| Sysop: | Amessyroom |
|---|---|
| Location: | Fayetteville, NC |
| Users: | 23 |
| Nodes: | 6 (0 / 6) |
| Uptime: | 46:58:59 |
| Calls: | 583 |
| Files: | 1,138 |
| Messages: | 111,071 |
Bazballers are playing a scared game in the evening deliberately
delaying the game with excuses which fired up Indian team and
especially Gill arguing animatedly with Crawley and Duckett.
It appears some English player was referenced "three overs of hell" to
Gill which fired him up when English players delayed the game.
I never expected bazballers to delay the game to avoid playing one more >over. That's NOT their philosophy in general.
In message <hpxcQ.88409$ZQ4b.58435@fx16.ams4>,
FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer <FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer@america.com> writes
Bazballers are playing a scared game in the evening deliberately
delaying the game with excuses which fired up Indian team and
especially Gill arguing animatedly with Crawley and Duckett.
It appears some English player was referenced "three overs of hell" to
Gill which fired him up when English players delayed the game.
I never expected bazballers to delay the game to avoid playing one
more over. That's NOT their philosophy in general.
I think their Bazball philosophy takes second place to being hardheaded
in this situation - to the extent of arguably cheating - when the short amount of time left in the day means there's really nothing to gain from batting an extra over considered against the risk of losing a wicket.
It's not the first time they've done this, and all Test sides do it.
This was an exceptionally blatant instance, though. Maybe in situations
like this the umpires should be given the power to require that an extra over should be bowled, even though the nominal close of play time has
been reached?
On the subject of delays, the public have been short-changed in this
match through both sides only bowling their overs at about 12 overs an
hour. There have been multiple changes of the ball as well as failed attempts to change it, injuries to players, drinks breaks lasting longer than they should, drinks being brought on for the batsmen when it's not
an official drinks break, replacement batting gloves being brought on,
play restarting after an interval a minute or two late, and even players being massaged by the physio. The umpires seem to have no interest in
trying to keep things moving. No doubt a general lethargy has been
brought on by the hot weather, but I do cynically wonder whether both captains when fielding have been keen to reduce the number of overs
bowled in the day to avoid their bowlers getting too tired.
I have a feeling that this match might finish up as that rare thing nowadays, a drawn game, when if 90 overs had been bowled per day there
might have been time for a result. Assuming that England aren't bowled
out cheaply, Stokes is going to have a tricky decision to make on when
to declare, though I think we can be pretty confident that he won't be setting India 600. :) Hopefully Bashir will be fit to bowl; luckily the injury was to his non-bowling hand. It's rather ironic in view of the fitness concerns about England's quicks, who all kept going pretty well, that it should be the spinner who had to leave the field.
On the subject of delays, the public have been short-changed in
this match through both sides only bowling their overs at about 12
overs an hour. There have been multiple changes of the ball as
well as failed attempts to change it, injuries to players, drinks
breaks lasting longer than they should, drinks being brought on
for the batsmen when it's not an official drinks break,
replacement batting gloves being brought on, play restarting after
an interval a minute or two late, and even players being massaged
by the physio. The umpires seem to have no interest in trying to
keep things moving.
On 12 Jul 2025, John Hall wrote
-snip-
On the subject of delays, the public have been short-changed in
this match through both sides only bowling their overs at about 12
overs an hour. There have been multiple changes of the ball as
well as failed attempts to change it, injuries to players, drinks
breaks lasting longer than they should, drinks being brought on
for the batsmen when it's not an official drinks break,
replacement batting gloves being brought on, play restarting after
an interval a minute or two late, and even players being massaged
by the physio. The umpires seem to have no interest in trying to
keep things moving.
Not only that, the umpires added a completely unnecessary delay
yesterday (day 4), when they waited until the drinks break had ended
before taking another few minutes to select a replacement ball (the >pre-drinks-break ball having failed the "ring" test), which they
surely could have at least started doing during that break.
They opened up 3 or 4 boxes of old balls and dithered over which
ball to use, trying a number of the reserve balls through the ring.
A number of those balls failed the "ring" test, and they had to
reject them and look for other balls.
Just think about that for a second: a number of used balls, held in
reserve to replace balls which had gone out of shape, were themselves
found to be out of shape. In which case, WHY THE HELL WERE THEY IN
THE RESERVE BALL BOXES IN THE FIRST PLACE??
