| Sysop: | Amessyroom |
|---|---|
| Location: | Fayetteville, NC |
| Users: | 26 |
| Nodes: | 6 (0 / 6) |
| Uptime: | 91:12:00 |
| Calls: | 483 |
| Calls today: | 1 |
| Files: | 1,073 |
| Messages: | 97,671 |
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
Melissa Hortman and her husband Mark were at home in Brooklyn Park when
they were murdered. Their two children were not killed. She was first
elected to the House for a term starting in 2005. In the current redistricting, she represented district 34B. When DFL had the majority,
she was Speaker. She was briefly minority leader in the current term
till March 17. Then there was a tie between seats held by DFL and
Republicans and was declared DFL Leader.
State Senator John Hoffman and his wife Yvette were shot but still alive after surgery.
The perpetrator was dressed in what appeared to be a police uniform with
body armor, badge, and gear.
Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com>:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state >>legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned >down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on >and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable >if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these >attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of >government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com> >wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned >down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on >and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable >if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these >attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of >government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com> >wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned >down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on >and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable >if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these >attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of >government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com>:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state >>>legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned >>down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on >>and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable >>if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these >>attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of >>government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
Well, I can't tell you how to feel about the murders of Melissa Hortman
and her husband, and the attempted murders of John Hoffman and his wife.
I was quite upset. I don't care for Americans behaving like they live in
a shithole country and assasination is the only way to overturn
government and its policies.
But let me help you with Mangione. Put yourself in the position of one of >Brian Thompson's policy members. You surely wouldn't have wanted Thompson
to die by targeted killing. That's a quick death he didn't deserve. No,
you'd have wanted him to succumb to trauma or disease and the associated >stress of trying to obtain pre-approval from member services for the >treatment or elective surgery he required from customer service that's >instructed to deny everything.
Dying whilst waiting on hold for a supervisor who will never come to the >phone? That would have been more like it. No, Mangione did a disservice.
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:31:58 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>
wrote:
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com>
wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned >> down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..."
excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on >> and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable >> if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these >> attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of >> government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'. >>
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:58:09 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com>:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>> the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>> the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>> excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on >>> and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these >>> attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
Well, I can't tell you how to feel about the murders of Melissa Hortman
and her husband, and the attempted murders of John Hoffman and his wife.
I was quite upset. I don't care for Americans behaving like they live in
a shithole country and assasination is the only way to overturn
government and its policies.
But let me help you with Mangione. Put yourself in the position of one of
Brian Thompson's policy members. You surely wouldn't have wanted Thompson
to die by targeted killing. That's a quick death he didn't deserve. No,
you'd have wanted him to succumb to trauma or disease and the associated
stress of trying to obtain pre-approval from member services for the
treatment or elective surgery he required from customer service that's
instructed to deny everything.
Dying whilst waiting on hold for a supervisor who will never come to the
phone? That would have been more like it. No, Mangione did a disservice.
Wow such hatred on display. Amazing that you appear to care so much
about the legislators. I guess to you some lives are more equal than
others.
On 6/15/2025 7:00 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:31:58 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>Because he's not. He's very consercvative and anti-abortion. Why do you
wrote:
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com> >>> wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>> the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>> the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>> excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on
and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these
attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
think he targeted 2 Dem legislators?
CNN told me ....
In <102mvco$11dcb$3@dont-email.me> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> writes:
[snip]
CNN told me ....
It's so amusing, no make that pitiful, how BTR routinely parrots
the claim that CNN is part of the "lying media", except, well,
when they make a report he latches onto.
In <102mvco$11dcb$3@dont-email.me> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> writes:
[snip]
CNN told me ....
It's so amusing, no make that pitiful, how BTR routinely parrots
the claim that CNN is part of the "lying media", except, well,
when they make a report he latches onto.
On Jun 15, 2025 at 10:30:42 AM PDT, "danny burstein" <dannyb@panix.com> wrote:
In <102mvco$11dcb$3@dont-email.me> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> writes:
[snip]
CNN told me ....
It's so amusing, no make that pitiful, how BTR routinely parrots
the claim that CNN is part of the "lying media", except, well,
when they make a report he latches onto.
