From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

A fortnight ago, we were informed by the BBC that it was a cold day to
be dead. Did we care, if we were dead?

This morning, the BBC News had an item on improving the recycling of
components in Formula 1 cars. We were told that the industry was
trying to create a 'circular car', which would be a challenge for the
drivers, and then that the manufacturers were looking to 'the Aerosmith industry' for manufacturing processes. I wonder if they pay Aerosmith royalties?
As is often the case, these were on a pre-recorded item, so there was opportunity to check the sub titles before transmission, and there were
no corrections.
--
Davey.

--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

On 18/05/2025 08:23, Davey wrote:

A fortnight ago, we were informed by the BBC that it was a cold day to
be dead. Did we care, if we were dead?

This morning, the BBC News had an item on improving the recycling of components in Formula 1 cars. We were told that the industry was
trying to create a 'circular car', which would be a challenge for the drivers, and then that the manufacturers were looking to 'the Aerosmith industry' for manufacturing processes. I wonder if they pay Aerosmith royalties?
As is often the case, these were on a pre-recorded item, so there was opportunity to check the sub titles before transmission, and there were
no corrections.

I am always surprised at the number of pre-recorded items (eg news
reports, excluding live satellite reports) which seem to be subtitled
during broadcast so the subtitles lag the pictures by several seconds.

Anything where people are speaking words that have been written in
advance can use that script to generate the subtitles. That applies both
to a news report where the reporter and editor work together to time the script to the pictures, and to studio presenters reading the words off
the autocue.

You can always tell subtitles which are generated on the fly because
they appear one word at a time rather than one sentence/phrase at a time.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

On Sun, 18 May 2025 20:20:39 +0100
NY <me@privacy.net> wrote:

On 18/05/2025 08:23, Davey wrote:

A fortnight ago, we were informed by the BBC that it was a cold day
to be dead. Did we care, if we were dead?

This morning, the BBC News had an item on improving the recycling of components in Formula 1 cars. We were told that the industry was
trying to create a 'circular car', which would be a challenge for
the drivers, and then that the manufacturers were looking to 'the
Aerosmith industry' for manufacturing processes. I wonder if they
pay Aerosmith royalties?
As is often the case, these were on a pre-recorded item, so there
was opportunity to check the sub titles before transmission, and
there were no corrections.

I am always surprised at the number of pre-recorded items (eg news
reports, excluding live satellite reports) which seem to be subtitled
during broadcast so the subtitles lag the pictures by several seconds.

Anything where people are speaking words that have been written in
advance can use that script to generate the subtitles. That applies
both to a news report where the reporter and editor work together to
time the script to the pictures, and to studio presenters reading the
words off the autocue.

You can always tell subtitles which are generated on the fly because
they appear one word at a time rather than one sentence/phrase at a
time.

I find it annoying when the subtitles precede the spoken word. Not
frequent, but it does happen. But it is really bad when, as in the
report today, a pre-recorded item has mistakes that have just not
been checked and found prior to transmission. Along with missing 'not's,
which clearly completely throws the meaning of something upside down.
--
Davey.

--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

On 18/05/2025 20:20, NY wrote:

I am always surprised at the number of pre-recorded items (eg news
reports, excluding live satellite reports) which seem to be subtitled
during broadcast so the subtitles lag the pictures by several seconds.

Anything where people are speaking words that have been written in
advance can use that script to generate the subtitles. That applies both
to a news report where the reporter and editor work together to time the script to the pictures, and to studio presenters reading the words off
the autocue.

You can always tell subtitles which are generated on the fly because
they appear one word at a time rather than one sentence/phrase at a time.

I thought that a lot of subtitles were prepared in advance then recalled
when used.



--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

On Sun 18/05/2025 23:13, JMB99 wrote:

On 18/05/2025 20:20, NY wrote:

I am always surprised at the number of pre-recorded items (eg news
reports, excluding live satellite reports) which seem to be subtitled
during broadcast so the subtitles lag the pictures by several seconds.

Anything where people are speaking words that have been written in
advance can use that script to generate the subtitles. That applies
both to a news report where the reporter and editor work together to
time the script to the pictures, and to studio presenters reading the
words off the autocue.

You can always tell subtitles which are generated on the fly because
they appear one word at a time rather than one sentence/phrase at a time.

I thought that a lot of subtitles were prepared in advance then recalled when used.

