From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Off-topic discussion to ask how we can get Frank Slootweg to stop trolling.

Given this year we're trying hard to not respond to the incessant personal attacks from the likes of the Frank Slootweg trolls, we can use this placeholder thread to document the many trolls by Frank Slootweg w/o
responding directly to his incessant never-ending personal attacks in the technical threads where Frank Slootweg attempts to derail important topics
to defending against his attacks.

It takes hours to document the original posts in any technical thread.
It takes Frank Slootweg mere seconds to derail topics he doesn't like.

It's unfair to all the work the rest of us invest in technical topics.
And hence, it needs to be publicly pointed out and saved for posterity.

The hope is that Frank Slootweg will STOP his incessant trolling attacks.
And begin to helpfully contribute to the technical topics being discussed.

Cross your fingers... and hope...
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Regarding this technical thread about contacts privacy on this newsgroup:

From: Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com>
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android
Subject: How many apps on your phone have contacts read permission?
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 16:51:26 -0500
Message-ID: <10mg98t$pig$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>

I have 78 or 79, including system apps that have read permission to my
contacts, although none of them can get even a single contact from me.

How many do you have?
----------------------

This is Frank Slootweg's contribution to this privacy-strategy discussion:

From: Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid>
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android
Subject: Re: How many apps on your phone have contacts read permission?
Date: 14 Feb 2026 10:38:36 GMT
Message-ID: <10mpmrf.18m8.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>

Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2026-02-13 18:34, Maria Sophia wrote:

[...]

That's your claim, and we do not accept it. We are all respectful of
other people privacy when using the Android contact app.

I think it's rather disrespectful of 'Arlen' to put the names
and e-mail addresses of his contacts "on the cloud".

And no 'Arlen', this is not trolling, this is just exposing
the inconsistency in your argument.

And yes 'Arlen', I've made this argument before and you ignored it
and silently snipped it. We wonder why.
----------------------

And this is my restrained response, as I did not wish to derail the
technical discussion since Frank's motive was clearly not technical.

Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android
Subject: Re: How many apps on your phone have contacts read permission?
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2026 15:44:46 -0500
Message-ID: <10mqmru$28q7$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>

Frank Slootweg wrote:

That's your claim, and we do not accept it. We are all respectful of
other people privacy when using the Android contact app.

I think it's rather disrespectful of 'Arlen' to put the names and
e-mail addresses of his contacts "on the cloud".

And no 'Arlen', this is not trolling, this is just exposing the inconsistency in your argument.

And yes 'Arlen', I've made this argument before and you ignored it and silently snipped it. We wonder why.

Hi Frank,

You are misrepresenting what I actually do with contacts.

My setup is simple. The system contacts database on my phone is empty
and I use a separate, sandboxed contacts app which stores its data in
its own database. That means the many packages with read permission
on the system contacts provider have nothing at all to read.

I do not store my contacts in any public cloud service. If you have a
specific quote where I said otherwise, please feel free to point to it.

If you see a technical inconsistency in that model, describe it in
concrete terms and we can talk about it. Personal remarks about my
respect for privacy do not change how the data flows actually work.
----------------------

Following will be my technical analysis of Frank's troll stratagem
which I carefully avoided falling into with that measured response.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Maria Sophia wrote:

Following will be my technical analysis of Frank's troll stratagem
which I carefully avoided falling into with that measured response.

Most of us on this newsgroup are trying to discuss concrete technical
issues such as contacts read permissions, system apps & content providers
in the aforementioned recent technical thread, but the ever-pervasive
trolls keep pulling the thread from the topic into their own personal
a. Identity drama (Arlen vs Maria vs XDA).
b. Meta arguments between the trolls about who is insulting whom.
c. Frank's false accusations of hypocrisy instead of technical discussion.

It's not the adults on this newsgroup who are doing this.
Its the trolls s|b, Alan Baker, Kerr-Mudd, Rudolph & Franklin doing it.

In this latest attack, Franklin is clearly leaning into this stratagem:

1. Franklin reframes my position so he can attack a straw version of it.
I'm advocating minimizing exposure of contacts.
Franklin reframes it as "I put contacts on the cloud" (which is false)
but he frames it as true so as to re-style me as a hypocrite.

2. Franklin asserts facts about my behavior without any evidence.
For example, Franklin states as fact that I put names and email
addresses in the cloud, but Franklin does not show where I ever
said that or how he knows it (given I don't do it after all).

3. Franklin shifts from a technical discussion to moral accusation.
Instead of "your model is technically flawed", Franklin goes to
"it is disrespectful for me to do X".
That is designed as a direct personal attack, not to clarify.

4. Franklin claims this is not trolling while incessantly repeatedly
doing exactly what trolls do.
When Franklin asserts "This is not trolling, this is just exposing
the inconsistency", it's Franklin's way to preemptively excuse
himself while still incessantly hurling personal attacks at me.

5. Franklin invokes past, allegedly ignored prior arguments to put me
on the back foot when he deceitfully claims he has "made this
argument before": and I "ignored it", which is Franklin's way
to paint you as evasive and dishonest as there is no way to
defend against Franklin's fabrications sans any references.

6. Franklin tries to force me into defending my character instead
of the respectful privacy-based use model which I have proposed.

In summary, the goal of the trolls (s|b, Alan Baker, Kerr-Mudd,
Franklin & Rudolph) is to derail this privacy-based technical
discussion thread from being about contacts, permissions & data flows
to being whatever strawman argument those trolls want it to be.
a. Alan Baker -> It's about XDA Developers accounts apparently
b. Kerr-Mudd -> It's about his need for attention apparently
c. s|b -> It's hard to figure out what his issues are
etc.

