From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

I used to be a Draytek fan but I eventually got fed up with their
quirky and difficult to use interface.

I now use Asus routers with asuswrt-merlin, excellent!
--
Chris Green
-+
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

On 15/08/2025 21:48, NY wrote:

On 15/08/2025 20:15, David Wade wrote:

You can buy a separate DSL modem but they're rare and expensive.

But no use on modern FTTP connections which have an Ethernet connection.

In that case you'd use a "pure" router to take the WAN traffic and hide
it behind NAT for LAN Ethernet and wifi connections. A lot of routers nowadays have two inputs: an ADSL/VDSL input to the modem, and an
Ethernet input from a separate modem or an FTTP fibre-to-Ethernet
converter (I'm ashamed to say that I don't actually know the technical
term for a fibre-to-Ethernet translation box).

Its an Optical Network Terminator or ONT. It handles the encryption of
the traffic so its hard, but not impossible for those on the same fibre segment to sniff your traffic.

If we ever get FTTP, I will make sure that I label the WAN Ethernet
cable very clearly to avoid it accidentally getting plugged into a LAN socket on the router or into an Ethernet hub, because that would expose
PCs to the WAN with no NAT and firewall.

Usually not true. Most of the alt-net FTTP providers use CGNAT so your
IP is not externally visible. Then to prevent random connections they typically use PPP over Ethernet so unless you plug it into the router
port you don't get a connection.

Dave
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> wrote:

On 15/08/2025 21:48, NY wrote:

On 15/08/2025 20:15, David Wade wrote:

You can buy a separate DSL modem but they're rare and expensive.

But no use on modern FTTP connections which have an Ethernet connection.

In that case you'd use a "pure" router to take the WAN traffic and hide
it behind NAT for LAN Ethernet and wifi connections. A lot of routers
nowadays have two inputs: an ADSL/VDSL input to the modem, and an
Ethernet input from a separate modem or an FTTP fibre-to-Ethernet
converter (I'm ashamed to say that I don't actually know the technical
term for a fibre-to-Ethernet translation box).

Its an Optical Network Terminator or ONT. It handles the encryption of
the traffic so its hard, but not impossible for those on the same fibre segment to sniff your traffic.

If we ever get FTTP, I will make sure that I label the WAN Ethernet
cable very clearly to avoid it accidentally getting plugged into a LAN
socket on the router or into an Ethernet hub, because that would expose
PCs to the WAN with no NAT and firewall.

Usually not true. Most of the alt-net FTTP providers use CGNAT so your
IP is not externally visible. Then to prevent random connections they typically use PPP over Ethernet so unless you plug it into the router
port you don't get a connection.

Dave

Just a minor niggle: if your FTTP comes via CityFibre whether or not you
get CGNAT depends on which isp you sign up to. I donrCOt suffer from it on my IDnet service.

But yes, if you donrCOt connect via the routerrCOs WAN port the connection wonrCOt be authenticated. Well at least with CF. IrCOm assuming that altnets that use their own in-house isp also require authentication from the
router.

As far as I can tell werCOve basically got two types of FTTP service:
Open Reach or City Fibre, where you have a choice of isp
Altnet with in-house isp with no choice of isp

The latter seems unfortunate, as they have you over a barrel in terms of
future price hikes (see VM), especially if Open Reach fibre isnrCOt also available.

--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

On 14/08/2025 in message <xn0p9jh628s4aj000@news.individual.net> Jeff
Gaines wrote:

If I use my own router (which I would have to buy) could I keep the home >network up in these circumstances but just lose Internet access?

I have found my TWP-Link Archer VCR2100 which I used before moving to my
ISP's device, must be a few years ago now.

It has a dedicated socket for DSL input and says "the LAN4/WAN port is
used for connecting to a Cable/FTTH/VDSL/ADSL device".

I can't remember when I last used it but it seems to me I can plug a cable from the splitter in my Openreach box to it - it's FTTC so is that VDSL,
the WAN port?

I am being extremely cautious, it's a small village, I don't want to be
the bloke who blew the Internet up!
--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
We chose to do this not because it is easy but because we thought it would
be easy.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

Jeff Gaines wrote:

On 14/08/2025 in message <xn0p9jh628s4aj000@news.individual.net> Jeff
Gaines wrote:

If I use my own router (which I would have to buy) could I keep the
home network up in these circumstances but just lose Internet access?

I have found my TWP-Link Archer VCR2100 which I used before moving to my ISP's device, must be a few years ago now.

