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On 9/3/2024 8:22 PM, bill wrote:
On 9/3/2024 6:27 PM, Craig A. Berry wrote:
Has anyone actually tried porting FPC to VMS? It looks at first glance >>> like a lot of it is written in Pascal, so I assume it would need to be
cross-compiled initially.
Why? Wasn't the VMS Pascal compiler ported? I would think it
would be a lot easier porting something written in Pascal
compared to something written in C.
If FPC source is ISO Pascal then VMS Pascal may be able to build it
with maybe a few tweaks.
But if the FPC source is Object Pascal then VMS Pascal is of no use.
A quick glance at https://github.com/fpc/FPCSource/screams Object Pascal.
Arne
On 9/3/2024 8:35 PM, bill wrote:
On 9/3/2024 8:34 PM, Arne Vajh°j wrote:
On 9/3/2024 8:22 PM, bill wrote:
On 9/3/2024 6:27 PM, Craig A. Berry wrote:
Has anyone actually tried porting FPC to VMS? It looks at first glance >>>>> like a lot of it is written in Pascal, so I assume it would need to be >>>>> cross-compiled initially.
Why? Wasn't the VMS Pascal compiler ported? I would think it
would be a lot easier porting something written in Pascal
compared to something written in C.
If FPC source is ISO Pascal then VMS Pascal may be able to build it
with maybe a few tweaks.
But if the FPC source is Object Pascal then VMS Pascal is of no use.
A quick glance at https://github.com/fpc/FPCSource/screams Object Pascal. >>>
So, that OO shit comes out to bite people on the ass yet again. :-)
Some like to forget, at the bottom, it is just ones and zeros ...
On 9/3/2024 8:34 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
On 9/3/2024 8:22 PM, bill wrote:
On 9/3/2024 6:27 PM, Craig A. Berry wrote:
Has anyone actually tried porting FPC to VMS? It looks at first glance >>>> like a lot of it is written in Pascal, so I assume it would need to be >>>> cross-compiled initially.
Why? Wasn't the VMS Pascal compiler ported? I would think it
would be a lot easier porting something written in Pascal
compared to something written in C.
If FPC source is ISO Pascal then VMS Pascal may be able to build it
with maybe a few tweaks.
But if the FPC source is Object Pascal then VMS Pascal is of no use.
A quick glance at https://github.com/fpc/FPCSource/ screams Object Pascal.
So, that OO shit comes out to bite people on the ass yet again. :-)
On 04/09/2024 01:34, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
On 9/3/2024 8:22 PM, bill wrote:
On 9/3/2024 6:27 PM, Craig A. Berry wrote:
Has anyone actually tried porting FPC to VMS? It looks at first glance >>>> like a lot of it is written in Pascal, so I assume it would need to be >>>> cross-compiled initially.
Why? Wasn't the VMS Pascal compiler ported? I would think it
would be a lot easier porting something written in Pascal
compared to something written in C.
If FPC source is ISO Pascal then VMS Pascal may be able to build it
with maybe a few tweaks.
But if the FPC source is Object Pascal then VMS Pascal is of no use.
A quick glance at https://github.com/fpc/FPCSource/screams Object Pascal.
I see that FPC are planning LLVM back-end support...
On 9/3/2024 2:02 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
BTW, about portability, the Free Pascal people say this on their website:
|Free Pascal is a mature, versatile, open source Pascal compiler. It
|can target many processor architectures: Intel x86 (16 and 32 bit),
|AMD64/x86-64, PowerPC, PowerPC64, SPARC, SPARC64, ARM, AArch64, MIPS,
|Motorola 68k, AVR, and the JVM. Supported operating systems include
|Windows (16/32/64 bit, CE, and native NT), Linux, Mac OS
|X/iOS/iPhoneSimulator/Darwin, FreeBSD and other BSD flavors, DOS (16
|bit, or 32 bit DPMI), OS/2, AIX, Android, Haiku, Nintendo GBA/DS/Wii,
|AmigaOS, MorphOS, AROS, Atari TOS, and various embedded platforms.
|Additionally, support for RISC-V (32/64), Xtensa, and Z80
|architectures, and for the LLVM compiler infrastructure is available
|in the development version. Additionally, the Free Pascal team
|maintains a transpiler for pascal to Javascript called pas2js.
