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[ rCa ]
As an assistant professor I was required to do public education
outreach as part of my job. I started doing projects at my kid's
elementary schools. I'd bring in an incubator and hatch some chicks.
In middle school we did some embryology along with hatching the chicks.
I stopped in middle school. Anyone could likely repeat what I did and
find the same thing that I discovered. The kids start out as sponges
in kindergarten. You have trouble keeping them from asking questions
over each other. They want to understand just about everything down to
how the incubator works. This type of inquiry slowly gets beaten out
of them as they are taught to take the tests instead of learn anything.
It would tick me off when a college student would interrupt a lecture
to ask if what was under discussion was going to be on the test. What
I found out was that this behavior was ingrained into the students by
middle school. Most of the students in middle school were no longer interested in learning something new, but they wanted to know what
would be on the test.
https://www.nbcnews.com/world/asia/trump-h1b-visa-fee-travel-tech- workers-india-china-immigration-rcna232695
This is a pretty stupid anti immigration bit of stupidity.
On 2025-09-21 16:57:26 +0000, RonO said:
[ rCa ]
As an assistant professor I was required to do public education
outreach as part of my job.-a I started doing projects at my kid's
elementary schools.-a I'd bring in an incubator and hatch some chicks.
In middle school we did some embryology along with hatching the
chicks. -aI stopped in middle school.-a Anyone could likely repeat what
I did and find the same thing that I discovered.-a The kids start out
as sponges in kindergarten.-a You have trouble keeping them from asking
questions over each other.-a They want to understand just about
everything down to how the incubator works.-a This type of inquiry
slowly gets beaten out of them as they are taught to take the tests
instead of learn anything. -aIt would tick me off when a college
student would interrupt a lecture to ask if what was under discussion
was going to be on the test.-a What I found out was that this behavior
was ingrained into the students by middle school.-a Most of the
students in middle school were no longer interested in learning
something new, but they wanted to know what would be on the test.
In 1977 I spent a winter quarter teaching a Master's Course on enzyme kinetics at the University of Guelph.
1. Guelph is not the most exciting place to spend a winter weekend
alone, and every Friday-a night I took the bus to Toronto, where I spent
a couple of nights staying with my aunt. I was typically the only non-student in the bus, and I had a lot of opportunity to find out what students talked about when there were no professors around. They didn't
talk about football; they didn't talk about ice hockey; they didn't talk about romantic engagements; they didn't talk about films they had seen;
they didn't talk about vacations; they didn't talk about books they had read. They talked EXCLUSIVELY about what had been in last week's test
and what they thought would be in next week's test. That was it.
2. In the course of the second lecture I mentioned that Maud Menten was
the first woman and maybe the first Canadian to make a major mark in biochemistry. About half the students were women, and virtually all were Canadian, but from the looks on their faces they were all thinking the
same thing: why is he telling us this stuff that is not likely to be in
the exam? There were two professors auditing the course (probably
reporting to the department-a on my qualiies as a teacher, but I was too naive to think that at the time; I thought they were just interested).
Both of them agreed that my interpretation of the students' reaction was correct. (In 1977 very few people knew that Maud Menten was a Canadian woman.)
As an assistant professor I was required to do public education outreach
as part of my job. I started doing projects at my kid's elementary
schools. I'd bring in an incubator and hatch some chicks. In middle
school we did some embryology along with hatching the chicks. I stopped
in middle school. Anyone could likely repeat what I did and find the
same thing that I discovered. The kids start out as sponges in kindergarten. You have trouble keeping them from asking questions over
each other. They want to understand just about everything down to how
the incubator works. This type of inquiry slowly gets beaten out of
them as they are taught to take the tests instead of learn anything. It would tick me off when a college student would interrupt a lecture to
ask if what was under discussion was going to be on the test. What I
found out was that this behavior was ingrained into the students by
middle school. Most of the students in middle school were no longer interested in learning something new, but they wanted to know what would
be on the test. It made me quit that type of outreach. I tried to
explain that there was no test, and that the demonstration was just something to bring what they were reading in their textbooks to life,
but most of the students remained skeptical. That is the type of
students we are producing. It makes H-1B visas a necessity to keep the
US on the cutting edge of science. If we go insular and self absorbed
all the major science journals will likely be published in Chinese in another generation.
Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
On 2025-09-21 16:57:26 +0000, RonO said:
[ rCa ]
As an assistant professor I was required to do public education
outreach as part of my job.-a I started doing projects at my kid's
elementary schools.-a I'd bring in an incubator and hatch some chicks.
In middle school we did some embryology along with hatching the chicks. >>> -aI stopped in middle school.-a Anyone could likely repeat what I did
and find the same thing that I discovered.-a The kids start out as
sponges in kindergarten.-a You have trouble keeping them from asking
questions over each other.-a They want to understand just about
everything down to how the incubator works.-a This type of inquiry
slowly gets beaten out of them as they are taught to take the tests
instead of learn anything. -aIt would tick me off when a college
student would interrupt a lecture to ask if what was under discussion
was going to be on the test.-a What I found out was that this behavior
was ingrained into the students by middle school.-a Most of the
students in middle school were no longer interested in learning
something new, but they wanted to know what would be on the test.
In 1977 I spent a winter quarter teaching a Master's Course on enzyme
kinetics at the University of Guelph.
A high school friend of mine, Linda Sadler, was planning on a
biochemistry degree at Guelph. If she went on to to a Master's, she
might have been in your course.
Two vignettes from that experience:
1. Guelph is not the most exciting place to spend a winter weekend
alone, and every Friday-a night I took the bus to Toronto, where I
spent a couple of nights staying with my aunt. I was typically the only
non-student in the bus, and I had a lot of opportunity to find out what
students talked about when there were no professors around. They didn't
talk about football; they didn't talk about ice hockey; they didn't
talk about romantic engagements; they didn't talk about films they had
seen; they didn't talk about vacations; they didn't talk about books
they had read. They talked EXCLUSIVELY about what had been in last
week's test and what they thought would be in next week's test. That
was it.
At exactly that time I took a very similar ride from Toronto to Waterloo.
While I mostly read, I do recall one conversation that lasted the whole trip, about Bonaparte and Hitler. The people I was talking with were history students and were genuinely interested in the topic. Of
course, as history students they were plagued with essays, not weekly
tests.
On the other hand, I did tutor (in the North American sense, i.e.
basically taught a class rather than properly tutoring) mathematics and found that the pre-med students were only interested in getting the
highest possible marks, for which I cannot blame them given the absurd admission requirements of the time. Only a few students were at all interested in the subject, one of them a future lawyer. I kept him in
mind in case I ever needed a good lawyer, resolved to keep away from
them if I needed a doctor.
When I arrived at a university in Texas as a postdoc, I found that the faculty was almost entirely American. But, aside from those sent us by
the military, the grad students were almost entirely foreign.
In my group there were three postdocs and six grad students, hailing
from Japan, Hong Kong, South Korea, Taiwan, and Canada.
The irony of this is that my supervisor had chosen a position in Texas
in part because he noticed that undergrad physics students in local universities didn't go on to grad school. Many went into banking or stockbroking instead. He felt that by livening up our department he
might attract some. But no.
2. In the course of the second lecture I mentioned that Maud Menten was
the first woman and maybe the first Canadian to make a major mark in
biochemistry. About half the students were women, and virtually all
were Canadian, but from the looks on their faces they were all thinking
the same thing: why is he telling us this stuff that is not likely to
be in the exam? There were two professors auditing the course (probably
reporting to the department-a on my qualiies as a teacher, but I was
too naive to think that at the time; I thought they were just
interested). Both of them agreed that my interpretation of the
students' reaction was correct. (In 1977 very few people knew that Maud
Menten was a Canadian woman.)
Well, at least you tried. I took first year chemistry the year after Herzberg won the Nobel, but he was never mentioned. I didn't come
across his name, except in passing, until I took QM two years later.
