From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

This is now the last updated version of Windows 10 Pro that I am aware of
for those of us who never created the MSA (for obvious privacy reasons).

ver

Microsoft Windows [Version 10.0.19045.6456]

winver

Version 22H2 (OS Build 19045.6456) Windows 10 Pro

Runbox > control update > Update & security > Windows Update
Your version of windows has reached the end of support
Look for the banner or message that says
"Your version of Windows has reached end of support".
Enroll in Extended Security Updates
"Enroll now"
Sign in with your Microsoft account.
Choose a plan:
Free option (requires backing up your data to MS OneDrive)
Paid option ($30/year)

Unfortunately for me...
1. I don't have an MSA (for privacy reasons!)
2. I don't back up data on the net (for privacy reasons!)
3. I don't pay for anything on the net (for privacy reasons!)
4. If I do create an MSA, I'll use protonmail or tutanoa to do that.
5. What matters now is figuring out the LEAST to back up to MS OneDrive.

Any ideas for extended support that preserve some semblance of privacy?

The best "plan" can come up with on my own, without your help yet, is:
1. Create a protonmail email address a month ago
Each day, send an innocuous email & respond to any replies.
2. Press the "Create the MSA" button in the form that shows up above.
3. After signing in, go to Settings > Privacy
4. Turn off everything under "Activity history," "Diagnostics," & "Sync."

This takes about a month to perform successfully, so it's best to plan
ahead by creating a Protonmail account and sending/receiving innocuous
emails for about a month as Protonmail will permanently block the account
from receiving "registration" emails if you start registering right away.
(Ask me how I found that out.)

If we choose the free ESU option, Microsoft requires us to back up some
data to OneDrive. To meet the minimum requirement while preserving privacy:

1. Create a new folder, name it something like "ESU Backup".
2. In that folder, create an empty text file, like "placeholder.txt".
3. Open Settings > Accounts > Windows Backup.
4. Sign in with your Microsoft account (created a month ago).
5. Choose to back up only that one folder to OneDrive.
This satisfies the backup requirement with zero personal data.

Is this the easiest/least expensive method to garner extended support?

Below is what my current hotfix version is, which I suspect is similar for anyone on Windows 10 as of today given we had our last midnight update.

Check Windows Update History

wmic qfe list brief /format:table

or

Get-HotFix | Sort-Object InstalledOn -Descending

As admin:

Get-HotFix | Sort-Object InstalledOn -Descending

Description HotFixID InstalledBy InstalledOn
----------- -------- ----------- -----------
Security Update KB5066790 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/15/2025 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5066791 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/15/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5066130 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/14/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5063979 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 09/10/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5063261 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 07/25/2025 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5063706 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 07/09/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5059504 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 06/11/2025 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5058526 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/14/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5054682 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/09/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5052916 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 03/12/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5050111 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 02/12/2025 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5050388 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 01/15/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5046823 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/13/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5043130 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/13/2024 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5043935 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 09/11/2024 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5041579 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/14/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5039336 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 07/10/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5037995 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 06/06/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5037240 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/15/2024 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5037018 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/17/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5036447 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 03/13/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5034224 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 02/13/2024 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5034441 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 01/20/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5032907 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/13/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5032392 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/14/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5031540 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/01/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5011048 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/31/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5030841 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/31/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5031539 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/30/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5015684 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/30/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5026879 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 06/15/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5025315 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/10/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5023794 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/12/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5022924 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 03/15/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5020372 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/14/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5018506 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/09/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5016705 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/22/2022 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5012170 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/09/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5015895 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/06/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5014671 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 07/12/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5014035 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 06/15/2022 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5014032 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/11/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5003791 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/15/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5011651 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/12/2022 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5011352 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 02/14/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5007273 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/17/2021 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5006753 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/18/2021 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5005699 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 09/15/2021 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB4589212 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 03/12/2021 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB4577586 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 02/17/2021 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4598481 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 01/13/2021 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB4562830 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/27/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4593175 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/10/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4586864 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/10/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4580325 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/13/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4577266 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 09/10/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4570334 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/15/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4561600 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/15/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4557968 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/11/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4537759 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/11/2020 12:00:00 AM

The first three lines above confirm that the Windows 10 Pro system
received three updates yesterday 2025, including two security updates:
KB5066790 (Security Update) - Installed 10/15/2025
KB5066791 (Security Update) - Installed 10/15/2025
KB5066130 (Update) - Installed 10/14/2025

These are likely the final cumulative & security patches for Windows 10 now that support has ended, unless a privacy-robbing MSA account is created.

Any ideas for extended support that preserve some semblance of privacy?











--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On 10/15/2025 7:06 AM, Marion wrote:

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

This is now the last updated version of Windows 10 Pro that I am aware of
for those of us who never created the MSA (for obvious privacy reasons).
C:\> ver
Microsoft Windows [Version 10.0.19045.6456]
C:\> winver
Version 22H2 (OS Build 19045.6456) Windows 10 Pro

Runbox > control update > Update & security > Windows Update
Your version of windows has reached the end of support
Look for the banner or message that says
"Your version of Windows has reached end of support".
Enroll in Extended Security Updates
"Enroll now"
Sign in with your Microsoft account.
Choose a plan:
Free option (requires backing up your data to MS OneDrive)
Paid option ($30/year)

Unfortunately for me...
1. I don't have an MSA (for privacy reasons!)
2. I don't back up data on the net (for privacy reasons!)
3. I don't pay for anything on the net (for privacy reasons!)
4. If I do create an MSA, I'll use protonmail or tutanoa to do that.
5. What matters now is figuring out the LEAST to back up to MS OneDrive.

Any ideas for extended support that preserve some semblance of privacy?

The best "plan" can come up with on my own, without your help yet, is:
1. Create a protonmail email address a month ago
Each day, send an innocuous email & respond to any replies.
2. Press the "Create the MSA" button in the form that shows up above.
3. After signing in, go to Settings > Privacy
4. Turn off everything under "Activity history," "Diagnostics," & "Sync."

This takes about a month to perform successfully, so it's best to plan
ahead by creating a Protonmail account and sending/receiving innocuous
emails for about a month as Protonmail will permanently block the account from receiving "registration" emails if you start registering right away. (Ask me how I found that out.)

If we choose the free ESU option, Microsoft requires us to back up some
data to OneDrive. To meet the minimum requirement while preserving privacy:

1. Create a new folder, name it something like "ESU Backup".
2. In that folder, create an empty text file, like "placeholder.txt".
3. Open Settings > Accounts > Windows Backup.
4. Sign in with your Microsoft account (created a month ago).
5. Choose to back up only that one folder to OneDrive.
This satisfies the backup requirement with zero personal data.

Is this the easiest/least expensive method to garner extended support?

Below is what my current hotfix version is, which I suspect is similar for anyone on Windows 10 as of today given we had our last midnight update.

Check Windows Update History
C:\> wmic qfe list brief /format:table
or
PS> Get-HotFix | Sort-Object InstalledOn -Descending
As admin:
PS> Get-HotFix | Sort-Object InstalledOn -Descending

Description HotFixID InstalledBy InstalledOn
----------- -------- ----------- -----------
Security Update KB5066790 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/15/2025 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5066791 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/15/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5066130 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/14/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5063979 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 09/10/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5063261 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 07/25/2025 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5063706 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 07/09/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5059504 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 06/11/2025 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5058526 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/14/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5054682 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/09/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5052916 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 03/12/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5050111 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 02/12/2025 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5050388 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 01/15/2025 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5046823 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/13/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5043130 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/13/2024 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5043935 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 09/11/2024 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5041579 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/14/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5039336 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 07/10/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5037995 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 06/06/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5037240 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/15/2024 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5037018 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/17/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5036447 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 03/13/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5034224 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 02/13/2024 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5034441 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 01/20/2024 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5032907 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/13/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5032392 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/14/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5031540 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/01/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5011048 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/31/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5030841 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/31/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5031539 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/30/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5015684 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/30/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5026879 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 06/15/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5025315 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/10/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5023794 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/12/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5022924 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 03/15/2023 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5020372 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/14/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5018506 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/09/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5016705 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/22/2022 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5012170 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/09/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5015895 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/06/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5014671 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 07/12/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5014035 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 06/15/2022 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5014032 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/11/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5003791 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/15/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5011651 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 04/12/2022 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5011352 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 02/14/2022 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5007273 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/17/2021 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB5006753 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/18/2021 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB5005699 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 09/15/2021 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB4589212 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 03/12/2021 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB4577586 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 02/17/2021 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4598481 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 01/13/2021 12:00:00 AM
UpdateKB Update KB4562830 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/27/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4593175 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 12/10/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4586864 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 11/10/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4580325 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 10/13/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4577266 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 09/10/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4570334 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/15/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4561600 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 08/15/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4557968 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/11/2020 12:00:00 AM
Security Update KB4537759 NT AUTHORITY\SYSTEM 05/11/2020 12:00:00 AM

The first three lines above confirm that the Windows 10 Pro system
received three updates yesterday 2025, including two security updates:
KB5066790 (Security Update) - Installed 10/15/2025
KB5066791 (Security Update) - Installed 10/15/2025
KB5066130 (Update) - Installed 10/14/2025

These are likely the final cumulative & security patches for Windows 10 now that support has ended, unless a privacy-robbing MSA account is created.

Any ideas for extended support that preserve some semblance of privacy?

