| Sysop: | Amessyroom |
|---|---|
| Location: | Fayetteville, NC |
| Users: | 26 |
| Nodes: | 6 (0 / 6) |
| Uptime: | 48:48:45 |
| Calls: | 632 |
| Files: | 1,187 |
| D/L today: |
3 files (4,227K bytes) |
| Messages: | 177,138 |
Apple
does actually continue supporting some of the the older OS versions for
a while longer with important fixes, even after a new one is released.
Correct. He also doesn't understand that any version of ios supports many generations of models and drops support from newer ios versions very
slowly.
For example, iPadOS had an update to 17.7.10 (yes, 17) only a month
ago, even though iPadsOS 18 was released a year ago.
The only difference in older model support between iPadOS 17 & 18 is the
ipad 6th gen. Notably a 7 year-old device. There must be enough active ones out there for Apple to patch.
In contrast iOS 17 has had only three updates since the release of 18
because all iOS 17 compatible devices are also compatible with iOS 18.
iOS 15 & 16 received an update this week, interestingly.
Microsoft leads in total years of guaranteed full security support for a >single OS release (Windows 10 at ~10 years).
Google Android
Android 12 (example older major release)
Release date: 4 October 2021
Full security support ended: 3 March 2025
Duration: ~3 years and 5 months full security support
Notes: Timeline varies by version; Google Pixel devices typically
received 3rCo5 years depending on model
Specifically for the current releases, as of today...
Full-Support Timelines for All Known Vulnerabilities
Microsoft Windows
Windows 10
Release date: 29 July 2015
End of support: 14 October 2025
Duration: ~10 years full security support
Notes: After Oct 2025, Extended Security Updates (ESU) available
for up to 3 more years (paid)
Google Pixel
Pixel 8 series
Release date: 4 October 2023
End of support: October 2030
Duration: 7 years full support (Android OS and security updates)
Notes: Covers all Android upgrades, Pixel feature drops,
and security patches for the full period
Samsung Galaxy
Galaxy S24 series
Release date: 17 January 2024
End of support: January 2031
Duration: 7 years full support (Android OS and security updates)
Notes: Matches Google 7 year commitment for both OS and security updates
Apple iPhone
iPhone 15 series
Release date: 22 September 2023
Guaranteed full support: Until September 2028
Duration: Minimum 5 years full security support
Notes: Apple only guarantees 5 years; historically some devices get more,
but it is at Apple random discretion and not a firm commitment
I understand both iOS & Android support better'n any of you Apple trolls.
Recent Android "Exception" Security Patches for unsupported versions are
1. 2025-09-05 Android 12 / 12L
Patched two actively exploited zero-days:
CVE-2025-38352 (Kernel privilege escalation)
CVE-2025-48543 (Android Runtime sandbox escape)
Security support for Android 12 ended Mar 2025, but fix was backported
via OEM updates and Google Play system modules
2. 2024-08-05 Android 11
Patched critical libwebp vulnerability (CVE-2023-4863)
Remote code execution via malicious images
Even as Android 11 support ended Feb 2024
3. 2023-09-05 Android 10
Patched actively exploited kernel vulnerability (CVE-2023-35674)
Allowed privilege escalation from apps to system
Android 10 support ended Mar 2023, but fix issued for select devices
I'm glad you finally admit that Android does get full support "forever" and than project mainline is only sticking plaster. Android is full support is finite.
Apple iPhone
iPhone 15 series
Release date: 22 September 2023
Guaranteed full support: Until September 2028
Duration: Minimum 5 years full security support
Notes: Apple only guarantees 5 years; historically some devices get more, >> but it is at Apple random discretion and not a firm commitment
More relevant example is:
iPhone 11 series
Release date: 19 September 2019
Guaranteed full support: at least until September 2026
Duration: 7 years or more
I understand both iOS & Android support better'n any of you Apple trolls.
Why do you keep demonstrating the opposite, then?
3. 2023-09-05 Android 10
Patched actively exploited kernel vulnerability (CVE-2023-35674)
Allowed privilege escalation from apps to system
Android 10 support ended Mar 2023, but fix issued for select devices
Further evidence that your previous claim that all Android from 10 onwards
is fully supported "forever" was simply a lie. If the above are
"exceptional" then it's clear support is limited. Thus anyone stuck on any unsupported Android (i.e. 12 and older) are up a creek.
Windows 10 Full Support Timeline
Release date: 29 July 2015
End of support date: 14 October 2025
Duration: Approximately 10 years of full security support for
all known vulnerabilities
On 9/19/25 7:47 AM, Marion wrote:
Microsoft leads in total years of guaranteed full security support for a >single OS release (Windows 10 at ~10 years).
Chromebooks come with 10 years of updates. But my refurb Chrome tablet came
with only 5 years left and a regular Chromebook I bought new only had 8
years left. So it's perhaps wise to check dates before buying one. On the
other hand I doubt many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years.
Something (battery?) will likely fail first. Or maybe they (me) just want
something new to play with...
<https://support.google.com/chrome/a/answer/6220366?hl=en>
AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
On 9/19/25 7:47 AM, Marion wrote:
Microsoft leads in total years of guaranteed full security support for a >>> single OS release (Windows 10 at ~10 years).
Chromebooks come with 10 years of updates. But my refurb Chrome tablet came >> with only 5 years left and a regular Chromebook I bought new only had 8
years left. So it's perhaps wise to check dates before buying one. On the >> other hand I doubt many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years. >> Something (battery?) will likely fail first. Or maybe they (me) just want >> something new to play with...
<https://support.google.com/chrome/a/answer/6220366?hl=en>
Indeed not many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years, but
my wife's laptop is well over 11 years old (15MAY2014). And yes, it's
battery failed, but it could be easily replaced (from the outside).
Arlen,
Windows 10 Full Support Timeline
Release date: 29 July 2015
End of support date: 14 October 2025
Duration: Approximately 10 years of full security support for
all known vulnerabilities
Lets add some more facts :
Windows hardware average lifespan : 5 years (with some major upgrades upto 8).
Is Win 10 upgradable ? No. Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10 hardware. You're stuck with it until you buy new hardware (A repeated
issue, see the "windows 8 ready" debacle)
"Facts" indeed.
First, Windows is not a "consumer operating system". The vast
majority of users are businesses. Yes, there are small number of
consumers using it, but it is not a consumer product.
First, Windows is not a "consumer operating system". The vast majority of users are businesses. Yes, there are small number of consumers using
it, but it is not a consumer product.
Second, Windows 11 will absolutely install on "Windows 10 hardware". The issue is the *age* of the hardware.
None have TPM 2.0 and Secure boot.
Not the fact that it is curently running Windows 10.
Third, Windows 11 can easily be installed on "unsupported" hardware. It is not a "hack", it is done using Microsoft's own, documented settings that most people don't know about.
AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
On 9/19/25 7:47 AM, Marion wrote:
Microsoft leads in total years of guaranteed full security support for a
single OS release (Windows 10 at ~10 years).
