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Blueshirt <blueshirt@indigo.news> wrote:
There's only one Genesis that counts... and it featured Tom
Baker and some Daleks.
Strange how they did ‘Genesis’ and Revelation’ of the Daleks,
but not any of the other books of the Bible. There are lots
that might work:
Exodus of the Daleks
Numbers of the Daleks
Judges of the Daleks
Kings of the Daleks
Proverbs of the Daleks
Lamentations of the Daleks
Chronicles of the Daleks
Acts of the Daleks
and of course
Second Epistle to the Corinthians of the Daleks
On 4/07/2025 11:37 pm, solar penguin wrote:
Blueshirt <blueshirt@indigo.news> wrote:
There's only one Genesis that counts... and it featured Tom
Baker and some Daleks.
Strange how they did ‘Genesis’ and Revelation’ of the
Daleks, but not any of the other books of the Bible. There
are lots that might work:
Exodus of the Daleks
Where would they go??
solar penguin wrote:
Blueshirt <blueshirt@indigo.news> wrote:
There's only one Genesis that counts... and it featured Tom
Baker and some Daleks.
Strange how they did ‘Genesis’ and Revelation’ of the Daleks,
but not any of the other books of the Bible. There are lots
that might work:
Exodus of the Daleks
Numbers of the Daleks
Judges of the Daleks
Kings of the Daleks
Proverbs of the Daleks
Lamentations of the Daleks
Chronicles of the Daleks
Acts of the Daleks
and of course
Second Epistle to the Corinthians of the Daleks
You forgot;
Wisdom of the Daleks.
If we're gonna do it... we might as well do it right! ;-)
Daniel70 wrote:
On 4/07/2025 11:37 pm, solar penguin wrote:
Blueshirt <blueshirt@indigo.news> wrote:
There's only one Genesis that counts... and it featured Tom
Baker and some Daleks.
Strange how they did ‘Genesis’ and Revelation’ of the
Daleks, but not any of the other books of the Bible. There
are lots that might work:
Exodus of the Daleks
Where would they go??
Well... according to legend Skaro was blown up by the Hand of
Omega... so there had to have been some sort of exodus... or
Daleks would have nowhere to live would they?
I reckon "Exodus of the Daleks" could be a 'missing' story just
waiting for somebody to write it...
But not John Peel!
The True loon lectured:
On 27/06/2025 21:56, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
The Bible doesn't say rib, it says SIDE. Eve was made from the side of >>>> Adam because Adam was parted in two to make Eve. Originally Adam and Eve >>>> were one. Read Aristophanes' speech in Plato's Symposium which makes the >>>> origin of the Bible story clear especially when Socrates cites the
original source.
Even if Plato and/or Aristophanes knew about the Genesis story,
it doesn’t make their fanfic part of the Biblical canon.
The Bible was written AFTER Plato's Symposium took place.
That depends what you mean by “The Bible”. It isn’t one book
but a collection of many books written at different times and
based on different sources which in turn drew from different
traditions.
There isn’t one single date when it was written.
The story
already existed in Athens in 416 BC before Genesis was even composed.
That might be possible. Genesis is based on three sources: the
E source(Elohist), J source (Jahwist) and P source (Priestly).
And they all drew on earlier traditions and stories.
It’s possible one of them might’ve taken something from the same traditional story that Plato and friends used.
But that still doesn’t mean that Plato’s version of the story is Biblical canon. Genesis also drew on Mesopotamian creation myths like the
Enuma Elish. But that doesn’t make the Mesopotamian versions of
those myths canon. Why should Plato be any different?
And it definitely doesn’t make it biological fact.
And neither is a Time Lord changing gender during regeneration.
Nobody ever claimed Time Lords were any kind of fact. We’re
all aware they’re fictional.
On 28/06/2025 00:21, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
On 27/06/2025 21:56, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
The Bible doesn't say rib, it says SIDE. Eve was made from the side of >>>>> Adam because Adam was parted in two to make Eve. Originally Adam and Eve >>>>> were one. Read Aristophanes' speech in Plato's Symposium which makes the >>>>> origin of the Bible story clear especially when Socrates cites the
original source.
Even if Plato and/or Aristophanes knew about the Genesis story,
it doesn’t make their fanfic part of the Biblical canon.
The Bible was written AFTER Plato's Symposium took place.
That depends what you mean by “The Bible”. It isn’t one book
but a collection of many books written at different times and
based on different sources which in turn drew from different
traditions.
