From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Paul wrote:


I've found an unusual thing in Windows 11, while looking around for
things that might have crashed the system and corrupted it extensively.
In Reliability Monitor there are error messages of "unexpected shutdown"
tied to every occasion that I've shut the damn thing down. So I tried my
usual shutdown, rebooted, and lo! unexpected shutdown.
I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to
choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.
Now, that seems utterly stupid. I have two (no, three) questions.
1. What earthly advantage does that give? Surely, more problem-causing
than helpful.
2. Who or what set it on my box of tricks?
3. The on/off button always went off. WTF?

Ed

--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Fri, 6 Feb 2026 13:11:44 +0000, Ed Cryer wrote:

Paul wrote:

I've found an unusual thing in Windows 11, while looking around for
things that might have crashed the system and corrupted it extensively.
In Reliability Monitor there are error messages of "unexpected shutdown" tied to every occasion that I've shut the damn thing down. So I tried my usual shutdown, rebooted, and lo! unexpected shutdown.
I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to
choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.
Now, that seems utterly stupid. I have two (no, three) questions.
1. What earthly advantage does that give? Surely, more problem-causing
than helpful.
2. Who or what set it on my box of tricks?
3. The on/off button always went off. WTF?

Ed

Well, Welcome to Win-11 , More Buggy of all Windows
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Fri, 2/6/2026 8:11 AM, Ed Cryer wrote:

Paul wrote:

I've found an unusual thing in Windows 11, while looking around for things that might have crashed the system and corrupted it extensively.
In Reliability Monitor there are error messages of "unexpected shutdown" tied to every occasion that I've shut the damn thing down. So I tried my usual shutdown, rebooted, and lo! unexpected shutdown.
I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.
Now, that seems utterly stupid. I have two (no, three) questions.
1. What earthly advantage does that give? Surely, more problem-causing than helpful.
2. Who or what set it on my box of tricks?
3. The on/off button always went off. WTF?

Ed

When you got your mini, was there the normal OOBE (Out Of Box Experience) prompts,
indicating no one had played with the settings at all ?

*******

You can go Start : Run : control.exe as that opens the control panels.

The "Power" panel is a place to start.

Then "Choose what the Power button does".
Note that when done this way, this is for "frozen machines"
or for "emergency shutdown my machine is on fire". This is
not a replacement for some menu option in the OS.

"When I press the power button" [Shut down]

There is also on that page, a

"Change settings that are currently unavailable"

Note that, if you press the power button, that's
a dirty shutdown, not a controlled shutdown.

You're supposed to shut down using the menu in Windows 11. Use the "Start" button and the Start Menu, and the power button is in the
lower right corner. When you click that, there is a menu,
including a Shut Down and that flushes the disk before shutdown.

As an alternative, click your most on the desktop bare surface
(not a window) and use alt-F4 to bring up a more traditional menu.
Same options will be there, including Shutdown for an orderly shutdown.

You may want to disable Fast Start, so that the box does not
hibernate the kernel between sessions. The box should start
fast enough, with a full kernel boot each time. If that is
enabled right now, the "currently unavailable" interface will
expose the fast start button so you can disable it.

*******

In an Administrator Terminal, you can do

powercfg -? # Help options

powercfg /a # Available sleep states

Using that, helps you identify why the "currently unavailable"
things are currently unavailable.

That should be enough to get you started. As
we don't know if anything is wrong with it right now.

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Paul wrote:

I've found an unusual thing in Windows 11, while looking around for
things that might have crashed the system and corrupted it extensively.
In Reliability Monitor there are error messages of "unexpected shutdown" tied to every occasion that I've shut the damn thing down. So I tried my usual shutdown, rebooted, and lo! unexpected shutdown.
I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to
choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.
Now, that seems utterly stupid. I have two (no, three) questions.
1. What earthly advantage does that give? Surely, more problem-causing
than helpful.
2. Who or what set it on my box of tricks?
3. The on/off button always went off. WTF?

You probably mean the Control Panel -> Power Options setting 'Choose
what the power button does' (or the similar setting in Settings).

If so, then 'When I press the power button:' has been set to 'Sleep'
for at least since Windows 8.1, at least for systems which have a smart
power button, i.e. a short press does a Sleep and a long press does a
forced power off (giving the system no chance to do a proper shutdown).

If you did a long press, that explains the unexpected shutdown
message, because you should do a shutdown via the Start or other menu,
not with the power button.

