• Okies SUE To Prevent Public-School "Bible Studies"

    From 186283@ud0s4.net@21:1/5 to All on Fri Oct 18 01:09:40 2024
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, alt.atheism, alt.politics.usa
    XPost: alt.politics.republicans

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13973169/Oklahoma-parents-sue-education-officials-stop-Bible-studies-introduced-class.html

    A group of parents of public school students, teachers, and
    ministers are fighting to stop schools being forced to
    incorporate the Bible into lessons

    They are suing State Superintendent Ryan Walters, Oklahoma's
    top education official, to prevent him forcing the lesson
    plans on students in grades 5 through 12.

    The lawsuit filed with the Oklahoma Supreme Court also
    asked the court to stop the state spending $3 million
    to buy Bibles in support of Walters' mandate.

    . . .

    I agree with them.

    If a school is gonna be pushing religion(s) then
    it has to push a BUNCH of religions - Islam, Hindu,
    Zoroastrian, 'Satanism', All Hail Woden One-Eye. It
    also needs to push the idea that religions are BS.
    NO favorites !!! That's the (wise) gist of the
    1st amendment.

    I can *understand* the desire to insert more
    morality/ethics for the kiddies. They really
    HAVE become nasty/dangerous of late. No "greater"
    paradigm, well, just doesn't work well for real-
    world humans. Sometimes a Big Lie is more useful
    than Truth/perspective ... sorry.

    BUT, as we've seen from the Inquisition to ISIS,
    going TOO far into the Lie also has serious
    down-sides. There's a kinder and gentler (and
    safer) middle ground in there somewhere.
    -
    IMHO, revive "ethics". To many it SEEMS "religious",
    but really isn't. More "empathetic", universal.

    Way back in the 60s, I was probably the only kid
    in school known to be un-religious (despite the
    cold-war push against 'godless commies'). Thing
    is I was never persecuted for it. Why ? Because
    I realized early on that un-belief should never
    be "evangelical" - otherwise it BECOMES a de-facto
    religion for all intents and purposes, and with
    all the same negatives. They wanna believe in 'X',
    fine, no prob, let 'em, their right, don't
    denigrate. People "believe" in all sorts of stuff.
    Oh, also wasn't a 'commie', nothing against the
    imperialist football jocks or biz or such. Guess
    proto-MAGA went back quite a way :-)

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  • From Frank Lee@21:1/5 to 186282@ud0s4.net on Thu Oct 17 22:32:50 2024
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, alt.atheism, alt.politics.usa
    XPost: alt.politics.republicans

    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13973169/Oklahoma-parents-sue-education-officials-stop-Bible-studies-introduced-class.html

    A group of parents of public school students, teachers, and
    ministers are fighting to stop schools being forced to
    incorporate the Bible into lessons

    They are suing State Superintendent Ryan Walters, Oklahoma's
    top education official, to prevent him forcing the lesson
    plans on students in grades 5 through 12.

    The lawsuit filed with the Oklahoma Supreme Court also
    asked the court to stop the state spending $3 million
    to buy Bibles in support of Walters' mandate.

    . . .

    I agree with them.

    If a school is gonna be pushing religion(s) then
    it has to push a BUNCH of religions - Islam, Hindu,
    Zoroastrian, 'Satanism', All Hail Woden One-Eye. It
    also needs to push the idea that religions are BS.
    NO favorites !!! That's the (wise) gist of the
    1st amendment.

    I can *understand* the desire to insert more
    morality/ethics for the kiddies.

    This isn't about morality or ethics. It's about
    establishment of religion, pure and simple. It's about
    trading the constitution for theocracy.

    <...>

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  • From 186283@ud0s4.net@21:1/5 to Frank Lee on Fri Oct 18 02:09:41 2024
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, alt.atheism, alt.politics.usa
    XPost: alt.politics.republicans

    On 10/18/24 1:32 AM, Frank Lee wrote:
    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13973169/Oklahoma-parents-sue-education-officials-stop-Bible-studies-introduced-class.html

    A group of parents of public school students, teachers, and
    ministers are fighting to stop schools being forced to
    incorporate the Bible into lessons

    They are suing State Superintendent Ryan Walters, Oklahoma's
    top education official, to prevent him forcing the lesson
    plans on students in grades 5 through 12.

    The lawsuit filed with the Oklahoma Supreme Court also
    asked the court to stop the state spending $3 million
    to buy Bibles in support of Walters' mandate.

    . . .

    I agree with them.

    If a school is gonna be pushing religion(s) then
    it has to push a BUNCH of religions - Islam, Hindu,
    Zoroastrian, 'Satanism', All Hail Woden One-Eye. It
    also needs to push the idea that religions are BS.
    NO favorites !!! That's the (wise) gist of the
    1st amendment.

    I can *understand* the desire to insert more
    morality/ethics for the kiddies.

