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On 12/27/2024 2:46 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Fri Dec 27 05:38:43 2024 zen cycle wrote:
On 12/24/2024 2:18 PM, cyclintom wrote:
Roger, Liebermann doesn't even know what you're talking about but is telling you all about it. Most people would find that annoying if not personally insukting. But he continues endlessly.
Have a very merry christmas anhd a happy new year while Jeff is denying the existance of Christ.
Neither Jeff nor any Jew I've ever met has denied the existence of Jesus >> Christ.
Flunky denied that Pontius Pilisate ever sent a letter to Ceasar
There may have been a historical character named Pontius Pilisate who
sent a letter to one of the Caesars. I'm sure you'll give us a link to
that evidence any time now.
concerning Jesus including him walking on water which is a matter of historical record and is presently in the Vatican.
You wrote that Pontious Pilate wrote a letter to Julius Caesar. This is
wrong, Julius Caesar died before Christ was born. There is no letter
from Pontious Pilate to Julius Caesar in the vatican, or anywhere else.
Poor Flunky even denies the fact that I did.
You did what? You denied Christ existed or you wrote a letter to Julius Caesar?
There is nothing in this world that he will not deny.
I don't deny that you're an idiot.
Claiming that he doesn't know any Jew that denies Jesus
Tommy, no follower of judaism in any of its accepted sects deny the
existence of Jesus Christ. In fact:
https://jewsforjesus.org/
(not generally recognized by the major sects of judaism, but the point remains...)
is easy when you know no Jews or deny their religion.
Given that you're under the delusion that Jews deny the existence of
jesus, it's safe to say I know more jewish people than you do
On Fri Dec 27 14:59:43 2024 Zen Cycle wrote:
On 12/27/2024 2:46 PM, cyclintom wrote:
On Fri Dec 27 05:38:43 2024 zen cycle wrote:
On 12/24/2024 2:18 PM, cyclintom wrote:Poor Flunky even denies the fact that I did.
Roger, Liebermann doesn't even know what you're talking about but is telling you all about it. Most people would find that annoying if not personally insukting. But he continues endlessly.
Have a very merry christmas anhd a happy new year while Jeff is denying the existance of Christ.
Neither Jeff nor any Jew I've ever met has denied the existence of Jesus >>>> Christ.
Flunky denied that Pontius Pilisate ever sent a letter to Ceasar
There may have been a historical character named Pontius Pilisate who
sent a letter to one of the Caesars. I'm sure you'll give us a link to >>>> that evidence any time now.
concerning Jesus including him walking on water which is a matter of historical record and is presently in the Vatican.
You wrote that Pontious Pilate wrote a letter to Julius Caesar. This is >>>> wrong, Julius Caesar died before Christ was born. There is no letter
from Pontious Pilate to Julius Caesar in the vatican, or anywhere else. >>>
You did what? You denied Christ existed or you wrote a letter to Julius
Caesar?
There is nothing in this world that he will not deny.
I don't deny that you're an idiot.
Claiming that he doesn't know any Jew that denies Jesus
Tommy, no follower of judaism in any of its accepted sects deny the
existence of Jesus Christ. In fact:
https://jewsforjesus.org/
(not generally recognized by the major sects of judaism, but the point
remains...)
is easy when you know no Jews or deny their religion.
Given that you're under the delusion that Jews deny the existence of
jesus, it's safe to say I know more jewish people than you do
You believe what you want to believe.
On a good day you barely reach the IQ of an idiot.
This history of the Earth is clear
and it pretty much demonstrates that "let there be light, and there was".
That everything appeared virtually instantly.
Is there any reason that people should have the slightest care what you think?
You;re the one trying to pass off a fancy title as being more important than the QC manager it really is.
On Sun Aug 4 21:06:28 2024 Roger Merriman wrote:
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:
On Sun, 04 Aug 2024 10:44:55 GMT, Roger Merriman <roger@sarlet.com>
wrote:
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:
On Thu, 1 Aug 2024 21:36:41 -0000 (UTC), Ted Heise <theise@panix.com> >>>>> wrote:
I do wonder if the thing got too wet when riding in the rain a few >>>>>> days ago, and is getting gradually better as it dries out. Who
knows.
