• Re: Off is the new on

    From Steve Hayes@hayesstw@telkomsa.net to alt.usage.english on Sun Jan 4 07:04:23 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    On Tue, 16 Dec 2025 11:42:27 +0200, Steve Hayes
    <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:

    I'd like to know if "based off" has completely superseded "based on".

    Here's a snippet from Facebook that illustrates the transition, which
    still seems to be taking place. I quote this not to comment on the
    content, but on the usage:

    "Moreover, if that is all you are basing your judgement on, then it is
    not entirely valid. My earlier post was not made to start any
    arguments but was just something to reflect upon. Why do people feel
    the need to judge others based off their own personal prejudices."

    And, in particular, "basing your judgement on" and "based off".

    "Based off" seems to be relatively recent usage, and the snippet above
    seems to show the transition from "on" to "off", which seems to lead
    to considerable confusion. Perhaps that is why some have decided to
    drop the preposition altogether and just say that something is
    "based".

    Which do you prefer?
    --
    Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
    Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
    Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
    E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Peter Moylan@peter@pmoylan.org to alt.usage.english on Sun Jan 4 16:59:27 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    On 04/01/26 16:04, Steve Hayes wrote:
    On Tue, 16 Dec 2025 11:42:27 +0200, Steve Hayes
    <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:

    I'd like to know if "based off" has completely superseded "based
    on".

    Personally, I'm still struggling with "across". "Please stay across ABC
    Radio, where our reporters will keep you across the progress of the fire
    that has just jumped across the highway."
    --
    Peter Moylan peter@pmoylan.org http://www.pmoylan.org
    Newcastle, NSW
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Steve Hayes@hayesstw@telkomsa.net to alt.usage.english on Sun Jan 4 20:56:45 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    On Sun, 4 Jan 2026 16:59:27 +1100, Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org>
    wrote:

    On 04/01/26 16:04, Steve Hayes wrote:
    On Tue, 16 Dec 2025 11:42:27 +0200, Steve Hayes
    <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:

    I'd like to know if "based off" has completely superseded "based
    on".

    Personally, I'm still struggling with "across". "Please stay across ABC >Radio, where our reporters will keep you across the progress of the fire
    that has just jumped across the highway."

    I haven't seen that for a while.

    I've just discovered that "dropped" is becoming a conntranym, or
    perhaps like "table" (vb) coming to mean different things in different
    places.

    I've always thought that "the idea was dropped" mean that the idea was abandfoned, but it seems that some people are now using to mean that
    the idea was launched.
    --
    Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
    Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
    Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
    E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Snidely@snidely.too@gmail.com to alt.usage.english on Sun Jan 4 14:29:47 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    Sunday, Steve Hayes quipped:
    On Sun, 4 Jan 2026 16:59:27 +1100, Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org>
    wrote:

    On 04/01/26 16:04, Steve Hayes wrote:
    On Tue, 16 Dec 2025 11:42:27 +0200, Steve Hayes
    <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:

    I'd like to know if "based off" has completely superseded "based
    on".

    Personally, I'm still struggling with "across". "Please stay across ABC
    Radio, where our reporters will keep you across the progress of the fire
    that has just jumped across the highway."

    I haven't seen that for a while.

    I've just discovered that "dropped" is becoming a conntranym, or
    perhaps like "table" (vb) coming to mean different things in different places.

    I've always thought that "the idea was dropped" mean that the idea was abandfoned, but it seems that some people are now using to mean that
    the idea was launched.

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists
    releasing an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in this
    group are old enough to imagine that as a record dropping onto the
    turntable, although the music industry might have come up with the
    phrasing without having that image.

    /dps
    --
    Ieri, oggi, domani
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Bertel Lund Hansen@rundtosset@lundhansen.dk to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 06:09:26 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    Den 04.01.2026 kl. 23.29 skrev Snidely:

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists
    releasing an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in this group are old enough to imagine that as a record dropping onto the turntable,

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on
    the turntable.
    --
    Bertel, Kolt, Danmark

    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Peter Moylan@peter@pmoylan.org to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 17:21:00 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    On 05/01/26 16:09, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
    Den 04.01.2026 kl. 23.29 skrev Snidely:

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists
    releasing an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in
    this group are old enough to imagine that as a record dropping
    onto the turntable,

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on
    the turntable.

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded with multiple
    discs. As one finished playing, the next would be dropped down. I
    haven't seen one for many years, though.
    --
    Peter Moylan peter@pmoylan.org http://www.pmoylan.org
    Newcastle, NSW
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Bertel Lund Hansen@rundtosset@lundhansen.dk to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 07:54:39 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    Den 05.01.2026 kl. 07.21 skrev Peter Moylan:

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded with multiple
    discs. As one finished playing, the next would be dropped down. I
    haven't seen one for many years, though.

    Yes, I remember them, but I wouldn't want one of those.