There isn’t one single date when it was written.
Well obviously the Books of Maccabees were written much later than The >Symposium given that they take place over 200 years later.
The real question is when was the first book of the Bible that was
written written.
Most people have the silly idea that Genesis was written first but maybe
it was written last and Maccabees was written before it.
The story
already existed in Athens in 416 BC before Genesis was even composed.
That might be possible. Genesis is based on three sources: the
E source(Elohist), J source (Jahwist) and P source (Priestly).
And they all drew on earlier traditions and stories.
We know one of the sources was the story of the old woman that Socrates
knew about and accused Aristophanes of plagiarising and there are other >sources which are common to Plato's Timaeus. What you are referring to
are not sources but alternate narratives. There's the main narrative of >Genesis which is the most detailed and has Noah around at the time of
the Flood and then there's an alternate version of Genesis which misses
out most of the details of creation and glosses all over Adam and Eve
while at the same time giving a shorter list of generations to the time
of Noah and missing out all of dates of begetting and not even
mentioning Noah at all but replacing him with 3 other individuals,
Jobel, Jubal, and Thobel. After the Food and generations to Abraham it's >just one narrative. The only variation is The Book of Jasher which is
not part of the Bible. Jasher looks like its drawing upon Roman period >sources of the same history and trying to fit in extra details into
Genesis such as Moses being Governor of Cush. Form Jasher it's clear to
see that they've taken well know Egyptian inscriptions even today and >doctored them to fit the existing narrative of the Pentateuch.
It’s possible one of them might’ve taken something from the same
traditional story that Plato and friends used.
But that still doesn’t mean that Plato’s version of the story is Biblical
canon. Genesis also drew on Mesopotamian creation myths like the
Enuma Elish. But that doesn’t make the Mesopotamian versions of
those myths canon. Why should Plato be any different?
Plato's version is taken from Phoenician texts (the ancient Greeks
didn't have a clue about Mesopotamia) and that's where the Biblical
version comes from too. Some of the Phoenician texts might have been
based on Mesopotamian sources such as Gilgamesh for Noah's Ark, but the >Greeks also use the story of the Ark in the story of the Deukalion
Flood. Even Josephus and Eusebius identified Noah, Ogygus, Deukalion,
and Jannus as being the same person.
Clearly there was a standard Egyptian history from which Manetho's
account, that of Diodorus, that of Herodotus, that of the Bible, and
that of Jasher all come from.
There was similarly a standard history of Syria-Palestine where the
biblical events set there all derive from. This may have been the
histories of Sanchuniathon from which the Judges figures
Jerrubaal/Gideon and Abimelech come from and the Phoenician history of >Menander translated into Greek.
There was also the history of the Hittites, Hurrians, and Mittani which
is the probable source for the descendants of Shem (Shuttarna I) to
Nahor (Naharin) all the way to Jacob. It could also be the source of the >story of Adam and Eve given that Eden is Adana in Turkey and given the
snake and ornamental garden motives is probably Gobekli Tepe.
Ham is probably based on Khamose from Egyptian history.
Japhet is clearly a corruption of Iapetus and Javan is Ion or Jannus and >this is clearly based on chronologies and kings lists that were used by
the Romans and also quoted by Nennius and in the Irish Book of
Invasions. The Roman chronologies come from The Phrygia by Thymaetes as
can be seen in Diodorus histories which demonstrates that this is the
source of Ktesias Chaldanian and European histories and the source of >Psedo-Berosus and Annius de Viterbe and this the source of The Travels
of Noah Into Europe. The Irish Book of Invasions (including the kings of >Scotland (literally Scythia/Scotia), and the Swedish, Nordic, and
British kings before Brutus given by Nennius are probably using the same >Scythian sources used by Herodotus.
For the kingdoms of Israel and Judea there is inscriptional evidence for.
And it definitely doesn’t make it biological fact.
And neither is a Time Lord changing gender during regeneration.
Nobody ever claimed Time Lords were any kind of fact. We’re
all aware they’re fictional.
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change gender during >regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant as reality in order to be >believed.
----
The True Doctor https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCngrZwoS0n21IRcXpKO79Lw
"To be woke is to be uninformed which is exactly the opposite of what it >stands for." --William Shatner
On 28/06/2025 00:21, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
And neither is a Time Lord changing gender during
regeneration.
