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I recently came across an old S-VHS recorder in the loft. It's many
years since I had a look inside and after doing so again wondered if
these were the most complex domestic devices ever designed and
manufactured. This particular recorder was a JVC HR-S5000EK (rebadged in
the UK as a Ferguson FR39S). I bought it as an ex-demo machine in 1991.
The cassette motor inside has a date of 26 September 1988.
Some photos...
Main view after removing case:
<https://ibb.co/27FWL7j>
View after folding back main (video) board:
<https://ibb.co/T4PYj0V>
Close-up of a couple of added components on the video board (see below). <https://ibb.co/X2bFpmS>
Some questions. Any idea what the two added "black boxes" are (one is
shown in the close-up)? They are 10mm square and 4 - 5mm high, with no markings and appear to be made of hard rubber (not epoxy). This is a
close-up of where one of the black boxes on the video board would appear
(PCB in service manual from Elektrotanya). Basically it is above C23 and
to the left of Q35.
<https://ibb.co/t3n09WF>
Another puzzle involves the added resistor under IC3 (it is on a small insulated pad. The colours aren't completely clear but it could be 18k
1%). On the board layout diagram something is shown as C178 where this resistor appears, which is under the board where IC3 is. These mods
aren't shown in the service manual.
Finally, also shown on the PCB layout diagram is something designated
B55 (between IC3 and the PCB?). What might this be? Unfortunately the
whole service manual is an image and so not searchable. There are
several other "Bnn" designations on the video and other boards, but they always seem to appear under an IC, between it and the PCB. Nothing in
the "Electrical parts list" is designated "Bnn". Is it just a link of
some sort?
The video recorder itself still plays back cassettes without problem, although the remote control has long since disappeared. Of course, as
there are no analogue channels for it to record from it's of little use.
It is, however, remarkable that 30+ years-old tapes play without
apparent error, and it is even possible to read the day's text news and information (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceefax>) on the S-VHS
cassettes.
I recently came across an old S-VHS recorder in the loft. It's many
years since I had a look inside and after doing so again wondered if
these were the most complex domestic devices ever designed and
manufactured. This particular recorder was a JVC HR-S5000EK (rebadged in
the UK as a Ferguson FR39S). I bought it as an ex-demo machine in 1991.
The cassette motor inside has a date of 26 September 1988.
Some photos...
Main view after removing case:
<https://ibb.co/27FWL7j>
View after folding back main (video) board:
<https://ibb.co/T4PYj0V>
Close-up of a couple of added components on the video board (see below). ><https://ibb.co/X2bFpmS>
Some questions. Any idea what the two added "black boxes" are (one is
shown in the close-up)? They are 10mm square and 4 - 5mm high, with no >markings and appear to be made of hard rubber (not epoxy). This is a
close-up of where one of the black boxes on the video board would appear
(PCB in service manual from Elektrotanya). Basically it is above C23 and
to the left of Q35.
<https://ibb.co/t3n09WF>
Another puzzle involves the added resistor under IC3 (it is on a small >insulated pad. The colours aren't completely clear but it could be 18k
1%). On the board layout diagram something is shown as C178 where this >resistor appears, which is under the board where IC3 is. These mods
aren't shown in the service manual.
Finally, also shown on the PCB layout diagram is something designated
B55 (between IC3 and the PCB?). What might this be? Unfortunately the
whole service manual is an image and so not searchable. There are
several other "Bnn" designations on the video and other boards, but they >always seem to appear under an IC, between it and the PCB. Nothing in
the "Electrical parts list" is designated "Bnn". Is it just a link of
some sort?
The video recorder itself still plays back cassettes without problem, >although the remote control has long since disappeared. Of course, as
there are no analogue channels for it to record from it's of little use.
It is, however, remarkable that 30+ years-old tapes play without
apparent error, and it is even possible to read the day's text news and >information (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceefax>) on the S-VHS cassettes.
I recently came across an old S-VHS recorder in the loft. It's many
years since I had a look inside and after doing so again wondered if
these were the most complex domestic devices ever designed and
manufactured. This particular recorder was a JVC HR-S5000EK (rebadged in
the UK as a Ferguson FR39S). I bought it as an ex-demo machine in 1991.
