On 10/22/2024 3:11 AM, Xocyll wrote:

Spalls Hurgenson <spallshurgenson@gmail.com> looked up from reading the entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

On Mon, 21 Oct 2024 07:06:53 -0400, Xocyll <Xocyll@gmx.com> wrote:

Spalls Hurgenson <spallshurgenson@gmail.com> looked up from reading the
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

<Big Snip>

[Shawn Layton doesn't mention this, but smaller games with shorter
development cycles would probably also alleviate the necessity for
mass layoffs after a big game completes, because rather than laying
off all those artists while the years-long pre-production and
programming for your AAA game takes place, you can just shift them
all over to a smaller project.]

Ahh but firing them all means more bonus money for the executives.

True. The biggest problem with Layton's argument is that it depends on
long-term thinking by C-level execs. It requires them to consider the
future of the company _beyond_ the immediate quarter. Too often, their
concern is only, "what will pop the stock price up a few ticks" and
not "what's good for the long-term health of the corporation?"...
especially since they're protected by too-high salaries and golden
parachutes.

Even without the parachutes and such, there's no loyalty to a company anymore.
The days of working your entire life in the same company are long gone,
so it's what will boost our stock value the most this year and therefore
make my stock options worth more, then I bail out and work for the competition (which also forces them to divest their shares in the old
company before the long term pain sets in.)

That was back when companies were loyal to their employees. Well, at
least a lot of them. Company paid for pension plans and retirement
benefits used to exist so employees had a _reason_ to stay. In turn
companies benefited from the ever more experienced work force.

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> looked up from reading the
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

On 10/22/2024 3:11 AM, Xocyll wrote:

Spalls Hurgenson <spallshurgenson@gmail.com> looked up from reading the
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

On Mon, 21 Oct 2024 07:06:53 -0400, Xocyll <Xocyll@gmx.com> wrote:

Spalls Hurgenson <spallshurgenson@gmail.com> looked up from reading the >>>> entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

<Big Snip>

[Shawn Layton doesn't mention this, but smaller games with shorter
development cycles would probably also alleviate the necessity for
mass layoffs after a big game completes, because rather than laying
off all those artists while the years-long pre-production and
programming for your AAA game takes place, you can just shift them
all over to a smaller project.]

Ahh but firing them all means more bonus money for the executives.

True. The biggest problem with Layton's argument is that it depends on
long-term thinking by C-level execs. It requires them to consider the
future of the company _beyond_ the immediate quarter. Too often, their
concern is only, "what will pop the stock price up a few ticks" and
not "what's good for the long-term health of the corporation?"...
especially since they're protected by too-high salaries and golden
parachutes.

Even without the parachutes and such, there's no loyalty to a company
anymore.
The days of working your entire life in the same company are long gone,
so it's what will boost our stock value the most this year and therefore
make my stock options worth more, then I bail out and work for the
competition (which also forces them to divest their shares in the old
company before the long term pain sets in.)

That was back when companies were loyal to their employees. Well, at
least a lot of them. Company paid for pension plans and retirement
benefits used to exist so employees had a _reason_ to stay. In turn >companies benefited from the ever more experienced work force.

Yeah the corporate raiders of the '90's put an end to that, wiping out
most of the old school companies and creating the "leaner, meaner,
what's in it for me, fuck the dead weight" type leadership.
Where the dead weight truly was dead weight originally, but became more
and more of the people who actually made what the corp sold.

They trimmed the fat, then they trimmed muscle and bone in endless
downsizings and killed the company dead, but jumped ship before it died.

Xocyll

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 22/10/2024 15:34, Dimensional Traveler wrote:

That was back when companies were loyal to their employees.  Well, at
least a lot of them.  Company paid for pension plans and retirement
benefits used to exist so employees had a _reason_ to stay.  In turn companies benefited from the ever more experienced work force.

I agree with that, there's been a move from a social contract to a
commercial one. So a simple example was that our expenses were fairly
flexible and then they started introducing maximum spends on food and
drink that barely covered what you might spend. They seem to think it
was perfectly ok to get a really cheap meal in the evening and then
spend the rest of the time sitting in a hotel room.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 23/10/2024 09:25, Xocyll wrote:

Yeah the corporate raiders of the '90's put an end to that, wiping out
most of the old school companies and creating the "leaner, meaner,
what's in it for me, fuck the dead weight" type leadership.
Where the dead weight truly was dead weight originally, but became more
and more of the people who actually made what the corp sold.

They trimmed the fat, then they trimmed muscle and bone in endless downsizings and killed the company dead, but jumped ship before it died.