    This isn't about morality or ethics. It's about
    establishment of religion, pure and simple. It's about
    trading the constitution for theocracy.

    To SOME, yes.

    However, overall, I'd say it's justified concerns,
    like survival concerns, over the "Clockwork Orange"
    generation.

    Pop religion is an easy go-to.

    IMHO, don't look TOO hard for Vast Konspiracies.
    A FEW are on that track, but they are a few.

    Didja see what I said about "evangelical" atheism ?

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From kazu@21:1/5 to 186282@ud0s4.net on Fri Oct 18 11:10:12 2024
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, alt.atheism, alt.politics.usa
    XPost: alt.politics.republicans

    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13973169/Oklahoma-parents-sue-education-officials-stop-Bible-studies-introduced-class.html


    A group of parents of public school students, teachers, and
    ministers are fighting to stop schools being forced to
    incorporate the Bible into lessons



    makes sense, bible is like a users guide for goat herders and
    most people arent.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From kazu@21:1/5 to 186282@ud0s4.net on Fri Oct 18 11:11:11 2024
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, alt.atheism, alt.politics.usa
    XPost: alt.politics.republicans

    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
    On 10/18/24 1:32 AM, Frank Lee wrote:
    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13973169/Oklahoma-parents-sue-education-officials-stop-Bible-studies-introduced-class.html


    A group of parents of public school students, teachers, and
    ministers are fighting to stop schools being forced to
    incorporate the Bible into lessons

    They are suing State Superintendent Ryan Walters, Oklahoma's
    top education official, to prevent him forcing the lesson
    plans on students in grades 5 through 12.

    The lawsuit filed with the Oklahoma Supreme Court also
    asked the court to stop the state spending $3 million
    to buy Bibles in support of Walters' mandate.

    . . .

        I agree with them.

        If a school is gonna be pushing religion(s) then
        it has to push a BUNCH of religions - Islam, Hindu,
        Zoroastrian, 'Satanism', All Hail Woden One-Eye. It
        also needs to push the idea that religions are BS.
        NO favorites !!! That's the (wise) gist of the
        1st amendment.

        I can *understand* the desire to insert more
        morality/ethics for the kiddies.

    This isn't about morality or ethics.  It's about
    establishment of religion, pure and simple.  It's about
    trading the constitution for theocracy.

      To SOME, yes.

      However, overall, I'd say it's justified concerns,
      like survival concerns, over the "Clockwork Orange"
      generation.

      Pop religion is an easy go-to.

      IMHO, don't look TOO hard for Vast Konspiracies.
      A FEW are on that track, but they are a few.

      Didja see what I said about "evangelical" atheism ?



    i have heard this reference in many places, i have to watch
    clockwork orange.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From John Doe@21:1/5 to 186282@ud0s4.net on Fri Oct 18 10:19:43 2024
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, alt.atheism, alt.politics.usa
    XPost: alt.politics.republicans

    On 10/17/2024 11:09 PM, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13973169/Oklahoma-parents-sue- education-officials-stop-Bible-studies-introduced-class.html

    A group of parents of public school students, teachers, and
    ministers are fighting to stop schools being forced to
    incorporate the Bible into lessons

    They are suing State Superintendent Ryan Walters, Oklahoma's
    top education official, to prevent him forcing the lesson
    plans on students in grades 5 through 12.

    The lawsuit filed with the Oklahoma Supreme Court also
    asked the court to stop the state spending $3 million
    to buy Bibles in support of Walters' mandate.

    . . .

      I agree with them.

      If a school is gonna be pushing religion(s) then
      it has to push a BUNCH of religions - Islam, Hindu,
      Zoroastrian, 'Satanism', All Hail Woden One-Eye. It
      also needs to push the idea that religions are BS.
      NO favorites !!! That's the (wise) gist of the
      1st amendment.

      I can *understand* the desire to insert more
      morality/ethics for the kiddies. They really
      HAVE become nasty/dangerous of late. No "greater"
      paradigm, well, just doesn't work well for real-
      world humans. Sometimes a Big Lie is more useful
      than Truth/perspective ... sorry.

      BUT, as we've seen from the Inquisition to ISIS,
      going TOO far into the Lie also has serious
      down-sides. There's a kinder and gentler (and
      safer) middle ground in there somewhere.
    -
      IMHO, revive "ethics". To many it SEEMS "religious",
      but really isn't. More "empathetic", universal.

      Way back in the 60s, I was probably the only kid
      in school known to be un-religious (despite the
      cold-war push against 'godless commies'). Thing
      is I was never persecuted for it. Why ? Because
      I realized early on that un-belief should never
      be "evangelical" - otherwise it BECOMES a de-facto
      religion for all intents and purposes, and with
      all the same negatives. They wanna believe in 'X',
      fine, no prob, let 'em, their right, don't
      denigrate. People "believe" in all sorts of stuff.
      Oh, also wasn't a 'commie', nothing against the
      imperialist football jocks or biz or such. Guess
      proto-MAGA went back quite a way  :-)


    Agree with much of this. It's very clear from history that this country
    was founding by people who thought the government and the church should
    be two separate entities.