That's a good possibility:
"Rain and moisture has serious detrimental effect on 830"
<https://forums.garmin.com/sports-fitness/cycling/f/edge-830/194977/rain-and-moisture-has-serious-detrimental-effect-on-830>
That seems to be confused, the displayed gradient across all devices be >>>> that Garmin or otherwise tends to lag to some degree ie its generally not >>>> accurate, particularly noticeable across short sharp climbs where the 20% >>>> will display after it starts to ease off.
I don't understand what you're saying. The failure mechanism is
rather simple, assuming the Edge 830 uses some type of MEMS (Micro
Electro Mechanical System) pressure sensor:
<https://www.sparkfun.com/categories/120>
<https://cdn.sparkfun.com/assets/0/c/d/5/3/bmp384-datasheet.pdf>
There are many variations in the sensor. For example, the BMP384
above uses a gel filled cavity to reduce the effects of condensation
and contamination. I have no idea what's actually inside the Garmin
830. None of them are "water proof".
The Gradient lag etc is exhibited on Garmin and other units with and
without a barometer.
Where as the elevation differences quite possibly are related to, a faulty >> or wet sensor.
When the altitude (air pressure) readings begin to lag behind the
actual altitude, that the first sign of condensation inside the
sensor. The sensor is something like a tuning fork, which is
deflected by the differential air pressure where one side of the fork
is inside a sealed enclosure, while the other side is exposed to the
atmosphere. Add a tiny drop of water to the atmospheric side and the
vibration frequency changes, which changes the indicated atmospheric
pressure. However, the sealed box might be genuinely hermetically
sealed or it might have a tiny hole in the box which leaks air to
re-establish a reference pressure over a long period of time, such as
a few days. I suspect this is the way Garmin does it because the
instructions demand that the user re-calibrate the altimeter before
the start of every ride.
The reader comment at:
<https://forums.garmin.com/sports-fitness/cycling/f/edge-830/194977/rain-and-moisture-has-serious-detrimental-effect-on-830/1312133#1312133>
provides a clue. The author cycles the air pressure with a vacuum
food box until the altitude delay problem magically went away. What
he did was pump out whatever water vapor or condensate had collected
inside the Edge 830. Heating, to promote evaporation or cooling, to
reduce relative humidity, can also be used to remove water. Installing
a desiccant bag inside the case would probably have prevented the
problem:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=desiccant+bag&tbm=isch>
Replace every one or two years or heat dry the bag:
<https://www.roycopackaging.com/blogs/news/a-step-by-step-tutorial-on-how-to-dry-a-desiccant-bag>
Desiccant is also useful for preventing corrosion.
Bad news travels fast, Id not chalk up much with folks on internet having >>>> problems, if it was a known big problem Id expect to see it mentioned
within the upgrade 840/540 over the 830/530 folks like
<https://www.dcrainmaker.com> who do highly detailed reviews and potential >>>> issues that come up.
DcRainmaker.com is a really good site for evaluating bicycle
electronics and gizmos:
<https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2019/04/garmin-edge-830-cycling-gps-in-depth-review.html>
As for news traveling fast, that's true. However, solutions, theories
and fixes don't appear anywhere near as fast when there is little or
no technical information available from the manufacturer. For
example, when I was looking for a photo of the inside of an Edge 830,
all I could find was the iFixit teardown, which showed very little.
Oops, I didn't notice that there were several 830 teardowns on the
iFixit site. This one shows a little more internal detail but nothing
that would help me find or identify the air pressure sensor:
<https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Garmin+Edge+830+Battery+Replacement/149237> >>>
Ie Im sure its possible but Im cynical that its a know issue as you
where.
My experience with Garmin products goes back to 1992(?), when I found
myself dealing with the company and their products in both the
avionics and marine sector. My actual involvement in those days was
minimal, but was a sufficient excuse to buy an early Garmin GPS-50
which was sufficient for learning something about how GPS works:
<http://retro-gps.info/Garmin/Garmin-GPS-50/index.html>
(Mine was for marine use using the same electronics but with a panel
mount enclosure).
I don't want to unload my experiences and disappointments with Garmin
and their products. Sufficient to say that I'm generally disappointed
with Garmin and some of their products and support. Yes, that's
cynical, but then I'm usually cynical with all companies and products
until they demonstrate otherwise.
The 530/830 was a leap ahead can?t remember if the 1030 had come out or not >> at that point, but the xx30 line Garmin made to combat Wahoo and others,
mainly a much more powerful CPU so it didn?t just bug out as old models
would.