Chromebooks come with 10 years of updates. But my refurb Chrome tablet came >> with only 5 years left and a regular Chromebook I bought new only had 8
years left. So it's perhaps wise to check dates before buying one. On the >> other hand I doubt many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years.
Something (battery?) will likely fail first. Or maybe they (me) just want >> something new to play with...
<https://support.google.com/chrome/a/answer/6220366?hl=en>
Indeed not many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years, but
my wife's laptop is well over 11 years old (15MAY2014).
And yes, it's
battery failed, but it could be easily replaced (from the outside).
But it can't be upgraded to Windows 11, so probably only a few weeks
or months to go.
N.B. My Windows 8.1 laptop lasted about 8 years (all the time with
Windows 8.1). Then a hardware failure (display) caused me to buy a new
one (with Windows 11).
On 9/20/25 3:39 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
On 9/19/25 7:47 AM, Marion wrote:
Microsoft leads in total years of guaranteed full security support for a >> >single OS release (Windows 10 at ~10 years).
Chromebooks come with 10 years of updates. But my refurb Chrome tablet came
with only 5 years left and a regular Chromebook I bought new only had 8 >> years left. So it's perhaps wise to check dates before buying one. On the >> other hand I doubt many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years. >> Something (battery?) will likely fail first. Or maybe they (me) just want >> something new to play with...
<https://support.google.com/chrome/a/answer/6220366?hl=en>
Indeed not many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years, but
my wife's laptop is well over 11 years old (15MAY2014).
My wife's HP 23" Envy Touchsmart Desktop was purchased in 6/14 (also 11
years old) with Windows 8. She still uses it. I bought her a modern 17"
laptop a few years back and she gave it back. Didn't like it. Still prefers
the desktop. And for her use (like producing family calendars) it still
works just fine.
But it can't be upgraded to Windows 11, so probably only a few weeks
or months to go.
Unless it's used for sensitive stuff I would see little reason to replace
it. Like me you surely have other up to date gear for that.
N.B. My Windows 8.1 laptop lasted about 8 years (all the time with
Windows 8.1). Then a hardware failure (display) caused me to buy a new
one (with Windows 11).
I usually update my toys for fun. The great grandkids are the winners. I
stopped giving away stuff to the grandkids when they became adults. One of
my grandkids turns age 40 this year... 8-O
Frank Slootweg wrote:
AJL wrote:
I doubt many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years.
Indeed not many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years,
I bought my tablet on 2016-08. Actually that one fell to the floor,
cracked the glass and stopped responding to the finger touch; so I
bought another identical one three months later. Years later a guy at a
shop told me that I could still use the first one with a mouse, so I >actually use both tablets.
So not yet 10 years, but the problem is not the tablet itself, but the >ancient Android that it runs. Several apps crash often on it.
If these machines could be upgraded as computers are, the hardware is still capable.
Tyrone,
First, Windows is not a "consumer operating system". The vast majority
of users are businesses. Yes, there are small number of consumers using
it, but it is not a consumer product.
Just as I always ask Arlen (and he /always/ refuses), do quote where I
made any claim in that direction.
If you can't (and I'm /pretty sure/ you can't) your above "information"
will be regarded as an attempt to (at least) confuse the matter.
Second, Windows 11 will absolutely install on "Windows 10 hardware".
The issue is the *age* of the hardware.
Nope ...
None have TPM 2.0 and Secure boot.
... but that first one will.
Not the fact that it is curently running Windows 10.
I'm afraid you are the only one here who has claimed such a thing. But
if you think I did than do quote it. Good luck.
Third, Windows 11 can easily be installed on "unsupported" hardware. It
is not a "hack", it is done using Microsoft's own, documented settings
that most people don't know about.
iow, "most people" won't be able to upgrade their Win 10 'puters.
Thanks for the confirmation. :-)
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Chris wrote:
I'm glad you finally admit that Android does get full support "forever" and >> than project mainline is only sticking plaster. Android is full support is >> finite.
Chris,
What I said was Project Mainline is forever for all Android 10+ phones.
And I said Project Mainline is a well-defined set of core Android modules.
Do you seriously think I claimed Project Mainline was the entire release?
With iOS, you sure as hell will know every moment that it's updating!
Which is one reason most iPhone owners skip lots of the updates, Chris.
Don't you think there's a reason iOS is 1-1/2 times more exploited Chris?
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
Apple iPhone
iPhone 15 series
Release date: 22 September 2023
Guaranteed full support: Until September 2028
Duration: Minimum 5 years full security support
Notes: Apple only guarantees 5 years; historically some devices get more, >>> but it is at Apple random discretion and not a firm commitment
More relevant example is:
iPhone 11 series
Release date: 19 September 2019
Guaranteed full support: at least until September 2026
Duration: 7 years or more
Your iPhone 11 info is mostly true.
Release date: 20 September 2019
Shipped with iOS 13, and as of September 2025 it runs iOS 26.
That's 7 major iOS versions already but they're not the same thing
as, oh, say, a Windows major OS version (or even an Android OS version).
Based on Apple's track record, the iPhone 11 is likely nearing the end
of its major update cycle. It may or may not get iOS 27 in 2026.
Note: Apple has never guaranteed any number of years for the iPhone 11.
The EU & UK forced Apple to state the number of years only recently.
And that's five (while Google/Samsung are seven for the flagships).
I understand both iOS & Android support better'n any of you Apple trolls. >>Why do you keep demonstrating the opposite, then?
It's a trait of the Apple trolls that they've been told they're stupid
their entire lives, mainly because they can't comprehend simple facts.
A normal person would never say something that obviously stupid, Chris.
Show me once, for example, where I've stated something incorrect
Note that the whole difference between normal people and you wholly unprepossessing Apple trolls is that Apple trolls have such a low IQ that everything you claim proves you're incredibly unfathomably stupid people.
On 2025-09-20 14:17:19 +0000, R.Wieser said:
Tyrone,
First, Windows is not a "consumer operating system". The vast majority of users are businesses.-a Yes, there are small number of consumers using
it, but it is not a consumer product.
Just as I always ask Arlen (and he /always/ refuses), do quote where I made any claim in that direction.
If you can't (and I'm /pretty sure/ you can't) your above "information" will be regarded as an attempt to (at least) confuse the matter.
I don't think there is any such breakdown of numbers anywhere. It's also confused by the differing versions of Windows (Home, Pro, Education, Enterprise). Also some home users use Pro and some businesses use Home.
I fired up my iPad Air 2 today. This model was released on October 16, 2014 and discontinued on March 21, 2017. There is an update for it. iPadOS 15.8.5.
158.2MB.
Here is an Actual Fact (not an Arlen Claim): Apple support is outstanding.
Do let us know what 11 YEAR OLD ANDROID DEVICE is still getting updates.
...First, Windows is not a "consumer operating system". The vast majority
of users are businesses. Yes, there are small number of consumers using >>> it, but it is not a consumer product.
I don't think there is any such breakdown of numbers anywhere.
Second, Windows 11 will absolutely install on "Windows 10 hardware". The >>> issue is the *age* of the hardware.