It has a dedicated socket for DSL input and says "the LAN4/WAN port is
used for connecting to a Cable/FTTH/VDSL/ADSL device".

What this means is an Ethernet connection to a modem which in turn
connects to "Cable/FTTH/VDSL/ADSL" service. This is what they mean by "device". Probably you have to reconfigure the VCR2100 to use its LAN4
port for the WAN service, and reboot. Then it will give you access to a
page where you provide the PPPoE login and password for your ISP's
connection. These credentials are sent out of the LAN4/WAN port through
the modem to your ISP.

I can't remember when I last used it but it seems to me I can plug a
cable from the splitter

What do you mean by "splitter"?

in my Openreach box to it - it's FTTC so is that
VDSL, the WAN port?

FTTC is indeed VDSL. But you would need a VDSL modem to connect to the
socket in the Openreach box.

But your Archer VCR2100 already contains a VDSL modem! It uses the grey socket on the back marked "DSL". So you only need a suitable cable to
connect the DSL socket to the Openreach box. Then you need to provide
your ISP's login credentials in the settings for the VDSL connection in
your Archer VCR2100.

I am being extremely cautious, it's a small village, I don't want to be
the bloke who blew the Internet up!

No chance of that!
--
Graham J
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

On 16/08/2025 in message <107pk58$1kmeq$1@dont-email.me> Graham J wrote:

Jeff Gaines wrote:

On 14/08/2025 in message <xn0p9jh628s4aj000@news.individual.net> Jeff >>Gaines wrote:

If I use my own router (which I would have to buy) could I keep the home >>>network up in these circumstances but just lose Internet access?

I have found my TWP-Link Archer VCR2100 which I used before moving to my >>ISP's device, must be a few years ago now.

It has a dedicated socket for DSL input and says "the LAN4/WAN port is >>used for connecting to a Cable/FTTH/VDSL/ADSL device".

What this means is an Ethernet connection to a modem which in turn
connects to "Cable/FTTH/VDSL/ADSL" service. This is what they mean by >"device". Probably you have to reconfigure the VCR2100 to use its LAN4
port for the WAN service, and reboot. Then it will give you access to a >page where you provide the PPPoE login and password for your ISP's >connection. These credentials are sent out of the LAN4/WAN port through
the modem to your ISP.

I can't remember when I last used it but it seems to me I can plug a >>cable from the splitter

What do you mean by "splitter"?

in my Openreach box to it - it's FTTC so is that VDSL, the WAN port?

FTTC is indeed VDSL. But you would need a VDSL modem to connect to the >socket in the Openreach box.

But your Archer VCR2100 already contains a VDSL modem! It uses the grey >socket on the back marked "DSL". So you only need a suitable cable to >connect the DSL socket to the Openreach box. Then you need to provide
your ISP's login credentials in the settings for the VDSL connection in
your Archer VCR2100.

I am being extremely cautious, it's a small village, I don't want to be >>the bloke who blew the Internet up!

No chance of that!

Many thanks :-)

When I had broadband fitted here Openreach used a single socket box with a splitter hanging from it rather than a box with individual
'phone/broadband outputs.
--
Jeff Gaines Dorset UK
Have you ever noticed that all the instruments searching for intelligent
life are pointing away from Earth?
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

Jeff Gaines wrote:

[snip]

When I had broadband fitted here Openreach used a single socket box with
a splitter hanging from it rather than a box with individual 'phone/broadband outputs.

The "splitter" is also described as a "microfilter". It has two
outputs: RJ11 for the cable to your router, and a socket for the BT
standard type 431A phone plug. The RJ11 socket is wired straight
through so connects to the Openreach master socket which means that it
carries the full bandwidth. The 431A socket is fed via the filter so
that the high frequencies used for ADSL and more recently for VDSL do
not reach the telephone. This removes any strange noises you might hear
when making a phone call, and reduces any interference with the
broadband signal that might be caused by the phone.

So it provides two functions: the correct connector for your router,
and prevention of audio/telephone interference with the broadband signal.

---

A master socket with individual 'phone/broadband outputs contains the
filter components, and can allow connection of an extension phone line
after the filter (wired through the backplate that mounts it on the
wall). The socket for your router connection will accept a RJ45 plug so
a standard Ethernet (Cat 5 or CAT 6) cable can be used to provide a RJ45 socket at another location into which you can plug the RJ11 cable from a router. So having the router in a more sensible location isn't
difficult apart from the potential for an unsightly cable.
--
Graham J
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> wrote:

On 15/08/2025 21:48, NY wrote:

On 15/08/2025 20:15, David Wade wrote:

You can buy a separate DSL modem but they're rare and expensive.

