about...at least one of which
is impossible on a Mac.
And your initial reaction to his post was to laugh and mock,
because you think Cosmic looks like MacOS.
How many Unix desktops have you seen? (Besides MacOS,--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
that is...)
On 2026-01-12 09:58, CrudeSausage wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 17:28:30 +0000, vallor wrote:
< snip >
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
That's because Alan knows very well that Apple doesn't allow you to do
much to deviate from the standard MacOS desktop. You can change the
wallpaper, you can move the dock and you can choose which of their widgets >> are interesting to you. That's about it. Anything more than that would
probably cause Apple to excommunicate you and for Apple users themselves
to start doing the unfathomable: thinking for themselves.
--Either way, there is no communicating with Alan. If you need to know what
he thinks about something, just create a script which automatically
delivers the Apple-endorsed response.
Of the 5 things you listed, I can do most of them.
I can reposition the Dock.
I can remove elements from the Dock.
I can use different icons.
The two I can't do are PURELY cosmetic.
On 2026-01-12 10:20, vallor wrote:
At Mon, 12 Jan 2026 10:06:21 -0800, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2026-01-12 09:58, CrudeSausage wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 17:28:30 +0000, vallor wrote:
< snip >
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop,
I'll show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default,
presents me with most of what I want out of a desktop experience.
Here is a screenshot of what I use though:
<https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate
horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already
available in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is
what I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared,
so I set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is
no more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a
third-party, paid application. I could do more if I really wanted
to, but I'm not wild with those things either.
According to Alan, this isn't customization.
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
That's because Alan knows very well that Apple doesn't allow you to
do much to deviate from the standard MacOS desktop. You can change
the wallpaper, you can move the dock and you can choose which of
their widgets are interesting to you. That's about it. Anything
more than that would probably cause Apple to excommunicate you and
for Apple users themselves to start doing the unfathomable:
thinking for themselves.
Either way, there is no communicating with Alan. If you need to
know what he thinks about something, just create a script which
automatically delivers the Apple-endorsed response.
Of the 5 things you listed, I can do most of them.
I can reposition the Dock.
I can remove elements from the Dock.
I can use different icons.
The two I can't do are PURELY cosmetic.
So?-a Who says customizations have to be anything
_but_ cosmetic?
No one. But it shows how trivial this business of "I can customize, and
you can't, neener-neener!" really is.
CS casually made changes to his desktop that he
didn't even have to think about...at least one of which
is impossible on a Mac.
You KNOW it's impossible do, you?
Checked, have you?
And your initial reaction to his post was to laugh and mock,
because you think Cosmic looks like MacOS.
You don't find it funny that someone with such animus to macOS chooses
to use an OS that strongly resembles it?
How many Unix desktops have you seen?-a (Besides MacOS,
that is...)
Alan wrote:
(snipped, unread)
Were you unsatisfied with the answer he gave?
...
Well, I for one agree that Apple's move to ARM was a more significant technological event than RISC-V or LoongArch (which is way behind in performance, as far as I know) hypothetically supplanting it one day.
Nevertheless, the point remains that the wonderful line ARM uses is
limited to MacOS and is completely at the mercy of Apple and their
decision on how long it each machine should be supported. At least with
the competitors, you can install another system and extend the life of whatever hardware you invest in.
...
IrCOve never so much as set foot in a Starbucks. Ever.
...
On 1/12/26 1:40 PM, Alan wrote:
On 2026-01-12 10:20, vallor wrote:
At Mon, 12 Jan 2026 10:06:21 -0800, Alan <nuh-uh@nope.com> wrote:
On 2026-01-12 09:58, CrudeSausage wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 17:28:30 +0000, vallor wrote:
< snip >
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop, >>>>>>> I'll show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default,
presents me with most of what I want out of a desktop experience. >>>>>>> Here is a screenshot of what I use though:
<https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate
horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already
available in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely. >>>>>>>
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is >>>>>>> what I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, >>>>>>> so I set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is >>>>>>> no more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a
third-party, paid application. I could do more if I really wanted >>>>>>> to, but I'm not wild with those things either.
According to Alan, this isn't customization.
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
That's because Alan knows very well that Apple doesn't allow you to
do much to deviate from the standard MacOS desktop. You can change
the wallpaper, you can move the dock and you can choose which of
their widgets are interesting to you. That's about it. Anything
more than that would probably cause Apple to excommunicate you and
for Apple users themselves to start doing the unfathomable:
thinking for themselves.
Either way, there is no communicating with Alan. If you need to
know what he thinks about something, just create a script which
automatically delivers the Apple-endorsed response.
Of the 5 things you listed, I can do most of them.
I can reposition the Dock.
I can remove elements from the Dock.
I can use different icons.
The two I can't do are PURELY cosmetic.
So?-a Who says customizations have to be anything
_but_ cosmetic?
No one. But it shows how trivial this business of "I can customize,
and you can't, neener-neener!" really is.