Nope ...
Yes ... but it depends on a few factors.
"But only Windows 10 PCs that are running the most current
version of Windows 10 *and meet the minimum hardware*
specifications will be able to upgrade."
On 2025-09-21 05:28:14 +0000, Tyrone said:
I fired up my iPad Air 2 today. This model was released on October 16, 2014 >> and discontinued on March 21, 2017. There is an update for it. iPadOS 15.8.5.
158.2MB.
Here is an Actual Fact (not an Arlen Claim): Apple support is outstanding. >>
Do let us know what 11 YEAR OLD ANDROID DEVICE is still getting updates.
Yep, that update was released six daya ago for both iPadOS and iOS, so iPhones way back to the iPhone 6 from 2014 got it too. :-)
About the security content of iOS 15.8.5 and iPadOS 15.8.5
<https://support.apple.com/en-us/125142>
I fired up my iPad Air 2 today. This model was released on October 16, 2014 and discontinued on March 21, 2017. There is an update for it. iPadOS 15.8.5.
158.2MB.
Here is an Actual Fact (not an Arlen Claim): Apple support is outstanding.
Do let us know what 11 YEAR OLD ANDROID DEVICE is still getting updates.
Just today saw that my 8 year old iPhone 8 plus also has an update. 16.7.12.
What I said was Project Mainline is forever for all Android 10+ phones.
And I said Project Mainline is a well-defined set of core Android modules.
You always make the comparison to the lack of full support (your words) in iOS and the dependence on random updates. Project mainline is effectively
no better. Doesn't matter whether it's forever or not.
Do you seriously think I claimed Project Mainline was the entire release?
Not since I explained in detail the difference to you last week. I can tell when you learn something despite your dogma. First, you ignore and snip
what was stated. Then a few days later you change your assertions without acknowledging it.
This is the first time you've ever made the distinction between full
releases (and therefore full support) and project mainline. You're welcome.
With iOS, you sure as hell will know every moment that it's updating!
Which is one reason most iPhone owners skip lots of the updates, Chris.
lol. Yet another lie. You can't help yourself can't you?
This demonstrates that within two months the most recent version becomes
the dominant version. https://gs.statcounter.com/ios-version-market-share/mobile-tablet/worldwide
Whereas for Android it takes 8-9 months. https://gs.statcounter.com/os-version-market-share/android/mobile-tablet/worldwide
On 9/20/25 3:39 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
AJL <noemail@none.com> wrote:
On 9/19/25 7:47 AM, Marion wrote:
Indeed not many folks will keep a tablet or laptop for 10 years, but
my wife's laptop is well over 11 years old (15MAY2014).
My wife's HP 23" Envy Touchsmart Desktop was purchased in 6/14 (also 11
years old) with Windows 8. She still uses it. I bought her a modern 17" laptop a few years back and she gave it back. Didn't like it. Still prefers the desktop. And for her use (like producing family calendars) it still
works just fine.
And yes, it's
battery failed, but it could be easily replaced (from the outside).
Here there are stores that will replace locked inside batteries which is still cheaper than buying new. My Samsung Galaxy S10+ is over 6 years old
now and still on the original battery. But I think that's probably unusual. And when it does finally fail I'll replace the phone since its last update was over a year ago (6/24).
But it can't be upgraded to Windows 11, so probably only a few weeks
or months to go.
Unless it's used for sensitive stuff I would see little reason to replace
it. Like me you surely have other up to date gear for that.
N.B. My Windows 8.1 laptop lasted about 8 years (all the time with
Windows 8.1). Then a hardware failure (display) caused me to buy a new
one (with Windows 11).
I usually update my toys for fun. The great grandkids are the winners. I stopped giving away stuff to the grandkids when they became adults. One of
my grandkids turns age 40 this year...-a 8-O
Notice my assessments are based on documented facts (with cites).
On 2025-09-20 17:31, AJL wrote:[...]
On 9/20/25 3:39 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
But it can't be upgraded to Windows 11, so probably only a few weeks
or months to go.
Unless it's used for sensitive stuff I would see little reason to replace it. Like me you surely have other up to date gear for that.
Well, I used my tablet to play Amazon Prime videos, sending them to the sitting room TV via a Chromecast USB dongle.
These type of apps have to be recent or they can refuse to run.
Now it crashes too much on the tablet, but fortunately my new smart TV
(LG) comes with apps that play them videos. Makes one wonder how many
years will that TV work. Mine is small, but I don't think one would want
to replace a bed sized TV often.
Notice my assessments are based on documented facts (with cites).
Lol. You wouldn't know a fact even if it kicked you in the nuts.
Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
On 2025-09-20 17:31, AJL wrote:[...]
On 9/20/25 3:39 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
[About my wife's Windows 10 laptop/'desktop':]
But it can't be upgraded to Windows 11, so probably only a few weeks
or months to go.
Unless it's used for sensitive stuff I would see little reason to replace >>> it. Like me you surely have other up to date gear for that.
Well, I used my tablet to play Amazon Prime videos, sending them to the
sitting room TV via a Chromecast USB dongle.
These type of apps have to be recent or they can refuse to run.
Now it crashes too much on the tablet, but fortunately my new smart TV
(LG) comes with apps that play them videos. Makes one wonder how many
years will that TV work. Mine is small, but I don't think one would want
to replace a bed sized TV often.
I recently bought a Google TV Streamer 4K (as a replacement for a - temporarily - no longer working Google Chromecast (2nd generation)).
It's a little box which runs many Android apps, which you can
connect to the network (Wi-Fi or hardwired) and via HDMI to a TV and
which you can control with the supplied remote or/and your smartphone.
You have a kind of 'Play Store' facility to download and install apps.
For example I've tried the VLC app. I don't know if you can 'sideload'
apps.
I like it and use it very often, for example to watch F1 TV (Formula 1 motorracing, etc.) and streaming past broadcasts from my (cable)
broadcast provider.
My (2010) TV was a 'Smart TV' at the time, but its apps were no longer working/supported. By bying the Google TV Streamer 4K, I again have a
'smart' TV for a relatively low investment (EUR 119).
[...]--
Chris wrote:
Notice my assessments are based on documented facts (with cites).
Lol. You wouldn't know a fact even if it kicked you in the nuts.
And yet, I provided cites for every single fact I had stated, Chris.
Is Win 10 upgradable ? No. Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10 hardware.This is not really true.
And yet, I provided cites for every single fact I had stated, Chris.
Your cites are usually opinion pieces or don't actually support your assertions or both.
For example, your CISA "cite" doesn't match your claim.
Is Win 10 upgradable ? No. Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10This is not really true.
hardware.
See <https://www.zdnet.com/article/how-to-upgrade-your-incompatible-windows-10-pc-to-windows-11-for-free/>
I did this on one Ryzen 5 Windows 10 laptop we have and it worked just
fine.
Notice my assessments are based on documented facts
(with cites).
Show me once, for example, where I've stated something incorrect
And yet, I provided cites for every single fact I had stated, Chris.
sms,
Is Win 10 upgradable ? No. Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10This is not really true.
hardware.
