On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 22:26:52 +0000, RWC wrote:

On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 12:47:21 -0400, DianeE <DianeE@NoSpam.net> wrote:

On 9/30/2024 12:44 PM, DianeE wrote:

Look, it's not really a well-designed quiz. 

It's more the simplistic results that are of limited value - for
assessing an individual's collection of political stances. A voter who
is generally left of center might have one or two 'disguised' mid-right stances on key issues. For instance, Geoff is against *mass* immigration because it might eventually cause serious problems in society (regarding cultural values, and/or housing affordability and demands on public
service infrastructure.)

OTOH Roger is perfectly OK with measured legal migration where the
incoming parties are often bringing job qualifications and expertise
with them.

What Roger is totally against is the huge amount of ILLEGAL migration
currently going on VERY big time from France to England across the
narrowest part of the English Channel (22 miles or so wide) near Dover.

Instead of treating these people with kid gloves and placing them often
in three and four star hotel rooms at HUGE expense to the UK taxpayer
they should be turned around at sea and forced back to France regardless
of the inevitable French reaction.

Such action would mean us leaving the ECHR (the European court) plus
passing new legislation forbidding the immigrants from mounting any kind
of legal challenges against such action and preventing any UK lawyers
acting on their behalf on pain of being struck off

NOW we're getting someplace!!

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On Tue, 1 Oct 2024 19:52:33 +0000, Roger wrote:

On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 22:26:52 +0000, RWC wrote:

On Mon, 30 Sep 2024 12:47:21 -0400, DianeE <DianeE@NoSpam.net> wrote:

On 9/30/2024 12:44 PM, DianeE wrote:

Look, it's not really a well-designed quiz. 

It's more the simplistic results that are of limited value - for
assessing an individual's collection of political stances. A voter who
is generally left of center might have one or two 'disguised' mid-right
stances on key issues. For instance, Geoff is against *mass* immigration
because it might eventually cause serious problems in society (regarding
cultural values, and/or housing affordability and demands on public
service infrastructure.)

OTOH Roger is perfectly OK with measured legal migration where the
incoming parties are often bringing job qualifications and expertise
with them.

What Roger is totally against is the huge amount of ILLEGAL migration currently going on VERY big time from France to England across the
narrowest part of the English Channel (22 miles or so wide) near Dover.

Instead of treating these people with kid gloves and placing them often
in three and four star hotel rooms at HUGE expense to the UK taxpayer
they should be turned around at sea and forced back to France regardless
of the inevitable French reaction.

Such action would mean us leaving the ECHR (the European court) plus
passing new legislation forbidding the immigrants from mounting any kind
of legal challenges against such action and preventing any UK lawyers
acting on their behalf on pain of being struck off

NOW we're getting someplace!!

I don't think you can outlaw legal challenges. Anybody has the right to
put forth a legal challenge. You can change the laws so that the judges
will dismiss the cases more often, but I don't think you can just people
from filing a legal challenge.

For that question about immigration, did you say that you don't want it
because your country will be "losing our identity as a nation?"

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On Tue, 1 Oct 2024 19:52:33 +0000, Roger wrote:

What Roger is totally against is the huge amount of ILLEGAL migration currently going on VERY big time from France to England across the
narrowest part of the English Channel (22 miles or so wide) near Dover.

You are very hung up on LEGAL and ILLEGAL when it comes to immigration.
To me it doesn't matter much at all. If I was one of those people trying
to get away from gangs and an oppressive government I'm gonna go there
either way.

So why are these migrants coming from France to England? Why don't they
just stay in France? Is there something about the UK that makes it a
better place for them to come to than France?

So called "illegal immigrants" here commit fewer crimes than legal
Americans, and work at many jobs that few Americans are willing to do.
They also pay into things like social security and unemployment where
they are not eligible for any benefits.

I asked copilot about this same thing in the UK:


Sent by you:
In the UK who commits more crimes, illegal immigrants or English
citizens?