The cassette motor inside has a date of 26 September 1988.
Some photos...
Main view after removing case:
<https://ibb.co/27FWL7j>
View after folding back main (video) board:
<https://ibb.co/T4PYj0V>
Close-up of a couple of added components on the video board (see below). <https://ibb.co/X2bFpmS>
Some questions. Any idea what the two added "black boxes" are (one is
shown in the close-up)? They are 10mm square and 4 - 5mm high, with no markings and appear to be made of hard rubber (not epoxy). This is a
close-up of where one of the black boxes on the video board would appear
(PCB in service manual from Elektrotanya). Basically it is above C23 and
to the left of Q35.
<https://ibb.co/t3n09WF>
Another puzzle involves the added resistor under IC3 (it is on a small insulated pad. The colours aren't completely clear but it could be 18k
1%). On the board layout diagram something is shown as C178 where this resistor appears, which is under the board where IC3 is. These mods
aren't shown in the service manual.
Finally, also shown on the PCB layout diagram is something designated
B55 (between IC3 and the PCB?). What might this be? Unfortunately the
whole service manual is an image and so not searchable. There are
several other "Bnn" designations on the video and other boards, but they always seem to appear under an IC, between it and the PCB. Nothing in
the "Electrical parts list" is designated "Bnn". Is it just a link of
some sort?
I recently came across an old S-VHS recorder in the loft. It's many
years since I had a look inside and after doing so again wondered if
these were the most complex domestic devices ever designed and
manufactured. This particular recorder was a JVC HR-S5000EK (rebadged in
the UK as a Ferguson FR39S). I bought it as an ex-demo machine in 1991.
The cassette motor inside has a date of 26 September 1988.
Some photos...
Main view after removing case:
<https://ibb.co/27FWL7j>
View after folding back main (video) board:
<https://ibb.co/T4PYj0V>
Close-up of a couple of added components on the video board (see below). <https://ibb.co/X2bFpmS>
Some questions. Any idea what the two added "black boxes" are (one is
shown in the close-up)? They are 10mm square and 4 - 5mm high, with no markings and appear to be made of hard rubber (not epoxy). This is a
close-up of where one of the black boxes on the video board would appear
(PCB in service manual from Elektrotanya). Basically it is above C23 and
to the left of Q35.
<https://ibb.co/t3n09WF>
Another puzzle involves the added resistor under IC3 (it is on a small insulated pad. The colours aren't completely clear but it could be 18k
1%). On the board layout diagram something is shown as C178 where this resistor appears, which is under the board where IC3 is. These mods
aren't shown in the service manual.
Finally, also shown on the PCB layout diagram is something designated
B55 (between IC3 and the PCB?). What might this be? Unfortunately the
whole service manual is an image and so not searchable. There are
several other "Bnn" designations on the video and other boards, but they always seem to appear under an IC, between it and the PCB. Nothing in
the "Electrical parts list" is designated "Bnn". Is it just a link of
some sort?
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:13:40 +0000, Jeff Layman wrote:
I recently came across an old S-VHS recorder in the loft. It's many
years since I had a look inside and after doing so again wondered if
these were the most complex domestic devices ever designed and
manufactured. This particular recorder was a JVC HR-S5000EK (rebadged in
the UK as a Ferguson FR39S). I bought it as an ex-demo machine in 1991.
The cassette motor inside has a date of 26 September 1988.
Some photos...
Main view after removing case:
<https://ibb.co/27FWL7j>
View after folding back main (video) board:
<https://ibb.co/T4PYj0V>
Close-up of a couple of added components on the video board (see below).
<https://ibb.co/X2bFpmS>
Some questions. Any idea what the two added "black boxes" are (one is
shown in the close-up)? They are 10mm square and 4 - 5mm high, with no
markings and appear to be made of hard rubber (not epoxy). This is a
close-up of where one of the black boxes on the video board would appear
(PCB in service manual from Elektrotanya). Basically it is above C23 and
to the left of Q35.