See
<https://www.zdnet.com/article/how-to-upgrade-your-incompatible-windows-10-pc-to-windows-11-for-free/>
I did this on one Ryzen 5 Windows 10 laptop we have and it worked just
fine.
I don't think you ever noticed the title of that link.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
There is a good chance the CPU part is compatible....
There might some other issue.
None have TPM 2.0 and Secure boot. But those are only checked during the install. Neither are needed to actually RUN Windows 11.
Notice my assessments are based on documented facts
You have a history of claiming that and similar, but always "forgetting" to provide support for it. Your assurance here is therefore worth absolutily nothing.
You have a history of claiming that and similar, but always "forgetting"
to
provide support for it. Your assurance here is therefore worth
absolutily
nothing.
Name a single fact I stated in the post to Chris you feel is wrong.
Do you even understand the difference (between fact & assessment of fact)?
This is a fact:
iOS has had about 1-1/2 times the known exploits as had Android.
Note that it takes no brains to claim that cite
doesn't say that fact, but it takes actual intelligence to pull
the information out of that cite.
It takes nothing to refute facts, Rudy.
But it takes intelligence to comprehend facts, Rudy.
Arlen,<snip>
You have a history of claiming that and similar, but always
"forgetting" to provide support for it. Your assurance here is
therefore worth absolutily nothing.
Name a single fact I stated in the post to Chris you feel is wrong.
I'm sorry that you could not parse my post far enough to see that I
already gave you several. Not really my problem though.
On 2025-09-20 14:48, Tyrone wrote:
...
None have TPM 2.0 and Secure boot. But those are only checked during the
install. Neither are needed to actually RUN Windows 11.
Hum.
I have a W11 virtual machine on a vmware host running on Linux. One day
I needed to delete some files. Windows refused. Ok, boot Linux from a
CD and do it. But Linux CD would not boot, because failed key. Fine,
disable secure boot, then boot Linux CD, then delete the damn file,
finally reboot Windows.
Hey, this is funny, Windows has lost internet access. What...? Did I
delete something crucial? No, W11 decided that no secure boot implies networking is disabled, not secure.
Nobody needs to name a *single* "fact" that the village idiot "Arlen"
posts which is wrong ... when absolutely *EVERYTHING* that moron posts
is completely wrong!!-a-a Efyo
On 2025-09-20 14:48, Tyrone wrote:
...
None have TPM 2.0 and Secure boot. But those are only checked during the
install. Neither are needed to actually RUN Windows 11.
Hum.
I have a W11 virtual machine on a vmware host running on Linux. One day
I needed to delete some files. Windows refused. Ok, boot Linux from a CD
and do it. But Linux CD would not boot, because failed key. Fine,
disable secure boot, then boot Linux CD, then delete the damn file,
finally reboot Windows.
Hey, this is funny, Windows has lost internet access. What...? Did I
delete something crucial? No, W11 decided that no secure boot implies networking is disabled, not secure.
Chris wrote:
And yet, I provided cites for every single fact I had stated, Chris.
Your cites are usually opinion pieces or don't actually support your
assertions or both.
For example, your CISA "cite" doesn't match your claim.
The fact you call all these facts wrong is what you MAGA Apple trolls do.
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/10/apple-clarifies-security-update-policy-only-the-latest-oses-are-fully-patched/>
<https://blog.google/threat-analysis-group/state-backed-attackers-and-commercial-surveillance-vendors-repeatedly-use-the-same-exploits/>
<https://duo.com/decipher/apple-releases-fix-for-actively-exploited-webkit-bug>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2019/08/a-very-deep-dive-into-ios-exploit.html>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2019/08/the-many-possibilities-of-cve-2019-8646.html>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2020/09/jitsploitation-three.html> <https://hothardware.com/news/apple-admits-only-fully-patches-security-flaws-in-latest-os-releases>
<https://screenrant.com/apple-product-security-update-lifespan/> <https://support.apple.com/en-ph/guide/security/sec87fc038c2/web> <https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201224> <https://www.androidauthority.com/iphone-software-support-commitment-3449135/>
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog> <https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobile/samsung-extends-android-and-security-updates-to-7-years/>
<https://www.tomsguide.com/opinion/google-pixel-8-software-updates> <https://www.vice.com/en/article/google-project-zero-bugs-used-to-hack-iphones-and-android-phones/>
R.Wieser wrote:
Notice my assessments are based on documented facts
You have a history of claiming that and similar, but always "forgetting" to >> provide support for it. Your assurance here is therefore worth absolutily >> nothing.
Name a single fact I stated in the post to Chris you feel is wrong.
Do you even understand the difference (between fact & assessment of fact)?
This is a fact:
iOS has had about 1-1/2 times the known exploits as had Android.
This is a credible cite for that fact:
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
Note that it takes no brains to claim that cite doesn't say that fact, but
it takes actual intelligence to pull the information out of that cite.
On 2025-09-23 11:51:43 +0000, Carlos E.R. said:
On 2025-09-20 14:48, Tyrone wrote:
...
None have TPM 2.0 and Secure boot. But those are only checked during the >>> install. Neither are needed to actually RUN Windows 11.
Hum.
I have a W11 virtual machine on a vmware host running on Linux. One
day I needed to delete some files. Windows refused. Ok, boot Linux
from a CD and do it. But Linux CD would not boot, because failed key.
Fine, disable secure boot, then boot Linux CD, then delete the damn
file, finally reboot Windows.
Hey, this is funny, Windows has lost internet access. What...? Did I
delete something crucial? No, W11 decided that no secure boot implies
networking is disabled, not secure.
Windoze is cheap crap, it has always been cheap crap, and it will always
be cheap crap ...
Name a single fact I stated in the post to Chris you feel is wrong.
What is even the point? You never, ever accept anything. It's always deny, deflect, ignore. Always.
Do you even understand the difference (between fact & assessment of fact)? >>
This is a fact:
iOS has had about 1-1/2 times the known exploits as had Android.
Yet again you're wrong. That's an assertion or claim. Not a fact.
This is a credible cite for that fact:
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
No it isn't. Simply because you can't count and have never proven your assertion. Which ultimately makes it a lie.
Note that it takes no brains to claim that cite doesn't say that fact, but >> it takes actual intelligence to pull the information out of that cite.
Which you lack. As you've never shown your workings.
Plus the fact that you don't accept that CISA is not a source of absolute truth and therefore cannot be used to make absolute assertions.
An intelligent person would accept this and move on.
Name a single fact I stated in the post to Chris you feel is wrong.
What is even the point? You never, ever accept anything. It's always deny, deflect, ignore. Always.
Do you even understand the difference (between fact & assessment of fact)? >>
This is a fact:
iOS has had about 1-1/2 times the known exploits as had Android.
Yet again you're wrong. That's an assertion or claim. Not a fact.
This is a credible cite for that fact:
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
No it isn't. Simply because you can't count and have never proven your assertion. Which ultimately makes it a lie.