In message <XnsB31CB781CD198whhvans@157.180.91.226>, HVS <office@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk> writes
On 12 Jul 2025, John Hall wrote
-snip-
On the subject of delays, the public have been short-changed in
this match through both sides only bowling their overs at about 12
overs an hour. There have been multiple changes of the ball as
well as failed attempts to change it, injuries to players, drinks
breaks lasting longer than they should, drinks being brought on
for the batsmen when it's not an official drinks break,
replacement batting gloves being brought on, play restarting after
an interval a minute or two late, and even players being massaged
by the physio. The umpires seem to have no interest in trying to
keep things moving.
Not only that, the umpires added a completely unnecessary delay
yesterday (day 4), when they waited until the drinks break had ended
before taking another few minutes to select a replacement ball (the >>pre-drinks-break ball having failed the "ring" test), which they
surely could have at least started doing during that break.
Yes, the Sky commentators were unimpressed by that.
They opened up 3 or 4 boxes of old balls and dithered over which
ball to use, trying a number of the reserve balls through the ring.
A number of those balls failed the "ring" test, and they had to
reject them and look for other balls.
Just think about that for a second: a number of used balls, held in >>reserve to replace balls which had gone out of shape, were themselves
found to be out of shape. In which case, WHY THE HELL WERE THEY IN
THE RESERVE BALL BOXES IN THE FIRST PLACE??
The number of times the ball needs replacing nowadays. I wonder there's
a problem with finding enough balls of the right sort of age.
Apparently the regulations require that when a new ball is taken it
should fit through the rings, but there's no requirement for it to do so after it's had some use. Maybe the match referee has reminded the
umpires of that, and also reminded the players that the umpires are
supposed to be the sole judges of whether a ball has become unfit for
any reason and that they should stop chivvying the umpires. At any rate,
for whatever reason Stokes didn't try to get the ball changed today, as
far as I noticed, even though by the second session of play it had
clearly become very soft (as most of this summer's batch of Dukes balls
have done).
Anyway it was a terrific match. It's strange how such an unsatisfactory
pitch should produce such a gripping contest. The final two Tests are at
Old Trafford and The Oval, which normally produce pitches with good pace
and bounce, though I suppose this extreme summer weather means that's
not guaranteed this time.
The Old Trafford Test doesn't start till a week on Wednesday, which is
just as well as it will give the players time to recover from exhaustion
and some minor injuries. Hopefully Pant will be fit to keep by then. If
not, I suppose Pant might play as a specialist batsman with Jurel
keeping, but that would disrupt the balance of the side. It's anybody's
guess if Bumrah will play or be saved for The Oval. Since India are 2-1
down, In think he ought to play. I also think they should bring in
Kuldeep, maybe for Reddy though that would lengthen the tail. As well as having pace and bounce, the Old Trafford pitch normally turns later in
the game.
If Atkinson is fit, England will probably bring him in to give one of
the other quicks a rest - maybe for Woakes, as Old Trafford isn't really
his sort of pitch. Of course the bowler who could really do with a rest
is Stokers. Though he's clearly very fit, he's no longer young, and if
he keeps on flogging himself into the ground I'm afraid that before long
he will pick up another serious injury.
England will also need to find a replacement for Bashir, since I think they'll need a spinner at Old Trafford. I'd pick Dawson, who is the best England-qualified spinner in the country as well as a proper batsman,
but I rather suspect that England won't choose him.
yes commendable effort, this time successful, although as the score
edged and inched ever closer i thought it might end very badly for
england: defeat and a host of injuries. Stokes hasnt bowled so many
overs [44] in a match for a long time, even at Hamilton he only bowled
36. I think hes only once bowled more overs once in a test [50] in that >dreadful match in the windies where they got a terrible thrashing under
Root about 6 yrs ago. Plus it does seem that whoever we pick as bowlers
we still cant knock over the tail,
although stokes seem to be trying to
do that quite literally in his barrage of bouncers to Bumrah. When
Stokes was stretched out on the groin earlier in the match i thought he
was going to be another stretcher case. So miraculous recovery to bowl
that long spell in the upper 80s.
I wonder about Carse too: the collision with Jag was accidental but not
Carse reaction to it, practically had him in a headlock.
ironic that we choose these quicks like Wood & Carse and now archer and
bash with a broke finger takes the final wkt. If instead of watching it
roll back on his stumps, siraj had kicked it away would he have been not
out?
England will also need to find a replacement for Bashir, since I think
they'll need a spinner at Old Trafford. I'd pick Dawson, who is the best
England-qualified spinner in the country as well as a proper batsman,
but I rather suspect that England won't choose him.
Yes so would i, but it would be a surprise that they would select some >dependable county pro in his mid 30s, like they used to in the 70s
[Steele, Balderson, Radley] Although Dawson is back in the t20 squad i
think.
