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On 1/17/25 1:33 PM, Your Name wrote:
On 2025-01-17 21:13:51 +0000, Dudley Brooks said:
On 1/16/25 4:49 PM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
Should I defrag afterwards? Or does the OS (10.13.6 High Sierra)
make it somehow unnecessarry
That's not something you need to do with flash storage (SSDs).
Ah! Excellent! Thanks!
The original post says "HD", as in hard drive, not SSD flash storage.
As usual Jolly Roger didn't bother actually reading the question.
Having noted that, defragging isn't really neccessary on MacOS hard
drives either.
My apologies -- it actually is an SSD. I just have been using
computers for so long that I still say "HD" generically -- anything
that's not a floppy or a tape!
On 2025-01-17 21:45:25 +0000, Dudley Brooks said:
On 1/17/25 1:33 PM, Your Name wrote:
On 2025-01-17 21:13:51 +0000, Dudley Brooks said:
On 1/16/25 4:49 PM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
On 1/16/25 11:16 AM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote: >>>>>>>
(I hope that "memory swapping" is the correct term.)
Model: Late 2013 Macbook Pro
OS: OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra
HD: 1 TB, 954.34 GB used, 44.27 GB available
CPU: 2.6 GHz Intel
Mem: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
As you see, my HD is very full.
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function --
programs load
much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same >>>>>>>> time,
windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good >>>>>>>> performance?
That would depend on how much RAM you actually use, but the general >>>>>>> recommendation is to keep 10-20% free on the startup drive,
depending on how much your system swaps due to low memory
conditions. You're way short of that 100 GB (10%).
OK, thanks! Now I know what to aim for. Luckily, it will not be too >>>>>> difficult to accomplish -- loads of stuff I can get rid of.
🙂👍🏼
Should I defrag afterwards? Or does the OS (10.13.6 High Sierra) >>>>>> make
it somehow unnecessarry
That's not something you need to do with flash storage (SSDs).
Ah! Excellent! Thanks!
The original post says "HD", as in hard drive, not SSD flash storage.
As usual Jolly Roger didn't bother actually reading the question.
Having noted that, defragging isn't really neccessary on MacOS hard
drives either.
My apologies -- it actually is an SSD. I just have been using
computers for so long that I still say "HD" generically -- anything
that's not a floppy or a tape!
It's an easy mistake to make, especially as Apple kept on labelling the
main storage drive "Macintosh HD" even long after they were switched
over to using SSDs instead.
But whether you made a mistake or not, it was typed as HD and Jolly
Roger replied about SSDs.
Do Mac hard drives need to be defragmented?
macOS does not include a built-in defragmentation tool
because it is deemed unnecessary. macOS is designed to
handle file fragmentation automatically, especially for
small files. Using an external defragmentation tool on
a Mac is not recommended.
<https://www.crucial.com/articles/mac-users/how-to-defragment-a-mac
And Thank You to both of you.
Do Mac hard drives need to be defragmented?
macOS does not include a built-in defragmentation tool
because it is deemed unnecessary. macOS is designed to
handle file fragmentation automatically, especially for
small files. Using an external defragmentation tool on
a Mac is not recommended.
<https://www.crucial.com/articles/mac-users/how-to-defragment-a-mac
On 2025-01-17, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
On 1/17/25 1:33 PM, Your Name wrote:
On 2025-01-17 21:13:51 +0000, Dudley Brooks said:
On 1/16/25 4:49 PM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
Should I defrag afterwards? Or does the OS (10.13.6 High Sierra) >>>>>> make it somehow unnecessarry
That's not something you need to do with flash storage (SSDs).
Ah! Excellent! Thanks!
The original post says "HD", as in hard drive, not SSD flash storage.
As usual Jolly Roger didn't bother actually reading the question.
Having noted that, defragging isn't really neccessary on MacOS hard
drives either.
My apologies -- it actually is an SSD. I just have been using
computers for so long that I still say "HD" generically -- anything
that's not a floppy or a tape!
Yes, I understood this. Apparently Your Name is the one who didn't
bother reading your original post, because if he had he would have read
past "HD" to see the model Mac you are referencing, which doesn't even
have an option for hard drives as it's an SSD-only model - something I figured out within a few seconds of reading your original post. 😉
At any rate, defragging isn't something you need to do with modern Macs
(even those with hard drives).
On 2025-01-19, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
And Thank You to both of you.