In the time it took you to write all that, you could've made the MS
account, and just accepted that option, and gotten extended updates
free. I recommend embracing the MS account.
--
Joel W. Crump
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Joel W. Crump wrote:

Any ideas for extended support that preserve some semblance of privacy?

In the time it took you to write all that, you could've made the MS
account, and just accepted that option, and gotten extended updates
free. I recommend embracing the MS account.

Thanks for that heartfelt advice, where I am fully aware of the mentality
of "just give up" as it's what slaves do and people who surrender in war.

Trust me I'm with you that it's far easier to surrender all your privacy
like any POW would do than it is to be intelligent about protecting it.

The problem that needs to be stated, since you said "in the time it took to document for posterity for future users the current status of Windows
Update", is that it takes about a month, in my experience, to get a
protonmail account which was started on Tor to accept validation emails.

Just as freedom isn't free, privacy isn't without intelligent effort.
Which is why I asked the group at large if they know more than I do.

I already created the protonmail account, and I will be sending innocuous emails once a day (or so) to establish it as "real" for the MS account.

However, I wonder if others here have used perhaps another privacy-based
email on Tor to register for the MS account such as GMX or Tuta (formerly Tutanota) and whether that registration was effective the same day you
created the account (or within 24 hours, which is customary on some
platforms)?


I'll try these on TOR which a search just unearthed for me for the MSA registration verification (to see if it works within the same day).

0. Proton <https://protonirockerxow.onion>
1. Cock <https://cock.li>
2. Tuta <https://tuta.com> (formerly <https://tutanota.com>)
3. Secmail via Tor <http://secmailw453j7piv.onion>
4. AnonAddy <https://anonaddy.com>
5. Mail2Tor via Tor <http://mail2tor2zyjdctd.onion

The way this Usenet community works is if someone already knows the answer, they can let everyone else know which is the most efficient solution known.

Otherwise, the way Usenet works is I will *test* each of those, knowing
already that Protonmail takes about a month to get a registration email
when using Tor the entire time, but I'm not sure about the others.

I asked the question because I seek someone who knows the answer.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On 2025-10-15 21:13, Marion wrote:

Joel W. Crump wrote:

Any ideas for extended support that preserve some semblance of privacy?

In the time it took you to write all that, you could've made the MS
account, and just accepted that option, and gotten extended updates
free. I recommend embracing the MS account.

Thanks for that heartfelt advice, where I am fully aware of the mentality
of "just give up" as it's what slaves do and people who surrender in war.

Trust me I'm with you that it's far easier to surrender all your privacy
like any POW would do than it is to be intelligent about protecting it.

The problem that needs to be stated, since you said "in the time it took to document for posterity for future users the current status of Windows Update", is that it takes about a month, in my experience, to get a protonmail account which was started on Tor to accept validation emails.

Just as freedom isn't free, privacy isn't without intelligent effort.
Which is why I asked the group at large if they know more than I do.

I already created the protonmail account, and I will be sending innocuous emails once a day (or so) to establish it as "real" for the MS account.

However, I wonder if others here have used perhaps another privacy-based email on Tor to register for the MS account such as GMX or Tuta (formerly Tutanota) and whether that registration was effective the same day you created the account (or within 24 hours, which is customary on some platforms)?

I'll try these on TOR which a search just unearthed for me for the MSA registration verification (to see if it works within the same day).

Arlen, how will you impede Windows from sending your true IP when you
try to update? Because your machine has an IP from your ISP, your
machine knows it, and you connect to M$ servers to get the updates.

It is impossible. They will correlate your hidden email with your true
IP. Windows is not designed for privacy. An entire organization with
millions of dollars and thousands of employees is working to find you out.

If you use Windows, surrender to them. If you want privacy, never use
Windows again. Simple!

Maybe, if you run a TOR host or node in another machine with a second
Ethernet port, and connect your windows machine only to it. For ever!

But the CIA will still know you. They have penetrated the TOR network.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
ESEfc-Efc+, EUEfc-Efc|;
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On Wed, 15 Oct 2025 11:06:50 -0000 (UTC), Marion wrote:

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

This has been discussed here for months, with solution posted and
discussed -- "here" meaning in the Windows 10 group, not the
irrelevant one and the nonexistent one you crossposted to. I don't
fault you for waiting till past the last minute, but you're supposed
to check in a newsgroup _before_ you post, to see if your question
has already been answered.

Here is the solution I mentioned, and yes I posted to say I had
success. As of today, Settingsa+ Update and Securitya+ Windows Update
Still confirms "Your PC is enrolled to get Extended Security
Updates."

On Fri, 19 Sep 2025 15:48:09 -0400, Paul wrote:

On Fri, 9/19/2025 12:55 PM, Bill Bradshaw wrote:

John C. wrote:

Bill Bradshaw wrote:

jason_warren wrote:

I thought that the end of Win 10 support would still allow
users to pay MS to continue distrbuting security updates.
Now I'm reading things that run counter to that. What's
true?

Go into Settings, Update & Security, and if you are enrolled in the
Extended Security Updates there will be a notice to that effect. I
did not get a request to pay but I am informed that I am enrolled.

Bill, did you in fact enroll? I'm assuming you did. I didn't, and my
settings window says:

Windows 10 support ends in October 2025
Enroll in Extended Security Updates to help keep your device secure.

I did enroll. I used the ConsumerESU-master program. I don't have the url
but maybe somebody can provide it or you could find it with a search. It was pretty simple to use. This is not a Microsoft program.

It's a script on github.

https://github.com/abbodi1406/ConsumerESU

https://codeload.github.com/abbodi1406/ConsumerESU/zip/refs/heads/master

Name: ConsumerESU-master.zip # Is being edited as time passes...
Size: 9816 bytes (9 KiB)
SHA256: 4658F0BD8E1BC9BF9D8E46AD659A3502CE36406761917A65BA3FBBF9B4EC6415

Consumer_ESU_Enrollment.ps1 # Script for enrolling user in Win10 ESU.

Consumer_ESU_Enrollment_run.cmd # Wrapper to remove PowerShell restricted execution.
# This would be the part we would normally tell users verbally.

Details in the Readme file. Run as Administrator (Administrator Terminal maybe).

https://github.com/abbodi1406/ConsumerESU/blob/master/README.md

Needs July 2025 Patch Tuesday Cumulative, as there is a ConsumerESU.dll
in the OS folders after the Patch Tuesday is installed, and the
script checks for the existence of that file. That file is presumably
a part of the solution.

--
"The power of accurate observation is frequently called cynicism by
those who don't have it." --George Bernard Shaw
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On 10/15/25 6:08 PM, Stan Brown wrote:

On Wed, 15 Oct 2025 11:06:50 -0000 (UTC), Marion wrote:

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to >> create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to >> creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

This has been discussed here for months, with solution posted and
discussed -- "here" meaning in the Windows 10 group, not the
irrelevant one and the nonexistent one you crossposted to. I don't
fault you for waiting till past the last minute, but you're supposed
to check in a newsgroup _before_ you post, to see if your question
has already been answered.

Here is the solution I mentioned, and yes I posted to say I had
success. As of today, Settings-a-+ Update and Security-a-+ Windows Update Still confirms "Your PC is enrolled to get Extended Security
Updates."

On Fri, 19 Sep 2025 15:48:09 -0400, Paul wrote:

On Fri, 9/19/2025 12:55 PM, Bill Bradshaw wrote:

John C. wrote:

Bill Bradshaw wrote:

jason_warren wrote:

I thought that the end of Win 10 support would still allow
users to pay MS to continue distrbuting security updates.
Now I'm reading things that run counter to that. What's
true?

Go into Settings, Update & Security, and if you are enrolled in the
Extended Security Updates there will be a notice to that effect. I
did not get a request to pay but I am informed that I am enrolled.

Bill, did you in fact enroll? I'm assuming you did. I didn't, and my
settings window says:

Windows 10 support ends in October 2025
Enroll in Extended Security Updates to help keep your device secure.

I did enroll. I used the ConsumerESU-master program. I don't have the url >>> but maybe somebody can provide it or you could find it with a search. It >>> was pretty simple to use. This is not a Microsoft program.

It's a script on github.

https://github.com/abbodi1406/ConsumerESU

https://codeload.github.com/abbodi1406/ConsumerESU/zip/refs/heads/master >>
Name: ConsumerESU-master.zip # Is being edited as time passes... >> Size: 9816 bytes (9 KiB)
SHA256: 4658F0BD8E1BC9BF9D8E46AD659A3502CE36406761917A65BA3FBBF9B4EC6415

Consumer_ESU_Enrollment.ps1 # Script for enrolling user in Win10 ESU. >>
Consumer_ESU_Enrollment_run.cmd # Wrapper to remove PowerShell restricted execution.
# This would be the part we would normally tell users verbally.

Details in the Readme file. Run as Administrator (Administrator Terminal maybe).

https://github.com/abbodi1406/ConsumerESU/blob/master/README.md

Needs July 2025 Patch Tuesday Cumulative, as there is a ConsumerESU.dll
in the OS folders after the Patch Tuesday is installed, and the
script checks for the existence of that file. That file is presumably
a part of the solution.