Nobody ever claimed Time Lords were any kind of fact. We’re
all aware they’re fictional.
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant as
reality in order to be believed.
The True Doctor wrote:
On 28/06/2025 00:21, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
And neither is a Time Lord changing gender during
regeneration.
Nobody ever claimed Time Lords were any kind of fact. We’re
all aware they’re fictional.
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant as
reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their gender
whilst regenerating on-screen... so your opinion on it counts for
nothing as it has already happened. We can't unsee it now!
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so it
is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now become part
of "Doctor Who" lore.
The True Doctor wrote:
On 28/06/2025 00:21, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
And neither is a Time Lord changing gender during
regeneration.
Nobody ever claimed Time Lords were any kind of fact. We’re
all aware they’re fictional.
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant as
reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their gender
whilst regenerating on-screen... so your opinion on it counts for
nothing as it has already happened. We can't unsee it now!
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so itNo it has not. Doctor Who had already ended by the time that piece of degeneration fan fiction was written by RTD on LSD.
is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now become part
of "Doctor Who" lore.
On 05/07/2025 11:36, Blueshirt wrote:
The True Doctor wrote:
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant
as reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their
gender whilst regenerating on-screen... so your opinion on
it counts for
No we have not. That was deranged fan fiction like the moon
hatching into a giant space dragon which flew away with 90% of
it's mass and then with only 10% of its mass remaining in the
broken shell it all came back together within seconds and
looked and weight exactly the same as it did before.
nothing as it has already happened. We can't unsee it now!
Everything from Kill The Moon onwards can be considered to be
cannon.
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
Totally deranged fan fiction.
it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so
it is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now
become part of "Doctor Who" lore.
No it has not. Doctor Who had already ended by the time that
piece of degeneration fan fiction was written by RTD on LSD.
On 05/07/2025 11:36, Blueshirt wrote:
The True Doctor wrote:
On 28/06/2025 00:21, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
And neither is a Time Lord changing gender during
regeneration.
Nobody ever claimed Time Lords were any kind of fact. We’re
all aware they’re fictional.
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant as
reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their gender
whilst regenerating on-screen... so your opinion on it counts for
No we have not. That was deranged fan fiction like the moon hatching
into a giant space dragon which flew away with 90% of it's mass and then >with only 10% of its mass remaining in the broken shell it all came back >together within seconds and looked and weight exactly the same as it did >before.
nothing as it has already happened. We can't unsee it now!
Everything from Kill The Moon onwards can be considered to be cannon.
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
Totally deranged fan fiction.
it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so itNo it has not. Doctor Who had already ended by the time that piece of >degeneration fan fiction was written by RTD on LSD.
is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now become part
of "Doctor Who" lore.
----
The True Doctor https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCngrZwoS0n21IRcXpKO79Lw
"To be woke is to be uninformed which is exactly the opposite of what it >stands for." --William Shatner
The True Doctor wrote:
On 05/07/2025 11:36, Blueshirt wrote:
The True Doctor wrote:
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant
as reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their
gender whilst regenerating on-screen... so your opinion on
it counts for
No we have not. That was deranged fan fiction like the moon
hatching into a giant space dragon which flew away with 90% of
it's mass and then with only 10% of its mass remaining in the
broken shell it all came back together within seconds and
looked and weight exactly the same as it did before.
You really didn't like that episode, did you?!
nothing as it has already happened. We can't unsee it now!
Everything from Kill The Moon onwards can be considered to be
cannon.
It can, by you or anyone. As there is no official BBC Doctor Who
canon so you can include or exclude anything you like. (I do.)
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
Totally deranged fan fiction.
I'll stick with stupid idea.
it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so
it is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now
become part of "Doctor Who" lore.
No it has not. Doctor Who had already ended by the time that
piece of degeneration fan fiction was written by RTD on LSD.
<rolls eyes>
Just when I thought you were starting to takes things
seriously...
The True Doctor wrote:
On 05/07/2025 11:36, Blueshirt wrote:
The True Doctor wrote:
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant
as reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their
gender whilst regenerating on-screen... so your opinion on
it counts for
No we have not. That was deranged fan fiction like the moon
hatching into a giant space dragon which flew away with 90% of
it's mass and then with only 10% of its mass remaining in the
broken shell it all came back together within seconds and
looked and weight exactly the same as it did before.
You really didn't like that episode, did you?!
nothing as it has already happened. We can't unsee it now!