Do Mac hard drives need to be defragmented?
macOS does not include a built-in defragmentation tool
because it is deemed unnecessary. macOS is designed to
handle file fragmentation automatically, especially for
small files. Using an external defragmentation tool on
a Mac is not recommended.
<https://www.crucial.com/articles/mac-users/how-to-defragment-a-mac
That's correct. Since HFS+, Apple's Mac-native file systems
automatically defragment themselves, and using third-party
defragmentation utilities isn't recommended. Lots of detail here about
it, for anyone interested:
<https://blog.delx.au/2008/11/hfs-auto-defragmentation-of-files-under-mac-os-x/>
(I hope that "memory swapping" is the correct term.)
Model: Late 2013 Macbook Pro
OS: OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra
HD: 1 TB, 954.34 GB used, 44.27 GB available
CPU: 2.6 GHz Intel
Mem: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
As you see, my HD is very full.
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs load
much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time,
windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good
performance?
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
(I hope that "memory swapping" is the correct term.)
Model: Late 2013 Macbook Pro
OS: OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra
HD: 1 TB, 954.34 GB used, 44.27 GB available
CPU: 2.6 GHz Intel
Mem: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
As you see, my HD is very full.
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs load
much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time,
windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good
performance?
That would depend on how much RAM you actually use, but the general recommendation is to keep 10-20% free on the startup drive, depending on
how much your system swaps due to low memory conditions. You're way
short of that 100 GB (10%).
On 1/16/25 11:16 AM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
(I hope that "memory swapping" is the correct term.)
Model: Late 2013 Macbook Pro
OS: OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra
HD: 1 TB, 954.34 GB used, 44.27 GB available
CPU: 2.6 GHz Intel
Mem: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
As you see, my HD is very full.
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs load
much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time,
windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good
performance?
That would depend on how much RAM you actually use, but the general
recommendation is to keep 10-20% free on the startup drive, depending on
how much your system swaps due to low memory conditions. You're way
short of that 100 GB (10%).
OK, thanks! Now I know what to aim for. Luckily, it will not be too difficult to accomplish -- loads of stuff I can get rid of.
Should I defrag afterwards? Or does the OS (10.13.6 High Sierra) make
it somehow unnecessarry
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs load
much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time,
windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good
performance?
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
On 1/16/25 11:16 AM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
(I hope that "memory swapping" is the correct term.)
Model: Late 2013 Macbook Pro
OS: OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra
HD: 1 TB, 954.34 GB used, 44.27 GB available
CPU: 2.6 GHz Intel
Mem: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
As you see, my HD is very full.
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs load >>>> much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time,
windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good
performance?
That would depend on how much RAM you actually use, but the general
recommendation is to keep 10-20% free on the startup drive, depending on >>> how much your system swaps due to low memory conditions. You're way
short of that 100 GB (10%).
OK, thanks! Now I know what to aim for. Luckily, it will not be too
difficult to accomplish -- loads of stuff I can get rid of.
🙂👍🏼
Should I defrag afterwards? Or does the OS (10.13.6 High Sierra) make
it somehow unnecessarry
That's not something you need to do with flash storage (SSDs).
On 1/16/25 4:49 PM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
On 1/16/25 11:16 AM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
(I hope that "memory swapping" is the correct term.)
Model: Late 2013 Macbook Pro
OS: OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra
HD: 1 TB, 954.34 GB used, 44.27 GB available
CPU: 2.6 GHz Intel
Mem: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
As you see, my HD is very full.
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs load >>>>> much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time, >>>>> windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good
performance?
That would depend on how much RAM you actually use, but the general
recommendation is to keep 10-20% free on the startup drive, depending on >>>> how much your system swaps due to low memory conditions. You're way
short of that 100 GB (10%).
OK, thanks! Now I know what to aim for. Luckily, it will not be too
difficult to accomplish -- loads of stuff I can get rid of.
🙂👍🏼
Should I defrag afterwards? Or does the OS (10.13.6 High Sierra) make
it somehow unnecessarry
That's not something you need to do with flash storage (SSDs).
Ah! Excellent! Thanks!
On 2025-01-17 21:13:51 +0000, Dudley Brooks said:
On 1/16/25 4:49 PM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
On 1/16/25 11:16 AM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
(I hope that "memory swapping" is the correct term.)
Model: Late 2013 Macbook Pro
OS: OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra
HD: 1 TB, 954.34 GB used, 44.27 GB available
CPU: 2.6 GHz Intel
Mem: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
As you see, my HD is very full.