On 2025-09-21 21:28:19 +0000, William Hyde said:
Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
On 2025-09-21 16:57:26 +0000, RonO said:
[ |ore4-a ]
As an assistant professor I was required to do public education
outreach as part of my job.|e-a I started doing projects at my kid's
elementary schools.|e-a I'd bring in an incubator and hatch some
chicks. In middle school we did some embryology along with hatching
the chicks. |e-aI stopped in middle school.|e-a Anyone could likely
repeat what I did and find the same thing that I discovered.|e-a The
kids start out as sponges in kindergarten.|e-a You have trouble
keeping them from asking questions over each other.|e-a They want to
understand just about everything down to how the incubator works.|e
This type of inquiry slowly gets beaten out of them as they are
taught to take the tests instead of learn anything. |e-aIt would tick >>>> me off when a college student would interrupt a lecture to ask if
what was under discussion was going to be on the test.|e-a What I
found out was that this behavior was ingrained into the students by
middle school.|e-a Most of the students in middle school were no
longer interested in learning something new, but they wanted to know
what would be on the test.
In 1977 I spent a winter quarter teaching a Master's Course on enzyme
kinetics at the University of Guelph.
A high school friend of mine, Linda Sadler, was planning on a
biochemistry degree at Guelph.-a If she went on to to a Master's, she
might have been in your course.
I don't recognize the name, but after nearly half a century the memory fades.
-a Two vignettes from that experience:
1. Guelph is not the most exciting place to spend a winter weekend
alone, and every Friday|e-a night I took the bus to Toronto, where I
spent a couple of nights staying with my aunt. I was typically the
only non-student in the bus, and I had a lot of opportunity to find
out what students talked about when there were no professors around.
They didn't talk about football; they didn't talk about ice hockey;
they didn't talk about romantic engagements; they didn't talk about
films they had seen; they didn't talk about vacations; they didn't
talk about books they had read. They talked EXCLUSIVELY about what
had been in last week's test and what they thought would be in next
week's test. That was it.
At exactly that time I took a very similar ride from Toronto to Waterloo.
While I mostly read, I do recall one conversation that lasted the
whole trip, about Bonaparte and Hitler.-a The people I was talking with
were history students and were genuinely interested in the topic.-a Of
course, as history students they were plagued with essays, not weekly
tests.
On the other hand, I did tutor (in the North American sense, i.e.
basically taught a class rather than properly tutoring) mathematics
and found that the pre-med students were only interested in getting
the highest possible marks, for which I cannot blame them given the
absurd admission requirements of the time.-a Only a few students were
at all interested in the subject, one of them a future lawyer.-a I kept
him in mind in case I ever needed a good lawyer, resolved to keep away
from them if I needed a doctor.
When I arrived at a university in Texas as a postdoc, I found that the
faculty was almost entirely American.-a But, aside from those sent us
by the military, the grad students were almost entirely foreign.
In my group there were three postdocs and six grad students, hailing
from Japan, Hong Kong, South Korea, Taiwan, and-a Canada.
The irony of this is that my supervisor had chosen a position in
Texas in part because he noticed that undergrad physics students in
local universities didn't go on to grad school.-a Many went into
banking or stockbroking instead.-a He felt that by livening up our
department he might attract some.-a But no.
2. In the course of the second lecture I mentioned that Maud Menten
was the first woman and maybe the first Canadian to make a major mark
in biochemistry. About half the students were women, and virtually
all were Canadian, but from the looks on their faces they were all
thinking the same thing: why is he telling us this stuff that is not
likely to be in the exam? There were two professors auditing the
course (probably reporting to the department|e-a on my qualiies as a
teacher, but I was too naive to think that at the time; I thought
they were just interested). Both of them agreed that my
interpretation of the students' reaction was correct. (In 1977 very
few people knew that Maud Menten was a Canadian woman.)
Well, at least you tried.-a I took first year chemistry the year after
Herzberg won the Nobel, but he was never mentioned.-a I didn't come
across his name, except in passing, until I took QM two years later.
Incidentally, French students are no more interested than those of
Guelph in history, in my experience. A few years ago I was talking about Monod, Changeux and Jacob in a lecture. I showed a picture of the
Institut Jacques Monod in Paris, and I asked if anyone could tell me
what Monod had done to deserve a massive new building in his name: no
one had any idea. Likewise with Changeux and Jacob.