OT used to have a rep as a spin friendly pitch, and with the
scorching hot summer you'd think it would be more so, but i wonder if
that rep is still justified.
mike
In message <97712601d20f9f00db58e1ed59158984@www.novabbs.org>, miked <dmike2004@gmail.com> writes
<snip>
yes commendable effort, this time successful, although as the score
edged and inched ever closer i thought it might end very badly for
england: defeat and a host of injuries. Stokes hasnt bowled so many
overs [44] in a match for a long time, even at Hamilton he only bowled
36. I think hes only once bowled more overs once in a test [50] in that
dreadful match in the windies where they got a terrible thrashing under
Root about 6 yrs ago. Plus it does seem that whoever we pick as bowlers
we still cant knock over the tail,
Well Tongue has been managing it, though he hasn't looked very good when bowling at the upper order. I think in this case the bowlers have a
valid excuse, though. The ball had gone very soft, the uneven bounce had disappeared, and there was little or no sideways movement to be had.
Baship might have bowled more but for his injury and got enough turn to
be a problem.
although stokes seem to be trying to
do that quite literally in his barrage of bouncers to Bumrah. When
Stokes was stretched out on the groin earlier in the match i thought he
was going to be another stretcher case. So miraculous recovery to bowl
that long spell in the upper 80s.
It was remarkable. I wonder if it could have been a trapped nerve, as
it's hard to see how he could recover so quickly and completely from
even a minor muscle strain.
I wonder about Carse too: the collision with Jag was accidental but not
Carse reaction to it, practically had him in a headlock.
I suppose emotions had been running high. He's an angel compared to John Show, who I remember once shoulder-charged Sunil Gavaskar out of the way.
ironic that we choose these quicks like Wood & Carse and now archer and
bash with a broke finger takes the final wkt. If instead of watching it
roll back on his stumps, siraj had kicked it away would he have been not
out?
Yes, not out. By the time he realised what was happening, he may have
been afraid that the ball was so close to the stumps that he was at risk
of kicking them too. Also when the ball rolls back gently onto the
wicket like that it doesn't always have enough force to knock a ball
off, but unluckily for him this time it did.
England will also need to find a replacement for Bashir, since I think
they'll need a spinner at Old Trafford. I'd pick Dawson, who is the best >>> England-qualified spinner in the country as well as a proper batsman,
but I rather suspect that England won't choose him.
Yes so would i, but it would be a surprise that they would select some
dependable county pro in his mid 30s, like they used to in the 70s
[Steele, Balderson, Radley] Although Dawson is back in the t20 squad i
think.
He is.
OT used to have a rep as a spin friendly pitch, and with the
scorching hot summer you'd think it would be more so, but i wonder if
that rep is still justified.
mike
I' m sure England will want a spinner. I hope they don't see Bashir's
injury as a way of getting Bethell into the side as, though he's a
hugely promising batsman, he's still a tyro as a bowler. They could go
back to Leach, but Dawson is at least as good a bowler and offers far
more with the bat. Or they could bring back Rehan Ahmed.
In message <hpxcQ.88409$ZQ4b.58435@fx16.ams4>,
FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer <FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer@america.com> writes
Bazballers are playing a scared game in the evening deliberately
delaying the game with excuses which fired up Indian team and
especially Gill arguing animatedly with Crawley and Duckett.
It appears some English player was referenced "three overs of hell" to
Gill which fired him up when English players delayed the game.
I never expected bazballers to delay the game to avoid playing one
more over. That's NOT their philosophy in general.
I think their Bazball philosophy takes second place to being hardheaded
in this situation - to the extent of arguably cheating - when the short amount of time left in the day means there's really nothing to gain from batting an extra over considered against the risk of losing a wicket.
It's not the first time they've done this, and all Test sides do it.
This was an exceptionally blatant instance, though. Maybe in situations
like this the umpires should be given the power to require that an extra over should be bowled, even though the nominal close of play time has
been reached?
On the subject of delays, the public have been short-changed in this
match through both sides only bowling their overs at about 12 overs an
hour. There have been multiple changes of the ball as well as failed attempts to change it, injuries to players, drinks breaks lasting longer than they should, drinks being brought on for the batsmen when it's not
an official drinks break, replacement batting gloves being brought on,
play restarting after an interval a minute or two late, and even players being massaged by the physio. The umpires seem to have no interest in
trying to keep things moving. No doubt a general lethargy has been
brought on by the hot weather, but I do cynically wonder whether both captains when fielding have been keen to reduce the number of overs
bowled in the day to avoid their bowlers getting too tired.