    Teaching the Golden Rule is the easiest way to install morality in
    people, and that doesn't require religion, just empathy.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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  • From 186283@ud0s4.net@21:1/5 to kazu on Fri Oct 18 23:53:09 2024
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, alt.atheism, alt.politics.usa
    XPost: alt.politics.republicans

    On 10/18/24 7:11 AM, kazu wrote:
    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
    On 10/18/24 1:32 AM, Frank Lee wrote:
    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13973169/Oklahoma-parents-sue-education-officials-stop-Bible-studies-introduced-class.html


    A group of parents of public school students, teachers, and
    ministers are fighting to stop schools being forced to
    incorporate the Bible into lessons

    They are suing State Superintendent Ryan Walters, Oklahoma's
    top education official, to prevent him forcing the lesson
    plans on students in grades 5 through 12.

    The lawsuit filed with the Oklahoma Supreme Court also
    asked the court to stop the state spending $3 million
    to buy Bibles in support of Walters' mandate.

    . . .

        I agree with them.

        If a school is gonna be pushing religion(s) then
        it has to push a BUNCH of religions - Islam, Hindu,
        Zoroastrian, 'Satanism', All Hail Woden One-Eye. It
        also needs to push the idea that religions are BS.
        NO favorites !!! That's the (wise) gist of the
        1st amendment.

        I can *understand* the desire to insert more
        morality/ethics for the kiddies.

    This isn't about morality or ethics.  It's about
    establishment of religion, pure and simple.  It's about
    trading the constitution for theocracy.

       To SOME, yes.

       However, overall, I'd say it's justified concerns,
       like survival concerns, over the "Clockwork Orange"
       generation.

       Pop religion is an easy go-to.

       IMHO, don't look TOO hard for Vast Konspiracies.
       A FEW are on that track, but they are a few.

       Didja see what I said about "evangelical" atheism ?



    i have heard this reference in many places, i have to watch clockwork
    orange.

    You've never even SEEN/read it ???

    Kinda 'arty' Brit film - a very young Malcom McDowell
    in a very sinister role. It was a book before it was
    a film.

    You'll rec the thugs pretty well however despite the
    artsy dress-up ... AND the do-little for-appearances
    govt types.

    --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
    * Origin: fsxNet Usenet Gateway (21:1/5)
  • From kazu@21:1/5 to 186282@ud0s4.net on Sat Oct 19 09:52:31 2024
    XPost: talk.politics.misc, alt.atheism, alt.politics.usa
    XPost: alt.politics.republicans

    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
    On 10/18/24 7:11 AM, kazu wrote:
    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
    On 10/18/24 1:32 AM, Frank Lee wrote:
    186282@ud0s4.net wrote:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13973169/Oklahoma-parents-sue-education-officials-stop-Bible-studies-introduced-class.html


    A group of parents of public school students, teachers, and
    ministers are fighting to stop schools being forced to
    incorporate the Bible into lessons

    They are suing State Superintendent Ryan Walters, Oklahoma's
    top education official, to prevent him forcing the lesson
    plans on students in grades 5 through 12.

    The lawsuit filed with the Oklahoma Supreme Court also
    asked the court to stop the state spending $3 million
    to buy Bibles in support of Walters' mandate.

    . . .

        I agree with them.

        If a school is gonna be pushing religion(s) then
        it has to push a BUNCH of religions - Islam, Hindu,
        Zoroastrian, 'Satanism', All Hail Woden One-Eye. It
        also needs to push the idea that religions are BS.
        NO favorites !!! That's the (wise) gist of the
        1st amendment.

        I can *understand* the desire to insert more
        morality/ethics for the kiddies.

    This isn't about morality or ethics.  It's about
    establishment of religion, pure and simple.  It's about
    trading the constitution for theocracy.

       To SOME, yes.

       However, overall, I'd say it's justified concerns,
       like survival concerns, over the "Clockwork Orange"
       generation.

       Pop religion is an easy go-to.

       IMHO, don't look TOO hard for Vast Konspiracies.
       A FEW are on that track, but they are a few.

       Didja see what I said about "evangelical" atheism ?



    i have heard this reference in many places, i have to watch
    clockwork orange.

      You've never even SEEN/read it ???

      Kinda 'arty' Brit film - a very young Malcom McDowell
      in a very sinister role. It was a book before it was
      a film.

      You'll rec the thugs pretty well however despite the
      artsy dress-up ... AND the do-little for-appearances
      govt types.


    is it streaming anywhere or i have to pirate it? let me see.

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