When Franklin uses his "we" language to claim a group against me, yet
without stating even a single verifiable fact, he's trying to provoke me
into a moral defense to his personal feelings about a technical topic.

"We do not accept it" and "we wonder why" are classic moves to
imply that the group is united and that I am the outlier for trying to
discuss a technical topic, specifically how to tell which apps have read permission on the Android 12+ default sqlite contacts database.

Since Franklin responded to Carlos in attacking me, we need to ask:
What is Carlos doing in this thread?
(but only in response to why Franklin chose to piggyback off him)

As far as I can tell...
a. Carlos is trying to keep his own boundaries, for example, he says
"You do not decide who I answer or why or what I write" which is
his way of saying "do not manage my behavior" (AFAICT).

c. Carlos is apparently feeling accused and therefore he is pushing back.
When Carlos amplifies trolls and I point it out to him, Carlos
responds with "that is your claim".

c. Carlos is not really attempting to discuss the technical model.
For example, he is not walking through the empty system contacts db
idea of the sandboxed app, or data flows. He is reacting to tone.

Carlos is not as openly combative as Franklin is, but he is also not
going to stop amplifying the off topic trolls, as he enjoys them himself.

This is my attempt at understanding the motives and methods used by Frank Slootweg in the aforementioned technical thread, where we can all take note that Andy, Jeff, Carlos and I listed how many apps had read permission.

Did Franklin report to the team how many apps had his read permission?
Did Franklin show any understanding of the topic that was being discussed?
What was Franklin's purpose if his posts have nothing to do with the topic?
--
Given Frank clearly deprecatres Arlen I will publicly state I will call him Franklin only when he uses "Arlen" (yet Frank otherwise) to make a point.

--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-14 12:55, Maria Sophia wrote:

Off-topic discussion to ask how we can get Frank Slootweg to stop trolling.

Given this year we're trying hard to not respond to the incessant personal attacks from the likes of the Frank Slootweg trolls, we can use this placeholder thread to document the many trolls by Frank Slootweg w/o responding directly to his incessant never-ending personal attacks in the technical threads where Frank Slootweg attempts to derail important topics
to defending against his attacks.

It takes hours to document the original posts in any technical thread.
It takes Frank Slootweg mere seconds to derail topics he doesn't like.

It's unfair to all the work the rest of us invest in technical topics.
And hence, it needs to be publicly pointed out and saved for posterity.

The hope is that Frank Slootweg will STOP his incessant trolling attacks.
And begin to helpfully contribute to the technical topics being discussed.

Cross your fingers... and hope...

Hmmmmm...seems like you're "insulting" Frank.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> wrote:

Regarding this technical thread about contacts privacy on this newsgroup:

From: Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com>
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android
Subject: How many apps on your phone have contacts read permission?
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2026 16:51:26 -0500
Message-ID: <10mg98t$pig$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>

I have 78 or 79, including system apps that have read permission to my
contacts, although none of them can get even a single contact from me.

How many do you have?
----------------------

This is Frank Slootweg's contribution to this privacy-strategy discussion:

Nope, that was *not* my response to your question ("How many do you
have?"). I answered your question and gave details my apps which have
read permission for contacts.

What you quote (below) is a much later response and *not* related to
your question, but, as evidenced by the attribution, to what Carlos
posted.

Moral: Read for comprehension and do not engage your army of straw
men.

From: Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid>
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android
Subject: Re: How many apps on your phone have contacts read permission?
Date: 14 Feb 2026 10:38:36 GMT
Message-ID: <10mpmrf.18m8.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>

Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2026-02-13 18:34, Maria Sophia wrote:

[...]

That's your claim, and we do not accept it. We are all respectful of other people privacy when using the Android contact app.

I think it's rather disrespectful of 'Arlen' to put the names
and e-mail addresses of his contacts "on the cloud".

And no 'Arlen', this is not trolling, this is just exposing
the inconsistency in your argument.

And yes 'Arlen', I've made this argument before and you ignored it
and silently snipped it. We wonder why.

[...]
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Another example today of Frank's incessant trolling of this newsgroup is
this exchange between a reasonable poster and Frank Slootweg just now.

In a privacy-related thread discussing how to explore the read permissions
on the Android default sqlite contacts database, after over 50 discussions, Frank Slootweg doesn't answer the question, but sends this veiled riddle.

From: Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid>
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android
Subject: Re: How many apps on your phone have contacts read permission?
Date: 14 Feb 2026 10:38:36 GMT
Message-ID: <10mpmrf.18m8.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>

I think it's rather disrespectful of 'Arlen' to put the names and
e-mail addresses of his contacts "on the cloud".

And no 'Arlen', this is not trolling, this is just exposing the
inconsistency in your argument.

And yes 'Arlen', I've made this argument before and you ignored it and silently snipped it. We wonder why.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ignoring the personal attack, I responsibly openly & honestly replied with: ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2026 15:44:46 -0500
Message-ID: <10mqmru$28q7$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>

Hi Frank,

You are misrepresenting what I actually do with contacts.

My setup is simple. The system contacts database on my phone is empty
and I use a separate, sandboxed contacts app which stores its data in
its own database. That means the many packages with read permission
on the system contacts provider have nothing at all to read.

I do not store my contacts in any public cloud service. If you have a
specific quote where I said otherwise, please feel free to point to it.