    BTW, my eldest grandson is into lp's.
    --
    Bertel, Kolt, Danmark

    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Snidely@snidely.too@gmail.com to alt.usage.english on Sun Jan 4 23:20:18 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    On Sunday or thereabouts, Bertel Lund Hansen declared ...
    Den 04.01.2026 kl. 23.29 skrev Snidely:

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists releasing >> an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in this group are old >> enough to imagine that as a record dropping onto the turntable,

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on the turntable.

    No stacks on an automatic spindle? <URL:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuoFW2yAD7g>

    Jukeboxes drop the records, too, but the arm does get pretty close to
    the target.
    <URL: https://youtu.be/NmGaXEmfTIo?t=94>

    /dps
    --
    Ieri, oggi, domani
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Bertel Lund Hansen@rundtosset@lundhansen.dk to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 09:30:27 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    Den 05.01.2026 kl. 08.20 skrev Snidely:

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on
    the turntable.

    No stacks on an automatic spindle?

    No way.
    --
    Bertel, Kolt, Danmark

    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From athel.cb@gmail.com@user12588@newsgrouper.org.invalid to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 09:11:28 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english


    Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org> posted:

    On 05/01/26 16:09, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
    Den 04.01.2026 kl. 23.29 skrev Snidely:

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists
    releasing an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in
    this group are old enough to imagine that as a record dropping
    onto the turntable,

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on
    the turntable.

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded with multiple
    discs. As one finished playing, the next would be dropped down. I
    haven't seen one for many years, though.

    That worked well with 78s, but less well with LPs, because the more
    scratchable surface was more easily damaged by having one unprotected
    one over another.



    --
    athel

    Living in Marseilles for 38 years; mainly in England before that
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From liz@liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 09:15:53 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org> wrote:

    On 05/01/26 16:09, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
    Den 04.01.2026 kl. 23.29 skrev Snidely:

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists
    releasing an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in
    this group are old enough to imagine that as a record dropping
    onto the turntable,

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on
    the turntable.

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded with multiple
    discs. As one finished playing, the next would be dropped down. I
    haven't seen one for many years, though.

    Sets of 78s that made up a long classical work were sold in two
    versions, normal and auto-coupling. The sides were arranged
    differently:

    NORMAL
    Part 1 = Disc 1 Side A
    Part 2 = Disc 1 Side B
    Part 3 = Disc 2 Side A
    Part 4 = Disc 2 Side B
    Part 5 = Disc 3 Side A
    Part 6 = Disc 3 Side B
    Part 7 = Disc 4 Side A
    Part 8 = Disc 4 Side B
    Part 9 = Disc 5 Side A
    Part 10 = Disc 5 Side B
    Part 11 = Disc 6 Side A
    Part 12 = Disc 6 Side B

    AUTO-COUPLING
    Part 1 = Disc 1 Side A
    Part 2 = Disc 2 Side A
    Part 3 = Disc 3 Side A
    Part 4 = Disc 4 Side A
    Part 5 = Disc 5 Side A
    Part 6 = Disc 6 Side A
    Part 7 = Disc 6 Side B
    Part 8 = Disc 5 Side B
    Part 9 = Disc 4 Side B
    Part 10 = Disc 3 Side B
    Part 11 = Disc 2 Side B
    Part 12 = Disc 1 Side B


    There was also a third arrangement known as Broadcast Coupling which was
    used to give a continuous performance when two turntables were
    available. Broadcast coupling was only used internally by radio
    stations and wasn't available for commercial pressings.

    BROADCAST COUPLING
    Part 1 = Disc 1 Side A
    Part 2 = Disc 2 Side A
    Part 3 = Disc 1 Side B
    Part 4 = Disc 2 Side B
    Part 5 = Disc 3 Side A
    Part 6 = Disc 4 Side A
    Part 7 = Disc 3 Side B
    Part 8 = Disc 4 Side B
    Part 9 = Disc 5 Side A
    Part 10 = Disc 6 Side A
    Part 11 = Disc 5 Side B
    Part 12 = Disc 6 Side B
    --
    ~ Liz Tuddenham ~
    (Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
    www.poppyrecords.co.uk
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From liz@liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 09:25:10 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    <athel.cb@gmail.com> wrote:

    Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org> posted:

    On 05/01/26 16:09, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
    Den 04.01.2026 kl. 23.29 skrev Snidely:

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists
    releasing an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in
    this group are old enough to imagine that as a record dropping
    onto the turntable,

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on
    the turntable.

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded with multiple discs. As one finished playing, the next would be dropped down. I
    haven't seen one for many years, though.

    That worked well with 78s, but less well with LPs, because the more scratchable surface was more easily damaged by having one unprotected
    one over another.

    That's why 45 rpm 'singles' had thickened centres with a milled ridge,
    to keep the playing surfaces apart and give better grip between the
    discs in the stack.
    --
    ~ Liz Tuddenham ~
    (Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
    www.poppyrecords.co.uk
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Blueshirt@blueshirt@indigo.news to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 09:56:06 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    Peter Moylan wrote:

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded
    with multiple discs. As one finished playing, the next would
    be dropped down. I haven't seen one for many years, though.