<https://ibb.co/t3n09WF>
Another puzzle involves the added resistor under IC3 (it is on a small
insulated pad. The colours aren't completely clear but it could be 18k
1%). On the board layout diagram something is shown as C178 where this
resistor appears, which is under the board where IC3 is. These mods
aren't shown in the service manual.
Finally, also shown on the PCB layout diagram is something designated
B55 (between IC3 and the PCB?). What might this be? Unfortunately the
whole service manual is an image and so not searchable. There are
several other "Bnn" designations on the video and other boards, but they
always seem to appear under an IC, between it and the PCB. Nothing in
the "Electrical parts list" is designated "Bnn". Is it just a link of
some sort?
The video recorder itself still plays back cassettes without problem,
although the remote control has long since disappeared. Of course, as
there are no analogue channels for it to record from it's of little use.
It is, however, remarkable that 30+ years-old tapes play without
apparent error, and it is even possible to read the day's text news and
information (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceefax>) on the S-VHS
cassettes.
The engineering on the better ones (JVC made better ones) is impressive
for sure. Even if you can't record on it any more, you can still play old tapes of your own and any you might pick up at boot fairs. Who knows what
you might find on them? Could be a fun hobby! I'm quite surprised the
belts haven't stretched or perished after all this time, though. Must have used good quality rubber.
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:13:40 +0000, Jeff Layman <Jeff@invalid.invalid>
wrote:
I recently came across an old S-VHS recorder in the loft. It's many
years since I had a look inside and after doing so again wondered if
these were the most complex domestic devices ever designed and
manufactured. This particular recorder was a JVC HR-S5000EK (rebadged in
the UK as a Ferguson FR39S). I bought it as an ex-demo machine in 1991.
The cassette motor inside has a date of 26 September 1988.
Some photos...
Main view after removing case:
<https://ibb.co/27FWL7j>
View after folding back main (video) board:
<https://ibb.co/T4PYj0V>
Close-up of a couple of added components on the video board (see below).
<https://ibb.co/X2bFpmS>
Some questions. Any idea what the two added "black boxes" are (one is
shown in the close-up)? They are 10mm square and 4 - 5mm high, with no
markings and appear to be made of hard rubber (not epoxy). This is a
close-up of where one of the black boxes on the video board would appear
(PCB in service manual from Elektrotanya). Basically it is above C23 and
to the left of Q35.
<https://ibb.co/t3n09WF>
Another puzzle involves the added resistor under IC3 (it is on a small
insulated pad. The colours aren't completely clear but it could be 18k
1%). On the board layout diagram something is shown as C178 where this
resistor appears, which is under the board where IC3 is. These mods
aren't shown in the service manual.
Finally, also shown on the PCB layout diagram is something designated
B55 (between IC3 and the PCB?). What might this be? Unfortunately the
whole service manual is an image and so not searchable. There are
several other "Bnn" designations on the video and other boards, but they
always seem to appear under an IC, between it and the PCB. Nothing in
the "Electrical parts list" is designated "Bnn". Is it just a link of
some sort?
The video recorder itself still plays back cassettes without problem,
although the remote control has long since disappeared. Of course, as
there are no analogue channels for it to record from it's of little use.
It is, however, remarkable that 30+ years-old tapes play without
apparent error, and it is even possible to read the day's text news and
information (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceefax>) on the S-VHS cassettes.
I'm still amazed that videotapes worked at all, much less were
reliable and affordable.
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity, people who
knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularly back in the day but I've never had much luck if the unit has a serious fault, and the service manuals I've seen tend to be pretty unhelpful.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now particularly the laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a few decades I expect there will be almost none in working condition. like the Chevy Vega.
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone will really miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
Might be interesting to see what's around at boot fairs - VHS tapes are often almost given away.