If you see a technical inconsistency in that model, describe it in
concrete terms and we can talk about it. Personal remarks about my
respect for privacy do not change how the data flows actually work.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Instead of openly & honestly responding, Frank repeated silly riddles: ---------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Re: How many apps on your phone have contacts read permission?
Date: 15 Feb 2026 13:25:58 GMT

Nope, I'm not, but you're so caught up in the phone/phone-number
contacts part that you do not even (seem to) realize that you put the
names and e-mail addresses of your contacts "on the cloud".

I do not store my contacts in any public cloud service.

Yes, you do store the names and e-mail addresses of your contacts on a
public service, you just don't realize it. The public service you use is
as liable to leaking contact information as the Google service you don't
(want to) use. That's the inconsistency in your argument.

-------------------------------------------------------------------
To which Richmond openly & honestly inquisitively asked for details. -------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2026 13:53:00 +0000
Message-ID: <82pl66ru4j.fsf@example.com>

That's not the way I read it. I read it as he doesn't use the contacts
app, he puts his contacts somewhere else, presumably somewhere which is
not stored or backed up to the cloud. (Although Google Contacts are
encrypted in the cloud anyway, so it is only on the phone where apps
have permission to read them that it matters).

------------------------------------------------------------------------- Instead of openly & honestly faithfully answering the question, Frank says: -------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 15 Feb 2026 14:04:00 GMT
Message-ID: <10msn8m.s94.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>

I'm not commenting on what he says, but on what he does *not* say, but
still *does*, without realizing it.

| (Although Google Contacts are encrypted in the cloud anyway, so it is
| only on the phone where apps have permission to read them that it matters).

I think he begs to differ! :-)

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Being reasonable, Richmond asked yet again, openly & honestly, for facts. -------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2026 14:10:07 +0000
Message-ID: <82ldgurtc0.fsf@example.com>

OK, what is it he does without realising it, and how did you know about
it if he didn't?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Frank again repeated his riddle which only he gets to make the rules for. -------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: 15 Feb 2026 14:32:05 GMT
Message-ID: <10msota.18d0.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>

Sorry, but that's for him (and perhaps for you?) to find out. I'm not
going to spoil it.

In case you're not aware of who and what 'Maria' a.k.a. 'Arlen' is, I
can understand that this looks a rather strange way of (not) discussing
things. Be patient.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
In exasperation at Frank's trolls wasting our valuable time, I explained: -------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2026 13:13:45 -0500
Message-ID: <10mt2cp$lau$1@nnrp.usenet.blueworldhosting.com>

Hi Richmond,

What is happening here with Frank is not a technical discussion at all.
It is a rhetorical game. Frank is deliberately withholding his supposed "gotcha" so he can posture as the clever one in the room.

It's Frank's game, but that is not how reasonable people behave when they actually have a technical point they wish to discuss openly & honestly.

Any reasonable participant would ask exactly what you asked:
"OK, what is it he does without realising it,
and how did you know about it if he did not?"

And notice what happened next, he dodged the question again.
Dodging is the tell.

If he had honest motives on a technical argument, he would simply state it. But Frank is inherently a dishonest person to the core as we can see here.

Instead of answering your repeated open and honest questions, Frank repeats
the same vague accusation, refuses to explain it, and hides behind a
childish "I will not spoil it" conspiracy-theme "only I know it" routine.

That is not analysis, it is performance.

This is his signature Usenet move:
a. Imply he knows something secret
b. Refuse to say what it is
c. Hope the audience fills in the blanks
d. Then pop back in later claiming victory because he gets to
define the riddle any way that he feels like it, after the fact

It is a waste of everyone's time.
It's what trolls do.

Meanwhile, the rest of us are openly discussing the actual technical
details honestly. My setup has been explained clearly and repeatedly:

a. The system contacts provider on my phone is empty by design.
b. I use a sandboxed contacts app with its own private database.
c. I do not sync contacts to Google or any cloud service.
d. I invited him, repeatedly, to point out a specific technical
inconsistency, and I expressed an open willingness to discuss it.

I didn't respond to his ever-present incessant personal attacks.

He responded with:
a. No specifics
b. No mechanism
c. No evidence
d. No technical content
e. Just a smug "I know something you do not" posture

That is not a debate. It is just trolling.

And for the record, his veiled hint about "putting email addresses on the cloud" does not even land. I do not use a mail client on my phone at all.
At my age, I simply cannot read email comfortably on a small screen. If I
did, I would use a privacy respecting FOSS client like FairEmail, but that
is irrelevant to this discussion.

The same goes for me making & receiving phone calls using the privacy-aware contacts app through my federally & state-regulated carrier over the air.

The bottom line is simple, he cannot point to any inconsistency because
there is not one. So instead he is playing riddles to inflate his ego.
--
People who have no value love to play silly riddle games with others
because they're desperate to artificially inflate their own value.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-15 19:44, Frank Slootweg wrote:

Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> wrote:

[...]

Given Frank clearly deprecatres Arlen I will publicly state I will call him >> Franklin only when he uses "Arlen" (yet Frank otherwise) to make a point.

I use 'Arlen' because that's an old nym of yours which is used by many
to indicate who we're talking about c.q. addressing. That you use
umpteen nyms, doesn't mean that we have to. Anyway, calling you, a male, 'Maria Sophia' is a tad silly, don't you agree?

In some countries would have him in court.

So my use of 'Arlen' is just that, nothing less, nothing more.

If you prefer another common, non-changing, 'name' to address you,
then say so, and I/we will see what I/we can/want_to do.