    They were fashionable when singles were a thing... singles
    being the small 7" records that were also called 45's, as they
    spun at a different speed to LP's. (45 rpm as opposed to 33 1/3
    rpm... or 78 rpm.)

    You could load four/five singles on the one we had back in the
    day, and generally they'd drop and play properly... but not
    always.

    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From athel.cb@gmail.com@user12588@newsgrouper.org.invalid to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 10:15:49 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english


    liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) posted:

    Peter Moylan <peter@pmoylan.org> wrote:

    On 05/01/26 16:09, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
    Den 04.01.2026 kl. 23.29 skrev Snidely:

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists
    releasing an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in
    this group are old enough to imagine that as a record dropping
    onto the turntable,

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on
    the turntable.

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded with multiple discs. As one finished playing, the next would be dropped down. I
    haven't seen one for many years, though.

    Sets of 78s that made up a long classical work were sold in two
    versions, normal and auto-coupling. The sides were arranged
    differently:

    NORMAL
    Part 1 = Disc 1 Side A
    Part 2 = Disc 1 Side B
    Part 3 = Disc 2 Side A
    Part 4 = Disc 2 Side B
    Part 5 = Disc 3 Side A
    Part 6 = Disc 3 Side B
    Part 7 = Disc 4 Side A
    Part 8 = Disc 4 Side B
    Part 9 = Disc 5 Side A
    Part 10 = Disc 5 Side B
    Part 11 = Disc 6 Side A
    Part 12 = Disc 6 Side B

    If I remembered rightly, that was introduced by manufacturers for LPs specifically to discourage stacking.

    AUTO-COUPLING
    Part 1 = Disc 1 Side A
    Part 2 = Disc 2 Side A
    Part 3 = Disc 3 Side A
    Part 4 = Disc 4 Side A
    Part 5 = Disc 5 Side A
    Part 6 = Disc 6 Side A
    Part 7 = Disc 6 Side B
    Part 8 = Disc 5 Side B
    Part 9 = Disc 4 Side B
    Part 10 = Disc 3 Side B
    Part 11 = Disc 2 Side B
    Part 12 = Disc 1 Side B


    There was also a third arrangement known as Broadcast Coupling which was
    used to give a continuous performance when two turntables were
    available. Broadcast coupling was only used internally by radio
    stations and wasn't available for commercial pressings.

    BROADCAST COUPLING
    Part 1 = Disc 1 Side A
    Part 2 = Disc 2 Side A
    Part 3 = Disc 1 Side B
    Part 4 = Disc 2 Side B
    Part 5 = Disc 3 Side A
    Part 6 = Disc 4 Side A
    Part 7 = Disc 3 Side B
    Part 8 = Disc 4 Side B
    Part 9 = Disc 5 Side A
    Part 10 = Disc 6 Side A
    Part 11 = Disc 5 Side B
    Part 12 = Disc 6 Side B



    --
    athel

    Living in Marseilles for 38 years; mainly in England before that
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From liz@liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 11:05:17 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    Blueshirt <blueshirt@indigo.news> wrote:

    Peter Moylan wrote:

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded
    with multiple discs. As one finished playing, the next would
    be dropped down. I haven't seen one for many years, though.

    They were fashionable when singles were a thing... singles
    being the small 7" records that were also called 45's, as they
    spun at a different speed to LP's. (45 rpm as opposed to 33 1/3
    rpm... or 78 rpm.)

    You could load four/five singles on the one we had back in the
    day, and generally they'd drop and play properly... but not
    always.

    'Singles' were designed from the outset for use on autochangers. The
    large centre holes were to allow the automatic mechanism to handle them
    from the centre. It was very soon discovered that this wasn't necessary
    and sales would improve if the holes fitted a standard spindle.

    The optional large centre holes were retained for juke boxes which
    benefitted from the wider tolerances which made the mechanisms less
    liable to mishaps. (A jammed-up jukebox was expensive in terms of lost
    revenue and high call-out costs, so reliability was a very important
    factor.)
    --
    ~ Liz Tuddenham ~
    (Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
    www.poppyrecords.co.uk
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
  • From Sam Plusnet@not@home.com to alt.usage.english on Mon Jan 5 19:56:26 2026
    From Newsgroup: alt.usage.english

    On 05/01/2026 06:21, Peter Moylan wrote:
    On 05/01/26 16:09, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:
    Den 04.01.2026 kl. 23.29 skrev Snidely:

    I've seen that for quite a while in the context of music artists
    releasing an album or sometimes an important single. Many of us in
    -athis group are old enough to imagine that as a record dropping
    onto the turntable,

    That wouldn't occur to me. I was always careful when placing an lp on
    -athe turntable.

    There used to be record players that could be pre-loaded with multiple
    discs. As one finished playing, the next would be dropped down. I
    haven't seen one for many years, though.

    Often with a built-in amp & speaker, constructed in a wooden box covered
    in "Leathercloth".
    --
    Sam Plusnet
    --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2