Note that it takes no brains to claim that cite doesn't say that fact, but >> it takes actual intelligence to pull the information out of that cite.
Which you lack. As you've never shown your workings.
Plus the fact that you don't accept that CISA is not a source of absolute truth and therefore cannot be used to make absolute assertions.
An intelligent person would accept this and move on.
For example, your CISA "cite" doesn't match your claim.
The fact you call all these facts wrong is what you MAGA Apple trolls do.
<then fails to post any facts>
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/10/apple-clarifies-security-update-policy-only-the-latest-oses-are-fully-patched/>
<https://blog.google/threat-analysis-group/state-backed-attackers-and-commercial-surveillance-vendors-repeatedly-use-the-same-exploits/>
<https://duo.com/decipher/apple-releases-fix-for-actively-exploited-webkit-bug>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2019/08/a-very-deep-dive-into-ios-exploit.html>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2019/08/the-many-possibilities-of-cve-2019-8646.html>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2020/09/jitsploitation-three.html> >> <https://hothardware.com/news/apple-admits-only-fully-patches-security-flaws-in-latest-os-releases>
<https://screenrant.com/apple-product-security-update-lifespan/>
<https://support.apple.com/en-ph/guide/security/sec87fc038c2/web>
<https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201224>
<https://www.androidauthority.com/iphone-software-support-commitment-3449135/>
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
<https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobile/samsung-extends-android-and-security-updates-to-7-years/>
<https://www.tomsguide.com/opinion/google-pixel-8-software-updates>
<https://www.vice.com/en/article/google-project-zero-bugs-used-to-hack-iphones-and-android-phones/>
If you think urls are facts, then this is a root cause of your failure to understand problem.
Chris wrote:
Name a single fact I stated in the post to Chris you feel is wrong.
What is even the point? You never, ever accept anything. It's always deny, >> deflect, ignore. Always.
You're the one who said every single fact was wrong, Chris. Not me.
Yet you can't name even one fact I had posted in this thread that's wrong.
This is a fact:
iOS has had about 1-1/2 times the known exploits as had Android.
Yet again you're wrong. That's an assertion or claim. Not a fact.
It's a fact Chris. It's right there in your face, Chris.
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
It's basic arithmetic math, Chris.
The fact you claim all math must be wrong that you don't know, simply means you're an Apple troll who can't even count the number of exploits listed.
Chris wrote:
<then fails to post any facts>For example, your CISA "cite" doesn't match your claim.
The fact you call all these facts wrong is what you MAGA Apple trolls do. >>
<https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/10/apple-clarifies-security-update-policy-only-the-latest-oses-are-fully-patched/>
<https://blog.google/threat-analysis-group/state-backed-attackers-and-commercial-surveillance-vendors-repeatedly-use-the-same-exploits/>
<https://duo.com/decipher/apple-releases-fix-for-actively-exploited-webkit-bug>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2019/08/a-very-deep-dive-into-ios-exploit.html>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2019/08/the-many-possibilities-of-cve-2019-8646.html>
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2020/09/jitsploitation-three.html> >>> <https://hothardware.com/news/apple-admits-only-fully-patches-security-flaws-in-latest-os-releases>
<https://screenrant.com/apple-product-security-update-lifespan/>
<https://support.apple.com/en-ph/guide/security/sec87fc038c2/web>
<https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201224>
<https://www.androidauthority.com/iphone-software-support-commitment-3449135/>
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
<https://www.cnet.com/tech/mobile/samsung-extends-android-and-security-updates-to-7-years/>
<https://www.tomsguide.com/opinion/google-pixel-8-software-updates>
<https://www.vice.com/en/article/google-project-zero-bugs-used-to-hack-iphones-and-android-phones/>
If you think urls are facts, then this is a root cause of your failure to
understand problem.
WTF? Jesus Christ, Chris.
Seriously. OMG.
You claim those facts reported in those cites are all not facts?
What kind of strange person does such a thing?
No adult would do that, Chris.
Not one.
Just you Apple trolls do that.
What is wrong with you Apple trolls?
No sensible adult would say what you just said.
Just you Apple trolls do that.
What's so wrong with you Apple trolls that you can't comprehend facts?
Chris wrote:
Name a single fact I stated in the post to Chris you feel is wrong.
What is even the point? You never, ever accept anything. It's always
deny,
deflect, ignore. Always.
Heh heh heh...
Apple trolls claim everything they simply can't understand, must be wrong.
I'm sorry that you could not parse my post far enough to see that<snip>
I already gave you several. Not really my problem though.
Nobody needs to name a *single* "fact" that the village idiot "Arlen"
posts which is wrong ... when absolutely *EVERYTHING* that moron posts is completely wrong!! :-\
Your Name wrote on 9/23/2025 3:18 PM:
On 2025-09-23 11:51:43 +0000, Carlos E.R. said:
On 2025-09-20 14:48, Tyrone wrote:
...
None have TPM 2.0 and Secure boot. But those are only checked during the >>>> install. Neither are needed to actually RUN Windows 11.
Hum.
I have a W11 virtual machine on a vmware host running on Linux. One day I needed to delete some files. Windows refused. Ok, boot Linux from a CD and do it. But Linux CD would not boot, because failed key. Fine, disable secure boot, then boot Linux CD, then delete the damn file, finally reboot Windows.
Hey, this is funny, Windows has lost internet access. What...? Did I delete something crucial? No, W11 decided that no secure boot implies networking is disabled, not secure.
Windoze is cheap crap, it has always been cheap crap, and it will always be cheap crap ...
That's why Linus RULEZ Dood!
And Apple!
sms,
Is Win 10 upgradable ? No. Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10This is not really true.
hardware.
See
<https://www.zdnet.com/article/how-to-upgrade-your-incompatible-windows-10-pc-to-windows-11-for-free/>
I did this on one Ryzen 5 Windows 10 laptop we have and it worked just
fine.
I don't think you ever noticed the title of that link.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
LOL, you stated " Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10
hardware."
That is untrue. What is true is that it requires a workaround.
What's so wrong with you Apple trolls that you can't comprehend facts?
Again, you've proven me correct. You simply do not understand how to make a cogent argument. Try going back to college to learn and/or get a book to
help you. Take a picture of it if it that's what you need.
What's so wrong with you Apple trolls that you can't comprehend facts?
Again, you've proven me correct. You simply do not understand how to make a cogent argument. Try going back to college to learn and/or get a book to
help you. Take a picture of it if it that's what you need.
You never respond to those, of course: deny, deflect, ignore.
You never respond to those, of course: deny, deflect, ignore.
Chris wrote:
You never respond to those, of course: deny, deflect, ignore.
Just responding to your crap, wastes my valuable time & that
of others.
You Apple trolls claim the earth is flat.
To be clear, a few of the non-Apple trolls do what you Apple...
trolls do.
Rudy Wieser...
Arlen,
Chris wrote:
You never respond to those, of course: deny, deflect, ignore.
Just responding to your crap, wastes my valuable time & that
of others.
No arlen, just yours.
Than again, *everyone* wastes your time when they do not agree with you.