I refuse to call him Maria.
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> wrote:

Carlos E. R. wrote:

Given Frank clearly deprecatres Arlen I will publicly state I will call him
Franklin only when he uses "Arlen" (yet Frank otherwise) to make a point. >>

I use 'Arlen' because that's an old nym of yours which is used by many >> to indicate who we're talking about c.q. addressing. That you use
umpteen nyms, doesn't mean that we have to. Anyway, calling you, a male, >> 'Maria Sophia' is a tad silly, don't you agree?

In some countries would have him in court.

So my use of 'Arlen' is just that, nothing less, nothing more.

If you prefer another common, non-changing, 'name' to address you,
then say so, and I/we will see what I/we can/want_to do.

I refuse to call him Maria.

If anyone thinks my real name is Maria, then... well... let's just say it's not. Besides, I'm German. So it would be Marius instead. :) Rest assured
all you need to do is reply to the content as that's all which matters.

The point of this thread is I am simply asking Frank (whom I'll call
Franklin when he calls me Arlin, to make a point) to stop trolling this ng.

So *answer* the question which I raised! If you do not want to be
called 'Arlen', what *do* you want to be addressed as c.q. referenced
by?

Frank calls me a troll,

Cite?

[...]

Frank incessantly trolls this group, and this thread is simply a strategic approach to ask Frank publicly, openly, and politely, to stop trolling us.

Frank doesn't troll 'this group' and Frank doesn't troll 'us'.

What Frank *does* do, is feed *you* clue-by-fours, but you've closed
your mind and interpret the clue-by-fours as 'trolling'.

Please look at his recent riddles where he endlessly trolled Richmond only today, which you can find in the thread specifically about the sqlite db.

I didn't troll Richmond and I explained to him why I could not answer
his questions, but, as usual, you dishonestly silently snipped that part.

[...]
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Arlen,

Is that how you think an open and honest technical discussion should be?

Kiddo, you haven't had, by your own choice, a honest technical discussion in in these newsgroups since forever (if ever!).

Whenever you cannot counter someones reasoning or facts you refuse to engage and instead either bluntly ignore, or lash out at them.

Do you agree that is a troll as he strings Richmond along time & again?

Start with looking in the mirror and recognise its *you* who is maliciously trolling newbies with your shitheaps of "tutorials", "psw's" and all your still-waiting-to-be-supported "facts".

Rudy Wieser


--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Carlos E. R. wrote:

Carlos... Do you agree that is a troll as he strings Richmond along time
& again? Is that how you think an open and honest technical discussion
should be?

Would you like we put a public vote about who is the troll here, democratically?

I get it that you're desperate to change the subject, where this thread is about politely asking Frank Slootweg to stop trolling us.

If Frank stops trolling this newsgroup, there's no further need for this thread, as he can turn over a new leaf, just as I have trying to be nice
when he insults people, mostly me, day in and day out, constantly.

I used to respond to Frank's incessant stalking.
Now I don't.

If I can turn over a new leaf, then Frank can too.
Don't you think?

I pointed to Frank's trolls in this thread, with references cited.
I discussed Franks' trolls openly and honestly in this thread.

If you think what I pointed to are NOT Frank's trolls, then simply respond
to my question which is on topic for this thread.

Do you think what Frank did to Richmond specifically, and us today, is
NOT a troll?

Yes or no.
If yes, then we know why (because it is) so no need to explain.
I already explained why Frank trolled us today.

If no, tell us why stringing Richmond along time and again is not a troll?
-
HINT: Richmond MULTIPLE TIMES asked Frank to answer the question.
Frank refused. Answering the question would end the drama.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Maria Sophia, 2026-02-14 21:55:

Off-topic discussion to ask how we can get Frank Slootweg to stop trolling.

Just don't reply and don't start "discussions" like this...
--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-16 02:16, Maria Sophia wrote:

Carlos E. R. wrote:

Carlos... Do you agree that is a troll as he strings Richmond along
time & again? Is that how you think an open and honest technical
discussion should be?

Would you like we put a public vote about who is the troll here,
democratically?

I get it that you're desperate to change the subject, where this thread is about politely asking Frank Slootweg to stop trolling us.

But he is not.
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote:

Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> wrote:

[Nearly all deleted.]

I'm not going to address your multitude of misunderstandings, misinterpretations, misrepresentations, etc., because there's just no
point. I don't think that any of it makes *me* look bad, so why worry
about it.

So I'll limit it to just one correction of a clear falsehood and a clarification.

Did Franklin report to the team how many apps had his read permission?

Yes, I did and gave details and you responded to my response. So if
you 'forgot' that that happened, you have only yourself to blame.

And not for the first time.

[...]

Given Frank clearly deprecatres Arlen I will publicly state I will call him >> Franklin only when he uses "Arlen" (yet Frank otherwise) to make a point.

I use 'Arlen' because that's an old nym of yours which is used by many
to indicate who we're talking about c.q. addressing.

Clearly he's a hypocrite. Many people (including myself) have been using
Arlen for a long time - a couple of years I think? - and *now* he
complains?!

That you use
umpteen nyms, doesn't mean that we have to. Anyway, calling you, a male, 'Maria Sophia' is a tad silly, don't you agree?

So my use of 'Arlen' is just that, nothing less, nothing more.

If you prefer another common, non-changing, 'name' to address you,
then say so, and I/we will see what I/we can/want_to do.

That's why I prefer "Donald". And, no, it's not a political comment.


--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> wrote:

Off-topic discussion to ask how we can get Frank Slootweg to stop trolling.

So the new you has last approximately six weeks. You're now reverting to
type. Can't say I'm shocked.