I have a feeling that this match might finish up as that rare thing nowadays, a drawn game, when if 90 overs had been bowled per day there
might have been time for a result. Assuming that England aren't bowled
out cheaply, Stokes is going to have a tricky decision to make on when
to declare, though I think we can be pretty confident that he won't be setting India 600. :) Hopefully Bashir will be fit to bowl; luckily the injury was to his non-bowling hand. It's rather ironic in view of the fitness concerns about England's quicks, who all kept going pretty well, that it should be the spinner who had to leave the field.
In message <hpxcQ.88409$ZQ4b.58435@fx16.ams4>,
FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer <FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer@america.com> writes
Bazballers are playing a scared game in the evening deliberately
delaying the game with excuses which fired up Indian team and
especially Gill arguing animatedly with Crawley and Duckett.
It appears some English player was referenced "three overs of hell" to
Gill which fired him up when English players delayed the game.
I never expected bazballers to delay the game to avoid playing one
more over. That's NOT their philosophy in general.
I think their Bazball philosophy takes second place to being hardheaded
in this situation - to the extent of arguably cheating - when the short amount of time left in the day means there's really nothing to gain from batting an extra over considered against the risk of losing a wicket.
It's not the first time they've done this, and all Test sides do it.
This was an exceptionally blatant instance, though. Maybe in situations
like this the umpires should be given the power to require that an extra over should be bowled, even though the nominal close of play time has
been reached?
On the subject of delays, the public have been short-changed in this
match through both sides only bowling their overs at about 12 overs an
hour. There have been multiple changes of the ball as well as failed attempts to change it, injuries to players, drinks breaks lasting longer than they should, drinks being brought on for the batsmen when it's not
an official drinks break, replacement batting gloves being brought on,
play restarting after an interval a minute or two late, and even players being massaged by the physio. The umpires seem to have no interest in
trying to keep things moving. No doubt a general lethargy has been
brought on by the hot weather, but I do cynically wonder whether both captains when fielding have been keen to reduce the number of overs
bowled in the day to avoid their bowlers getting too tired.
I have a feeling that this match might finish up as that rare thing nowadays, a drawn game, when if 90 overs had been bowled per day there
might have been time for a result. Assuming that England aren't bowled
out cheaply, Stokes is going to have a tricky decision to make on when
to declare, though I think we can be pretty confident that he won't be setting India 600. :) Hopefully Bashir will be fit to bowl; luckily the injury was to his non-bowling hand. It's rather ironic in view of the fitness concerns about England's quicks, who all kept going pretty well, that it should be the spinner who had to leave the field.
Bashir is NOT playing the next two tests according to cricinfo reports.
What happened to experienced Jack Leach?
Why is he not even being considered for England tests?
In message <78ec786e-38f9-43a5-8aac-917ac7b438c6@america.com>, FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer <FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer@america.com> writes
Bashir is NOT playing the next two tests according to cricinfo reports.
What happened to experienced Jack Leach?
Why is he not even being considered for England tests?
I'm sure he was considered, but Dawson has been so good at county level
over the last couple of seasons that it would have been hard to overlook him.
India MUST PLAY Bumrah at Old Trafford because he is getting a WEEK of
REST and India MUST at least DRAW or WIN the test to keep the series alive.
The number of times the ball needs replacing nowadays. I wonder there's
a problem with finding enough balls of the right sort of age.
Apparently the regulations require that when a new ball is taken it
should fit through the rings, but there's no requirement for it to do so after it's had some use.
In message <XnsB31CB781CD198whhvans@157.180.91.226>, HVS <office@REMOVETHISwhhvs.co.uk> writes
On 12 Jul 2025, John Hall wrote
-snip-
On the subject of delays, the public have been short-changed in
this match through both sides only bowling their overs at about 12
overs an hour. There have been multiple changes of the ball as
well as failed attempts to change it, injuries to players, drinks
breaks lasting longer than they should, drinks being brought on
for the batsmen when it's not an official drinks break,
replacement batting gloves being brought on, play restarting after
an interval a minute or two late, and even players being massaged
by the physio. The umpires seem to have no interest in trying to
keep things moving.
Not only that, the umpires added a completely unnecessary delay
yesterday (day 4), when they waited until the drinks break had ended
before taking another few minutes to select a replacement ball (the
pre-drinks-break ball having failed the "ring" test), which they
surely could have at least started doing during that break.
Yes, the Sky commentators were unimpressed by that.
They-a opened up 3 or 4 boxes of old balls and dithered over which
ball to use, trying a number of the reserve balls through the ring.