I've got to get a decent SCART cable as the old one came apart in my hands. I can use component (phono connectors) as well. But S-VHS recorders predate HDMI,
and my newest (4-years old) Panasonic TV has only HDMI and component input. An
older TV has SCART, component, and a 4-pin s-video input. I'm pretty sure that
I no longer have a 4-pin cable! It seems that the older TV can also use the SCART input to detect S-VHS if the recorder generates a signal on pin 15. It probably did that, but I always used to connect via a 4-pin s-video cable with
a much older CRT TV.
That HR-S5000EK stopped recording around 1998 and I replaced it with a new JVC
HR-S8600EK. I also brought that down from the loft and it worked perfectly after I removed a cassette I'd left in it! It jammed up a bit when I first turned it on, but I eventually got it out. As far as I remember that machine was still recording well when I replaced it with a Panasonic DVD-RAM DMR55E recorder (also analogue only; no HDMI).
As you say, any rubber used must have been of exceptional quality as both machines have survived 12+ years in the loft with temperatures cycling from 0 to 40°C or more. By the way, I paid £699 for that ex-demo recorder in 1991 -
the price for a new one was £999!
On 1/5/2025 12:28 PM, bitrex wrote:
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity,
people who knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularly
back in the day but I've never had much luck if the unit has a serious
fault, and the service manuals I've seen tend to be pretty unhelpful.
CD players are relatively trivial, compared to VCRs. There is NO "media handling" other than hoping the user installs the medium on the spindle correctly.
By contrast, a VCR has to extract the tape from the cassette (after
opening the access door and unlocking the reels) and pull it around the rotating head assembly. Then, has to ensure the alignment of the head
tracks the magnetic slices laid down on the medium, in real time.
As well as having to ensure the *mechanism* is operating at the right
"rate of speed" to ensure the video signal complies with that expected downstream.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now
particularly the laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a few
decades I expect there will be almost none in working condition. like
the Chevy Vega.
If you resign yourself to using drives intended for use with computers
(even having audio output capability), you can rescue as many as you can carry!
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone will
really miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
The CD was a huge step up from vinyl. No fussing with tracking, warped media, dust and other contaminants, etc. Play it the Nth time and it's
just as faithful to the source as the first!
*Mini* CDs were a complete waste of time.
<https://blogscanada.ca/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/dvd_rewinder_gr.jpg>
On 1/5/2025 12:48 PM, Jeff Layman wrote:
Might be interesting to see what's around at boot fairs - VHS tapes are often
almost given away.
You may find that what's ON the tape is not what the label indicates! :>
We stopped accepting VCR tapes as donations because, often, folks would overwrite the original content -- often with "home videos" of "dubious" intent...
I'm still using a JVC HR-S9911U for "tape-to-digital" transfers.
<https://support.jvc.com/consumer/product.jsp?modelId=MODL026935>
No value for OTA broadcasts. I don't think you can even set the *time*
on it, nowadays!
On 05/01/2025 22:02, Don Y wrote:
On 1/5/2025 12:48 PM, Jeff Layman wrote:
Might be interesting to see what's around at boot fairs - VHS tapes are often
almost given away.
You may find that what's ON the tape is not what the label indicates! :> >>
We stopped accepting VCR tapes as donations because, often, folks would
overwrite the original content -- often with "home videos" of "dubious"
intent...
Well, "Dirty Harry" might be referring to another Harry...! :-)))
I'm still using a JVC HR-S9911U for "tape-to-digital" transfers.
<https://support.jvc.com/consumer/product.jsp?modelId=MODL026935> >> No value for OTA broadcasts. I don't think you can even set the *time*
on it, nowadays!
I see that the manual for that machine is dated mid-2002. I had a look and noticed that it had s-video but not SCART sockets. Was it usual for cassette video recorders sold in the US to not have SCART sockets? It seems a bit
strange as both the JVC recorders I bought had them. Perhaps there was a greater cost saving to be had by designing them out than having a single case which included them. Whatever, it still shows how good JVC machines are as you're still using yours even though it's approaching 25 years old!
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:13:40 +0000, Jeff Layman <Jeff@invalid.invalid>
wrote:
I recently came across an old S-VHS recorder in the loft. It's many
years since I had a look inside and after doing so again wondered if
these were the most complex domestic devices ever designed and
manufactured. This particular recorder was a JVC HR-S5000EK (rebadged in
the UK as a Ferguson FR39S). I bought it as an ex-demo machine in 1991.