The OP also states he's on 22H2 which is 2 versions back. I would think he's want to be
on 24H2.
--
Linux Mint 22.2, Thunderbird 128.14.0esr, Mozilla Firefox 143.0.4
Alan K.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Stan Brown wrote on 10/15/2025 5:08 PM:

On Wed, 15 Oct 2025 11:06:50 -0000 (UTC), Marion wrote:

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to >> create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to >> creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

This has been discussed here for months, with solution posted and
discussed -- "here" meaning in the Windows 10 group, not the
irrelevant one and the nonexistent one you crossposted to. I don't
fault you for waiting till past the last minute, but you're supposed
to check in a newsgroup _before_ you post, to see if your question
has already been answered.

Here is the solution I mentioned, and yes I posted to say I had
success. As of today, Settingsa+ Update and Securitya+ Windows Update
Still confirms "Your PC is enrolled to get Extended Security
Updates."

I'm so happy for you. Damn, you're really on the ball.


--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

In article <10cp84m$3tkqq$2@dont-email.me>, alan@invalid.com (Alan K.) wrote:

The OP also states he's on 22H2 which is 2 versions back. I would
think he's want to be on 24H2.

The final major release version of Windows 10 is 22H2 so I don't know where you got 24H2 from!
--
Regards
John
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On Wed, 15 Oct 2025 11:06:50 -0000 (UTC), Marion <marionf@fact.com>
wrote:

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to >create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to >creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

While I'm not so concerned with privacy, I do have some questions
about Microsoft accounts, which seem to be compulsory with the latest
versions of Windows 11.

I am wary about backing up stuff on OneDrive, because of Microsofts predilection for making new versions incompatible with older ones. If
I back up on OneDrive, who's to say a future update won't make it
inaccessible to me?

That happened with DropBox, Sounded like a good idea, so I started
using it to sync files between my desktop and my laptop and my wife's
laptop. But then along came an update, and it stopped working on my
desktop. For a while I got around that by syncing using a flash drive,
and backing up to dropbox from the laptop. But another update might
knock that out too.

And if it happens with DropBox, it's also likely to happen with
OneDrive and GoogleDrive and so on.

And there's this story that you've got to be online to install Windows
11 properly. Does that mean you always have to be online to use it? If
I take my laptop to the archives to record my research, and they don't
have public wi-fi, does that mean I won't be able to use my laptop at
all?

And what happens if the power goes off?

I have a laptop because it has a battery and I can use it away from
mains electricity, or when there's a power failure. But if it won't
work when it's not online, there's not much point, is there?

To put it simply and broadly, does having a Microsoft account in
effect turn your computer into a dumb terminal rather than a PC?
--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://www.khanya.org.za/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://khanya.wordpress.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk --- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On 10/15/2025 9:07 PM, Steve Hayes wrote:

On Wed, 15 Oct 2025 11:06:50 -0000 (UTC), Marion <marionf@fact.com>
wrote:

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to >> create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to >> creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

While I'm not so concerned with privacy, I do have some questions
about Microsoft accounts, which seem to be compulsory with the latest versions of Windows 11.

I am wary about backing up stuff on OneDrive, because of Microsofts predilection for making new versions incompatible with older ones. If
I back up on OneDrive, who's to say a future update won't make it inaccessible to me?

That happened with DropBox, Sounded like a good idea, so I started
using it to sync files between my desktop and my laptop and my wife's
laptop. But then along came an update, and it stopped working on my
desktop. For a while I got around that by syncing using a flash drive,
and backing up to dropbox from the laptop. But another update might
knock that out too.

And if it happens with DropBox, it's also likely to happen with
OneDrive and GoogleDrive and so on.

And there's this story that you've got to be online to install Windows
11 properly. Does that mean you always have to be online to use it? If
I take my laptop to the archives to record my research, and they don't
have public wi-fi, does that mean I won't be able to use my laptop at
all?

And what happens if the power goes off?

I have a laptop because it has a battery and I can use it away from
mains electricity, or when there's a power failure. But if it won't
work when it's not online, there's not much point, is there?

To put it simply and broadly, does having a Microsoft account in
effect turn your computer into a dumb terminal rather than a PC?

One of the Windows Backup options, seemed to be focused on
App settings and a few libraries in your profile, rather than
backing up everything.

The OneDrive offering, may create aliases for more things in your
Profile and you then suffer the confusion of "where is my stuff
this morning, is it on OneDrive or on C: ". While the integration
is supposed to be seamless, if a thing is on OneDrive, there would
be a delay fetching it. The thing uses a caching scheme, with
materials here or there.

The thing the Enrollment was doing, was setting up enough OneDrive
for a small sampling of your Profile, rather than a comprehensive
backup. As I discovered in another post, you *could* migrate to a
Windows 11 PC, a new one, which is the Microsoft marketing plan,
and at least, your Metro.App collection is synchronized with the
W11 new machine via the Windows Backup information.

But you yourself have a Win32 legacy collection
as well, and that part has to re-installed by hand. And there
is no particular reason all the Settings would be aligned with
fresh installs of the Win32 stuff.

So the Windows Backup, is kind of like a LapLink PCMover,
when the new Windows 11 machine is connected to the network
and you have entered a common MSA used on both machines.

The free capacity of OneDrive is limited to 5GB, and Microsoft
is not trying to overflow that. If they had used Windows Backup
to keep a copy of your Downloads folder, they might easily exceed
the 5GB capacity.

You need a good network connection, and not everyone here
has a good connection. There are still users in NA who connect
at 3Mbit/sec over a 36000 foot phone line via ADSL (that's
twice the distance of the original design spec of 18000 feet).
Such connections are "first generation quality" and the upload
is so slow, it feels like dialup. Anything collected for
Windows Backup skeletal purposes or OneDrive slightly better,
is going to be doing a lot of waiting on a slow connection.

If you're at the public library and using the free Wifi there,
the performance would be "practical".

For the people here, the Windows Backup is more of a nuisance
factor, a dangling end, and they would be making their own
provisions for carting their data around. Nothing has changed
in that respect. Did Microsoft get a copy of my Pictures
folder ? I don't know and I don't care :-)

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On 16/10/2025 02:07, Steve Hayes wrote:

If
I back up on OneDrive, who's to say a future update won't make it inaccessible to me?

In that case you can use Linux Ubuntu (Mint/Debian/Fedora etc etc) to
access your files. These can be booted up from a flash drive (costing $5
for 64bit version plus Trumps 500% tariff :) ).

I don't get it why can't people have another laptop or desktop to run
Windows 11? Machines can be purchased quite cheaply these days. Windows
10 machine can be used for legacy software while Windows 11 for latest
AI versions of the same product.


--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Steve Hayes wrote:

While I'm not so concerned with privacy, I do have some questions
about Microsoft accounts, which seem to be compulsory with the latest versions of Windows 11.

I am wary about backing up stuff on OneDrive, because of Microsofts predilection for making new versions incompatible with older ones. If
I back up on OneDrive, who's to say a future update won't make it inaccessible to me?

With respect to your OneDrive wary-ness...
- Everything from SkyDrive(the precursor name for the online cloud
service) since 2007 to OneDrive(name change in 2013) has been available
with OneDrive updates for over 18 yrs.
- Granted, retaining an active Microsoft Account(MSA) is required, but
that is user related not OneDrive updates related.

Yes, future updates may change the app's features or UI, but
accessibility to stored content has never been an issue for an active account(MSA).
--
...w-i|#-o-#-n|#
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Carlos E.R. wrote:

how will you impede Windows from sending your true IP when you
try to update? Because your machine has an IP from your ISP, your
machine knows it, and you connect to M$ servers to get the updates.

It is impossible. They will correlate your hidden email with your true
IP. Windows is not designed for privacy. An entire organization with millions of dollars and thousands of employees is working to find you out.

If you use Windows, surrender to them. If you want privacy, never use Windows again. Simple!

Maybe, if you run a TOR host or node in another machine with a second Ethernet port, and connect your windows machine only to it. For ever!

But the CIA will still know you. They have penetrated the TOR network.

Hi Carlos and anyone who thinks Microsoft knows your IP address.

Q: How would Microsoft know my IP address?
A: ?

Note that I've proxied all the Microsoft programs that do the updates.

Also note that I could have missed some MS programs so when you say it's impossible, maybe you know which ones I have missed that I don't know.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Hank Rogers wrote:

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to >>> create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to >>> creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

This has been discussed here for months, with solution posted and
discussed -- "here" meaning in the Windows 10 group, not the
irrelevant one and the nonexistent one you crossposted to. I don't
fault you for waiting till past the last minute, but you're supposed
to check in a newsgroup _before_ you post, to see if your question
has already been answered.

Here is the solution I mentioned, and yes I posted to say I had
success. As of today, Settingsa+ Update and Securitya+ Windows Update
Still confirms "Your PC is enrolled to get Extended Security
Updates."

I'm so happy for you. Damn, you're really on the ball.

This is in response to Stan who apparently accidentally missed the point.

Actually, I think he missed a few points, but I can forgive him because
most people have no idea what it takes to be private on the Internet.

Given I've already proxied all (most/some?) of the Microsoft Update
activities such that Microsoft does not know my real IP address....

What I need (and we need!) is a known good working way to create an email address which is also not tied to our IP address or to our phones.

I create those email addresses on TOR, of course, but if Stan (or anyone
else reading this) has never done that, they might not know most mail
servers (e.g., GMail) won't let you use Tor to set up an email sans phone verification. Almost all will require phone or a second email if you try to
set it up on Tor. You can set up some (e.g., GMX) on VPN though, but most
mail servers will not allow you to set up the email on VPN either.