CS casually made changes to his desktop that he
didn't even have to think about...at least one of which
is impossible on a Mac.
You KNOW it's impossible do, you?
Checked, have you?
And your initial reaction to his post was to laugh and mock,
because you think Cosmic looks like MacOS.
You don't find it funny that someone with such animus to macOS chooses
to use an OS that strongly resembles it?
How many Unix desktops have you seen?-a (Besides MacOS,
that is...)
You clearly have a strange need to see Apple imitated, despite how
uncommon it actually is.-a They led with smartphones, but never with desktops.
<snip>
Because my basic question is: what is stopping the FOSS developers from
also writing a Linux flavor for Apple silicon?
I know of the Asahi Linux project, who's reportedly already doing this.
As such, how is there any valid differentiation to be claimed between
x86 based systems -vs- Apple M based systems?
On 2026-01-12 09:58, CrudeSausage wrote:
On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 17:28:30 +0000, vallor wrote:
< snip >
If you're looking for the customizations I've done on my desktop,
I'll show you the few I've done to Pop_OS! which, by default,
presents me with most of what I want out of a desktop experience.
Here is a screenshot of what I use though:
<https://imgur.com/a/EHb95Ix>
1) The dock is on the left since there is more real estate
horizontally than vertically.
2) Since the workspace and applications options are already available
in the panel, I've removed them from the dock entirely.
3) I prefer the Kora icons to the default Cosmic ones, so that is
what I'm using there.
4) I find that the dock looks better rounded rather than squared, so
I set it up that way.
5) I find that the dock and panel look best when their opacity is no
more than 50%.
Those are five customizations I can do without requiring a
third-party,
paid application. I could do more if I really wanted to, but I'm not
wild with those things either.
According to Alan, this isn't customization.
Meanwhile, he hasn't said how he's customized his Mac.
I smell a rat.
That's because Alan knows very well that Apple doesn't allow you to do
much to deviate from the standard MacOS desktop. You can change the
wallpaper, you can move the dock and you can choose which of their
widgets are interesting to you. That's about it. Anything more than
that would probably cause Apple to excommunicate you and for Apple
users themselves to start doing the unfathomable: thinking for
themselves.
Either way, there is no communicating with Alan. If you need to know
what he thinks about something, just create a script which
automatically delivers the Apple-endorsed response.
Of the 5 things you listed, I can do most of them.
I can reposition the Dock.
I can remove elements from the Dock.
I can use different icons.
The two I can't do are PURELY cosmetic.
vallor wrote:
Alan wrote:
(snipped, unread)
Were you unsatisfied with the answer he gave?
Of course not. He's an unreasonable dipshit.
In fact, the variety of Linux distributions and Linux desktop
environments *do* count as "actual customizations". The result is tons
of choice "out of the box" and also tons of choice for the end user to customize, to "mix and match".
But, being an unreasonable dipshit, "Alan" is unable to concede any
advantage of GNU/Linux over his beloved Apple.
P.S. Both of today's "Alan" posts were deleted, unread, as will any
future posts of his, in this thread. As we've seen, the "Alan" dipshit
needs to have the last word.
On 1/4/26 22:14, CrudeSausage wrote:
...
Ummm... I've not been following this thread, but I'm quickly browsing
through it to catch up & see if it is anything new.
To that end, this statement caught my eye:
(preamble):
Well, I for one agree that Apple's move to ARM was a more significant
technological event than RISC-V or LoongArch (which is way behind in
performance, as far as I know) hypothetically supplanting it one day.
(this part):
Nevertheless, the point remains that the wonderful line ARM uses is
limited to MacOS and is completely at the mercy of Apple and their
decision on how long it each machine should be supported. At least with
the competitors, you can install another system and extend the life of
whatever hardware you invest in.
Where these competitors are various flavors of Linux, right?
Anyone else really?
Because my basic question is: what is stopping the FOSS developers from
also writing a Linux flavor for Apple silicon?
I know of the Asahi Linux project, who's reportedly already doing this.
As such, how is there any valid differentiation to be claimed between
x86 based systems -vs- Apple M based systems?
-hh wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
<snip>
Because my basic question is: what is stopping the FOSS developers from
also writing a Linux flavor for Apple silicon?
I know of the Asahi Linux project, who's reportedly already doing this.
Here's one:
<https://git.zerfleddert.de/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi/m1-debian/>
Apparently some hardware still doesn't work.
As such, how is there any valid differentiation to be claimed between
x86 based systems -vs- Apple M based systems?
You're comparing apples and oranges :-D
Shouldn't you be comparing Mx and ARM?
-hh wrote this post by blinking in Morse code:
<snip>
Because my basic question is: what is stopping the FOSS developers from
also writing a Linux flavor for Apple silicon?
I know of the Asahi Linux project, who's reportedly already doing this.
Here's one:
<https://git.zerfleddert.de/cgi-bin/gitweb.cgi/m1-debian/>
Apparently some hardware still doesn't work.
... their actual complaint ... is that they find Apple hardware too
expensive for their personal budget.
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