You don't get the concept of sarcasm, do you?
On 6/15/2025 11:43 AM, BTR1701 wrote:
On Jun 15, 2025 at 10:30:42 AM PDT, "danny burstein" <dannyb@panix.com>If your sarcasm is so obscure as to not be recognized as such, maybe you don't get it.
wrote:
In <102mvco$11dcb$3@dont-email.me> BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> writes:
[snip]
CNN told me ....
It's so amusing, no make that pitiful, how BTR routinely parrots
the claim that CNN is part of the "lying media", except, well,
when they make a report he latches onto.
You don't get the concept of sarcasm, do you?
On 6/15/2025 7:00 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:31:58 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>Because he's not. He's very consercvative and anti-abortion. Why do you
wrote:
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com>
wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>> the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>> the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>> excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on >>> and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these >>> attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
think he targeted 2 Dem legislators?
On 6/15/2025 10:02 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:58:09 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com>:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>>> the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>>> the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>>> excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on
and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these
attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
Well, I can't tell you how to feel about the murders of Melissa Hortman
and her husband, and the attempted murders of John Hoffman and his wife. >>> I was quite upset. I don't care for Americans behaving like they live in >>> a shithole country and assasination is the only way to overturn
government and its policies.
But let me help you with Mangione. Put yourself in the position of one of >>> Brian Thompson's policy members. You surely wouldn't have wanted Thompson >>> to die by targeted killing. That's a quick death he didn't deserve. No,
you'd have wanted him to succumb to trauma or disease and the associated >>> stress of trying to obtain pre-approval from member services for the
treatment or elective surgery he required from customer service that's
instructed to deny everything.
Dying whilst waiting on hold for a supervisor who will never come to the >>> phone? That would have been more like it. No, Mangione did a disservice.
Wow such hatred on display. Amazing that you appear to care so much
about the legislators. I guess to you some lives are more equal than
others.
But not to you? Umm, let's hope you're still under warranty...
On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 09:36:20 -0700, suzeeq <suzeeq@imbris.com> wrote:
On 6/15/2025 7:00 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:31:58 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>Because he's not. He's very consercvative and anti-abortion. Why do you
wrote:
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com> >>>> wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>>> the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>>> the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>>> excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on
and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these
attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
think he targeted 2 Dem legislators?
Laughter! That's why he had a car full of Kings day fliers.
On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 12:52:38 -0400, moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com>
wrote:
On 6/15/2025 10:02 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:58:09 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:Wow such hatred on display. Amazing that you appear to care so much
Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com>:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state >>>>>> legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>>>> the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>>>> the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>>>> excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on
and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these
attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
Well, I can't tell you how to feel about the murders of Melissa Hortman >>>> and her husband, and the attempted murders of John Hoffman and his wife. >>>> I was quite upset. I don't care for Americans behaving like they live in >>>> a shithole country and assasination is the only way to overturn
government and its policies.
But let me help you with Mangione. Put yourself in the position of one of >>>> Brian Thompson's policy members. You surely wouldn't have wanted Thompson >>>> to die by targeted killing. That's a quick death he didn't deserve. No, >>>> you'd have wanted him to succumb to trauma or disease and the associated >>>> stress of trying to obtain pre-approval from member services for the
treatment or elective surgery he required from customer service that's >>>> instructed to deny everything.
Dying whilst waiting on hold for a supervisor who will never come to the >>>> phone? That would have been more like it. No, Mangione did a disservice. >>>
about the legislators. I guess to you some lives are more equal than
others.
But not to you? Umm, let's hope you're still under warranty...
Can you find where I've attempted to justify murder like you have?
On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 09:36:20 -0700, suzeeq <suzeeq@imbris.com> wrote:
On 6/15/2025 7:00 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:31:58 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>Because he's not. He's very consercvative and anti-abortion. Why do you
wrote:
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com> >>>> wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>>> the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>>> the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>>> excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on
and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these
attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
think he targeted 2 Dem legislators?
Laughter! That's why he had a car full of Kings day fliers.
