From Newsgroup: alt.bible
On 12/22/2025 12:51 AM, Noah Wang wrote:
https://zionintravail.com/
1 Peter 4:17 (KJV):
For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and
if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
Thessalonians 2:1-3:
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the
son of perdition;
Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that
is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
Matthew 24:14:
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
1 Thessalonians 2:14:
For ye, brethren, became followers of the churches of God which in
Judaea are in Christ Jesus: for ye also have suffered like things of
your own countrymen.
Matthew 24:15-16:
When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
Daniel 12:4 KJV:
But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the
time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
This promotes the teaching of Harold Camping. He made two predictions
about the date of the Lord's return, which proved to be false. A lot of
what he taught was correct, but his claims about the church are
unsupported from any of the Scriptures you cited.
As far as how God saves people, He's always saved them by grace, through
faith in the gospel (Romans 1:16-17; 10:17; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4;
Ephesians 2:8-9; Romans 4; Galatians).
The church is the people (1 Corinthians 12:27), not the building or denomination. All those who believe on the Lord Jesus Christ for
salvation are part of the church, and there are still people being saved
today (Romans 11:25), until the time of the fullness of the Gentiles be
come in.
The claim rCLGod is ONLY saving outside the churchesrCY directly contradicts the plain teaching of Scripture. The passages cited do not teach that
God abandons the church or saves people apart from it. They are being
misread, combined without context, and pressed into a conclusion the
text never makes.
1 Peter 4:17
rCLFor it is time for judgment to begin at the household of GodrCarCY (1 Peter 4:17, ESV).
Peter speaks to believers undergoing persecution. rCLJudgmentrCY here means purifying discipline, not rejection. God refines His people first. The
verse contrasts believers with rCLthose who do not obey the gospel.rCY It
does not say God stops saving within the church. It assumes the church consists of saved people whom God corrects as sons (Hebrews 12:5rCo11).
2 Thessalonians 2:1rCo3
rCLLet no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless
the rebellion comes firstrCarCY (2 Thessalonians 2:3, ESV).
Paul warns about deception before the day of the Lord. He does not say
the true church disappears or becomes unsaved. Apostasy means a falling
away from truth by some, not the extinction of ChristrCOs body. Paul later affirms that God saves through belief in the truth (2 Thessalonians
2:13rCo14, ESV).
Matthew 24:14
rCLAnd this gospel of the kingdom will be proclaimed throughout the whole worldrCarCY (Matthew 24:14, ESV).
This verse affirms worldwide proclamation, not rejection of the church.
The risen Christ explicitly entrusted that mission to His disciples and promised to be with them to the end of the age (Matthew 28:18rCo20, ESV). Scripture never presents an alternative saving institution outside
ChristrCOs assembled people.
1 Thessalonians 2:14
rCLFor you, brothers, became imitators of the churches of God in Christ JesusrCarCY (1 Thessalonians 2:14, ESV).
This verse directly undermines the claim. Paul praises churches as
genuine examples of believers rCLin Christ Jesus.rCY He does not distance salvation from churches. He locates salvation within them.
Matthew 24:15rCo16
rCLThen let those who are in Judea flee to the mountainsrCY (Matthew 24:16, ESV).
This is a specific historical and prophetic instruction tied to Judea
and the abomination of desolation. It is not a command to abandon the
church. It concerns physical flight from judgment, not spiritual
separation from ChristrCOs body.
Daniel 12:4
rCLMany shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increaserCY (Daniel 12:4, ESV).
This describes increased activity and understanding near the end, not a
new salvation method. Daniel says nothing about God saving people apart
from His covenant people.
The consistent biblical teaching
God saves sinners through the gospel of ChristrCOs death and resurrection
(1 Corinthians 15:1rCo4, ESV). Christ saves people into one body, not into isolation (1 Corinthians 12:13, ESV). He loves the church and gave
Himself for her (Ephesians 5:25, ESV). The church stands as rCLthe
household of GodrCaa pillar and buttress of the truthrCY (1 Timothy 3:15, ESV).
Yes, false teachers arise. Yes, some assemblies abandon truth. Scripture
warns about that repeatedly (Acts 20:29rCo30, ESV). But Scripture never teaches that God saves only outside the church. Instead, God calls
believers to hold fast to sound doctrine, to test teachers, and to
remain faithful within ChristrCOs body (Hebrews 10:23rCo25, ESV).
Conclusion
The claim depends on fear-driven proof-texting, not careful exegesis.
Judgment begins with GodrCOs people to purify them, not to replace them. Apostasy proves the need for discernment, not separation from the
church. God saves sinners by grace through faith in Christ and places
them into His church, not away from it (Ephesians 2:8rCo10; 2:19rCo22, ESV).
--
Have you heard the good news Christ died for our sins (rCa), and God
raised Him from the dead?
That Christ died for our sins shows we're sinners who deserve the death penalty. That God raised Him from the dead shows Christ's death
satisfied God's righteous demands against our sin (Romans 3:25; 1 John
2:1-2). This means God can now remain just, while forgiving you of your
sins, and saving you from eternal damnation.
On the basis of Christ's death and resurrection for our sins, call on
the name of the Lord to save you: "For 'everyone who calls on the name
of the Lord will be saved'" (Romans 10:13, ESV).
https://christrose.news/salvation
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