The cassette motor inside has a date of 26 September 1988.
Some photos...
Main view after removing case:
<https://ibb.co/27FWL7j>
View after folding back main (video) board:
<https://ibb.co/T4PYj0V>
Close-up of a couple of added components on the video board (see below).
<https://ibb.co/X2bFpmS>
Some questions. Any idea what the two added "black boxes" are (one is
shown in the close-up)? They are 10mm square and 4 - 5mm high, with no
markings and appear to be made of hard rubber (not epoxy). This is a
close-up of where one of the black boxes on the video board would appear
(PCB in service manual from Elektrotanya). Basically it is above C23 and
to the left of Q35.
<https://ibb.co/t3n09WF>
Another puzzle involves the added resistor under IC3 (it is on a small
insulated pad. The colours aren't completely clear but it could be 18k
1%). On the board layout diagram something is shown as C178 where this
resistor appears, which is under the board where IC3 is. These mods
aren't shown in the service manual.
Finally, also shown on the PCB layout diagram is something designated
B55 (between IC3 and the PCB?). What might this be? Unfortunately the
whole service manual is an image and so not searchable. There are
several other "Bnn" designations on the video and other boards, but they
always seem to appear under an IC, between it and the PCB. Nothing in
the "Electrical parts list" is designated "Bnn". Is it just a link of
some sort?
The video recorder itself still plays back cassettes without problem,
although the remote control has long since disappeared. Of course, as
there are no analogue channels for it to record from it's of little use.
It is, however, remarkable that 30+ years-old tapes play without
apparent error, and it is even possible to read the day's text news and
information (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceefax>) on the S-VHS cassettes.
I'm still amazed that videotapes worked at all, much less were
reliable and affordable.
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 13:24:22 -0700, Don Y wrote:
On 1/5/2025 12:28 PM, bitrex wrote:
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity,
people who knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularly
back in the day but I've never had much luck if the unit has a serious
fault, and the service manuals I've seen tend to be pretty unhelpful.
CD players are relatively trivial, compared to VCRs. There is NO "media
handling" other than hoping the user installs the medium on the spindle
correctly.
By contrast, a VCR has to extract the tape from the cassette (after
opening the access door and unlocking the reels) and pull it around the
rotating head assembly. Then, has to ensure the alignment of the head
tracks the magnetic slices laid down on the medium, in real time.
As well as having to ensure the *mechanism* is operating at the right
"rate of speed" to ensure the video signal complies with that expected
downstream.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now
particularly the laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a few
decades I expect there will be almost none in working condition. like
the Chevy Vega.
If you resign yourself to using drives intended for use with computers
(even having audio output capability), you can rescue as many as you can
carry!
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone will
really miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
The CD was a huge step up from vinyl. No fussing with tracking, warped
media, dust and other contaminants, etc. Play it the Nth time and it's
just as faithful to the source as the first!
True, but there must be *something* about vinyl that more than compensates for its shortcomings, given the fact that prices for old turntables have soared and record shops are now stocking vinyl albums again.
On 1/5/2025 12:28 PM, bitrex wrote:
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity, people who
knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularly back in the day but >> I've never had much luck if the unit has a serious fault, and the service
manuals I've seen tend to be pretty unhelpful.
CD players are relatively trivial, compared to VCRs. There is NO
"media handling" other than hoping the user installs the medium
on the spindle correctly.
By contrast, a VCR has to extract the tape from the cassette (after
opening the access door and unlocking the reels) and pull it around the >rotating head assembly. Then, has to ensure the alignment of the
head tracks the magnetic slices laid down on the medium, in real time.
As well as having to ensure the *mechanism* is operating at the right
"rate of speed" to ensure the video signal complies with that expected >downstream.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now particularly the
laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a few decades I expect there
will be almost none in working condition. like the Chevy Vega.