You Apple trolls claim the earth is flat.
You must have a rather sore thumb with always sucking "facts" like that outof it.
To be clear, a few of the non-Apple trolls do what you Apple...
trolls do.
Rudy Wieser...
Phew, I was a bit afraid that I *wouldn't* be in your "bad person" list.
Hey, I've shown you time-and-again that I don't believe your "facts",
claims and now "assessments", so I deserve to be in it. :-)
By the way, did you ever figure out what a "cite" is supposed to be
looking like ?
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Chris wrote:
You never respond to those, of course: deny, deflect, ignore.
Just responding to your crap, wastes my valuable time & that of others.
On 2025-09-24 18:05:46 +0000, R.Wieser said:
Arlen,
Chris wrote:
You never respond to those, of course: deny, deflect, ignore.
Just responding to your crap, wastes my valuable time & that
of others.
No arlen, just yours.
Than again, *everyone* wastes your time when they do not agree with you.
You Apple trolls claim the earth is flat.
You must have a rather sore thumb with always sucking "facts" like
that outof it.
"thumb"?!?
He gets all his "facts" out of his backside / bumhole, just like Trump
the Chump, who is probably the village idiot Arlen's idol.
To be clear, a few of the non-Apple trolls do what you Apple...
trolls do.
Rudy Wieser...
Phew, I was a bit afraid that I *wouldn't* be in your "bad person" list.
Hey, I've shown you time-and-again that I don't believe your "facts",
claims and now "assessments", so I deserve to be in it. :-)
By the way, did you ever figure out what a "cite" is supposed to be
looking like ?
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
On Sep 23, 2025 at 7:51:43rC>AM EDT, ""Carlos E.R."" <robin_listas@es.invalid>
wrote:
On 2025-09-20 14:48, Tyrone wrote:
...
None have TPM 2.0 and Secure boot. But those are only checked during the >>> install. Neither are needed to actually RUN Windows 11.
Hum.
I have a W11 virtual machine on a vmware host running on Linux. One day
I needed to delete some files. Windows refused. Ok, boot Linux from a CD
and do it. But Linux CD would not boot, because failed key. Fine,
disable secure boot, then boot Linux CD, then delete the damn file,
finally reboot Windows.
Hey, this is funny, Windows has lost internet access. What...? Did I
delete something crucial? No, W11 decided that no secure boot implies
networking is disabled, not secure.
Not sure what any of that has to do with anything I stated. Sounds like a problem with your VM.
The fact is, I am running Windows 11 on several 10 year old (and older) PCs. The whole point of Rufus is to remove the checks for TPM 2.0 and Secure Boot during the install. Many other people are doing the same thing. Rest assured that a Lenovo IdeaPad Z710 with a 4th gen i7 does not have Secure Boot or TPM 2.0. It does have UEFI boot. It is running Windows 11 24H2 just fine.--
sms,Not sure what upside you see in lying, but whatever lights your board.
LOL, you stated " Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10
hardware."
That is untrue. What is true is that it requires a workaround.
Noipe, that statement is quite true.
That you refuse Win 11's refusal (and force it) doesn't mean that it isn't a refusal I'm afraid.
And that refusal is what most users* will ever see when they press the "upgrade to win 11" button.
* the few technically inclined users like you excepted.
Not sure what upside you see in lying, but whatever lights your board....
Had I upgraded to Window 11 as soon as it was available, no workaround
would have been required since Microsoft didn't even require TPM for
Windows 11 until December 3, 2024
Took me all of five minutes to a) Google the workaround, and b) perform
it.
He sure hates apples.
You must have a rather sore thumb with always sucking "facts" like that
outof it.
"thumb"?!?
He gets all his "facts" out of his backside / bumhole,
just like Trump the Chump, who is probably the village idiot Arlen's idol.
On 9/24/2025 8:45 AM, R.Wieser wrote:
sms,Not sure what upside you see in lying, but whatever lights your board.
LOL, you stated " Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10
hardware."
That is untrue. What is true is that it requires a workaround.
Noipe, that statement is quite true.
That you refuse Win 11's refusal (and force it) doesn't mean that it isn't a >> refusal I'm afraid.
And that refusal is what most users* will ever see when they press the
"upgrade to win 11" button.
* the few technically inclined users like you excepted.
I ran into this whole thing two weeks ago when my wife asked me to upgrade her HP laptop to Windows 11 from Windows 10 because she was having an issue running an application in Windows 10. TPM was not built into her laptop which is about four years old.
Took me all of five minutes to a) Google the workaround, and b) perform it.
Had I upgraded to Window 11 as soon as it was available, no workaround would have been required since Microsoft didn't even require TPM for Windows 11 until December 3, 2024, more than three years after it was launched, I just never bothered to do the upgrade sooner.
Actually, it's the Mac that requires a much more complicated workaround to install the latest version of OS-X, using the OpenCore Legacy Patcher. I've done this too! See <https://www.reddit.com/r/mac/comments/1ilxd9o/how_to_install_macos_ventura_or_newer_on_an_older/>.
Certainly I wish that Microsoft and Apple didn't make these upgrades require a workaround, but it's understandable that the hardware requirements change.
Arlen,
Chris wrote:
Name a single fact I stated in the post to Chris you feel is wrong.
What is even the point? You never, ever accept anything. It's always
deny,
deflect, ignore. Always.
Heh heh heh...
Apple trolls claim everything they simply can't understand, must be wrong.
Heh heh heh...
Arlen is the troll who refuses to even respond to anything he simply can't understand - and therefore it - must be wrong.
Funny how such accusations work two ways, isn't it ? :-)
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Rudy, if you don't mind .... who is this 'Chris' that 'Arlen'/'Marion'
is replying to??
Is 'Chris' posting to one of the phone groups (iphone/andriod) but I'm
not seeing that actual post in the Win-10 group, just 'Arlen'/'Marion' quoting of them??
Rudy, if you don't mind .... who is this 'Chris' that 'Arlen'/'Marion' is replying to??
Is 'Chris' posting to one of the phone groups (iphone/andriod) but I'm not seeing that actual post in the Win-10 group, just 'Arlen'/'Marion' quoting of them??
Strange though that in this, the alt.comp.os.windows-10 newsgroup,
several posts of arlen aimed at Chris seem to have a post of mine as its parent ...
Is 'Chris' posting to one of the phone groups (iphone/andriod) but I'm
not seeing that actual post in the Win-10 group, just 'Arlen'/'Marion'
quoting of them??
Chris is
So, whats the lie again ?
Daniel70,
Rudy, if you don't mind .... who is this 'Chris' that 'Arlen'/'Marion' is >> replying to??
I /assume/ its a real person ... :-)
The last post of his in this, the alt.comp.os.windows-10 newsgroup seems to be at Sunday, September 21, 2025 00:36 .
Is 'Chris' posting to one of the phone groups (iphone/andriod) but I'm not >> seeing that actual post in the Win-10 group, just 'Arlen'/'Marion' quoting >> of them??