On 9/22/2025 2:44 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
On 2025-09-21 21:28:19 +0000, William Hyde said:
Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
On 2025-09-21 16:57:26 +0000, RonO said:
[ |ore4-a ]
As an assistant professor I was required to do public education
outreach as part of my job.|e-a I started doing projects at my kid's >>>>> elementary schools.|e-a I'd bring in an incubator and hatch some
chicks. In middle school we did some embryology along with hatching the >>>>> chicks. |e-aI stopped in middle school.|e-a Anyone could likely repeat >>>>> what I did and find the same thing that I discovered.|e-a The kids
start out as sponges in kindergarten.|e-a You have trouble keeping them >>>>> from asking questions over each other.|e-a They want to understand just >>>>> about everything down to how the incubator works.|e This type of
inquiry slowly gets beaten out of them as they are taught to take the >>>>> tests instead of learn anything. |e-aIt would tick me off when a
college student would interrupt a lecture to ask if what was under
discussion was going to be on the test.|e-a What I found out was that >>>>> this behavior was ingrained into the students by middle school.|e-a >>>>> Most of the students in middle school were no longer interested in
learning something new, but they wanted to know what would be on the >>>>> test.
In 1977 I spent a winter quarter teaching a Master's Course on enzyme >>>> kinetics at the University of Guelph.
A high school friend of mine, Linda Sadler, was planning on a
biochemistry degree at Guelph.-a If she went on to to a Master's, she
might have been in your course.
I don't recognize the name, but after nearly half a century the memory fades.
-a Two vignettes from that experience:
1. Guelph is not the most exciting place to spend a winter weekend
alone, and every Friday|e-a night I took the bus to Toronto, where I
spent a couple of nights staying with my aunt. I was typically the only >>>> non-student in the bus, and I had a lot of opportunity to find out what >>>> students talked about when there were no professors around. They didn't >>>> talk about football; they didn't talk about ice hockey; they didn't
talk about romantic engagements; they didn't talk about films they had >>>> seen; they didn't talk about vacations; they didn't talk about books
they had read. They talked EXCLUSIVELY about what had been in last
week's test and what they thought would be in next week's test. That
was it.
At exactly that time I took a very similar ride from Toronto to Waterloo. >>>
While I mostly read, I do recall one conversation that lasted the whole >>> trip, about Bonaparte and Hitler.-a The people I was talking with were
history students and were genuinely interested in the topic.-a Of
course, as history students they were plagued with essays, not weekly
tests.
On the other hand, I did tutor (in the North American sense, i.e.
basically taught a class rather than properly tutoring) mathematics and >>> found that the pre-med students were only interested in getting the
highest possible marks, for which I cannot blame them given the absurd
admission requirements of the time.-a Only a few students were at all
interested in the subject, one of them a future lawyer.-a I kept him in >>> mind in case I ever needed a good lawyer, resolved to keep away from
them if I needed a doctor.
When I arrived at a university in Texas as a postdoc, I found that the
faculty was almost entirely American.-a But, aside from those sent us
by the military, the grad students were almost entirely foreign.
In my group there were three postdocs and six grad students, hailing
from Japan, Hong Kong, South Korea, Taiwan, and-a Canada.
The irony of this is that my supervisor had chosen a position in Texas >>> in part because he noticed that undergrad physics students in local
universities didn't go on to grad school.-a Many went into banking or
stockbroking instead.-a He felt that by livening up our department he
might attract some.-a But no.
2. In the course of the second lecture I mentioned that Maud Menten was >>>> the first woman and maybe the first Canadian to make a major mark in
biochemistry. About half the students were women, and virtually all
were Canadian, but from the looks on their faces they were all thinking >>>> the same thing: why is he telling us this stuff that is not likely to >>>> be in the exam? There were two professors auditing the course (probably >>>> reporting to the department|e-a on my qualiies as a teacher, but I was >>>> too naive to think that at the time; I thought they were just
interested). Both of them agreed that my interpretation of the
students' reaction was correct. (In 1977 very few people knew that Maud >>>> Menten was a Canadian woman.)