FYI, on my wife's Mini-PC, 'When I press the power button:' is also
set to Sleep, which is no problem, because I only touch the power button
to turn the system *on* (which hardly ever happens, because the system
is ither awake or sleeping or hibernated) or in the very uncommon case
that I have to force a power off.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Frank Slootweg wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Paul wrote:


I've found an unusual thing in Windows 11, while looking around for
things that might have crashed the system and corrupted it extensively.
In Reliability Monitor there are error messages of "unexpected shutdown"
tied to every occasion that I've shut the damn thing down. So I tried my
usual shutdown, rebooted, and lo! unexpected shutdown.
I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to
choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.
Now, that seems utterly stupid. I have two (no, three) questions.
1. What earthly advantage does that give? Surely, more problem-causing
than helpful.
2. Who or what set it on my box of tricks?
3. The on/off button always went off. WTF?

You probably mean the Control Panel -> Power Options setting 'Choose
what the power button does' (or the similar setting in Settings).

If so, then 'When I press the power button:' has been set to 'Sleep'
for at least since Windows 8.1, at least for systems which have a smart
power button, i.e. a short press does a Sleep and a long press does a
forced power off (giving the system no chance to do a proper shutdown).

If you did a long press, that explains the unexpected shutdown
message, because you should do a shutdown via the Start or other menu,
not with the power button.

FYI, on my wife's Mini-PC, 'When I press the power button:' is also
set to Sleep, which is no problem, because I only touch the power button
to turn the system *on* (which hardly ever happens, because the system
is ither awake or sleeping or hibernated) or in the very uncommon case
that I have to force a power off.

Where is MS' "power button"?
Is it the physical button on the box; or is it the software one in the menu?
I always use the software one. And the physical one's light dies. At
which point I thought the system was powered off. A reasonable
conclusion. But no! It was only at Sleep!
How can you defend such a sloppy use of English? The Sleep option always appears, alongside the Shutdown. If I wanted that I'd have chosen it.

Ed
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Paul wrote:

I've found an unusual thing in Windows 11, while looking around for
things that might have crashed the system and corrupted it extensively.
In Reliability Monitor there are error messages of "unexpected shutdown" >> tied to every occasion that I've shut the damn thing down. So I tried my >> usual shutdown, rebooted, and lo! unexpected shutdown.
I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to
choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.
Now, that seems utterly stupid. I have two (no, three) questions.
1. What earthly advantage does that give? Surely, more problem-causing
than helpful.
2. Who or what set it on my box of tricks?
3. The on/off button always went off. WTF?

You probably mean the Control Panel -> Power Options setting 'Choose what the power button does' (or the similar setting in Settings).

If so, then 'When I press the power button:' has been set to 'Sleep'
for at least since Windows 8.1, at least for systems which have a smart power button, i.e. a short press does a Sleep and a long press does a forced power off (giving the system no chance to do a proper shutdown).

If you did a long press, that explains the unexpected shutdown
message, because you should do a shutdown via the Start or other menu,
not with the power button.

FYI, on my wife's Mini-PC, 'When I press the power button:' is also
set to Sleep, which is no problem, because I only touch the power button
to turn the system *on* (which hardly ever happens, because the system
is ither awake or sleeping or hibernated) or in the very uncommon case
that I have to force a power off.

Where is MS' "power button"?
Is it the physical button on the box; or is it the software one in the menu? I always use the software one. And the physical one's light dies. At
which point I thought the system was powered off. A reasonable
conclusion. But no! It was only at Sleep!
How can you defend such a sloppy use of English? The Sleep option always appears, alongside the Shutdown. If I wanted that I'd have chosen it.

The power button I was referring to is the physical one.

The software one (Start -> right-hand side -> icon of a power button)
is not a just a button, but a menu button, with choices:

- Lock
- Sleep
- Hibernate (might be absent)
- Shut down
- Restart

So *which* of those do you click and what happens then?

As you said the errors were "tied to every occasion that I've shut the
damn thing down". If you wanted to do a shut down then you obviously
should use 'Shut down' in the above menu and then wait for the pwer LED
to turn off before disconnecting power (if you do the latter).

Such a shut down should not do a sleep and should not cause
"unexpected shutdown" errors.