No VMS however.
Seems as if thoswe people aren't as "open" as they think they are. If
the world is mainly WEENDOZE and Unix and derivatives perhaps.
On 9/3/2024 2:02 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
On 2024-09-03, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
As for VMS and Pascal, there is a very decent implementation of that
language on
VMS, so what's the problem when a product aimed at a different
environment will
not run on every environment.
So how capable are the OO features in VMS Pascal these days ?
You state that similar to my comment above, as if it is a given that OO
is necessary. Perhaps not. Cheap way to avoid my question.
[LLVM] will definitely help with the optimization of the code generated
by FPC. It is significantly worse than what GCC/LLVM/MSVC++.
On Wed, 4 Sep 2024 15:10:49 -0400, Arne Vajh°j wrote:
[LLVM] will definitely help with the optimization of the code generated
by FPC. It is significantly worse than what GCC/LLVM/MSVC++.
Also, I came across this project called QBE <https://c9x.me/compile/>.
It?s nowhere near as ambitious as LLVM, but it looks interesting for some smaller-scale uses.
There?s a standard Debian package available. Also, it doesn?t insist on strict SSA. ;)
On Tue, 3 Sep 2024 22:36:02 -0400, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
And to be clear then this work would have to be driven by fondness for
Pascal. There is no business case.
Back in the day, there was DECUS -- an active community of users creating/ adapting and collecting software for DEC systems, for each other to use.
Where is that now?
And to be clear then this work would have to be driven by fondness for Pascal. There is no business case.
If VSI or someone else want to port something on a commercial basis then
I think the priority list should be:
1) .NET with C#, F# and VB.NET
On Tue, 3 Sep 2024 22:36:02 -0400, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
If VSI or someone else want to port something on a commercial basis then
I think the priority list should be:
1) .NET with C#, F# and VB.NET
Dotnet never seemed more than a Microsoft corporate vanity project (a reaction to Sun’s lawsuit over Java), rather than an actual important technology. Microsoft themselves have never used it for anything strategic (e.g. Office); their one attempt to incorporate it deeply into the OS
(Vista) ended in failure.
On 9/4/2024 3:29 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
On 9/3/2024 10:48 PM, Dave Froble wrote:
On 9/3/2024 2:02 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
On 2024-09-03, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
As for VMS and Pascal, there is a very decent implementation of that >>>>> language on
VMS, so what's the problem when a product aimed at a different
environment will
not run on every environment.
So how capable are the OO features in VMS Pascal these days ?
You state that similar to my comment above, as if it is a given that
OO is
necessary. Perhaps not. Cheap way to avoid my question.
If you write OS kernel or an embedded application for a device counting
memory in KB (or maybe a few MB): it is not necessary.
Ok, your word, "necessary".
Explain to me why OO is necessary ...
Not that it may be useful, or desired. You wrote "necessary".
On 9/3/2024 10:48 PM, Dave Froble wrote:
On 9/3/2024 2:02 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
On 2024-09-03, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
As for VMS and Pascal, there is a very decent implementation of that
language on
VMS, so what's the problem when a product aimed at a different environment will
not run on every environment.
So how capable are the OO features in VMS Pascal these days ?
You state that similar to my comment above, as if it is a given that OO is >> necessary. Perhaps not. Cheap way to avoid my question.
If you write OS kernel or an embedded application for a device counting memory in KB (or maybe a few MB): it is not necessary.
On 9/6/2024 8:19 PM, Dave Froble wrote:
On 9/4/2024 3:29 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
On 9/3/2024 10:48 PM, Dave Froble wrote:
On 9/3/2024 2:02 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
On 2024-09-03, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
As for VMS and Pascal, there is a very decent implementation of that >>>>>> language on
VMS, so what's the problem when a product aimed at a different environment
will
not run on every environment.
So how capable are the OO features in VMS Pascal these days ?
You state that similar to my comment above, as if it is a given that OO is >>>> necessary. Perhaps not. Cheap way to avoid my question.
If you write OS kernel or an embedded application for a device counting
memory in KB (or maybe a few MB): it is not necessary.
Ok, your word, "necessary".
Explain to me why OO is necessary ...
Not that it may be useful, or desired. You wrote "necessary".
Dave, you're wasting your time. The COBOL world asked that
question and look what they did to them. :-)
bill