If you resign yourself to using drives intended for use with computers
(even having audio output capability), you can rescue as many as you can >carry!
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone will really >> miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
The CD was a huge step up from vinyl. No fussing with tracking, warped >media, dust and other contaminants, etc. Play it the Nth time and it's
just as faithful to the source as the first!
*Mini* CDs were a complete waste of time.
<https://blogscanada.ca/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/dvd_rewinder_gr.jpg>
On 1/6/25 01:19, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 13:24:22 -0700, Don Y wrote:
On 1/5/2025 12:28 PM, bitrex wrote:
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity,
people who knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularly
back in the day but I've never had much luck if the unit has a serious >>>> fault, and the service manuals I've seen tend to be pretty unhelpful.
CD players are relatively trivial, compared to VCRs. There is NO "media >>> handling" other than hoping the user installs the medium on the spindle
correctly.
By contrast, a VCR has to extract the tape from the cassette (after
opening the access door and unlocking the reels) and pull it around the
rotating head assembly. Then, has to ensure the alignment of the head
tracks the magnetic slices laid down on the medium, in real time.
As well as having to ensure the *mechanism* is operating at the right
"rate of speed" to ensure the video signal complies with that expected
downstream.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now
particularly the laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a few >>>> decades I expect there will be almost none in working condition. like
the Chevy Vega.
If you resign yourself to using drives intended for use with computers
(even having audio output capability), you can rescue as many as you can >>> carry!
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone will
really miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
The CD was a huge step up from vinyl. No fussing with tracking, warped >>> media, dust and other contaminants, etc. Play it the Nth time and it's >>> just as faithful to the source as the first!
True, but there must be *something* about vinyl that more than
compensates
for its shortcomings, given the fact that prices for old turntables have
soared and record shops are now stocking vinyl albums again.
Vinyl sales have been higher than CD sale for years and growing
something like 20% per year while CD sales drop like a rock
On 1/6/2025 6:57 AM, Lasse Langwadt wrote:
On 1/6/25 01:19, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 13:24:22 -0700, Don Y wrote:
On 1/5/2025 12:28 PM, bitrex wrote:
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity, >>>>> people who knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularlyCD players are relatively trivial, compared to VCRs. There is NO "media >>>> handling" other than hoping the user installs the medium on the spindle >>>> correctly.
back in the day but I've never had much luck if the unit has a serious >>>>> fault, and the service manuals I've seen tend to be pretty unhelpful. >>>>
By contrast, a VCR has to extract the tape from the cassette (after
opening the access door and unlocking the reels) and pull it around the >>>> rotating head assembly. Then, has to ensure the alignment of the head >>>> tracks the magnetic slices laid down on the medium, in real time.
As well as having to ensure the *mechanism* is operating at the right
"rate of speed" to ensure the video signal complies with that expected >>>> downstream.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now
particularly the laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a few >>>>> decades I expect there will be almost none in working condition. like >>>>> the Chevy Vega.
If you resign yourself to using drives intended for use with computers >>>> (even having audio output capability), you can rescue as many as you can >>>> carry!
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone will >>>>> really miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
The CD was a huge step up from vinyl. No fussing with tracking, warped >>>> media, dust and other contaminants, etc. Play it the Nth time and it's >>>> just as faithful to the source as the first!
True, but there must be *something* about vinyl that more than compensates >>> for its shortcomings, given the fact that prices for old turntables have >>> soared and record shops are now stocking vinyl albums again.
Vinyl sales have been higher than CD sale for years and growing something
like 20% per year while CD sales drop like a rock
The album art is bigger on LPs, and they have more distortion (warmth.)
Also as I somewhat mentioned before they haven't made _good_ standalone CD players at a consumer-friendly price point in like 25-30 years. New cars don't
come with CD players anymore. Very few laptops have optical drives anymore.
And a lot of the more budget models even in the early 90s were getting
enshittified and cost-reduced. And once the laser diode on them goes that's it,
I've read that audiophiles have started resorting to cannibalizing cheaper units with the same mechanism to keep higher end ones going.
