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On Friday, July 28, 2023 at 7:11:08rC>AM UTC-4, Daud Deden wrote:--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2
On Friday, July 28, 2023 at 2:07:03rC>AM UTC-4, Ruud Harmsen wrote:
Thu, 27 Jul 2023 13:45:38 -0700 (PDT): Daud DedenEtymology
<daud....@gmail.com> scribeva:
On Thursday, July 27, 2023 at 4:02:38?PM UTC-4, Ross Clark wrote:it irregular, not archaic.
On 28/07/2023 1:22 a.m., Daud Deden wrote:
Sons of Jacob (in Russian): Synovya Iakova (?)What's not correct?
Not correct.
synovial (adj.)No,no,no.
1756, "pertaining to the synovia," albuminous fluid secreted by certain glands, from Modern Latin sinovia (16c.), probably coined by Paracelsus and apparently an invented word.
syn- [ xyuamb, sum]
word-forming element meaning "together with, jointly; alike; at the same time," also sometimes completive or intensive, from Greek syn (prep.) "with, together with, along with, in the company of," from PIE *ksun- "with" (source also of Russian so- "with, together," from Old Russian su(n)-). Assimilated to -l-, reduced to sy- before -s- and -z-, and altered to sym- before -b-, -m- and -p-.
Synovya is an archaic plural of Russian /syn/ 'son'. Yes, cognate with
the English word. https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%D1%81%D1%8B%D0%BD#Declension_3 calls
Thanks, interesting. I checked 3 sites googling 'etym synovya', no mention of syn/son in Russian, all mentioned synovial fluid, so I thought the original cite (Clive Cussler, author of fiction, novel) was in error or invented.--
I guess you mean that 'synovya' is cognate with 'sons'.
Ruud Harmsen, https://rudhar.com
u-stem derivation from the root *sewH- (rCLto give birthrCY), thus the original meaning being "birth, fruit of the body". Tocharian, Greek and Armenian reflect the -yu- derivation from the same root: *suHy||s. Sanskrit an+aNean+an+ (s+2b|u-U|U, rCLparturient womanrCY) and Albanian gjysh (< Proto-Albanian *s+2+i-U) derived from later variation *suHs||s.
Noun
*suhreUn||s or *suhrean||s m[1]
son
-
Cognate with 'issue'?
Xyua(mbuatl) through, threw, in parallel with Malay bua(h/t/ng) fruit-fert/make/throw out-parturate (xyuam)buatl
Compare *sewH- birthing with *tewh- swelling and to endu/endo, Theo/Deu/tue.sday, xyua- opening of dome hut
Restarting thread from here, Aug. 2025
Spanish & Welsh cognates (facebook)
https://www.facebook.com/share/p/178M8HSo9e/
Ar an t-ocht|| l|i d|-ag de m|! L||nasa, scr|!obh DDeden:
Restarting thread from here, Aug. 2025
Spanish & Welsh cognates (facebook)
https://www.facebook.com/share/p/178M8HSo9e/
God bless you, Facebook, you have locked me out, I cannot make any further comments without making a Facebook account, which account I deleted over a decade ago, and with which decision I am happy. I wish rCLPolyglots (The Community)rCY well with this long-standing thread which, as far as I can see, was
a waste of everyonerCOs time.
Camphor, a white crystalline tree resin, from PMP qapuR : lime from burnt coral/shell, for betel chewing, also a white crystalline powder, used around SEA but not at Vanatua where kava2 usage originated (kava <~ qapuR?).
https://groups.io/g/1WorldofWords/message/630
Camphor sounds similar to camp, kampong, kampf, xyuambuatl; perhaps derived from use of calcium for cement or ceramic?
Was powdered limestone mixed with mud or manure in house (mortar, brick, adobe?) construction?
Camphor, a white crystalline tree resin, from PMP qapuR : lime from burnt coral/shell, for betel chewing, also a white crystalline powder, used around SEA but not at Vanatua where kava2 usage originated (kava <~ qapuR?).
https://groups.io/g/1WorldofWords/message/630
Camphor sounds similar to camp, kampong, kampf, xyuambuatl; perhaps derived from use of calcium for cement or ceramic?
Was powdered limestone mixed with mud or manure in house (mortar, brick, adobe?) construction?
QapuR distinct from kapu = taboo
Camphor was burnt at Batu Caves, M'sia during Thaipusam Indian festival which I attended.
On 25/08/2025 8:08 a.m., DDeden wrote:
Camphor, a white crystalline tree resin, from PMP qapuR : lime from burnt coral/shell, for betel chewing, also a white crystalline powder, used around SEA but not at Vanatua where kava2 usage originated (kava <~ qapuR?).
https://groups.io/g/1WorldofWords/message/630
Camphor sounds similar to camp, kampong, kampf, xyuambuatl; perhaps derived from use of calcium for cement or ceramic?
