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On 27/10/2024 21:34, D wrote:
On Sun, 27 Oct 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 27/10/2024 05:35, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
On 10/26/24 10:21 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:Well so says the metaphysics of the classical scientific world view.
On Sun, 27 Oct 2024 02:06:21 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
"Our whole universe was in a hot dense state..."
As I look around, I see some in this noisegroup who still seem to be in >>>>> that state ...
Normally these groups are VERY quiet. But then it's only
about a week before elections.
As for the universe, it USED to be in a 'hot dense state',
but has cooled-off considerably. If 'dark energy' calx are
correct we're already on the downside - headed for icy doom.
We are surfing a wave of entropy created by the big bang and will all end >>> up washed up the beach gasping and then die.
Of course the metaphysics of the classical scientific world view is only >>> a man made theory, when it comes down to it. And can neither be proven
true or false.
The world actually can be proven true. G.E. Moore did it many decades ago. >> Here's a hand!
Well no, in any given terms it cant be. At best you end up with 'something exists, even if its only me thinking something exists'
Moore's logic is flawed. He has to presuppose an external world in which a hand can be held up before he can perform the action.
Which is in the limit circular thinking, as if you stop thinking (proper transcendental meditation) you and the world both vanish, subjectively.
On Mon, 28 Oct 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 27/10/2024 21:34, D wrote:
On Sun, 27 Oct 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 27/10/2024 05:35, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
On 10/26/24 10:21 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:Well so says the metaphysics of the classical scientific world view.
On Sun, 27 Oct 2024 02:06:21 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
"Our whole universe was in a hot dense state..."
As I look around, I see some in this noisegroup who still seem to
be in
that state ...
Normally these groups are VERY quiet. But then it's only
about a week before elections.
As for the universe, it USED to be in a 'hot dense state',
but has cooled-off considerably. If 'dark energy' calx are
correct we're already on the downside - headed for icy doom.
We are surfing a wave of entropy created by the big bang and will
all end up washed up the beach gasping and then die.
Of course the metaphysics of the classical scientific world view is
only a man made theory, when it comes down to it. And can neither be
proven true or false.
The world actually can be proven true. G.E. Moore did it many decades
ago. Here's a hand!
Well no, in any given terms it cant be. At best you end up with
'something exists, even if its only me thinking something exists'
Moore's logic is flawed. He has to presuppose an external world in
which a hand can be held up before he can perform the action.
Which is in the limit circular thinking, as if you stop thinking
(proper transcendental meditation) you and the world both vanish,
subjectively.
Actually, the brilliance is that he does not. The hand is proof of the external world. The TM-guy does not cease to exist, and neither does the world. You can easily utilize the same proof as Moore. It is brilliant
in its simplicity, and I think that is why some people don't get it. It
is simply too "easy".
Another extremely strong point in its favour is that it is actually the people who propose that there is no external world who need to come up
with the arguments for it and so far, no one has been able to
successfully convince the world at large, that the external world does
not exist, by coming up with an alternative, that has iron clad proof.
Another indication of the strength of the position of a material world existing is that about 70% of professional philosopher subscribe to
this. This is of course not a proof, but a strong indication as well.
On 10/28/24 6:10 AM, D wrote:
On Mon, 28 Oct 2024, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
On 10/27/24 5:34 PM, D wrote:
On Sun, 27 Oct 2024, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 27/10/2024 05:35, 186282@ud0s4.net wrote:
On 10/26/24 10:21 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:Well so says the metaphysics of the classical scientific world view. >>>>>
On Sun, 27 Oct 2024 02:06:21 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
"Our whole universe was in a hot dense state..."
As I look around, I see some in this noisegroup who still seem to be >>>>>>> in
that state ...
Normally these groups are VERY quiet. But then it's only
about a week before elections.
As for the universe, it USED to be in a 'hot dense state',
but has cooled-off considerably. If 'dark energy' calx are
correct we're already on the downside - headed for icy doom.
We are surfing a wave of entropy created by the big bang and will all >>>>> end up washed up the beach gasping and then die.
Of course the metaphysics of the classical scientific world view is >>>>> only a man made theory, when it comes down to it. And can neither be >>>>> proven true or false.
The world actually can be proven true. G.E. Moore did it many decades
ago. Here's a hand!
Even the Buddha said the universe was "real" - just
that creatures like US, maybe any, could never really
see it's entirety - barely a key-hole view. Our evolution,
bodies, senses, brains ... we see things through "Human-
Colored Glasses" and that's our kinda faux view of things.
I think this is pretty obvious. I also think it shows that Buddha was a
wise man!
If it's obvious, why don't I hear it much ? It represents
a loss of self-determination, a stone wall we can never
penetrate ... forever trapped in our little tiny warped
version of the universe.
Actually, Plato's "Allegory Of The Cave" points to the
same conclusion, he just kinda leaves off the last para -
maybe for political reasons. Plato and Buddha were near-
contemporaries and some ideas may have filtered across
from the east.