Sent by Copilot:
The relationship between immigration and crime is complex and often
influenced by various factors. According to available data, there isn’t
a straightforward comparison between crimes committed by illegal
immigrants and English citizens. However, research generally indicates
that immigrants, including illegal immigrants, are less likely to commit
crimes compared to native-born citizens12.

For instance, a study by the Migration Observatory found that
foreign-born individuals often have lower arrest and conviction rates
than UK-born individuals. Additionally, the British Crime Survey
suggests that immigrants are less likely to report being victims of
crime, which might also reflect lower involvement in criminal
activities.

It’s important to approach this topic with sensitivity and consider the broader social and economic contexts that influence crime rates.

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On Tue, 1 Oct 2024 23:35:30 +0000, savoybg@aol.com (Bruce) wrote:

So why are these migrants coming from France to England? Why don't they
just stay in France? Is there something about the UK that makes it a
better place for them to come to than France?

Copilot kindly informs us:

There are several reasons why some immigrants who arrive in France choose
to take the risk of crossing the Channel to the UK:

1. **Family and Community Ties**: Many immigrants have family or friends already living in the UK. Reuniting with loved ones can be a strong
motivator.

2. **Language and Cultural Familiarity**: English is a widely spoken
language, and some immigrants may already have some knowledge of it,
making it easier to integrate and navigate daily life.

3. **Perceived Better Opportunities**: The UK is often seen as having
better economic opportunities, job prospects, and a more favorable asylum process compared to France.

4. **Asylum Acceptance Rates**: The UK has a higher acceptance rate for
asylum applications compared to France, which can influence the decision
to move on from France.

5. **Living Conditions**: Some immigrants face poor living conditions in France, especially in informal camps like those in Calais, which can push
them to seek better conditions in the UK.

6. **Smugglers' Influence**: People smugglers often play a significant
role, promising safe passage to the UK, which can be a compelling, though dangerous, option for many.

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On Tue, 01 Oct 2024 22:01:56 -0400, RWC <letsrock@opbox.com> wrote:

On Tue, 1 Oct 2024 23:35:30 +0000, savoybg@aol.com (Bruce) wrote:

So why are these migrants coming from France to England? Why don't they >>just stay in France? Is there something about the UK that makes it a
better place for them to come to than France?

Copilot kindly informs us:

There are several reasons why some immigrants who arrive in France choose
to take the risk of crossing the Channel to the UK:

...

Question for Copilot regarding Muslim immigrants to the UK:

What community organizations and support networks are there for Muslim immigrants?

Here are a few notable ones:

1. **Muslim Council of Britain (MCB)**: This is an umbrella organization
that represents the interests of Muslims in the UK. They provide various services, including advocacy, community support, and educational
resources.

2. **Islamic Relief UK**: This organization offers a range of services, including emergency relief, development programs, and support for
refugees and asylum seekers.

3. **Refugee Council**: While not exclusively for Muslims, the Refugee
Council provides extensive support for refugees and asylum seekers,
including housing, legal advice, and integration services.

4. **British Islamic Medical Association (BIMA)**: BIMA supports Muslim healthcare professionals and provides health-related services to the
community, including mental health support.

5. **Muslim Aid**: This charity offers a variety of services, including emergency relief, development programs, and support for refugees and
asylum seekers.

These organizations play a crucial role in helping Muslim immigrants
navigate their new lives in the UK, offering everything from legal
assistance to community integration programs.

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Take the Pew Political Typology Quiz and see where you fit in on the
political spectrum. Diane and I both came out as as "Establishment
Liberal" which is the second most Liberal classification after
progressive.

You have to scroll up a bit for the questions after you hit "Next
Question." Even on the first question when you start the quiz.

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/quiz/political-typology/?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwurS3BhCGARIsADdUH532XdXKjrSAkEHfSHwCn4tvj2JtK1-Kh8PkCAjdjqsNKuah2TvU3UgaAvRbEALw_wcB

There are only 16 questions, all with multiple choice answers, so this
will only take you like 5 minutes to do. Then come back to the thread
and let us know where you ended up.