On 6/16/2025 4:41 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 09:36:20 -0700, suzeeq <suzeeq@imbris.com> wrote:So he could blend into the crowd. He also had lists of names, like Gov
On 6/15/2025 7:00 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:31:58 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com>Because he's not. He's very consercvative and anti-abortion. Why do you >>> think he targeted 2 Dem legislators?
wrote:
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com> >>>>> wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state >>>>>> legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful; >>>>>> the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of >>>>>> the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..."
excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on
and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these
attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
Laughter! That's why he had a car full of Kings day fliers.
Tim Walz, Senator Amy Klobushar, addresses of abortion clinics and others.
On Jun 16, 2025 at 8:34:51 AM PDT, "suzeeq" <suzeeq@imbris.com> wrote:
On 6/16/2025 4:41 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sun, 15 Jun 2025 09:36:20 -0700, suzeeq <suzeeq@imbris.com> wrote:So he could blend into the crowd. He also had lists of names, like Gov
On 6/15/2025 7:00 AM, NoBody wrote:
On Sat, 14 Jun 2025 21:31:58 -0000 (UTC), BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> >>>>> wrote:Because he's not. He's very consercvative and anti-abortion. Why do you >>>> think he targeted 2 Dem legislators?
On Jun 14, 2025 at 10:27:40 AM PDT, ""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com>
wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state >>>>>>> legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned
down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..."
excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on
and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable
if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these
attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of
government officials?
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'.
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
Laughter! That's why he had a car full of Kings day fliers.
Tim Walz, Senator Amy Klobushar, addresses of abortion clinics and others.
He was also a former political appointee of Walz.
Seems like his politics were all over the place.
BTR1701 <atropos@mac.com> wrote:
""Adam H. Kerman"" <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
I don't know how I'm supposed to feel about this. When Luigi Mangione gunned >>down a health care CEO, it was met with at best "murder is wrong, but..." >>excuse-making by the leftist pundit-sphere, if not outright cheering him on >>and calling for jury nullification in his trial.
So if murder in service to strongly-held political beliefs is understandable >>if not laudable, then should I feel that justice has been served with these >>attacks in Minnesota or should I be outraged over the cold-blooded murder of >>government officials?
I wouldn't say Mangione was so much a political killing as either
revenge for all of the deaths United Health Care had caused or
protection for potential victims when UHC refuses to cover any
insurance needs. That said no one should be murdered. As much as I
despise what the UHC CEO was having his company do that doesn't
justify him being killed.
I need a leftist to tell me what I should think and how this is 'different'. >>
You'll have to look further than myself as I'm more of a moderate.
On 6/14/2025 10:27 AM, Adam H. Kerman wrote:
This morning, 6/14/2025, two Democratic-Farm-Labor Minnesota state
legislators were shot at their homes. One assasination was successful;
the husband was also killed. The other was an attempted assasination of
the politician and his wife.
Melissa Hortman and her husband Mark were at home in Brooklyn Park when
they were murdered. Their two children were not killed. She was first
elected to the House for a term starting in 2005. In the current
redistricting, she represented district 34B. When DFL had the majority,
she was Speaker. She was briefly minority leader in the current term
till March 17. Then there was a tie between seats held by DFL and
Republicans and was declared DFL Leader.
State Senator John Hoffman and his wife Yvette were shot but still alive
after surgery.
The perpetrator was dressed in what appeared to be a police uniform with
body armor, badge, and gear.
And had a police car, or one made to look official. He's probably shed
the uniform by now, so he can blend into the crowd to get more hits in.
NoBody <NoBody@nowhere.com> writes:
They're still trying to figure out what to say about the fact the
murderer is a lib.
Hey, NoBody, your parents are still trying to figure out
why you're such an uckingfay lier. In the Reality Based
World, there's planty of PROOF your latest murdering hero
is a Christo-fascist, evangelical, bible thumping delusional.
In California, where illegals already get free cradle-to-grave health care, >they quite often have better health benefits than the America citizens who are >paying for it. E.g., illegal alien health care includes dental. *I* don't have >dental. I had to get (and pay for) separate dental insurance. Plus, I now have >to pay for their dental insurance, too.