When responding, do not just use words to say what you're doing, but *exactly* *what* you click in which sequence. And, for

I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to
choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.

where *exactly* that is, because AFAWK, there is no setting which sets *shutdown* to sleep.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Frank Slootweg wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to
choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.

where *exactly* that is, because AFAWK, there is no setting which sets *shutdown* to sleep.

Well, Frank, we'll change roles. I'll be the omniscient Win11 expert,
and you can be the humble student willing to learn (:-

Lesson one;
Control Panel
Power options
Choose what the power buttons do.

My "When I press the power button" was set to "Sleep". After changing it
to "Shut down" my "improper shutdown error" didn't occur.

Ed

--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Fri, 2/6/2026 9:36 PM, Ed Cryer wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to >>>>> choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.

where *exactly* that is, because AFAWK, there is no setting which sets
*shutdown* to sleep.

Well, Frank, we'll change roles. I'll be the omniscient Win11 expert, and you can be the humble student willing to learn-a-a-a (:-

Lesson one;
Control Panel
Power options
Choose what the power buttons do.

My "When I press the power button" was set to "Sleep". After changing it to "Shut down" my "improper shutdown error" didn't occur.

Ed

Which suggests the Sleep ACPI procedure isn't working properly.
It's dropping the sleep session on the floor.

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Paul wrote:

On Fri, 2/6/2026 9:36 PM, Ed Cryer wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to >>>>>> choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.

where *exactly* that is, because AFAWK, there is no setting which sets
*shutdown* to sleep.

Well, Frank, we'll change roles. I'll be the omniscient Win11 expert, and you can be the humble student willing to learn-a-a-a (:-

Lesson one;
Control Panel
Power options
Choose what the power buttons do.

My "When I press the power button" was set to "Sleep". After changing it to "Shut down" my "improper shutdown error" didn't occur.

Ed

Which suggests the Sleep ACPI procedure isn't working properly.
It's dropping the sleep session on the floor.

Paul

I think the Sleep ACPI is working fine.
This is what happens (or was happening) in the real situation.
I send it to sleep (thinking I've turned it off); it stays so until at
bedtime I switch off all units.
Ergo, the power was suddenly turned off.

Ed
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to >>>> choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.

where *exactly* that is, because AFAWK, there is no setting which sets *shutdown* to sleep.

Well, Frank, we'll change roles. I'll be the omniscient Win11 expert,
and you can be the humble student willing to learn (:-

Lesson one;
Control Panel
Power options
Choose what the power buttons do.

My "When I press the power button" was set to "Sleep". After changing it
to "Shut down" my "improper shutdown error" didn't occur.

But this setting is about the *physical* power button. As you say,
you only use the ('Shut down' choice of) the *software* power button (on
the Start menu), this 'incorrect' setting of the action of the physical
power button should be irrelevant. So something is very strange here.

As I mentioned, my wife's Mini-PC has the same 'wrong' Sleep setting
for "Choose what the power buttons do" and it never gave a problem.

BUT, to be [f|F]rank, I hardly ever use the software 'Shut down'
function. The system is just active or sleeping or in hibernate, no need
for 'Shut down'. Once a month at Windows Update time, the system does a 'forced' Restart, but that's a Restart, not a Shut down.

Anyway, if the "improper shutdown error" problem is gone, all is good,
I suppose.

BTW, a minor correction to earlier information: I said that when the
'power' LED of the machine is off, it's safe to disconnect power, but on
my wife's Mini-PC I saw that that LED also turns off when the machine is sleeping, so - at least on that machine - it's not just a simple *power*
LED.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Sat, 2/7/2026 11:16 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

I found out that in the Power Options for Win11 there's the option to >>>>>> choose what happens with shutdown, and mine was set to Sleep.

where *exactly* that is, because AFAWK, there is no setting which sets
*shutdown* to sleep.

Well, Frank, we'll change roles. I'll be the omniscient Win11 expert,
and you can be the humble student willing to learn (:-

Lesson one;
Control Panel
Power options
Choose what the power buttons do.

My "When I press the power button" was set to "Sleep". After changing it
to "Shut down" my "improper shutdown error" didn't occur.

But this setting is about the *physical* power button. As you say,
you only use the ('Shut down' choice of) the *software* power button (on
the Start menu), this 'incorrect' setting of the action of the physical
power button should be irrelevant. So something is very strange here.

As I mentioned, my wife's Mini-PC has the same 'wrong' Sleep setting
for "Choose what the power buttons do" and it never gave a problem.