So you need an email server for your MSA that...
1. Allows creation via TOR
2. Without asking for a second email or a phone number
3. That will accept a registration verification request from Microsoft

My goto email server for that type of process used to be ProtonMail,
but when I tried it, it permanently banned me from ever receiving
registration emails because I tried too soon, so you have to wait.

In the past you only had to wait 24 hours, but now you have to wait longer, and, you have to impersonate a real email account by sending & receiving emails, which, in and of itself is problematic in terms of privacy.

In summary, in terms of PRIVACY, the problem isn't as simple as Stan (and
many others) may think it is but I understand that most people don't try to
be private on the Internet so they won't be able to help us in this quest.

However... if you know which private email address Microsoft will accept
and which mail server will accept TOR registration emails after creation,
THAT is what this question is after.

Once we find that out, everyone will benefit who cares about privacy and
who wants to do the least possible to garner the extended Win10 support!

Thanks for all your help in this privacy quest.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Paul wrote:

The OneDrive offering, may create aliases for more things in your
Profile and you then suffer the confusion of "where is my stuff
this morning, is it on OneDrive or on C: ". While the integration
is supposed to be seamless, if a thing is on OneDrive, there would
be a delay fetching it. The thing uses a caching scheme, with
materials here or there.

One this Win10 Pro device(enrolled in ESU, nothing backed up(Reward
points used for enrollment) with a 300Mbps internet connection it takes
only a few minutes to sync down the entire 1.1GB of online storage to
the local folder.
Note: Fresh download(OneDrive unlinked, local folder(on Disk 1
internal 4GB WD Black)content wiped, OneDrive opened, location change
from default user profile(Disk 0) and relinked to the same empty
OneDrive WD Black folder.
- Any later normal changes(adds, deletions local or online)sync in few seconds. Yes, uploading a large file(online or copying to OneDrive local folder is subject to isp upload /download speed.)

The free capacity of OneDrive is limited to 5GB, and Microsoft
is not trying to overflow that. If they had used Windows Backup
to keep a copy of your Downloads folder, they might easily exceed
the 5GB capacity.

The 5GB limit can be a concern...the limit used to be 7 GB, earlier as
high as 15 GB [1]
- FYI when it was 7GB, 96% of all users online storage was less than
100MB.

For most consumers today 5 GB without an M365 Personal(1TB) or Family
Plan(1TB for up to 6 persons) is more than sufficient...but it does
require(as you know) understanding how to effectively manage local and
cloud storage.

[1] Older MSn/Hotmail/Live account were grandfathered and continue to be
with higher storage.
e.g. My original Windows 95 beta Microsoft issued MSN account for MSN Explorer(no longer an ad-free account as of 2013) continues to provide
80 GB capacity(total storage <g> on that OD is 170 files, 3 MB)
- if you need a recipe for Pozole Rojo I'll send you a link!!!

Also, if one started using a MSA for Windows Live in 2008, it's very
likely those MSA's have 25 GB to 40 GB of grandfathered never reduced
storage.
--
...w-i|#-o-#-n|#
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Alan K. wrote:

This has been discussed here for months, with solution posted and
discussed -- "here" meaning in the Windows 10 group, not the
irrelevant one and the nonexistent one you crossposted to. I don't
fault you for waiting till past the last minute, but you're supposed
to check in a newsgroup _before_ you post, to see if your question
has already been answered.

I'm all about adding value... that is saved forever... for others... so...
to make sure what Stan thinks isn't what everyone else thinks, I add...

Just to be clear. the newsgroups alt.comp.microsoft.windows has existed forever, so, if I were to be cheeky, I'd suggest Stan look first. :)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>

But I don't fault Stan for not knowing that alt.comp.microsoft.windows
exists, as a lot of people aren't aware of all the Windows-related ngs.
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>

But I mention it here BECAUSE everyone on these newsgroups should know.
https://i2pn2.pugleaf.net/groups/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>

In fact, for years, Google wouldn't archive the Windows 10 newsgroup.
When I finally discussed that fact with the relevant folks in Palo Alto
about that, which is no small feat mind you, they said that the only
official Windows newsgroup was, in fact, alt.comp.microsoft.windows
<https://newsgrouper.org/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>

So I think it's kind'a funny that people think it doesn't exist.
Nonetheless, I do agree that most people post to the version-specific ngs.
<https://alt.comp.microsoft.windows.narkive.com/>
--
Part of the reason I document in detail is for others to benefit who don't
even use Usenet since my threads are often the first hits on Google search.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

John K.Eason wrote:

In article <10cp84m$3tkqq$2@dont-email.me>, alan@invalid.com (Alan K.) wrote:

The OP also states he's on 22H2 which is 2 versions back. I would
think he's want to be on 24H2.

The final major release version of Windows 10 is 22H2 so I don't know where you
got 24H2 from!

Most likely thinking about Windows 11 not Windows 10.
--
...w-i|#-o-#-n|#
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

John K.Eason wrote:

In article <10cp84m$3tkqq$2@dont-email.me>, alan@invalid.com (Alan K.) wrote:

The OP also states he's on 22H2 which is 2 versions back. I would
think he's want to be on 24H2.

The final major release version of Windows 10 is 22H2 so I don't know where you
got 24H2 from!

I don't fault Alan K for thinking the version would be different, but as
John K.Easton observed, indeed, the version is 22H2 for Windows 10 (AFAIK).

As for Stan Brown's assertion that creating a private email address has
nothing to do with Windows 11, I disagree. People have MSA's on Win11 also.

In fact, I think there may be a few people on Windows 11 who had to create
an MSA just to use it, and therefore, the topic of how best to create a
private email address that Microsoft will accept as a verification email
(and that will accept the Microsoft verification email) is apropos to both newsgroups.

In summary, I think a private email is de rigueur for both Windows 10 & 11.

Note also that, to Carlos' point, if you haven't proxied your Microsoft Updates, then Microsoft will know your "real" IP address unless you've
taken other measures. Windows Update on both Windows 10 and 11 typically connects directly to Microsoft servers using system-level networking.

Updates bypass browser-level proxies like SOCKS5 or HTTP proxies unless
those proxies are configured system-wide although VPNs, when active,
reroute all traffic, but you have to configure such things to kick in upon reboot.

Browsers and most apps use WinINET settings.
Windows Update and other system-level services use WinHTTP settings.

Therefore the key step is to copy WinINET proxy settings into WinHTTP.
netsh winhttp import proxy source=ie

Although, I just checked my proxy settings and I found a minor hiccup,
where not all the Windows Update was going through the proxy.

That is, if we want Windows Update to go through the proxy, we need to
expose an HTTP/HTTPS proxy endpoint (not just SOCKS) where we then
configure the WinHTTP (which is what Windows Update uses!) via
netsh winhttp set proxy 127.0.0.1:port

In short, I'm happy this issue came up by Carlos and others that supposedly Microsoft knows your IP address, because when I doublechecked my scripts, I realized since WinHTTP doesn't process PACs or SOCKS, Windows Update will always bypass it unless we give it a plain HTTP proxy address.

Thanks to Stan, Carlos, John K.Easton & Alan K. for bringing this up, as everyone who wants privacy needs to do at least two things with the MSA:
1. Make sure the MSA account is private, and,
2. Make sure Windows Update doesn't use your real IP address.
--
As always, posted to add value to the permanent Usenet record for all to benefit from, out of the goodness of my heart and from that of others.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On Thu, 10/16/2025 2:58 AM, Marion wrote:

Alan K. wrote:

This has been discussed here for months, with solution posted and
discussed -- "here" meaning in the Windows 10 group, not the
irrelevant one and the nonexistent one you crossposted to. I don't
fault you for waiting till past the last minute, but you're supposed
to check in a newsgroup _before_ you post, to see if your question
has already been answered.

I'm all about adding value... that is saved forever... for others... so... to make sure what Stan thinks isn't what everyone else thinks, I add...

Just to be clear. the newsgroups alt.comp.microsoft.windows has existed forever, so, if I were to be cheeky, I'd suggest Stan look first. :)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>

But I don't fault Stan for not knowing that alt.comp.microsoft.windows exists, as a lot of people aren't aware of all the Windows-related ngs.
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>

But I mention it here BECAUSE everyone on these newsgroups should know.
https://i2pn2.pugleaf.net/groups/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>

In fact, for years, Google wouldn't archive the Windows 10 newsgroup.
When I finally discussed that fact with the relevant folks in Palo Alto
about that, which is no small feat mind you, they said that the only
official Windows newsgroup was, in fact, alt.comp.microsoft.windows
<https://newsgrouper.org/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>

So I think it's kind'a funny that people think it doesn't exist. Nonetheless, I do agree that most people post to the version-specific ngs.
<https://alt.comp.microsoft.windows.narkive.com/>

And you would have to understand the history of alt.*
to know how it got the way it is today.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alt.*_hierarchy

"Unlike most of the other hierarchies, there is no centralized control
of the hierarchy and anyone who is technically capable of creating a newsgroup
can do so. [That used to be true. Less so now.]

In practice, however, most newsgroups follow an informal procedure involving
a public discussion in alt.config before being created. This procedure is
designed to help the potential creator better understand what factors
contribute to a newsgroup's success.

