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According to physics, time travel is NOT ruled out
completely.
We do not know how to travel through time. The means may
actually be entirely theoretical. In fact, right now they
ARE entirely theoretical. For us. But...
This is not at all similar to the case of Faster Than Light
travel.
Our physics rule it out.
It's not possible, traveling faster than the speed of light,
according to everything we know. Which means we are in this
ridiculous position of arguing magic, or we rule out Faster
Than Light travel.
i think faster than light travel indirectly will be possible. general relativity is not the end of the story.
According to physics, time travel is NOT ruled out
completely.
We do not know how to travel through time. The means may
actually be entirely theoretical. In fact, right now they
ARE entirely theoretical. For us. But...
This is not at all similar to the case of Faster Than Light
travel.
Our physics rule it out.
It's not possible, traveling faster than the speed of light,
according to everything we know. Which means we are in this
ridiculous position of arguing magic, or we rule out Faster
Than Light travel.
So, why would an alien race invest insane amounts of capital
into coming here, if one presumes it's beyond a dumb probe,
if there is literally zero hope of any return?
Think about it.
At the speed of light, AT LEAST 99% of our galaxy is more
than a thousand years away. So if they could get here at the
speed of light, their first return signal would be reaching
them back home after 2,000 years, by which time there would
be no guarantee that anyone would even be aware that there
is a signal, much less how to read it.
Of course, grasping this model, 75% of our galaxy would be
AT LEAST 25,000 light years away....
So one you understand that Faster Than Light travel is
impossible -- not a mystery, the question has been solved
and it's impossible -- sending anything here is either some
cheap Voyager type probe or...
The only reason to come here beyond some dumb probe is...
The only thing that could make it word their while...
The only way they might expect a return on their investment
is...
Is if it's a Seek-and-Destroy mission.
That's it.
The investment to get here would be so large, and there
would be so much time between launching and receiving so
much as data in return that the people sending it couldn't
even count on having descendants, much less seeing a return
on their investment. UNLESS it was a Seek-and-Destroy mission.
To help you understand this:
There is no family on earth that can reliably trace it's
heritage back even 2,000 years.
Oh there's claims but no records to back up those claims.
If you don't believe in a literally true Old Testament bible,
for instance, you can cross one of those families right off
the list. And if you scratch out Japanese mythology, there
goes another... on & on.
Like I said, there are families that claim to trace their
lineage back 2,000 years or more, but they are on less solid
footage than Elizabeth Warren's native roots...
WHOLE ETHNICITY have vanished in the last few thousand years.
When was the last time you met a Vandal or a Goth? They were
real people. They were a genuine ethnicity, they were an
identity just as real as "Mexican" or "Italian" is today.
"Ancient Egypt lasted 3 thousand years!"
No it didn't. It collapsed three times BEFORE the 1st century
A.D.
Money itself only goes back about 2,600 years. There was
trade, gold was valuable and highly sought after, all
true, but money wasn't around until about 600 B.C.
The time scales we are talking about here, moving across
even a small percentage of the galaxy, are off the human
charts...
But, if your objective is to destroy other civilizations,
you have an excellent chance at a return on your investment.
See, even if your civilization collapses, even if you nation
state, your ethnicity, your language and religion -- your
identity -- is long gone, your planet still benefits if any
potential threat is wiped out.
That's what we're talking about here:-a Eliminating threats.
Another civilization is a potential threat to your
civilization, so wipe it out.
No more threat.
And if you get there and wipe them out BEFORE they achieve
interstellar travel?-a So much the better!
The only "Problem" is if you wipe them out too late. You
can wipe them out as early as is convenient.
So, if you're an alien race and you haven't mistaken Star
Trek for a documentary, you know that arriving here would
require a massive investment, one that you could not
possibly ever see a return on. Unless you kill us. Then if
your species still exists, even if it collapsed itself back
into a stone age, it still benefits. You still reap the
reward:-a SAFE from the threat of an alien species!
On 8/6/2025 1:34 AM, JTEM wrote:
According to physics, time travel is NOT ruled out
completely.
We do not know how to travel through time. The means may
actually be entirely theoretical. In fact, right now they
ARE entirely theoretical. For us. But...
This is not at all similar to the case of Faster Than Light
travel.
Our physics rule it out.
It's not possible, traveling faster than the speed of light,
according to everything we know. Which means we are in this
ridiculous position of arguing magic, or we rule out Faster
Than Light travel.
So, why would an alien race invest insane amounts of capital
into coming here, if one presumes it's beyond a dumb probe,
if there is literally zero hope of any return?
Think about it.
At the speed of light, AT LEAST 99% of our galaxy is more
than a thousand years away. So if they could get here at the
speed of light, their first return signal would be reaching
them back home after 2,000 years, by which time there would
be no guarantee that anyone would even be aware that there
is a signal, much less how to read it.
Of course, grasping this model, 75% of our galaxy would be
AT LEAST 25,000 light years away....
So one you understand that Faster Than Light travel is
impossible -- not a mystery, the question has been solved
and it's impossible -- sending anything here is either some
cheap Voyager type probe or...
The only reason to come here beyond some dumb probe is...
The only thing that could make it word their while...
The only way they might expect a return on their investment
is...
Is if it's a Seek-and-Destroy mission.
That's it.
The investment to get here would be so large, and there
would be so much time between launching and receiving so
much as data in return that the people sending it couldn't
even count on having descendants, much less seeing a return
on their investment. UNLESS it was a Seek-and-Destroy mission.
To help you understand this:
There is no family on earth that can reliably trace it's
heritage back even 2,000 years.
Oh there's claims but no records to back up those claims.
If you don't believe in a literally true Old Testament bible,
for instance, you can cross one of those families right off
the list. And if you scratch out Japanese mythology, there
goes another... on & on.
Like I said, there are families that claim to trace their
lineage back 2,000 years or more, but they are on less solid
footage than Elizabeth Warren's native roots...
WHOLE ETHNICITY have vanished in the last few thousand years.
When was the last time you met a Vandal or a Goth? They were
real people. They were a genuine ethnicity, they were an
identity just as real as "Mexican" or "Italian" is today.
"Ancient Egypt lasted 3 thousand years!"
No it didn't. It collapsed three times BEFORE the 1st century
A.D.
Money itself only goes back about 2,600 years. There was
trade, gold was valuable and highly sought after, all
true, but money wasn't around until about 600 B.C.
The time scales we are talking about here, moving across
even a small percentage of the galaxy, are off the human
charts...
But, if your objective is to destroy other civilizations,
you have an excellent chance at a return on your investment.
See, even if your civilization collapses, even if you nation
state, your ethnicity, your language and religion -- your
identity -- is long gone, your planet still benefits if any
potential threat is wiped out.
That's what we're talking about here:-a Eliminating threats.
Another civilization is a potential threat to your
civilization, so wipe it out.
No more threat.
And if you get there and wipe them out BEFORE they achieve
interstellar travel?-a So much the better!
The only "Problem" is if you wipe them out too late. You
can wipe them out as early as is convenient.
So, if you're an alien race and you haven't mistaken Star
Trek for a documentary, you know that arriving here would
require a massive investment, one that you could not
possibly ever see a return on. Unless you kill us. Then if
your species still exists, even if it collapsed itself back
into a stone age, it still benefits. You still reap the
reward:-a SAFE from the threat of an alien species!
Aliens are here, and they are controlling your mind.
Dawn
Aliens areAgain, you keep repeating your disorder here.