BUT, to be [f|F]rank, I hardly ever use the software 'Shut down'
function. The system is just active or sleeping or in hibernate, no need
for 'Shut down'. Once a month at Windows Update time, the system does a 'forced' Restart, but that's a Restart, not a Shut down.

Anyway, if the "improper shutdown error" problem is gone, all is good,
I suppose.

BTW, a minor correction to earlier information: I said that when the 'power' LED of the machine is off, it's safe to disconnect power, but on
my wife's Mini-PC I saw that that LED also turns off when the machine is sleeping, so - at least on that machine - it's not just a simple *power*
LED.

Isn't there supposed to be a flashing LED during (pure) sleep ?

There should be some indication that the machine is in a
fragile state (like, don't turn off the power on the back).

Perhaps what a LED-off indicates, is the machine is in
Hybrid Sleep, and removing the power does no permanent damage
(the hiberfil.sys has the session). Just the loading time will
be a bit longer on the next button push.

Paul

--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 2/7/2026 11:16 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:

[...]

BTW, a minor correction to earlier information: I said that when the 'power' LED of the machine is off, it's safe to disconnect power, but on
my wife's Mini-PC I saw that that LED also turns off when the machine is sleeping, so - at least on that machine - it's not just a simple *power* LED.

Isn't there supposed to be a flashing LED during (pure) sleep ?

There should be some indication that the machine is in a
fragile state (like, don't turn off the power on the back).

That apparently depends on the implementation.

On all my laptops since the late 90s, there always was a blinking
power LED when the laptop was sleeping. That's still the case on my
current Windows 11 laptop (but the LED is in a key on the keyboard, so
not visible when the lid is closed, which is a bit of a pain).

But on my wife'd Mini-PC, the 'power' LED is off in sleep and in
hibernation (and obviously when disconnected from power).

Perhaps what a LED-off indicates, is the machine is in
Hybrid Sleep, and removing the power does no permanent damage
(the hiberfil.sys has the session). Just the loading time will
be a bit longer on the next button push.

I don't think that my wife's Min-PC is using Hybrid Sleep, because a
manual Sleep is near instant, while a Hibernate takes some noteable
time. A wake from sleep is fast as well, but because the monitor is also sleeping, you can't tell which one wakes faster, the computer or the
monitor.

But please remind me how I can check if the system can use Hybrid
Sleep, if it's enabled and if it's actually Hybrid Sleeping. Thanks.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Sat, 2/7/2026 2:39 PM, Frank Slootweg wrote:

Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 2/7/2026 11:16 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:

[...]

BTW, a minor correction to earlier information: I said that when the
'power' LED of the machine is off, it's safe to disconnect power, but on >>> my wife's Mini-PC I saw that that LED also turns off when the machine is >>> sleeping, so - at least on that machine - it's not just a simple *power* >>> LED.

Isn't there supposed to be a flashing LED during (pure) sleep ?

There should be some indication that the machine is in a
fragile state (like, don't turn off the power on the back).

That apparently depends on the implementation.

On all my laptops since the late 90s, there always was a blinking
power LED when the laptop was sleeping. That's still the case on my
current Windows 11 laptop (but the LED is in a key on the keyboard, so
not visible when the lid is closed, which is a bit of a pain).

But on my wife'd Mini-PC, the 'power' LED is off in sleep and in hibernation (and obviously when disconnected from power).

Perhaps what a LED-off indicates, is the machine is in
Hybrid Sleep, and removing the power does no permanent damage
(the hiberfil.sys has the session). Just the loading time will
be a bit longer on the next button push.

I don't think that my wife's Min-PC is using Hybrid Sleep, because a
manual Sleep is near instant, while a Hibernate takes some noteable
time. A wake from sleep is fast as well, but because the monitor is also sleeping, you can't tell which one wakes faster, the computer or the
monitor.

But please remind me how I can check if the system can use Hybrid
Sleep, if it's enabled and if it's actually Hybrid Sleeping. Thanks.

I don't think Hybrid Sleep is an ACPI state. There is just S3.

powercfg /a
The following sleep states are available on this system:
Standby (S3)
Hibernate <=== should have labeled as S4
Hybrid Sleep
Fast Startup

The following sleep states are not available on this system:
Standby (S1)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Standby (S2)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Standby (S0 Low Power Idle)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Nothing in a menu, hints at whether Sleep or Hybrid Sleep
is about to be used when Sleep is selected. You'd just have
to watch the disk LED to figure it out.