Given this year we're trying hard to not respond to the incessant personal

Is that the royal "we"? This is only something you can impose on yourself.
And it's been great, while it lasted.

It takes hours to document the original posts in any technical thread.
It takes Frank Slootweg mere seconds to derail topics he doesn't like.

If a technical document can be undermined in seconds that tells you alot
about the (lack of) quality in the document.


--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Carlos E. R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

On 2026-02-15 20:12, Maria Sophia wrote:

Carlos E. R. wrote:

...

Carlos... Do you agree that is a troll as he strings Richmond along time
& again? Is that how you think an open and honest technical discussion
should be?

Would you like we put a public vote about who is the troll here, democratically?

Seconded!

--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Carlos E. R. wrote:

I get it that you're desperate to change the subject, where this thread is >> about politely asking Frank Slootweg to stop trolling us.

But he is not.

I don't understand how you can say Frank is not trolling us when you first haven't even bothered to look at the two trolls that I pointed out already.

I don't want this thread to be about you, but if you can't apply Occam's
Razor, then your opinion is meaningless since you don't base it on facts.

Look at the two temporal trolls (that happened just this week) that I
pointed out in this thread, and tell me why you think they're not trolls.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Chris wrote:

Carlos... Do you agree that is a troll as he strings Richmond along time >>> & again? Is that how you think an open and honest technical discussion
should be?

Would you like we put a public vote about who is the troll here,
democratically?

Seconded!

I don't understand how you can say Frank is not trolling us when you first haven't even bothered to look at the two trolls that I pointed out already.

I don't want this thread to be about you, but if you can't apply Occam's
Razor, then your opinion is meaningless since you don't base it on facts.

Look at the two temporal trolls (that happened just this week) that I
pointed out in this thread, and tell me why you think they're not trolls.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

R.Wieser wrote:

Start with looking in the mirror

I don't understand how you can say Frank is not trolling us when you first haven't even bothered to look at the two trolls that I pointed out already.

I don't want this thread to be about you, but if you can't apply Occam's
Razor, then your opinion is meaningless since you don't base it on facts.

Look at the two temporal trolls (that happened just this week) that I
pointed out in this thread, and tell me why you think they're not trolls.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Chris wrote:

Yes, I did and gave details and you responded to my response. So if
you 'forgot' that that happened, you have only yourself to blame.

And not for the first time.

This thread isn't about you, Chris, it's about Frank trolling us.

If you insist on off-topic discussions, then you're simply amplifying the trolls from Frank Slootweg, which is the topic of this thread.

Please do not respond further if you do not LOOK at the two temporal trolls listed in this thread that Frank trolled us this very week.

Mind you, that's only Frank's current trolls, but if you can't even LOOK at
the two trolls in this thread to give us your assessment, then your opinion
is not based on facts, and hence meaningless in import.

Tell us why you think the two trolls from Frank that I pointed out in this thread are not trolls.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Arno Welzel wrote:

Just don't reply and don't start "discussions" like this...

If Frank stops trolling this newsgeroup, there would be no need to ask
Frank politely to stop trolling this newsgroup.

It's that simple.

If you disagree, then simply tell us why you think the two trolls from
Frank that I pointed out in this thread are not trolls in your opinion.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Chris wrote:

Given this year we're trying hard to not respond to the incessant personal

Is that the royal "we"? This is only something you can impose on yourself. And it's been great, while it lasted.

This isn't about you. this isn't about me. This is about politely asking
Frank Slootweg to stop trolling this newsgroup.

If you think Frank Slootweg is not trolling this newsgroup, simply tell us
why you think the two trolls from Frank that I pointed out in this thread
are not trolls.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-16 20:36, Maria Sophia wrote:

Carlos E. R. wrote:

I get it that you're desperate to change the subject, where this
thread is
about politely asking Frank Slootweg to stop trolling us.

But he is not.

I don't understand how you can say Frank is not trolling us when you first haven't even bothered to look at the two trolls that I pointed out already.

I don't want this thread to be about you, but if you can't apply Occam's Razor, then your opinion is meaningless since you don't base it on facts.

Ho, ho, ho! :-D

What you call facts we call opinions.

Look at the two temporal trolls (that happened just this week) that I
pointed out in this thread, and tell me why you think they're not trolls.

That would not be fair, because I am refraining myself, not saying why
we consider you a troll. Don't get started, shall we?
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Carlos E. R. wrote:

That would not be fair, because I am refraining myself

You have no right to claim Frank isn't trolling us without looking at the trolls and letting us know why you repeatedly defend his trolling of us.

You're not being fair to your own opinion.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-16 21:06, Maria Sophia wrote:

Carlos E. R. wrote:

That would not be fair, because I am refraining myself

You have no right to claim Frank isn't trolling us without looking at the trolls and letting us know why you repeatedly defend his trolling of us.

You're not being fair to your own opinion.

You have no grounds to call anybody a troll, because your behaviour is trollish. We don't accept you opinion on this.

Shut up!

I told you not to start this road.
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Arlen,

I don't understand how you can say Frank is not trolling us when you first haven't even bothered to look at the two trolls that I pointed out
already.

You have called pretty-much everyone who had the audacity not to agree with you a troll - including me. As a result your claim that someone is a troll has zero value to me.

I don't want this thread to be about you,

Good, lets keep talking about you, shall we ?

but if you can't apply Occam's Razor, then your opinion is meaningless
since you don't base it on facts.

Nope, not about you. Rejected.

Look at the two temporal trolls (that happened just this week) that I
pointed out in this thread, and tell me why you think they're not trolls.