It is up to each individual news administrator whether to add a new newsgroup,
and some will not do so if the group has not been discussed in alt.config.
"

At one time, the creation of alt.* newsgroups got out of control. Vanity
groups would be created, like someone would make a

alt.greg.sucks.donkey.balls

in other words, tit-for-tat sniping using newsgroups as "toys".
Eventually, there were around 100,000 alt.* newsgroups.
Something had to be done.

Administrators first tightened the creation process.
I believe there might be a queue on the server, attempts
to create go in there, there could be "signing" used to indicate
semi-legit attempts at group creation. The administrator processes
these manually (after a fashion).

Then, the alt.* cesspit was cleaned out. Groups with
low traffic (like only two spam posts in two years), would
get removed. The number of alt groups today is smaller.

There is no guarantee that two servers carry exactly
the same alt.* set. Alt.* has been through a lot over
the years. And that's the result.

Even the alt.comp.os.windows-10 and alt.comp.os.windows-11
are not necessarily on all the hobby servers. And Google
Groups would not have added them either, as a number of
alt.* groups are missing on Google (a temporal cutoff, Google
stopped adding alt.* at some point, some Linux ones are missing).

Paul
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Flash Drive wrote:

I don't get it why can't people have another laptop or desktop to run Windows 11?

Three reasons Windows 11 "sucks" compared to Windows 10 (for me)...
1. There's nothing wrong with my Windows 10 desktop, and,
2. Why should I buy two desktops when I only need one, and,
3. Windows 11 is a loss of functionality for me (e.g., with menus).

As for the "migration", I must have hundreds of batch & powershell scripts
and easily thousands of tweaks in my Windows 10 desktop (since I've had it since 2009) that I don't feel like migrating to Windows 11.

I don't mind replacing the memory or the graphics card but I certainly do
mind the absolutely immense setup it would take to get Windows 11 working.

Plus, Windows 11 can't do what Windows 10 can do, so it's a loss of functionality in ways that matter greatly to me.

Still, the question is apropos how to create a private MSA.

It entails:
a. Setting up VPN/Proxy for WinHTTP (which is what Windows Update uses)
b. Setting up a private email that will allow same-day MSA registration

I wrote up an extremely detailed solution to the first problem.
I'm working on the second problem as we speak.

Both are apropos to Windows 11 users as much as to Windows 10 users.
But only if they care about privacy.

As I've always said, most people own the mentality of slaves where they do whatever Microsoft tells them to do - but I try to break out of that mold.

1. My Windows Update doesn't know my IP address
(although I found a flaw today that I have to work on in my scripts)
2. My Windows Update won't have an email that ties back to me

That's just basic privacy.

A. You need to make sure Windows Update never gets your real IP address
B. And you make sure Microsoft never gets any identifiable email address

It takes both intelligence & effort to be private from Windows Update.
--
Probably 1 in a million people understand a word I just said above; but
I would hope that almost everyone on these newsgroups does understand.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Paul wrote:

So I think it's kind'a funny that people think it doesn't exist.
Nonetheless, I do agree that most people post to the version-specific ngs. >> <https://alt.comp.microsoft.windows.narkive.com/>

And you would have to understand the history of alt.*
to know how it got the way it is today.

Thanks Paul, for explaining the reason that Google refused to archive the Windows 10 newsgroup when I literally drove to Palo Alto to talk to them.

All I could accomplish was I was able to get them to *change* the URL from
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>
to
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.comp.microsoft.windows>
for all Usenet newsgroups (not just for the Windows newsgroup).

Once they did that, I no longer needed to create the tinyurl shortcuts
which I created to make the Usenet search simple for non-NNTP users.

Even the alt.comp.os.windows-10 and alt.comp.os.windows-11
are not necessarily on all the hobby servers. And Google
Groups would not have added them either, as a number of
alt.* groups are missing on Google (a temporal cutoff, Google
stopped adding alt.* at some point, some Linux ones are missing).

As you probably can recall, I was able to work with the NovaBBS admin (RetroGuy) to archive all the Windows newsgroups for non-NNTP users but he
died recently so I worked with the pugleaf folks a little bit to port it
(which they did).

As you probably also recall, I worked with the admin for Narkive (Davide Cavion) who responded by email to me and to news.admin.peering that he just didn't have the time to maintain that server well.

And pcbanter seems to have died long ago, so this link I created is 404:
<https://tinyurl.com/alt-comp-os-windows-10>

I've probably done more than anyone other than those admins for making sure
the archives are available to everyone, where I find most of my Usenet
articles from those servers (or from a Google search for my own threads).

The archives are great because one, five, ten, twenty or more years from
now, people can make use of all the information we've kind heartedly added.

BTW, I haven't responded to your msedge/copilot post but I read it, but I haven't been able to resolve the problem yet so I was waiting for more data (which I don't have yet - but I do appreciate the kind hearted help you provided, as copilot seems to have many shape shifting forms I didn't know
of, so when I say copilot it might not be what you mean when you say it).
--
The whole point of Usenet is for intelligent people to help each other,
& for the results to be archived so that anyone can access our knowledge.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

...winston wrote:

With respect to your OneDrive wary-ness...
- Everything from SkyDrive(the precursor name for the online cloud service) since 2007 to OneDrive(name change in 2013) has been available
with OneDrive updates for over 18 yrs.
- Granted, retaining an active Microsoft Account(MSA) is required, but that is user related not OneDrive updates related.

Yes, future updates may change the app's features or UI, but
accessibility to stored content has never been an issue for an active account(MSA).

Has anyone noticed how almost EXACTLY Microsoft is copying Apple's tricks?

Win+R > control update > Update & security > Windows Update
Your version of windows has reached the end of support
Look for the banner or message that says
"Your version of Windows has reached end of support".
Enroll in Extended Security Updates
"Enroll now"
Sign in with your Microsoft account.
Choose a plan:
Free option (requires backing up your data to MS OneDrive)
Paid option ($30/year)

Note that "free" option line has a catch:
a. You need to create an MSA (just like Apple requires you to use iOS)
b. You get only a puny 5GB (which is as worthless as Apple's puny 5GB)

And that's for Windows 10!
Windows 11 is even worse in that it's even closer to Apple's strategy.

Since Windows 11 requires you to have that MSA just to use the OS.
(yes, I am aware there are hacks but they're for 1 out of a million people)

Essentially, by tying the required account to the required (but worthless) backup storage, Microsoft has EXACTLY copied Apple's (successful) strategy.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Marion wrote:

Note that I've proxied all the Microsoft programs that do the updates.

Also note that I could have missed some MS programs so when you say it's impossible, maybe you know which ones I have missed that I don't know.

I must thank Carlos for the impetus to look at my proxy scripts where I
just found a potential flaw that I wasn't aware of until this very moment.

First, before we get lost in the weeds of Windows complexity, let's firmly state what the obvious goal is, for everyone on this newsgroup who cares
about privacy, which is simply to keep our IP address away from Microsoft.

That's it.
We do not want Microsoft to know what our "real" IP address is.

Keeping in mind the strategic resolve to not be a slave, but to use intelligence (& effort) to keep our IP address out of Microsoft's
databases... let's state next what everyone already knows about proxies.

Windows Update on both Windows 10 and 11 typically connects directly to Microsoft servers using system-level networking.

While a full-tunnel VPN ensures all traffic, including Windows Update, goes through the VPN, it's faster but more involved to get Windows Update to use
a proxy (either instead of a VPN or in addition to a VPN).

Bear in mind that browsers and most apps use WinINET settings.
But Windows Update and other system-level services use WinHTTP settings.

In doing so, WinHTTP (used by Windows Update, some system services & PowerShell) does not support PAC files or SOCKS proxies.

Windows Update only understands static HTTP/HTTPS proxy addresses!

Drat. Given my last posted revision of psiphon.bat v2.1 to this newsgroup
a. Launches Psiphon in socks mode
b. Sets a PAC file in the registry for WinINET
http://127.0.0.1/proxy.pac (served by mongoose automatically)
c. Copies the current WinINET proxy configuration into WinHTTP
netsh winhttp import proxy source=ie

This copy is the critical step, or so I had thought until now.

Copying WinINET into WinHTTP means Windows Update (which uses WinHTTP) will now use the same proxy settings that Psiphon had initially injected into WinINET by default.

But there's a catch!
A. The psiphon.bat script only transfers static HTTP/HTTPS proxy addresses from WinINET to WinHTTP.
B. It does not transfer PAC logic or SOCKS settings.

Drat!
I thank Carlos for pointing that out, as I hadn't noticed that until now.

Since Psiphon is running in SOCKS mode, and the sync only moves over HTTP/HTTPS proxy addresses, Windows Update may not actually tunnel through Psiphon unless the PAC file resolves to a usable HTTP/HTTPS proxy.

The catch is the following:
1. The psiphon.bat script, version 2.1, is designed to push proxy settings
into WinHTTP, so Windows Update will try to use them.
2. But because Psiphon is running in SOCKS mode, and because WinHTTP
doesn't understand SOCKS or PAC logic directly, Windows Update may
not actually succeed in routing through Psiphon unless the PAC file
points to a local HTTP proxy that Psiphon provides.

The previously posted psiphon.bat version 2.1 script attempts to make
Windows Update use the Psiphon proxy by syncing settings into WinHTTP. However, because Windows Update doesn't natively support SOCKS, it will
only work if Psiphon (or the PAC file) exposes an HTTP/HTTPS proxy endpoint that WinHTTP can use. If not, Windows Update will either fail or fall back
to a direct connection.