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 2/7/2026 2:39 PM, Frank Slootweg wrote:

Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

On Sat, 2/7/2026 11:16 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:

[...]

BTW, a minor correction to earlier information: I said that when the >>> 'power' LED of the machine is off, it's safe to disconnect power, but on >>> my wife's Mini-PC I saw that that LED also turns off when the machine is >>> sleeping, so - at least on that machine - it's not just a simple *power* >>> LED.

Isn't there supposed to be a flashing LED during (pure) sleep ?

There should be some indication that the machine is in a
fragile state (like, don't turn off the power on the back).

That apparently depends on the implementation.

On all my laptops since the late 90s, there always was a blinking
power LED when the laptop was sleeping. That's still the case on my
current Windows 11 laptop (but the LED is in a key on the keyboard, so
not visible when the lid is closed, which is a bit of a pain).

But on my wife'd Mini-PC, the 'power' LED is off in sleep and in hibernation (and obviously when disconnected from power).

Perhaps what a LED-off indicates, is the machine is in
Hybrid Sleep, and removing the power does no permanent damage
(the hiberfil.sys has the session). Just the loading time will
be a bit longer on the next button push.

I don't think that my wife's Min-PC is using Hybrid Sleep, because a manual Sleep is near instant, while a Hibernate takes some noteable
time. A wake from sleep is fast as well, but because the monitor is also sleeping, you can't tell which one wakes faster, the computer or the monitor.

But please remind me how I can check if the system can use Hybrid
Sleep, if it's enabled and if it's actually Hybrid Sleeping. Thanks.

I don't think Hybrid Sleep is an ACPI state. There is just S3.

powercfg /a
The following sleep states are available on this system:
Standby (S3)
Hibernate <=== should have labeled as S4
Hybrid Sleep
Fast Startup

The following sleep states are not available on this system:
Standby (S1)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Standby (S2)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Standby (S0 Low Power Idle)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Nothing in a menu, hints at whether Sleep or Hybrid Sleep
is about to be used when Sleep is selected. You'd just have
to watch the disk LED to figure it out.

Paul

It looks like a system either has Hybrid Sleep or it hasn't. If it
has, there's a 'Allow Hybrid Sleep' setting in the 'Sleep' section of
the 'Power Options' Control Panel applet [1].

Hybrid Sleep is not present on my laptop, nor on my wife's Mini-PC.
For my wife's Mini-PC, 'powercfg /a' says:

The following sleep states are available on this system:
Standby (S3)
Hibernate
Fast Startup

The following sleep states are not available on this system:
Standby (S1)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Standby (S2)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Standby (S0 Low Power Idle)
The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Hybrid Sleep
The hypervisor does not support this standby state.

So it doesn't have 'Hybrid Sleep'. Also 'Sleep' is apparently just old-fashioned 'Standby (S3)', not 'Standby (S0 Low Power Idle)' (also
known as Modern Standby) (which my laptop *does* have).

Bottom line: My wife's Mini-PC just does a normal Sleep, not a Hybrid
Sleep, So it's strange that the 'power' LED goes off during Sleep, but
it does.

[1] See for example the screenshot of the 'Power Options' applet near
the bottom of this page:

<https://www.wisecleaner.com/think-tank/468-HowtoEnableHybridSleep-on-a-Laptop.html>
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Mon, 2/9/2026 4:32 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

A desktop computer has no battery, so it can't really have sleep mode,
so neither can have hybrid mode. Sleep with PSU running at a lower power?

A desktop definitely has S3 sleep. The DIMMs are powered by
+5VSB, and that is the power rail which does not require fan cooling.
There are power converters, suitable for delivering the DIMM sleep voltage value.

If you plug in your Apple iPhone to charge it, into a charge port on
the back of the PC, that could overload +5VSB... and then your S3
sleep on the desktop could be lost (unless the Hybrid Sleep was enabled).

Paul


--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

Ed Cryer <ed@somewhere.in.the.uk> wrote:

Frank Slootweg wrote:

[...]

For my wife's Mini-PC, 'powercfg /a' says:

The following sleep states are available on this system:
Standby (S3)
Hibernate
Fast Startup

[...]

You'd be well advised to bring Fast Startup into your considerations.
It hibernates the kernel session to hiberfil.sys, acting as a kind of
hybrid shutdown.

Thanks for spotting that! I thought I had disabled Fast Startup on my
wife's Mini-PC, but apparently I hadn't.