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On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 23:19:44 -0400, RWC <letsrock@opbox.com> wrote:

On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 22:58:25 +0000, savoybg@aol.com (Bruce) wrote:

Take the Pew Political Typology Quiz and see where you fit in on the >>political spectrum. Diane and I both came out as as "Establishment
Liberal" which is the second most Liberal classification after >>progressive.

Geoff came out 'Establishment Liberal'
'à along with 13% the public'

I then tried to pretend to be a MAGA/Trump supporter and
shock horror I was labeled a 'Faith and Flag Conservative' :-)

Pew describes this political group (10% of Public) as being:
"Staunchly conservative on all issues; deeply loyal to Donald Trump"

For a much fuller, and easy to read, 2021 Pew report on F&FCs: https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/11/09/faith-and-flag-conservatives/

On another Pew topic, are you in the American Middle Class: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/16/are-you-in-the-american-middle-class/
One person housholds in NYC need to earn $37,000+ before tax to be
deemed 'middle-class'.

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On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 22:58:25 +0000, savoybg@aol.com (Bruce) wrote:

Take the Pew Political Typology Quiz and see where you fit in on the >political spectrum. Diane and I both came out as as "Establishment
Liberal" which is the second most Liberal classification after
progressive.

Geoff came out 'Establishment Liberal'
'à along with 13% the public'

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On Sat, 28 Sep 2024 3:19:44 +0000, RWC wrote:

On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 22:58:25 +0000, savoybg@aol.com (Bruce) wrote:

Take the Pew Political Typology Quiz and see where you fit in on the >>political spectrum. Diane and I both came out as as "Establishment
Liberal" which is the second most Liberal classification after >>progressive.

Geoff came out 'Establishment Liberal'
'… along with 13% the public'

Same as Diane and me.

--- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05
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On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 22:58:25 +0000, Bruce wrote:

Take the Pew Political Typology Quiz and see where you fit in on the political spectrum. Diane and I both came out as as "Establishment
Liberal" which is the second most Liberal classification after
progressive.

You have to scroll up a bit for the questions after you hit "Next
Question." Even on the first question when you start the quiz.

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/quiz/political-typology/?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwurS3BhCGARIsADdUH532XdXKjrSAkEHfSHwCn4tvj2JtK1-Kh8PkCAjdjqsNKuah2TvU3UgaAvRbEALw_wcB

There are only 16 questions, all with multiple choice answers, so this
will only take you like 5 minutes to do. Then come back to the thread
and let us know where you ended up.

Obviously I had to "translate" some of the questions to a more British
setting but it seemed to work okay

Came out as AMBLIVALENT RIGHT (along with 12% of USA public)

As long as that doesn't make me a rabid Trump supporter (which I
certainly am NOT) then I'm okay with that :)

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On Sat, 28 Sep 2024 6:30:40 +0000, Roger wrote:

On Fri, 27 Sep 2024 22:58:25 +0000, Bruce wrote:

Take the Pew Political Typology Quiz and see where you fit in on the
political spectrum. Diane and I both came out as as "Establishment
Liberal" which is the second most Liberal classification after
progressive.

You have to scroll up a bit for the questions after you hit "Next
Question." Even on the first question when you start the quiz.

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/quiz/political-typology/?gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjwurS3BhCGARIsADdUH532XdXKjrSAkEHfSHwCn4tvj2JtK1-Kh8PkCAjdjqsNKuah2TvU3UgaAvRbEALw_wcB

There are only 16 questions, all with multiple choice answers, so this
will only take you like 5 minutes to do. Then come back to the thread
and let us know where you ended up.

Obviously I had to "translate" some of the questions to a more British setting but it seemed to work okay

Came out as AMBLIVALENT RIGHT (along with 12% of USA public)

As long as that doesn't make me a rabid Trump supporter (which I
certainly am NOT) then I'm okay with that :)

So you are a bit right of center I guess. I'm shocked there were no
abortion questions.

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Ambivalent Right

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