Below is that previous script, but I may need to update it to fix this.

So that everyone benefits from every action I take, which is how I'm
wired, I'll post the fixes (if any) to the aforementioned proxy thread.

@echo off
REM C:\data\sys\batch\psiphon.bat version 1.0 20250819
REM This is psiphon.bat version 2.2 (??? lines)
REM Runs "C:\app\network\psiphon\psiphon3.exe" -mode=socks
REM This method leaves windows open.
REM %comspec% /k C:\app\network\psiphon\psiphon3.exe -mode=socks
REM This method closes windows.
REM psiphon.bat version 1.1 20250916
REM Added automatic PAC sync/apply after Psiphon launch
REM psiphon.bat version 1.2 20250916
REM Added logging to proxy.log when PAC is triggered from psiphon
REM psiphon.bat version 1.3 20250916
REM Added optional pause for viewing output before closing
REM psiphon.bat version 1.4 20250916
REM Changed to never close parent cmd window and always pause at end
REM psiphon.bat version 1.5 20250916
REM Added self-elevation to request UAC if not already admin
REM psiphon.bat version 1.6 20250916
REM Added final PAC URL + Auto-Detect set to ensure persistence
REM after Psiphon/proxy changes
REM psiphon.bat version 1.7 20250917
REM Added launch of mongoose.vbs to serve proxy.pac before PAC logic
REM psiphon.bat version 1.8 20250917
REM Reordered launch sequence: Mongoose now starts BEFORE Psiphon
REM Added PAC availability check using curl
REM Added 2-second wait after Mongoose launch to ensure readiness
REM psiphon.bat version 1.9 20250917
REM Error: PAC file not available. Aborting. Press any key to continue
REM Increased delay from 2 to 4 to give Mongoose more time to bind & serve
REM psiphon.bat version 2.0 20250917 (111 lines)
REM Decreased delay back to 2 as it didn't make a difference
REM Added echo message during Mongoose wait to indicate progress
REM psiphon.bat version 2.1 20250917 (118 lines)
REM Expanded Psiphon's reach to WinHTTP apps without compromising WinINET apps
REM By adding Automatic Sync of WinINET to WinHTTP (e.g., for Windows Update)
REM Transfers only the Psiphon-injected static HTTP/HTTPS proxy address
REM Does not transfer PAC logic and SOCKS settings from WinInet to WinHTTP

:: --- Elevate to admin if not already ---
>nul 2>&1 net session
if %errorlevel% neq 0 (
echo Requesting administrative privileges...
powershell -Command "Start-Process '%~f0' -Verb RunAs"
exit /b
)

REM Launch Mongoose silently to serve proxy.pac
cscript //nologo "C:\data\sys\batch\launchmongoose.vbs"

REM Wait for Mongoose to initialize (added in v1.8)
echo waiting for mongoose... (added in v2.0)
timeout /t 2 /nobreak >nul

REM Verify PAC file is available before proceeding (added in v1.8)
curl --silent --fail http://127.0.0.1/proxy.pac >nul || (
echo PAC file not available. Aborting.
pause
exit /b
)

REM Launch Psiphon in SOCKS mode
start "" /D "C:\app\network\psiphon" psiphon3.exe -mode=socks

REM Wait a few seconds for Psiphon to initialize
timeout /t 5 /nobreak >nul

REM Log that PAC is being run from psiphon
echo [%DATE% %TIME%] pac.cmd triggered from psiphon.bat >> C:\data\sys\log\proxy.log

REM Apply PAC logic automatically (silent mode)
call "C:\data\sys\batch\pac.cmd" /silent

REM Force PAC URL and Auto-Detect to desired values at the very end
REM This ensures Psiphon or proxy sync cannot leave them unset
reg add "HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Internet Settings" /v AutoConfigURL /t REG_SZ /d http://127.0.0.1/proxy.pac /f >nul
reg add "HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Internet Settings" /v AutoDetect /t REG_DWORD /d 1 /f >nul

REM Sync WinINET proxy settings into WinHTTP (added in v2.1)
netsh winhttp import proxy source=ie

REM Always pause so you can see output if run from a console
echo.
echo Press any key to close...
pause >nul

REM End batch without killing the shell
exit /b


::START: You type Win+R -> psiphon
:: |
:: v
::psiphon.bat
:: - Check if running as admin
:: - If not, request UAC elevation and restart
:: - Launch mongoose.vbs to serve proxy.pac (moved earlier in v1.8)
:: - Wait 2 seconds for Mongoose to initialize (added in v1.8)
:: - Echo "waiting for mongoose..." during delay (added in v1.9)
:: - Verify PAC file is accessible via curl (added in v1.8)
:: - Launch psiphon3.exe in SOCKS mode
:: - Wait 5 seconds for Psiphon to initialize
:: - Log that pac.cmd is being run
:: - Call pac.cmd /silent
:: |
:: v
:: pac.cmd
:: - Log run
:: - Run proxy.cmd /sync to align WinINET -> WinHTTP
:: - Capture current PAC URL and Auto-Detect status
:: - If missing or wrong, call proxy.cmd with PAC URL
:: - Force set PAC URL and Auto-Detect in registry
:: - Re-capture status so final display is accurate
:: - Show final PAC and Auto-Detect status
:: - Return to psiphon.bat
:: - Force set PAC URL and Auto-Detect again (double guarantee)
:: - Pause for user to see output
:: - Exit without closing parent shell
::END
--
Probably 1 in a million people understand a word I just said above; but
I would hope that almost everyone on these newsgroups does understand.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

...winston wrote:

John K.Eason wrote:

In article <10cp84m$3tkqq$2@dont-email.me>, alan@invalid.com (Alan K.) wrote:

The OP also states he's on 22H2 which is 2 versions back. I would
think he's want to be on 24H2.

The final major release version of Windows 10 is 22H2 so I don't know where you
got 24H2 from!

Most likely thinking about Windows 11 not Windows 10.

This will show our exact Windows version and build.

systeminfo | findstr /B /C:"OS Name" /C:"OS Version"

Mine reports:
OS Name: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro
OS Version: 10.0.19045 N/A Build 19045
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Marion wrote:

But there's a catch!
A. The psiphon.bat script only transfers static HTTP/HTTPS proxy addresses from WinINET to WinHTTP.
B. It does not transfer PAC logic or SOCKS settings.

Drat!
I thank Carlos for pointing that out, as I hadn't noticed that until now.

Whew! Good news.
Windows Update was NOT seeing my real IP, as Carlos mentioned might happen.

It turns out that I didn't screw up. The Windows Update Service
(wuauserv) was actually always flowing through the proxy service.

Q: How would Microsoft know my IP address?
A: They don't. They see the proxy. Or the VPN. But not my real IP address.

I ran a few debug steps, and will write a script to make it easier.
This is how to tell if Windows Update is CONFIGURED to use the proxy.

Win+R > cmd {ctrl+shft+rtn}

netsh winhttp show proxy

a. If it shows this, Windows Update is going straight out to the internet:
Direct access (no proxy server)
b. If it shows something like this, Windows Update is using the proxy:
Proxy Server(s) : http=127.0.0.1:8080;https=127.0.0.1:8080

Mine showed this:
Current WinHTTP proxy settings:
Proxy Server(s) :
http=127.0.0.1:3095;https=127.0.0.1:3095;socks=127.0.0.1:1080
Bypass List : <local>;10.*;172.16.*;172.17.*;172.18.*;172.19.*;172.20.*;172.21.*;172.22.*;172.23.*;172.24.*;172.25.*;172.26.*;172.27.*;172.28.*;172.29.*;172.30.*;172.31.*;192.168.*;169.254.*;[fc*];[fd*];[fe8*];[fe9*];[fea*];[feb*]

Regarding: http=127.0.0.1:3095;https=127.0.0.1:3095
This means WinHTTP (and therefore Windows Update) is configured to send all HTTP and HTTPS traffic through a local proxy listening on port 3095.

Regarding: socks=127.0.0.1:1080
Unfortunately, even though there is a socks line, WinHTTP does not support SOCKS. It will ignore that part. Only the HTTP/HTTPS entries matter.

Regarding: <local>;10.*;172.16.* iK 192.168.*;169.254.*;[fc*];[fd*];[fe*]
This means private/internal addresses are excluded from the proxy.

This is how to tell if Windows Update is actually USING the proxy!

Set up two windows, one of which is an admin window for Powershell:
Trigger a Windows Update scan manually in the Powershell admin window.

usoclient StartScan

Trigger a scan to watch port 3095 while that's running:

netstat -ano | findstr :3095

TCP 127.0.0.1:3095 0.0.0.0:0 LISTENING 9452
TCP 127.0.0.1:3095 127.0.0.1:3151 ESTABLISHED 9452
TCP 127.0.0.1:3143 127.0.0.1:3095 TIME_WAIT 0
TCP 127.0.0.1:3144 127.0.0.1:3095 TIME_WAIT 0
TCP 127.0.0.1:3145 127.0.0.1:3095 TIME_WAIT 0
TCP 127.0.0.1:3151 127.0.0.1:3095 ESTABLISHED 9108

Rather than race the clock, we can run the netstat every second first.

netstat -ano 1 | findstr :3095

I'm gonna write a script so anyone can check if their proxy is working to
hide their real IP address from the Windows Update process for privacy.