Everything from Kill The Moon onwards can be considered to be
cannon.
It can, by you or anyone. As there is no official BBC Doctor Who
canon so you can include or exclude anything you like. (I do.)
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
Totally deranged fan fiction.
I'll stick with stupid idea.
it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so
it is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now
become part of "Doctor Who" lore.
No it has not. Doctor Who had already ended by the time that
piece of degeneration fan fiction was written by RTD on LSD.
<rolls eyes>
Just when I thought you were starting to takes things
seriously...
On 05/07/2025 15:40, Blueshirt wrote:
The True Doctor wrote:
Everything from Kill The Moon onwards can be considered to
be cannon.
I meant "...can not be considered to be canon."
The True Doctor wrote:
On 28/06/2025 00:21, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
And neither is a Time Lord changing gender during
regeneration.
Nobody ever claimed Time Lords were any kind of fact. We’re
all aware they’re fictional.
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant as
reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their gender
whilst regenerating on-screen...
so your opinion on it counts for nothing as it has already happened.
We can't unsee it now!
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so it
is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now become part
of "Doctor Who" lore.
On 05/07/2025 15:40, Blueshirt wrote:
The True Doctor wrote:
On 05/07/2025 11:36, Blueshirt wrote:
The True Doctor wrote:
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant
as reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their
gender whilst regenerating on-screen... so your opinion on
it counts for
No we have not. That was deranged fan fiction like the moon
hatching into a giant space dragon which flew away with 90% of
it's mass and then with only 10% of its mass remaining in the
broken shell it all came back together within seconds and
looked and weight exactly the same as it did before.
You really didn't like that episode, did you?!
nothing as it has already happened. We can't unsee it now!
Everything from Kill The Moon onwards can be considered to be
cannon.
I meant "...can not be considered to be canon."
It can, by you or anyone. As there is no official BBC Doctor Who
canon so you can include or exclude anything you like. (I do.)
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
Totally deranged fan fiction.
I'll stick with stupid idea.
It's not canon.
It is not canon.it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so
it is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now
become part of "Doctor Who" lore.
No it has not. Doctor Who had already ended by the time that
piece of degeneration fan fiction was written by RTD on LSD.
<rolls eyes>
Just when I thought you were starting to takes things
seriously...
----
The True Doctor https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCngrZwoS0n21IRcXpKO79Lw
"To be woke is to be uninformed which is exactly the opposite of what it >stands for." --William Shatner
The True Doctor wrote:
On 05/07/2025 15:40, Blueshirt wrote:
The True Doctor wrote:
Everything from Kill The Moon onwards can be considered to
be cannon.
I meant "...can not be considered to be canon."
I knew what you meant! After all, it's only about the 47th
time you have gone on about "Kill The Moon" ... and some of
the seasons that came after it... my memory is not bad enough
yet to forget.
I am not Daniel, I ignore typos!
On 2025-07-05 10:36:42 +0000, Blueshirt said:
The True Doctor wrote:
On 28/06/2025 00:21, solar penguin wrote:
The True loon lectured:
And neither is a Time Lord changing gender during
regeneration.
Nobody ever claimed Time Lords were any kind of fact. We’re
all aware they’re fictional.
That doesn't change the fact that Time Lords can't change
gender during regeneration. Fiction has to be as constant as
reality in order to be believed.
That opinion is fine if that's what you believe, but it can't
be a fact as we have already seen Time Lords change their gender
whilst regenerating on-screen...
Only because the idiot RTD purposely did it to jump on the Politically >Correct bandagon (as well as appeasing BBC "equality" checklists), so
he lazily hijacked an existing character rather than actually do
something creative like make a brand new character.
RTD Wanted Doctor Who to Move Away from “Very Straight,
Masculine, and Testosterone-y” Sci-Fi
Reflecting on his recent work with Doctor Who, showrunner
Russell T Davies revealed that one of his driving goals
since taking the reins again was to steer the show away
from what he called “very straight, very masculine, very
testosterone-y” science fiction.
<https://www.doctorwhotv.co.uk/doctor-who-rtd-testosterone-scifi-105852.htm>
so your opinion on it counts for nothing as it has already happened.
We can't unsee it now!
A bit like bi-generation... I think it was a stupid idea but
it's happened and been seen to happen in "The Giggle"... so it
is what it is. Believable fiction or not it has now become part
of "Doctor Who" lore.