Nope, not about you either. Rejected.

Have I ever told you that your attempts to change the subject are a *little* transparent ? Well, they are. :-)

Regards,
Rudy Wieser


--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-16 21:57, R.Wieser wrote:

Arlen,

I don't understand how you can say Frank is not trolling us when you first >> haven't even bothered to look at the two trolls that I pointed out
already.

You have called pretty-much everyone who had the audacity not to agree with you a troll - including me. As a result your claim that someone is a troll has zero value to me.

Seconded, same here.

I don't want this thread to be about you,

Good, lets keep talking about you, shall we ?

but if you can't apply Occam's Razor, then your opinion is meaningless
since you don't base it on facts.

Nope, not about you. Rejected.

Look at the two temporal trolls (that happened just this week) that I
pointed out in this thread, and tell me why you think they're not trolls.

Nope, not about you either. Rejected.

Have I ever told you that your attempts to change the subject are a *little* transparent ? Well, they are. :-)

I have to agree on all points.
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Carlos E. R. wrote:

We don't accept you opinion on this.

Hi Carlos,

This thread is simply to ask Frank publicly openly & honestly to stop
trolling this newsgroup (and I presented the trolls as proof of fact).

Did you look at Frank's trolls, or not?
Why do you think Frank's trolls are not trolls, if that's your claim?

If you refuse to answer the question posed of you after you look at the
facts raised in this thread where Frank clearly trolled this newsgroup
twice this very week, then your expressed opinion is not worth anything.

Facts:
1. I claim Frank is trolling this newsgroup.
2. I posted two very recent examples backing up that claim.
3. I simply ask Frank to stop trolling this newsgroup.

You have claimed you don't accept the facts.
And that's your pregogative to not accept the facts.

But you're also telling us clearly that your opinion is worthless.
Because it's not based on any of the facts presented in this thread.

Did you read the facts I presented in this thread of Frank's trolls?
Or not?
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Carlos E. R. wrote:

You have called pretty-much everyone who had the audacity not to agree with >> you a troll - including me. As a result your claim that someone is a troll >> has zero value to me.

Seconded, same here.

This thread is simply to ask Frank publicly openly & honestly to stop
trolling this newsgroup (and I presented the trolls as proof of fact).

If the result is Frank stops trolling this newsgroup, then I would have succeeded in single handled imp;roving the content of this newsgroup.

I'm open. I'm honest. That's the goal. It's for the newsgroup. Not me.

Rudolph, Carlos, and Chris have trolled this thread, but they haven't even bothered to look at the facts, which were clearly presented in this thread.

For trolls to defend the trolls is expected.
It is meaningless to claim Frank have every right in the world to troll.

I agree with you a priori.
It's the same when Rudolph constantly and incessantly trolls this ng.

He's never said a word about Android in his entire life on this ng.
So his opinion, is worthless.

But what I'm asking you to do is look at the facts presented of Frank's
trolls, and then tell us what your opinion is of those exact trolls.

If you refuse to look at the fact presented of Franks recent trolls,
then your opinion carries no merit since it's based on ignorance of fact.

Q: Are Frank's trolls presented as facts in this thread trolls or not?
A:
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-16 22:22, Maria Sophia wrote:

Carlos E. R. wrote:

We don't accept you opinion on this.

Hi Carlos,

This thread is simply to ask Frank publicly openly & honestly to stop trolling this newsgroup (and I presented the trolls as proof of fact).

Shut up!

Or we will accuse you of being a troll.
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Carlos E. R. wrote:

This thread is simply to ask Frank publicly openly & honestly to stop
trolling this newsgroup (and I presented the trolls as proof of fact).

Shut up!

Or we will accuse you of being a troll.

I will stop responding to YOU in this thread since you asked, and more importantly, since you haven't added any on-topic value to this thread.

Given my brain is wired for Occam's Razor assessments, my main advice to
you, Carlos, is you need to take in the facts when you make assessments.

You have refused to do that, so I could claim that it is you who is
trolling us, but the point of this thread isn't whose trolling whom.

The point of this thread is clearly to openly and honestly and sincerely
ask Frank Slootweg to stop trolling us, and I gave examples of his trolls.

If this thread accomplishes that goal, then it will have been worth it.

Note that Frank is put on notice that if he continues to incessantly troll
this newsgroup with is "mock surprise riddles", I will post them here.

That way, all of Franks upcoming trolls will be archived in the same
thread, where, the hope is that Frank stops trolling so that I don't have
to do that to get him to stop trolling.

If Frank stops trolling us, then this thread will need no additional posts.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Maria Sophia, 2026-02-16 20:41:

Arno Welzel wrote:

Just don't reply and don't start "discussions" like this...

If Frank stops trolling this newsgeroup, there would be no need to ask
Frank politely to stop trolling this newsgroup.

Trolls want responses. If no one responds to troll posts, it becomes
boring for the troll and he will eventually stop. It's that simple.

The only other alternative would be to block the trolls user account.
But first of all this will usually not happen just because some people complaining about trolling and he can just move on to another server or
create a different account and continue.
--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Maria Sophia, 2026-02-16 20:42:

Chris wrote:

Given this year we're trying hard to not respond to the incessant personal >>

Is that the royal "we"? This is only something you can impose on yourself. >> And it's been great, while it lasted.

This isn't about you. this isn't about me. This is about politely asking Frank Slootweg to stop trolling this newsgroup.