Meanwhile there are probably like 50 million Technics SL-whatever turntables floating around in generally working condition they made basically the same turntable for like 40 years.
I'm still using a JVC HR-S9911U for "tape-to-digital" transfers.
<https://support.jvc.com/consumer/product.jsp?modelId=MODL026935> >>> No value for OTA broadcasts. I don't think you can even set the *time* >>> on it, nowadays!
I see that the manual for that machine is dated mid-2002. I had a look and >> noticed that it had s-video but not SCART sockets. Was it usual for cassette >> video recorders sold in the US to not have SCART sockets? It seems a bit
SCART never caught on, here. Composite video with separate ("stereo")
audio on 3 phono plugs was the "hi end" way for home video interconnect. Early game consoles (and computers!) used RF modulators.
On 1/6/25 01:19, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 13:24:22 -0700, Don Y wrote:
On 1/5/2025 12:28 PM, bitrex wrote:
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity,
people who knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularly
back in the day but I've never had much luck if the unit has a serious >>> fault, and the service manuals I've seen tend to be pretty unhelpful.
CD players are relatively trivial, compared to VCRs. There is NO "media >> handling" other than hoping the user installs the medium on the spindle
correctly.
By contrast, a VCR has to extract the tape from the cassette (after
opening the access door and unlocking the reels) and pull it around the
rotating head assembly. Then, has to ensure the alignment of the head
tracks the magnetic slices laid down on the medium, in real time.
As well as having to ensure the *mechanism* is operating at the right
"rate of speed" to ensure the video signal complies with that expected
downstream.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now
particularly the laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a few >>> decades I expect there will be almost none in working condition. like
the Chevy Vega.
If you resign yourself to using drives intended for use with computers
(even having audio output capability), you can rescue as many as you can >> carry!
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone will
really miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
The CD was a huge step up from vinyl. No fussing with tracking, warped
media, dust and other contaminants, etc. Play it the Nth time and it's
just as faithful to the source as the first!
True, but there must be *something* about vinyl that more than compensates for its shortcomings, given the fact that prices for old turntables have soared and record shops are now stocking vinyl albums again.
Vinyl sales have been higher than CD sale for years and growing
something like 20% per year while CD sales drop like a rock
On 1/6/25 01:19, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 13:24:22 -0700, Don Y wrote:Vinyl sales have been higher than CD sale for years and growing
On 1/5/2025 12:28 PM, bitrex wrote:
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity,
people who knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularly
back in the day but I've never had much luck if the unit has a
serious fault, and the service manuals I've seen tend to be pretty
unhelpful.
CD players are relatively trivial, compared to VCRs. There is NO
"media handling" other than hoping the user installs the medium on the
spindle correctly.
By contrast, a VCR has to extract the tape from the cassette (after
opening the access door and unlocking the reels) and pull it around
the rotating head assembly. Then, has to ensure the alignment of the
head tracks the magnetic slices laid down on the medium, in real time.
As well as having to ensure the *mechanism* is operating at the right
"rate of speed" to ensure the video signal complies with that expected
downstream.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now
particularly the laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a
few decades I expect there will be almost none in working condition.
like the Chevy Vega.
If you resign yourself to using drives intended for use with computers
(even having audio output capability), you can rescue as many as you
can carry!
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone will
really miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
The CD was a huge step up from vinyl. No fussing with tracking,
warped media, dust and other contaminants, etc. Play it the Nth time
and it's just as faithful to the source as the first!
True, but there must be *something* about vinyl that more than
compensates for its shortcomings, given the fact that prices for old
turntables have soared and record shops are now stocking vinyl albums
again.
something like 20% per year while CD sales drop like a rock
Last time I saw someone walking around with a portable record player
was.... never.
The album art is bigger on LPs, and they have more distortion (warmth.)
Nostalgia. Folks also play 80's video games. Yet, you don't see
those industries ressurected so the demand is more of an oddity
than a financial reality.