As I mentioned, I hardly ever use 'Shut down', so I also hardly ever boot/startup, so Fast Startup has no real advantage for me. But it does
carry the risk that at some time a cold boot is needed (to (try to)
clear a problem), but with Fast Startup enabled, the system does a
warm(ish) boot.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2026-02-09 15:02, Paul wrote:

On Mon, 2/9/2026 4:32 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

A desktop computer has no battery, so it can't really have sleep mode,
so neither can have hybrid mode. Sleep with PSU running at a lower power?

A desktop definitely has S3 sleep. The DIMMs are powered by
+5VSB, and that is the power rail which does not require fan cooling.
There are power converters, suitable for delivering the DIMM sleep voltage value.

If you plug in your Apple iPhone to charge it, into a charge port on
the back of the PC, that could overload +5VSB... and then your S3
sleep on the desktop could be lost (unless the Hybrid Sleep was enabled).

I remember a computer I bought with Windows Me, long ago. It could go to sleep, but the CPU burned to the touch.
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Mon, 2/9/2026 12:52 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

On 2026-02-09 15:02, Paul wrote:

On Mon, 2/9/2026 4:32 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

A desktop computer has no battery, so it can't really have sleep mode,
so neither can have hybrid mode. Sleep with PSU running at a lower power? >>

A desktop definitely has S3 sleep. The DIMMs are powered by
+5VSB, and that is the power rail which does not require fan cooling.
There are power converters, suitable for delivering the DIMM sleep voltage value.

If you plug in your Apple iPhone to charge it, into a charge port on
the back of the PC, that could overload +5VSB... and then your S3
sleep on the desktop could be lost (unless the Hybrid Sleep was enabled).

I remember a computer I bought with Windows Me, long ago. It could go to sleep, but the CPU burned to the touch.

Windows Me might have been APM (the scheme before ACPI), and then
I don't know what state that would be. Maybe a kind of Standby
rather than a Sleep.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Power_Management

APM defines five power states for the computer system:

Full On: The computer is powered on, and no devices are in a power saving mode.

APM Enabled: The computer is powered on, and APM is controlling device power management as needed.

APM Standby: Most devices are in their low-power state, the CPU is slowed or stopped,
and the system state is saved. The computer can be returned to its
former state quickly (in response to activity such as the
user pressing a key on the keyboard).

APM Suspend: Most devices are powered off, but the system state is saved.
The computer can be returned to its former state, but takes a
relatively long time. (Hibernation is a special form of the
APM Suspend state).

Off: The computer is turned off.

That's not a very detailed description.

It couldn't be a "stopped clock" (BCLK) because x86 CPUs have had
DRAM for internal storage of things. (Multiport SRAM for registers,
but DRAM of some sort for more bulk storage inside.) And then if
the CPU was expected to keep-state, BCLK still had to run to
arrange Refresh for the DRAM cells. The DRAM used fewer transistors, back
when transistor count mattered.

There were a few (non-Intel) CPUs which were fully static, and if you pulled their BCLK-equivalent to Logic 0, the leakage was practically zero.
And those would be ice cold when parked. A number of those flew in satellites.

There wasn't really much power-saving back around the year 2000.
It took the video cards, for example, a long time to incorporate
power saving. The 8800 video card, its power save state used
50% of the 3D run-level power. A savings for sure, but not a
big savings. The very best achievement was video cards that
could drop to around 3 watts. The video cards today are
unlikely to be able to reach 3 watts. Their resting power will be
more than that (like 40 watts maybe, on the biggest card).

Paul
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From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2026-02-10 08:35, Paul wrote:

On Mon, 2/9/2026 12:52 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

On 2026-02-09 15:02, Paul wrote:

On Mon, 2/9/2026 4:32 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

...

I remember a computer I bought with Windows Me, long ago. It could go to sleep, but the CPU burned to the touch.

Windows Me might have been APM (the scheme before ACPI), and then
I don't know what state that would be. Maybe a kind of Standby
rather than a Sleep.

Yes, it was APM. And the state was probably standby, from the
description below. But a bug somewhere, firmware or hardware, stopped
the fans and CPU almost burned to the touch. So I disabled the mode.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Power_Management

APM defines five power states for the computer system:

Full On: The computer is powered on, and no devices are in a power saving mode.

APM Enabled: The computer is powered on, and APM is controlling device power management as needed.