Was powdered limestone mixed with mud or manure in house (mortar, brick, adobe?) construction?
QapuR distinct from kapu = taboo
Camphor was burnt at Batu Caves, M'sia during Thaipusam Indian festival which I attended.
Camphor sounds to me like a product of medieval technology, hence not
likely to be of any great antiquity in Austronesian cultures or
languages. Blust has a PAN *dakeS for the camphor laurel (Cinnamomum
spp.), but attested only in Formosan languages.
Otherwise nothing.
OED traces English "camphor" and the other European words through Arabic k-Uf+2r, and k-Up+2r in Old Persian, Hindi and Malay. They also cite a Sanskrit karp+2ram, but don't say how early that form is (they never do),
or whether there is any evidence whether it's a local formation or a borrowing. I would see the Malay word as a straight borrowing from India
or Persia, particularly given the long vowels in both syllables.
My 1960s Eng-Indo dictionary doesn't even give a word for camphor. (It's
not as common a household product as it used to be.) However, Winstedt
says it's Malay kapor Barus. I don't know what "Barus" is supposed to
mean there, but "kapor" is defnitely lime or lime-kiln. So clearly
somebody saw a resemblance with that other white crystalline substance.
PAN *qapuR, PMP *kapuR for lime (calcium carbonate), made by burning
shell or coral limestone, used in betel-chewing, have reflexes all
through AN as far as the Solomons. And, as you say, that's where the
betel stops and kava begins. I don't think the name of Piper methysticum
is related to the lime words. Proto-Oceanic *kawa is based on
Polynesian, southern Vanuatu and a scattering of other cognate forms.
(In most of Vanuatu it's called *maloqu.) John Lynch's conclusion was
that it was a metathetic variant of *wakaR 'root'.
The word *qapuR is still around in Vanuatu, often with adjacent senses
such as "ashes" or "dust". Lime itself had other uses -- notably for bleaching hair (or even a head-covering when out fishing -- Buck, Samoan Material Culture) -- so the making of it never disappeared. In Fijian
and Polynesian it's called *lase -- originally the coral rock from which it's derived.
Ross Clark <benlizro@ihug.co.nz> posted:
On 25/08/2025 8:08 a.m., DDeden wrote:
Camphor, a white crystalline tree resin, from PMP qapuR : lime from burnt coral/shell, for betel chewing, also a white crystalline powder, used around SEA but not at Vanatua where kava2 usage originated (kava <~ qapuR?).
https://groups.io/g/1WorldofWords/message/630
Camphor sounds similar to camp, kampong, kampf, xyuambuatl; perhaps derived from use of calcium for cement or ceramic?
Was powdered limestone mixed with mud or manure in house (mortar, brick, adobe?) construction?
QapuR distinct from kapu = taboo
Camphor was burnt at Batu Caves, M'sia during Thaipusam Indian festival which I attended.
Camphor sounds to me like a product of medieval technology, hence not
likely to be of any great antiquity in Austronesian cultures or
languages. Blust has a PAN *dakeS for the camphor laurel (Cinnamomum
spp.), but attested only in Formosan languages.
Otherwise nothing.
OED traces English "camphor" and the other European words through Arabic
k-Uf+2r, and k-Up+2r in Old Persian, Hindi and Malay. They also cite a
Sanskrit karp+2ram, but don't say how early that form is (they never do),
or whether there is any evidence whether it's a local formation or a
borrowing. I would see the Malay word as a straight borrowing from India
or Persia, particularly given the long vowels in both syllables.
My 1960s Eng-Indo dictionary doesn't even give a word for camphor. (It's
not as common a household product as it used to be.) However, Winstedt
says it's Malay kapor Barus. I don't know what "Barus" is supposed to
mean there, but "kapor" is defnitely lime or lime-kiln. So clearly
somebody saw a resemblance with that other white crystalline substance.
PAN *qapuR, PMP *kapuR for lime (calcium carbonate), made by burning
shell or coral limestone, used in betel-chewing, have reflexes all
through AN as far as the Solomons. And, as you say, that's where the
betel stops and kava begins. I don't think the name of Piper methysticum
is related to the lime words. Proto-Oceanic *kawa is based on
Polynesian, southern Vanuatu and a scattering of other cognate forms.
(In most of Vanuatu it's called *maloqu.) John Lynch's conclusion was
that it was a metathetic variant of *wakaR 'root'.
The word *qapuR is still around in Vanuatu, often with adjacent senses
such as "ashes" or "dust". Lime itself had other uses -- notably for
bleaching hair (or even a head-covering when out fishing -- Buck, Samoan
Material Culture) -- so the making of it never disappeared. In Fijian
and Polynesian it's called *lase -- originally the coral rock from which
it's derived.