Well - it's a trolls nature to ignore what people want. Why do you think
a troll will stop just because anyone asks for it?
--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Maria Sophia <mariasophia@comprehension.com> wrote:
[...]

Note that Frank is put on notice that if he continues to incessantly troll this newsgroup with is "mock surprise riddles", I will post them here.

<barf!>

"is put on notice"!? Are you for real!? (Don't answer that.)

You owe me a new laptop for posting stuff like that without a beverage
alert!

I call Godwin.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Arno Welzel wrote:

Maria Sophia, 2026-02-16 20:41:

Arno Welzel wrote:

Just don't reply and don't start "discussions" like this...

If Frank stops trolling this newsgeroup, there would be no need to ask
Frank politely to stop trolling this newsgroup.

Trolls want responses. If no one responds to troll posts, it becomes
boring for the troll and he will eventually stop. It's that simple.

The only other alternative would be to block the trolls user account.
But first of all this will usually not happen just because some people complaining about trolling and he can just move on to another server or create a different account and continue.

Hi Arno,

I respect your acumen. And that of Carlos. And Chris. And yes, even Frank.

Frank has the capacity to add value.
He just chooses not to.

That's not all.

Frank has the capacity to NOT insult me in his many posts on this ng.
Again, he just chooses not to.

All I'm openly & honestly asking Frank to do in this thread is to cut it
out. If Frank does that, then this thread will have served its purpose.

However... to your point...

I think we need to take into account Occam's Razor when we claim that the solution to stop trolls is to stop feeding them since I think that's not
the full solution when you take into account variety of troll techniques.

Frank's 'mock-surprise' trolls are vastly different than Joerg Lorenz's
trolls, for example, but if we look at each one, they troll differently.

Would you agree that almost nobody responds to Joerg Lorenz' trolls?
Certainly I never do.

And yet, he trolls.
So, "not feeding him" doesn't seem to have any effect on his actions.

But, Joerg Lorenz' trolls are different from Frank Slootweg's trolls.
And therein lies the reason "this thread" can cut down on them.

Joerg, let's just cut to the point, is an idiot who can't add value.
He's desperate to try, so what his trolls invariably are consist of
1. Mostly he denies anything he doesn't liek that someone says
(without ever proposing a counter argument of course)
2. But almost as often, he picks a troll and amplifies it
(that way the two trolls can reinforce each other

Once in a while, people who aren't trolls at heart (such as Carlos or
Chris) will amplify the trolls' trolls, and in some of those cases, I
simply ask them not to do that (because we're forced to see it).

Having said that, Frank Slootweg's trolls are similar in that he very often amplifies other trolls, particularly when it's attacking me personally.

If you think I need to validate that statement of fact, then just ask.
As the evidence is ample not only on this ng but on Windows ngs too.

Given Frank has taken a personal slant to his trolls against me, you should understand why I'm asking Frank openly & honestly here to cut it out.

Seriously.
Think about this fact.

How hard would it be for Frank Slootweg to NOT incessantly hurl insults at
me in his many posts to not only the Windows newsgroups but to Usenet
server, reader & peering ngs too, in addition to this Android newsgroup?

Frank's "mock-surprise" riddle discussed in this thread is his attempt, in
my opinion, to prove is suppsosed clever superiority over me, where the
tell is in teh fact that he refused Richmond's many requests (and mine) to
back up his claim.

Do you remember what Frank said when we asked?
He said it would 'spoil the fun' if he ended his theatrical performance too soon.

So my only on-topic question to you is whether or not you feel the posts in this thread which I claim are trolls from Frank, are trolls.
--
If I had wanted to troll, all I'd need to do is respond to Joerg Lorenz.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

Arno Welzel wrote:

This isn't about you. this isn't about me. This is about politely asking
Frank Slootweg to stop trolling this newsgroup.

Well - it's a trolls nature to ignore what people want. Why do you think
a troll will stop just because anyone asks for it?

Hi Arno,

Frank is a *different* kind of troll than "most trolls" are.
I think he *will* stop trolling us if we openly & honestly ask him to.

I agree though, that this won't work with the likes of Alan Baker's trolls.
But I think Frank is someone who *can* add value to this ng's techy topics.

So it's worth the effort to *try* to ask Frank to stop trolling this ng.

You may not know this, but Frank Slootweg incessantly hurls personal
insults directly at me in many of his posts to the Windows newsgroup, and
to the Usenet server, reader and peering newsgroups, in addition to here.

His goal, in my humble opinion, is clearly shown in the "mock-riddle"
trolls I pointed out in this thread as proof of what I'm explaining.

Frank's "mock-surprise" riddle discussed in this thread is his attempt, in
my opinion, to prove his supposed clever superiority over me, where the
tell is in the fact that he refused Richmond's multiple honest and open requests (and mine) to back up his claim.

Do you remember what Frank said when Richmond pressed Frank?

Frank literally said it would 'spoil the fun' if he ended his theatrical performance too soon. All I ask of you, is, whether that's a troll or not?

Verbatim...

From: Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid>
Newsgroups: comp.mobile.android
Subject: Re: How many apps on your phone have contacts read permission?
Date: 15 Feb 2026 14:32:05 GMT
Message-ID: <10msota.18d0.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net>

Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> wrote:

Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> writes:

Richmond <dnomhcir@gmx.com> wrote:

Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> writes:

Yes, you do store the names and e-mail addresses of your contacts on a
public service, you just don't realize it. The public service you use is
as liable to leaking contact information as the Google service you don't
(want to) use. That's the inconsistency in your argument.

That's not the way I read it. I read it as he doesn't use the contacts
app, he puts his contacts somewhere else, presumably somewhere which is
not stored or backed up to the cloud.