Yep we had that, get rid of the office manager and let the engineers do
all those little jobs themselves. After constantly running out of
printer paper a graduate was delegated to look after it.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

JAB <noway@nochance.com> looked up from reading the entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:

On 23/10/2024 09:25, Xocyll wrote:

Yeah the corporate raiders of the '90's put an end to that, wiping out
most of the old school companies and creating the "leaner, meaner,
what's in it for me, fuck the dead weight" type leadership.
Where the dead weight truly was dead weight originally, but became more
and more of the people who actually made what the corp sold.

They trimmed the fat, then they trimmed muscle and bone in endless
downsizings and killed the company dead, but jumped ship before it died.

Yep we had that, get rid of the office manager and let the engineers do
all those little jobs themselves. After constantly running out of
printer paper a graduate was delegated to look after it.

Why not just get an unpaid intern?

"Your job is to change the paper in the printers and such, no money but
you get valuable experience you can put on your resume to get you a real
job next year. Oh and do you have a younger sibling who'd like your
unpaid job next year?"

Xocyll

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 10/24/2024 8:04 PM, Xocyll wrote:

JAB <noway@nochance.com> looked up from reading the entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:

On 23/10/2024 09:25, Xocyll wrote:

Yeah the corporate raiders of the '90's put an end to that, wiping out
most of the old school companies and creating the "leaner, meaner,
what's in it for me, fuck the dead weight" type leadership.
Where the dead weight truly was dead weight originally, but became more
and more of the people who actually made what the corp sold.

They trimmed the fat, then they trimmed muscle and bone in endless
downsizings and killed the company dead, but jumped ship before it died.

Yep we had that, get rid of the office manager and let the engineers do
all those little jobs themselves. After constantly running out of
printer paper a graduate was delegated to look after it.

Why not just get an unpaid intern?

"Your job is to change the paper in the printers and such, no money but
you get valuable experience you can put on your resume to get you a real
job next year. Oh and do you have a younger sibling who'd like your
unpaid job next year?"

Prospective interns don't accept those kinds of positions anymore.
These days the only people who intern are those who have already mapped
out their careers for the next 20 years and are taking internships in
the industry they are getting advanced degrees for. They are there for
the hands on experience in the field and the bonus credits to get an
over 4.0 GPA.

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

On 25/10/2024 04:04, Xocyll wrote:

Yep we had that, get rid of the office manager and let the engineers do
all those little jobs themselves. After constantly running out of
printer paper a graduate was delegated to look after it.

Why not just get an unpaid intern?

"Your job is to change the paper in the printers and such, no money but
you get valuable experience you can put on your resume to get you a real
job next year. Oh and do you have a younger sibling who'd like your
unpaid job next year?"

In the UK the whole idea of unpaid interns was ruled illegal so they
still have to get paid as they are doing work. The exceptions are what
we call work experience which will typical be a week or two and the main
one, those who 'work' for charity organisations.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)

Dimensional Traveler <dtravel@sonic.net> looked up from reading the
entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs
say:

On 10/24/2024 8:04 PM, Xocyll wrote:

JAB <noway@nochance.com> looked up from reading the entrails of the porn
spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say:

On 23/10/2024 09:25, Xocyll wrote:

Yeah the corporate raiders of the '90's put an end to that, wiping out >>>> most of the old school companies and creating the "leaner, meaner,
what's in it for me, fuck the dead weight" type leadership.
Where the dead weight truly was dead weight originally, but became more >>>> and more of the people who actually made what the corp sold.

They trimmed the fat, then they trimmed muscle and bone in endless
downsizings and killed the company dead, but jumped ship before it died. >>>

Yep we had that, get rid of the office manager and let the engineers do
all those little jobs themselves. After constantly running out of
printer paper a graduate was delegated to look after it.

Why not just get an unpaid intern?

"Your job is to change the paper in the printers and such, no money but
you get valuable experience you can put on your resume to get you a real
job next year. Oh and do you have a younger sibling who'd like your
unpaid job next year?"

Prospective interns don't accept those kinds of positions anymore.
These days the only people who intern are those who have already mapped
out their careers for the next 20 years and are taking internships in
the industry they are getting advanced degrees for. They are there for
the hands on experience in the field and the bonus credits to get an
over 4.0 GPA.

Intern is just a title, it doesn't have to mean a professional.
Often it's a high schooler looking for that first job exp to put on the
resume so they can apply for something else.

Not all are university students interning at a prospective future
employer.

If through some gov't job aid program, often called a "work placement."

Xocyll

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
* Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)