I'll post it when I've tested it and proved that it's working on my
version of Windows, which is as shown from this command below:

systeminfo | findstr /B /C:"OS Name" /C:"OS Version"

Mine reports:
OS Name: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro
OS Version: 10.0.19045 N/A Build 19045
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On 16/10/2025 09:11, Marion wrote:

...winston wrote:

With respect to your OneDrive wary-ness...
- Everything from SkyDrive(the precursor name for the online cloud
service) since 2007 to OneDrive(name change in 2013) has been available
with OneDrive updates for over 18 yrs.
- Granted, retaining an active Microsoft Account(MSA) is required, but
that is user related not OneDrive updates related.

Yes, future updates may change the app's features or UI, but
accessibility to stored content has never been an issue for an active
account(MSA).

Has anyone noticed how almost EXACTLY Microsoft is copying Apple's tricks?

Win+R > control update > Update & security > Windows Update
Your version of windows has reached the end of support
Look for the banner or message that says
"Your version of Windows has reached end of support".
Enroll in Extended Security Updates
"Enroll now"
Sign in with your Microsoft account.
Choose a plan:
Free option (requires backing up your data to MS OneDrive)
Paid option ($30/year)

Note that "free" option line has a catch:
a. You need to create an MSA (just like Apple requires you to use iOS)
b. You get only a puny 5GB (which is as worthless as Apple's puny 5GB)

And that's for Windows 10!
Windows 11 is even worse in that it's even closer to Apple's strategy.

Since Windows 11 requires you to have that MSA just to use the OS.
(yes, I am aware there are hacks but they're for 1 out of a million people)

Essentially, by tying the required account to the required (but worthless) backup storage, Microsoft has EXACTLY copied Apple's (successful) strategy.

As ever your advice is misleading.

The free ESU option does NOT force backing up your data to MS OneDrive.
The enforced backup is the Windows preferences and app list which
involves their servers but is not part of monitored OneDrive usage.

Windows 11 requires *consumers* to have an MSA to use the OS, not an organisation which by Microsoft's definition is anyone with Windows Pro
and a network domain server.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Marion wrote:

I'm gonna write a script so anyone can check if their proxy is working to hide their real IP address from the Windows Update process for privacy.

I'll post it when I've tested it and proved that it's working on my
version of Windows...

Strategy:
a. Microsoft does NOT get your real IP address
b. Microsoft does not get any information from your email address MSA

For that strategy, you can be on VPN all the time, but a proxy is faster.
Much faster. And you can always tack on the VPN before or after the proxy.

I assert that Microsoft does NOT get my real IP address as Carlos suggested.
To prove it (to myself more than anything but also to others)...

I wrote and tested the script for a few hours, but I hesitated to make the script itself run the Windows Update from inside the script because then it would only work on my system (as you have to add a package to PowerShell).

So I made the script need an OUTSIDE call to the Windows Update using the
GUI (which is the most reliable way & still be compatible for everyone).

Below is the script that I tested on my machine to check if Windows Update
is getting my real IP address, or the Psiphon proxy IP address instead.

The use model is simple:
a. Run the script
b. While the script is running, manually run a Windows Update check
c. Kill the script

The log file will look something like this if your proxy is trapping calls.
==============================================
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:07.59] Starting scan
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:07.63] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:07.82] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:12.22] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:12.22] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=5712 Proc=svchost.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:12.22] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:12.22] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:15.31] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:20.16] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:20.16] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=5712 Proc=svchost.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:20.16] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:20.16] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:22.87] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:27.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:27.15] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=5712 Proc=svchost.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:27.15] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:27.15] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:29.89] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:34.18] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:34.18] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:34.18] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:34.18] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:34.61] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:39.14] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:39.14] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:39.14] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:39.14] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:39.14] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=5712 Proc=svchost.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:39.14] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:39.14] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:42.12] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:47.20] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:47.20] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:47.20] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:47.20] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=5712 Proc=svchost.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:47.20] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:47.20] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:50.16] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:55.21] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:55.21] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:55.21] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:55.21] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:55.21] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:55.21] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:01:55.84] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:00.13] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:00.13] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:00.13] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:00.13] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:00.13] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:00.13] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=5712 Proc=svchost.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:00.13] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:00.13] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:03.30] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:08.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:08.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:08.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:08.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:08.15] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=5712 Proc=svchost.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:08.15] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:08.15] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:11.29] monitoring...
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:16.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:16.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:16.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:16.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:16.15] PID=0 Proc=System
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:16.15] PID=9452 Proc=psiphon-tunnel-core.exe
[Thu 10/16/2025 6:02:16.79] monitoring...

Here is the script (obviously, change the paths to suit your preferences). @echo off
REM C:\data\sys\batch\checkwindowsupdate.bat 20251016 version 1.0
REM This is version 1.5
REM Tool to log details (i.e., use of proxy) when an update scan is done.
REM v1.0 20251016, 91 lines
REM Runs "usoclient StartScan" to kick off a Windows Update check.
REM Optionally run "usoclient StartInteractiveScan" for a deeper scan.
REM Every 5 seconds, checks for connections on port 3095.
REM For each PID using that port, resolves the process name
REM (svchost.exe for Windows Update).
REM Creates a timestamped log file in C:\data\sys\log\.
REM Appends timestamp + PID + process name to the log.
REM v1.1 20251016, 101 lines
REM Modified the port to be a variable
REM Padded single-digit timestamps in logfile for consistent sorting
REM v1.2 20251016, 113 lines
REM Added highlight for the wuauserv process
REM If the process is not svchost.exe, it logs normally.
REM If it is svchost.exe, it runs a quick PowerShell check:
REM Which looks up the services hosted by that PID.
REM If one of them is wuauserv, it writes a highlighted line:
REM [date time] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=736 Proc=svchost.exe
REM Otherwise, it logs normally.
REM v1.3 20251016, 118 lines
REM Fixed %%a was used but never set, which breaks the inner loop.
REM v1.4 20251016, 123 lines
REM Commented out "usoclient StartScan" because it won't run if cached
REM Added "usoclient StartInteractiveScan" as it will run even if cached
REM v1.5 20251016, 138 lines
REM Added a heartbeat to confirm the loop is alive
REM Gave up on the usoclient commands above.
REM Don't want to make the script not work on everyone else's PC
REM But if I wanted to run the update in this script, I need to do this
REM Install-Module PSWindowsUpdate
REM Import-Module PSWindowsUpdate
REM Get-WindowsUpdate -MicrosoftUpdate -AcceptAll -IgnoreReboot
REM Install-Module PSWindowsUpdate
REM But even that requires admin so let's just run the update in the GUI
REM So this is no longer a tool to trigger Windows Update & log proxy hits
REM It just logs proxy hits when the Windows Update is manually triggered.
REM Comment linelength limit ================================================== REM 567890 1234567890 1234567890 1234567890 1234567890 1234567890 1234567890 12 :: This is how to tell if Windows Update is CONFIGURED to use the proxy.
::
:: Win+R > cmd {ctrl+shft+rtn}
:: C:\> netsh winhttp show proxy
::
:: a. If it shows this, Windows Update is going straight out to the internet: :: Direct access (no proxy server)
:: b. If it shows something like this, Windows Update is using the proxy:
:: Proxy Server(s) : http=127.0.0.1:8080;https=127.0.0.1:8080
::
:: Mine showed this:
:: Current WinHTTP proxy settings:
:: Proxy Server(s) : http=127.0.0.1:3095;https=127.0.0.1:3095;socks=127.0.0.1:1080
:: Bypass List : <local>;10.*;172.16.*;172.17.*;172.18.*;172.19.*;172.20.*;172.21.*;172.22.*;172.23.*;172.24.*;172.25.*;172.26.*;172.27.*;172.28.*;172.29.*;172.30.*;172.31.*;192.168.*;169.254.*;[fc*];[fd*];[fe8*];[fe9*];[fea*];[feb*]
::
:: Regarding: http=127.0.0.1:3095;https=127.0.0.1:3095
:: This means WinHTTP (and therefore Windows Update) is configured to send all HTTP and HTTPS traffic through a local proxy listening on port 3095.
::
:: Regarding: socks=127.0.0.1:1080
:: Unfortunately, even though there is a socks line, WinHTTP does not support SOCKS. It will ignore that part. Only the HTTP/HTTPS entries matter.
::
:: Regarding: <local>;10.*;172.16.* iK 192.168.*;169.254.*;[fc*];[fd*];[fe*]
:: This means private/internal addresses are excluded from the proxy.
::
:: This is how to tell if Windows Update is actually USING the proxy!
::
:: Set up two windows, one of which is an admin window for Powershell:
:: Trigger a Windows Update scan manually in the Powershell admin window.
:: PS:> usoclient StartScan
:: Trigger a scan to watch port 3095 while that's running:
:: C:\> netstat -ano | findstr :3095
:: TCP 127.0.0.1:3095 0.0.0.0:0 LISTENING 9452 :: TCP 127.0.0.1:3095 127.0.0.1:3151 ESTABLISHED 9452 :: TCP 127.0.0.1:3143 127.0.0.1:3095 TIME_WAIT 0
:: TCP 127.0.0.1:3144 127.0.0.1:3095 TIME_WAIT 0
:: TCP 127.0.0.1:3145 127.0.0.1:3095 TIME_WAIT 0
:: TCP 127.0.0.1:3151 127.0.0.1:3095 ESTABLISHED 9108 ::
:: Rather than race the clock, we can run the netstat every second first.
:: C:\> netstat -ano 1 | findstr :3095
:: This proves that the process found is the Windows Update service
:: PS C:\Windows\system32> Get-CimInstance Win32_Service | Where-Object { $_.ProcessId -eq 736 } | Select-Object Name, DisplayName
::
:: Name DisplayName
:: ---- -----------
:: wuauserv Windows Update
::
::
:: NOTE: Port 3095 is used here because that's the port our local
:: HTTP-to-SOCKS proxy is configured to listen on.
:: You can verify this by checking your WinHTTP proxy settings:
:: netsh winhttp show proxy
:: If it shows http=127.0.0.1:3095, then this script will work as-is.
:: Otherwise, update the port number below to match your actual proxy listener.