I just took a peek at both newsgroups, but there is something funny going on. I can see a whole subtree of posts between the two starting at Fri, 19 Sep 2025 22:08:42 UTC in comp.mobile.android, but can't find the same back in alt.comp.os.windows-10.
Than again, Chris has made several attempts to remove the alt.comp.os.windows-10 newsgroup, only to have arlen re-add it. That might something to do with it I guess.
So, whats the lie again ?
No change.
"Win 11 *refuses* to be installed on Win 10 hardware. You're stuck
with it until you buy new hardware."
It's not true. You're not "stuck" with Windows 10. There's a simple solution.
You can cite a fact to Apple trolls a thousand times & they deny it
exists.
They even claim you never gave them that cite before denying it exists.
Than again, Chris has made several attempts to remove the
alt.comp.os.windows-10 newsgroup, only to have arlen re-add it.
That might something to do with it I guess.
Absolutely. I removed win10 because the discussion - I use that term
loosely - was irrelevant to that ng.
Marion just likes to share his idiocy far and wide...
My argument is that Apple support is the *worst* in the industry.
While the trolls (who know nothing about the topic at hand) troll,
these are on-topic facts about the TRUTH of operating system support.
These are proven cited facts we covered in depth already on this thread.
1. *iOS written legally-obligated promised full support is far shorter*
than that of Google/Samsung flagships (i.e., about 1/3rd shorter).
Windows takes the cake though, in terms of years of full support.
<https://www.androidauthority.com/iphone-software-support-commitment-3449135/>
2. *iOS has had 1-1/2 times the known exploits as Android has had.*
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
(But Windows takes the cake many times over in terms of exploits).
<https://blog.ostorlab.co/known_exploitable_vulnerabilities_catching_them_all.html>
3. *Apple has never fully supported more than a single release* while
every other major OS OEM has fully supported multiple releases.
<https://support.apple.com/en-ca/guide/deployment/depc4c80847a/web>
Android takes the cake here but Windows isn't too shoddy either.
Keeping on topic and not responding to the trolls who can only subtract
value since they know nothing about the topic, here is yet another
well-cited fact about Apple's astoundingly atrocious QA process.
4. *Large portions of the iOS code have never once been through testing!*
Google Project Zero - A very deep dive into iOS Exploit chains found in the wild <https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2019/08/a-very-deep-dive-into-ios-exploit.html>
"We'll see cases of code which seems to have never worked, code that
likely skipped QA or likely had little testing or review before being
shipped to users."
This is explicit acknowledgement that significant portions of iOS shipped with untested or nonfunctional code.
Google Threat Analysis Group - State-backed attackers and commercial surveillance vendors repeatedly use the same exploits <https://blog.google/threat-analysis-group/state-backed-attackers-and-commercial-surveillance-vendors-repeatedly-use-the-same-exploits/>
"In each iteration of the watering hole campaigns, the attackers used exploits that were identical or strikingly similar to exploits previously used by commercial surveillance vendors."
Project Zero - JITSploitation: Three zero-days and one cached JIT spray
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2020/09/jitsploitation-three.html> "This three-part series highlights the technical challenges involved in finding and exploiting JavaScript engine vulnerabilities in modern web browsers and evaluates current exploit mitigation technologies."
This shows Apple's mitigations weren-at catching known exploit patterns.
Vice - Google Project Zero bugs used to hack iPhones and Android phones <https://www.vice.com/en/article/google-project-zero-bugs-used-to-hack-iphones-and-android-phones>
"Researchers at Google's Project Zero uncovered vulnerabilities in WebKit
and JIT engines that were quietly patched by Apple and Google after being exploited in the wild."
The need for third-party researchers to find and exploit these flaws indicates they were not caught by Apple's in-house testing.
In summary, above are FACTS which the trolls can't understand nor dispute. But those facts play into my assessment *iOS is the worst supported OS*.
Hi Chris,
Keeping on topic,
what do you make of this graph from the CISA data?
<https://blog.ostorlab.co/static/img/2024_01_10_Known_exploitable_vulnerabilities/distribution_of_RE_NRE_CVES.png>
REFERENCE:
*Ostorlab Known Exploitable Vulnerabilities: Catching them all*
<https://blog.ostorlab.co/known_exploitable_vulnerabilities_catching_them_all.html>
Marion <marionf@fact.com> wrote:
My argument is that Apple support is the *worst* in the industry.
While the trolls (who know nothing about the topic at hand) troll,
these are on-topic facts about the TRUTH of operating system support.
Shouting doesn't make your errors or lies any more true.
These are proven cited facts we covered in depth already on this thread.
1. *iOS written legally-obligated promised full support is far shorter*
than that of Google/Samsung flagships (i.e., about 1/3rd shorter).
Windows takes the cake though, in terms of years of full support.
<https://www.androidauthority.com/iphone-software-support-commitment-3449135/>
Factcheck: ambiguous. There's no "legal obligation" required here and the quoted support timelines are minimums.
2. *iOS has had 1-1/2 times the known exploits as Android has had.*
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
You have been told and corrected many times that that claim is not
supported by the URL and you *never* show your workings.
Factcheck: does not support claim.
(But Windows takes the cake many times over in terms of exploits).
<https://blog.ostorlab.co/known_exploitable_vulnerabilities_catching_them_all.html>
You're conflating Microsoft/Apple with Windows/iOS. If you actually looking at the CISA link you boringly post all the time you'd see the difference.
NB: remember that searching for "iOS" also finds cisco's IOS and FortiOS.
Factcheck: does not support the claim.
3. *Apple has never fully supported more than a single release* while
every other major OS OEM has fully supported multiple releases.
<https://support.apple.com/en-ca/guide/deployment/depc4c80847a/web>
Android takes the cake here but Windows isn't too shoddy either.
Your link contradicts you. The very bottom table shows that iOS 18.7 and
iOS 26 are both fully supported until 15th December.
Factcheck: does not support the claim.
Keeping on topic and not responding to the trolls who can only subtract
value since they know nothing about the topic, here is yet another
well-cited fact about Apple's astoundingly atrocious QA process.
4. *Large portions of the iOS code have never once been through testing!*
Google Project Zero - A very deep dive into iOS Exploit chains found in the >> wild
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2019/08/a-very-deep-dive-into-ios-exploit.html>
"We'll see cases of code which seems to have never worked, code that
likely skipped QA or likely had little testing or review before being
shipped to users."
This is explicit acknowledgement that significant portions of iOS shipped
with untested or nonfunctional code.
Google Threat Analysis Group - State-backed attackers and commercial
surveillance vendors repeatedly use the same exploits
<https://blog.google/threat-analysis-group/state-backed-attackers-and-commercial-surveillance-vendors-repeatedly-use-the-same-exploits/>
"In each iteration of the watering hole campaigns, the attackers used
exploits that were identical or strikingly similar to exploits previously
used by commercial surveillance vendors."
Project Zero - JITSploitation: Three zero-days and one cached JIT spray
<https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2020/09/jitsploitation-three.html> >> "This three-part series highlights the technical challenges involved in
finding and exploiting JavaScript engine vulnerabilities in modern web
browsers and evaluates current exploit mitigation technologies."