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs
load
much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time, >>>>>> windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good
performance?
That would depend on how much RAM you actually use, but the general
recommendation is to keep 10-20% free on the startup drive,
depending on
how much your system swaps due to low memory conditions. You're way
short of that 100 GB (10%).
OK, thanks! Now I know what to aim for. Luckily, it will not be too >>>> difficult to accomplish -- loads of stuff I can get rid of.
🙂👍🏼
Should I defrag afterwards? Or does the OS (10.13.6 High Sierra) make >>>> it somehow unnecessarry
That's not something you need to do with flash storage (SSDs).
Ah! Excellent! Thanks!
The original post says "HD", as in hard drive, not SSD flash storage. As usual Jolly Roger didn't bother actually reading the question.
Having noted that, defragging isn't really neccessary on MacOS hard
drives either.
Do Mac hard drives need to be defragmented?
macOS does not include a built-in defragmentation tool
because it is deemed unnecessary. macOS is designed to
handle file fragmentation automatically, especially for
small files. Using an external defragmentation tool on
a Mac is not recommended.
<https://www.crucial.com/articles/mac-users/how-to-defragment-a-mac
For your reference, records indicate that
Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs load
much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time,
windows don't open at full size, etc.
Something is missing from your assessment. While things can slow down when the computer takes time to swap things from RAM to HD and back again, none
of that should keep windows from opening/resizing properly.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
Maybe, or not. Whether or not free space is used for swap or something
else depends a lot on what you’re actually doing. For example, it could
be that one of the apps you use creates large temp files, and it has
reduced functionality when it has trouble doing that.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good
performance?
The right way to think about it is what you’re actually doing that is impacting performance. Open Activity Monitor and see what’s using RAM, CPU, etc. Given that you already have 16GB of RAM, you’d have to be running *dozens* of large apps for you to be needing equivalent amounts of swap. Although, keep in mind that if you leave a web browser open with multiple tabs, each site can chew up far more RAM than you might expect (I’m talking more than 1GB for a single web page!).
You have a very old machine, which doesn’t help. I still have a 2012 Mac mini with 8GB that runs fine for most things, but I don’t push it to do things I know it is too slow to handle. If you expect to keep using Intel hardware that’s a decade old, you have to be realistic about what it can
and can’t do.
On 1/17/25 1:33 PM, Your Name wrote:
On 2025-01-17 21:13:51 +0000, Dudley Brooks said:
On 1/16/25 4:49 PM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
On 1/16/25 11:16 AM, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2025-01-16, Dudley Brooks <dbrooks@runforyourlife.org> wrote:
(I hope that "memory swapping" is the correct term.)
Model: Late 2013 Macbook Pro
OS: OS X 10.13.6 High Sierra
HD: 1 TB, 954.34 GB used, 44.27 GB available
CPU: 2.6 GHz Intel
Mem: 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
As you see, my HD is very full.
As it fills up, I have seen a big dropoff in function -- programs load >>>>>>> much more slowly, can only have a few programs open at the same time, >>>>>>> windows don't open at full size, etc.
I assume this is because of not enough swap space on the HD.
What is the recommended amount of HD space to keep free for good >>>>>>> performance?
That would depend on how much RAM you actually use, but the general >>>>>> recommendation is to keep 10-20% free on the startup drive, depending >>>>>> on how much your system swaps due to low memory conditions. You're way >>>>>> short of that 100 GB (10%).
OK, thanks! Now I know what to aim for. Luckily, it will not be too >>>>> difficult to accomplish -- loads of stuff I can get rid of.
🙂👍🏼
Should I defrag afterwards? Or does the OS (10.13.6 High Sierra) make >>>>> it somehow unnecessarry
That's not something you need to do with flash storage (SSDs).
Ah! Excellent! Thanks!
The original post says "HD", as in hard drive, not SSD flash storage.
As usual Jolly Roger didn't bother actually reading the question.
Having noted that, defragging isn't really neccessary on MacOS hard
drives either.
My apologies -- it actually is an SSD. I just have been using
computers for so long that I still say "HD" generically -- anything
that's not a floppy or a tape!
Do Mac hard drives need to be defragmented?
macOS does not include a built-in defragmentation tool
because it is deemed unnecessary. macOS is designed to
handle file fragmentation automatically, especially for
small files. Using an external defragmentation tool on
a Mac is not recommended.
<https://www.crucial.com/articles/mac-users/how-to-defragment-a-mac