I'm not commenting on what he says, but on what he does *not* say, but still *does*, without realizing it.

OK, what is it he does without realising it, and how did you know about
it if he didn't?

Sorry, but that's for him (and perhaps for you?) to find out.
I'm not going to spoil it.

In case you're not aware of who and what 'Maria' a.k.a. 'Arlen' is,
I can understand that this looks a rather strange way of (not)
discussing things. Be patient.

Do you see how Frank's theatrical performance isn't deigned to "help"
Richmond, or me, or anyone on this newsgroup. No. That's not his goal.

What is happening here with Frank is not a technical discussion at all.
It is a rhetorical game. Frank is deliberately withholding his supposed "gotcha" so he can posture as the clever one in the room (IMHO).

Q: Is Frank acting like a troll, or not?
A: ?
--
If I had wanted to troll, all I'd have to do is respond to Alan Baker.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-17 11:19, Maria Sophia wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

-a You owe me a new laptop for posting stuff like that without a beverage
alert!

Hi Frank,

Speaking of humor...
I read *all* your posts, so I'm aware of which are trolls and which are not trolls, where I'm aware of the "troll thread" about me which is hilarious since it's only the trolls responding (e.g., Alan Baker & Joerg Lorenz).

Even you must agree it's funny for Joerg Lorenz to claim anyone is a troll. Right? Or Alan Baker, right?

You're too much of a narcissist NOT to read anything you think might
mention you, Arlen.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-17 00:44, Arno Welzel wrote:

Maria Sophia, 2026-02-16 20:41:

Arno Welzel wrote:

Just don't reply and don't start "discussions" like this...

If Frank stops trolling this newsgeroup, there would be no need to ask
Frank politely to stop trolling this newsgroup.

Trolls want responses. If no one responds to troll posts, it becomes
boring for the troll and he will eventually stop. It's that simple.

Give a single example in the entire history of Usenet where that has
EVER actually happened.

The only other alternative would be to block the trolls user account.
But first of all this will usually not happen just because some people complaining about trolling and he can just move on to another server or create a different account and continue.

Another alternative is take what amusement you can from a troll.

:-)
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: comp.mobile.android

On 2026-02-17 11:34, Maria Sophia wrote:

Arno Welzel wrote:

Maria Sophia, 2026-02-16 20:41:

Arno Welzel wrote:

Just don't reply and don't start "discussions" like this...

If Frank stops trolling this newsgeroup, there would be no need to ask
Frank politely to stop trolling this newsgroup.

Trolls want responses. If no one responds to troll posts, it becomes
boring for the troll and he will eventually stop. It's that simple.

The only other alternative would be to block the trolls user account.
But first of all this will usually not happen just because some people
complaining about trolling and he can just move on to another server or
create a different account and continue.

Hi Arno,

I respect your acumen. And that of Carlos. And Chris. And yes, even Frank.

Wow.

Look at the narcissist blather on!

(I'm leaving the blather intact, but I'll let you off the hook and tell
you there is no more of my text beyond here.)

Frank has the capacity to add value. He just chooses not to.

That's not all.

Frank has the capacity to NOT insult me in his many posts on this ng.
Again, he just chooses not to.

All I'm openly & honestly asking Frank to do in this thread is to cut it
out. If Frank does that, then this thread will have served its purpose.

However... to your point...
I think we need to take into account Occam's Razor when we claim that the solution to stop trolls is to stop feeding them since I think that's not
the full solution when you take into account variety of troll techniques.

Frank's 'mock-surprise' trolls are vastly different than Joerg Lorenz's trolls, for example, but if we look at each one, they troll differently.

Would you agree that almost nobody responds to Joerg Lorenz' trolls? Certainly I never do.
And yet, he trolls.
So, "not feeding him" doesn't seem to have any effect on his actions.

But, Joerg Lorenz' trolls are different from Frank Slootweg's trolls.
And therein lies the reason "this thread" can cut down on them.

Joerg, let's just cut to the point, is an idiot who can't add value.
He's desperate to try, so what his trolls invariably are consist of
1. Mostly he denies anything he doesn't liek that someone says
-a-a (without ever proposing a counter argument of course)
2. But almost as often, he picks a troll and amplifies it
-a-a (that way the two trolls can reinforce each other

Once in a while, people who aren't trolls at heart (such as Carlos or
Chris) will amplify the trolls' trolls, and in some of those cases, I
simply ask them not to do that (because we're forced to see it).

Having said that, Frank Slootweg's trolls are similar in that he very often amplifies other trolls, particularly when it's attacking me personally.

If you think I need to validate that statement of fact, then just ask.
As the evidence is ample not only on this ng but on Windows ngs too.

Given Frank has taken a personal slant to his trolls against me, you should understand why I'm asking Frank openly & honestly here to cut it out.

Seriously.
Think about this fact.

How hard would it be for Frank Slootweg to NOT incessantly hurl insults at
me in his many posts to not only the Windows newsgroups but to Usenet
server, reader & peering ngs too, in addition to this Android newsgroup?

Frank's "mock-surprise" riddle discussed in this thread is his attempt, in
my opinion, to prove is suppsosed clever superiority over me, where the
tell is in teh fact that he refused Richmond's many requests (and mine) to back up his claim.

Do you remember what Frank said when we asked? He said it would 'spoil
the fun' if he ended his theatrical performance too
soon.

So my only on-topic question to you is whether or not you feel the posts in this thread which I claim are trolls from Frank, are trolls.

--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2