A number of those balls failed the "ring" test, and they had to
reject them and look for other balls.
Just think about that for a second:-a a number of used balls, held in
reserve to replace balls which had gone out of shape, were themselves
found to be out of shape.-a In which case, WHY THE HELL WERE THEY IN
THE RESERVE BALL BOXES IN THE FIRST PLACE??
The number of times the ball needs replacing nowadays. I wonder there's
a problem with finding enough balls of the right sort of age.
Apparently the regulations require that when a new ball is taken it
should fit through the rings, but there's no requirement for it to do so after it's had some use. Maybe the match referee has reminded the
umpires of that, and also reminded the players that the umpires are
supposed to be the sole judges of whether a ball has become unfit for
any reason and that they should stop chivvying the umpires. At any rate,
for whatever reason Stokes didn't try to get the ball changed today, as
far as I noticed, even though by the second session of play it had
clearly become very soft (as most of this summer's batch of Dukes balls
have done).
Anyway it was a terrific match. It's strange how such an unsatisfactory pitch should produce such a gripping contest. The final two Tests are at
Old Trafford and The Oval, which normally produce pitches with good pace
and bounce, though I suppose this extreme summer weather means that's
not guaranteed this time.
The Old Trafford Test doesn't start till a week on Wednesday, which is
just as well as it will give the players time to recover from exhaustion
and some minor injuries. Hopefully Pant will be fit to keep by then. If
not, I suppose Pant might play as a specialist batsman with Jurel
keeping, but that would disrupt the balance of the side. It's anybody's guess if Bumrah will play or be saved for The Oval.
Since India are 2-1down, In think he ought to play. I also think they should bring in
Kuldeep, maybe for Reddy though that would lengthen the tail. As well as having pace and bounce, the Old Trafford pitch normally turns later in
the game.
If Atkinson is fit, England will probably bring him in to give one of
the other quicks a rest - maybe for Woakes, as Old Trafford isn't really
his sort of pitch. Of course the bowler who could really do with a rest
is Stokers. Though he's clearly very fit, he's no longer young, and if
he keeps on flogging himself into the ground I'm afraid that before long
he will pick up another serious injury.
England will also need to find a replacement for Bashir, since I think they'll need a spinner at Old Trafford. I'd pick Dawson, who is the best England-qualified spinner in the country as well as a proper batsman,
but I rather suspect that England won't choose him.
On 15/07/2025 11:19, FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer wrote:
India MUST PLAY Bumrah at Old Trafford because he is getting a WEEK of
REST and India MUST at least DRAW or WIN the test to keep the series
alive.
... although ironically they have lost the two matches that he played,
and won the one that he didn't.
On 15/07/2025 16:55, John Hall wrote:
In message <78ec786e-38f9-43a5-8aac-917ac7b438c6@america.com>, >>FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer <FBInCIAnNSATerroristSlayer@america.com>
writes
Bashir is NOT playing the next two tests according to cricinfo reports.I'm sure he was considered, but Dawson has been so good at county
What happened to experienced Jack Leach?
Why is he not even being considered for England tests?
level over the last couple of seasons that it would have been hard to >>overlook him.
Leach has a better CC bowling average than Dawson this season (26.5 vs
40.0) and last season (22.8 vs 25.1). He has more wickets than any
other spinner this season.
Obviously batting is a very different matter.
From a Somerset POV, I'm pleased that they've picked Dawson. ;)
Regarding the Lord's pitch, my newspaper has an interesting interview
with the head groundsman, Karl McDermott, of which I think the most
important part is this:
rCLThe question for us at LordrCOs is this: are we ready to re-lay
pitches? That would be the ultimate commitment to changing things,rCY he says.
Re-laying a pitch takes it out of action for three years, so you could
never re-lay the whole square at once, and doing so would cost MCC
around -u10 million, because they would have to give up a major match
for three seasons. It seems that at this stage, they are not prepared to
do that, although this is a cricket club, so the cricket pitches are
pretty important.
rCLMy predecessor Mick Hunt always had a pitch up his sleeve that he
could re-lay and not have any cricket on,rCY McDermott says. rCLBut we donrCOt have that luxury now, because of the rise in cricket: The
Hundred, thererCOs more womenrCOs cricket, which is fantastic, but
nothing has given way.rCY
McDermott and Rob Lynch, the director of cricket operations, want to try
a drop-in pitch. That would see it prepared in a tray away from the
square, then transplanted permanently. rCLRisky,rCY is McDermottrCOs assessment, especially as they would need to work the slope in.