Only for the "look at me!" factor. I've probably a hundred vinyl boots "just out of shrinkwrap" stored -- along with a Beogram 8000. None
have seen the light of day since they were ripped (the sound quality
isn't going to get any BETTER with use so whatever I captured originally
has been faithfully preserved (and repeatedly reproduced) each time
I listen to them -- regardless of WHERE I choose to do that (including
on cross country flights: "Miss, can I plug my turntable in, somewhere?")
On 1/6/2025 6:57 AM, Lasse Langwadt wrote:
On 1/6/25 01:19, Cursitor Doom wrote:The album art is bigger on LPs, and they have more distortion (warmth.)
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 13:24:22 -0700, Don Y wrote:Vinyl sales have been higher than CD sale for years and growing
On 1/5/2025 12:28 PM, bitrex wrote:
CD players are probably right up there for Rube Goldberg complexity, >>>>> people who knew what they're doing probably repaired them regularly
back in the day but I've never had much luck if the unit has a
serious fault, and the service manuals I've seen tend to be pretty
unhelpful.
CD players are relatively trivial, compared to VCRs. There is NO
"media handling" other than hoping the user installs the medium on
the spindle correctly.
By contrast, a VCR has to extract the tape from the cassette (after
opening the access door and unlocking the reels) and pull it around
the rotating head assembly. Then, has to ensure the alignment of the >>>> head tracks the magnetic slices laid down on the medium, in real
time.
As well as having to ensure the *mechanism* is operating at the right
"rate of speed" to ensure the video signal complies with that
expected downstream.
A lot of the parts for vintage CD players are unobtanium now
particularly the laser diode which seems to be a common fault, in a
few decades I expect there will be almost none in working condition. >>>>> like the Chevy Vega.
If you resign yourself to using drives intended for use with
computers (even having audio output capability), you can rescue as
many as you can carry!
I see why people miss vinyl sometimes but I can't imagine anyone
will really miss the CD, a real stopgap technology.
The CD was a huge step up from vinyl. No fussing with tracking,
warped media, dust and other contaminants, etc. Play it the Nth time >>>> and it's just as faithful to the source as the first!
True, but there must be *something* about vinyl that more than
compensates for its shortcomings, given the fact that prices for old
turntables have soared and record shops are now stocking vinyl albums
again.
something like 20% per year while CD sales drop like a rock
Also as I somewhat mentioned before they haven't made _good_ standalone
CD players at a consumer-friendly price point in like 25-30 years. New
cars don't come with CD players anymore. Very few laptops have optical
drives anymore.
And a lot of the more budget models even in the early 90s were getting enshittified and cost-reduced. And once the laser diode on them goes
that's it, I've read that audiophiles have started resorting to
cannibalizing cheaper units with the same mechanism to keep higher end
ones going.
Meanwhile there are probably like 50 million Technics SL-whatever
turntables floating around in generally working condition they made
basically the same turntable for like 40 years.
On 1/6/2025 3:00 PM, Don Y wrote:
Last time I saw someone walking around with a portable record player
was.... never.
The album art is bigger on LPs, and they have more distortion (warmth.)
Nostalgia. Folks also play 80's video games. Yet, you don't see
those industries ressurected so the demand is more of an oddity
than a financial reality.
"80s-inspired" new-release video games is a genre, like how synthwave/80s-inspired new-release music is a genre.
There might be more 8-bit looking and playing video games (that were built with
modern software tools) on the market now via Steam and online distribution than
there were 8-bit games available for sale at any point in the actual 1980s...
In the latter case "that 80s sound" never really went away and popular music goes through cycles of huge reverbs and gated snares...
Only for the "look at me!" factor. I've probably a hundred vinyl boots
"just out of shrinkwrap" stored -- along with a Beogram 8000. None
have seen the light of day since they were ripped (the sound quality
isn't going to get any BETTER with use so whatever I captured originally
has been faithfully preserved (and repeatedly reproduced) each time
I listen to them -- regardless of WHERE I choose to do that (including
on cross country flights: "Miss, can I plug my turntable in, somewhere?")
Yeah I don't mess with either, I move a lot and large collections of physical media are a pain to lug about. I prefer to have books if I'm going to keep one
variety of it