This shows Apple's mitigations weren-at catching known exploit patterns.
Vice - Google Project Zero bugs used to hack iPhones and Android phones
<https://www.vice.com/en/article/google-project-zero-bugs-used-to-hack-iphones-and-android-phones>
"Researchers at Google's Project Zero uncovered vulnerabilities in WebKit
and JIT engines that were quietly patched by Apple and Google after being
exploited in the wild."
The need for third-party researchers to find and exploit these flaws
indicates they were not caught by Apple's in-house testing.
factcheck: claim it's overblown with respect to very detailed and narrow analyses.
In summary, above are FACTS which the trolls can't understand nor dispute. >> But those facts play into my assessment *iOS is the worst supported OS*.
None of your above claims are facts. Plus your global claim is a
comparative statement ("worst"). 3-4 of your claims only relate to iOS and make no relative judgement compared to other OSes. Your sources cannot say whether iOS is better or worse than the others.
In summary, as per usual, you're talking out of your arse.
Factcheck: stated claim is narrowly focused and doesn't acknowledge obvious strengths in Apple support and weaknesses in Android support.
Chris wrote:
Factcheck: stated claim is narrowly focused and doesn't acknowledge obvious >> strengths in Apple support and weaknesses in Android support.
The models to compare the $1000 iPhone to aren't the $35 Androids, Chris.
FACTS:
*Apple finally confirms how long it will support iPhones*
*(5 years) & it's less than Samsung & Google (7 years)
<https://www.androidauthority.com/iphone-software-support-commitment-3449135/>
Marion <marionf@fact.com> wrote:
Chris wrote:
Factcheck: stated claim is narrowly focused and doesn't acknowledge obvious >>> strengths in Apple support and weaknesses in Android support.
The models to compare the $1000 iPhone to aren't the $35 Androids, Chris.
Oh, Arlen! You've been doing well lately, but now regressed to your old
ways.
We've been through this. You're comparing your "free" entry level android with a very much non-free premium iphone. We all know you got an almost
free iphone at around the same time so you also know you should be
comparing your $35 galaxy A-32 to your $58 (iirc?) iphone 12 (mini?).
FACTS:
*Apple finally confirms how long it will support iPhones*
*(5 years) & it's less than Samsung & Google (7 years)
<https://www.androidauthority.com/iphone-software-support-commitment-3449135/>
Alslo FACTS:
Your galaxy is no longer supported by Samsung (since February) and that iphone - if you still had it - is still fully supported by Apple. And
likely will be for another two years. Looks like if you wanted a phone with longterm support you returned the wrong one.
The link above puts it really well:
"Some iPhones have received security updates six or more years after the initial release, which is far more support than the vast majority of
Android devices receive."
b. The promised support for competing Android flagships is 40% longer.
Your brain can't separate that it's two completely DIFFERENT arguments!
a. The $35 phone runs more software functionality than a $1000 iPhone.
b. The promised support for competing Android flagships is 40% longer.
This is (one reason) why I assess that Apple trolls lack formal education
On 30/09/2025 2:55 am, Marion wrote:
<Snip>
Your brain can't separate that it's two completely DIFFERENT arguments!
a. The $35 phone runs more software functionality than a $1000 iPhone.
b. The promised support for competing Android flagships is 40% longer.
This is (one reason) why I assess that Apple trolls lack formal education
*IF* you are happy with the functionality of your $35 Android phone .... GREAT ..... but why, oh, why do you have to go on and on and on about it??
If other people want to waste *THEIR* money, why worry about it??
Your brain can't separate that it's two completely DIFFERENT arguments!*IF* you are happy with the functionality of your $35 Android phone ....
a. The $35 phone runs more software functionality than a $1000 iPhone.
b. The promised support for competing Android flagships is 40% longer.
This is (one reason) why I assess that Apple trolls lack formal education >>>
GREAT ..... but why, oh, why do you have to go on and on and on about it?? >>
If other people want to waste *THEIR* money, why worry about it??
Discussion for the sake of discussion is one thing but at a certain
point it feels like mindless trolling for the sake of getting a rise. I worry that some people never progressed past the temptation to say "my
dad can beat up your dad!"
Depends on how you define "software functionality". iOS allows apps to
bind ports below 1024 without root access in contrast to Android.
popular apps like messengers, banking, social media stuff, navigation,
media players, streaming, shopping etc. are usually available for iOS
and Android likewise since no big company can afford not to support both platforms.
Recently Apple was also forced to allow third-party app
stores - it may not be as flexible as Android which allows even to
download malware from any website and install it, but it's a step to
more flexibility nevertheless.
Also a lot of software available for Android phones is just garbage.
Just counting the number of available apps in the respective app stores
makes little sense.
Having millions of games or stupid apps which just
got created to make money with ads or "in-app purchases" is not an
advantage on it's own.
b. The promised support for competing Android flagships is 40% longer.
Is it? Google provides 7 years of updates for the Pixel 10 Pro. Apple supports iPhones also around 7 years - that's why you can still get
updates for the iPhone 11 Pro which was released 6 years ago in 2019.
<https://endoflife.date/pixel>
<https://endoflife.date/iphone>
In article <10bgcls$3kjar$1@dont-email.me>,
Daniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 30/09/2025 2:55 am, Marion wrote:
<Snip>
Your brain can't separate that it's two completely DIFFERENT arguments!*IF* you are happy with the functionality of your $35 Android phone ....
a. The $35 phone runs more software functionality than a $1000 iPhone.
b. The promised support for competing Android flagships is 40% longer.
This is (one reason) why I assess that Apple trolls lack formal education >>>
GREAT ..... but why, oh, why do you have to go on and on and on about it?? >>
If other people want to waste *THEIR* money, why worry about it??
Discussion for the sake of discussion is one thing but at a certain
point it feels like mindless trolling for the sake of getting a rise. I
worry that some people never progressed past the temptation to say "my
dad can beat up your dad!"
On 2025-09-30 16:02:55 +0000, Smithwicks said:
In article <10bgcls$3kjar$1@dont-email.me>,
aDaniel70 <daniel47@nomail.afraid.org> wrote:
On 30/09/2025 2:55 am, Marion wrote:
<Snip>
Your brain can't separate that it's two completely DIFFERENT arguments! >>>> a. The $35 phone runs more software functionality than a $1000 iPhone. >>>> b. The promised support for competing Android flagships is 40% longer. >>>>*IF* you are happy with the functionality of your $35 Android phone .... >>> GREAT ..... but why, oh, why do you have to go on and on and on about
This is (one reason) why I assess that Apple trolls lack formal
education
it??
If other people want to waste *THEIR* money, why worry about it??
Discussion for the sake of discussion is one thing but at a certain
point it feels like mindless trolling for the sake of getting a rise. I
worry that some people never progressed past the temptation to say "my
dad can beat up your dad!"
Arlen's "dad" is apparently a slow piece of el cheapo Android crap with
five year old tech inside it and he's never even seen Apple's "dad".