As far as I know, most live news subtitles are machine generated. Hence
why you sometimes get rubbish which is manually corrected a second or
two later by human intervention.


--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

On Mon, 19 May 2025 08:22:40 +0100
Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:

On Sun 18/05/2025 23:13, JMB99 wrote:

On 18/05/2025 20:20, NY wrote:

I am always surprised at the number of pre-recorded items (eg news
reports, excluding live satellite reports) which seem to be
subtitled during broadcast so the subtitles lag the pictures by
several seconds.

Anything where people are speaking words that have been written in
advance can use that script to generate the subtitles. That
applies both to a news report where the reporter and editor work
together to time the script to the pictures, and to studio
presenters reading the words off the autocue.

You can always tell subtitles which are generated on the fly
because they appear one word at a time rather than one
sentence/phrase at a time.

I thought that a lot of subtitles were prepared in advance then
recalled when used.

As far as I know, most live news subtitles are machine generated.
Hence why you sometimes get rubbish which is manually corrected a
second or two later by human intervention.

That is my understanding of the process. And as I have pointed out,
even when a programme is pre-recorded, many errors are generated and
not fixed before transmission.
--
Davey.

--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

On 19/05/2025 08:22, Woody wrote:

As far as I know, most live news subtitles are machine generated. Hence
why you sometimes get rubbish which is manually corrected a second or
two later by human intervention.

The way it used to be done was with palantype keyboards, which enter the
text phonetically. It may now be done with automatic speech
recognition. Either way, you need some lookahead to establish the
context, and choose between similar sounding phrases.

There may well be human intervention, but even the automation will need
to backtrack, if dealing with live input.

(There seems to be a big demand currently, for real time transcription
of phone calls, but it seems to me that you will get a better result by transcribing the whole call, at the end of the call.)
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

In article <100em80$1giqd$1@dont-email.me>,
Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:

As far as I know, most live news subtitles are machine generated. Hence
why you sometimes get rubbish which is manually corrected a second or
two later by human intervention.

I was told - a few years ago now - that it used sutomatic speech
recognition, but on the speech as immediately repeated by a trained
speaker rather than the original.

Of course they may well have decided that speech recognition is good
enough that they can save money by cutting out the middle man - with
an "acceptable" loss of quality.

-- Richard
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

On Mon, 19 May 2025 08:22:40 +0100
Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:

On Sun 18/05/2025 23:13, JMB99 wrote:

On 18/05/2025 20:20, NY wrote:

I am always surprised at the number of pre-recorded items (eg news
reports, excluding live satellite reports) which seem to be
subtitled during broadcast so the subtitles lag the pictures by
several seconds.

Anything where people are speaking words that have been written in
advance can use that script to generate the subtitles. That
applies both to a news report where the reporter and editor work
together to time the script to the pictures, and to studio
presenters reading the words off the autocue.

You can always tell subtitles which are generated on the fly
because they appear one word at a time rather than one
sentence/phrase at a time.

I thought that a lot of subtitles were prepared in advance then
recalled when used.

As far as I know, most live news subtitles are machine generated.
Hence why you sometimes get rubbish which is manually corrected a
second or two later by human intervention.

Just now, the Beeb weather reported that we were watching a cloud
formation to the south of Oregon. This with a map of the UK on the
screen.
There was no correction posted.
--
Davey.

--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: uk.tech.digital-tv

On Mon, 19 May 2025 08:22:40 +0100
Woody <harrogate3@ntlworld.com> wrote:

On Sun 18/05/2025 23:13, JMB99 wrote:

On 18/05/2025 20:20, NY wrote:

I am always surprised at the number of pre-recorded items (eg news
reports, excluding live satellite reports) which seem to be
subtitled during broadcast so the subtitles lag the pictures by
several seconds.

Anything where people are speaking words that have been written in
advance can use that script to generate the subtitles. That
applies both to a news report where the reporter and editor work
together to time the script to the pictures, and to studio
presenters reading the words off the autocue.

You can always tell subtitles which are generated on the fly
because they appear one word at a time rather than one
sentence/phrase at a time.

I thought that a lot of subtitles were prepared in advance then
recalled when used.

As far as I know, most live news subtitles are machine generated.
Hence why you sometimes get rubbish which is manually corrected a
second or two later by human intervention.

A recent football match was described the other day as a 'twittering'
of one team by another. Don't tell Elon.
--
Davey.

--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2