Well, at least you tried.-a I took first year chemistry the year after
Herzberg won the Nobel, but he was never mentioned.-a I didn't come
across his name, except in passing, until I took QM two years later.
Incidentally, French students are no more interested than those of
Guelph in history, in my experience. A few years ago I was talking
about Monod, Changeux and Jacob in a lecture. I showed a picture of the
Institut Jacques Monod in Paris, and I asked if anyone could tell me
what Monod had done to deserve a massive new building in his name: no
one had any idea. Likewise with Changeux and Jacob.
In the late 1970's I took majors Biochemistry at Berkeley. It started
off as a good experience because I had Koshland as an instructor for
the first quarter, but then it went downhill. Koshland had a knack for making his lectures interesting.
The last quarter was taught by Schekman.
It was mostly nucleic acid biochemistry and I was frankly bored, and
at the time I was deeply into doing my undergraduate research most
nights and I ended up sleeping in the class most days because it was my first morning class. One test question asked how to identify the
tryptophan operon repressor. I answered with how Jacob and Monod had
done it with the lac operon. The answer that he wanted was that
bacterial extracts bound tryptophan in a dialysis bag creating a higher concentration of tryptophan in the bag compared to the outside
solution. It was probably the only time I went in and tried to get
more credit for any test answer, but Schekman said that my answer was a genetic answer and not biochemistry. Even though his answer only
indicated that something had an affinity for tryptophan inside the
dialysis bag and was not direct evidence for identification of a
tryptophan repressor he would not accept a correct answer. He even
told me that my answer was correct. As crazy as this exchange was
Schekman ended up getting the Nobel prize for integrating genetics and Biochemistry years later, but at the time he was a new hire in the biochemistry department.
On 2025-09-22 15:00:21 +0000, RonO said:
On 9/22/2025 2:44 AM, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
On 2025-09-21 21:28:19 +0000, William Hyde said:
Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
On 2025-09-21 16:57:26 +0000, RonO said:
[ |a-o|orCU-4|e-a ]
As an assistant professor I was required to do public education
outreach as part of my job.|arCU|e-a I started doing projects at my >>>>>> kid's elementary schools.|arCU|e-a I'd bring in an incubator and hatch >>>>>> some chicks. In middle school we did some embryology along with
hatching the chicks. |arCU|e-aI stopped in middle school.|arCU|e-a Anyone
could likely repeat what I did and find the same thing that I
discovered.|arCU|e-a The kids start out as sponges in kindergarten.|arCU|e
You have trouble keeping them from asking questions over each
other.|arCU|e-a They want to understand just about everything down to >>>>>> how the incubator works.|arCU-a This type of inquiry slowly gets
beaten out of them as they are taught to take the tests instead of >>>>>> learn anything. |arCU|e-aIt would tick me off when a college student >>>>>> would interrupt a lecture to ask if what was under discussion was >>>>>> going to be on the test.|arCU|e-a What I found out was that this
behavior was ingrained into the students by middle school.|arCU|e Most >>>>>> of the students in middle school were no longer interested in
learning something new, but they wanted to know what would be on
the test.
In 1977 I spent a winter quarter teaching a Master's Course on
enzyme kinetics at the University of Guelph.
A high school friend of mine, Linda Sadler, was planning on a
biochemistry degree at Guelph.|e-a If she went on to to a Master's,
she might have been in your course.
I don't recognize the name, but after nearly half a century the
memory fades.
|e-a Two vignettes from that experience:
1. Guelph is not the most exciting place to spend a winter weekend
alone, and every Friday|arCU|e-a night I took the bus to Toronto, where >>>>> I spent a couple of nights staying with my aunt. I was typically
the only non-student in the bus, and I had a lot of opportunity to
find out what students talked about when there were no professors
around. They didn't talk about football; they didn't talk about ice >>>>> hockey; they didn't talk about romantic engagements; they didn't
talk about films they had seen; they didn't talk about vacations;
they didn't talk about books they had read. They talked EXCLUSIVELY >>>>> about what had been in last week's test and what they thought would >>>>> be in next week's test. That was it.