But no use on modern FTTP connections which have an Ethernet connection.

In that case you'd use a "pure" router to take the WAN traffic and hide
it behind NAT for LAN Ethernet and wifi connections. A lot of routers nowadays have two inputs: an ADSL/VDSL input to the modem, and an
Ethernet input from a separate modem or an FTTP fibre-to-Ethernet converter (I'm ashamed to say that I don't actually know the technical term for a fibre-to-Ethernet translation box).

Its an Optical Network Terminator or ONT. It handles the encryption of
the traffic so its hard, but not impossible for those on the same fibre segment to sniff your traffic.

Some altnets provide the ONT and router in one box, in which case you would have to look for a feature equivalent to 'modem mode' that allows you to
bypass the router functionality.

If we ever get FTTP, I will make sure that I label the WAN Ethernet
cable very clearly to avoid it accidentally getting plugged into a LAN socket on the router or into an Ethernet hub, because that would expose PCs to the WAN with no NAT and firewall.

Usually not true. Most of the alt-net FTTP providers use CGNAT so your
IP is not externally visible. Then to prevent random connections they typically use PPP over Ethernet so unless you plug it into the router
port you don't get a connection.

Some do CGNAT, some don't: https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2024/04/ipv6-and-cgnat-support-survey-of-uk-altnet-fttp-broadband-isps.html

Often you can pay for a 'static IP' package that gets you a public IPv4.
They may or may not offer you a public IPv6 range on their default package.
.
For some ISPs there are guides as to how to set up your router for their version of PPPoE.

Theo
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:

I would agree with Graham and Bob that Draytek routers are very capable
and from what I hear reliable BUT they can be very difficult to program unless your are well into router programming AND, as already said, they
are not cheap - north of 2 ton is quite normal whereas most suitable TPL units are in the order of half that or so. I have a Draytek in the
cupboard (can't remember the model number) and although I've only had
two goes at it I have yet to crack how to make it do what I want!!

If you want a capable router it's also worth looking at installing OpenWRT
on a router. Gets you the configurability on less expensive hardware. I'm running it on an ex-Zen Fritzbox 7530 (not AX) which was about -u40 second
hand and it works well (I haven't tested the DSL part, which OpenWRT does support).

(Avoid GL.iNet who sell routers with 'OpenWRT preinstalled' - they're just a Chinese closed source fork. Some of them can run vanilla OpenWRT but others have closed source drivers which aren't available)

My current router - that I have been using for maybe over a decade - is
a TP-L Archer D2 and it would take quite a bit to make me replace it!

A lot of TP-Links can run OpenWRT too. Routers with DSL support are a bit rarer though.

Theo
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

On Sat, 16 Aug 2025 10:48:17 +0100
Graham J <nobody@nowhere.co.uk> wrote:

I am being extremely cautious, it's a small village, I don't want
to be the bloke who blew the Internet up!

No chance of that!

That sounds like another way of saying "What could possibly go wrong?"

When I was a student, we three blokes who shared a house would have a
cheap very used TV set. One summer, I had taken the set home, to use in
my room. One evening, it suddenly let all the smoke out, and died spectacularly. The next day, everyone in the street was talking about
what could possibly have caused a temporary TV blackout, at exactly the
time that my set had self-combusted. I remained quiet......
--
Davey.

--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

I have wondered what havoc could be wreaked to a Passive Optical
Network through a faulty ONT, or deliberate user interference.
--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

"Graham." wrote:

I have wondered what havoc could be wreaked to a Passive Optical
Network through a faulty ONT, or deliberate user interference.

Any subscriber's ONT could 'jabber' over all other subscriberss'
transmit slots ...
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

On 10/10/2025 13:24, Graham. wrote:

I have wondered what havoc could be wreaked to a Passive Optical
Network through a faulty ONT, or deliberate user interference.

Surely no different to the havoc a faulty mobile phone would cause,
within a cell ? Same principles, timeslot multiplexing ?
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.telecom.broadband

On 10/10/2025 14:47, Andy Burns wrote:

"Graham." wrote:

-a I have wondered what havoc could be wreaked to a Passive Optical
-a Network through a faulty ONT, or deliberate user interference.

Any subscriber's ONT could 'jabber' over all other subscriberss'
transmit slots ...

Lots, article on troubleshooting here:-

<https://www.fs.com/uk/blog/how-to-identify-and-resolve-rogue-onuont-issues-in-pon-networks-4277.html>

Dave
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