That is interesting.
I'd think Persian & Indian traders got kapur name from SEAsia, from powder via heat or maceration.
"All the plant parts of camphor tree have the distinctive, easy-to-recognise camphoraceous odor." One could get medicinal benefit without complex methods of distillation just by heating foliage, bark & woodchips, in sunlight, later near fire, so probably very ancient. I would guess originally it was chewed into a pulp and spit into a bowl, similarly to how kava was chewed(?). A still can be made with bamboo & clay pots, perhaps leaving a crystalline powder on the receptacle.
Taiwan was rich in camphor laurels until industrial extraction.
"The finest camphor came from Malaya, Borneo and Sumatra, but long-distance trade took it to societies at the geographical poles of demand - China and the medieval West already in late Antiquity (ca. 6th century A.D.). In India it was in use at an even much earlier period."
Barus: a west Sumatran port where camphor was traded.
Pure Barus camphor is a natural, crystalline substance that sublimes (evaporates without leaving a residue).
Origin of the Name
Kapur Barus:
This term comes from the Malay word "kapur," meaning "chalk," referring to its white color.
Barus:
This was an ancient port on the western coast of Sumatra where foreign traders would purchase this camphor, leading to the name "kapur Barus" or "chalk of Barus".
Historical Significance
Trade:
Barus was a significant trading hub for this valuable commodity in ancient times, linking Southeast Asian production with Indian and Middle Eastern markets.
Medicine and Rituals:
In India and Southeast Asia, pure Barus camphor has long been used in Hindu religious rituals, as an Ayurvedic medicine, and as a fumigant.
Characteristics
Natural Product:
Barus camphor is extracted from camphor trees found in regions like Sumatra. Sublimation:
When pure, it is a volatile compound that sublimes, meaning it turns directly from a solid to a gas without melting.
Restarting thread from here, Aug. 2025
Spanish & Welsh cognates (facebook)
https://www.facebook.com/share/p/178M8HSo9e/
Restarting thread from here, Aug. 2025
Spanish & Welsh cognates (facebook)
https://www.facebook.com/share/p/178M8HSo9e/
At 95, Noam ChomskyrCothe legendary linguist, philosopher, and political thinkerrCohas reportedly lost much of his ability to speak and write due to health issues.
For decades, Chomsky used words not to comfort, but to challenge. He dissected global power structures, media manipulation, war, and inequalityrCoalways urging people to think critically, even when the truth was uncomfortable.
He never asked to be followed blindly. In fact, he warned against it.
rCLThe smart way to keep people passive and obedient,rCY he once said, rCLis to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum.rCY
He believed real change didnrCOt come from waiting on leadersrCobut from understanding systems, questioning history, and organizing ordinary people.
Chomsky didnrCOt just give answers.
He gave generations the tools to ask better questions.
And though his voice may be quiet now, his words are still loud in classrooms, protests, libraries, and minds around the world.
https://www.facebook.com/share/p/178M8HSo9e/
True friends false cognates
True friends, true cognates
False friends, true cognates
False friends, false cognates
https://www.facebook.com/share/1EzmGMwohk/
Antarctican accent, citizens
https://groups.io/g/1WorldofWords/message/684
Cepan @ Azt : combine <= XyUAMBuAtl
There isn't a single, simple verb for "combine" in Nahuatl; instead, the idea is conveyed through the word cepan (or |oepan), which functions as an adverb meaning "together" or "in company with one another" and can be incorporated into verbs.
Here's why and how it works:
Adverbial meaning
: cepan means "together" or "jointly".
Incorporation into verbs
: This adverb can be added to a verb to express the idea of combining or being together simultaneously. For example, in the sentence "yquac yaque sepanolestin yn i|oepan mexica opan Florida," sepanolestin is a verb formed from cepan, indicating that the Spanish went together with the Mexica.
Contextual usage
: The specific way to express "combine" depends on the context. You might use cepan with a verb of movement, like the example above, or other actions to show that things are done together.
Ar an tri|| l|i de m|! Deireadh F||mhair, scr|!obh DDeden:
Antarctican accent, citizens
https://groups.io/g/1WorldofWords/message/684
rCyFor instance, a German woman stationed at the Rothera Research Station began
to speak like a native English speaker as she talked more and more with her
colleagues from the UK.rCO
[...]
rCyThe incipient linguistic changes observed in Antarctica, while captured over
a brief six-month period, are not without precedent. They represent the first
moments of a process that has played out countless times throughout human
history, leading to the diversification of languages and the birth of new
dialects.
While the rCLAntarctic accentrCY may sound surprising, itrCOs not without
precedent. History is full of cases where small, isolated groups of people
forged entirely new ways of speaking.rCO
Glad it has been documented. The article has plenty of filler, which is not a shock.