set PROXYPORT=3095

set LOGDIR=C:\data\sys\log
if not exist "%LOGDIR%" md "%LOGDIR%"

set hour=%TIME:~0,2%
if "%hour:~0,1%"==" " set hour=0%hour:~1,1%

set LOGFILE=%LOGDIR%\update_proxy_hits_%DATE:~10,4%%DATE:~4,2%%DATE:~7,2%_%hour%%TIME:~3,2%%TIME:~6,2%.log

echo Starting Windows Update scan and proxy logging...
echo Log file: %LOGFILE%
echo Press Ctrl+C to stop.
echo ============================================== >> "%LOGFILE%"
echo [%DATE% %TIME%] Starting scan >> "%LOGFILE%"

:: Trigger Windows Update scan (might not run if results are recently cached) REM usoclient StartScan
:: Trigger Windows Update scan (should trigger even if it was cached recently) usoclient StartInteractiveScan

:: Continuous logging of connections to port 3095
:loop
for /f "tokens=5" %%a in ('netstat -ano ^| findstr :%PROXYPORT%') do (
for /f "tokens=1,*" %%b in ('tasklist /fi "PID eq %%a" /fo table /nh 2^>nul') do (
if /i "%%b"=="svchost.exe" (
rem Check if this svchost is hosting Windows Update
powershell -command "if ((Get-CimInstance Win32_Service | Where-Object { $_.ProcessId -eq %%a }).Name -eq 'wuauserv') { Write-Output '[%DATE% %TIME%] *** WINDOWS UPDATE HIT *** PID=%%a Proc=%%b' } else { Write-Output '[%DATE% %TIME%] PID=%%a Proc=%%b' }" >> "%LOGFILE%"
) else (
echo [%DATE% %TIME%] PID=%%a Proc=%%b >> "%LOGFILE%"
)
)
)

:: Add a heartbeat to confirm the loop is alive
echo [%DATE% %TIME%] monitoring... >> "%LOGFILE%"
timeout /t 5 >nul

goto loop

:: end of C:\data\sys\batch\checkwindowsupdate.bat
--
The main point of Usenet is for intelligent people to help each other, &
for results to be archived so that anyone can access our immense knowledge.
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From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

MikeS wrote:

The free ESU option does NOT force backing up your data to MS OneDrive.
The enforced backup is the Windows preferences and app list which
involves their servers but is not part of monitored OneDrive usage.

Windows 11 requires *consumers* to have an MSA to use the OS, not an organisation which by Microsoft's definition is anyone with Windows Pro
and a network domain server.

It's useful that MikeS added that information as it shows that most of us
have only some of this Microsoft stuff figured out, but not all of it.

The free Windows 10 ESU program doesn't force you to back up all your files
to OneDrive, but it does require enabling the Windows Backup app, which
uses OneDrive infrastructure to sync preferences, credentials, and app
lists.

File backup is optional, but the mechanism is still tied to OneDrive.

On Windows 11, you're right that consumers must use a Microsoft Account
where both Home and Pro editions enforce this during setup unless the
device is domain-joined or provisioned by an organization. In
organizational contexts (domain-joined PCs), the MSA requirement doesn't
apply.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

In alt.comp.os.windows-11 Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:

On Wed, 15 Oct 2025 11:06:50 -0000 (UTC), Marion <marionf@fact.com>
wrote:

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to >create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to >creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

While I'm not so concerned with privacy, I do have some questions
about Microsoft accounts, which seem to be compulsory with the latest versions of Windows 11.

It is still possible to have a local account on Windows 11. The tricks
to get one change over time. *If* Microsoft ever closes all doors, you
can install Windows 11 with a Microsoft Account and after installation
convert that account back to a local account.

Bottom line: No problem.

I am wary about backing up stuff on OneDrive, because of Microsofts predilection for making new versions incompatible with older ones. If
I back up on OneDrive, who's to say a future update won't make it inaccessible to me?

Then don't backup to OneDrive. I don't. Anyway, the default free
OneDrive is only 5GB, way too little for most people.

That happened with DropBox, Sounded like a good idea, so I started
using it to sync files between my desktop and my laptop and my wife's
laptop. But then along came an update, and it stopped working on my
desktop. For a while I got around that by syncing using a flash drive,
and backing up to dropbox from the laptop. But another update might
knock that out too.

And if it happens with DropBox, it's also likely to happen with
OneDrive and GoogleDrive and so on.

And there's this story that you've got to be online to install Windows
11 properly.

See above. Mostly FUD, but if you don't want to use the tricks, yes
you need to be online during install (unless you have Windows Pro).

Does that mean you always have to be online to use it? If
I take my laptop to the archives to record my research, and they don't
have public wi-fi, does that mean I won't be able to use my laptop at
all?

No of course you don't have to be online to use it (Windows 11). FYI,
I use my Windows 11 laptop in outback Australia where there *is no*
Internet, full stop (except pay-through-the-nose satellite Internet).
That's the whole point of a laptop, that you can use it everywhere, with
or without Internet.

[More of the same deleted.]

To put it simply and broadly, does having a Microsoft account in
effect turn your computer into a dumb terminal rather than a PC?

No, it doesn't. It basically doesn't change much, but it's of course
easier for Microsoft to get information about/from you, especially if
you answer yes to all the questions you get and will get.

Bottom line: Don't worry about a Microsoft Account. If you don't mind
or want one, fine. If you (like me) don't want one, fine as well.
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

On 10/16/2025 6:08 AM, Marion wrote:

...winston wrote:

John K.Eason wrote:

In article <10cp84m$3tkqq$2@dont-email.me>, alan@invalid.com (Alan K.) wrote:

The OP also states he's on 22H2 which is 2 versions back. I would
think he's want to be on 24H2.

The final major release version of Windows 10 is 22H2 so I don't know where you
got 24H2 from!

Most likely thinking about Windows 11 not Windows 10.

This will show our exact Windows version and build.

systeminfo | findstr /B /C:"OS Name" /C:"OS Version"

Mine reports:
OS Name: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro
OS Version: 10.0.19045 N/A Build 19045

That would be 22H2.
10.0.19045 Latest Build is 6456
i.e. no 24H2 for Windows 10


24H2 is Windows 11
10.0.26100 Latest Build is 6899

Fyi...
Instead of using systeminfo in PS which does not show the current build,
just use winver in Windows
StartMenu button, type winver, on the promted screen click enter or open.
--
...w-i|#-o-#-n|#
--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2

From Newsgroup: alt.comp.os.windows-10

Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:

On Wed, 15 Oct 2025 11:06:50 -0000 (UTC), Marion <marionf@fact.com>
wrote:

Today, October 15th, 2025, I am no longer getting Windows 10 updates.

Any ideas for me, and for anyone in the same situation who does NOT wish to >> create a privacy-robbing MSA account, or, if it's a must, then how best to >> creatre that privacy-robbing MSA account with the least loss of privacy?

While I'm not so concerned with privacy, I do have some questions
about Microsoft accounts, which seem to be compulsory with the latest versions of Windows 11.

I am wary about backing up stuff on OneDrive, because of Microsofts predilection for making new versions incompatible with older ones. If
I back up on OneDrive, who's to say a future update won't make it inaccessible to me?

OneDrive is integrated into Windows so as long as you have an up-to-date Windows you'll be fine.

That happened with DropBox, Sounded like a good idea, so I started
using it to sync files between my desktop and my laptop and my wife's
laptop. But then along came an update, and it stopped working on my
desktop. For a while I got around that by syncing using a flash drive,
and backing up to dropbox from the laptop. But another update might
knock that out too.

I'm surprised to read this. I've had dropbox for at least 10 years over multiple systems. Never had this issue.

And if it happens with DropBox, it's also likely to happen with
OneDrive and GoogleDrive and so on.

And there's this story that you've got to be online to install Windows
11 properly. Does that mean you always have to be online to use it? If
I take my laptop to the archives to record my research, and they don't
have public wi-fi, does that mean I won't be able to use my laptop at
all?

And what happens if the power goes off?

I have a laptop because it has a battery and I can use it away from
mains electricity, or when there's a power failure. But if it won't
work when it's not online, there's not much point, is there?

To put it simply and broadly, does having a Microsoft account in
effect turn your computer into a dumb terminal rather than a PC?

Not an issue. A requirement for being always online would fail in so many scenarios - including your suggestions - that it can't happen.


--- Synchronet 3.21a-Linux NewsLink 1.2