APM Standby: Most devices are in their low-power state, the CPU is slowed or stopped,
and the system state is saved. The computer can be returned to its
former state quickly (in response to activity such as the
user pressing a key on the keyboard).

APM Suspend: Most devices are powered off, but the system state is saved.
The computer can be returned to its former state, but takes a
relatively long time. (Hibernation is a special form of the
APM Suspend state).

Off: The computer is turned off.

That's not a very detailed description.

It couldn't be a "stopped clock" (BCLK) because x86 CPUs have had
DRAM for internal storage of things. (Multiport SRAM for registers,
but DRAM of some sort for more bulk storage inside.) And then if
the CPU was expected to keep-state, BCLK still had to run to
arrange Refresh for the DRAM cells. The DRAM used fewer transistors, back when transistor count mattered.

There were a few (non-Intel) CPUs which were fully static, and if you pulled their BCLK-equivalent to Logic 0, the leakage was practically zero.
And those would be ice cold when parked. A number of those flew in satellites.

There wasn't really much power-saving back around the year 2000.
It took the video cards, for example, a long time to incorporate
power saving. The 8800 video card, its power save state used
50% of the 3D run-level power. A savings for sure, but not a
big savings. The very best achievement was video cards that
could drop to around 3 watts. The video cards today are
unlikely to be able to reach 3 watts. Their resting power will be
more than that (like 40 watts maybe, on the biggest card).

Sending the display to some sleep mode was a big save. A big CRT display
could eat a hundred watts.
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Tue, 2/17/2026 3:08 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

Sending the display to some sleep mode was a big save. A big CRT display could eat a hundred watts.

I had a Trinitron here, and I checked and standby didn't save a watt :-)
The beam still seemed to be running, and perhaps deflected to the
side or something.

There was a definite dependence on resolution/refresh rate.
When the monitor would no longer run at 1280x1024 and I had
to turn down the resolution to stop arc-over on the HV,
the thing ran a *lot* cooler.

It got retired when it was getting a bit on the dim side.

Paul


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From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 18/02/2026 8:21 pm, Paul wrote:

On Tue, 2/17/2026 3:08 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

Sending the display to some sleep mode was a big save. A big CRT
display could eat a hundred watts.

I had a Trinitron here, and I checked and standby didn't save a watt
:-) The beam still seemed to be running, and perhaps deflected to
the side or something.

Perhaps the Heater kept that Cathode at Electron-emitting temperature
... but the CRT Grid voltage went far enough negative to cut off the
flow of electrons towards the screen.

So the Power Supply would still be producing all the required voltages
... just the Electron Beam would be disabled.
--
Daniel70
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On 2026-02-18 10:21, Paul wrote:

On Tue, 2/17/2026 3:08 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

Sending the display to some sleep mode was a big save. A big CRT display could eat a hundred watts.

I had a Trinitron here, and I checked and standby didn't save a watt :-)

Mmm. I did not have a power meter at the time. I simply trusted a label
these things had, I forget the text. APM compliant? Green something
compliant?

The beam still seemed to be running, and perhaps deflected to the
side or something.

Maybe keeping the cathode hot, but no high voltage?

There was a definite dependence on resolution/refresh rate.
When the monitor would no longer run at 1280x1024 and I had
to turn down the resolution to stop arc-over on the HV,
the thing ran a *lot* cooler.

It got retired when it was getting a bit on the dim side.

Paul

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21b-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-11

On Wed, 2/18/2026 7:38 AM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

On 2026-02-18 10:21, Paul wrote:

On Tue, 2/17/2026 3:08 PM, Carlos E. R. wrote:

Sending the display to some sleep mode was a big save. A big CRT display could eat a hundred watts.

I had a Trinitron here, and I checked and standby didn't save a watt :-)

Mmm. I did not have a power meter at the time. I simply trusted a label these things had,
I forget the text. APM compliant? Green something compliant?

I don't get a particularly strong feeling about this APM thing.
The terminology seemed a bit wishy-washy. The ACPI specs, at
five hundred pages a piece, may seem excessive as specs, but
at least you can build something that (eventually) worked.
You no longer have HIPM/DIPM issues.

The spare desktop here, is almost as good as my laptop. That's
how much improvement in power savings they managed on the CPU
at idle. My daily driver is 11W higher at idle (and has a video
card, because the iGPU caused problems). The spare desktop
is OK with its iGPU.

Paul

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