Essentially Garmin had to stop being so complacent the 520 etc didn?t fair >> well compared to the competition so they needed to up their game, which
unlike Nokia for example they did.
It's possible to "pump" water into an allegedly waterproof enclosure. >>>>> Heat the GPS with hot air to about 45C. Then dump it in a bucket of >>>>> 10C cold water. The air inside the GPS will contract and create a
partial vacuum, which then sucks the water into the enclosure (if
there are any leaks). Look for condensation INSIDE of the enclosure >>>>> and intermittent button press failures.
Most consumer GPS products can survived one or two heating and dunking >>>>> cycles without difficulty. The units that I tested in the mid 1990's >>>>> were horrible. None of them survived more than about 10 heating and >>>>> dunking cycles. After failure, none of them recovered by themselves >>>>> as there was no path for the water vapor to exit the enclosure. I had >>>>> to disassemble all the test units and hot air dry them. (Hint: Rice >>>>> doesn't work).
The Edge 830 has a IPX7 water rating:
<https://www8.garmin.com/manuals/webhelp/edge830/EN-US/GUID-CE2FC337-A232-482C-8747-A49C0098962E.html>
<https://www.garmin.com/en-US/legal/waterrating-definitions/>
"IPX7 - Withstands incidental exposure to water of up to 1 meter for >>>>> up to 30 minutes. Suitable for: splashes, rain or snow, showering"
In other words, forget about submerging it in a bucket of water even >>>>> though the spec hints that it can be done. That also includes a
puddle of water on the faceplate, standing water on the faceplate
caused by a front bezel that creates a pond, or standing water on any >>>>> joint in the pastic case.
The bezel is flat no ridges so water will not pool but be drops though >>>> dont use the silicone case which I guess might make it pool marginally >>>> more, only problem with rain is the touch screen but one can lock that, and
generally i certainly dont touch the device much once started.
Yes, a silicone case will collect water and is probably a bad idea in
a wet environment. However, it's a good addition if there's any
danger of dropping the Edge 830 on hard pavement.
I suspect the case isn?t water tight to the unit so water would still be
drops than a pool let alone the action of riding ie unlikely to perfectly
level.
If you suspect that water is the culprit, my suggestions is to open
the Edge 830 case and let it dry out. Hopefully, that will help it
recover.
Sorry about not answering your question earlier. I had no idea what >>>>> was causing the problem and didn't think of water incursion until you >>>>> mentioned it.
Good luck.
Roger Merriman
Roger Merriman
Roger, Liebermann doesn't even know what you're talking about but is telling you all about it. Most people would find that annoying if not personally insukting. But he continues endlessly.
Have a very merry christmas anhd a happy new year while Jeff is denying the existance of Christ.
Flunky denied that Pontius Pilisate ever sent a letter to Ceasar
concerning Jesus including him walking on water which is a matter of historical record and is presently in the Vatican.
On Fri Dec 27 05:38:43 2024 zen cycle wrote:
On 12/24/2024 2:18 PM, cyclintom wrote:
Roger, Liebermann doesn't even know what you're talking about but is telling you all about it. Most people would find that annoying if not personally insukting. But he continues endlessly.
Have a very merry christmas anhd a happy new year while Jeff is denying the existance of Christ.
Neither Jeff nor any Jew I've ever met has denied the existence of Jesus
Christ.
Flunky denied that Pontius Pilisate ever sent a letter to Ceasar
There may have been a historical character named Pontius Pilisate who
sent a letter to one of the Caesars. I'm sure you'll give us a link to
that evidence any time now.
concerning Jesus including him walking on water which is a matter of historical record and is presently in the Vatican.
You wrote that Pontious Pilate wrote a letter to Julius Caesar. This is
wrong, Julius Caesar died before Christ was born. There is no letter
from Pontious Pilate to Julius Caesar in the vatican, or anywhere else.
Poor Flunky even denies the fact that I did.
There is nothing in this world that he will not deny.
Claiming that he doesn't know any Jew that denies Jesus
is easy when you know no Jews or deny their religion.
https://jewsforjesus.org
(not generally recognized by the major sects of judaism, but the point >remains...)
is easy when you know no Jews or deny their religion.
Given that you're under the delusion that Jews deny the existence of
jesus, it's safe to say I know more jewish people than you do