At exactly that time I took a very similar ride from Toronto to
Waterloo.
While I mostly read, I do recall one conversation that lasted the
whole trip, about Bonaparte and Hitler.|e-a The people I was talking
with were history students and were genuinely interested in the
topic.|e-a Of course, as history students they were plagued with
essays, not weekly tests.
On the other hand, I did tutor (in the North American sense, i.e.
basically taught a class rather than properly tutoring) mathematics
and found that the pre-med students were only interested in getting
the highest possible marks, for which I cannot blame them given the
absurd admission requirements of the time.|e-a Only a few students
were at all interested in the subject, one of them a future
lawyer.|e-a I kept him in mind in case I ever needed a good lawyer,
resolved to keep away from them if I needed a doctor.
When I arrived at a university in Texas as a postdoc, I found that
the faculty was almost entirely American.|e-a But, aside from those
sent us by the military, the grad students were almost entirely
foreign.
In my group there were three postdocs and six grad students, hailing
from Japan, Hong Kong, South Korea, Taiwan, and|e-a Canada.
The irony of this is that my supervisor had chosen a position in
Texas in part because he noticed that undergrad physics students in
local universities didn't go on to grad school.|e-a Many went into
banking or stockbroking instead.|e-a He felt that by livening up our
department he might attract some.|e-a But no.
2. In the course of the second lecture I mentioned that Maud Menten >>>>> was the first woman and maybe the first Canadian to make a major
mark in biochemistry. About half the students were women, and
virtually all were Canadian, but from the looks on their faces they >>>>> were all thinking the same thing: why is he telling us this stuff
that is not likely to be in the exam? There were two professors
auditing the course (probably reporting to the department|arCU|e-a on my >>>>> qualiies as a teacher, but I was too naive to think that at the
time; I thought they were just interested). Both of them agreed
that my interpretation of the students' reaction was correct. (In
1977 very few people knew that Maud Menten was a Canadian woman.)
Well, at least you tried.|e-a I took first year chemistry the year
after Herzberg won the Nobel, but he was never mentioned.|e-a I didn't >>>> come across his name, except in passing, until I took QM two years
later.
Incidentally, French students are no more interested than those of
Guelph in history, in my experience. A few years ago I was talking
about Monod, Changeux and Jacob in a lecture. I showed a picture of
the Institut Jacques Monod in Paris, and I asked if anyone could tell
me what Monod had done to deserve a massive new building in his name:
no one had any idea. Likewise with Changeux and Jacob.
In the late 1970's I took majors Biochemistry at Berkeley.-a It started
off as a good experience because I had Koshland as an instructor for
the first quarter, but then it went downhill.-a Koshland had a knack
for making his lectures interesting.
I knew Dan very well.I heard him give research lectues two or three
times, but I never heard him lecture to students. I can believe he was
as good as you say.
-aThe last quarter was taught by Schekman.
At first I tought you meant Howard Schachman, but I was wrong, of
course. I never encouuntered Schekman.
-a It was mostly nucleic acid biochemistry and I was frankly bored, and
at the time I was deeply into doing my undergraduate research most
nights and I ended up sleeping in the class most days because it was
my first morning class.-a One test question asked how to identify the
tryptophan operon repressor.-a I answered with how Jacob and Monod had
done it with the lac operon.-a The answer that he wanted was that
bacterial extracts bound tryptophan in a dialysis bag creating a
higher concentration of tryptophan in the bag compared to the outside
solution.-a-a It was probably the only time I went in and tried to get
more credit for any test answer, but Schekman said that my answer was
a genetic answer and not biochemistry.-a Even though his answer only
indicated that something had an affinity for tryptophan inside the
dialysis bag and was not direct evidence for identification of a
tryptophan repressor he would not accept a correct answer.-a He even
told me that my answer was correct.-a As crazy as this exchange was
Schekman ended up getting the Nobel prize for integrating genetics and
Biochemistry years later, but at the time he was a new hire in the
biochemistry department.
Incidentally, the Wikiparticle on Howard Schachman is pathetically bad.
I would like to fix it, but I cannot, because I have been blocked from editing by three idiot administrators. The reason was unintelligible,
but had something to do with misuse by someone who uses a similar
internet connection. I appealed, but the appeal was denied, no reason
being given. After five years and 22000 edits Wikipedia will have to
survive without me, but I expect it will manage.
https://www.nbcnews.com/world/asia/trump-h1b-visa-fee-travel-tech- workers-india-china-immigration-rcna232695
This is a pretty stupid anti immigration bit of stupidity.-a We are a
nation of immigrants, and these are the highest caliber immigrants that exist.-a R&D companies do not hire these people to exploit them.-a They
are paid the same as a US citizen in the same position would be paid. If
we could hire US citizens to fill these positions we would, but the US
is pretty poor at this time in producing high tech and science savvy workers.-a It is weird but there is a lack of interest in science in US culture.-a There is even a negative suspicion of science in the US.
Public schools produce students that look down on nerds with a more open desire to learn things.-a It allows scam artists like the ID perps to
exists and propagate their stupid anti-science political stupidity in
order to support their religious and backwards political beliefs.-a The
only point of the obfuscaation and denial switch scam is to keep the students as ignorant as possible so that they can continue to be lied to
by the IDiotic scam artists.
It should be telling how foreign students predominate in our graduate science institutions.-a Even a lot (the majority?) of the qualified graduates that the US produces are not US citizens, and foreign
countries have graduate science institutions that can be better than the ones we have established in the US.-a US citizens avoid these
disciplines, but students in foreign countries do not.
Before and after World War II the US benefited by foreign immigrant scientists because of instability in Europe.-a By the time that I got
into grad school in the 1980s the universities were phasing out the
foreign language requirement for the PhD.-a Only a few science journals
were still published in a foreign language.-a By the time I got an
assistant professor position in 1996 all the major and useful science journals were published in English.-a The US dominated world science, English became the new latin, many foreign countries began to require
their PhD students to publish their Theses in English, but science
education in the US was in decline.
My generation benefited from Sputnik.-a Russia forced the US science
deniers to fold and for a while public science education was greatly improved.-a Real science textbooks like the BSCS biology textbooks
started to be written.-a The anti-evolution laws were struck down, but
there was always push back from the anti-science factions.-a Suspicion of science became the norm because IDiotic type science deniers had their
own political agendas, and there was a lot about science that the
average person did not like in the atomic age.-a It is all reflected in
the lack of student interest in the sciences.-a Now we have to deal with
the ID perps, and stupid people like the Kansas creationists that wanted
to dumb down the science standards, and creationists in other states
have wanted to do the same thing.
As an assistant professor I was required to do public education outreach
as part of my job.-a I started doing projects at my kid's elementary schools.-a I'd bring in an incubator and hatch some chicks.-a In middle school we did some embryology along with hatching the chicks.-a I stopped
in middle school.-a Anyone could likely repeat what I did and find the
same thing that I discovered.-a The kids start out as sponges in kindergarten.-a You have trouble keeping them from asking questions over each other.-a They want to understand just about everything down to how
the incubator works.-a This type of inquiry slowly gets beaten out of
them as they are taught to take the tests instead of learn anything.-a It would tick me off when a college student would interrupt a lecture to
ask if what was under discussion was going to be on the test.-a What I
found out was that this behavior was ingrained into the students by
middle school.-a Most of the students in middle school were no longer interested in learning something new, but they wanted to know what would
be on the test.-a It made me quit that type of outreach.-a I tried to explain that there was no test, and that the demonstration was just something to bring what they were reading in their textbooks to life,
but most of the students remained skeptical.-a That is the type of
students we are producing.-a It makes H-1B visas a necessity to keep the
US on the cutting edge of science.-a If we go insular and self absorbed
all the major science journals will likely be published in Chinese in another generation.
Ron Okimoto
On 9/21/25 12:57 PM, RonO wrote:
https://www.nbcnews.com/world/asia/trump-h1b-visa-fee-travel-tech-
workers-india-china-immigration-rcna232695
This is a pretty stupid anti immigration bit of stupidity.
That's both redundant and repetitive.
And the issue is not and never has been "Immigration." It's illegal
aliens.